Im looking heavily at either a megatarp or paratipi for some back country hunting i an going to do. But i haven't seen much info on competitors to kifaru.

I have seen some of tigoats stuff but am curious if there is anyone else offering stuff in this same category.

Anyone know of anywhere else to see similar tents/tipi/tarps?

Seek Outside makes great tipis, and the owner Kevin T is on this forum.

Seek Outside. I could tell you why they are better option than Kifaru on features, construction and price but I don't want to hurt anybodys feelings. For what your looking for the LBO and its different parts/setups would work well for you.

I jumped on really fast to their site and found the lil bug out. There will only be two of us most of the time. Would the Bug out with the vestibule be enough or would it be cramming it a bit?

I also seen that their smallest stove is a medium.?. Would this be to much for that small of a set up?

A Seekoutside LBO, either two bases or a base and a vestibule would work well as would a Backcountry Shelter. The BCS is my favorite.

As far as stoves, one of my roll-up titanium stoves, either a 12" or 16' would work well.

This is worth a read although its now outdated:

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/5537405

This also if your interested in the BCS:

http://hillpeoplegear.com/Forum/tabid/679/forumid/23/threadid/1176/scope/posts/Default.aspx

Oh, and this great write up on the LBO:

http://sreekers81.blogspot.com/2012/11/more-than-teaser-lil-bug-out.html

I am not sure on the SO medium as I have never seen or used one in person. I could recommend an Ed T stove though, a 12" I think would work well in a LBO or BCS.

I can only speak to the Seek Outside LBO and their first generation 6.

For two, the double base set up would work. If you ran one of their medium stoves in it, space would be tight with gear, but doable. The link on the LBO page is a write up that I did on the LBO. I haven't used one of Ed T's, although I would like to in the future.

The BCS has a bit more space, but I haven't used one, yet. I have plans to do a write up comparing the LBO, BCS, and the 4 man in April.

This has been coming up as an alternative to the Megatarp on Various forums.

http://mountainsmith.com/index.php/tents-sleeping-bags/tents/mountain-shelter-lt.html

The LBO and Vest can work for two depending on sleeping arrangement. It is 56 sq feet , so it isn't really small. You can also leave one side not attached and get a larger footprint with 7/8 coverage in fairer weather. The medium stove will work in it as its only 10 inches long and 12 high, although for running a stove and lots of gear I would choose 2 bases if that was primary usage. It depends on if the stove is to be used all the time as a primary function or just on occasion. The really nice thing, is the LBO can adapt to the situation at hand really easily, I primarily use it as base and vest for one or two and then add a tarp connector for stove use and bigger camps. You can also run it vest, tarp, vest as well, and have a stove in the middle and separate exits as well. It's not bad that way, just not compatible with a nest, but it's comfy for two and gear in a floorless set up.

How appropriate a customer sent us a stove video they made. They did a lot better job than we have at videos. It's a medium stove in the video


enjoy

If, you are going to spend any extended periods in ANY backpackable shelter, try to buy one a bit bigger than your absolute minimum. This, in multi-day/night stints in really vile weather, as much of the year in BC, makes a HUGE difference.

I would take EdT's advice and I would buy the BCS, one of his stoves and the extra panel.....very choice little rig, IMHO.

Funny story, our wood this year was so dry during deer season that we may have had some flames coming out of the 8 foot pipe on accident. I tried to get pictures but it didn't work. We stayed warm though....

I talked to another member on here today that lives in the same town as me. I asked him what he thought and he just happens to have the bcs. So i hope to be able to set it up and see for my self. He also has to of Eds stoves. Should be the ticket from what i hear.

It would be a primary use for two people but could three fit if needed.....even if it was close?

See if he will let you take it for a test drive, likely help your decision making process.

I talked to another member on here today that lives in the same town as me. I asked him what he thought and he just happens to have the bcs. So i hope to be able to set it up and see for my self. He also has to of Eds stoves. Should be the ticket from what i hear.

It would be a primary use for two people but could three fit if needed.....even if it was close?

Yep...I'd opt for the BCS from Seek Outside for a stand alone extended trip shelter out of the ones mentioned here...great shelter indeed.

Al, you had a chance to play with the LBO yet?

I tried to attach an excel file (that I zipped so it would let me attach it) that I made when trying to buy a tarp/tipi shelter. It tops out at about 25 different models, and I have columns for weight, size, material, an online link to website, price, etc. The price might be a bit off cause I get some pro deals, but feel free to take a look. It helped me a lot to narrow things down.

On ones without a stove jack I was going to buy one from TiGoat and install.

