What would you rate the safest safety? Would it be a tanger like the old Rugers ? 3 positions? I would be interested to hear others' opinions.

I prefer the 3 - position safeties….. as in a Model 70 Winchester. I normally keep mine in the farther back position (bolt locked and on safe), if I decide to run the rounds through the chamber to unload…..the safety is still on! memtb

Original military M-98 , then M70, Kimber, Ruger MKII.
If it doesn't block the firing pin, it's not even up for consideration imo.

Empty chamber until shooting is imminent.

Following that I like 3 position.

I have 2 of them, among a few guns- a 725 and now a M70. Don't mind my 77 tangers tho - I stay more aware if I'm using them, the 98, or the 700.

Hoo-ey! Now ya done it!!

Model 70 type

I do like how the ruger will notch in place into the firing pin in that 3rd position; might be my favorite safety.
But as you know I overall prefer the m70s to pretty much anything.

A bunch of dead people would agree 100%

So………no one would suggest modifying a Winchester Model 70 to a 1980’s vintage Remington safety and trigger assembly! 🤔 😂 memtb

Cross bolt.

Empty chamber for me.

Empty chamber.

LOL. Yep. 😬

the one between your ears is the best in my op.

Not better than an empty chamber though.

US Rifle of 1917, later utilized on the Remington Model 30 Express. No brush patch, no tumble, ever defeated this safety...yet it's fast and can be quiet.

flintlocke;
Good afternoon to you sir, I trust the last day of the year finds you well.

Honestly after a lifetime of fooling with all types of firearms, many of them broken so the intent of my actions were to get them working once more, I'm in agreement with you on that one.

The Pattern 14/Model of 1917 Enfield safety mimicked the rolling Lee Enfield safety which was one of the Mk III variants - prior to WWI but the early LE rifles had a different wing up on the striker, not like the one we're talking about.

Even a Mauser can be brushed off, but that kind really can't be inadvertently taken off or at least I cannot envision how.

That said, I'm an empty chamber guy myself if I'm moving, especially now that I'm not as light footed and nimble as I was when my age started with a 3 or even a 4, well or even a 5.....

All the best and Happy New Year.

Dwayne

That is my favorite. And no, I don't hunt on an empty chamber.

When jump shooting elk in the dark timber, empty chamber doesn't work. Just keep the safety on, control the muzzle, finger on trigger guard. Point, sight picture, safety off, shoot. Worked for me for 40 years

Only time I put one in the chamber of a rifle is when I am on final stalk or sitting and waiting. This “habit” has never caused me a missed opportunity. Ain’t no one walking behind me with a round in the chamber either.

Steyr safe bolt system hands down. For all intents and purposes, a 4 position safety.
Plus you can latch the mag in one notch below where the bolt can pick up and feed a cartridge.

I'm going with M77 Mk-II.

the safest bolt gun safety question implies that you are carrying/hunting hot. A lot of virtue signalers here say they only put one in the pipe when they are ready to shoot - probably the same ones who have one in the chamber when out duck hunting.

Exactly.. Those shots require you to be ready in a split seconds notice. Those that have never BTDT, wouldn't have a clue.

Chamber round when ready would be my first choice but sometimes stealth requires otherwise. With a round in the chamber, I enjoy hunting with the Blaser R8 system best. Just have to quietly move the cocking slide into position when ready. A 3 position would be my next preferred and two position my last at least for rifles I own.

Steyr safe bolt no doubt. No way to bump it off.

Actually, plenty have and do have a clue... ever followed bears into alder patches? I will stop "virtue signaling" if you will.

I’m not sure we’ve had o d of these threads all year.

Finally!!

Let’s change some minds!!
🤪😂

Alright, you guys intrigued me on this Steyr bolt system. Looked it up, watch a video or two, and still don't know, or see a provision that would allow, if it locks the firing pin so it's impossible for it to fall, like a Mauser, Springfield, or M70 does.

So, does it?

Thanks,
Rex

Maybe some of the Pa guys will check in, but I’ve been hunting for 60 years and I don’t recall anyone ever hunting with an empty chamber

I grew up in PA and hunted whitetails until I moved out. When walking I never chambered a round, neither did anyone else in our party. When we found a spot to sit, round chambered.

Would you feel totally comfortable having someone walk behind you in rugged terrain with a round in their chamber?

