A guy comes into your place of business and explains his vehicle is out of gas and needs repairs for him continue his move across Country. He pulls out a very nice Vintage Krag that is in excellent shape.

He then asks if you are willing to hold it for thirty days against a loan of $300 dollars so he can repair his vehicle and finish his trip. He makes the promise "I will be back before 30 days is up" so you loan him the funds.

Thirty days go by and you are admiring and showing your new Firearm to close friends and Family. On the Fortieth day, 10 days late, the guy shows up and claims he got held up due to circumstances beyond his control but he has the money and would like the Gun back.

He goes on to explain how priceless it is to him because it was the very Firearm his Great Grandfather used while in Cuba fighting the Spanish American War. The Firearm is indeed period correct so he is more than likely telling the truth.

What would you do?

Being a little bit late is like being a little bit pregnant. Id charge him the going rate.

At first I thought I would give it back, then I typed it out, then I erased it. I don't know what I would do...good luck!

Well, if you keep it, will you feel good about it?

That sounds fair.....

no doubt, give it back. Wouldn't even think twice.

Charge him $100 interest and give him some complimentary Aloe Vera.

GTC

i would give it back.

I'd return the rifle in exchange for the $300, but I would certainly mention that he was late on the agreement. If it's evident that it's a family heirloom I'm not keeping it. I've got some blacksmith tools that belonged to one of my great-grandfathers, my grandfathers shotgun, a Colt pistol from the Civil War, etc. and would be sad if I had to let them go.

First...and very first thing...on the day I took possession of it...I would ask the police to run a stolen item search on it.

But thats just me.

i have let karma guide a lot of my dealings for the majority of my adult life and have usually not been disappointed.

I was in the gun biz, and we even pawned guns for years, trust me when I tell you they all come up with a lame assed excuse for being late with a pawn, or even a layaway payment.
Given the tiniest excuse, they will play you like a harmonica.

Give him the benefit of the doubt along with the rifle. Treat him as I would like to be treated were I held up due to circumstances beyond my control.

If he offers to kick in another 10 or 20 bucks because he's late, accept it with a gracious thank you, if not then just hand him the rifle back and wish him good luck.

And in a way I get that. But OTOH this was not planned, the OP is not a pawn shop????

And as such, give me the cash, I"ll mention you are late, and if you give me another 20 or whatever fine, if not no biggy.

Being in the business, its all business. I don't think this was the case.

Jeff...I understand your point....but it all hinges on the guy actually telling the truth...which I don't think is the case.
If it was truly that important to him, he would have been on time. And failing that he should have been ashamed to show up ten days late looking for sympathy.


I wish I still had your ( and many other members here...) faith in humanity, but Ive been lied to and cheated so many times that no one gets a pass.

No doubt the fair and right thing.

Remember, you are the one that did him a favor. Now, by returning the rifle, it's two favors.

This.

kwg

This

Without a doubt. 10 days ain't schit.

Christian faith and values tell me the right thing to do is let him pay the $300.00 give him the gun back, and sleep well at night. This wasn't a deal done at a pawnshop, it was a gentleman's handshake agreement. In the end, I've got to live with my self. I doubt either party woke up that morning planning on doing a deal for a Krag.

Yep.
Doin' the right thing ain't always easy, but it's always right.

I'd have to see the guy and determine whether I thought he was being truthful.

I wouldn't keep the gun, but I might certainly tell him the price went up $40 for late fees.


did similar with a kinda family member, took him a long time to get the cash to buy his Sako back.

but let him have it back at what I'd given him against it.

and if it was biz, the guy could have damned well called on day 30 unless he was in the pokey

There's only one thing to do....the right thing. Look yourself in the mirror and that guy will tell you what's right.

I'd tell him to go buy me a 1/2 gallon of FAMOUS GROUSE....come back and sit down and we'll have a shot or two....and give him the $$$$ back!

Simple!

Mebbe tell him since he was late you sent to the 'smith for rechambering to a .300 Blackout and new tactical stock?

Then I'd give it back, take the $300 and move on.

