http://www.americasfreedomfighters....perty-owners-fight-government-land-grab/


When Kit Laney answered a knock on his door Saturday, law enforcement officers from the U.S. Forest Service handed him a piece of paper announcing his Diamond Bar Ranch in southwest New Mexico would be shut down Wednesday and his 300 head of cattle grazing there would be removed � one way or the other.
Other Forest Service officials were busy nailing similar notices on fence posts along the highway and informing neighbors that after Feb. 11, they should not attempt to enter the Diamond Bar property.

Laney was not surprised. He knew someday there would be an on-the-ground confrontation to enforce a 1997 court ruling which says his cattle are trespassing on federal land. That day has arrived.

Laney insists the land in question belongs to him; the Forest Service says it belongs to the federal government. So far, the federal court is on the side of the Forest Service. But Laney is not willing to throw in the towel and give up the land that has been in his family since long before there was a U.S. Forest Service.

Moreover, in New Mexico, there is a �brand law� that says, essentially, no cattle may be sold or transported out of state without approval from the State Livestock Board.

Local sheriff Cliff Snyder has notified the Forest Service and other state and federal officials that even though the Forest Service has a court order authorizing the confiscation of the Diamond Bar cattle, they �cannot be shipped and sold without being in direct violation of NM Statute.�

His memo also says �I intend to enforce the state livestock laws in my county. I will not allow anyone, in violation of state law, to ship Diamond Bar Cattle out of my county.�

Last hope for ranchers?

Kit and Sherry Laney are one of hundreds, perhaps thousands, of ranching families who are being squeezed off their land throughout the West. This case has the potential to erect a barrier to further expansion of federal land takeovers in the West or to erase the last hope of retaining ranching as a part of Western culture in the United States.

Both ranchers and federal officials are watching with great anxiety as the conflict moves toward resolution.

The Diamond Bar Ranch is at least 180,000 acres and includes some of the most beautiful land in southwest New Mexico, situated between and including portions of the http://www.wilderness.net/index.cfm?fuse=NWPS&sec=stateView&state=nm�>Gila and Aldo Leopold Wilderness areas.

Laney�s ancestors began the �Laney Cattle Company� there in 1883 when the area was still a territory. In those days, �prior appropriation� of water determined grazing rights to the land. That meant the first person to make beneficial use of water obtained the �rights� to the water and to the forage within an area necessary to utilize the available water.

Laney�s ancestors acquired the water rights and the attendant grazing rights on the land now claimed by the federal government.

In 1899, the federal government withdrew from the public domain the land that later became the Gila National Forest, which included much of the land on which Laney�s ancestors had valid claim to water and grazing rights.

Several court cases have determined that land to which others have claims or rights attached cannot be considered �public land.�

Specifically, �It is well settled that all land to which any claims or rights of others have attached does not fall within the designation of public land,� according to Bardon vs. Northern Pacific Railroad Co.

Consequently, Laney reasons, since his ancestors had acquired legal rights to the water and adjacent grazing land before the federal withdrawal, his land could not be considered a part of the public domain.

As soon as they kick off the ranchers, the hunters will be next.

and that's your worry? the hunters? wow

shortly there will be those along who will declare this man a freeloader and volunteer to help slaughter his herd.

There are hundreds of cases like this.

I have friends in the same situation... And personally know of many more.

Usually, it is a radical environmentalist group that gets the BLM or USFS to be the evictors.

Isaac will be along soon to call them freeloaders. Fudking government.

They may even call him a pussy if the Bundy threads are any measure.

Exactly, this one was the Gila trout.

That one got a little western, he whipped one contract worker and chased USFS workers horse back. If I remember right, he did 6 months for it. It got to where they would handcuff and shackle him every time he would have to appear in court.

That guy's a f ucking idiot

This reminds me of what the Soviets did to farmers after the revolution.

I posted this a coupla' years ago. I just hope we'll see more responsible and Constitutional behavior from ALL of our Sheriffs.

GTC

Link: [http://www.eauclairejournal.com/]

Link: http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/5890420/1

Sheriffs Stand Up to Fed
[http://www.eauclairejournal.com/]

A Conservative Newspaper Promoting,
Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness

Written By: Larry Pratt | Posted: Thursday, December 1st, 2011

GOA member Dr. Ray Seidel alerted me to the stirring of freedom that is taking place in his village of Ruidoso, New Mexico. I have already reported on the first battle with Mayor Ray Alborn and how he tried to impose an unconstitutional gun ban in the village. To get the full story of what happened in Ruidoso, you can go here and listen to my first debriefing session with Seidel.