I LOVE Kifaru products!!!! Greatest packs on the planet. Probably some of the very best tents/tarps. I would love the new Mega Tarp. I had a Paratipi, did not like it. The thing is rather large inside for square footage. Useable square footage for sleeping and sitting is horrible though. I feel the design of this one is not good if you are at all tall. I just could not stay off the tarp fabric, sitting or sleeping. Put a stove in it, and it is really bad. Just my opinion of the Paratipi........

Brent

Is the door panel worth the extra money for the space on the bcs?

Golite Shangrala

Ed,

Do you have any weights for your stoves posted on your web site? I couldn't find them.

Why the BCS plus panel instead of the SO 4 man tipi? I am leaning towards the 4 man. Looks to be a little larger, taller, and cheaper than the BCS plus panel. May weigh a little more though. Plus you get 2 doors with the 4 man. Any other differences I am missing? I would like to get the medium stove too. This would be for 2 guys, gear, and the stove when needed.

Can you walk into a 4 man standing up ?

4 man is a bit larger, and feels a bit bigger if you use the side guy outs, it also has dual vents ,that are a bit more refined . 4 man has the flexi pitch all the other tipis have. It can take a nest. I think it was a 3 ounce weight gain on the 4, but will weigh a few before definitive.

I have slept 2 and a stove in the bcs without the panel several times. It is doable, but not my favorite. You can sleep 2 better with the add in panel or very comfy in a 4 style with opposing exits. I've slept two in the bug out as well with vestibule several times. I've slept up to 4 with the stove and tarp etc. The dual bug outs with tarp and stove in the middle is cavernous for two people. It feels like they are in another zip code.

Yes

The BCS is more versatile. You can add the extra panel or leave it at home. I believe the BCS is taller, but Kevin would have to verify that. The BCS is a full 7' when pitched without the panel. With the panel I believe they are close to the same height.

If you do some trips solo and some with 2 guys, the BCS or the LBO would deserve a good look.

If going always with 2 guys, however, the 4 man would be a good choice.

That pretty much sums it up. The BCS is a couple inches taller without the panel and about 4 shorter with the panel. It depends on how you plan to use it.

Kevin

I went through this same debate recently, looking for a tent and stove combo for a buddy and I to back country hunt with. I wanted something that would shelter us and a weeks worth of gear and bows as it can rain here in WA....for days at a time. Also wanted something large enough that he and I could take our sons on a light overnight camp/hike.

I made the list, compared weights, costs, etc. In the end I ended up with a Seek Outside 6 man tipi and large stove. Between 2 guys packing it in, the extra pound or so each was worth it for the comfort that will be gained by the large tent and stove.

Seek Outside won the day due to their weight and features.....and Kevin's putting up with all my questions.

I haven't set the tent up yet since I've only had it 2 weeks and been busy, probably this weekend to let the kids play in it and do a burn in of the stove. I laughed when I got the small box from Seek Outside. Coming from wall tents that you can park a truck inside of I couldn't believe this small and light box not only held a 6 man tent but a large stove!!

http://seekoutside.com/products/ultralight-tipis/tipittents/

Interesting differing view here. I have Just one packs and a long hunter. I have yet to see the longhunter do anything better/more comfortable than the Just ones have done, that only goes up to around 120 pound loads though. But I keep hearing the long hunter is best so I keep it and try it from time to time. Just like how the Just one is set up better though.

RE the paratipi, wife and I use it on backpack elk hunts. Plenty large enough to sleep just fine, and to cook and get dressed in for us. We keep our packs outside covered though.

Next step would be a tipi, but have a 6 man thast a bit much for 2 folks on a pack trip.

That really depends on how tall you are. I can't stand straight up in a tent less than 8'6" when you consider the angle of the walls and the location of the stove and center pole.

The weights are as follows with 7' pipes, stove bags and all accessories:
12" 1 lb 15 oz
16" 2 lb 5 oz

22" is going to be replaced by a 10" x 18"

I've had a BCS for over a year now, and here's my input:

If you're going solo some and with two some and you like head room the BCS is perfect.

If I were going with two all the time and liked head room I'd get a 4 man because you can each have your side of the tipi and a seperate exit.

LBO isn't stand up height, but is a UL one, two, or more person shelter, with the purchase of additional pieces.

I've got my eye on a LBO with vestibule for archery elk this year.

Your stoves seem a lot lighter then other stoves. Im assuming that its because the volume is lower due to the fact that they are round?

How do they compare in burn times? I konw that no back country stove will ever last all night. Thats not what im after. But i just dont want to be adding small sticks every 20 min. cuase i dont have the room or space to put small kindling in.

