Best way to ship a rifle - 24hourcampfire

UPS, Fed Ex or USPS? Thanks.

I get far fewer questions and hassles when I use FedEx. USPS isn't bad, but occasionally you will get some dumb ass who asks too many questions and get the runaround. UPS store in my area just won't ship them at all.

In terms of what? security? damage prevention? cost? time?
What is your primary concern.
f its cost then breaking the rifle down into stock and action and shipping USPS priority in one of those triangle blueprint tubes is cheapest.
A hard case and FED EX EXPRESS overnight Air would reduce the damage risk but cost big bucks.

Last one came USPS. No damage.

Make it registered and insured.

Sorry, I need to be more specific. I'm shipping a Ruger 1B with nice wood in original box put inside a Remington box. Looking for hassle free, good package handling at a reasonable price. I asked the USPS woman about shipping a rifle and she said "you need a special transport license"!

Shes a stupid Min wage employee who knows jack [bleep]. Get a plain outer box with no gun reference on it. package the rifle to minimize any movement and take it to the USPS and ship it priority labeled. Tracking is free. insure it for what you need to.
Put the dealers name on the address, not the name of the shop. that will reduce intrusion better than "JOE BOBS GUNS AND CHIT" in the address.

Last one I shipped, I took over to my FFL dealer. He packed it, shipped it, handled the paperwork, and charged me $20.
To me, that is the best way to ship.

Originally Posted by GSP814

Sorry, I need to be more specific. I'm shipping a Ruger 1B with nice wood in original box put inside a Remington box. Looking for hassle free, good package handling at a reasonable price. I asked the USPS woman about shipping a rifle and she said "you need a special transport license"!

Ask for the supervisor or Station manager. Look at USPS reg 432.1 and DMM 601. YOU DON'T need no stinking special license.

I use FedEx because it is closer to my home

I have had one rifle lost with UPS that I sold to a member here, huge hassle. Other than that, I have always shipped USPS and never had a single problem. The USPS folks here are gun-friendly and one guy is always asking what I am shipping since he is a gun guy.

Originally Posted by GSP814

Sorry, I need to be more specific. I'm shipping a Ruger 1B with nice wood in original box put inside a Remington box. Looking for hassle free, good package handling at a reasonable price. I asked the USPS woman about shipping a rifle and she said "you need a special transport license"!

See my response above again about dumb asses you get sometimes at the USPS....

Originally Posted by Mannlicher

Last one I shipped, I took over to my FFL dealer. He packed it, shipped it, handled the paperwork, and charged me $20.
To me, that is the best way to ship.

When was this, 1960? It'll cost closer to $40 to ship a 10-pound 48"x8"x4" package with $1K insurance and it's been closer to that cost for a hell of a long time.

Poor advice on your part, but I'm not surprised.

Originally Posted by ringworm

then breaking the rifle down into stock and action and shipping USPS priority in one of those triangle blueprint tubes is cheapest.

If you are referring to one of the triangle tubes provided by the post office, it specifically says in the regulations (and maybe on the packaging itself) that they are intended for blueprints or such. I don't know if they would honor an insurance claim for damage. I agree with breaking it down but I would use a much more substantial package. Just food for thought.

I've shipped a bunch via the USPS...handguns and long guns...and have never had a problem at all. I ship them all by Priority Mail and insure every shipment. I don't offer any information on what it is that I'm shipping. I just ship it. No problems. Ever.

Originally Posted by GSP814

Sorry, I need to be more specific. I'm shipping a Ruger 1B with nice wood in original box put inside a Remington box. Looking for hassle free, good package handling at a reasonable price. I asked the USPS woman about shipping a rifle and she said "you need a special transport license"!

USPS is the most cost-effective means available.

USPS Priority Mail 2-Day for an 11-pound package measuring 48"x4"x8" with $1K insurance from New Jersey to Dallas, Texas is $39.13 if purchased online and $43.35 if purchased in person. Delivery is two business days.

Federal Express Ground is $22.95 and delivery is 3-4 business days. Federal Express Saver is $51.81 and delivery is guaranteed in three business days.

UPS Ground is 29.94 and delivery is 3-4 business days.

You stated the Ruger box is being placed within a Remington box: DO NOT HAVE ANY MARKINGS PRESENT ON THE EXTERIOR OF THE BOX INDICATING A FIREARM IS BEING SHIPPED.

Bricktop--thank you, your information has been most helpful. I have already taped over all of the Remington info. When you ship UPS or Fed Ex do you tell them it's a firearm or machine parts?

1. Take a copy of the FFL with you that it is being shipped to. They might ask. No matter who it is!

2. All UPS "stores" are forbidden by UPS from accepting firearms for shipment. You have to go the main UPS office. If you have the FFL, no hassles is the normal rule.

3. USPS, again take the FFL and normally no hassle shipping a long arm. they will not ship handguns.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

1. Take a copy of the FFL with you that it is being shipped to. They might ask. No matter who it is!

2. All UPS "stores" are forbidden by UPS from accepting firearms for shipment. You have to go the main UPS office. If you have the FFL, no hassles is the normal rule.

3. USPS, again take the FFL and normally no hassle shipping a long arm. they will not ship handguns.

WRONG!!!!!!!!!

DISREGARD EVERY SINGLE BIT OF THIS "INFORMATION." IT'S ALL COMPLETE HORSESHIT.

Originally Posted by GSP814

Bricktop--thank you, your information has been most helpful. I have already taped over all of the Remington info. When you ship UPS or Fed Ex do you tell them it's a firearm or machine parts?

Nope. You aren't required to tell them squat. Federal law only requires a common or contract carrier to be notified if the recipient is NOT a federal firearms licensee.

"� 478.31 Delivery by common or contract carrier.

(a) No person shall knowingly deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce to any person other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is being transported or shipped: Provided, that any passenger who owns or legally possesses a firearm or ammunition being transported aboard any common or contract carrier for movement with the passenger in interstate or foreign commerce may deliver said firearm or ammunition into the custody of the pilot, captain, conductor or operator of such common or contract carrier for the duration of that trip without violating any provision of this part.

(b) No common or contract carrier shall require or cause any label, tag, or other written notice to be placed on the outside of any package, luggage, or other container indicating that such package, luggage, or other container contains a firearm."

Simply stated, it says this:

'It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to deliver or cause to be delivered...to persons other than...licensed dealers...any package...in which there is any firearm...without written notice to the carrier that such firearm...is being...shipped...'"

And the USPS' DMM:

The United States Postal Service (USPS) will accept long guns from unlicensed persons and handguns from federal firearms licensees:

"11.3 Rifles and Shotguns

Although unloaded rifles and shotguns not precluded by 11.1.1e and 11.1.2 are mailable, mailers must comply with the Gun Control Act of 1968, Public Law 90-618, 18 USC 921, et seq., and the rules and regulations promulgated thereunder, 27 CFR 178, as well as state and local laws. The mailer may be required by the USPS to establish, by opening the parcel or by written certification, that the gun is unloaded and not precluded by 11.1.1e

11.4 Legal Opinions on Mailing Firearms

Postmasters are not authorized to give opinions on the legality of any shipment of rifles or shotguns. Contact the nearest office of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms for further advice."

OT, but...

Originally Posted by ringworm

Shes a stupid Min wage employee...

USPS employees are definitely not minimum wage employees. That's part of USPS's problem.

How about shipping rifle ammunition, does it need to be declared and shipped as a restricted item? Thanks.

