|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 860
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 860 |
First thing you should do is determine if the trailer uses a ground through the connector or the trailer tongue. This can cause quite a bit of confusion and throw you off on your troubleshooting. This link really covers just about every application out there. http://www.etrailer.com/faq-wiring.aspxI highly recommend using sealed splices instead of the cheap crimp type, if you have to use the crimp type put a piece of heat shrink over it to seal the splice. Wrap the spliced area with some electrical tape and finish using a section of wire loom tied off with wire ties. That's how I always fix my trailer wires and it makes it look professional too. Not very many trailers are grounded through the tongue anymore, and really that's a pretty poor way to ground the system. While the tongue-ball is a pretty secure mechanical connection it's not a very good electrical path, especially as you're driving down the road and the coupler is rattling/vibrating around on the trailer ball.
Last edited by ajmorell; 04/03/15.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,317
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,317 |
Grounding through the tongue is a terribly unreliable method, but it sometimes happens, regardless of the intention of your wiring. That is the source of a lot of intermittent trailer lights.
Could be worse - you could be dunking the whole thing in salt water a few times a week.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554 |
There's an easy fix if your trailer is grounded through the tongue, simply cut the trailer ground wire and extend it long enough to it's connector and connect to the ground pin. The truck/vehicle connector should already have a ground wire attached to it.
That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.
Steelhead
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
LED's alone won't cure your problems, good wire is a must [img]http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTYwMFgxNTEx/z/baUAAOSwDN1US~b7/$_35.JPG?set_id=880000500F[/img] and sealed splices and use some dialectric grease on the plug connection Dialectric grease is NON-conductive so it must be used right. The wires must have a very solid attachment or the grease can get between the wires and block the current flow. It works great to keep moisture out of the connector but can be counterproductive if it gets IN the connector. If you want to pack the connector full of grease, there are conductive greases to use instead.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 86,385 Likes: 39
Campfire Oracle
|
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 86,385 Likes: 39 |
Trailer lights operate on the PFM principle.
If you take the time it takes, it takes less time. --Pat Parelli
American by birth; Alaskan by choice. --ironbender
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
Truckers carry a can of WD40 as standard equipment. A shot in the light plug cleans it out and gives good contacts.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 22,022 Likes: 16
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 22,022 Likes: 16 |
Always had good luck using dielectric grease on Scully connectors, which use low voltage current through sensors and computer type devices.
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
As long as there's good metal to metal contact inside the connectors, dielectric grease won't affect them. However, if it gets between the contact points, it blocks the current. That's the nature of electricity and a non-conductor.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,220 Likes: 4
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,220 Likes: 4 |
My truck started acting like it was possessed once. I was stumped. Hit the brakes and the mirrors would light up, turn signal would freak out the radio and wipers.....bizarre stuff. I found a bad ground and dusty trailer plug at fault. New trucks are VERY picky about the voltage feedback. Keep everything clean.
I would not buy something that runs on any kind of primer given the possibility of primer shortages and even regulations. In fact, why not buy a flintlock? Really. Rocks aren't going away anytime soon.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
A bad ground can do some weird stuff.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
Nobody has mentioned this so I will. It might help understand the strange things that happen when the ground is poor.
Current flows from Neg to Pos, not Pos to Neg. Electricity is the flow of negatively charged electrons which are stored in the Neg half of the battery. When a circuit is closed, they flow out through the ground wire, through the appliance, and back to the Pos post on the battery. The ground on a vehicle is usually a battery cable bolted to the frame somewhere near the battery. All appliances are then bolted to the frame, too, either directly or indirectly. This is why, when attaching any electrical device to a vehicle, they tell you to disconnect the NEG battery cable, to neutralize the car body which is essentially hot all the time. Early cars had a positive ground system. Most of them switched in the '50's. I don't understand the chemistry here but they were having problems with the copper wire corroding with positive ground.
For the current to reach trailer lights, it has to flow through the entire car frame to the light plug, then through the trailer. There are miriad ways for the current to get blocked. That's why it's safer to run a special ground wire all the way from front to back, or at least through the trailer if your light plug on the car is grounded to the frame. It's to reduce the resistance from all the connections.
