In context of including hot summers/clothing, farm/shotshell use, and being foolproof.
Shoot my bobbed alloy commander with more authority, and value the compactness of the sig 938, too, but there's no getting around the do-all of the little j-frame.
I'd take that over a frickin 10 lb UZI or MP-5 any ole day! Out of all the full auto guns I've got to play with, the Glock 18 was by far the most fun! And the fastest rate of fire, too.
I don't know that I like my Glock 22 more than anything else but it is what I'm most comfortable with, carry the most and what I train and teach with at our company. I could be happy with it for my one SD handgun.
Tough decision...sentimental favorite would be a J-frame because I carried one for so long, but if I could only have one, it would have to be something bigger. The rebuilt BHP below would work well, I guess. Bob
In context of including hot summers/clothing, farm/shotshell use, and being foolproof.
Shoot my bobbed alloy commander with more authority, and value the compactness of the sig 938, too, but there's no getting around the do-all of the little j-frame.
I have a J-frame 357 that I mostly shoot 38's in and a S 938. For me the 938 is pretty tough to beat in regard to concealment and shoots very well.
I've I'm in a majority white town that recently had a white thief killed while attacking a cop, I carry an T/C Contender in 22LR.
I've I'm in a majority black town that recently had a black thief killed while attacking a cop, I carry 2 Glock 17's and a few 33 round magazines as backup.
AS much as I am a very big fan of this ultra reliable, soft shooting, accurate big bore, it does not conceal nearly as easily as a G19, or single stack 1911.
I did executive protection years ago for the governor, and due to the size of the issued G21, and related printing of such under a suit coat, I opted to carry my Kimber 1911, as it definitely concealed easier in an IWB rig from Sparks.
Where the G21/G21SF really shines, though is not often mentioned, is as an outdoorsman's sidearm. Especially when running heavy for caliber, cast bullets. Essentially running +P to .45 Super loads. With a basic load, including one in the chamber, and a reload with a +4 extension, that is 31 rounds of hard hitting .45 caliber projectiles.
AS much as I am a very big fan of this ultra reliable, soft shooting, accurate big bore, it does not conceal nearly as easily as a G19, or single stack 1911.
I did executive protection years ago for the governor, and due to the size of the issued G21, and related printing of such under a suit coat, I opted to carry my Kimber 1911, as it definitely concealed easier in an IWB rig from Sparks.
Where the G21/G21SF really shines, though is not often mentioned, is as an outdoorsman's sidearm. Especially when running heavy for caliber, cast bullets. Essentially running +P to .45 Super loads. With a basic load, including one in the chamber, and a reload with a +4 extension, that is 31 rounds of hard hitting .45 caliber projectiles.
We were always pretty fond of the G21 as a duty gun for uniform wear
40 rounds of 230 grain Gold Dots are aweful comforting
As much as I like the 45 and the 40 the 9mm is much better recoil wise and much easier to shoot and make multiple hits in a short time frame. With today's ammo, I'm not sure the 45 has that much over the 9mm as a defense carry round against humans. The Glock was built and designed for the 9mm and I believe the Glock is most dependable when chambered for this round. The Glock 19 hides as easy as most compacts with the right holster. For a carry pistol and easy to conceal the Glock 19 rules the roost.
GG, I spent a day in a shoothouse observing some Brits shooting those in the SD version {silencer]. They liked to put 2-3 in the blowhole and I never saw a miss. They were that good w/ everything they shot.
The Uzi is pretty cool...if you are a jewish woman.
If I was in some theoretical universe where I could only have one pistol, I guess I would want whichever one I could theoretically get the most ammo for. And if they stuck me in a theoretical universe that only had glocks, I would shoot my way to the nearest f-ing wormhole asap.
GG, I spent a day in a shoothouse observing some Brits shooting those in the SD version {silencer]. They liked to put 2-3 in the blowhole and I never saw a miss. They were that good w/ everything they shot.
The Uzi is pretty cool...if you are a jewish woman.
The G19 is the choice of the Ubermensch.
mike r
The MP5SD is a very different weapon than the MP5k. SMG's are worthwhile weapons, machine pistols are worthless.
GG, some people have access to MP5ks w/ silencer. Some people can shoot them w/ mastery. Because this is outside of your experience does not alter the facts. The secret service used to run micro and mini Uzis in a very effective manner. It is the archer not the arrow.
GG, some people have access to MP5ks w/ silencer. Some people can shoot them w/ mastery. Because this is outside of your experience does not alter the facts. The secret service used to run micro and mini Uzis in a very effective manner. It is the archer not the arrow.
mike r
I have a LOT of experience with SMG's. The USSS had butt-stocks on their UZI's. An MP5K with an extended buttstock such as the one on the PDW can be effective. Even the crappy H&K retractable stock can turn a useless MP5K into an effective weapon. But without the buttstock, you're much better armed with a handgun. I've seen it time and time and time again. Put up 5 targets at nearly any range, one guy with a handgun and one guy with a stockless machine pistol, the guy with the handgun will put effective fire on all 5 targets in much shorter time.