Originally Posted by GSP814

How about shipping rifle ammunition, does it need to be declared and shipped as a restricted item? Thanks.

I've shipped a ton of it, and I've never declared anything or shipped it as a 'restricted item'. I don't offer any information to em' on what I'm shipping. I've packed it up nice and tight where it doesn't rattle around at all, and shipped it like I would anything else. No problems. Ever.

Originally Posted by GSP814

How about shipping rifle ammunition, does it need to be declared and shipped as a restricted item? Thanks.

You can't ship it via the USPS, it needs to go contract carrier; i.e., UPS and Federal Express. No legal requirement to declare it, though UPS and Federal Express each have business policies requiring the sender to declare it. I couldn't give a [bleep] about complying with UPS' or Federal Express' dickhead policies.

Sign up for a Federal Express or UPS account online, print your labels on your own, drop off your ammunition or handguns for shipment. No questions and no hassles.

As I stated, I would prefer USPS for all the reason BT mentions, however, it is hit or miss on the hassles I have dealt with there. FedEx may cost a few more bucks but every time but one was as easy as dropping it off, pay, than go. One time I had a clerk ask what was in the box, I told her it was none of her business, the manager came over and apologized, and my package was sent.

Go FedEx.

Originally Posted by Bricktop

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

1. Take a copy of the FFL with you that it is being shipped to. They might ask. No matter who it is!

2. All UPS "stores" are forbidden by UPS from accepting firearms for shipment. You have to go the main UPS office. If you have the FFL, no hassles is the normal rule.

3. USPS, again take the FFL and normally no hassle shipping a long arm. they will not ship handguns.

WRONG!!!!!!!!!

DISREGARD EVERY SINGLE BIT OF THIS "INFORMATION." IT'S ALL COMPLETE HORSESHIT.

OK you smartass dipshit what exactly is wrong?

I have shipped a whole damn bunch of rifles with USPS and UPS and in my area it is exactly as I said no matter what your smart ass says. Shipping one on Wed and guarantee it will go as stated.

As for handguns USPS WILL NOT ship for individuals.

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

As for UPS

"Getting Your Firearm Shipment to UPS
Firearms (including handguns) may be shipped only through a UPS Scheduled Pickup Account (specifically, Daily Pickup, Daily On-Route Pickup, UPS Smart Pickup�, and Day-Specific Pickup), or through a UPS Customer Center (counters at UPS operational facilities). Note: Firearms (including handguns) are not accepted for shipment via UPS Drop Boxes, UPS On-Call PickupSM, or at locations of The UPS Store� or any third party retailer.
When you are shipping a package that contains a handgun, you must verbally notify the UPS driver or UPS Customer Center clerk.
See the terms and conditions in the UPS Tariff/Terms and Conditions of Service for information regarding firearm shipments."

If you think that is wrong you had better get your head out of your ass and find out the facts before you start throwing out the horseshit label because you just ended up with horsehit in your face.

Quote

I couldn't give a [bleep] about complying with UPS' or Federal Express' dickhead policies.

That is why when they catch your dumbass it will be 5 years and $25,000 fine.

You avatar explains everything dumbass!!!

If anyone is stupid enough to believe that idiot Bricktop after that posting you deserve to go to jail with his stupid ass.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Originally Posted by Bricktop

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

1. Take a copy of the FFL with you that it is being shipped to. They might ask. No matter who it is!

2. All UPS "stores" are forbidden by UPS from accepting firearms for shipment. You have to go the main UPS office. If you have the FFL, no hassles is the normal rule.

3. USPS, again take the FFL and normally no hassle shipping a long arm. they will not ship handguns.

WRONG!!!!!!!!!

DISREGARD EVERY SINGLE BIT OF THIS "INFORMATION." IT'S ALL COMPLETE HORSESHIT.

OK you smartass dipshit what exactly is wrong?

I have shipped a whole damn bunch of rifles with USPS and UPS and in my area it is exactly as I said no matter what your smart ass says. Shipping one on Wed and guarantee it will go as stated.

As for handguns USPS WILL NOT ship for individuals.

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

As for UPS

"Getting Your Firearm Shipment to UPS
Firearms (including handguns) may be shipped only through a UPS Scheduled Pickup Account (specifically, Daily Pickup, Daily On-Route Pickup, UPS Smart Pickup�, and Day-Specific Pickup), or through a UPS Customer Center (counters at UPS operational facilities). Note: Firearms (including handguns) are not accepted for shipment via UPS Drop Boxes, UPS On-Call PickupSM, or at locations of The UPS Store� or any third party retailer.
When you are shipping a package that contains a handgun, you must verbally notify the UPS driver or UPS Customer Center clerk.
See the terms and conditions in the UPS Tariff/Terms and Conditions of Service for information regarding firearm shipments."

If you think that is wrong you had better get your head out of your ass and find out the facts before you start throwing out the horseshit label because you just ended up with horsehit in your face.

The only person who needs to pull their heads out of their asses is YOU, little man. There is no requirement that a sender produce a copy of an FFL as a condition of shipment. Not in the '68 GCA, not in UPS' or Federal Express' polices, NOT ANYWHERE. But morons like you keep repeating this LIE when you OBVIOUSLY DO NOT KNOW WHAT IN THE HELL YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT and it only complicates matters. Hell's bells, there's not even any legal requirement to disclose what's being shipped provided the recipient is a federal firearms licensee.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Originally Posted by Bricktop

I couldn't give a [bleep] about complying with UPS' or Federal Express' dickhead policies.

That is why when they catch your dumbass it will be 5 years and $25,000 fine.

You avatar explains everything dumbass!!!

If anyone is stupid enough to believe that idiot Bricktop after that posting you deserve to go to jail with his stupid ass.

Please cite a specific example of this happening. I never realized that UPS and Federal Express had their own jails.

Do yourself and everyone else a favor and don't post about things you can't understand.

Quote

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

About two hours ago I walked into the local USPS, alone, (I am not a FFL holder) with a pistol in a " if it fits it ships" box, sent it to Florida. All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL.
No FFL license was ask for, or required, from here, or the recipient from the USPS.

Registered Mail, insured.

It ain't the cheapest. It ain't the easiest way to package.

But it's the best.

All FFL compliance caveats apply, of course.

Insured requires a signature on the receiving end.

Registered is only as good as the PO. I sent ONE rifle registered but it apparently ended up in the BULK pile. They couldn't tell me where it was past the Post Office I mailed it from. It took over 2 weeks to make the trip.

Registered means not much.

Except you have separate processing/transport and chain-of-custody records, much less chance of loss or theft for that reason.

I suppose every system has its flaws, but yours is the first I've encountered, and it made it to its destination.

Witness the person you hand it to sign the log, and you have your first ass to kick if something happens. Much less chance of theft or damage if each person signs for it andis responsible for it until the baton is passed.

But there is a chair for every ass. I'll stick to registered.

Also, Registered ain't the fastest. Were you shipping from AK at the time?

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

About two hours ago I walked into the local USPS, alone, (I am not a FFL holder) with a pistol in a " if it fits it ships" box, sent it to Florida. All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL.
No FFL license was ask for, or required, from here, or the recipient from the USPS.

