Worth 10 min of your time.

Sheeesh

I still love Michigan. #GoBlue

That could have gone sideways a couple of times.....

My question to this is, why not just give the cop your insurance card, be polite, and go. The only rude person I saw in that clip was the driver.

I have no experience being pulled over. But I wonder if that speech and attitude by the citizen would have played out well in my rural area. I suspect that around here, that would have escalated out of control quickly. One and sometimes 2 deputies in a county the size of the State of Hawaii at night. Several Rez's here, and the braves don't mind a fight now and then. The local cops have a tendency to seize control of the situation from the get go with no back up available for up to an hour in most places. Who is legally right and who is wrong has nothing to do with the here and now when you are getting a good ass kicking. Regardless if it was a 'good' probable cause for the stop, I think, if you are driving, then you are required to show your license on demand in almost every state. But, it was pretty clear that the cop in the video was lying his ass off, reading a front plate to his rear on a dark rainy night...I don't think so.

Hahaha that was quite something

I LOVE it! Time for the people to show these cu.nts who is in charge. Liars and sh.itbags in in uniform are just as mortal and fragile as those they harass.

Because the base reason for the stop was illegal. And the driver knew it was and the cop knew also. As a comparison, what would you think if a cop woke you out of a sound sleep in your bed tomorrow at about 3am and demanded to see proof that that was actually your home? Not a lot of difference.

And if you don't equate and illegal detainment as worse than being rude, then you my friend are a part of the problem.

Ummm because the cop was lying

Wrong

Balls the size of coconuts.

Boom!

I was too lazy to look up every state of course, but I just googled the question and it looks like license and insurance card are legally required when asked.

This guy is an a**hole.
Being on the roads is way different from being at your home. You can be drunk at your home. You can't be drunk on the road. You are required to take a written test and eyesight test to be able to drive a car.

If this is y'alls best example of a Warrior for Liberty, you are desperate.

He probably is a "sovereign citizen."

They would have been real nice here. For not supplying, license and insurance, and registration, tow the vehicle and let the courts figure it out next month. Right or wrong. Kind of like Flintlocks area, ours don't have much backup in a hurry! They don't play games along the road, they play them in court!

I'm guessing that would have gone differently had there been no camera.

And the stop would have never happened if the dude was black.

Guaranteed.

seriously?

Standing up for his rights and wanting them respected is being a sovereign citizen? You another one that was raised to "aLwAYs ReSpEcT tHe LaW"...

Cops.

Not a single cop , not one, knows the laws or constitution, not one.

Thank God for cameras.

Do you honestly believe the cop that initiated contact had a legal right to do so?

Yes, they are. You can refuse to produce your operator's license when asked, but the only recourse after that is to be arrested for operating without a license. Then you can make bond, come to court and eventually show your license to have the charges dropped. The only one getting skinned up is the driver who doesn't want to simply produce an operator's license. If you do anything other than put your hands behind your back and walk back to the car to ride to jail you can and will be charged with resisting arrest. You may get away with being annoyed with some pressure point control techniques, until you decide to go along with the program, or in the case of some of the younger types, they'll go ahead and initiate the Electric Company. Now you have been tasered. I assure you, this is not pleasant. If you have now progressed to this point, your options in court have diminished. It's all cool sounding to mess with the fuzz, but your best option is STILL to obey lawful commands.

Cameras are like chronographs. I call them lie detectors.
I’ve only had I believe 3 tickets in my life which is unbelievable. I will say nobody gave me one because I earned it. The saying you can’t outrun a radio is bull crap. When I was young in my Trans Am I did it many times. Edk

Cops have to have reasonable, articulable suspicion that you have, will or are committing a crime, unless it's a stop and ID state. This blindly doing what they tell you to do is why these bastards have gotten out of control going unchecked for so long. If they just pull you over and demand ID and make it clear that they didn't have a lawful traffic stop, they can catch a lawsuit and hopefully lose their qualified immunity in the process. It's happened many times before.

There is a difference between “rights” and “privilege”

When there is a license involved, your privilege is what allows you to engage in the licensed activity…

Driver: Am I being detained?

Dumb ass cop: No

Driver: Am I free to leave?

Dumb ass cop: No

Pssst, hey Dumb ass cop, that is the definition of “ Being Detained”

Cops, bunch of morons.

For a while there, I was convinced I was watching an episode of Reno 911...

That kid got schooled. I hope he unfûcks himself after this, or gets fired/quits in humiliation.

OK Bandit. Lmao.


We’re you running beer to Texarkana?

You’re missing the point.

It wasn’t a lawful command.





P

Not if he had a ALPR, which would easily read a license plate behind, in front, or to either side.

…and your rights “protect” you from abuse while you “exercise” your privilege.

When does a tag run come back with your insurance statis???

Commyfornia is sure would
They will not give you your tags if you do not have Insurance and Smog your vehicle when they tell you to which is every other year here

If the Ins status is stored in the same database as the plate info, it will come back.

Exp plates sound an alert in the car, as do those with a warrant for someone that had been driving that car when pulled over for the charge that turned into a warrant.

Plate alert can show if the person the plate is registered to has a suspended or expired driver license.

On the civil side, parking lot readers and tow truck readers alert to repos.

Back in the day, I’d get the occasional wise guy that didn’t want to produce a DL or ID. I always had a valid reason for the stop or interview, so when a perp got testy, I just hooked him up and took him to jail as a John Doe refusing to identify himself. You didn’t need a good ID to get in jail, but you damned sure needed one to get out!

Only one I’ve had remotely like that I was driving around Harriman State Park in NY Stste early hours of the morning, like 2am listening for whippoorwills. Turned left onto a main highway leaving the park and as I looked to the right to check for traffic I saw a local Cop in the dark standing by the side of his unlit patrol car off the side of the highway with his duty belt undone and his pants open. No idea what he was doing or with whom.

He caught up to me a short time later and pulled me over, ran my license, seemed nervous, IIRC gave me a verbal warning about the stop sign. I have no idea what was really going on, no harm no foul.

Completely stolen from an episode of Mr InBetween on FX.

When the stop is a traffic stop. Meaning it had to be a legal stop. Officer has to have a reason to pull you over such as speeding, then you are required. But if the guy looks over and sees you driving through inner city chicago and pulls you over because you don't fir the profile of the normal inner city resident. He has no probable cause meaning he has no legal right to ask/demand id.

Dang you are dense aren't you?

The boys were thirsty in Atlanta.

Good show.

I wonder who his replacement will be.....probably be an infallible race and an even more infallible gender. Maybe both.

The kid is a cuck, but the "staff" that he gets replaced with won't check all the dots for the modern stereotypes.

The fact that those cops didn’t arrest him is proof enough they knew they were wrong.

"Any questions for us?"

"FUUCK OFF"

Boy, most of you guys are trying to be a real rebel. Wonder if that guy would argue with the judge like that if he got pulled into court.

Those two cops need to get a little backbone... My father is law was a trooper in Minnesota for 33 years... I've rode in his cruiser with him multiple times.. he was mainly based way up north out of Hibbing area on the Iron Range. He was president of the state's patrolman's association the last 18 years of his 33 yr tenure. Every trooper knew Bill, he was 6 ft 8. Actually taller than the regs would allow.. but at 20 he joined the HWY patrol, and the National Guard... After a couple of weeks out of the Academy, he got activated to go do his basic training and AIT. He was gone 4 months, and his height grew 8 inches in that time, when he was 20. When he comes back, he was already on the Hwy Patrol so they couldn't fire him because he gained 8 inches while doing his military training. Due to his height, he was the only Troop in the State Patrol that had his own cruiser assigned, because they had to move the front seat back like 6 inches to accommodate his height. He was also the only trooper that couldn't transport an arrest in his cruiser, because the seat being so far back...