I recently interviewed Dr. Seidel a second time on my Gun Owners News Hour weekly radio program and asked him about several acts of local interposition in the surrounding counties -- all of which underscores the importance of the office of the sheriff and the militia.

For example, over near Deming, New Mexico is the Gila National Forest. The U.S. Forest Service wanted to make almost all of it off limits for people -- until the militia of Luna County intervened. They told the feds that they would resist any effort by the Forest Service to restrict access to visitors. The result? Visitors have continued to access all of the Gila National Forest!

In the Southeast corner of the state, many landowners have working oil wells on their property. The EPA told the oil operators they would have to stop operating their wells because there was too much risk of harming the environment. At a town hall meeting convened by the EPA, a woman in her 60s rose to address the feds. She pointed out that her land had been in her family for over 200 years, and she was not about to let some official from an unconstitutional bureaucracy tell her what she could or could not do with her land.

The woman ended by warning the feds that her family has many guns and a huge supply of ammunition, and they would use all of it if needed to keep the EPA off of their land. The locals who had packed out the hearing room jumped to their feet with a shout and prolonged applause. That was in August of this year. As of November, oil is still being pumped at full tilt.

In Otero County, villages in the mountains are surrounded by forests. The county commission voted to establish an 80,000 acre plan to manage forest overgrowth. Residents wanted to cut fire breaks to protect their homes in Cloudcroft, but the Forest Service said, "No." The residents responded that they had to for safety's sake and were going to construct the fire break in spite of the Forest Service. Residents were told that if they cut down any trees, they would be arrested. But Sheriff Raymond Cobos told the Forest Service that if they made any arrests, they would be arrested for false arrest.

Not only were the trees cut down with no opposition from the feds, the first tree was cut down by Congressman Steve Pearce (R-2nd District). Would that there were many more like Rep. Pearce. The folks in the Second District are blessed with a constitution-supporting congressman and a number of constitutional sheriffs backed by the militias of their counties. This is the way that local governments can push back and help the feds to live within the limitations that have been placed upon them in Article 1, Section 8 of the U.S. Constitution.

As you can see, there's a lot happening in New Mexico. The militia in Lincoln County - some 200 plus men who keep their rifle and battle bag in their vehicles 24/7 -can be mustered in about 30 minutes at any place in the county. New Mexico is becoming a text book example of how the Founding Fathers envisioned the states would rein in an out-of-control government.

As stated by Alexander Hamilton in Federalist 28: "It may safely be received as an axiom in our political system that the State governments will, in all possible contingencies, afford complete security against invasions of the public liberty by the national authority."

If there were more sheriffs like those in New Mexico serving around the country, we would be well on the way to safeguarding our liberties against Washington's "invasions of the public liberty." It also might occur to the Congress that more examples of sheriffs interposing themselves might result in shrinking down the federal government to do little more than just funding the national defense.

Larry Pratt has been Executive Director of Gun Owners of America for 27 years. GOA is a national membership organization of 300,000 Americans dedicated to promoting their second amendment freedom to keep and bear arms. The GOA web site is: gunowners.org. E-Mail: [email protected]

Yup

GTC

Gregg,

I was in the very middle of all that mess in Otero County.
Aside from ranching BLM on the liberals beloved Mesa, I was a Wildlife Specialist that worked for the county.

I had a close relationship with the sheriff as well. The sheriff is a "Constitutional Sheriff", and he stood up for the people in his county. I stood with him.

When the tree cutting took place against the wishes of the Forest Circus, I was there, and was armed. As were many other patriots.

It wasn't like the Bundy ordeal. Largely because the sheriff and local county commissioners stood up and said "Enough!".

Bundy's standoff never would have gone as far as it did if the county and state politicians had stood up to the BLM and upheld the constitution before things went as far as they did.

The sheriff in Nevada, (Gillespie) and that County Commissioner, Tom Collins need to be impeached and jailed for their refusal to uphold the constitution, and the commissioner needs even more payback for threatening protesters that came to Bundy's aid with their very lives.

The Feds need to be stopped cold, in their land grab agenda. Simple as that.

