Don't hate me cause I'm beautiful!! LOL!! I loved my Zenith 1.5-6x42 so much that I just had to try the Zenith 3-12x50. It's one hell of a piece of glass.
nyrifleman,
I'd stick with the 3-12x42 for your 300 RUM. The 4-16x50 is VERY limited in elvation & windage adjustment. Plus the 3-12x42 is very sleek (as far as S&B scopes go) and fits a hunting rifle very well!!
nyrifleman, Little eye candy for you. 1.5-6x42 Flash Dot on top. 3-12x50 Classic on the bottom. Im 6'6" and the 50mm scoped rifle actually fits me better. The TDS is the best of all worlds with a FFP S&B as you could use the same hold overs at any power setting. The TDS is simple and pretty clean for a holdover type reticle.Should work fine. In the dark I prefer HEAVY reticles say a No4 or No9.Also you can have a lighted reticle as an option.Lit reticles from S&B trump Heavy reticles in the dark every time.The Flash Dot scope are S&B best of class. You also can order a BDC for a Schmidt.its expensive but someting you could think about. Be aware.S&B is an aquired taste.Once you get it.Its going to cost you real money...Just sayen...
Dave, Don't hate me cause I'm beautiful!! LOL!! I loved my Zenith 1.5-6x42 so much that I just had to try the Zenith 3-12x50. It's one hell of a piece of glass.
Buddie has a Zenith 3-12x50 Flash Dot.I got to play with it some.I liked it alot. You can hate me back.I just did a new PMII from Euro optics.Wait until you get aload of this thing......
To me S&B's are worth the money....but I do get paid to use mine....grin!
Steelhead, I had an 8X56 for a time....best poor light scope I've ever looked through....traded it for a 4-16X50 PMII. Wish I still had it. Hell of a scope for hunting Whitetail bucks showing up on hay fields at dark-thirty. One inch tube made of steel...very rugged...you'll need a higher comb on a conventional hunting stock to keep your chin down..as you probably already knew...
Fixed power scopes are not that popular in the UK, as we mainly tend to go for variables. I certainly do, as I like the ability to be able to dial up/down according to my need. But to be brutally honest; think for a moment what power you use to shoot most animals; I bet it�s around 7-9, given most are taken from some form of supported position � sticks, high seats or even vehicles. So something around that figure in a simpler package might be useful.
Dedicated
Most of my night shooting is on rabbits and hares is with my 17HMR Ruger All-Weather and in most cases I set the variable to x7 or 8, which is about right for low light work. So it occurred to me that something more dedicated might be the ticket. Being very much a fan of European glass, and also not spending any more money than I have to, Schmidt & Bender sprung to mind as they are by far the cheapest of the quality makes but with no loss of ability when compared to other market leaders.
So what better for night work than their 8x56 Klassik that is made in Hungary? This also brings the cost down as labour is cheaper, but not the quality as all components are supplied by Germany with the end result being identical.
The 8x56 has a 30mm body tube and its big objective bell sits easily on the Ruger in a set of their high rings, even with a Butler Creek lens cap fitted. A 1� tube version is also available, however this will place the optic nearer the barrel, so higher mounts are in order. Turrets are the old-style with the basic reticule, position indicator dial included. The drums are medium height, easy to dial and set under caps, as is proper for a hunting scope.
All the sixes
Click values are 1cm @ 100m, with 28 per turn (11�) with six, full rotations (66�) available. At the rear is a fast-focus eye piece, twilight factor is 21.1 and field of view (FOV) at 100 yards is 15 feet and apart from the superior lens quality and solid build that�s your lot. First impressions are a big optic as the Klassik is not short at 14.6� nor light at 22 oz. However, for my intended use that made no never mind.
Reticule choice covers nine options, from the three, tapered posts of the #1 to the Varmint grid of the #8. I went for the #7 which I consider to be the best, which shows thick posts at 3, 6 and 9 o�clock with a fine cross hair coming down from 12 o�clock. Subtension of this at 100 yards is just shy of the width of a fired, 12-bore case, as once zeroed I was using these as targets. Perhaps a tad coarse but easily visible and hard to lose in any light. Plus still a lot smaller than a rabbits head, so more than good enough.