I knew you never really win an argument with an LEO. Being a wise ass buys you no brownie points. I have had few tickets in my life time, when I am still driving for business anywhere from 40 to 60K miles a year. Been pulled over, but being respectful and telling the troop to tell me exactly what he wants me to do, has normally been appreciated by the LEO...What I see that Troopers and cops have to deal with in what we call "the public".. personally I don't see how they have the patience for it. In fact I've had many times of the times I've been pulled over that the officer has thanked me for being cooperative, thanked me for my service if they notice something that indicates I am a veteran, and send me on my way, telling me to have a safe trip....

The guy in the car was just an A hole in my book. Any cop with a backbone would have told him its no problem. Call a tow truck, haul him in his car to impound, give him a night to sleep off his A holyness... and let him present his case to the judge in the morning...

Sure there a few A Hole cops, in ratio, there is a boat load more A Holes in the General Public.

any LEOs on here, thank you for your service to your communities, in spite of the communities lack of appreciation for what you do...

The rest of you.. Flame away, but I stand behind the LEOs.. Most I've ever met have been very respectable guys...
and I've always been the type if they are threatened by some one armed, and I have quick access I'll back them up...

and yeah, I've done that several times in my life...an LEO or a Service Member.. I see no difference... they are serving the public and our nation.

Driver is not real smart. It is not a good idea to instigate a pissing match with a LEO on the side of the road at night. I confess that I did not watch much at all of the video, but after the first minute or so told me all I needed to see. I have no idea what, if anything, the driver did wrong, nor do I have any idea what the laws governing such stops in this area are. What I do know is that the driver was stopped for some reason, legal or not. The LEO was not abusive, but the driver was being beligerant and a smart-ass. The driver may have been legally within his rights as to his actions as I don't know the local laws, but he was not very smart. Yeah, I know that some LEOs are [bleep] at times and this can be even worse if they are having a particularly bad day. However, the majority of them are not. I have found almost without exception, that if you treat them with common respect and courtesy, that is usually what you will receive in return. It is more than likely that if you are pulled over for something and really piss them off, they will find something to write you up for. If you really show your ass for no good reason and get very beligerant with them, things are probably not going to end well for you. If you act decently you may very well get a break. I have not been stopped very many times, but I have always acted respectfully and was polite. BTW - I have documented over 3 million miles driving for in a past life I was a professional driver, so I have "been there and done that". This includes twice that I recall disagreeing with the LEO, but I did so respectfully. Both of those times I was let go on my way with no charge. Another two times I was stopped for speeding and was guilty as can be, no argument. I was polite and compliant and asked if he could just make it a warning, and both times it was done as requested. Yeah, I didn't try to show them what a bad-ass I was and try to escalate the situation. You can disagree with them if you think you are right, but do so respectfully and reasonably. Otherwise, you are going to be on the losing end, right or wrong. If you think that you have been wrongfully sited or treated then take it to court. The reality is that you will probably loose without some really strong evidence in your favor. But, trying to intimidate a LEO on the side of the road somewhere at night is not real damn smart. Choose your battles wisely.

I'm not for stops without cause. It's usually pretty easy to find cause, though, if you want to have a talk with a driver.

Seriously?


"I confess that I did not watch much at all of the video, but after the first minute or so told me all I needed to see. I have no idea what, if anything, the driver did wrong, nor do I have any idea what the laws governing such stops in this area are. What I do know is that the driver was stopped for some reason, legal or not. "

Oh well he got called on his on the fly bullschit and his little power trip he is so accustomed too was 180 flipped on him.
Dude probably had "kick me" stuck on his back from jr high thru high school and dreamt of being a cop to have some power over people finally.

The I'm gonna get my payback finally stuff when I get a badge and a gun and be somebody in charge..


About 1/4 th of cops are LE for the need to have " power" solely as their base reason for becoming LE.
Alot of LE are this way and should not be in the job at all.
They are not out to serve and protect.
But out to intimidate to satisfy a desire for power they never had.
A individual reason known only to themselves and they like to think no one can see it.
IMO....

His whole world collasped around him once that driver stood his ground and called his bluff on the pretext for the stop.

Just looking at the cops facial expressions, hearing his vocal tone, and his body language tells alot about his real demeanor once his intial "power" as a authority figure he relies on was shifted away from him is pretty revealing.
Most Def a B type camouflaged in a uniform.


LE stops me for whatever reason.
Even if it is legit or Bullschit.
Hand over the DL, reg, insurance.
Ask why being stopped.
Let em do their job.
But I don't give them the satisfaction of anymore discussion than needed, no little pleasantries exchanged during the course of it all.
Or say fuuuking "thank you officer" once I can go.

All these little vocal interactions most people give LE beyond the minimal amount needed, feed a sense of power in a sublime way too a LE of this type.
Their is a difference in needed minimal info and discussion with a LE and those who fawn to them on a rountine stop.
Power hungry types like it when someone Kowtows to them and people dont even realize they are feeding that need for power to a authority figure many times.

Lots of dynamics going on in that vid.


When the 2nd officer showed up and basically went into CYA mode for both of them.

🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️
That was total surrender and please just leave and stop making us uncomfortable mode.
Make the ugly time go away sorta thing.
Humble pie time basically....

You can guarantee the next couple of encounters those 2 cops had with the general public over came their wounded lion feelings and built up their status of power in the mind once again.

cop probably thought he'd get him a dui in the middle of the night.

I got pulled over 5am going turkey hunting. I did nothing wrong, I took a right on a green arrow. Cop told me that there was no way I had the light timed that good and that I was really meaning to run a red light. He literally said that. "So I turned right on green", "yes". "What's the problem then?" He even wrote me a warning....

He was just bored and needed to meet quota or something.

Then one morning and took a right turn down a country road, my front drivers side tire touched the center line during the turn...as most of us do everyday at some point, etc. Cops, included. Just happened to be a cop coming my way and pulled me over. Joker was a dick.

Really? Are you saying that if you are speeding, and get pulled over for that, you are not required to show your license on demand in almost every state?

Not arguing, but I would like to understand your argument better.

Wow, simply wow. Illegal stop plain and simple. Officer got called out on it.

I got pulled over for going 1 mile over the speed limit once. I was very succinct and stern in my replies to the officer. He was on a serious power trip that morning. He knew it was a total bullshit stop, he knew that I knew, it was a total bullshit power trip stop.

Officer: Do you know why I pulled you over.

No

Officer: You were speeding.

How fast was I going"

Officer: 76 in a 75.

Incredulously, sarcastic. You pulled me over for 1 mile over the speed limit?

Officer: Where are you going.

Doesn't matter.

Officer: License, registration and proof of insurance.

He goes back to his car and returns with a warning ticket for 1 mile over.

Am I free to go?

Officer: yes

Roll up the window and take off. What a prick.

All because he was running speed control in the left lane on the interstate and and got all butt hurt when I went by him in the right lane. With my cruise set at 75. in

Least respectful I have been to any LEO in 55 years. Pisses me off to this day.

In Texas a vehicle can be stopped just to check for a drivers license and if a registration is checked and shown to not have valid insurance, the uninsured vehicle will be towed. Driver most likely jailed.

Yep. He's a co ck su cker not a hero.

Pretty sure if you’re operating a vehicle on a public road , you need to provide a license when stopped and asked. Many states I know a passenger doesn’t have to.

If it’s a bullschit stop, you address it with the judge.

That cop was young and clearly not comfortable dealing with a prick. Doesn’t mean he’s a bad cop. He’ll learn….or not.

IF they actually ARE lawful...

I can't imagine being in law enforcement and dealing with Azzholes like that guy, what a fxxcking prick!. As much as I believe in personal freedom and responsibility, we do accept certain rules and laws when we drive on public roads.