Yup. Try to convince many people this is what's going on, though. They are doubtful, incredulous. They don't know history and the antics of totalitarian regimes. Couldn't happen here, they say.

But it is.

The politicos and their underlings in the agencies do what their masters tell them to. People should look up the Buffalo Commons and also be advised of how much land Ted Turner and other various rich guys own.

Exactly.

This should get even more attention if the land is truly the ranchers land. Even the blind and ignorant should be able to acknowledge that this family is 100% right. Where the Bundy episode had a major problem. Being he stopped paying the lease. But even that situation, anyone with anything between there ears was well aware the skirmish had nothing to do with being delinquent on allotment payments. A quick look at the situation told even those with a learning disability. It was about a federal gooberment Running ruff shod over citizens.


Here is something for some ( not all ) of you spineless liberal sheep back east to chew on.


1) SPOTTED OWL ( In relation to families put out of work )

2) The new " TURTLE " ( In relation to the Bundy Scam )

3) The BLM Mustang's ( The next thing to be saved. Ahead of livelihoods )

4) THE PRARIE CHICKEN ( Also ahead of family livelihoods. )

5) Multiple wet lands & critters along the KEYSTONE PIPLINE ( To be more important than American jobs and a more self reliant energy plan. )

6) HSUS ( The HUMAN SOCIETY UNITED STATES. THE BIGEST RIP OFF IN THE COUNTRY. )

7) Wolf reintroduction ( FUTURE PLANS FOR MORE BANED LAND FOR CITIZENS. )

8) AGENDA 21 ( Research it!!! Look at all the names you have heard about in other dishonest dealings.

If after researching if you still think the Bundy deal was about a cattle lease. And this family trying to hold on to what appears to be theirs. Is about misinformed crazy people that have it all wrong. You probably will be looking for an excuse not to do your share to stop anything. No matter how tyrannical the situation. Really no different than being on the GOOBERMENT TIT. Just expecting someone else to fight for your freedom and liberty simply because you feel entitled to them.


Take care, Willie

That's the problem with some of you. This is a different situation and I haven't seen one opposing comment, yet some of you speculate, accuse and jump to conclusions based on nothing.

As for slavery Ethan, It wouldn't have ended until mechanization became more profitable...

I wonder if you would have minded being a slave for an extra 20 or 30 years so it could work itself out peaceably?

That statement was truly epic.

You do make me laugh buddy.

Since it would have ended without a war, that makes the war senseless.

But the bondage and suffering of millions over those 20-30 years wouldn't be?

A swing and a miss.

And I agree, it was senseless as it ruined the South.

Most wars are senseless.

The death and destruction in your eyes was the way to go? Sensible you are----- NOT!

Agreed.

Case in point...Thank you. laffin.

Another accusation based upon nothing.

Show me where I said that?

I've only made 3 posts on this thread, so I'll give you 45 minutes to read and comprehend them before I expect a response.

The issue should have been settled peaceably through negotiation.

As I DID SAY- That war ruined the South for many decades.

The bloodlust on the Campfire is becoming sickening.

Too many here were just wishing the Bundy debacle would have started another "revolutionary" war.

Sick, that.

I'll save him the time.

You never got close to saying that.

I'm no fan of this administration by any stretch. They've earned our disgust and anger.

Unfortunately, here at the fire, government stupidity is met with more stupidity.

Still don't see it...

Seems most any reasonable, intelligent human being would realize that there was a 3rd option...

Negotiated settlement.

But that's not an option with the arm chair revolutionists. Y

And can someone please help him with the quote boxes?

You never mentioned a 3rd option in your quotes.

Your continually calling others stupid wears thin

Part of the whole thing that started this was the inability of some to stay civil. IMO I was very civil to you on the thread where this came up. If I've said something to you on this or any "Bundy" thread that was less than so, please refresh my memory.

As to your having not advocated war in your previous posts to me that jwp is referencing...if you are not, then what are you talking about? I stated on a thread that wasn't about this topic, that the South would have been out of the slave business in twenty years without the WBTS anyway, and you come back now asking me if I'd have wanted to wait that long for my freedom? That certainly to most people, alludes to you having been in favor of war to free the slaves, which is what happened. Then you state you want to avoid bloodshed. The two points seem at odds and evidently I'm not the only one who thinks so.

Based on the highlighted portion of my previous post that you obviously ignored so you could lie, please explain how i favored the war?