Good to see all the "do the right thing" replies here. The question was Hypothetical curiosity based on a real event from my past.

Because this choice was indeed a turning point in my life when it happened 35 years ago at the age of 19. Whether he was honest or not didn't matter. All I could think of was "What if it was my Great Grandfather's Rifle?" and he was indeed being sincere and honest about it.

I did give him the benefit of the doubt and gave it back to him. I would like to believe that this action may have helped towards some of the extremely good fortune I have had in life since. Good to see those who would do the right thing, not just for the guy wanting it back, But for themselves.

Would I do it again today? or tomorrow? Absolutely

Good Man!

I see a whole bunch of guys on here that deserve that more than I do!

Know what would be cool? If one of the longtime respected Members here on the Fire popped up and said "Hey! that was me!".

I would feel even better

I don't loan strangers money.
If he wanted to sell it, fine.

I'm w/ Ingwe. If you are willing to put up a family heirloom as collateral your motivation should be greater than the value of the object. If it is truly of importance you would not take advantage of the person extending you the credit.

Phug a bunch of losers w/ sob stories, let them feel the bern.


mike r

It's a business transactions.

The purpose of collateral is to insure you are repaid. In this instance you are being repaid, so it that regard in served it's purpose. If he's returning it late, you should be happy, after all, you are earning an extra 10 days worth of interest without any additional labor, and earn some good will in the process.

It's just good business.

Don't worry when I get as old as you are I'll be there.... I'm getting there fast.

But the above would have to be walk a mile in my shoes. I didn't take it this was a pawn shop, just a repair shop or gas station of the old days, and we were all more honest in days gone by I think. I happen to know a bit more about the story than y'all do. LOL.

Of course I'm country and prefer it that way, and as such I'm a bit... maybe a lot, more naieve. The fact he came back for it speaks worlds to me...

Yep. Me too.

And if it comes up hot, you done lost your $300.00 and the gun. Keep the cops out of it.

It seems like if he was genuinely concerned about a family heirloom, he would have attempted to contact you when he knew he was going to be late. Either way you didn't lose anything that was yours and your conscience is clear. Win-win.

Give it back. No question.

Two problems-

Phone calls are free. Why didn't he call and inform you he was going to be late? Poor upbringing or decision making.

Second, since he obviously has not been taught that his word is his responsibility to protect, I would teach him that lesson. He gave his word and failed. You have no responsibility to enable him to continue in his poor decision making.

Hold his feet to the fire since his parents never did, apparently.

Throw the Krag in the river for all I care, but hold him to his word one way or another.

how do you know he had his #, and if he was in the process of moving he could of run into some problems, how far did he have to travel to get back, might of started a new job and couldn't get away when he thought he could.

I'd ask him his position on management of public lands by the USFS and BLM. If he said public lands should be transferred to the states, I'd keep the rifle.

he could show up a yr later i'd still give it back to him, i didn't buy it, just took it for collateral, as long as i got my money back he'd get the gun back.

maybe I'm just tired, but you jabronis are crackin me up tonite


good job

I would give it back. Who wants something that doesn't belong to them. I have a scope that I sold to a guy on the campfire for an agreed price the first of March with the promise to pay me fully by April 15. It is almost May and I am still waiting for the last $600.00.

I hope he sends the check soon, as I told him I am not a store and don't do layaways. He sounded like a nice guy that really wants the scope.

I may be back asking for help soon if I don't see the money. Someone else may be telling me to wait some more...

Exactly. Karma is not a bad thing, sell it back and get on with your life ........

Shouldn't even be a question here.

That is the big question. If it were me I would give the gun back and go to bed knowing I did a good deed for someone who was in a bind. But that is just me and it time past I have been in a bind myself.

I probably would,..but I'd be miffed about it.

More than likely, I wouldn't get into an arrangement like that just because of what happened in this instance.

Guy says he'll have the money back to you in 30 days,...shows up in 40 sniveling about being late,...granpaw's rifle,..blah blah blah.

It's best just to stay out of stuff like that. It's a recipe for bad feelings.