All your bloviating only means something IF the stop was a legitimate stop. The leo knew it wasn't. The driver knew it wasn't.

You guys keep missing the point in your attempt to prove how much you love cops or how much you hate people that are a-holes while sticking up for themselves.

I have gotten pulled over more than most. Have received tickets in over 10 states. Used to get pulled over 4 or 5 times for every ticket meaning I met a lot of officers on the side of the road. Pretty much every time he/she had a legal reason for stopping me. Only 1 time did a leo act stupid and I called her on it, rather directly but politely. I am not advocating challenging all cops. But when the cop actually engages in an illegal act in pulling you over for no reason, all your superfluous BS about how great cops as a whole are and how you should just give in goes right the hell out the door.

Umm, that equation starts with the leo abiding by laws. And when he/she doesn't, then his orders are not lawful.

Certainly are a lot of armchair warriors here that do not know their rights, do not know what the laws on the books are, and seemingly, do not (by default) give a crap about the rights of others.
Pity...

so we all watched the same video and i am amazed at all the different opinions on it
either i need to or others need to watch and listen to it again and see if they have the same opinion after

I'm sure the US Code on what a "driver" is has long been scrubbed but basically the original legal definition (paraphrasing here) was a person who made their income transporting goods and services on public highways and byways, like stage coach "drivers" and UPS "drivers". Everyone else was/is traveling. The term was conveniently transposed onto the general public when the FED RES/IRS were foisted onto the public. The concept of taxing amurikans with newly acquired mobility created by the automobile for travelling the highways and byways of this great nation (an obvious right) was too lucrative an idea to pass up so the powers that be conjured "registration and licensing" to procure their scam. This concept of a "privilege" to move about is bogus if you consider we have a right to private contract, to vote, the right to petition etc. etc. and the only way to exercise those rights is the ability to travel across this nation.

Just guessing, but time of day could have played into a profiling and more of a curious stop to check if the driver was sober or not. I would say the kid was wrong, but he was probably bored and an easy stop to make sure he didn’t let a drunk pass.

The driver was within his rights to not want an unwarranted stop, but he was enough of a bad ass, I’ll bet the officer was wishing he hadn’t stopped him.

Police work is thankless job anymore and you can’t hardly find anyone that would put up with the handcuffs that are placed on LEOs that doesn’t allow them much safety among the people he is trying to protect from the people that are real criminals.


Who would even want to be a cop these days?

It amazes me how many people do not know their constitutional rights. Some law-enforcement personnel take advantage of this and others get their asses handed to them and their departments get sued. Some police officers play by the rules and others don’t.The bottom line is know your rights. There are thousands if not tens of thousands of videos on YouTube pertaining to this. I highly recommend sitting back one evening And enjoying the entertainment.

Watched it and a little puzzled as to whether or not there was a reason for the stop. Clearly he was put off balance by the citizens attitude and didn't articulate his reason for the stop very well.

There well could have been PC for the stop if the officer ran the plate and there was a lack of proof of insurance on file.

But in the end, he may have just concluded it was more trouble than it was worth to push the issue. You don't have to file any reports if you just let him leave and get paid the same.

It's an attitude more and more new officers are displaying, the term they use is FIDO. Fugg It Drive On. Do as little as possible and be risk averse. Mirror the firemen, respond if sent, otherwise do nothing and wait for a call.

Problem is getting into the habit of doing as little as possible as a young officer will carry into their entire carreer and doesn't translate well when the sheet hits the fan and they have to decisively react.

I see what the problem is. Theres alot of people here that were taught to believe that cops are some form of ultimate authority not to be questioned and to always be respected. That's the reason they got out of hand over the years. You have personal rights and freedoms and every right to call them out on unlawful bullschitt at any place and time. People are learning their rights and always have cameras and cops can still unlawfully detain you and drag you in for not stroking his ego but he's going to lose his job and be starred right front center of a popular youtube video to never be hired by another county. Get the boot out of your mouths. Being a cop doesn't make one a good person. And again, you DO NOT have to follow unlawful commands.

What reason did the cop read the plate to begin with? What had the driver done that warranted the reading of the plate? Sounds like cop was fishing for something. Any cop can make up that they show you dont have insurance, now you must show me that you do....

I dont think you need a reason to read a plate, a plate is in "plain view."

Some agencies have plate readers equipped in their cars, looking for stolen cars.
When I worked uniform every day we got a "Hot Sheet" listing cars that were stolen, wanted in felonies, known to have wanted subjects ect, and some would scan car plates for stolen cars-"Hot Rollers" we called them. Some of the older officers would say "quit looking at that Hot Sheet, we aren't chasing any cars."
The modern plate readers are the automated continuation of these.

The police don't like it when "plain view " is on the other foot.

So insurance companies are required by law to report to the state dmv whether their current policy holders are up to date on their auto coverage?

Both were idiots.

End of argument

I dont think most cop cars have these.

He felt it was worth his time to type it in to his little laptop for some reason.

That's not the case in my state. Here you have to show proof of insurance if stopped.
Unsure about how it works in Michigan. Could be that you have to show proof of insurance when registering or renewing plates there. Doubt that they make the insurance companies provide it.

Here in NV and in many other states insurance companies are required to immediately report to DMV any lapse in coverage. As much as I dislike government in general, I like this law. Irresponsible drivers need a thump up the side of the head.

I shouldn't have to file a claim with my company and suffer higher rates for years, accordingly, if some slob druggie, or drunk, or simple idiot runs a light or stop sing and clobbers me.

Just another U TUBE moron wanting to show what a big set he had.

Had the cop had an old timer for a partner, the nightstick would have taken out a tail light (not on the moron's camera) and a ticket would be the result.

Police have a horrible job, worse now than any recent time.

"Get along, go along" having known many police as friends.

He made bad stop. Illegally detained a USC. Yes the safe play is to plead your case to the judge. He may not be a “bad cop” but he’s definitely a kid over his head and unprepared for his job. His only saving grace was he didn’t bow up and escalate it, likely because he realized he was wrong. That means he might have a chance to not be a piece of shît.

here lack of ins is an immediate suspension of registration and the reason for suspension is noted.

You forgot texting, believe it or not one out of four accidents in the United States is from texting. I just googled it :-)

In Utah insurance companies are required by law to provide the dmv of proof of insurance for all drivers.

Ah, yes, crooked cops are the answer.

Moron.

Y'all just made me go print our a current insurance card, havent had a new one in my vehicle in years.

In Louisiana, the man in the video would have been in the wrong, maybe even arrested. You can not refuse to identify yourself, give your address, or explain your actions. That's the law.

here lack of ins is an immediate suspension of registration and the reason for suspension is noted.


yep, all it takes is some studying of the vehicle code. really want to get deep in the weeds so to speak learn the FMCSA laws.

i'm willing to bet it's both here the ins company is mandated to notify DMV immediately of any lapse. a vehicle operator is also required to have proof of insurance in his vehicle to produce on demand

I wonder what percentage of the at fault are female?

In MI, insurance status is attached to the registration and updated every two weeks last i recall. It’s common for folks to buy a short term policy to renew their plates not knowing that information gets transmitted to the sec of state. When that happens, the registration is updated to reflect fraudulent application for insurance

Looks like two dicks crossed paths. The third guy just wants to smooth things over and get the hell outta there.

No respect

No. But this guy didn’t get pulled over for speeding. This was an illegal stop.

How much respect did the officer earn? A badge alone does not command respect.

Exactly!!

Are you saying you support unlawful stops? And illegal activity by officers? Because having this parked car towed illegally would not be a good look.