High contrast
My 17HMR is capable of �� at 100 yards and the Schmidt did not change that, so after zeroing and a bit of fun with the 12-bore cases it was time to go out. Rabbits were thin on the ground that night, as I only got ten but the Klassik showed its quality with excellent low light performance with the longest shot out to 153 yards. Often as not, as the light was going, I would see a target which looked a bit dark and swing onto it. Once in the scope it was not only easier to see but also apparently brighter in terms of contrast.
For my rimfire needs, which are often from a truck or sitting in the back of one at night; the 8x56 proved a highly effective optic. Likewise if you do a lot of high seat work on deer, or shoot over longer distances; its medium/high power and large objective will allow good shots dawn to dusk.
The Schmidt & Bender 8x56 Klassik is a simple design whose high quality build and components combine to make what might be considered the ultimate, fixed power scope. This model is also offered in 6x42 and 10x42 versions.
We Reckon: � Superior quality � A bit mission specific � Consider a fixed power Technical Specifications Name Schmidt & Bender 8x56 Klassik (Hungarian) Body tube 30mm Fast-focus eye piece Reticule #7 (on test) Click values 1cm @ 100m Clicks per turn 28 Full rotations 6 Twilight factor 21.1 FOV @ 100 yards 15 ft
I'm looking at setting up as sort of a specialized rig and thinking the fixed 8 will do the trick, thanks.
http://www.eurooptic.com/Schmidt-Be...ory=SF03&vendor=XXSB&parent=XXSB The 8x56 can be had with a 1 inch or a 30mm tube.Im thinking the 30mm tube looks alittle less drastic than shrinking a 56mm obj down to 1 inch.30mm version would be able to use a lower ring height as well...Just sayen...
For a scope like this JMHO would be to special order a No4 or a "hold your nose" No1 reticle.Your going to be usuing it at the very last light and if its not a lighted one, get the heavest thing you can get your hands on. The thicker the better. A more flexable reticle would be a lighted one.Say a L7 or a L3.These will always show up in the dark and will be fine enough for load development and vermin and such in daylight.Again a special order.But so much more flexable. The S&B lighted reticle controll is just excellant and battery life is not an issue.
You do know Steelhead that if you actually order one of thses we all have to get togeather for a group HUG.....dontjaknow..
Group hugs and Steelhead in the same sentence?? You been drinkin' dave??
LOL!!!
Naw,I just know that if he ever gets his hands on a S&B for any length of time.He will be just like the rest of us. "Group hugs" I was actually thinking about a fixed 8x56 as I have a need for one.But I blew my budget on a different one instead .I will eventually have one and I pretty much have it all picked our in my head..... A fixed 8x56 with a 30mm tube lighted reticle either a L7 or a L3. And....and.... a BDC.Have the parrallx changed from 100 meters to 200 meters and call it a day.If your gonna go.Why not just go all the way.It costs extra for the options for sure but the functionality of this thing would be awesome. This set up would still be lighter weight and cheeper that a 2.5x10-56 Flashdot. Killer.
I doubt it, I can appreciate GREAT glass in spotters and binos, the gnat's differences in scopes don't mean much, just needs to put a bullet where it's supposed to go.
I doubt it, I can appreciate GREAT glass in spotters and binos, the gnat's differences in scopes don't mean much, just needs to put a bullet where it's supposed to go.
Steelhead, Ill tell ya alittle story. In another life before I became the anti E. I owned Leupolds.I used Leupolds.I still own and use Leupolds.I own many Leupolds.In fact I most likey still own more Leupolds than you do.Leupold was "the" scope for me,for many years.I recommened them to friends.And felt as you do,that loopies were all that was "needed". I was very much a "just needs to put a bullet where it's supposed to go" type of guy.And thats alright.Lord knows for many years thats all I could afford. And then I bought my first 1.5-6x42 from Dunns in 86.I didnt much care for the reticle that got "bigger".Seemed goofy to me.I didnt much care for the ,at that time,very short eye relief.Only 3.1 back then.Took a couple of seasons to get used to it.At that time I only had one rifle.A Nelson Berger built 280 AI.But over the course of several hunting seasons.It grew on me. It grew on me as younger man when I dropped it out of tree stands,fell on it.And used it to part brush with.It grew on me as I repeatedly turned it into a popsicle in frozen hell Alberta 7 years running.It grew on me as I always found myself comming out of the woods later than my friends did.They had to quit because they couldn't see where the bullet was supposed to go.I could.It grew on me sitting at the rifle range as it got dark and everyone else was caseing there rifles and I was just getting ready to squeese off another group.They couldn't see. The people I have converted..... It grew on me on very expensive hunts when I had the opportunity,from time to time,to take shots in lighting conditions that in my mind I knew a lesser scope would fail me. Over a long period of time I've pretty much come to the conclusion that although an aiming devise will get the job done.Great glass and hand built, build quality, make more than a "gnat's difference" TO ME. Be warned.You buy one,your gonna end up like BobinNH.It will cost you. Trust me.