But there is significantly more to it than the picture you paint. Your FFL is required to log the handgun into his bound book and it will also show to whom it was sent and the FFL had to get a copy of the recipient's FFL. You were acting as agent for the FFL at that point and he is responsible for anything illegal you might do. (for example sending it loaded or including ammunition)

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Originally Posted by Bricktop

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

1. Take a copy of the FFL with you that it is being shipped to. They might ask. No matter who it is!

2. All UPS "stores" are forbidden by UPS from accepting firearms for shipment. You have to go the main UPS office. If you have the FFL, no hassles is the normal rule.

3. USPS, again take the FFL and normally no hassle shipping a long arm. they will not ship handguns.

WRONG!!!!!!!!!

DISREGARD EVERY SINGLE BIT OF THIS "INFORMATION." IT'S ALL COMPLETE HORSESHIT.

OK you smartass dipshit what exactly is wrong?

I have shipped a whole damn bunch of rifles with USPS and UPS and in my area it is exactly as I said no matter what your smart ass says. Shipping one on Wed and guarantee it will go as stated.

As for handguns USPS WILL NOT ship for individuals.

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

As for UPS

"Getting Your Firearm Shipment to UPS
Firearms (including handguns) may be shipped only through a UPS Scheduled Pickup Account (specifically, Daily Pickup, Daily On-Route Pickup, UPS Smart Pickup�, and Day-Specific Pickup), or through a UPS Customer Center (counters at UPS operational facilities). Note: Firearms (including handguns) are not accepted for shipment via UPS Drop Boxes, UPS On-Call PickupSM, or at locations of The UPS Store� or any third party retailer.
When you are shipping a package that contains a handgun, you must verbally notify the UPS driver or UPS Customer Center clerk.
See the terms and conditions in the UPS Tariff/Terms and Conditions of Service for information regarding firearm shipments."

If you think that is wrong you had better get your head out of your ass and find out the facts before you start throwing out the horseshit label because you just ended up with horsehit in your face.

Quote

I couldn't give a [bleep] about complying with UPS' or Federal Express' dickhead policies.

That is why when they catch your dumbass it will be 5 years and $25,000 fine.

You avatar explains everything dumbass!!!

If anyone is stupid enough to believe that idiot Bricktop after that posting you deserve to go to jail with his stupid ass.

Bounty Hunter
Sorry, but you are completely incorrect as Bricktop says. FFLs are specifically instructed to NOT give anyone copies of the FFL unless they are an FFL, period. To suggest their presence somehow changes anything is wrong...

I have had an FFL for a very long time...
art

Originally Posted by RickBin

Also, Registered ain't the fastest. Were you shipping from AK at the time?

Yep, AK. I saw it go into the book but there isn't any guarantee after that, unless you ride along with it. Point being, it's far from fail proof and I'll not spend the extra coin/packing for something to go registered again.

It was logged as registered at the PO I shipped it from, it didn't show as registered at the next stop. It got there, I was reimbursed for the shipping.

I am going to stick with it due to the chain of custody thing primarily. Makes it much less likely to get stolen or lost when somebody is personally on the hook. Plus, I've never had an experience like yours with regmail.

It was the only time I did registered and it was the only problem I've ever had with a firearm shipment.

Again, there ain't no chain of custody if they decided to stick it a bulk rate pile.

Hey Dumbass (aka Bricktop) or LITTLER Man

No one said it was GCA or federal law to show an FFL, but you better look at the rules, read and understand them as you are required to prove the receipient is lawful and how else are you going to do it?

Oh, I am sorry you are the assclown that said you do not give a damn about the rules or law.

Quote

Use These UPS Services for Your Firearm Shipment
UPS accepts packages containing firearms (as defined by Title 18, Chapter 44, and Title 26, Chapter 53 of the United States Code) for transportation only (a) between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors (as defined in Title 18, Chapter 44 of the United States Code), and government agencies and (b) where not otherwise prohibited by federal, state or local law (i) from an individual to a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector; and (ii) from a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to an individual. The shipper must comply with and must ensure that each shipment complies with all federal, state and local laws applicable to the shipper, recipient, and package.

As noted in their rules, THEY WILL NOT ACCEPT A FIREARM AT A UPS STORE, AND THEY ONLY ACCEPT SHIPMENTS TO THE ABOVE WHICH INCLUDES AN ffl. That is the UPS rules

You posted that you are not required to tell them and then posted the law that contradicts you. Whatta dumbass!

Quote

"No person shall knowingly deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce to any person other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is being transported or shipped:"

Bottom line is this:

1. You can lie/and or not tell them it is a firearm and you are in direct violation of the law! NO and IF or butts.

2. You have already posted you do not give a damn about the law, so why don't you quit trying to give stupid advice to people trying to do it right.

3. Never said it was the required to show an FFL, but it is required by law that the receiver be a lawful receipient and the shippers normally ask for proof and as long as you have a copy of the FFL and the address on the package matches the FFL they ship no hassle. NO FFL, most UPS and USPS will NOT ship. Your call show it or take it home.

4. As for proof of the 5 yrs and $25,000 take your head out of your ass when you go into any UPS or Post Office and look on the wall at the posters that say exactly that. You can break the law 20 times and never get caught, that does not make it legal or right to tell someone else to do it.

Again, you are one stupid ass dip that openly admits to violating the law on the internet and then wants people to follow your advice!

Guy that logged it is responsible. The buck stops with the last signature.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

You posted that you are not required to tell them and then posted the law that contradicts you. Whatta dumbass!

Quote

"No person shall knowingly deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce to any person other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is being transported or shipped:"

Are you really that STUPID?!!! Read what you repeated from my post, dumbass. ANY PERSON OTHER THAN A LICENSED DEALER.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Bottom line is this:

1. You can lie/and or not tell them it is a firearm and you are in direct violation of the law! NO and IF or butts.

Nope, Wrong. WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY WRONG.

You, my non-reading scourge of a LITTLE person, need to devote more time to reading comprehension.

Bounty HUnter
This is an argument you ought to just quit on... You need the laws and rules to match and be complete. Posting just part of the rule is where you fail here. You are only required to notify the common carrier if the recipient is NOT an FFL or otherwise entitled entity.

As he correctly pointed out, UPS rules are not laws and there is no legal consequence to breaking them.

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

About two hours ago I walked into the local USPS, alone, (I am not a FFL holder) with a pistol in a " if it fits it ships" box, sent it to Florida. All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL.
No FFL license was ask for, or required, from here, or the recipient from the USPS.

But there is significantly more to it than the picture you paint. Your FFL is required to log the handgun into his bound book and it will also show to whom it was sent and the FFL had to get a copy of the recipient's FFL. You were acting as agent for the FFL at that point and he is responsible for anything illegal you might do. (for example sending it loaded or including ammunition)

All I painted was what USPS requires.

Originally Posted by antlers

Originally Posted by GSP814

How about shipping rifle ammunition, does it need to be declared and shipped as a restricted item? Thanks.

I've shipped a ton of it, and I've never declared anything or shipped it as a 'restricted item'. I don't offer any information to em' on what I'm shipping. I've packed it up nice and tight where it doesn't rattle around at all, and shipped it like I would anything else. No problems. Ever.

Exactly.
Box it up like it will be thrown by gorillas ( kicked and stomped)
Because it WILL.
Don't mark anything on it.
If anyone is stupid enough to ask, tell them :
" Machined Parts "

Because that is an accurate description. You are not lying and they do not need to know more.

If you mark it
"Expensive FIREARM "
it is sure to disappear!

Then pick the gorillas of your choice.
I have used them all and find USPS or UPS to be more convenient.