Yes, you can win arguments with highway patrol. I’ve done so twice. It’s amazing how differently they behave when being filmed. The last time I was pulled over was around 11 years ago. The officer pulled me over for speeding a whopping two miles an hour. He said that I looked uneasy and upset (I just left the hospital where my grandmother died 20 minutes earlier). He then demanded to search my truck.

I refused his search. He proceeds to tell me he’s never had an innocent man refuse a search. My demeanor changed at this point. I tell him “I’ve never had an [bleep] cop ask to search me before, it’s a first for us both.” He then asks me to come to his cruiser, tells me “the K-9 unit is on its way”. I tell him he has fifteen minutes to charge me or I’m leaving. He continues to ask me questions. After twenty minutes I get up and go back to my truck. He flings his door open and starts yelling at me telling me I couldn’t go. I flipped him the bird and yell “Rodriguez, [bleep]” and drive away.

Same trooper later got disciplined and later fired for stalking and harassment.

My friend got pulled over by the same guy on his way to work at 0600. He was pulled over for speeding, again two MPH. He shined his light into the truck bed and saw a beer can crumbled up. He then told him he was under suspicion of DUI. He blew a 0.00, the trooper refused to accept that, put him in cuffs and hauled him to the county sheriff’s office for a blood draw. It was also negative. He then reluctantly released him. My friend asked how he was supposed to get back to his truck, to which the trooper told him to get a cab.

Many cops are indeed jerks and they do operate outside the law. It shouldn’t be tolerated.

The occurrences of such defining evidence from this one are stacking up daily.

The driver was perfectly in the right legally, but boy did he go out of his way to antagonize the cops. I understand being pissed for being stopped/questioned for no reason, but this guy is asking for retribution. Spewing F-Us with impunity seems to be old hat for this guy. He was lucky he did not run into some young hothead egomaniac and get dragged from his vehicle and beat to a pulp or shot for resisting. He would still be in the right legally, but beat up or shot nonetheless.

My whole perspective on LEO changed thirty years ago when my best friend from high school became highway patrol and I started hanging out socially with many of them.

They are just like any other group of individuals. Some good, some bad.

Unfortunately now a days. The good ones are smart enough to pick another career.

The LEO in the video is either a bad one, or a good one that made a mistake. Only time will tell.

From what I saw, there was no probable cause to stop. Had the LEO actually stated something, he would have been 100% covered by law. Which my association with LEO over the years actually means nothing. Heard it stated many times. If I want to pull someone over, there is always a reason. Right or wrong that is the way it is.

Sounds like a lottery winner.

It does for me until actions prove otherwise.

The stopped SOB should have been dragged out of the vehicle and been beat down. F these social justice warriors!

Ve must see zee papers! Out of zee automobile! Fuch your “constitution”!

The premise for the stop was flawed from the jump. Why is that so hard to understand?

Odds of a Molon Labe bumper/window sticker on the vehicle of all the 'cooperate' crew? 80% or better I'd say.


Ironical

Wow.

Lots of internet law experts here. Please post the year you passed the bar.

No, he should have never been stopped in the first place. There was absolutely no valid probable cause stated by the LEO.

Does one have to be a lawyer to know the Constitution and to know one’s rights…?

Well, now we know where Elkslayer is.

Meanwhile, a week later the same "gentleman" is being robbed and calls the police late in the evening. Dispatcher puts the call out to the police and they say, "Probably best to wait until tomorrow morning when we can have a supervisor present." LoL

It sucks to live in Uvalde.

I’m really surprised that a Michigan State Trooper wasn’t better prepared to handle that situation. That’s got to be a practical evolution in every academy. It didn’t appear to me that he was very confident in his position. If he made a legal stop, he has all the authority he needs. If he didn’t, he needs to be retrained or held accountable if it involved misconduct.

I probably made 20,000 traffic stops in my career. Never, did I make one without reasonable suspicion. That’s what the law requires. Once I made the stop, the first thing I did was introduce myself and explain the reason for the stop. We were not going to debate or negotiate. How I was treated went a long way towards determining whether a person was cited for a traffic violation, given a written warning or arrested, if appropriate. Be decent to me and I’ll be polite, professional and understanding. Be a dick and you get what the law requires. 99 percent of the people I dealt with understood that.

Even if you are certain that you’re right, your chances of winning an argument alongside the road are very slim. Your signature on the summons is not an admission of guilt, but a promise to appear in court. I had occasion to deal with individuals such as this guy a couple dozen times. It’s part of the job. I never let them dictate how things were going to go. Anything that I have to do, or anything he had to do, was decided by the courts long before I made the stop.

Telling me to spit it out, or that I was dismissed, would not have worked in his favor. My traffic stops were filmed and recorded during my entire career. They will be retained for 99 years as Virginia law requires. There’s nothing on any of them that I’d be embarrassed to have seen publicly. All that said, seeing this video just reaffirms how happy I am that I retired 4 months ago. This is somebody else’s problem from now on.

I hope, for the sake of public safety, that young Trooper gets the retraining he clearly needs. If not, he will be a liability.

Years ago, had a deputy sheriff tell me he automatically pulled over anyone that looked young, if they were out after midnight. Asked him him about the justification and he laughed, said he just claimed every single one of them was weaving erratically if the reason for the stop became an issue.

He probably kept quite a few drunk kids off the road, didn't make it right though.

Lots of police do this. It is profiling. But acting suspicious is not a crime, and probable cause that a crime is, was, or is about to be committed must be present for police to detain you and demand identification. A police officer has no right to ID you if he does not have PROBABLE cause that a crime is, was, or is about to be committed by you. They can ask for it all they want but have no legal recourse if you refuse, as happened in the video.

I would suggest some of the legal scholars here on the Fire, take the time to learn what the terms they use actually mean. To name a couple…Probable Cause. It’s required to make an arrest. Reasonable Suspicion, it’s required to detain someone or to make a traffic stop. From that, Probable Cause may be developed or further investigation may determine that you no longer have Reasonable Suspicion. The person is then free to leave. Google them!

Correct. I used the terms incorrectly but the premise remains.

I always liked when I'd get the ole "what are you a lawyer?" when I would stand up for my rights or quote the law which is my due diligence as a citizen but they're sure quick as schitt to say that ignorance of the law is no excuse to break it, if I didn't know something that I did was unlawful. I bypassed a dangerous intersection one day by going through an adjacent parking lot and using an entrance/exit that was much safer, got pulled over and hassled by some cop that seemed to want to escalate everything at every word because it was apparently called "shortcutting" and was a city ordnance violation or something like that. I asked just how in the hell was the average citizen supposed to know that and asked if they send out mailers with all of the laws and ordnances to the residents AND anyone that may pass through. He about blew his top to that and thank God his superior walked up in time and told him to chill out and let me go. I have issue with flexing authority over victimless crimes.

I appreciate you recognizing that. However, those terms have real meaning. Kind of similar to the difference between Rights versus Privileges. They may seem the same but there is a huge difference.

So you maintain YOUR game plan would be to argue with the LEO?

Well I support YOU doing that every time you get pulled over... when things don't turn out like you were expecting, remember it was YOUR fault and no one else's not even the cops..

You don't like the length of one of my posts, there is a simple alternative.. don't read the friggin thing...
Pretty simple ain't it...

Enjoy you conversation with LEO the next time you get pulled over.. and remember.. DON'T LET HIM GIVE YOU!!!! ANY CRAP.

Got that once for a useless stop. My tracks were actually quite clear in the fresh snow behind me, and I had only traveled a block after pulling out of the lot. Actually, my tags were within 1 day of expiring and I suspect that was the real reason. It takes significant effort to weave around with a long bed F350 crew cab. Asked if I'd been drinking and I was on my way. He was a new town mounty.

Near all of our local and state boys are really fine folks.