While certainly there have been battles like these in the past, what memo has gone out from the emperors administration that now has this issue at the forefront? Is Sally Jewell promoting this? Is this a bone thrown to the environmentalists in front of approval of the Keystone pipeline? Why after 5 1/2 years is this issue being pushed?

I can certainly appreciate how you and JWP wanted to avoid the bloodshed that was the civil war.

Show me where I've advocated it.

What is truly mystifying, is that while both of you abhor the violence that took place in that conflict, you are both perfectly willing to shed blood over some cows.

I'll use your own words Ethan---

How did jwp lie? I ask this in all sincerity and with no animosity. I addressed this on my previous post since it concerned a conversation I was involved in.

Certainly what you said gave the impression that you were in favor of the WBTS which freed the slaves. I'm not twisting your words at all. I think almost anybody would get that meaning, how could they not? I was saying that the WBTS was unnecessary because the slaves would have been freed fairly shortly anyway. You asked me if I'd want to wait twenty or thirty years. That gives the distinct impression that you think the WBTS was justified on the basis of slaves not wanting to wait to be freed.

I didn't say that was your meaning or what you had in your head. I just stated that it gives almost everybody that impression since you came very close to stating it flat-out. I also left the door open for you to explain yourself.

John I've explained it clearly to the best of my ability at least twice now and am at a loss as to how to communicate my point any differently.

I made the point that the WBTS was ostensibly over an issue, slavery, which would have been settled at least, in another generation, without the war. You asked me how I would have liked to have been a slave another twenty or thirty years. The whole thing was about avoidance of war so your words seem to be advocating war since that was the method used to avoid the twenty or thirty extra years.

What am I missing?

How long is it going to be before this "something for nothing" free loading farmer pays his fees?
I pay mine.

Disgusted.

Wsmnut

He made an accusation that I favored the war. In his haste, he accidentally included a quote that clearly points out that I didn't.

Easily seen for what it is by those who want to see.

Show me where I came close to supporting the civil war Ethan?

My first post on this thread was about people making false accusations based on an inability to comprehend.

I laid a trap and I even warned you, yet you both fell in it within 5 minutes.

Both of you accuse me of saying something I have not said, you can provide no proof- so you are both wrong.

Putting words in peoples mouths is a bad habit Ethan and is the only recourse for those on the losing end of an argument.

I'm off to Palm Sunday mass to ask forgiveness for playing tricks on such gullible folk.

LOL

Have a good one, no hard feelings.

Again you jump to conclusions, no where can you find where I promoted blood shed in the Bundy vs BLM. No where.

Exactly.

Don't bother researching, or hell even reading in numerous posts here that the BLM spurred by environmental radials cut the rancher's grazing permit to next to nothing before he ever refused to pay anything...

Don't bother to even remotely consider the special agendas of special interest groups involved in the attack that the BLM and other government agencies BROUGHT to this rancher over 20 years ago. He paid his fees right on time until the fight was brought to HIM.

Just keep walking to that same tired, old drum beat that the liberals are putting out in the media on orders from Reid and the Obama administration.

Enlightenment is truly enlightening. But, much like a week old kitten, one has to open their eyes before much light comes in....

Doesn't feel so good does it?

Lesson over.

He clearly advocated the position that the Civil War was preferable to gradual, peaceful, resolution of the slavery issue.

I hope you learned something.

I think 99.9% of people would have taken it that way.

What a bunch of f*cking babies.... Another thread sh*t upon.

Yes. Someone needs to point out a couple of objective articles that spell out just what the fed is doing and what/whom is motivating them.

Are they out to flex their legal muscle with laws that have gone un-enforced?
Are the enviro-wackos spurring them on?

The personal shots here don't lend clarity to the issue.

They're hugely increasing their control over the American people.

Greed motivates them.

The only peaceful solution is a constitutional convention and replace federalism with confederalism. And even that won't peaceful now that I think about it.

It's amazing how many legal immigrants have decided the USA is a third world chithole and have headed back to their native country rather than become naturalized citizens. Rats leaving a sinking ship?

The last civil war was the North versus the South. The next civil war will be the East verses the West. Or maybe it will be the North versus the South and the West. The North definitely has a different culture from the South and the West.

I think it will be the so called slave class against the self proclaimed entitled added to that there will be the ones that just start fighting everyone for their day to day survival.

How ever it comes down it will be very messy for a very long time.