Originally Posted by 700LH

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

About two hours ago I walked into the local USPS, alone, (I am not a FFL holder) with a pistol in a " if it fits it ships" box, sent it to Florida. All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL.
No FFL license was ask for, or required, from here, or the recipient from the USPS.

But there is significantly more to it than the picture you paint. Your FFL is required to log the handgun into his bound book and it will also show to whom it was sent and the FFL had to get a copy of the recipient's FFL. You were acting as agent for the FFL at that point and he is responsible for anything illegal you might do. (for example sending it loaded or including ammunition)

All I painted was what USPS requires.

Then bragging about breaking Fed laws on the internet is foolish... And dragging your FFL into it probably would not make him happy.

Originally Posted by Steelhead

It was the only time I did registered and it was the only problem I've ever had with a firearm shipment.

Again, there ain't no chain of custody if they decided to stick it a bulk rate pile.

I used Registered Mail once for a $7k rifle that I sold to a guy out East. It took 10 or 12 days to get there from Iowa. That was normal - not lost in bulk mail. The package was signed in and out of a hold cage at every stop and, although neither I nor my local postmaster could look up its progress, when the buyer got worried and I got worried the Postmaster started calling for me and tracked it down as it moved. He is a good guy and a knows that I ship higher dollar rifles around a fair bit, so he went the extra mile to call the various mail depots along the way, and then wrestled with the supervisors at each of them to get a special accounting of my box.

I didn't realize that it was so slow but now that I do, I generally go Priority, insured. However, for big dollar guns (by my standards), registered is the only way to go, albeit slower than bulk mail.

BTW, if a father is mailing his adult daughter in another state a family shotgun, does he need to do the FFL thing on the receiving end (ie, if this is an "in the family" sort of thing)? I was just asked about an FFL by a friend whose daughter is a grad student here.

Originally Posted by BrentD

BTW, if a father is mailing his adult daughter in another state a family shotgun, does he need to do the FFL thing on the receiving end (ie, if this is an "in the family" sort of thing)? I was just asked about an FFL by a friend whose daughter is a grad student here.

If it is being transferred as part of an estate's disposition or an intestate disposition, then no.

Not a estate issue. No one died. He is just sending her a shotgun to go bird hunting with this fall.

Uhhh... Using the estate exemption is no bed of roses and ends up pretty close to the same hassle as just getting an FFL...

Quote

Then bragging about breaking Fed laws on the internet is foolish... And dragging your FFL into it probably would not make him happy

Mind explaining that?

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

Then bragging about breaking Fed laws on the internet is foolish... And dragging your FFL into it probably would not make him happy

Mind explaining that?

You statement:
"About two hours ago I walked into the local USPS, alone, (I am not a FFL holder) with a pistol in a " if it fits it ships" box, sent it to Florida. All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL.
No FFL license was ask for, or required, from here, or the recipient from the USPS."

It is illegal for a non-FFL to ship handguns via USPS. Therefore one has to assume you were acting as agent to the FFL (perfectly legal) to use USPS. However, for that to be the case the FFL had to enter the handgun in his books and required a copy of the receiving FFL. He also is required to check the BATFE website to verify the FFL is good.

You imply none of that was done... There is a USPS form notifying them of handgun shipments between FFLs and that may have been what you carried in. But that does not change the fact there is a lot more to it than just getting blessed by an FFL before mailing a handgun.

Your fulla chit as a Christmas turkey, I didn't imply any of that at all.
All I said was what USPS requires.

No law was broken.

Originally Posted by GSP814

UPS, Fed Ex or USPS? Thanks.

Take it to your gunsmith/dealer and pay him to ship it.

Gunner

Call it what you wish... your post implies you had nothing more than a form signed by an FFL:

"All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL."

While it obviously open to interpretation the way it was delivered in an open forum would lead one to believe you had done as described above... Few FFLs let anyone but friends mail guns for them, in my experience.

Quote

"All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL."

At the POST OFFICE.

Completely unfounded accusations.

Perhaps Evelyn Woodheads course might be beneficial

Originally Posted by GSP814

Sorry, I need to be more specific. I'm shipping a Ruger 1B with nice wood in original box put inside a Remington box. Looking for hassle free, good package handling at a reasonable price.

I like to remove the stock to reduce length. Wrap both pcs well and tape together so it's one solid unit inside the box.

Here in Canada there is an overlength fee for boxes over 1 meter. Shipping shorter boxes avoids damage, is cheaper and the package looks less like a firearm.

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

"All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL."

At the POST OFFICE.

Completely unfounded accusations.

Perhaps Evelyn Woodheads course might be beneficial

Perhaps you need a course in basic technical writing. Suggesting as you did that a form signed by an FFL made a difference has implications.

In all my years mailing handguns I have never been asked for said form and when supplied by me none of the employees at the window even knew what it was.

Gawd these threads are entertaining!

Originally Posted by gunner500

Originally Posted by GSP814

UPS, Fed Ex or USPS? Thanks.

Take it to your gunsmith/dealer and pay him to ship it.

Gunner

Or just pack it up yourself and send it. As was the focus of the original inquiry.

Quote

In all my years mailing handguns I have never been asked for said form

Acknowledging it's existence?

Quote

and when supplied by me none of the employees at the window even knew what it was.

And just what does that have to do with my experience today?
Not a dam thing.

Running your mouth, then caught being dummer n Daffy Duck must suk for such a aaahhummm,,, smart technickel guy.

Falsely accusing folks ain't nice.

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

In all my years mailing handguns I have never been asked for said form

Acknowledging it's existence?

Quote

and when supplied by me none of the employees at the window even knew what it was.

And just what does that have to do with my experience today?
Not a dam thing.

Running your mouth, then caught being dummer n Daffy Duck must suk for such a aaahhummm,,, smart technickel guy.

Falsely accusing folks ain't nice.

Wow! And I have the reading comprehension problem??? I already stated at least twice that there is a USPS form 1509 for notifying them of handguns being shipped.

http://about.usps.com/forms/ps1508.pdf

And you still fail to grasp the way you posed your visit to the PO?

Bet they were impressed with your coolness... yeah right!

Lets make it simple for me, OK?
everything was done legal, and beyond, and your a full of yourself jerk

Originally Posted by 700LH

Quote

432.1 General "Unloaded Handgun
Handguns � e.g., pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person � are nonmailable UNLESS mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, or a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or government of a state, territory, or district, and ONLY when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person�s official duties AND upon filing the required affidavit or certificate, as applicable (see DMM 601.11.1.3�7):"

About two hours ago I walked into the local USPS, alone, (I am not a FFL holder) with a pistol in a " if it fits it ships" box, sent it to Florida. All I had was a simple one page form signed by a local FFL.
No FFL license was ask for, or required, from here, or the recipient from the USPS.

did you wrap it in tin foil first...?
to block out the X-ray machine?

Here is the shipping guide off Gunbroker which summarizes the rules and laws.

Quote

(last updated on 6/17/2013)
Firearms Shipping Guide
Overview
This page provides information about Federal Laws, step that must be followed, and notes on using specific shippers when shipping firearms. This page is oriented toward the seller of an item. If you need information about how to buy a firearm through GunBroker.com, please refer to our Buyer's Tutorial.

This page contains information oriented toward persons shipping firearms within the United States. For sellers located outside the United States, please see our Import / Export page.