Across about 60+ years of driving, I've found "yes sir - no sir" seems to work pretty well.

NO, I saying pick your battles, when things are in your favor... they are NOT in your favor off the side of the road.... a little cooperation goes a long way...how many guys that are pulled over, think that is an opportunity to argue with an LEO, with the delusions they are going to prevail. Doesn't take a genius to figure that out. I respect the uniform and also respect what these gentlemen put up with daily. Being cooperative has always served me better, that trying to win an argument with a cop on the side of the road..

The times I have gotten a ticket, I have gone into court, and being reasonable and not acting like a victim, I've prevailed each time except about TWICE.

You guys do it your way, and I'll do it my way. Mine has worked out WELL for me over the last 50 plus years...and I'm on the road 30 to 40,000 miles on the road annually, and in the past its been more like 50 to 60K annually.

Even if the cop in an A Hole, I am still going to show him and his uniform the respect I think they deserve. Same way I respect an EMT or Paramedic ( of which I use to be both) or respect anyone who has put on a uniform and served our country....and yeah there are A Holes in those groups also..
but RESPECT and cooperation goes a lot further than being contrary with authority, whether they are right or wrong...I've been lucky enough to present myself in a way, that the judge saw it my way in most of the times I've been in front of them.

do whatever works for you.. same to all the others on this thread.

it was evident as hell, that the guy was fresh out of State Trooper School.. and was an unsure of himself as possible...

but why take that as an insult and get in an argument over it..

if the clown driving hadn't taken it as an invitation to argue with the cop, he would have been on his way, long before the 15 minutes he spent waiting for the kids "supervisor" to show up.. It wasn't his time.. it was him not being able to miss the opportunity, of his ego having to prove a cop was wrong...play stupid games and then complain about stupid consequences...

I bet the driver LIVES to be pulled over to just show the Michigan Highway Patrol what a bad ass he is...

This isn't about people's rights, the guy was 100% of proving a cop wrong, when the opportunity presented itself..

I'll bet since then, this guy has had his car impounded and been hauled off in cuffs in the back of a troopers Cruiser...

The driver was an idiot. and the cop hadn't been on the streets long enough to be wet behind the ears...

Never get pulled over

Sometimes getting into it with them on the side of the road is what saves these folks that got violated because they had their camera on and the cops kept digging themselves deeper.

You hitting the sauce tonight? Or have you always had this reading comprehension problem?

I’d ask you specifically, how would you feel if an LEO stirred you from your sleep in your bed at 3:30 am this morning g and demanded you prove that you had a right to be in your own home? Mind you, the leo would have had to break into your home to wake you from your sleep. How would you respond?

Jeff stands on a public sidewalk holding a "God Bless the Homeless Vets" sign. You should watch some of the reactions he gets.

Just shut up and comply, don’t ask questions, do what you are told do not question authority! Exercise your rights or you will lose them.

Driver acted like an azzhole and the officer DID explain the reason for the stop. Lucky to get off without and obstruction charge.

Dinny, With all due respect the police officer did not pass the bar either. it is our duty as American citizens to know our constitutional rights. You might not agree with the way that the individual expressed Himself to the police officer, neither do I he was a bit of a dick, But at the end of the day he was right.

Obviously does work for me. That's why I've never even been written a citation. I let them know they are being filmed. I am always courteous, but the moment the cop becomes an [bleep], so do I.

The officer explained he did something ILLEGAL.

Lol as a prior State trooper, it would not have ended well for that driver. If indeed he did break the law. Looks like the troopers either new, or a couple pussies

I think every patrol car here has a plate reader.

If it says the car is uninsured, that's against the law.

So how would this be an illegal stop.


Lotta guys throwing out "Illegal Stop" and insinuating anyone who doesn't know that is a Dumbass.

Well, I know my dumbass don't know a bunch of stuff, including this.

Someone kindly explain how, if his computer tells him the car isn't
insured, pulling it over to check is an illegal stop?








Daughter got pulled over a 2 years ago because her plate was registered to a Subaru but it was on an Impala.


Was that a legal stop?

Or should the trooper ignore what could easily be a stolen car
(or a stolen plate being used in a crime)?

FullFan
Please tell us what you would have done. Legal or not.
Charlie

In many states, courts have determined it illegal for an officer to pull over a vehicle for a secondary offense, which having no insurance is a secondary offense. Many states have automated systems when it comes to uploading proof of insurance, but they may only be updated monthly or bi-weekly. I believe the officer admitted he SOLEY made contact with drive because of information in the LEIN systems, not because of a primary offense.

I stand corrected, pretty sure you would have handled this situation much better than the LEO in the video.

no valid insurance is a primary offense here.


in fact I can easily articulate that the stop was made in good faith. if the officer runs the plate and mistakenly types in a wrong digit does that mean the stop is blatantly illegal or is he still conducting the stop in good faith based on the information given to him?

trooper gave me the impression he is new. sometimes simple things like confirming the plat gets missed. I am not sure if that's what happened. but it's happened to me. I ran a plate once that came back expired. lit em up, got em stopped and confirmed the plate. Comm center requested a phone call from me and explained that there was a mis type in the number. I got out walked up to the driver and said have a nice day I fat fingered the wrong number on your plate. turned around, got in my car and left

Posited that possibility a few pages ago.

But, the science is settled, as to this bein an improper stop.

Shows how easy, the "science" can get "settled".

There is no way to truly determine whether a stop was legal or not until all the facts are found.

Lots of overzealous cops go fishing and count on the encounter being being consensual. They get away with it a lot.

When you try those things on a guy in the OP they can and do go south very quickly. As demonstrated in that video.

I’d love to see the texts and hear the calls between the cop initiating the encounter and calling his buddy. LOL

Driver had NO EXCUSE for being a foul mouthed disrespectful azzhole period !

YYou hitting the sauce tonight? Or have you always had this reading comprehension problem?

I’d ask you specifically, how would you feel if an LEO stirred you from your sleep in your bed at 3:30 am this morning g and demanded you prove that you had a right to be in your own home? Mind you, the leo would have had to break into your home to wake you from your sleep. How would you respond?


1. Nope.. Don't use alcohol.
2. Reading Comprehension Problems? Of course, I usually ignore real dumbass questions..
3, How would I respond? Ummm, how about.. You're a Fuggin Idiot!

Would that work for ya? Sure works for me as that is all I am seeing in your responses.

have fun enjoying your bong all day.

Show us on the doll where the mean police officer touched you.

Last year, when you were still in high school, did you get picked on by someone who is a police officer now?

Correction: the officer SAID he ran the plates and came back no insurance. Based on how he handled himself when challenged how he did that, the officer’s stumbling and uncertainty screams of deception. Meaning, I am not all that convinced he really did run it and it came back no insurance. If he did actually do that, he could have shut the guy down in a heartbeat.

Fast forward to about 5:00 and based on the conversation, officer ran the plates and it came back good. Now knowing the insurance was in place, and the driver would obviously know he had insurance, challenging the officer’s assertion he had run plates prior to the stop adds credence to the appearance the officer was lying.

The fact neither officer pursued the driver for failure to provide dl and insurance just adds to the smell that this wasn’t right from the get-go.

LOL

They're a bunch of jack booted oath breakers and you're likely a dumbfugg with a Gadsen flag and back the blue on your tailgate.

Nice try avoiding the question. If an leo illegally approached you and gave you an order you knew to be unlawful, how would you respond?

Lay down and show him your belly and privates?

That’s the distinction. A-hole driver was very confident the leo was lying and fishing. He called him on it and based on the leo and his buddy’s response, the a-hole driver was right.

