never owned one of the 260's but they seem to have become quite popular and am curious. I am debating between two rifles that caught my eye and practicality ( and a few boxes of ammo on hand )keeps telling me .270....doesnt really matter as i have the "calibers surrounded" as far as hunting goes...give me your two cents worth for fun !

I prefer the .270 over any of the short cartridges. It's cheaper to shoot and feeds like butter.

When two cartridges overlap that much I start looking at the platform.....

thats the problem !

Uh-oh..... same platform?

the 260 never quite caught the eye of the american public. we've had the 243 and 270 for many years, each a well-established cartridge used from coast to coast. some might say the 260 filled a void that didn't exist. combine that with the fact that the 260 can't be found in some geographic areas, and you have a round that is in the decline nation wide. the 260 isn't a bad cartridge, is just never received the acceptance one might have hoped for.

Having owned and used both, my 2 cents would be the 270. I love the 6.5 caliber but did not see the attraction over my 6.5-06 or 6.5x55 rifles Russ

same platform ? no, but similar concept! (but TMI will sidetrack this thread instantly !)

Well at that rate...... gotta say. 270 Win, cheap factory ammo everywhere, big enough for the big stuff and not too big for anything, long action so you have the option to rebarrel to whatever you like. Hell I like em so much I've got two of em....

I would go with the .260, just because it's not a .270!

Actually, I would love to get a .260 in a 'real' rifle, as I think the M7s are too short for this oversized bubba. Something like a 22" 700 SS SPS or a FWT M70.

I've definitely been thinking bout a 700 SA with a short, MR contour barrel.... and. 260 Rem keeps coming to mind.

.260 is better than the .270 'cuz you can get it in this..

I'd never grab a 260 if there was a 270 in the rack...

i suspect that would be the ultimate long range "yote" gun !!

Itd probably come to the same end for me Bob.... but the inner loony wants to drink the short action Kool-aid.....

And you thought your boat paddle was ugly.....

Yep!

Rancho,rancho,rancho.....(shaking head)..

And why not???? I'm cornfused (that's is more dramatic confused)

I came sooooo close.. And I haven't sold my .260 dies and brass yet!

Can fill my five WT doe tags in about 3 seconds..

The .270 will outperform the .260. The 6.5-284 would be more of a match for the .270. My buddy and I hunt pronghorns every year, he with a .270 Sendaro, me with a med. wt. custom 6.5-284. Not that much difference, although my 6.5-284 will shoot slightly tighter groups. Out hunting, a slight benchrest advantage isn't an advantage at all. Both rifles are sub MOA.

DF

Sheesh, is that all.

I like the .260 for the long range performance it brings to short actions, and for no reason of consequence, I prefer short actions. Extremely high BC bullets are available that can be pushed to a reasonable velocity. It hits hard, and recoil is very mild.

Having had a few .270s though, it's kinda hard to go wrong with one. Up to 500 yards or so, it's everything a .260 is and more, and factory ammo is never a problem.

If you have no preference over long or short action, and you have no ideas of shooting waayy out there, the .270 makes more sense. If you want to stretch the range a bit, then a 6.5-06 or .280 would be a better choice than a .270 simply because of the high B.C. bullets available for it.

John

You are learning Grasshoppuh....

jwp I like the 270 mo betta....

Rational thought does not enter the equation

Im just looking for a donor to put in a Ti for now..... til I figure out what I want. At that point id have a long and short action ready to rebarrel at my whim.... though I seriously doubt the LA never not vein a. 270........

yep, been thinking 'bout that, myself...

http://www.armalite.com/ItemForm.as...ory=8be021dd-3f84-4aca-bfa1-afcb5ddcc9ba

OK...I never said you were learning fast....

Can't argue with the stats poobah..... .270 is a game killing maux faux... reckon I've already drunk the Kool aid.... I've got a. 300 Salvage and a. 303 Limey....

The .300 Salvage and .303 Brit both have a cool factor the .270 doesn't.....

And I know the .260 guys will wince at this...but the 6.5 Creedmoor sings a siren's song.......

So dats what you did your new Mashburn on..

Dober

What about the 6.5 Swede??

The .300 Salvage admittedly has some cool points.... but just how in the hell is the. 303 Limey Kraut Whacker cooler than the all American. 270, born of Americas most famous cartridge? First chambered in the predecessor of the Riflemans Rifle? ( you've got me on my soap box now )

W.D.M. Bell never shot a .270....

Jack O'Connor did....

Talk about apples to oranges.....

O'Connor is no W.D.M. Bell

Shall we concede?

Concede..????


NEVER!!!!!

Okay..... I wasn't that up on the big name ivory hunters.... google-fu reveals that while JOC was the man.... he was no WDM Bell....

But.... if he could've got hold of a 130 Solid in the. 270.... it would've smoked the 7x57......

You are clearly delusional.....

Hell I Hafta like Bell... bastid was one of our kinsman... ya think he hunted in a kilt? Ever? :

Nope...

But when men like Alan Black say they worshipped his shadow....you get an inkling that he was the real deal....

I read a little on Google, that was enough for me to give up that particular debate...

Whats a 260?

You just gained my respect

Not sure...

I knew Bell was an Ivory hunter.... I didn't know he was also a soldier, aviator, painter, safari guide...... list kept going.... JOC's one of my outdoor heroes but he didn't have half the resume.....