Shipping Legalities
Federal Law requires that all modern firearms be shipped to a holder of a valid Federal Firearms License (FFL) only. The recipient must have an FFL; however the sender is not required to have one. Any person who is legally allowed to own a firearm is legally allowed to ship it to an FFL holder for any legal purpose (including sale or resale).

Here is exactly what the ATF 'Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide' (ATF P 5300.4) says:
(B9) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by carrier?
A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by carrier to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm. [18 U. S. C. 922( a)( 2)( A) and 922( e), 27 CFR 178.31]

(B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U. S. Postal Service?
A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. A nonlicensee may not transfer any firearm to a nonlicensed resident of another state. The Postal Service recommends that longguns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms.

'Antique' firearms need not be shipped to a licensed dealer. These can be shipped directly to the buyer. An antique firearm is a firearm built in or before 1898, or a replica thereof. The exact ATF definition of an antique firearm is:
Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

Knives, air guns, accessories, and most gun parts need not be shipped to an FFL holder. We say most gun parts because each firearm contains at least one part that the ATF considers a firearm. This part is typically the part that contains the serial number. This part must be treated as a complete firearm when shipping the item.

Ammunition must be clearly identified as 'Small Arms Ammunition' on the outside of the box. Some shippers treat ammunition as dangerous or hazardous materials.

The section of the US Code that governs modern firearms is called Commerce in Firearms and Ammunition (CFA). This code is available online at: http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_09/27cfr478_09.html

When in doubt, we suggest arranging for transfer through a licensed dealer. Violation of the CFA is a felony and penalties for violation of it are severe.

Federal and State Law Resources
The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) has a very comprehensive site containing information about the various Federal and state laws regulating firearms. Please refer to the ATF information for legal questions regarding firearms.
ATF Home page: http://www.atf.gov
ATF Compilation of the various state laws: http://www.atf.gov/files/publicatio...st-editiion/2010-2011-atf-book-final.pdf
ATF Firearms Division Main Page: http://www.atf.gov/content/Firearms/firearms-industry

Shipment by Unlicensed Persons
Any shipper who does not have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be an 'unlicensed person'. This section contains information on how unlicensed persons can ship firearms. If you have an FFL, please skip to the next section for shipping suggestions.

The most important thing to know is that you must only ship guns to a licensed dealer. If the buyer is not a licensed dealer, he will have to make arrangements to ship the item to a dealer in his state.

Before you ship a gun, the buyer must fax or mail you a copy of the dealer's signed FFL license. You can only ship the gun to the address on the license. You must inform the carrier that the package contains a firearm. Of course, the firearm cannot be shipped loaded; ammunition may not be shipped in the same box. You should take the copy of the signed FFL with you when you take the item to be shipped in case the shipper wishes to see it.
Notes on specific shippers:

US Mail: An unlicensed person can ship a rifle or shotgun by US Mail. Unlicensed persons cannot ship a handgun by US Mail. Postal regulations allow the Post Office to open your package for inspection. Ammunition cannot be shipped by US Mail. You can search the US Post Office Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.

FedEx Express: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as hazardous goods via Ground in compliance with ORM-D.

FedEx Ground: FedEx Ground will transport and deliver firearms (excluding handguns) as defined by the United States Gun Control Act of 1968, between areas served in the U.S. Ammunition must be shipped as hazardous goods via Ground in compliance with ORM-D.

UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition. Most other shippers will no longer accept firearm shipments. Airborne and Roadway have specifically prohibited firearm shipments.

Shipment by Licensed Persons
Any shipper who has a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be a 'licensed person'. This section contains information on how licensed persons can ship firearms. If you do not have an FFL, please see the previous section of this page for shipping instructions.

Since licensed persons are responsible for knowing the law, we are going to assume that you already understand the CGA and know the applicable Federal, state, and local laws.

Notes on specific shippers:

US Mail: Licensed persons can ship a rifle, shotguns, or handguns by US Mail. In fact, we suggest that you use the USPS as it is now the most cost-effective way to ship a handgun. To ship a rifle or shotgun, you need only inform the Post Office that the package contains a firearm. A licensed manufacturer, dealer, or importer can ship a handgun via the US Post Office if the licensed dealer fills out a US Post Office Form PS 1508 and files it with the local Post Office branch where the handgun is to be shipped. You can search the US Post Office Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.

FedEx Express: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as hazardous goods via Ground in compliance with ORM-D.

UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition.

Most other shippers will no longer accept firearm shipments. Airborne and Roadway have specifically prohibited firearm shipments.

Notes on USPS Firearm Regulations
We recommend that you read the Post Office regulations on Other Restricted or Nonmailable Matter before shipping a firearm through the US Mail.

The following info comes from the USPS Regulation DMM Issue 54, January 10, 1999, section C-024

Page C-39, section 3.0, Rifles and Shotguns: "Although unloaded rifles and shotguns not precluded by 1.1e and 1.2 are mailable, mailers must comply with the Gun Control Act or 1968, Public Law 90-618, 18 USC 921, et seq., and the rules and regulations promulgated there under, 27 CFR 178, as well as state and local laws. The mailer may be required by the USPS to establish, by opening the parcel or by written certification, that the gun is unloaded and not precluded by 1.1e."

Page C-39, section 6.0, PROHIBITED PARCEL MARKING: "For any parcel containing a firearm or a ballistic or switchblade knife, any marking that indicates the contents is not permitted on the outside wrapper or container."

The following pertains only to licensed dealers shipping handguns:

Page C-37, section 1.3, Authorized Persons: "Subject to 1.4, handguns may be mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government......."

Page C-38, section 1.5, Manufacturers and Dealers: "Handguns may also be mailed between licensed manufacturers of firearms and licensed dealers of firearms in customary trade shipments, or for repairing or replacing parts."

Page C-38, section 1.6, Certificate of Manufacturers and Dealers: "A licensed manufacturer or dealer need not file the affidavit under 1.4, but must file with the postmaster a statement on Form 1508 signed by the mailer that he or she is a licensed manufacturer or dealer of firearms, that the parcels containing handguns (or major components thereof) are customary trade shipments or contain such articles for repairing or replacing parts, and that to the best of his or her knowledge or belief the addressees are licensed manufacturers or dealers of firearms."

(last updated on 6/17/2013)

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Here is the shipping guide off Gunbroker which summarizes the rules and laws.

Quote

(last updated on 6/17/2013)
Firearms Shipping Guide
Overview
This page provides information about Federal Laws, step that must be followed, and notes on using specific shippers when shipping firearms. This page is oriented toward the seller of an item. If you need information about how to buy a firearm through GunBroker.com, please refer to our Buyer's Tutorial.

This page contains information oriented toward persons shipping firearms within the United States. For sellers located outside the United States, please see our Import / Export page.

Shipping Legalities
Federal Law requires that all modern firearms be shipped to a holder of a valid Federal Firearms License (FFL) only. The recipient must have an FFL; however the sender is not required to have one. Any person who is legally allowed to own a firearm is legally allowed to ship it to an FFL holder for any legal purpose (including sale or resale).

Here is exactly what the ATF 'Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide' (ATF P 5300.4) says:
(B9) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by carrier?
A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by carrier to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm. [18 U. S. C. 922( a)( 2)( A) and 922( e), 27 CFR 178.31]

(B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U. S. Postal Service?
A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. A nonlicensee may not transfer any firearm to a nonlicensed resident of another state. The Postal Service recommends that longguns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms.