I stopped to help a guy with a flat tire on his chevy pickup in far south Houston, he had a lug wrench but didn't have a jack. We used my jack and he said he didn't have a spare, he asked if he could use my spare and seemed damn grateful, took my name and number and shook my hand hard. He said he would get his flat fixed and call me to return the spare, thirty years later and he has not called.

I would have told him to take it to a pawn shop.

Pretty much that simple in my mind. He lied about getting back to you in thirty days, why would you believe the rest of his story?

For those that like the good old country upbringing, your word is your bond. He showed what his was worth.


Yeah, I'm a curmudgeon.....

Damn that 'flave.....

A buddy of mine that I used to work with always had a little stash of money handy. He likes guns and motorcycles.

It wasn't a regular thing, but people knew he was usually ready to consider a deal on a quality firearm.

One guy needed money and sold him a .50 caliber Desert Eagle. The price was good, but it wasn't like he stole it off the guy.

A year later the guy sends his wife over to try and buy it back for the same price,...giving him a big sob story.

He just told her it wasn't for sale.

Some people got a lot of nerve.

I would give it back without a second thought. The world is full of liars, cheats and thieves, but it is also full of people who just drew a Joker and need a hand up.

If someone asks me for a hand and I can't identify them as being in the first group through my sixth sense I will give them the benefit of the doubt and help them if it does not seem likely to endanger me.

Sometimes I'm not sure and will keep my guard up but will still give them the benefit of the doubt. I know that sometimes good people need a hand up and it would bother me to not provide it if I could.

Did your buddy tell you about the BJ she gave him BEFORE he told her "no"?

If I was on the flip side of the deal, I would have called the guy up on day 30 and told him that I wasn't going to be able to come up with the money. Thank him for the hand up, and tell him that I hoped he enjoyed the rifle.

I'd be glad to give it back to him, although I would ask to shoot it just one time.

A gal pulled in my daddys drive way one time with a sad story... needed gas to get where ever, wanted money. My dad told her he wouldn't give her any money but he had gas in a can he'd put in here car. About a 1/2 gal out of the can and gas started pouring out of the filler neck on the car..... kind shot that story all to Hell... Hey, but what ever makes you guys feel warm and fuzzy......

Punt.

lol,...no

In fact, the woman pestered him a few times about it,...wouldn't leave it alone.

He ended up having to get a bit sharp with her to get her to leave him alone about it.

Trade it back. I'd judge him to be honest at least, if not so much punctual.

May this day be forever etched in Campfire lore as the day Tom CAVED and agreed with Fireball! Holy Smokes.

Same story eons ago, gun was WWll P-38. Didn't know the guy but he was in a bind and needed $50. Thirty day deal, he lived about 100 miles away. Called on the 29th day and said he couldn't make it down because of work and to keep the gun. Told him I would hold until his day off the next week. He came down the following week and picked the gun up.

Fellow officer while working loaned some mechanical tools to a individual who was broke down on the highway. Borrower agree to to leave the tools at the next service station. Couple hours later the officer stopped to pick up the tools. Guy had not dropped them off. He was located 100 miles down the road and still had the tools. Loaning officer arrested the individual for petty theft. GW

No schitt.....

well you can't always be right.

I don't deal in the ridiculous.

It's obvious the OP does.

Enjoy. Or don't. IDGAF either way.




Clark

Yeah, that's the second thing I noticed about you.

This thread would go a LOT smoother if everyone would just rub some Aloe Vera on their heads.

GTC

does it get rid of dandruff?

I didn't say which head, did I ?

GTC

well then crabs?

Late to this discussion but if I still had the rifle, I would let him get it back. On the other hand if it had bee long enough that I had gotten rid of it, I would tell him, sorry but you did not show up on time and I sold it. Then I would not worry about it either way. miles

Absolutely.

Jim

I'm not a fan of Krags, but even if it was a nice NULA or a sweet 20 ga. double, he'd get his gun back...BUT I'd let him know he should have called or contacted me if he was gonna be late...

Around the same time a guy left his Mother in Law for collateral against the loan of a nice Tow Chain and He actually came back.