No, the South would have JUMPED at the chance to have more'n 25% of their population, more than the whole free population in states like South Carolina and Mississippi, suddenly freed from chattel slavery and given the freedom to do what they wanted

This is what concerns me.

Bundy IIRC in talking to Hannity could not give an accurate number of the cows running loose on the disputed grounds. The actual roundup revealed a bunch of cows that had never been rounded up and branded/tagged whatever.

Granted, his own access may have been limited by his illegal status, but more'n likely given human nature in many cases public lands are probably being grazed about like frontier folks used to keep hogs; let 'em run wild, harvest as needed.

If the grazing is being controlled by the survival of the feral cattle themselves than ya, one would expect serious lasting changes to the environment as the range, whatever the carrying capacity, is grazed to the dirt.

The other thing is, all those here b&tching about the "turtle" likely could say nothing informed about it, nor its habitat requirements, nor its population. Bundy hisself held forth on the observation that the tortoise could survive eating cow crap.

Likewise the prairie chicken, Gila trout or whatever. Folks even wax on here as if ignorance of these things was a virtue. Heck, if'n I were making a living off of rangeland I'd want to know the workings of every critter and plant on it down to the grubs in the dirt.

I' sure we got good ranchers here who genuinely care about the range, I'm also sure the trout, the tortoise or the prairie chicken could survive alongside controlled grazing.

But I hear good ranchers here complaining about what I'd call "slob ranchers" (about like slob hunters).

Who polices the range, inspects the herds?

Why is it that the number of cattle on the Bundy tracts was a surprise, apparently to everyone?

And beyond grazing rights, how come there ain't no fines attached to slob ranching on public lands?

Birdwatcher

It goddam sure isn't the current crop of "Rangers".

Or USFS (they're CAUSING more burns than they're "controlling")

.....I'd guess evrybody's just a bit busy with TGGL sensitivity seminars, and what times left is tazer and small arms training.
Jeez,.......MRAPS training is going to be another drag on available hours.

WTF has time to worry about actually being OUT THERE ?

GTC

I'd like to know WTF the BORDER PATROL was doing up there, when and if their "leadership" finds time to answer questions about his dept's mandates.

GTC

How much money you got in the bank?

Have you ever claimed a deduction on taxes that was questionable?

When did you stop beating your wife?


Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer.

As to the obvious acceleration of the government takings, the Democrats expect to lose the Senate and to, again, take serious hits in state houses, especially in the West; and this will close a window on their looting. Obama is, also, termed out' and scandals are beginning to oust cabinet Secretaries. The Democrats are stealing all that they can as fast as they can while the window is still open.

Ever notice that:

Rich Republicans come to office with their money.

Rich Democrats leave office with 'their' money.

Yea, like live on welfare and pissing and moaning how bad they have it since slavery was abolished and how the USA is such a miserable place.

I have always found it to be passing strange that guys on a forum dedicated to hunting and outdoor recreation opportunities are so ready to label any and all who are concerned with habitat preservation etc. as "eviro-wackos" or something of the sort. I don't believe environmental protection and land use are mutually exclusive and I do believe the land is there for people as well as wildlife. However, I also believe land management is necessary or wildlife habitat will be lost to economic considerations. I would much rather see public lands supporting herds of elk than supporting herds of herefords. GD

You are seeing the huge divide between conservationist outdoorsmen and preservationist and even exclusionist environmentalists - many who never get closer to the wild lands than Golden Gate Park:

Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation
5705 Grant Creek
Missoula, MT 59808

Versus

Sierra Club
National Headquarters
85 Second Street, 2nd Floor
San Francisco, CA 94105
USA

Yes. The problem with this division is that conservationists are coming down as always in opposition to the preservationists even when they share common interests. It's frequently a tough call but to me, preservation of habitat for wildlife is a critical part of conservation of wildlife and increased hunting opportunities. In other words, I am almost always in favor of preservation of wildlife habitat but am also almost always in favor of freedom of access for hunters although not, necessarily, motorized access.
As far as this particular conflict is concerned, I don't have enough solid information to reach a conclusion and seriously doubt such information is to be found on any internet website! GD

Over 200 years ago, Thomas Jefferson wrote:

"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."


Jefferson also wrote:

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."


Seems like ol' Tom knew what the future might hold, eh?

But let's all hope it doesn't come to that...!