'Antique' firearms need not be shipped to a licensed dealer. These can be shipped directly to the buyer. An antique firearm is a firearm built in or before 1898, or a replica thereof. The exact ATF definition of an antique firearm is:
Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

Knives, air guns, accessories, and most gun parts need not be shipped to an FFL holder. We say most gun parts because each firearm contains at least one part that the ATF considers a firearm. This part is typically the part that contains the serial number. This part must be treated as a complete firearm when shipping the item.

Ammunition must be clearly identified as 'Small Arms Ammunition' on the outside of the box. Some shippers treat ammunition as dangerous or hazardous materials.

The section of the US Code that governs modern firearms is called Commerce in Firearms and Ammunition (CFA). This code is available online at: http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_09/27cfr478_09.html

When in doubt, we suggest arranging for transfer through a licensed dealer. Violation of the CFA is a felony and penalties for violation of it are severe.

Federal and State Law Resources
The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) has a very comprehensive site containing information about the various Federal and state laws regulating firearms. Please refer to the ATF information for legal questions regarding firearms.
ATF Home page: http://www.atf.gov
ATF Compilation of the various state laws: http://www.atf.gov/files/publicatio...st-editiion/2010-2011-atf-book-final.pdf
ATF Firearms Division Main Page: http://www.atf.gov/content/Firearms/firearms-industry

Shipment by Unlicensed Persons
Any shipper who does not have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be an 'unlicensed person'. This section contains information on how unlicensed persons can ship firearms. If you have an FFL, please skip to the next section for shipping suggestions.

The most important thing to know is that you must only ship guns to a licensed dealer. If the buyer is not a licensed dealer, he will have to make arrangements to ship the item to a dealer in his state.

Before you ship a gun, the buyer must fax or mail you a copy of the dealer's signed FFL license. You can only ship the gun to the address on the license. You must inform the carrier that the package contains a firearm. Of course, the firearm cannot be shipped loaded; ammunition may not be shipped in the same box. You should take the copy of the signed FFL with you when you take the item to be shipped in case the shipper wishes to see it.
Notes on specific shippers:

US Mail: An unlicensed person can ship a rifle or shotgun by US Mail. Unlicensed persons cannot ship a handgun by US Mail. Postal regulations allow the Post Office to open your package for inspection. Ammunition cannot be shipped by US Mail. You can search the US Post Office Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.

FedEx Express: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as hazardous goods via Ground in compliance with ORM-D.

FedEx Ground: FedEx Ground will transport and deliver firearms (excluding handguns) as defined by the United States Gun Control Act of 1968, between areas served in the U.S. Ammunition must be shipped as hazardous goods via Ground in compliance with ORM-D.

UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition. Most other shippers will no longer accept firearm shipments. Airborne and Roadway have specifically prohibited firearm shipments.

Shipment by Licensed Persons
Any shipper who has a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be a 'licensed person'. This section contains information on how licensed persons can ship firearms. If you do not have an FFL, please see the previous section of this page for shipping instructions.

Since licensed persons are responsible for knowing the law, we are going to assume that you already understand the CGA and know the applicable Federal, state, and local laws.

Notes on specific shippers:

US Mail: Licensed persons can ship a rifle, shotguns, or handguns by US Mail. In fact, we suggest that you use the USPS as it is now the most cost-effective way to ship a handgun. To ship a rifle or shotgun, you need only inform the Post Office that the package contains a firearm. A licensed manufacturer, dealer, or importer can ship a handgun via the US Post Office if the licensed dealer fills out a US Post Office Form PS 1508 and files it with the local Post Office branch where the handgun is to be shipped. You can search the US Post Office Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.

FedEx Express: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as hazardous goods via Ground in compliance with ORM-D.

UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition.

Most other shippers will no longer accept firearm shipments. Airborne and Roadway have specifically prohibited firearm shipments.

Notes on USPS Firearm Regulations
We recommend that you read the Post Office regulations on Other Restricted or Nonmailable Matter before shipping a firearm through the US Mail.

The following info comes from the USPS Regulation DMM Issue 54, January 10, 1999, section C-024

Page C-39, section 3.0, Rifles and Shotguns: "Although unloaded rifles and shotguns not precluded by 1.1e and 1.2 are mailable, mailers must comply with the Gun Control Act or 1968, Public Law 90-618, 18 USC 921, et seq., and the rules and regulations promulgated there under, 27 CFR 178, as well as state and local laws. The mailer may be required by the USPS to establish, by opening the parcel or by written certification, that the gun is unloaded and not precluded by 1.1e."

Page C-39, section 6.0, PROHIBITED PARCEL MARKING: "For any parcel containing a firearm or a ballistic or switchblade knife, any marking that indicates the contents is not permitted on the outside wrapper or container."

The following pertains only to licensed dealers shipping handguns:

Page C-37, section 1.3, Authorized Persons: "Subject to 1.4, handguns may be mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, a licensed dealer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government......."

Page C-38, section 1.5, Manufacturers and Dealers: "Handguns may also be mailed between licensed manufacturers of firearms and licensed dealers of firearms in customary trade shipments, or for repairing or replacing parts."

Page C-38, section 1.6, Certificate of Manufacturers and Dealers: "A licensed manufacturer or dealer need not file the affidavit under 1.4, but must file with the postmaster a statement on Form 1508 signed by the mailer that he or she is a licensed manufacturer or dealer of firearms, that the parcels containing handguns (or major components thereof) are customary trade shipments or contain such articles for repairing or replacing parts, and that to the best of his or her knowledge or belief the addressees are licensed manufacturers or dealers of firearms."

(last updated on 6/17/2013)

You're just bound and determined to take "STUPID" to new levels, aren't you?

Gunbroker isn't "summarizing" [bleep], knothead. They merely regurgitate the BATFE FAQs which are WRONG. The sections of the '68 GCA referenced state NOTIFICATION REQUIRED IF RECIPIENT ISN'T A FEDERAL FIREARMS LICENSEE. THE BATFE ACKNOWLEDGES THIS IN WRITING AND ADMITS THEIR FAQS ARE WRONG -- JUST LIKE YOU.

You'd think people were incapable of reading and comprehending 18 U.S.C. 922.

Here is is folks, download and read.

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/granule/US...-partI-chap44-sec922/content-detail.html

Originally Posted by Steelhead

You'd think people were incapable of reading and comprehending 18 U.S.C. 922.

Here is is folks, download and read.

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/granule/US...-partI-chap44-sec922/content-detail.html

BountyHunter isn't. Capable of reading, that is. Here's the specific section of 18 U.S.C. 922 regarding carrier notification:

� 922 Unlawful acts.

(e) It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce, to persons other than licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, or licensed collectors, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is being transported or shipped; except that any passenger who owns or legally possesses a firearm or ammunition being transported aboard any common or contract carrier for movement with the passenger in interstate or foreign commerce may deliver said firearm or ammunition into the custody of the pilot, captain, conductor or operator of such common or contract carrier for the duration of the trip without violating any of the provisions of this chapter. No common or contract carrier shall require or cause any label, tag, or other written notice to be placed on the outside of any package, luggage, or other container that such package, luggage, or other container contains a firearm.

This subsection shall not apply with respect to the sale or disposition of a firearm or ammunition to a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector who pursuant to subsection (b) of section 925 of this chapter is not precluded from dealing in firearms or ammunition, or to a person who has been granted relief from disabilities pursuant to subsection (c) of section 925 of this chapter.