Thanks Dave. Last year in Alberta the outfitter warned us that there would not be time to employ binos, but to use the scope to judge antlers.
He was right. However to my aging eyes at 450 yards the Leupy 4.5x14 wasn't getting it done.
Those types of hunts are too valuable to me not to give myself every possible advantage. Hence the S&B.
Originally Posted by BobinNH
Originally Posted by CLB
P.S. I think you have BobinNH salivating right now.
Heehee! That's funny!Well,see Dave has hunted Alberta with Russ Thornberry so understands that when they stick you on those fields,those rutting Alberta whitetails show without warning,are always on the move and don't stop in those fields unless a hot doe is holding them;they are always going from "here to there",and by the time you laze them, the distance has already changed,and this can be from 50 yards to as far as you can hit......time is of the essence;those bucks don't dilly-dally and neither should you.....ditto a lot of the larger mule deer that I've killed,which are distinctly different in behaviour from the younger one's that lolly gag in the open...
So I say laze when you can,but when you can't......I'd rather have Dave's machine in my mitts than a slow-poke round showing 18-20" of drop at the 400 yard mark...that rig will have one in him while the Western Extreme crowd is still doping distance...besides,where I hunt,there generally is not a camera crew and 4 observers with the Kestral Wind meters and a fleet of Swaro range finders behind me calling the shots....giving the obligatory "SEND IT" command....
To 500 yards and under(the distances most stuff is killed unless you deliberately put yourself further out,a practice common on TV or when peddling Hawkemyer Scopes)I can't think of anything better than what Dave has built,and few things as good.I also doubt that outfit is gonna contribute to a bull elk's life span
Like my buddy RinB says..."Trophy hunting is different...."
nyrifleman I've actually had outfitters ask me to leave binos in camp.And the reason is just what you said.NO TIME. Figure 10 seconds to see judge and kill um. For an Alberta hunt Schmidt & Bender is the only way to fly.
10 seconds was about twice the amount of time I had. I got into the habit of mentally counting how long it took those deer to cross the gas lines. 6 seconds was my max in a week's worth of hunting.
I'm betting, by looking at your rigs, that you and I hunt entirely differently. Eye relief is a premium, period.
Scott, if you really want one,the Summit has as much pure eye relief as any Leupold variable,and likely more at the top end.Very similar to a Zeiss Conquest 3-9. Not trying to sway you one way or the other but just letting you know the Summit has plenty,if you have a bit of difficulty (like I do)adjusting to the 30mm's
The guy that was with me wants a scope for his 300 RUM as he preps for Africa; he liked the wide view at 2.5,and the eye relief as well.
This is just a great, no-nonsense, general purpose hunting scope,as straight-forward and useful as it gets.Really no larger nor more obtrusive than, say, a Leup 3.5-10.
i had the 1.5-6x42 klassik and it was good. I dropped it climbing a tree and then proceeded to nail 2 does @ 160 yards. However, the 3-12x42 S&B is "the" all-around scope. I prefer the 12x to the 6x and i dont miss seeing half of my barrel on 1.5x. if dangerous game is involved then i would feel different
...... the 3-12x42 S&B is "the" all-around scope. I prefer the 12x to the 6x and i dont miss seeing half of my barrel on 1.5x. if dangerous game is involved then i would feel different
That same scope will be going on my Sako 75 300 RUM as soon as I get it back. Its at GA Precision getting pillar bedded into a McMillan Sako 75 stock - should be done shortly.
The 8x56 can be had with a 1 inch or a 30mm tube.Im thinking the 30mm tube looks alittle less drastic than shrinking a 56mm obj down to 1 inch.30mm version would be able to use a lower ring height as well...Just sayen...