Read " Bell of Africa" it is basically his memoirs....interesting schitt about a man not to be made sport of....

I loved reading O'Connor his writings are eloquent, but Bell was a one of a kind and a very astute individual

An excellent read IMHO

I guarantee I have to read it now.... half through Teddy Rosevelts " Hunting the Grisly" now....

Another good read is Brian Herne's "White Hunters" kind of a who's who with something interesting on every page...

when did you guys learn to read ???

Books on tape.....

now THAT was clever !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I haven't been able to stop since I read The Lost World at 5 or 6... just finished White Fang and Th Call of the Wild for the 2nd time....

Sounds like me...I was the only five year old with a subscription to National Geographic...

A man has to read Lonesome Dove too!

i stopped after "green eggs and ham"............

You were just hoping for one of the native woman boon shots...... dirtbag.... I haven't read Lonesome Dove.... Teddy Roosevelt and Sun Tai are on the table currently.

and as a handloader, My 270s get dusty and the 260s see field use...not knocking the 270, but it is usually more cartridge than I really need...

to my way of thinking, in most hunting situation that shots are going to be under 250 yds... I think even a 270/08 would be more practical than a 270 Win...however since it isn't a factory round that is a mute point...

and when someone's reason boils down to available ammo... I have to laugh...I don't see why any serious shooter isn't handloading... if my shooting time and desires, plus my wallet had to be slave to whatever the stores and the factory decided to put on the shelf, I'd just take up golf....

so we have all these choices available...
but I'll reach for a 260 anytime if the animal is smaller than an elk.. and even the bullets that are available in 6.5 bore... they easily handle Elk also...

but in my world anymore the only thing I need from the factory is an action...and components from those factories that make the brass, primers powder and bullets...

Boob not boon. Damn droid...

.260........or .270. Both will do about the same thing.

If you like to handload and tinker then take a closer look at the .260 and 130gr Swift Scirocco. With a .571 BC at 2950fps it will do some really nice things. If you're a factory ammo guy, then go with the .270. You can find ammo just about anywhere, including loose rounds rolling around the jockey boxes of damn near every ranch pickup out west.

dang it, i've contributed to sidetracking my owm post even though seafire has made an attempt to bring it back !! (likely in vain!)

Pat, you are talking practical common sense about a choice between two calibers....I think that ship has sailed on this thread....

Derail accomplished.....

Laffin!.......It's all good!

hehe

We know why you had that subscription, same reason the rest of us kids did. To see the boobies.

Oooohhhh 60 year old African boobies......

podunkkennels,

A few more for your list,

"Centennial", by James A. Michener

"Grizzly Years", by Doug Peacock

"Desert Solitaire", by Ed Abbey

and you only get cool points if that 300 Savage is in a Model 99

Well, when you're 9 you take what you can get. Pretty much the same as now.

"Grizzly Years", by Doug Peacock
Sounds like a good one, who wrote the story about two cowboys that ran into a grizzly den with several grizzlies?

Im out of O'Connor for now.... soon as I finish Teddy R im probly goin Mark Twain......

Okay, bro podunk, since I see that's how you roll, how about James Fenimore Cooper? You ever read him? I read all of the Leatherstocking Tales and loved them.

A superior cartridge to a .270...................

LOL

Haven't since high school but he's on the list..... for some reason I've been bit with the classics.

Mister Tom, that kinda remains to be seen. If reports are true and the 260 is on the decline and fades to oblivion, then history will refute you. I'm not saying it's not a good cartridge, mind you, cuz I think it is, and I would sorely hate to see it disappear, but the 270 is legendary, and the 260 is still a young sprout that has yet to stand the test of time. It's just a dang shame it's so hard to find a 260 in a lefty.

http://www.amazon.com/Horse-Buggy-West-Boyhood-Frontier/dp/B000IXF0PO

Best book Jack ever wrote...

LOL good fix

I went to the local Barnes and Noble the other day to get some JOC books but them suckers didn't have Jack.

One id really like to read scenar....

Everybody knows the 270 is just the ladies' version of the real mac daddy, the .30-06!

(I'm suitin' up in the Nomex!!!)

Ebay and Amazon are your friend. They do have a copy of the Call of the Wild and White Fang for $5 though...

http://www.jbmballistics.com/

.264 130gr Scirocco@ 2950fps vs. .277 140gr AccuBond@ 3000fps.

A guy might be suprised at these comparisons....

The 260 is a good round and has good ballistics. The 270 could benefit from some of the match type hunting bullets getting thrown its way.

In all fairness, Berger makes .277 VLD's in 140gr and 150gr.

I guess what impresses me the most with the short cartridges is what you get ballistically with 40 to 45 grs of powder.

BTW, I own and have hunted with various .270's since I was young and have no intensions of ever getting rid of them. It's a fine cartridge and will probably be around longer than any of us...

For me, the 260 was associated with Jim Carmichael...never could warm up to his writing, plus he dressed like a drugstore cowboy.

Boooyah!!

Hah!! see Scenars post.

It'll always be sucking hind tit to a 270 Tom.

Really????

Did you check Scenars #'s

I did.

You'd be suprised.

Just for an example...

At 500 yds =
The 6.5 drops 43.74 inches with 1427 lbs energy.
the .270 drops 43.8 inches with 1457 lbs energy.