(e) It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce, to persons other than licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, or licensed collectors, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is being transported or shipped; except that any passenger who owns or legally possesses a firearm or ammunition being transported aboard any common or contract carrier for movement with the passenger in interstate or foreign commerce may deliver said firearm or ammunition into the custody of the pilot, captain, conductor or operator of such common or contract carrier for the duration of the trip without violating any of the provisions of this chapter. No common or contract carrier shall require or cause any label, tag, or other written notice to be placed on the outside of any package, luggage, or other container that such package, luggage, or other container contains a firearm

As an aside, I'm buying this No 1 from GSP and he has been very conscientious about shipping the rifle insured so it shows up in a timely manner in the same condition he shipped it in. He's a good dude to transact with.

922 specifically requires "written" notification as you say.

If you go back to my original post where you threw the "horseshit", I never said written.

Plus anyone who ships a firearm normally is asked "what is in the package" when it comes to insurance. At that point you are required to tell them IF you ever want to get it insured or covered if damaged. That is normal people who do not lie!

Again, at that point they normally ask for the FFL to verify the address is same on package and FFL, which is by law.

It is my experience, NO FFL, no shipment and you will not win an arguement with them. But then I am not a dumbass who wants to lie about it.

When you are at the bottom of a deep hole ceasing the digging is usually a very good first step...

Quote

Plus anyone who ships a firearm normally is asked "what is in the package" when it comes to insurance. At that point you are required to tell them IF you ever want to get it insured or covered if damaged.

Wrong!

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

When you are at the bottom of a deep hole ceasing the digging is usually a very good first step...

And you should read that, then go look in the mirror.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

922 specifically requires "written" notification as you say.

If you go back to my original post where you threw the "horseshit", I never said written.

Plus anyone who ships a firearm normally is asked "what is in the package" when it comes to insurance. At that point you are required to tell them IF you oever want to get it insured or covered if damaged. That is normal people who do not lie!

Again, at that point they normally ask for the FFL to verify the address is same on package and FFL, which is by law.

It is my experience, NO FFL, no shipment and you will not win an arguement with them. But then I am not a dumbass who wants to lie about it.

There is no requirement that UPS, Federal Express or the USPS verify the recipient, you moron. First you were just wrong, now you're just making up [bleep]. Your ass is on the verge of being hauled to the woodshed.

And despite your protestations, yeah, you are a dumbass.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Plus anyone who ships a firearm normally is asked "what is in the package" when it comes to insurance.

I ship firearms exclusively via the USPS. I have been for years. I always insure every shipment. I have NEVER been asked "what is in the package".

Originally Posted by 700LH

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

When you are at the bottom of a deep hole ceasing the digging is usually a very good first step...

And you should read that, then go look in the mirror.

Just sent you a PM you should check into... An apology on your part might be a good place to start.

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

Originally Posted by 700LH

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

When you are at the bottom of a deep hole ceasing the digging is usually a very good first step...

And you should read that, then go look in the mirror.

Just sent you a PM you should check into... An apology on your part might be a good place to start.

Did you ever return the stock?

gawd, i love this...

Originally Posted by EthanEdwards

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

Originally Posted by 700LH

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

When you are at the bottom of a deep hole ceasing the digging is usually a very good first step...

And you should read that, then go look in the mirror.

Just sent you a PM you should check into... An apology on your part might be a good place to start.

Did you ever return the stock?

So an idiot 700LH goes out of his way to prove it and you want to make it last longer for him...

And prove yourself clueless in the process...

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

922 specifically requires "written" notification as you say.

If you go back to my original post where you threw the "horseshit", I never said written.

Plus anyone who ships a firearm normally is asked "what is in the package" when it comes to insurance. At that point you are required to tell them IF you ever want to get it insured or covered if damaged. That is normal people who do not lie!

Again, at that point they normally ask for the FFL to verify the address is same on package and FFL, which is by law.

It is my experience, NO FFL, no shipment and you will not win an arguement with them. But then I am not a dumbass who wants to lie about it.

What if you are shipping a small flat rate box with a $5000 dollar ring, do you tell them what is in it? Do they ask? Do they ask you every time you ship something insured? When they ask and you tell them, where on the receipt does it state what the item is? Is there some secret Post Office file where the list what the items are in every box that is shipped insured?

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

So an idiot 700LH goes out of his way to prove it and you want to make it last longer for him...

And prove yourself clueless in the process...

Did you return the stock?

how to ship rifles 101- the bigfish9684 method:

1) Find old rifle box and turn it inside out so the firearm manufacturers logos don't show (or custom make one from a larger box).

2) Cut 2 - 1/4" plywood sheets to match the large flat sides of the box so they fit inside the box on either side of the rifle- position them.

3) Wrap/cushion/secure the rifle as best you can so it WILL NOT move during shipping. I usually remove the bolt and wrap it and secure it somewhere else in the box. Not real sure why... I just do.

4) This part is not necessary but makes it easy for the receiving FFL to contact me if need be. I copy my driver's license with current address and also write my phone number on the copy, as well as who the rifle is for on the receiving end. This just makes things easy for everyone if something goes wrong and people need to be contacted. Again, not necessary, but I do it this way. Then secure everything with packing materials.

5) Duct Tape. And more Duct Tape. I get the tape as tight as I can and make sure nothing is moving inside the box. I'm sure the receiving FFL hates it but all my rifles have made it to the buyer with no issue... yet.

6) Shipping label: PRINT. CLEARLY. And I do not put the gunshop's name, just the FFL holder. I am also known to write LPG in place of Low Price Guns (or Bud's and not Bud's Gun Shop) and the name of the FFL holder. I also put "C/O XXXXXXX" for the buyer's name. Then I cover my shipping label in clear packing tape so it does not tear. Double check the duct tape and head to the PO.

7) At the post office, I say "Cheap and Slow, insured for $XXX value with tracking/confirmation." They will ask if there is anything breakable, perishable, something and something else... I answer "No." Pay and leave. Runs me about $40 to get a 20ish pound rifle package to PA from WA, insured. Most buyers of my rifles say the rifle arrived in a veritable bank vault. Costs me a little extra, but is more solid (to me) than a cheap plastic hard case in a cardboard box.

Now... continue

Anybody here using golf club boxes to ship long guns. If you are, where is the best source?

Originally Posted by Bricktop

Originally Posted by gunner500

Originally Posted by GSP814

UPS, Fed Ex or USPS? Thanks.

Take it to your gunsmith/dealer and pay him to ship it.

Gunner

Or just pack it up yourself and send it. As was the focus of the original inquiry.

True, but taking it in gives me reason to look around.

Gunner

I give up arguing with the "experts" and admitted liars.

But here is a little very current reality of what really happens when shipping rifles and associated items.

Just mailed two boxes (45 minutes ago) of reloading items and bullets (no powder or primers) by USPS. When I asked for $600 insurance, the USPS clerk asked what was in the boxes. For giggles, I asked, "What if I do not want to say". She said then, "We will not ship them!" So I told her and had to make sure she understood bullets were not loaded cartridges. Could I have argued and asked for a supervisor and got them shipped after opening the boxes or having them flagged for a postal inspector to look at sometime next week? Maybe, but not likely. As it is, they are shipped legally and insured legally!