No not yet...though it looks like a cool shelter and very modular. Though with my wife and I sleeping in a nest with our pads and bags coupled together its hard to get away from the simple square floor design of the SL-5 as it provides the most usable space for us given the weight of the shelter....something about 29 oz for 90 sq ft of shelter is pretty hard to get away from.

Everyone has different needs and I can certainly see how the LBO could fit a lot of peoples different needs.

twintips,

The burn times on my roll-up stoves are very similar to any similar volume stove. I would compare my 16" to about the same or a little more heat output than a Kifaru medium. My stoves and any with a damper will have longer burn time than a stove without a damper.

With any of the small backpackable stoves, they need to be stoked frequently to have good heat output. The lighter weight in the roll-ups comes from the thin titanium body .005 thickness.

The nest does fit nicely in the LBO, but there isn't much space to hangout in unless you are in the nest....I like that there is 60 sq ft for hanging out in bad weather and storing gear besides teh 30 sq ft for the nest.

Given the weight and the fact that the SL-5 is 100% protected from all directions, the layout of the footprint, high enough to stand up and get dressed in....all add up to the best floorless shelter I've seen so for my uses. That includes the BCS and Sawtooth, and Megatarp....Like I said just different needs for different folks. Not many people are running a two person nest with their bags coupled together nearly 100% of the time..if that wasn't the case there are certainly some other shelters that might fit my needs better.

No wrong shelter out there so long as it fits your needs best.

I didn't look after I replied, I butchered that.

Yup, all about needs. My preference is to always be able to stand up. Usually means a 6 man, especially when the snow or rain says stay put.

LBO is going to be my fast and light shelter for the overnight scouting trips this summer.

That's really thin. Do you have any pictures of the stoves packed up? Also what grade is your titanium?

Another option may be an MSR Twin Brothers. I've always wanted to check one out.

If you have something dialed like Lanche does by all means use it and stick with it. The LBO was not made to replace an SL tent as a point product, it's intent was more the ultimate in flexibility and it is much more flexible. Here are a few distinctions in comparison to Alaska Lanche's setup. This is by no means meant to be a sales pitch, just some important distinctions.

Our nest is different. It zips completely open, so if flying insects are not much of an issue, then you can leave it open and get the double wall protection but still have a very easy entrance and exit. Our nest also uses a DWR on 3 sides and can withstand light rain , mist and snow on it's own. We've slept on the coast of BC in nests alone in a light mist and were fine. In freezing weather they may condensate a little but it dissipates instead of dripping.

The LBO is a bit different than the SL series and part of this is due to the zipper orientation. The base can be pitched at it's main height , or lower like a tarp and will provide pretty good 3 sided protection. The Base and vestibule has similar square footage to a SL3 but IMO has a better sleeping orientation. When used with a nest that orientation is fine for couples or those that are fine being close. When sleeping the other orientation it allows both individuals to exit and enter without crawling over the other. I most often use this setup, but not pitched fully enclosed. I usually use it with a 7/8 coverage as if it had 3 panel but I only had two. I do this by just using a lower center height. This provides coverage from most directions and good summer ventilation and is large enough for two men and some gear. I've also used the vestibule more as an awning before due to space limitations when there was not the real estate to even pitch the LBO and vest.

The LBO with two bases, is much closer SL5 size, although for weight the SL wins by a a couple / three ounces and probably feels a tad bigger. The dual side zips though give the LBO easier exit / entrance and more possible ventilation as well.

The LBO with two bases and a center tarp, is probably more like a SL6 or large twin brothers I think it is. It allows a nest in each end or long ways sleeping as well. The side zips give everyone a entrance and exit when there are 4 people. Once again no fusing over someone. Since the sides can be pulled up and used as an awning it makes for a nice summertime gathering / cooking area, where the bases are primarily sleeping areas. When we used it at hunting camp in Oct , we just opened the side during the day and walked in went in freely grabbing gear, cooking, etc and then at night we zipped it and ran the stove.

You can also run variations of the tarp and vestibules together, which is a pretty nice two man setup with a stove. In this setup the stove jack is in the center of the tarp, and each person has an exit / entrance as well gear storage in the vestibules. The zippers are not fully covered in this orientation.

So , it does have some similarities to the SL, and the tipi's etc. It just has some big distinctions as well that at least in my opinion, make it a very livable shelter.
Kevin

Very well thought out bfeakdown Kevin...pretty much mirrors my thoughts as well. That LBO is a versatile little bugger. would love to use one for solo stuff for sure.