As to the reading comprehension issue, I made it clear I’ve had far more encounters with LEOs than most and I admitted to only really challenging one once, and I believe my language was that I did it politely. And yet you jump up and down and claim my plan is to yell at every leo I encounter. This website might help you a bit:

www.rif.org

You are being obtuse. If you know the officer acted illegally to be in the position he is (illegally enter your home or conduct an illegal traffic stop) all this other ranting and raving is bs.

Exactly.

Watch the video, and use your noggin. Cop was fishing and got busted.

Yer thinking and logic is ffed up, the cops were not dicks and deserved some respect. Although it does sound like you have alot of experience with this.

Laughing

Try walking then, it's a privilege to drive on a road built with money other than your own

I sure hope you never have to rely on a police officer. If you do, I hope they tell you to GFY!

Rely on them for what, to show up after the fact and take a report? Supreme Court already ruled that its not the job of the police to protect the citizens, which makes them nothing more than revenue generators. You were raised to always respect the law by somebody that assumed that "police are the good guys." Just wait until you're wrongfully on the otherside of the coin and your opinion will change.

Oh yeah, those leos were jack booted oath breakers, got it.

This will never happen, I'm living my life right.

I'm not a lawyer, but you can read it for yourself....

Art. 215.1. Temporary questioning of persons in public places; frisk and search for weapons

A. A law enforcement officer may stop a person in a public place whom he reasonably suspects is committing, has committed, or is about to commit an offense and may demand of him his name, address, and an explanation of his actions.

B. When a law enforcement officer has stopped a person for questioning pursuant to this Article and reasonably suspects that he is in danger, he may frisk the outer clothing of such person for a dangerous weapon. If the law enforcement officer reasonably suspects the person possesses a dangerous weapon, he may search the person.

C. If the law enforcement officer finds a dangerous weapon, he may take and keep it until the completion of the questioning, at which time he shall either return it, if lawfully possessed, or arrest such person.

D. During detention of an alleged violator of any provision of the motor vehicle laws of this state, an officer may not detain a motorist for a period of time longer than reasonably necessary to complete the investigation of the violation and issuance of a citation for the violation, absent reasonable suspicion of additional criminal activity. However, nothing herein shall prohibit a peace officer from compelling or instructing the motorist to comply with administrative or other legal requirements of Title 32 or Title 47 of the Louisiana Revised Statutes of 1950.

How is it a primary offense when it cannot be the reason to make the stop in the first place? Something else must be the primary offense. For instance in my state, it is unlawful for an officer to make a stop for a seat belt violation, but they can give a citation for it as a secondary offense. This is also true for insurance.

Lmfao 😂. Tell that to the fuggs that have been unfortunate enough to be wrongfully accused or on the wrong side of Johnny dick after he walked in on his neighbor plowing his wife and needs to take out his frustrations by abusing authority. I can post video after video here showing these types of rEsPeCtFuL AuThOrItY.

Clearly. If Jr had had actual probable cause and had actually received a lack of insurance report, Tyrone would have ended up being cited. That'd been a different scenario which, here in this thread, is not being discussed, although it appears that it is the scenario in some guy's heads. It's good to see pro-LE folks agree, bogus detainment.

Yes, the officer was being a dick. His actions were not justified. He had no legal authority to initiate contact and detain the USC.

I’ve stayed out of this but it seems to stirred up a hornets nest.
My opinion is after watching the video, the driver was wrong. In certain circumstances he could have been in some real trouble. That doesn’t let the officers off. Had they perused aggressive actions with him they would’ve been liable for false arrest but the driver gave them plenty of excuse to arrest him. The young officer made a mistake snd compounded it by not coming clean. He was fishing and he came up dry.
The whole thing was a stupid venture. There’s no excuse to go cussing an officer and officers have more to do than harass innocent citizens without good reason.
Just my .02

You said the magic words...."In my state". Not all states are the same. In La. seat belt violation is a primary offense and you can be stopped for anyone in the vehicle not wearing one. The driver is responsible for his passengers.

What does the LEO lovers think about this scumbag POS.

Told him if he did provide the requested documents, he would be removed from his vehicle and arrested.

In my 25 years I ran into this twice. Both were sovereign citizens. Both were educated real fast. By being removed from their vehicles and arrested as John Does. Both were taken before the local judge. One was incarcerated for a week before he decided it was a stupid to play a game
he could not win. The other gave his info when taken before the judge . Both ended up with hefty fines, tow bills and impound fees.

We have laws in Pa where when asked by a LEO to provide identification, you must comply.

Thanks for making the world a safer place. LOL. I imagine you got jollies scaring teenage kids too.

Depends on the circumstances.

Even in “stop and identify” states, the law only requires you to show the police your ID ‘if’ the police 1) pull you over for a traffic violation, or 2) detain you on a reasonable belief of criminal activity.

But aside from those two instances, you are ‘not’ required to identify yourself to police or to answer their questions…in ‘any’ state in America.

no seatbelt is a secondary offense here too. Insurance companies are required to notify our DMV as soon as any lapse of coverage occurs. theDMV then suspends the registration for 3 months. the reason for suspension is attached when we run a plate and it comes back suspended

Wasn't he parked and the LEO pulled up, blocked him in and initiated the contact and detainment? Com'on man.

Never say never! Let's say I'm a cop, I see you walking down the sidewalk, I believe you might be going to rob a store, and I stop you. In La. you are required by law to give you name, address, and an explanation of your actions.

You dont have to answer me, but you will be arrested if you dont.

I realize that is a is a simple example, but that's how easy it is. If you do anything to arouse suspicion, they can stop you.

Even in “stop and identify" states, cops can only lawfully order people whom they reasonably suspect of a crime to provide ID. If there is not reasonable suspicion that a crime has been committed, is being committed, or is about to be committed, an individual is not required to provide identification, even in Louisiana.

Who do you suppose the judge is going to side with?

It's your word against the LEO's on why he stopped you. How do you think that will go. Also, the stop doesn't have to be in a vehicle.

I got stopped for driving slowly by a grammer school, a few years ago. I was lost and trying to find my way out of a neighborhood and drove by the school, looking down the streets to maybe see a red light or a major intersection. When I explained that I was lost and my DL showed I wasn't from this area, the cop showed me the way back out to the highway. To the best of my knowledge, there is only 1 way in-n-out of the place.

So what was I doing wrong? Did he have reason for suspicion? I hadn't broken any laws. I had every right to drive down those streets.

See how easy it is to have a reason to stop someone.

Added: Define reasonable suspicion. Your definition better be the same as the LEO's.

There are crooked judges that wipe their ass with the Constitution and citizens rights just like there are crooked cops that wipe their ass with the Constitution and citizens rights.

Without regard to whom may ultimately be correct relative to the circumstances...............

Litigating the concept, in the middle of the night, with a guy that can beat TF outta you/kill you, and get away with it, is not the best approach.

Antlers, I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just saying if the LEO wants a reason to stop you, he'll come up with one. When he does, in La., you better give your Id, etc.

You are correct, sir. They often do it in unison.

Reasonable suspicion must be based on "specific and articulable facts", "taken together with rational inferences from those facts", and the suspicion must be associated with the specific individual; and evaluated using the standard that other LEO’s in the same circumstances would also reasonably suspect that a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity.

These are legal statutes that are based on actual court cases.

It was not a traffic stop.

Ok... This happened to a relative, while visiting another relative.

There had been several robberies at night in the neighborhood. My relative, from out of town, was walking his dog, on a leash, around a couple of blocks, just at dark. He was stopped, questioned, and they escorted him to the relative that lived in the area, for positive identification.

Reasonable suspicion, i dont think so. If that's the case, where do you start and stop. 2 Blocks away, 5 blocks away, a mile away? White man, black man, oriental man? What about if it had been a woman walking the dog, would that have made the officer change his mind and let her walk?