After Talking to her for about two hours I'm not sure I would have.

The guy with the Rifle was between a rock and a hard place and the Rifle was the only thing he had of real value to be hocked. Although I would have liked to add a Krag to my collection I already had plenty of Rifles at the time.

Including my own Great Grandfather's firearms.

Turned out that this was the only Rifle he owned at the time so the story about it being his Grandfather's was more than likely true and I needed the cash back even more. I have been between a rock and a hard place myself and was always grateful to have someone trust me and help me out this way.

Maybe some of you think I was not right in the head for being a compassionate person and giving it back as I did but I had a legitimate excuse...This was before I discovered how beneficial it was to apply Aloe Vera to my head on public lands!

I wonder how many of the give backers are of Christian faith and the "F" him guys are not?

I know a lot of non-Christians who would have also given it back. In fact probably even more than most of the Christians I know.

Unfortunately I no longer feel that Faith truly dictates Morality.

Looks like we failed Bugouts morality test but I still say it would have become nothing more than a business transaction when he added the no call no show to the equation....
Apparently this happened at a place of business so there's no reason why he couldn't find the number and make a simple phone call when he realized he would be late.....
"Doing the right thing" goes both ways....even for sanctimonious christians....

If I believed the story, I'd give it back for the money. I'd be pretty pissed off, though. The guy should have offered more than the $300.00 back, considering the deal he made (and broke), also.

Assuming he wasn't a resident of your state, I'd call the ATF on both of you.

Isn't that just for handguns?

That wouldn't be very christian of you....

Unlicensed people. You can't drive to Illinois and sell shotguns out of your trunk.

Come on, someone has to know.

I'm another that would have let him have it back.

This was 35 years ago...Before the Constitution was illegally redefined and the 2nd was still respected.

Hocking Guns for repairs and such were very common place back then. Sales between individuals was unregulated also.

That doesn't mean it was legal.

If the man has turned up with the money the rifle doesn't belong to you.

i'd a shot him with it for asking. just wounded though, not dead. he'd have learned a valuable life lesson and i'd have gained a fine krag. win-win

Yeah, I would not have touched that transaction with a person just passing through. Then, there is the whole issue as to how a security interest would be created and enforced under applicable state law. It looks like the statute of limitations ran a long time ago, though.

Well, there is another thing to consider in this instance. Said rifle was used during the Spanish-American war, which was in 1898. So said rifle is an ANTIQUE.

Yes...but so are half of the respondents.



Added...Hello Ingwe!

Maybe it was not legal, but minor things like this were not really enforced back then.

Thing is...I was a Ca resident, He was moving to Ca to become a resident, and the temporary exchange happened in Ca.

Do you think they would have taken the time and resources to prove a difference? Even if someone called them they would have probably just disregarded it.

Towing and Repair was a pretty good gig for Firearm Collectors back then.

I would have sold/traded the rifle on Day 31. Everybody is happy - he successfully moved across country and I dumped a rifle I never wanted in the first place. If the guy wanted to be ecstatic he would have shown up earlier.

Yep...It never was mine...I had to trust him too. He could have just reported it stolen and I would have went to jail the next time it was run. He would have got it back without paying the money and I would have went to jail on top of it.

This was one of the things I did indeed consider in this decision.

My cash back...risk gone.

I'd have given it back with repayment. Matter of fact I woulda hunted him down to get repayment because, unless it was owned by Teddy Roosevelt himself, there's no way I would have given $300 for a Krag 35 years ago.

I bet it happened more recently.

There's a vague air of immorality about this particular morality test.

Tech tip, check your compassion levels on a regular basis.
Avoid over-filling.

GTC

No...35 years ago and it very obviously had only a few rounds put through it and was in pristine shape. I was not real knowledgeable back then about Firearm values, I was only 19.

And Mitch is right, I probably was loaning him too much towards it. I was still a kid WANTED that Rifle. 30 days was long enough for me to think twice and reconsider the wisdom of it.