Equal.........with less powder.

Not really sucking hind tit now is it?

The .260 vs the .270

Heck the 7-08 beats the .260 get one of those

+1. The .270WCF beats the .260 in any head to head comparison you can think of. It even beats the 7x57... but that is not germane to this debate.

Numbers are numbers and results are well, results. The large male coyote on the right was shot at 880 meters(961 yards) while laying on top of the dark hill in the upper right hand corner of the picture. The pair came in together and I took the female in close at about 100 meters. The male never stopped until he got on top of the ridge, where he layed down. I had a friend along as we were hunting antelope and got side tracked when heard these coyotes howling. I was shooting 139gr scenars at 2850fps in my GAP .260.



I'm kinda fond of that rifle...

Its pretty close, no I didn't check them I already knew. I looked the numbers up a long time ago (when I wanted one). I just can't do the 308 based stuff. Now a 257R is right up my alley.

Nice shootin scenar! The 260 is the only 308 based cartridge I could like. Makes no sense I know, I just like the 06 based cartridges.

I agree, it's all about what works best for you and your hunting situations. Confidence in your rifle is the biggest part of making it work for you. Doesn't matter if it's a .243 or a .338 the one you feel the best with is the one you should grab on the way out the door...

Pat-love the pic of the yotes in the stubble, good stuff! I showed it to my G-son and he was like...can we go Today!!

2950 for the .260 I'd guess would be from a tube a bit longer is it not? I'd think something in the 2800-2850 range would be about it for a 22-23"? (side note, I have a Ti take off handle and a 260 mtn tube sitting waiting to get into the game..grin). Longball(g-son) likes to fondle the stock and keeps telling me it's just too nice to be around our place. And mentioned something about teaching some yotes a lesson..

Dober

(good to see ya the other day)

Mark, I'm getting 2925fps with my Lightweight .260 in a 24" Rock 1-9". I could push it to 2975-3000, but I dont see why. That load shoots .5"@100 meters with nice round primers and easy bolt lift, even in the heat...

Thx Pat

Dober

The grandyoung'n will love the .260!

Next time we'll try to have more time to hang out and solve all of the problems in the world.....grin!

Hope my new Surgeon will shoot like that ! WTG Pat...

Scott, I'll bet it will!....I've got a bit of load data.....grin!

Yotes aint a gonna like that one either..

Dober

that is what I am counting on !

Scott-any chance you know Bud Morrow from Sheridan?

Dober

yes sir ! good smith

set up a couple rifles for me back in the day. got a 220 swift that he did.

I may be a fool to disagree with Pat, but I found that anything over 2700 with 140 grainers was difficult with my two 260s that I had.

If one compares equal pressure loads (BTW--the 270 can be jacked up just as much as the tactical guys run the 260 if one wants), the 270 comes out on top.

And if one cannot get the 130 SII to run well, then where do the high BCs go? Kind of a one or two trick pony. I drank the 260 cool aid in 1997 when it came out. Have one left as a "collectible" of sorts, but have moved on. The 243 kills as well for me and flies as flat as the 260 at ranges I can measure (under 500) with less recoil. The 270 and 30-06 whack stuff more noticeably if that is what I want to look at.

he did my first 7 Mashburn Super, Hagel turned me onto him but haven't spoken with Bud in a long time

Thx
Dober

haven't seen him since he stopped working at Shipton's Big R in the gun department. He is missed there.

might have to drop him a line.

I get 2,900 from my 22" mtn tube Mark. I expect to push that number a bit as it's an Ackerly now.

620 yard kill with a 260 Rem, 130 Swift S2's. (DRT)


550 yard kill with the same bullet

Thx Su-I'd think...and for me it's a guess but I'd think that in a 22" tube with a bullet that long that 2900 is gonna be leaning on it just a bit (not that that scares me none) and case life a bit challenged. But, I know lil about most anything and even less about a .260!

For me, be it going @ 2847 or 2901 it don't really matter. I want accuracy, speed and will have either dotz or a M1 to sort it out once I go long.

Now I just gotta get the lil bugger set up.

Thx
Dober

(love that bottom buck!)

45.2 grains of H4350 ain't leaning to much.

This is a smokin' buck and should be imbedded in the brains of every person who loves big mule deer.....no doubt there are bigger one's but this buck kas everything a guy should be looking for...

Everytime I see this pic,my nostrils flare and I tear phone books in two....I also bay at the moon and wanna kill something

On the subject at hand,when it comes to the 270 Winchester, I read no ballistic tables, will not listen to logic,and refuse to be swayed by rational argument.......

I block my ears to balistic gack and computer printouts....I cannot help myself....

Because it is magic....

I've shot a bunch of deer with the 270 at various ranges and a bunch more and some coyotes with a 6.5x55 (ballistic twin of the 260). With bullets of roughly the same SD I found the 270 ~ 150-200 fps faster. I never could notice a difference on game in the field except the 6.5 is a just a little gentler and, really, a pleasure to hunt with.

I guess I'd sum up with the previous writer who said if factory is your gig go 270; if hand loading, I'd consider favorable nuances of the particular rifle. If no difference, you can't go wrong with either.

Glad I could help.

If you want performance like a 270 in a short action, why not go with a cartridge with case capacity closer to the 270, something like the 6.5-284, 284, 270 WSM, 7mm SAUM, or 7mm WSM?