I carry empty when I’m able, but with Blacktail blood on a guy in certain places one in the chamber is nice piece of mind when you can’t see ten feet ahead of you, Or when you return to base camp sheep hunting to resupply and a bear has rolled the whole camp into a ball but your all of your friends are 4 miles away… I'm not carrying empty. Guess I’m not that brave , lol

i'm in PA and i have not heard that either.

First place: Weatherby Mark V followed by 1917 Enfield & Remington 725.

I have shot whitetails from Connecticut to Washington and Michigan to Texas and a bunch of states between in all sorts of cover... no magic uncovered...

I've hunted the islands of Kodiak, Afognak, Knight, Green, Montague, Hinchinbrook and multiple units on the mainland for deer, elk, black bear, brown bear, sheep, mt. goat and moose since the 80's

Physically ... out hunting in the field... without a round in the chamber is simpleton stupidity

Digest that as you will

Considering the source, it came predigested...

Mosin Nagant 91-30. I can see the cold chamber thing out west where game is mostly seen at a distance but in the east I don’t know any who hunt cold. Seems strange that in the same areas you would bird hunt hot you would deer hunt cold?

I don't think it matters for the most part. A good 2 position safety that locks the bolt is fine. Remington got a bad rap for unintentional discharges, but the problem was in the trigger, not the safety. I have both Winchester 70's and Tikka's. Can live with the safety on either.

Hot or cold chamber depends for me. I've taught hunter safety courses since 1986. They don't recommend cold chambers as a general rule. They do teach that you unload the chamber when crossing a ditch, fence or any time you're walking in rugged terrain where a fall is more likely.

I primarily hunt here in GA, but have hunted in the western states a few times. I think the terrain, and the way you hunt in the west is going to be conducive to keeping a cold chamber more often than in the east.

the best feature of the M1917 safety is - it can be engaged with the rifle uncocked. This was pointed out to me years ago on a day long elk dragging session,

Same here BSA!

If I’m actually hunting, the rifle is in my hands at all times….. in which the safety being “changed” from safety all the way to fire position is highly unlikely. Plus, the safety position is checked often…..I’m not complacent about the safety!

If the rifle is on my shoulder, a rare occasion, the chamber is empty. Carrying the rifle on the shoulder, limits the ability to maintain complete safety control! JMO memtb

simple solution for me was i purchased Winchester model 70`s, s.s. with the claw and 3 position safety in a 30-06 and a 338 Win. mag. so weather is not a problem either as much.

Only a couple of times... .

3 position type safety that blocks the firing pin like a M98, Winchester M70 etc, as far as a safety that is next to impossible to go off. Some major parts would have to break first otherwise it's physically impossible for that firing pin to go forward, doesn't matter how bad it's slammed or jarred.

Far as carrying empty........around here you would get mocked and laughed at for suggesting such a thing when out hunting by yourself and actually trying to shoot something.

Walking in or out with more than 1 person? Sure, that's different. Lead person can be loaded if everyone is cool with it, everyone behind should be empty in my opinion. Lead guy walking carrying muzzle forward is a safe type of carry.

I like the three position on my Ruger. Absolutely not going off and the bolt is locked so the bolt won’t come open and lose a shell if tangled in heavy brush. I do have M700 foot print rifles as well but IF I’m hunting with others I go empty chamber with those. I normally have a sidearm I’m proficient with on my side as well. Everything is a compromise that you have to deal with.

One that locks the firing pin

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This

I grew up in PA and now live in SE AK. Growing up, everyone always had a round chambered. Around here, if I'm out of a boat or vehicle, there's a round chambered. Around here, aside from beach or alpine hunting you'd better be ready to shoot immediately or not at all. Then there's bears to consider as well.

By now in life I'm of the opinion that a three position safety ala M70, M77, Kimber, and such are the best idea going. Lever actions on half-cock work fine. I've got a Ruger No. 3 9.3X62 that gets some use as well. On that rifle I tweaked the safety so that it takes a definite effort to move it to fire.

I always have one in the chamber, we stalk a lot of the time in thick woods. I don’t hunt with other people except my son or daughter now and in that case they’re in front with one in the chamber and I’m behind with an empty chamber

I remember a similar thread many years ago on this same subject.......it got heated.