If there's a ground problem in the car, it can cause problems with all the appliances, not just the trailer lights. If a reduced current is all that can get through a dirty ground connection on the car, it will cause the current to be reduced on everything. If an appliance in the car isn't getting the full amps it needs to run because the trailer connection is syphoning off the juice, it can do some strange things in both the car and the trailer. If the bad connection is on the pos side, it will only affect that particular appliance.
I'm just theorizing here because I don't really know. Note that many cars have the neg battery cable bolted to the engine, not the frame. That might degrade the connection when the trailer plug ground is connected to the frame. In that case, it might be better to run a special ground wire for the trailer all the way to the battery.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,399 Likes: 6
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,399 Likes: 6 |
If the negative cable is attached to the engine then there should be a cable from the engine to the frame, that is all that is required.
drover
223 Rem, my favorite cartridge - you can't argue with truckloads of dead PD's and gophers.
24hourcampfire.com - The site where there is a problem for every solution.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 8,743
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 8,743 |
Direct ground from battery to engine is for the starter. It uses the most power of all electrical items. If all lights are grounded good to the trailer, a ground through the plug, and a good ground from plug to vehicle frame, you are 90% there. Most often ignored problem areas are in the back of the plugs themselves. Solder the ends of the wires, put them into clean sockets, and pack with dielectric grease. And NEVER use those damned crimp on scotch lock splices.
Last edited by calikooknic; 04/07/15.
Sean
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
Like I said before, use the dialectric grease on top of and outside the socket to keep water away but don't get it IN the socket. If it works it's way between the wire and the socket walls and screw, it will block current flow because it's non-conducting. Used on the outside of the sockets, it will help prevent shorts by preventing current bleeding through dirt from one socket to the others.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 8,743
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 8,743 |
I hear you cluckin big chicken, but what I meant was the inside of the plug before you put it back together. Not the male to female contact surfaces, but the internals to seal out the moisture. Smearing it on the outside just collects dirt. Here, after you have made all your connections. Not here.
Last edited by calikooknic; 04/08/15.
Sean
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 19,684 Likes: 21
Campfire Ranger
|
OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 19,684 Likes: 21 |
FWIW I guess the truck WAS fine. Must've needed a trailer plugged in for the trailer brake wire to energize. I rewired the trailer and it worked just fine. Just in case anybody runs into the same issue, figured I'd post the resolution.
MAGA
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,122 Likes: 8
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,122 Likes: 8 |
FWIW I guess the truck WAS fine. Must've needed a trailer plugged in for the trailer brake wire to energize. I rewired the trailer and it worked just fine. Just in case anybody runs into the same issue, figured I'd post the resolution. It took me a couple of days chasing ghost before I realize the same thing years ago so don't feel bad.
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28
Campfire Kahuna
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,594 Likes: 28 |
It can be a head scratcher when you're installing a new light plug on the truck. 'I KNOW this dang thing worked yesterday!'
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 19,684 Likes: 21
Campfire Ranger
|
OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 19,684 Likes: 21 |
Electricity is magic. Ever since I was little and saw my sister stick a fork in an outlet I have thought so, and nothing I've seen since and shaken that belief. Inexplicably things that should work sometimes don't, and things that shouldn't work sometimes do. It's easier to accept when I realize it's simply above my pay-grade to understand.
MAGA
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,122 Likes: 8
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,122 Likes: 8 |
I had a trailer with the old 6 pin small round plug, and then bought a new trailer with that bigger 7 pin plug. However, I still had a big 22 ft gooseneck flatbed with the old style plug. So I had a little converter jumper that went from the 6 pin my truck to the bigger 7 pin plug. Every year , I tore my hair out trying to find out why sometimes the lights worked, sometimes the brakes worked, then other times nothing on the flat bed. Turned out those darn little mud wasp, got into the female end of the plug, laid eggs, and back filled with mud. I wasn't clever enough to see the plug wasn't going in all the way. I guess sometimes the mud feel out, some times it didn't. I finally found it when I took the female connector apart and saw the contacts pushed back into the housing.
I took all those old type connectors off and replaced with them all with the new versions and now I keep plastic bag on all the trailer connectors when not in use.
Last edited by saddlesore; 04/11/15.
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
|
|
|
|
336 members (1badf350, 222Sako, 1Longbow, 160user, 06hunter59, 12344mag, 29 invisible),
10,338
guests, and
1,058
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,195,342
Posts18,546,421
Members74,060
|
Most Online21,066 May 26th, 2024
|
|
|
|