....only a complete IDIOT would suggest that 'Elk" could could, or WOULD choose to rustle on the range discussed here.

If you think what the BLM has been doing constitutes "Management", you've made the grade, and are INDEED a fuggin' idiot.

"Much Rather"

....that is verbiage worthy of one ENTITLED, or considering himself so.

GTC

WTF do you actually RESIDE, uninformed one ?

GTC

There is no such thing as "public" land.

Ill try and give it a shot birdwatcher



First let me say that there is always those that will abuse . that�s a given .
I cant speak for down there as the Bundy place is south of me by a few hundred miles . But up here , most don�t graze year round . In fact on USFS land your cows have to be out by the beginning of hunting season . Even if they didn�t require it , that�s what should happen if you want to keep your cows . They wont last a winter up there
Most folks know how many cows they put to range . But when that happens early prior to calving , then you have no real Idea . Add into that Ferial numbers . Those are more common south of here where the winters aren�t so bad as to clean them out
Now again I cant speak as to Bundy or how his operation works . Could very well be that he has cattle on the range year around . We however never did . I would however doubt that he is as he still would be maintain his bull cow ratios and have to do inoculations , brand , castrate�. Its also not uncommon to round up others cattle . They can range a lot farther then one thinks so you get strays . You bring them in and call the owner . Doing so is expected , its common curtsey
You also have losses , from predators , sickness , poachers and yes rustlers still live and breath today .
So in the fall your numbers were often different then the numbers you put out .



In some cases yes , in others no . over grazing can cause a lot of problems . You have stream bank erosion. Habitat destruction just to bring up two .
Cows don�t just hang out the spread out . Some stay in groups others go it alone . They like creek bottoms and thick brushy vegetation . Especially around or near water supplies .. So depending on the size of the creek , the cattal can have a very big impact on the fish in the stream , birds who nest in the under growth and such .
With the parry chickens , the issue is that they nest and bread in a specific type of terrain. Terrain the cows like as well . So their nests get trampled �� so range managment is really key for theatened species

Problem is that the management is sadly with the rancher . Regardless of what agencies like the BLM say . On a small scale the BLM does do some things like stream bank repair and defiantly the studies . But past that they tell the cattleman association , the ranchers and the general public. Ie hunters , fisherman , motorcycle clubs , off readers��. what they want done . Then a lot of time disappear
But mysteriously reappear when there is a ticket to write .
This isn�t to say all BLM district managers are bad . They are not . Some actually work closely with communities and really try to help people in every way possible . But it sure seems anymore that for every one of those , there are 2 or 3 of the bad ones . Which in turn seem to bread bad field agents which are nothing more then policemen with chips on their shoulders .


those can be just about anyone really , yep just like slob hunters .
They can be big outfits that buy up way more grazing rights then they can use just to keep others out .
Outfits that think because they have a grazing lease or right that they can keep the public out
Small outfits who cant gets a grazing lease , don�t have enough land so they just turn their herd out . Its cheepr to pay the fine then it is to pay the feed costs .
These same people often don�t maintain their herds IE no inoculations . Also often times they don�t have bulls . So they will release their cows out onto a given range . Some over on that ranches range , some over on another , and some on another as a way to get their heifers bread. Knowing that when those ranchers bring their herds in , they will be called to come and pick up their cows .


Well the BLM and USFS are the main two . Here the IDFG also reports violation. Then sometimes you have the land board and brand inspectors .

A good outfit though will have range riders or the rancher himself will check on the herd periodically. But remember once out on the range . The cows are not in one big herd . Their scattered . As far as inspections , you mean like health inspections and such ?? If so that�s the rancher or in the case of a sale , then sometimes there is a vet hired and available to inoculate at the sale if you so wish . Records are also kept and matched with ear tags when there are issues .



There is . However those fines often do not exceed the cost of being in violation .
Think of as obama care . Its not free if you cant aford the 120.00 base plan and the fine for not buying it is � , what are you going to do ?
On top of that , if the rancher is a member of the cattleman Association or other such group . Those groups often have their own systems for dealing with membership who are having a lot of complaints .
But even that doesn�t trump the community itself .
Its different out here . Granted not as strong as a difference as it used to be . But folks take care of each other . If someone is having issues , we help out . If someone calls you come a runnin . Why , because someday you may find yourself on the other end . Only when things get really , really bad between folks is there a break . But past that , even though you may not like someone real well you keep your mouth shut and lend a hand .
So while there is slob ranchers , unless they are really bad . Most folks don�t complain all that much other then between themselves

What then have I hunted on for 54 years now??