The obvious one nobody mentioned is the system now common on European rifles. No safety, but a decocker. Used in the excellent Blaser R8, Sauer 404, some of the Voere model 98s, and many others. It allows you to safely carry with a round in the chamber because the rifle is not cocked. Impossible to fire in this condition, and unlike every other safety system there's nothing to break or get out of adjustment. Cocking is accomplished by pushing the decocker forward, like a standard sliding tang safety. Longer travel and a bit harder to do, but easy with practise. An elegant solution and completely reliable. It gets my vote.

Exactly.

A safety is a mechanical device that can fail.

4H shooting never used safety and we taught it that way.

Our rifles are always on fire with a cold chamber until its time to chamber and then don't have to worry about the safety NOT releasing in a bind....

I know thats not your answer but since we don't use the safety I have no other answer.

Apparently some of you missed the part about "shooting is imminent". ( "or might be") was implied

One size does not fit all circumstances. No reason to have one chambered walking to the Tree stand in the dark, or climbing up into it, no reason not to chamber one once up there.


Etc. etc. etc.

I have installed two of PT&Gs Rem 700 three position M70-style swing safeties on the two 700's I hunt with. I like having a safety that locks the firing pin on my hunting guns and it is nice to have the mid position to operate the bolt with the safety on when clearing the rifles.

Hunting with an empty chamber doesn't answer the question.
Of all the rifles Ive every used, the Enfield P14 safety is the most fool proof and reliable. It's it my favorite, no- but it answers the OP question.

Thats true. Or a single shot with exposed hammer. Relying on a safety is a crutch though and I rarely if ever use one.

That said the safety on the AR15 trigger would be almost impossible to overcome.

The one where you control the muzzle direction and keep your finger away from the trigger

If I'm out stalking hogs by myself, I have one chambered, using a M70 or M77 Hawkeye both with 3-position safeties.

If I'm doing the same thing with some others, nobody has one chambered.


I thought I recently read of there being some tang or Remington style safeties that are now being made (or can be modified) as a 3-position. It doesn't seem to me that they would have the same tactile feel advantages of the swing safety of a M70 or M77. I've always wished the M77 was a little larger, like the M70. I can easily feel if they are in position 1, 2, 3

I feel the safest safety is the types that can be recognized with a glance, so anyone will notice when their companions safety is off.

I love my Remington’s but not their safeties. Hard to beat a Mauser 98 for a good safety. I like the Winchester pre-64’s too.

I was in NFLD a couple years ago for a moose hunt. The guide preferred that I hunt with an empty chamber.

I agreed with his reasoning and complied without argument.

To answer the OP, I would suggest that original M98 military flag safety is the best one out there.

If you're in a situation where for some reason you have to have a round chambered then it's hard to beat the Blaser safety/cocker/decocker system.

So you have followed bear into an alder patch with an unloaded gun?

Had a rem 700, had the safety checked by a rem gunsmith as they recommended. Day later it misfired upon closing the bolt. Sold it and bought Sako 3 position safety, good or not the sako's have been trouble free and only fire when the trigger is pulled.

Ok, guess I'll add my 2cents worth, as I'm always carrying a round in the Chamber, but the Rifle is not Cocked, I guess you could say my Granddad showed me this Trick about 60 yrs +/- now, this was his De-Cock way back when, and this will work with any Bolt-Action Rifle....
Sequence of Operation, and pay attention to this Sequence....
1st Open the Bolt and Load your Magazine, Dis-Regard this is you have a Removable Magazine....
2nd Insert your last Round in the Chamber.....
Again Pay attention, 1st Pull the Trigger Back and Hold it, and then Close the Bolt and push it down......
Ok, your ready to go.....
Now, when the time comes that you might be ready to Shoot, just reach down and JUST LIFT the BOLT-UP, and Push it back-down, your Locked and Loaded, pull the Trigger when Ready, and if you decide that you are not pulling the Trigger at this time, Lift the Bolt back-up, DO-NOT Pull the Bolt Back, just Pull and Hold the Trigger Back as you Re-Close the Bolt, Easy-Peasy, I'm 74 this year, and been doing for EVER, don't need to stinking safety......
Lj

And as far as the Firing-Pin Resting on a Live-Primer, I just looked at several of my Rifles, and Yea, you can see the Firing-Pin, but it is somewhat recessed, and in no-way a determent.
Oh, and yea, this is the way we carried our Bolt Rifles in a Scabbard on Horse-Back..... and the Lever-Guns were carried the same way, but on Half-Cock.

I like my horses too much to do that.