It was not intended to be a morality test of any kind at all Greg. I was just curious if anyone was going to pick up on the fact that this guy could have reported this Firearm Stolen and caused me a world of hurt. Anyone who would have kept it would have also been at serious risk in this scenario.

Greg...you are apparently going to badger me in attempt to get my Goat but it is not going to happen. What is it you want from me? My lunch money? What would make you feel better and satisfy your obvious agenda here?

Please detail your purpose and point with this and maybe I can gladly accommodate you.

I ain't given up my Lunch Money man...never did and never will...

The way we treat other people (in most instances) likely has a lot more to do with 'us' than it does with 'them'.

Absolutely. And I did do it for "Me". Not just because I was raised to think this way but the guy could have reported the thing Stolen!

I would reluctantly (and sorrowfully) give it back to him. It is his and just because he missed the 30 day limit, I couldn't take advantage of the situation.

Now, if he came back 2 years later, that could be a different story.

Having been in the same situation I'd do what I've always done....take the $300 and give him his gun. I might request a $100 late fee but that would definitely depend on the circumstances. I won't keep a family heirloom and have been successful in repatriating several heirlooms to their rightful owner.

I would give it back knowing there is only a small chance his story isnt BS and he has probably been laid up drunk some where. I'd charge him a late fee and say have a good day enjoy your heirloom.

As the Campfire turns, and Burns Soap opera.

Does anybody here think I'm badgering Tinfoil Hat Bughouse ?

Sheesh.

GTC

Damn Right.

GTC

Lol...Took you 1.5 hours to think up that Humor I'm actually getting a kick out of your Comical Immature Schoolyard Antics. But It's starting to get Silly...

OK if you are going to obsessively follow me around for two days crying about it just so you can get your thread bumped I will toss out my Aloe Vera and buy the product you are spamming. lol

Thank you for the chuckles Greg, Please continue, Practice makes perfect! Got to get ready for the next guy in your sights!

Silly ?

You take this stuff WAY to seriously, Bucko.

The 1.5 hours was spent actually DOING something,....and I can think stuff like this up faster than I can type.

Tell me, is there some on-line course that one takes in "Social Media Etiquette ?".

GTC

It wasn't a morality test ?

GTC

Badgering...definitely not.
Minking or weasling .....maybe.

Lol...talk about holding grudges and taking LITTLE things too seriously...It is not me following you over to other threads to perpetuate snide comments, obsesses and stress over unimportant lttle issues as my little "pet project".

That immaturity is all on you Buddy...I dropped the whole thing over at your thread and moved on. The issue was not important enough to stress over. Not even the Derogatory names you used out of ignorance trying to get a derogatory response in return.

Not going to happen. lol

You are baiting me into getting myself booted and it is not going to work man. If Rick or another Authorized Moderator asks me to go I will do so out of absolute respect.

Until then get over it. I'm here to stay. And you still ain't going to get my Lunch Money.

I'm confused.....In your OP you stated....

"He goes on to explain how priceless it is to him because it was the very Firearm his Great Grandfather used while in Cuba fighting the Spanish American War. The Firearm is indeed period correct so he is more than likely telling the truth."

And then five pages later you say.....




I'm far from a military firearms expert but I'd think a true battle rifle would be far from pristine and certainly have more that a few rounds through it from practicing even if it wasn't fired in battle all that much....

Nothing personal and I certainly don't want your lunch money but this thread is starting to reek of self serving

well maybe the owner was of french descent...

I think we're dealing with a sock puppet, myself,...

Fugger would make a damned fine POLITICIAN, 'cuz he sure has never giving a straight answer down to a fine art.

GTC

ANYTHING with Spanish American War provenance is going to show SEVERE wear and tear,....all one has to do is read Roosevelt to so ascertain.

GTC

Good point....

French rifles, pristine condition. Only dropped once.

Italian tanks, great condition, reverse gear shows a little wear.

Read his other threads and comments. This guy was testing our ability to spot the fact that the seller could report the firearm as stolen. I guess he doesn't know how to create a proper signed receipt. As a morality test we can now identify true christians?

B.S meter pegged at the Safariman level.


mike r