The distance between the centre line of the scope and the bottom of the objective will be the same regardless of whether its built on a 1" tube or 30mm, so tube size alone won't affect the height of the scope.
What might is the diameter of the ocular housing. I've had a few S&B's over the years and their ocular housing have changed, even with in the same range. I am betting (ok guessing!) the 30mm scope will have a larger ocular housing which may need higher mounts so the bolt handle clears...
Originally Posted by dave7mm
For a scope like this JMHO would be to special order a No4 or a "hold your nose" No1 reticle.
What would the difference be between a sepecial order No4 and S&B No7? I thought S&B No7 was their version of the generic European No4 reticule???
Tend to agree with the comments about the illuminated reticule especially for night shooting; wish I had gone that route myself!
Pete E Back in the late 90s S&B brought out there extended eye relief models.They were all variables.These scopes were limited to just a few power ranges and the rear ocular housing got about .080 thousands of an inch bigger in diameter.The pre classic scopes had about 3.2 inches of eye relief.The new ER scopes have 3.7 inches.Later S&B converted all there variable power models to the ER with the slightly bigger rear eye piece. If you look at the current specs for fixed S&Bs the rear oculars are smaller than the variables.And they have less eye relief.Im thinking that fixed S&Bs eye piece, are all pretty much the same size diameter. I much prefer the look of a 30mm tube on a 56mm obj scope. As a 56mm obj scope with a 1 inch tube,to me,loooks like something a Nazi might throw from a slit trench.(potato masher) You are right that the distance between the centre line of the scope and the bottom of the objective will be the same regardless of whether its built on a 1" tube or 30mm.Yes. But if they are mounted to the exact same height.The 30mm tube version will .0905 closer to the top of the reciever. I used to think I knew alot about S&B.And then I talked to Alex Roy this week......
Pete E But if they are mounted to the exact same height.The 30mm tube version will .0905 closer to the top of the reciever. I used to think I knew alot about S&B.And then I talked to Alex Roy this week...... dave
I've not seen a 30mm fixed power...Do they offer more adjustment than the one inch models?
I have to confess I am thinking of selling my 8x56mm S&B...Since buying the PM11, I am a scope over so to speak, and I think my .223Rem might be better served with my 3-12x50mm Swaro with the illiminated reticule, but we'll see...
I did not know S&B had a 30mm tubed 8x56 untill I started hanging out on the Euro Optics sight.I never took the 8x56 to serious as I detest the look of a 8x56 with a one inch tube. This changes things up a bit. I could not say about the adjustment range.I dought it would amount to much.
I've decided to put that 3-12x42 on my 7mm Rem Mag. The rifle was built by Rifles, Inc. on a Winchester 70 Classic action. It's been a .5 MOA rifle since I bought it, and really deserves better glass than what currently sits atop.
The RUM will have to earn quality glass. For now I'll take the VXIII 3.5x10 that currently is in residence and use it to develop loads for new rifles. The Leupy has proven to be reliable and should serve well in that capacity.
Not to give you a seizure but I sold my 4x36mm S&B in favour of my Meopta 4x32mm
Its a long story, but the Meopta had already proved its worth on a trip to RSA on my 9.3x62mm...I tried the S&B on the same rifle and for some reason I can't really put my finger on, I found I prefered and generally shot better with the Meopta.
So the S&B went to finance another purchase, and I'm looking at a Zeiss Victory 2.5-10x42mm for the 9.3x62mm, but I'm finding hard to justify after the x4 worked so well in RSA...
Alright...alright! Dave7mm & 300mag you made your point. Im going to try one on my next rifle. Leaning toward the Klassic 3-12x42.
They are like Lay's potato chips, you can't stop at one....
Take heed, it will not be your last, they are addicting. I once said that I'd never pay that much money for a scope, I bought one and suddenly I have 6....
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.I will eventually have one and I pretty much have it all picked our in my head..... A fixed 8x56 with a 30mm tube lighted reticle either a L7 or a L3. And....and.... a BDC.Have the parrallx changed from 100 meters to 200 meters and call it a day.If your gonna go.Why not just go all the way.It costs extra for the options for sure but the functionality of this thing would be awesome. 
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