Letting the firing pin rest on the primer makes me shudder.

Most of the popular bolt actions I am familiar with...in the scenario you describe, the firing pin tip is resting on a live primer, with whatever remaining mainspring pressure there may be...if the cocking piece is exposed, I can see where you could get an accidental discharge by dropping the rifle.

Never seen it in my life

Yes. Done it that way ever since

We make sure that someone else carries our ammo only doling 1 round at a time out when needed. We disassemble our rifles so that nobody sneaks a round in when we aren’t looking and we designate 1 guy to carry everyone’s bolts.

Safety first….😂

AK375DGR, the way you describe your method is also the way I store my gun at end of day.....takes pressure off the firing pin spring. Now if you do not want to have a round in the chamber, place like 3 rounds in the magazine and press down on the last round with your finger as you close the bolt. Just lift the bolt when ready to shoot ejecting a round into chamber.

The only reason I can see to have a rifle loaded with an empty chamber is if you are in a state like CO that allows hunters to, have a loaded rifle in a vehicle driving around scouting so long as the chamber is empty, however, since I am from PA I would not do that. When I hunted antelope in CO my rifle was had a detachable magazine so I kept in in my pocket untill I got out of the truck and then inserted it, and jacked one into the chamber when the guide said to do so. When in Rome, do as the Romans but when I hunt in my home state as well as others with simalar laws when I get to my stand which is always in the dark and get in I load up and jack one in the chamber. When small game hunting I load up and jack one in the chamber after we get out of the vehicle and start hunting. Do you empty chamber guys wait until the pheasant flushes or the rabbit bolts from cover to jack a round in the chamber? What is the difference between hunting? None small game or big game when it comes to gun safety? None, nota, zip, zero! The number one rule of gun safety is never allow your firearm to be pointed at anything you do not intend to shoot. There is being safe and then there is being ridiculous. How many here carry an handgun under a license to carry and then don't load it untill you see trouble? Think about it!

The safest safety I've ever come across, is the blr safety. On halfcock, it's typical.

But then you can hinge the hammer forward to protect the firing pin.

You could literally bash the hinged hammer, the rifle won't fire. It's a smart design.

Snork, When thrashing the lodgepole thickets for elks, we always used older takedown rifles...took down of course. No elks were ever harmed accidentally, let alone nimrods. Safety first.

As you say to each their own. Our handguns are holstered and contained and concealed often and fully loaded. TOTALLY different than waving a long arm around.

I"ve yet to need to load a rifle that cost me an animal while hunting. again YMMV on that.

With a full mag, empty chamber the muzzle is out of play. I am demanding of muzzle control from others and especially as a guide. I also value my life and know how many times I"ve been swept by a barrel. Even if its just a sling rifle on a pack and a guy leans to step over a log or such. Its almost innocent in a way. Especially after say a 10 mile day of hiking and or being up all hours and very little sleep. So its much easier to keep it totally safe.

I suppose the day may come I loose my life to an empty chamber with a bear. But its never even been close so far. And I can chamber and fire that rifle faster than I can draw the loaded handgun.

I do hunt birds a bit and yes those shotguns are also loaded when we are actively shooting. Although I hunt a LOT with double barrel guns and those are open until the time to shoot when they are closed and shot.

Yup I see your point, but the need for a loaded rifle chamber is just not there and any time I can be safer I am.

From my standpoint a gun is always loaded.. treat as such!

In doing so, wouldn't the firing pin be resting against the primer? There are many, many instances where I think this could be very dangerous.

Are you saying you walked around with a dbl barrel shotgun in the broken position until you are ready you shoot? I call bullsh*t. I cut my teeth hunting pheasants when they were plentiful and only an idiot would walk around with a broken shotgun. there is being safe and there is being stupid and then there is telling tales. I vote for the latter!

Old timers did that too.. Much quicker to close gun than cock hammers which were carried pre-cocked with open action.

Finally, a Colorado guy gets it.

I have never seen any gun fire with the safety on if they had one. Also I have never seen a gun fire without something pulling on the trigger. Maybe they do I just haven't seen it. I hear a model 70 safety locks the firing pin and is the safest system. I have never owned one.

Yup.

Just wondering out loud...
Did you happen to mention that to the buyer of said rifle?

When are you gonna start a new "Match King" thread, pard? I can see the wheels turning... 😉

As said a 3 position safety is best for bolt guns. You can load and unload with safety. Ruger and Winchester are two that come to mind. Remington no.