Now when you extend the stock, everything changes. My comments were directed to the MP5K that was in MM's photo; worhtless. Take that same SMG and put the PDW stock on it, and it becomes an effective weapon.
Sorry, you are wrong. The Brits in question had a sling/harness system that allowed them to press out the MP5k against resistance and retract it to its original position. They normally fired in semi-auto mode but were very capable in FA also.
It is obvious that it would be easier to fire any weapon w/ a buttstock. What you are missing is that there are people w/ skills that exceed your limitations and experience.
If I was in some theoretical universe where I could only have one pistol, I guess I would want whichever one I could theoretically get the most ammo for. And if they stuck me in a theoretical universe that only had glocks, I would shoot my way to the nearest f-ing wormhole asap.
now rufus, you know you don't think that way, with the heat in arizona those steel guns get so hot you can't handle them, that's why glocks rule.
After handling, shooting and carrying a 30S a bit, I am inclined to agree.
My duty and personal handguns are all 45's, save one Ruger LCP and a couple of 22's. 'Serious use' falls to a grip-modded G30 or whatever 1911 I'm in love with for the moment.
If you put me on the spot, I'd keep the damned Glock.
He's sleeping. Jammed a Benadryl down his throat and took him to the vet. They shot him up with antibiotics and steroids. He should pull through ok.
He just ate a few minutes ago, just a bunch of swelling in his foot/leg.
I do not like a [bleep] snake. I kilt one yesterday with the Cub Cadet. This spring my daughter was out jogging in our back pasture and got struck by one. A small rattler. Didn't break the skin. Probably a Masaugua.
Years ago my wife's Poodle got bit. He just kept staggering around and drinking water and finally came out of it. She was a little kid and her mom didn't drive. Her dad was gone so there was not much to do out in the sticks.
I despise a damned snake. I think we kilt eleven one year, all Masaugua's, just baling one meadow. Controlled burning is hard on the [bleep]. I'm glad your dog is okay.
thought about this one for awhile. If for some obscure reason, I just HAD to pick one for SD, it would by my old series 70 Commander.
IMHO You win on style points If everyday was a Bar B Q my nickle series 70 would also be the one
I have fought being a Glockboy for years but the more you play with them the more you understand its quite a tool no question I am just in love with my 17L
I'm partial to my Glock 17. But, I've been mulling the idea of chopping the grip to G19 length.
Reason? Not much different length. The part that mainly prints on a Glock, assuming a good IWB holster, is the back of the slide anyway, and a switch to a 19 won't change that any. As for slide length, in an IWB it makes no difference. Might as well keep the slightly better handling characteristics of the 17, I say.
I've tried - twice - and can't really warm up to Glocks.
So if I was allowed only one, and it was mostly an urban-type environment, then I'd pick a 9mm that had the weight and capacity of a Glock, but works better:
But throw in critters and fewer people, a 1911 would probably be the choice, either in 10mm or .45.
If big critters were the issue, and people only a rare threat, then a large magnum revolver, like say a 44 mag S&W 629.
If I was in some theoretical universe where I could only have one pistol, I guess I would want whichever one I could theoretically get the most ammo for. And if they stuck me in a theoretical universe that only had glocks, I would shoot my way to the nearest f-ing wormhole asap.
now rufus, you know you don't think that way, with the heat in arizona those steel guns get so hot you can't handle them, that's why glocks rule.
I have a 43 and a 19's and a 17 and a 42...a sharp dressed man has to have a watch and a glock for every occasion. Working on a 26 to complete my collection.
I guess beauty too me is in the function and capability of the device in my hands, I don't warm up to nothing anyway.
Kahr CM9.. Because I Will carry it. Great everyday gun.
The tactical situation was not defined so that's my choice as well since it's what I carry as a concealed weapon. Any other handgun would be openly carried for sporting use and not so much for self defense.
When in the house the defensive weapon is not a pistol but a Remington 870 with buckshot - Federal Personal Defense loads to be specific.
Liking your choice and, above all, being able to shoot it well, are the qualities that make one's choice the best for them. Mine is the SIG 220 Combat. Built with internal coatings to resist corrosion, proven as reliable as anything out there, and even useful as a club, are why. But, above all, I shoot it under combat conditions better than any other I've shot. If I really need a lighter gun, or one that holds lots of ammo, then it would be the 5.7 FN. E
If the concealment thing isn't too important, I could also go with my old LAPD issue 92 Beretta. No malfunctions or other problems to date. And I shoot it quite well. Bob
You cannot be 'in love' with a Glock. That's like admitting you took a blow-up doll to Cancun on your honeymoon.
I resent this post!!!Don't believe anthing my WIFE ever says! Oh,BTW,I would opt for a G19 with proper ammo.Easy to work on and maintain,high cap with joy sticks available not to mention G17 mags.If its confined to an evidence locker for a while,no big deal they make 'em every day.