JEff

LOL! My kind of hunter Bob, my kind of hunter.

In regards to the pic of the top buck, there was a bigger one closer.

Here's another one for you Bob.....260 and one 139gr scenar from 340 meters. Killed by a pal last fall.

OK, OK....a .270 would have killed it just as dead....grin!

Sure, with 15 grains more powder and recoil.


Nice buck Pat!

God, I've gotta get out west...

Oh man,Pat what a buck!....Another Smoker!.........and you and SU are waking me from summer doldrums.....glad I decided today to get my worthless ass to Wyoming this year..

But I am taking the Mashburn this year...... LOL!

Gawd I love this shidt!

Gorgeous buck!

Dober

And, and don't forget this important piece of "BG" the .270 would of killed it about .007 seconds quicker..

Dober

Id chit and turn purple if I saw a buck like that.... I've never seen a Whitetail that'd go much over 100 inches...

Or probably over 100 lbs for that matter either...grin

sorry, I know that was a Bertuzzi

Dober

Yeah Pat..haven't had a chance to tell you this lately but...


YOU SUCK!!!!

Dober you're not lying.... I've whacked and seen a few pushing 150, Pop shot a big 8 that weighed 175 one year. That's a monster down here....

podunk it is not ever to be forgotten...my first big mule deer I shook for an hour afterward.

I've no doubt Bob... im always cool til after the shot, then im prone to getting excited... If work holds out it wont be long before I finally make it. Can't be impatient though, hell im only 22....

Don't make me dig out old pic of what a 7x57 can do.....





Oh, OK...if you insist...this one is for Podunk...

................As long as you do your part on whatever game you`re going to hunt with either, it won`t make all that much of a difference.

Rifle platform, rifle platform and the rifle platform of your preference should be your priority. Short action? Long action? Bolt throw length? Rifle weight? Type of hunting? A hiking rifle? A stand rifle? Both?

Plus all the rest of it.

Some within the longer action crowd, give the 308 based cartridges a very un-deserved bad rap.

RIGHT SWAMPY?

Ah, the 7mm Rigby is a delightful cartridge IMHO

Ingwe another great buck!...I have used the 7x57, too,and seen it work in one instance at a distance that was,well,....LONG!


Plus it'll kill elephants

Damnfine bucks..... even if they were shot with sissy rifles...

Bob, it does get the juices going doesn't it though it's hard when it's 95 out. Going to western CO myself and will be looking for one like scenarshooter has there (very, very nice scenarshooter). No 260 or 270, or 7 Mash though-- 284!

sissied this'un plumb to death......





the 260. It works on bigger deers, too....

I would choose the .270. However, get the one you want more and worry about practicality later. Incidentally, check out Hornady 150 SST & Interbond if you want a high BC .270 game bullet. Not VLD target bullet, but at .525 are pretty respectible.

Lou

George we know that works too!

Problem is there are many good one's.

The. 260 7x57 and the. 270 all kill chit equally dead....

I think Don faked this photo....

just sayin'........

From my limited .260 experience, I think you hit the nail on the head. With 140gr Bullets about 2750 - 2800 has been reasonable in my Low Wall with a 24" barrel. 130s are good for about 2850 or so. I know many of the tactical guys get 2850 with 140s, but that's right on the edge of reasonable.

If the manufacturers put out 9" twist .270s and the bullet manufacturers put out .277 bullets with .6 BCs, the .270 would win hands down. As it is the .270 still wins out to 500 yards or so, where the high BC 6.5s finally catch up and take over.

As for me, I just like short actions, but still went with a Wyatt's box on my current .260 build to allow for the VLDs. If I weren't going with the VLDs, a 2.8" box would probably have been fine,

John

Maybe somebody can post this pic for you b/c I am in Norway.. as I think if the 260 were in THIS rack, you might think twice

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.shopacoholic.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/biggest-bra-size.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.shopacoholic.com/biggest-bra-size&usg=__eZikGpOiMiko-OFxACrclOHm1jg=&h=352&w=500&sz=28&hl=en&start=109&zoom=1&tbnid=w2lGy0YIrWJvyM:&tbnh=127&tbnw=163&ei=N90jTvqJGMXfsga0i5WmAg&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dbig%2Bbreast%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1441%26bih%3D607%26tbm%3Disch&um=1&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=316&page=5&ndsp=27&ved=1t:429,r:2,s:109&tx=57&ty=38

Now if you guys want to just kill chit dead, grab either one in a rifle you like and learn how to steer it. All this talk is just mental masturbation! If you choose to continue, you will all arrive at the same destination....satisfaction if you do your part. LOL.

Nothing a 270 will do w-say a 140 AB, that a 260-130AB or 7/08-140 AB wont do if you do your job.

SwampTroll, its clear you are impotent and have nothing to contribute. Tell Remington your assignment is done and the public does not buy your crap. You obviously never cycled a 260 thru a Sako....more buttery smooth than your 700.

Face it guys, its like ice cream, they all get the job done, just in different flavors.