Before that I had just shipped a $4000 rifle (to the same buyer) thru UPS this morning, again insured. Again I was asked what was in the box when I asked for $4000 insurance and when I said a rifle, the UPS clerk asked to see the FFL, which I produced. By the way UPS put on the insurance sticker the items that are "supposed" to be in the box. Good luck filing a claim for a rifle when you tell them on the insurance that it was a (scope stand or something else). I left the paper FFL home one time, argued, asked to see the supervisor and got sent home to get the FFL. Another time, UPS refused to ship again until I remembered I had the FFL on my phone, pulled it up and they were happy once they confirmed the address on the box and the FFL was the same.

Believe what you want, do what you want and argue with who you want trying to ship. Do not be surprised if you are shown the door. Lie about contents and good luck getting reimbursed on a claim.

Forget the federal code, GCA, this is reality.

So by "sticker" do you mean the shipping tag attached to the outside of the box?

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

I give up arguing with the "experts" and admitted liars.

I don't recall anyone "lying," but you've now resorted to just making up bullshit in a lame attempt to save face. You were wrong when you began posting in this thread and you're even more wrong in your exit.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

But here is a little very current reality of what really happens when shipping rifles and associated items.

Reality? You're sure as hell not qualified to even utter that word, you dickhead.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Just mailed two boxes (45 minutes ago) of reloading items and bullets (no powder or primers) by USPS. When I asked for $600 insurance, the USPS clerk asked what was in the boxes. For giggles, I asked, "What if I do not want to say". She said then, "We will not ship them!" So I told her and had to make sure she understood bullets were not loaded cartridges. Could I have argued and asked for a supervisor and got them shipped after opening the boxes or having them flagged for a postal inspector to look at sometime next week? Maybe, but not likely. As it is, they are shipped legally and insured legally!

You're making up bullshit now.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Before that I had just shipped a $4000 rifle (to the same buyer) thru UPS this morning, again insured. Again I was asked what was in the box when I asked for $4000 insurance and when I said a rifle, the UPS clerk asked to see the FFL, which I produced. By the way UPS put on the insurance sticker the items that are "supposed" to be in the box. Good luck filing a claim for a rifle when you tell them on the insurance that it was a (scope stand or something else). I left the paper FFL home one time, argued, asked to see the supervisor and got sent home to get the FFL. Another time, UPS refused to ship again until I remembered I had the FFL on my phone, pulled it up and they were happy once they confirmed the address on the box and the FFL was the same.

And did you all hold hands and dance in a circle and curtsy to each other, too?

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Believe what you want, do what you want and argue with who you want trying to ship. Do not be surprised if you are shown the door. Lie about contents and good luck getting reimbursed on a claim.

Forget the federal code, GCA, this is reality.

Don't have to argue if you know what in the f*ck you're talking about, [bleep]. Which is why you're in the position you're in now: trying to argue your way out of a subject where you're in over your head.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

I give up arguing with the "experts" and admitted liars.

But here is a little very current reality of what really happens when shipping rifles and associated items.

Just mailed two boxes (45 minutes ago) of reloading items and bullets (no powder or primers) by USPS. When I asked for $600 insurance, the USPS clerk asked what was in the boxes. For giggles, I asked, "What if I do not want to say". She said then, "We will not ship them!" So I told her and had to make sure she understood bullets were not loaded cartridges. Could I have argued and asked for a supervisor and got them shipped after opening the boxes or having them flagged for a postal inspector to look at sometime next week? Maybe, but not likely. As it is, they are shipped legally and insured legally!

Before that I had just shipped a $4000 rifle (to the same buyer) thru UPS this morning, again insured. Again I was asked what was in the box when I asked for $4000 insurance and when I said a rifle, the UPS clerk asked to see the FFL, which I produced. By the way UPS put on the insurance sticker the items that are "supposed" to be in the box. Good luck filing a claim for a rifle when you tell them on the insurance that it was a (scope stand or something else). I left the paper FFL home one time, argued, asked to see the supervisor and got sent home to get the FFL. Another time, UPS refused to ship again until I remembered I had the FFL on my phone, pulled it up and they were happy once they confirmed the address on the box and the FFL was the same.

Believe what you want, do what you want and argue with who you want trying to ship. Do not be surprised if you are shown the door. Lie about contents and good luck getting reimbursed on a claim.

Forget the federal code, GCA, this is reality.

Wow, you are one stupid SOB.

Originally Posted by Stoneybroke

Anybody here using golf club boxes to ship long guns. If you are, where is the best source?

Uline has 8" x 4" x 52" boxes fro $2.01/ each 200 lb test.

These with teh outer sleeve look to be a good option too http://www.cameronpackaging.com/AR-15_Boxes.html#CAR50_carton

ML

XX

Originally Posted by Bricktop

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

I give up arguing with the "experts" and admitted liars.

I don't recall anyone "lying," but you've now resorted to just making up bullshit in a lame attempt to save face. You were wrong when you began posting in this thread and you're even more wrong in your exit.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

But here is a little very current reality of what really happens when shipping rifles and associated items.

Reality? You're sure as hell not qualified to even utter that word, you dickhead.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Just mailed two boxes (45 minutes ago) of reloading items and bullets (no powder or primers) by USPS. When I asked for $600 insurance, the USPS clerk asked what was in the boxes. For giggles, I asked, "What if I do not want to say". She said then, "We will not ship them!" So I told her and had to make sure she understood bullets were not loaded cartridges. Could I have argued and asked for a supervisor and got them shipped after opening the boxes or having them flagged for a postal inspector to look at sometime next week? Maybe, but not likely. As it is, they are shipped legally and insured legally!

You're making up bullshit now.

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Before that I had just shipped a $4000 rifle (to the same buyer) thru UPS this morning, again insured. Again I was asked what was in the box when I asked for $4000 insurance and when I said a rifle, the UPS clerk asked to see the FFL, which I produced. By the way UPS put on the insurance sticker the items that are "supposed" to be in the box. Good luck filing a claim for a rifle when you tell them on the insurance that it was a (scope stand or something else). I left the paper FFL home one time, argued, asked to see the supervisor and got sent home to get the FFL. Another time, UPS refused to ship again until I remembered I had the FFL on my phone, pulled it up and they were happy once they confirmed the address on the box and the FFL was the same.

And did you all hold hands and dance in a circle and curtsy to each other, too?

Originally Posted by BountyHunter

Believe what you want, do what you want and argue with who you want trying to ship. Do not be surprised if you are shown the door. Lie about contents and good luck getting reimbursed on a claim.

Forget the federal code, GCA, this is reality.

Don't have to argue if you know what in the f*ck you're talking about, [bleep]. Which is why you're in the position you're in now: trying to argue your way out of a subject where you're in over your head.

Here is a $1000 challenge to Bricktop.

You said above I was just making things up. Well I can prove it.

I will post the 3 receipts I discussed above when you accept the challenge. If you got the guts, which I seriously doubt.

IF you have the guts to call, and I cannot post the receipts marked shipped today, I will pay $1000 to the charity of your choice in your name.

If you call and I post the receipts, you will write a check to the Special Operations Warrior Foundation in my name.

Check and charity return receipts will be posted here for all to see who is the liar.

Got the guts to call my "making stuff up" as you say? Put some money where you bigass mouth is!

Was I really making stuff up as you say and bluffing you, or are you the arrogant ass blow hard that is a sniveling coward afraid to backup his trash talk.

Guess we will all see.

My my, I hear sweat rolling off a little pinhead somewhere; the crickets chirping; and a creeping yellow streak now.

Gonna make my day or are you going to turn tail?

Quote

Gonna make my day

Good grief, Man,.......

You need to lower your daily Datura / Johimbe intake, and step slowly away from the keyboard.

GTC