He might mean that public land is a euphemism for government owned land. If you can hunt on it, it's because the government has given you permission to, which permission can be withdrawn at any time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_land

Yes, like the 'public land' ie national parks and such 'closed' as punishment during the govt shutdown...

I am surprised at the harsh tones of these threads, a non-military burearocratic section of the govt sends their private army against a citizen...they didn't garnish wages, they didn't retain income tax, they surround his homestead?

Pravda and Tass US media sell the story...there should be citizen solidarity and govt accountability.

Reminds me of a famous quote by Martin Niemoller:

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out-- Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out-- Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out-- Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

Rob Serling walkin' up out of the shadows, Cigarette blazing, and the Twilight Zone Theme audio ramping up can't cover your statement.

I have NO clue how to suggest a "we have just entered the Moronic Zone", either.

You are quite a piece of work,.....

GTC

oops,


Why get excited???? You do know ya can't fix stupid.



Take care, Willie

I know exactly, check it most every day. Do you have so much you find keeping track of it all difficult?



Well. I didn't think so, but the IRS felt otherwise



??? Never started.



While I know it is the height of cowboy impropriety to ask someone how many cows they got, in this case Bundy's cows were a national issue that coulda have and might still one day get someone shot.

So, is it actually stupid to expect a rancher like Bundy to have a pretty good idea of how many cows are on his lease, especially given the openness of the terrain and the fact that all those cows are gonna be dependent on just a few sources of water?

Birdwatcher

This just in:

BUNDY RANCH EVENT:

At 1750 hours ET, I was contacted by my source within the Department of Homeland Security regarding the current situation at the Bundy Ranch. To put it bluntly, the people are being hoodwinked into believing that the situation is being resolved. It is not. It is a strategic de-escalation to fool the public. This source stated that the retreat of the BLM agents and the release of the cattle was actually crafted as a potential plan yesterday (Friday, 11 April 2014) based on the following:

1. A military assessment of satellite and drone surveillance imagery of the �patriot resistance. Drones under the control of the U.S. military were in use, taking real-time photographic images of not just the activity at the ranch, but "identifying the protesters, any arms and any supplies they might have or be carrying. �Mission accomplished.�

2. Real-time communication intercepts between patriots on-site and their off-site support;

3. Active monitoring of internet traffic regarding the coverage of events at ranch;

4. The monitoring of real-time video from the scene.

This source stated that a response by the patriot movement was anticipated, although exceeded their expectations. Although this was a real operation, they also ran this as a test case for future government operations once they saw the response. They were also actively managing the media, in some cases threatening to cut off White House access to anyone covering the event.

Despite this, the coverage by the alternative media began to create a public relations problem that was not easily managed. Note the lack of acknowledgment by the White House regarding this event. They are intentionally framing it as a state issue, despite the fact that all federal response has been and continues to be from the White House. There is a reason for this � a reason that has not been identified in any of the public reports to date. I will explain in further detail in a follow-up report on Sunday, after this source attends [redacted] to obtain more specific information about future federal operations. Regardless, according to this source, the government will take back �their land� as they must to fulfill international obligations. It was never about grazing rights or anything other than (1) �securing clear title� to the land, and (2) further demonizing any patriotic resistance. It is my understanding, based on the information from this source, that it is a critical task to create a situation that will also advance their agenda of gun control and confiscation.

A more detailed report will follow on Sunday, 13 April 2014, with additional and much more specific information about their inside plans and future operations.PLEASE MAKE THIS VIRAL!

And if asked on a national radio show exactly how much you had in there while you KNOW someone is actively trying to steal it from you, would you tell exactly how much it was or would you demur?

Good point.

OTOH, IIRC something like 20% maybe 30% of the cattle rounded up on Bundy's lease were apparently feral; no brands no tags. I guess that at best amounts to lost income on an efficiently managed spread, and at worst evidence of slack management and neglect?

Birdwatcher

A calf or a yearling without a brand does not equate to an inefficiently managed spread. It means that they hadn't gotten out there to brand them yet this year.

You actually know something about ranching! I'm impressed. Still at it?

The govornment took all my families land in the fifties. $50 per acres, or nothing. It's all under Sam Rayburn Reservoir. None of this is new.