Seems I read years ago an article by an African professional that didn't use the safety on his rifle, but carried it with a round in the chamber and the bolt handle up. Mauser or M70 IIRC.

Mainer is correct. This method is really dumb because it’s less safe than just using the safety. Every time you do this the firing pin moves forward and smooshes against the primer. Eventually, the gun goes bang with this method. I know because I had a guy nearly take my head off with an ND while using this “safe method” back in ‘06.

Getting away with doing a dumb thing for years doesn’t make it any more reasonable. It’s still dumb and will catch up with you sooner or later.

More to the point it will catch up with whoever you hunt with.

I wanted to comment on the Steyr Safebolt safety. It is really a 4 position safety,a conventional 3 position plus an extra postion in which the bolt closes a few more degrees to rest very flat against the stock.

In this postion the firing pins moves so that it no longer aligned with the firing pin channel. The gun can not fire.

I don't know of another safety system that not only blocks the movement of the firing pin,but literally moves it out of alignment with the rest of the firing mechanism.

The Ruger #1 safety is superb. Couldn’t help saying it, despite this being about bolt gun safeties.

On the bolt gun, I like almost any safety that’s easy to get to and cams the striker back.

Blaser's (and some sauers, maybe others that are built by the same holding company) have a decoker safety that's bulletproof.

😏😉

Sold it to the gunsmith that checked it out, said he could fix it.
Off my hands and conscience.

You are a good egg sir! 😎

Let's keep each other safe out there.

I have a BDL in 270 Win, bought in 1968. Probably has over 1000 days in the field more on the range. On it's 3rd barrel. Killed everything from marmots, to elk and bears with it. Never an issue. My son has it now, got his first elk with it about 7 years ago. He loves the gun as do I. So I bought myself a "new in the box" BDL in 7mm Rem Mag cause my son won't give me my 270 back lol. I believe the newer ones have had some QC issues. The late 60s through early 80s models were pretty damn good rifles.

Silencers are not... they are suppressors.

Safeties are not... they are risk limiters...

Handsomest rifles ever made to my eye

It ain't the "safety", so much. It's the shooter and circumstances. Any one who depends on "safety" when a hot chamber is not necessary, is a fool. Sorry about that... Not.

An empty chamber (if not called for carried "hot"), is almost foolproof. Almost. There are always super-fools of course.

The Mod70 safety , et.al. are second best, IF a chamber needs be carried hot. And yes, there are circumstances it can/should be. But otherwise......

A "safety" can inadverantly be bumped off, taken off and forgotten to be put back on., gummed up, mechanically wear, fail, etc. If there is no round in the chamber, it's still "safe".

I was goat-hunting with a partner. Both of us (needlessly) carrying hot chambers on the assault up the mountain. Not even stalking goats as yet. I was second, stumbled on rock, my rifle swept Duane. I checked the safety ( (O3-A3, customized 308 Norma Mag) - it was off! I immediately unloaded the chamber.

LAST TIME- 50+ YEARS AGO, I EVER NEEDLESSLY CARRIED A HOT CHAMBER. SCARED THE CRAP OUT OF ME.

I never told Duane either.... any guy behind me carries an empty chamber, or, he goes first, and I never hunt with him again. Coming into camp, every one "safeties" their gun by insuring an empty chamber. I prefer to hear a dry fire..... No exceptions.

"Safeties". un-necessarily relied upon, are just your second (third/forth? ) chance.

las;
Top of the morning to you sir, I hope you're warm, well and dry up on the Kenai this morning.

We're actually getting a wee bit of prairie weather today in that it's currently -22°C with a biting north wind to add some zest.

Where we hunt during most of the season we can run into black or grizzly bear, whitetail or mule deer, elk, moose, California Bighorn, mountain goats, range cattle, feral horses, mushroom pickers, timber cruisers or grow op tenders. The grow op folks are less now that Sparkle Socks legalized weed, but for most of my hunting life here in BC - 40 years - that was the sum total of random stuff we'd bump into.

Our season starts at the beginning of September and runs to the end of November for big game, so we've got the luxury of both hunting on the mountain behind the house and also doing it for a quarter of the year.

On top of there being very specific seasons we've got point restriction, so moose will be no more than 2 points on one side, mule deer for much of the season is 4 point not including the brow tine and elk is 6 points.