DD - wisdom has come full circle w-todays bullets in 243s and I wont argue with your point, they do work and very well

ElkIvory, my advice:

Get the 270 b/c its calling your name and when you are not feeling up to rolling great 260 ammo, you can just grab it and some off the shelf ammo. Now in the meantime, also build a quality 260 and after getting to know it, see which rifle you grab most often

As I said, they really overlap, all you have to do is run numbers on the above 3 combos and you will find they run w/in an inch of each other IIRC to 400 yds and not much diff out to any sane distance.

Enjoy your rifles after ending the madness. As to the budget, you can always sell the one you use the least.

No real interest in a Sako or a .260. I'd as soon have a matte finished 700 ADL from Walmart in .270 or .30-06.

I'm beginning to think I want to hang out with Scenarshooter and SendaroMan...

you boys have some good tastes and also some class and skills to go with that...

My 260s look like factory crap compared to those toys...

Far from a reloading expert here. From my very limited experience with both the .260rem and the .270win I'd say they are alot closer than I thought..

Sure the velocity edge goes to the .270 but.

I run 6.5 140 Partitions @ 2800 BC = .490 in my 22" mtn rifle
6.5 130gr Accubonds @ 2900 BC = .509 in same rifle

Currently running .277 150gr Partitions @ 2850 BC = .465
.277 140gr Accubonds @ 2950 BC = .496
.277 140gr VLD's @ 2950 BC = .509

I could no doubt bump up the .270 velocity but all the loads(.260 and .270) are scary accurate and I'm good to 500yds on Deer and Elk with either.

Only real difference for me is the difference in rifles. Being a CRF guy I tend to grab the .270 in my Mod 70 Extreme Weather.

The way I load these two they are nearly Identical.. .260 having less recoil.

An EW in a .260 and the 270 would prolly get sold.

Well said Shag

Dober

thanks Seafire !

It may be sacrilege to say this here, but all of this can go by the name of a long ago movie, "Much Ado about Nothing." The dividing by degrees between a 260 and a 270 and a host of other similar cartridges is what loonies (loonys ?) dither over, but, practically, in the field a good hunter could go forth not even knowing what his rifle is chambered for (in regard to these two) and not be hampered.

Does this get me kicked off the 'campfire.

edited because of ADD

..............Walmart seems to be your favorite retail place Swampy.

I`m sure that by now, you advised them to stock nothing but Remingtons chambered only in 270s and 30-06s?? Yep! Those are the only two rounds that ANYONE could certainly need. Anything else, is just down right unneeded and is blasphemus in the world of Swampy.

Afterall, Walmart should make `ol Swampy feel right at home ..........:D

You're pretty much spot on George, lots of micro mgt of what I call BG (ballistic gack).

Dober

bigsqueeze almost hurt my feelings, then I realized he was talking to Swampy. Of course swampy thinks a 35 Whelen is useless, he has apparently never launched a 225 gr TSX out of one at 2700 fps either!

............. ....Almost gotcha there ay?

Its all good BG, I like all this gun talk. Kinda like sittin around the campfire.

I've launched a 270 grainer out of my .375H&H at 2700.

There is an inverse relationship between field experience and believing that numbers predict outcomes

Really???

Ahhh geez, you're back? been awhile.

Good day sir. Apologies were made all-around from Tom264 and I might be on amicable terms

This place is going farther into the toilet with you being back..

Did you get bounced from the state hospital?

Kill anything yet?

.....That`s all? .......You need to stuff some more powder in that H&H case there Swamp along with swabbin some Slick 50 or maybe some KY jelly down that barrel of yours..

I NEVER apologized to you you turd.

Why change what you wrote? I already told you that I accept your apologies for all of the difficulties you had.

Nah, it was already as far as it could go.

Ah, come on guys. We were having so much fun. Heck, I wanted to see who believed the .260 has those mystical properties we all dream of..... E

GTHYDMFer.........

I got most of that.... is "D" for dumb???

Yes.

You left out the S.

You know, all those cussins pop gave me when I was a teenager really paid off....

Your right... Oooops.

S? Now where's that go?

In front of the D

Or after it if you prefer.

Oooooohhhh.....

I prefer the 6.8, the fun 270. May have a go at a 6.5BR though. The BR comes within 100 fps of the 260, same bullet, and fits in an AR15 platform.

Thinking about picking up a 270 Winny, or mebbeso even a 270 WSM, when I get a chance.

.270 vs .260 ?

Ewww

YRJDLSK! BEADWP!
.



.




.



.


Tom264, try to figure that one out





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.




.




.P.S. I made it up; lighten up my old friend!

260 Rem. 5 shots 47 of H4831sc

139 Scenars

test loads in the Surgeon I just got.

That might work...

Dober

Did you have a chance to chrono that load?

John

nope... gonna load 15 more with 47 grains.

play with seating depth and see if it will tighten up a bit

5 at 2.810 same as above load
5 at 2.800
5 at 2.820

How far off the lands?

John

15 thou right now at 2.810

Antelope, and you need a 270.........LOL.......................

Thanks!

John

Long action = 270
Short action = 260

And to think, I've been spending MORE time getting laid, and LESS time on the campfire

The fire merely fills the gaps between "layings".....

Or even "during".....

JK,ing

Antelope and you need anything other than a 270?.........LOL!

Im no multi tasker .......

If you do it a certain way, you can both watch the monitor...

God no then shed fall asleep twice as fast.....

All this discussion about a .260 being as good as a .270 makes me think a 6.5-06 really IS better than a .270.

It is.....................