All it boiled down to was the he was a stranger in the area, walking around, just at dark. Because of that, he was stopped, questioned, and they verified his story.

Tell you what you do..... come to La. and test what you know/believe and see if it works. If you keep you mouth shut or refuse to give your Id, etc, I'll bet you wind up in jail. And I'll also bet the judge will agree with the LEO.

Like I said earlier, there are crooked judges that wipe their ass with the Constitution and citizens rights just like there are crooked cops that wipe their ass with the Constitution and citizens rights.

Y'all have got me convinced.

It is just the same as some innocent Jew in Warsaw in 1942 getting hauled off to Auschwitz by the Gestapo.

A person driving a car in America was asked to show ID.

Why even start an argument with an LEO? Does getting stopped to answer a few questions bother this many people that much?

Are you guys that intimidated by an LEO giving you some brief attention? Is that your reason for getting testy real quick.

ALL you guys who are arguing over all of these " citizens rights" stands, makes me respect LEOs all the more, if they are dealing with that high of a percentage of wannabe hard asses every day.

When I have shown courtesy and cooperation with a LEO, I HAVE NEVER had one go out of his way to give me a hard time...

I know in Washington State, they have two really vague laws up there, that arguing with an LEO when pulled over, can result in a $500 fine each.
If you start to argue with a cop right off the bat, slander them or start yelling... you are looking at two $500.00 fines/citations... You wanna push it, you'll be given evening accommodations in their Citizens BADBOYS Bed and Breakfast, with a free trip there and a free trip in front of the judge. Then when you get out, you can go down and pay a nice sized fee for the impounding and towing of your vehicle.

If you want to show an officer whose boss, I wouldn't recommending doing that up in Washington State.

I got pulled over in Washington a number of years ago for not using my turn signal changing lanes. Turned out my bulb was burnt out and the car had no indicator light on the instrument panel. I was respectful to the officer, and after giving me a citation for a burnt out bulb, he told me about those two laws, and told me that he could have given me tickets for those. and what the fines were. He showed up in court when I went in to speak to the judge, on something else. But he told the judge I was very respectful during the stop and stopped at an autoparts store to replace the bulb, immediately at the next exit. He passed by and saw me doing so in the parking lot.

The judge thanked me for being respectful to the LEO, and considering the situation, she excused the citation.

It was not a traffic stop. LOL

Your analogy is weak.
If you somehow think this is the same situation, you need to move to a communist country and see how that works for you.

And I know what you're reply will be.

Then how do you assume it is in the state which the video was made?

Yep.

Yep.
So what you're saying is LEO can be corrupt, disingenuous, and lie to get what they want?

You're saying to you support LEO doing something illegal, and support them MORE for having to deal with people who don't want their rights violated? Interesting perspective.

I'm not a sovereign citizen type. At least not overtly.
Maybe covertly. I tend to analyze rules and laws, then pick and choose
those I follow based on relevance. Most folks do that, right?


Sure, when I decided to not get my car inspected, the cop had to
pull me over when he saw a sticker 1 year outdated.
Was respectful, enough so that he asks if he could put me on a list his supervisor would contact to evaluate him. His supervisor about choked when told I was kinda glad it happened. Our daughters were in the car and got to experience a stop and how to act during one.


However, the PSP set up on the road through the old industrial park that also serves as a shortcut. Road block in the middle of the day, checking papers. Tell me that isn't Gestapo shït.

Only two things missing,
The accent,
And they specify documents instead of calling them "Papers".


Been checked a couple times, they found no problems.
However, every check made me increasingly madder.

To the point my wife warned me they were there, and I went that way
intending to turn around in a visible(to them) driveway and go the opposite direction.
Just to see if they would chase me. Planning to tell them I had more right to turn around then they did to set up fishing stations and screw with citizens doing absolutely nothing wrong on a workday afternoon.

Probably a good thing they had left.
I was spoiling for a fight. (Wife saw me going that way and was scared)
And like many have said here, you buck Johnnie Law, he gonna climb on his high horse and ride right over you.

Fear them? Hell no.
Resent? Damn straight.

Coming after me for actually breaking a law?
Bring it on, I'll pay the fine. Earned it, deserve it, no problem.

Fūcking with me because a uniform gives you power,
fishing expeditions, (which I now see the OP was)
IDGAF what SCOTUS has ruled. It is obvious the intent of the
Bill of Rights was to never allow LEOs to do such stuff.




PS. Look into comparisons between American Law Enforcement and their compatriots in most of our "equivalent" nations.

American cops do things on a routine basis that would get Them in a world of hurt in Europe.

They don't even release the names of people charged with crimes. Something about Innocent until Proven Guilty and destroying a person's reputation.

We on the other hand, frog march the poor bastard in front of cameras that were notified to be there.
Showing that supposedly Innocent (until Proven guilty) as a prisoner and in the worst possible way on major media.

Has this guy been nominated for his Presidential Medal of Freedom yet?

Do you not see the authoritative contradiction in that?

I haven't assumed anything. I was just making the point that the laws can be different in the states. What primary on one state is often secondary in another.

Not a traffic stop. LOL

LOL

Of course there are some bad ones, but that's not saying the majority are bad. I'm saying that if you are stopped by a LEO in La. and he ask for your ID, you are required by law to provide it. Also, they are allowed to stop you if you are committing a crime, have committed a crime, or believe you are about to commit a crime.

A black man walking in a white neighborhood or white man walking in a black neighborhood is gonna get stopped. You haven't committed a crime, but if you don't provide the ID, etc., you will go to jail for failing to.

If you don't want to give it to him, that's your business..... enjoy your stay in jail!

Okay Einstein... Walk up... punch a bear in the nose... See what happens...

maybe that is why CB slang for a cop was " A Bear"....

Smart people chose their battles.. dumb ones don't.

What I see is the end results.. what benefits does one gain by fighting their system ?

you pet a dog, it wags its tail... you slap a dog its gonna bite you...

what part of that is so hard to figure out?

If anyone feels that they have no problem paying fines and having the citation put on the driving record and their insurance goes up for 3 years, as long as they proved their point and felt they Rule the world for standing up for what they see as their "rights".. who am I to get in their way?

We each walk our own paths...I just don't feel like contributing to government coffers..

do what ever one needs to do, if that is the outcome that they seek. They seek theirs and I seek mine.

Shefire is on a roll......

Seafire, my point was that the officer "in charge" was indicating that he was doing you a favor for not writing you a citation for an offense that you never even committed. This is where crap starts to go sideways.
I really don’t care if his old lady might not have given him any the night before, the law should work both ways.

The police have given me more breaks than I deserve....Try doing 95 and getting a failure to observe a posted sign violation. The sign was a 55 MPH sign. No points, pay the fine and "I hope I don't have to stop you again. Have a good day." In addition when I saw him, i just pulled over. He only had to ride up the berm to get to me. That is only one of a few. Speeding in Ohio coming back from SD hunting. Pull over far into the grass so his ass isn't hanging out on the interstate. He notices and comments, and says if your license checks out, you are not getting a ticket. "Thanks, have a safe trip home." Have yet to have a problem with the police and until I do, consider them on my side.

Addition: These let's make the Police look like fools videos are a current you tube money maker. So let's set up a situation were we have them mistakenly pull us over, record it, we act like HA abused citizens, and get money hits on you tube, Has little to do with anything else. The more cars they can pull in the more hits.

Thanks!

I understand your point.. I'd have just handled it different.

I've had several sales positions, that I was assigned to handle government accounts, that had a lot of "service problems", and dissatisfaction, which resulted in lost business... it was my job on those accounts to turn them around...which I always did...I guess I was good at seeing both sides and coming to a solution....The Civilian in the car was just out to start an argument, whether the cop was right or wrong in stopping him. he esculated the incident, when it didn't need to be... and what was his motive in pursuing that route except being a dickhead to the cops....

everyone makes mistakes on a job... what does someone accomplish by trying to show case it and make others look bad, for his own personal entertainment...I'd put good money on it, the civilian, since this video was made, has talked his way into a jail cell and having his vehicle impounded.