If the concealment thing isn't too important, I could also go with my old LAPD issue 92 Beretta. No malfunctions or other problems to date. And I shoot it quite well. Bob
Glock 20. Carried the one that sits on my bedside for 16 years as a Deputy Sheriff in Texas. If I could only have ONE Pistol for self defense it would be my Glock 20.
Well, since this is a fantasy thing I'll throw another one into the mix...this one is a Colt accurized .45, set up for service pistol competition. Work was done by Jim Hoag in LA. It's now on its 2nd barrel, fitted by the AMU (Army Marksmanship Unit). No malfunctions with somewhere over 10,000 rounds downrange. The caveat is that they were all ball, mostly Federal 230 grain stuff.
Even though it's a match gun, it's reliable. And there's precedent...Bill Allard, NYPD stakeout squad, shot most of his suspects with an accurized Colt like this one (Bill has been in more gunfights than any other cop in the history of the NYPD).
I don't know about being "the only one," but the Sig P938 here in the Scorpion model, is eminently concealable, and handy.
I'm no expert on pistols or tactics but when I think "self defense," I think last moment, last option, breath-smelling distance. Outside of very close quarter threat to life and limb, my nine out of ten preferred options are fleeing or extricating myself or loved ones in any way from the threat.
To me, this dictates always carrying which excludes the bigger guns. My P226 would certainly work but outside of winter it's hard to carry covertly and comfortably and is fairly heavy. This is why I picked the P938 which is very comfortable and concealable in a IWB carry. Also as a lefty, it has an ambidextrous safety and is accurate.
I would trade it for a Witness Protection Ithaca 12 gauge. Target shooting at paper that doesn't shoot back is all fun and games. If somebody is trying to kill me or rape my children and beat up my wife the adrenaline would be flowing and I want the first shot I fire to be #4 buckshot from a short barreled 12 gauge. Let the FBI carry the 9mm. I want a 12 gauge pump. whelennut
The Governor. Have to like being able to deliver 24 quick .41 caliber lead balls on target out of a single loaded cylinder. Short of an extended mag, that beats a service sized Glock on firepower at the ready.
It's ironic that after all the years of Taurus and other companies ripping Smith off, Smith took Taurus' concept, that they just couldn't execute properly, and ran with it.
It's ironic that after all the years of Taurus and other companies ripping Smith off, Smith took Taurus' concept, that they just couldn't execute properly, and ran with it.
To me, this dictates always carrying which excludes the bigger guns.
You hear this a lot, and it makes my head hurt every time.
It seems to me, you are carrying that gun on the off chance you need to shoot it, and in that case it better do the job.
So the first step shouldn't be to pick something you like to carry. You need to pick something that you shoot really well, because I'm assuming when the SHTF, you are going to need all the help you can get, and you need to pick something that provides some reasonable margin of error in the oomph department.
To me, this dictates always carrying which excludes the bigger guns.
You hear this a lot, and it makes my head hurt every time.
It seems to me, you are carrying that gun on the off chance you need to shoot it, and in that case it better do the job.
So the first step shouldn't be to pick something you like to carry. You need to pick something that you shoot really well, because I'm assuming when the SHTF, you are going to need all the help you can get, and you need to pick something that provides some reasonable margin of error in the oomph department.
Then you figure out how to carry it.
Bingo. Couldn't agree more. It always frazzles me when I hear that, too.
Rufus and TRH, I guess it depends on both what your definition of "defense" is and what then your overall philosophy of engaging another human being with a firearm is. I wonder how many gun toters have thought that last one through. Even if you've gotten to that point I'm sure you've noticed there's a lot compromise and then different choices made by individuals on what they want to compromise on. See here in this thread.
Anyway, had both Sig's, a S&W 357, and a 45 out today. It was a beautiful day to shoot.
Rufus and TRH, I guess it depends on both what your definition of "defense" is and what then your overall philosophy of engaging another human being with a firearm is. I wonder how many gun toters have thought that last one through. Even if you've gotten to that point I'm sure you've noticed there's a lot compromise and then different choices made by individuals on what they want to compromise on. See here in this thread.
Anyway, had both Sig's, a S&W 357, and a 45 out today. It was a beautiful day to shoot.
I agree one size does not fit all. But I think people can conceal a bit bigger piece than they might assume they can.
Bea175: I have carried (both professionally and personally!) Glock 22's with high capacity magazines, night sights and top quality defense rounds for more than two decades now. I have as yet to come across a situation I could not handle or felt "under-gunned" in! One does not "fall in love with" a self defense pistol! One must "trust" in a reliable, safe and quick to get into action pistol for defending ones self. And LOOKS have very little or NOTHING AT ALL to do with "self defense"! Sheesh - get real people. I trust and rely on my Glocks COMPLETELY. Well placed and quickly placed 40 S&W quality bullets WILL solve, self defense situations - this is easy to do with the Glock 22. Hold into the wind VarmintGuy