Yawn.....

Now Robert.......................

I think I need a new sig line.

Hows this sound?

"No matter how hard you try, you can never make a .270 equal to a 6.5"

Tom, far as I am concerned the 1st Amendment to the Constitution is still the law of the land....post away!

Oh dang! wasnt the response I was expecting.

Oh well.

.260 rem... the poor little. 270 that didn't eat its vegetables...

DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

so, lemme get this straight. The 260 is better than the 270 because it is 200 fps slower and the diameter is .013 smaller and there are less bullets to pick from and factory ammo is not all that common, plus, there are not a lot of rifles chambered in the caliber. hmmmmmmm

I would go with a 270 vs a 260.

And I hate the 270

And here you seemed a sensible young man......

This is the same rhetoric at the core of the .270 vs .280 debate.
Personally I'd choose the 6.5/280 RCBS, and start looking longer.

Does OAL of the .260 w/140's in a 2.8" magazine work out ?

How far past the shoulder do these long toms protrude, or is it like the situation with the 6.5/284 which seems to work better in the long action.

In his later days when the .280 had been released,
even JOC acknowledged that the .280 was a superior design

Yeah, so the rumor mill spins but he never said so in print....and I have searched around but could never find any evidence that he actually killed anything with one....

IIRC the 280 came out in 1956.... JOC died in 1976;if he considered it superior, he had plenty of time to use it hunting,but it appears he never did.

If you believe his writings, he considered the 270 and 280 the same/same.

Along with the 7 mm Rem Mag..

As far as its effects on game that is.

Podunk yes he felt there was little difference.....JOC was not one for picking fly shidt out of pepper..

He soured on the 7mm Magnums in his later years...but early on thought highly of them.See his commments on the 7mm Weatherby in "The Big Game Rifle"...and his articles on the new 7mmRem Mag when it was introduced in 1962.He seems to have liked it.

I think the 7RM would've been his pet had it come out before the. 270 Win... it was a matter of ' this is nice, but I already have this and it does the same friggin thing..'

Who cares what JOC liked.

He picked up 1925 round and after 20 years of latent use made it popular because of print and an ability to write. Bygone era bygone round.

Better be glad you put the grin in..... thems fightin words.....

Yeah, I know!

I own both and IMO the 260 is not even in the same league as the 270 winchester. I know the 270 is boring to some but it's about the perfect deer cartridge. Anyway, thats how I feel about it.

My point exactly !
Hypothetically, what if JOC had championed the .25-06 ?

Comparing the Short action .260 to a Long action .270 would require similar bullet SD's and bbl lengths.

Those aspects that make the .270 more attractive than the .30-'06 are also present when comparing the .260 to the venerable .270

I'm seriously considering a 22" .260 for my son

Think BC,not SD.

Hint...........

OK - Same BC's ...

Nosler BT's 6.5 120gr vice .277 140gr ;
( BC's are virtually identical at .458 /.456 )

What are safe velocities of these 2 loads for comparison ?

Or, NP 6.5 125 Gr (BC = .449 ) or 6.5 140 Gr (BC = .490 )
vice .277 150Gr (BC = .456 ) or .277 160Gr (BC = .434 )

What's the retained energy & wind drift @ 300, 400 or even 500 Yards ?

Well if that ain't bait....

JOC was a long time ago...I posted that stuff to keep historical perspectives correct;because we can't know where we are unless we know how we got here.

Today hard core rifle cranks seem to prefer 6.5's and 7mm's, because there are a few specialty bullets that trump 270 slugs in BC and for target applications and some long range hunting.And it's true that with the highest BC bullets the 260 seems to catch up to almost match the 270,maybe even beat it, but those differences seem to show up beyond 600 yards(far beyond where most BG is actually killed).With most hunting bullets the differences in BC are too close to call and the 270 with it's added velocity simply trumps.Compare, for example 130 gr 6.5 AB's and 270 140 AB's.

That's assuming you can get the velocities from the little case claimed for it,and this mostly seems to involve at least 24" of barrel...so yeah you can play with numbers and make a case that the 260 is almost it's equal...

In my view and FWIW,if you want to really beat a 270,hands down,and thoroughly,(and especially with standard hunting bullets)you better be shooting a 264WM or a 7mm mag of some sort......a case with more capacity(not less).

I had dinner with John Burns in Casper last year,and commented that it was interesting how guys like Les Bowman and Warren Page figured out years ago how good a Big 7 was as an open country BG cartridge......I no sooner had the words out of my mouth when John came back with....."So did Jack O'Connor.....anyone who thinks the 270 isn't a great open country elk cartridge is nuts...!"(or words to that effect).

I'm sure John will recall the conversation.....because his comment sort of caught me off guard he being a real LR specialist and among that crowd the 270 has been relegated to the dust bin with 4X scopes....

I don't have the data to back it up at my disposal....but I have a funny feeling that, in a show of hands of BG hunters, world wide,the 270 Winchester will have left the nouveau short action 6.5's (and most other 6.5's for that matter)face down in the ditch.....

So,it might be from another era,but it's astonishing how it has taken 86 years of technological development just to equal it,and the use of substantially larger cases to soundly beat it,along with added recoil and shorter barrel life.

What I find interesting is that the first objective of anyone using one of these new 6.5's or 7mm's seems to be is to equal (or beat)the 270 Winchester...if the cartridge is relegated to the scrap heap, I wonder why they concern themselves?