Great post.....

Yeah, the bad cops give the other 5% a bad name.

Therein lies the problem. Cops are given too much power, more than most are mature enough to handle.

Its quite the opposite of what you describe. Nobody is walking up and punching a bear in the nose. People are going about their business and the bear throws a boulder in front of them, goes on a power trip, and makes a bunch of irrational demands and then gets excited to "make an example" of somebody that wants to be left alone.

What most people want is to be left alone. Cops are willing to break the law for an opportunity to eventually catch a criminal using some form of technicality or by outright violating the rights of the individual. Like the dumbfvck cop that pulled me over at 0200 hrs for "crossing the centerline" on a gravel road one night. He ASSUMED I was breaking the law, had no evidence, and no reasonable reason to stop me so made up something as dumb as that.

Here's a decent recap of the BS that went on in Brookside. All those "good cops" from the country sheriff's office and the state police looked the other way and let this go on for years.

Like I said earlier in the post, just go onto YouTube and check out some bad cops, lackluster is just one of thousands. This is just my opinion, coming from a family And friends in law-enforcement NYPD, Jersey troopers Pennsylvania trooper, And local Pennsylvania municipalities. they all think for the most part law enforcement personnel have changed dramatically in the past 20 years, And not for The better. There are some fantastic cops out there, very professional very courteous. And then there are some complete tyrants, unprofessional, not very courteous individuals That will lie to pull you over and try to get you on other Infraction. Because of cameras they getting caught. in 2021 the New York City Police Department paid over $206 million in lawsuits, That’s a lot of money. Another thing that amazes me is how many bootlickers there are to think that all cops are good and anybody that they pull over are [bleep]. Don’t need to be an attorney to know you a basic rights, constitutional rights. Always question authority! They are not all on your side.

We elect the fools that hire those corrupt officers and their Police Chief and Sherriff. We can stop the corruption anytime we want by electing honest people to protect and defend instead of harass and torture. The young officer in the video was allowed to harass citizens by stopping without reason. Somebody made that one of his charges. That's the person that needs to be on the carpet explaining why he did what he did. All that rannygazoo could've been avoided by the officer just apologizing and telling the guy he made a mistake. The guy could've just given the officer the dam proof he insisted on and went on his way instead of confronting him. Instead, it escalated almost to the point of becoming fatal. There's a fine line and they walked right up to the edge of it.

BIngo, and they're all extensions of government, which is never for the citizens.

Years ago while driving from MI back to IL a construction detour confused my mother and she drove all 4 of us kids into a rough neighborhood in Gary. A police officer pulled up next to our car while we were parked at a gas station and my mother was studying the atlas. He offered to escort us back to I-90 West. He was a rude, power-hungry man now wasn't he?

Another time in MI when I was even younger two officers pulled over to help my parents after our car broke down. IIRC, we had run out of gas and the officers drove my dad to the nearest station to fill a can and returned him shortly thereafter. Bad cops!

I recently witnessed a t-bone car accident involving a police car. He got hit on the passenger side. He wasn't mad at the other driver and although visibly shaken he was quickly out of his car and checking to see if the occupants were injured. When he kbew they were alive and didn't have any apparent life threats he went back to his car to anwser his radio. My wife and others had already called 911. He probably should have acted as judge, jury, and executioner according to some of you.

Our nation's police forces, like our military, are a microcosm of society. There are turds in both! I seriously doubt the turds account for more than 10% though.

It all depends on the pool they are drawn from. Look at what LE is faced with today, who is going to go into that job? Who's getting the fück out that's there now?

Just another arshole behind the wheel, he was antagonistic from the start.
Could easily just have rolled down the window, asked why he was stopped?
Provided his insurance and been gone in half the time.

Video the whole encounter or not, make a complaint later if he needed to show everyone how cool and tough he is.

Anyone who thinks they do that job, go apply and se how far you get or shut the fluck up!

If you pass the background, and go through a few doors first then maybe you can become an FTO and make a difference from within.
Bitching about cops behind your computer in your moms basement in Bemidji what bitch!

^ ^ ^
Softie.

The driver was knowledgeable and exercised his rights from the start.

Sounds like those fine officers did not violate the US Constitution. The ones in the video did. You are completely missing the point in your desperation to blindly support law enforcement. Officers that violate citizens rights and break laws are no better than the criminals. Encounters like this educate cops and citizens both. I think Ben Franklin said something about liberty, security, neither, blah blah blah.

I love how the masses on this site preach molon labe or however the hell you spell it, but when someone under the guise of authority breaks the law and infringes on someone's rights, so many are quick to jump up and say: "just go along and get along. That cop is probably a nice guy. A cop just like him helped me find my mother when I was lost at the county fair when I was 6 years old. Don't be mean or rude to any cops because of that."

He wasn't "stopped."


He was already parked, then blocked from leaving, and illegally detained without probable cause.


Sighhhhh.

Same püssies that have Molon Labe stickers that lined up for the jab.

A few years ago, I had a line of duty injury that was going to take at least a year to heal. I couldn’t stand the idea of sitting around all day at home. I was able to weasel my way into an administrative hearings examiner job that presided over probation violations. Basically, a half-azz probation judge. After a year of doing that, I learned how messed up other officers really were. That’s why I don’t sit around trying to defend everyone with a badge, even though I are one.

I have a really good friend who is high up in the state police. He has told me several times how corrupt the police often are and how they illegally profile and pull people over from bogus reasons. He's also told me how monthly quotas are are real thing. He said part of why he got promoted so quickly is because he wrote so many tickets in his early days.

I'm a bit pissed because I recently got a ticket for going 51 in a 45 although the cop pulled me over in a 55 zone. He said he clocked me in the 45 zone but my new truck tells me what the speed limit is. I looked down as soon as I saw him and it said 55 was the speed limit. It was the end of the month though. I questioned him on it and he said he actually clocked me at 56 so it didn't matter I was still speeding.

Bb

People are inclined to act toward others as others are acting toward them...

If someone is being a dick to a cop, then what reason does the cop have to NOT be a dick in return...

If an officer makes a mistake, point it out and don't be a dick about it...

Driver had a chip on his shoulder and was dead set on he had to show it off... and you guys are saying the cops in the video were the problem.

Stop would have taken a fraction of the time, If he didn't have to show off the big chip on his shoulder.. whole thing would have been no harm no foul...but NOPE, the driver picked the opportunity to be a dick about it...I guarantee the law of averages, if he acts like that all the time, I am sure at some point afterwards that type spent time in the back of a cruiser and a night in the local jail... and if he was like that in front of the judge, the court probably lightened his wallet some also....

Some of you boys are a little too sensitive if a cop pulls you over....

Cops are no different than I am... you show me respect, I show you respect... you don't show me respect and have a chip on your shoulder, that is what I am going to give you in return... many people will only mirror the attitude someone shows toward them... evidently more of you guys have problem with authority than I would have thought....

Yeah I chose to respect the badge, because I've ridden with my father in law in his cruiser more than once...more of the public are jerks than not..
of course I've also said on the campfire, I have more use for most dogs, than most people I meet in today's world... so I MUST BE the PROBLEM.

Anyone who knows me will tell you endlessly what a jerk I am.... ( that's sarcasm for those of you who can't figure that out )...

That, right there, is what makes us civilized....
Problem is, most ain't

What reason does a cop have to not be a dick in return? He’s supposed to be a professional and act in a way which he exhibits worthiness to the trust and authority the community entrusts him.