If I were looking to replace it in a 22" barreled light sporter and standard action (I'm not)the only two cartridges that would get a second look would be a 6.5/284 or a 280 Remington,not some short action cartridge of lesser velocity.....(I'm not that mad at standard length actions yet .....even then I seriously doubt I could tell the differences.

So we can knock it and say it's out dated,but at the end of the day, it will kill more BG animals,here and worldwide,this coming season than the entire conglomeration of 6.5mm cartridges piled together;and likely as many or more than it's magnum jugged competitors,.....even though it's users are drooling myopically in their oatmeal, using their last ounces of dwindling energy knocking off everything from groundhogs to Alaskan Yukon moose and African eland.

(My Wyoming rancher pal has used it on about 50 elk....like most ranchers, Bill is an eminently practical guy;if something does not work well, he won't use it,and I doubt he ever read a single word O'Connor ever wrote.)

Not only because of it's popularity (which continues even though it's chief proponent has been gone 35 years),but because it "works",and represents about as much power,killing effectivness, and "hittability" as 90% of the riflemen out there can manage and "prove" under field conditions, with a rifle in their hands.

This is something everyone has to figure out for themselves....

I own a 270 and the 270 wil git-r-done

If you are no brighter than that,in boolit selection...it is true,that it don't matter what cartridge YOU shoot.

Textbook example of how to miss the mark and by a mile.............

To argue the merits of a cartridge that hit the market in 1997 versus one which came out in 1925 is telling. For the .270 to hold its own for 86 years against all comers is a testament to its overall ballistic integrity, game anchoring ability and user friendliness. You can't ask for much more than that! Now pass the H4831SC.

Could you be a little more specific with your constructive criticism?

How so?

This made me smile.......


And if J-Doubl-Ya-P says it's good, I'm all in....

Like I said, it's my opinion based on using both (I have owned 3-.260's). The 200 FPS more with the 270 130 gr. bullet is substantial. I like the 260 Remington I have just seen the 270 do so much. Now I have 3- .270 winchester CZ 550 American, Remington 700 Sendero with a 26 inch barrel, and a Marlin XL-7 which accuracy is amazing for an inexpensive rifle. My opinion and 5 bucks might get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks. I just know what works for me.

Either will do the job required.
I wouldnt like to be at the receiving end of anything fired out of a 260 or 270.

Its just down to what float's your boat!!!

Gus

Thx, I'm just lookin for a VALID comparison. I Don't load for either cartridge. I do load & shoot a couple of .280's, and they aren't that much better than the .270 that I can't make the comparison.

Maybe an OGW comparison analysis would help.

If the Nosler's are too pedestrian for the CheeseStick TextBook,
I apologize with all due sincerity.

338,

Take a look at the Scenars and Amax's in either caliber. For the two chambering to have any real difference you need to look long range. Past 6-700 is where the 6.5 start to look good. For 400 or so yards in it just don't matter, use a rusty 3006 and corelokts. If you're going long the bullets really start to matter.

Mike

Rogue, Thanks -- Are these hunting or LR Target bullets ?

I'm interested in the .260 as an alternative to a .243 for a younger hunter/shooter.

The .270 is an impressive benchmark for deer & sheep hunting out to 4 or 5 hundred yards.

I'm looking for something in a more compact action hence my interest in the .260 as a hunting vice LR target round.

They're target bullets that'll do just fine for hunting. I've killed a lot of shiet with Noslers of a bunch of different flavors but have moved loads over to the Amax when the options there. Lot's of elk get crunched every year with "target bullets". If the target bullets make you nervous look at the Scirroco II, even the heavy Accubombs could be worse.

I really dig my 260, nothing wrong with a 243 two of my kids use them - look at the 105 Amax.

Some one mentioned a 280, I dig my 7 mils. 162 Amax is bad ass. .625 BC is real. That makes a 708 not a bad choice at all.

The 7 Shamwow on the left is loaded with a .625 bc 162 Amax at 2.80 col.

The 300 Shamwow on the right is loaded with a .509 bc 180 Ballistic Tip at 2.80 col. The 208 Amax when you can find them would be a sweet ride, I think it's bc is .640 or there abouts.

Just shows not all bullets are the same. 3-400 yards in I don't think it really matters much for most.



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For either 6.5 or 270, it's not that hard to find bullets long enough and pointy enough with super high BC's to require quick twist barrels. The trend in long range target shooting in fact appears to be 270's with 8 twist barrels.

Something to keep in mind, it is easy for any manufacturer to make higher BC bullets. But they know that longer bullets become much fussier regarding seating depths and accuracy. In target bullets the Sierra Matchking is an easy example, people look down on them because Bergers/Lapuas/etc have higher BC's. But the Matchkings are much less fussy with seating depths and finding accurate loads.

For hunting purposes, it's not worth worrying about the difference.

Rick, The 8 twist 270's with the 180 grainers may very well be the future.

Right now it's hard (not impossible) to top the 6, 6.5 and 7 mil for nice long range bullets.

Rogue would a 270 bullet have to be that heavy(180)to be comparable to a (say)140 gr 6.5?

I just ordered a 9 twist 270 barrel....will see how that goes.

Guys guys....most of you sound like a bunch of women ....comparing their lovers packages.....they will nearly ALWAYS choose the Longer Thicker one....yes both so similar in performance and really too close to call........and get the same job done.

Had JOC had the 260 in 1925.........till now their is not anything a properly loaded and spun 125-140gr 6.5 slug thrown from one could not do on big game, that a 277 would change the outcome IMHO.

And yes, had that been the case and the reverse happened....the 270 coming out today...in 1997 would have done FAR better than the 260 has across the board as the masses like the 'Bigger is Better' philosophy. A connection perhaps tied to their manhood that is engrained into their DNA. Gack will never change that power of that mindset..its here to stay

YET....Bigwhoop......what you forget to recognize....the 260 HAS been around......FAR more than 1997....in fact, the 1896 Mausers were around over a century before, in the '260 package' that was designed in 1891..... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.5x55

Now lets anyone argue that their is a reason the 120 year old 6.5x55 has survived this long, racked up TONS of Swedish Moose kills and other game around the world, as all 6.5s at this performance threshold. AND just what round won this 1K shoot....not a 277.......a lowly 264....at 6.5-08 speeds...

1999 British Long-Range Benchrest Championship was won by a Tikka Continental in 6.5x55. Group size was an almost unbelievable 10 rounds into 4.4 inches at 1,000 yards. Anyone looking for an accurate out-of-the-box varmint rifle would do well to consider a Tikka.

Above: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_2_49/ai_95680073/pg_2/?tag=mantle_skin;content

Seriously...either will satisfy when properly used as most in the know might admit if cornered.

I am with Gus K on this one.....but won't argue with BobinNH....nor Scenar Well....might 'rib' Bob on occasion...but in the end both men anchor game....and that is a fact...beyond 'Gack!'

Su35, Patrick James, etc...all are right. Hell...I think BigStick would even 'Get R Done' if he had too with either...and a few minutes of range time....lest he chooses a 7/08 or WSM as a staple.

Now that this is settled.......what to do as today's forecast is 109F before the heat index

Now if Big Green wants a new 'baby' perhaps they should re-shoulder and do a 270AI properly spun and stuff new high tech high BC/SD controlled mushroom 'Corelokts' and name their baby the '277 NBM Express'....Non-Belted Magnum Express. Unless of course Winchester does not first make their '270 WLR'....Winchester Long Range. LOL.

Optimum bullet choice would no doubt kick the 277 up a notch w/o magnum recoil producing powder charges...though at more recoil than a std. 130-150. Not optimum BC but the old 160 NPT in a 270 WCF has done things consistent with the 7 RM and 175s...though at lesser distances due to its nose.

No doubt...if/when a fast twist 270 hits the scene...w/proper ammo/bullets....then a new debate merges....and this time it will be...270 vs. 6.5-06/264 WM

If you haven't already, check out this website. Matrix Bullets are making some waves in F Class competition. The owner is a great guy too.
http://www.matrixballistics.com/

You might be surprised in which competitions his 270 bullets make an appearance this year.

Some VERY interesting BCs, esp. for the LR guys.

I believe Sierra did make a 155 MKHP long ago, but they never found alot of favor and ultimately may have been dropped.

Wonder if there may be parallels for the 6.5/155 combo vs. a 270/180. No doubt a QT is needed to spin a long bearing surfaced 277 slug, and that will induce more drag - in bore, and affect pressure curve.

Speeds possible in a WCF? Guessing 2600-2650 in typical 24" bbl.

I've used the 135 SMK a fair bit and to 600 it did very well for me. Long as I had dotz or turrets I can go a long ways with the .270.

Dober

Dober, I have a bunch of 135SMK's loaded up for steel practice. They shoot great and match up perfect with the 140 Accubonds.

Smoked a goph with one earlier this year, it died.....grin

Dats amazing, a SMK killing critters who would of thunk..

Dober

Years back Speer made a 180 grain round nose 270 bullets. Wildcat Bullets makes a 190 grain, but the 270 win doesn't have the powder capacity to drive them fast enough, but the RUM case does

I'd surmise the 180 RN would stabilize since a given twist seems to handle heavy RNs often when not doing the same with Spitzers.

I'd imagine on short/medium ranges the 180 Speer did fine - esp. if it did not yaw (stayed nose fwd vs. tumbling) during penetration.

Matrix is listing a .7828 BC with a 175 grain in .277, .7381 with the 165 grainer.

They're showing .8071 BC with a 190 grain 7mm and .7136 with the 168 grain 7mm. A standard 1/9 might even spin the latter?

Looks like I'll have some fun stuff to play with when I get home in a few months. Pretty cool stuff.

I may be wrong, but Speer made a 170 grain RN in 270, not a 180...

I have a 170 RN listed in a couple of old Speer Reload Manuals from the 60s, when they list the bullet as new...

I also have half a box of them given to me by someone who said he would never use them...they are somewhere around here...

Maybe I'm strange. When I buy a rifle, first I figure out what rifle I want, then I look for one chambered for a round to do what I want it to do. When I bought my main deer rifle, I decided on a CZ-550 Premium(no longer made was available in 30-06 and 270), then I bought one in 270 because it was what was in stock at the local shop at the time. Same deal with my Savage 99, got a .308 but could have been .300 Savage and it wouldn't have made a difference to me. On my budget you can't bee that fussy.