The first bull elk I called in had a spectacular rack that was 4 on the right - thick as a fence post mind you sir - and 5 on the left. I believe I must have counted his points at least a couple dozen times.

Anyways, during that time, like as not, I'd have had time to pull the lever on the No. 1 closed or if it'd been a bolt gun, just thumb the bolt down.

Way back when, I had two co-workers decide to go hunting together, we'll call them Martin and Chris since I'll at least keep it straight that way.

As they told it later, both had .308 lever rifles, Martin a BLR and Chris a 99. They were hunting mule deer, in the snow so it would have been a 4 point restriction, regardless both had the rifles slung, rounds chambered but the BLR was hammer forward.

Part way up a steep hill with Martin in front, Chris slipped and went ass over teakettle downhill. Somewhere during that performance the 99 went off.

Chris stood up and said to Martin something to the effect of, "Holy S..t, I almost blew my head off!" to which Martin replied, "Yah well you shot me!".

Martin was kind enough to give me some photos of the wound that I passed around in Hunter Safety class every spring for the next 25 years.

The bullet hit him about his half way up to his knee on the leg, missed all the leg bones but still took out a scoop of flesh about the size of a lemon. It took him a good year before he could walk without a noticeable limp.

The elk story took place a few years after the Chris and Martin story and between it and a couple other moments where I took the time to consider life, I'd decided to be very intentional about how I carried while hunting.

As always there's a whole bunch of roads leading to Mecca and this is merely where I'm at on mine.

All the best.

Dwayne

When I still hunt, I hunt alone. If the terrain is such that I might slip or fall, I suppose things would be different.
If I’m hiking with a hunting partner to a location to start hunting, that’s different.
If I’m on a hill side by my self glassing a valley, that’s different.
Quite frankly I rarely am hunting with someone close by.

If I have one in the chamber, I do so in certain circumstances. If someone has a problem with my gun safety, they have not mentioned it.

If I have a magazine full of ammo and the only way to empty the magazine short of taking the barreled action out of the stock. I will ensure the safety is engaged while I work the bolt. If I don’t chamber the round while emptying the magazine that’s different too.

A little common sense goes a long way.

^^ me too and i won`t hunt with an idiot that does that ^^

As to actual bolt rifles, a pre-64 Model 70 or original Mauser. Sharps SS.
Also pre-war Winchester lever rifles. (I have heard there other rifles made-don't own any.)
{Lever action Winchester /Browning rifles with tang/side non-John Browning original design safeties}
NOT-allowed in my portion of the National Forest.

Hunt by myself or with Apache /Half-a-gas- can natives

I have installed two of PT&Gs Rem 700 three position M70-style swing safeties on the two 700's I hunt with. I like having a safety that locks the firing pin on my hunting guns and it is nice to have the mid position to operate the bolt with the safety on when clearing the rifles.

Had one that was made in 1979 ( ADL ) in 06. That thing went off on me several times, when closing the bolt.

Let a friend use it and when he was unloading it in a parking lot in the field, it went off and hit the rear box on a brand new 1 ton Chevy 4 door 4WD dually pick up. Still had the temporary plates on it. The owner was climbing in the front door when the rifle went off. When my friend returned it to me, he virtually threw the rifle at me. Had a gunsmith replace it, but it still did the same thing several times on me.

I won't pass off a problem like that to someone else, by selling the rifle. I rebarreled it to a 6mm Rem, with a fast twist.
I carry it in the field still, and still own it. When I hunt with it, it is strictly a single shot. I don't close the bolt all the way until I'm ready to shoot it. Occasionally I carry it to the range, where it is Single Shot used.

I don't want it to be someone else's problem. That is just good ethics. And Yes it was sent back to Remington, but they didn't solve the problem either. no other Remington I've owned has been a problem.

I won a stainless Remington mod 70 when the gun going off when the bolt was closed was still news. I never took it out of the box m I traded it for a Kahh MK40 handgun.

I don't know when this issue started or the bolt handles falling off. I don't disbelieve anyone. All I can say is I bought my BDL in 270 new in 1968. Hunted over many years with it some years 50 plus days per year. Hunted in Montana including the Bob Marshall Wilderness on horseback. Arizona south of Tucson. The Adirondacks. It never failed to function. Alway shot around .5 MOA and still does in my son's hands. Never lost an animal. Would it be my first choice for Alaskan brown bear, no. But if I won a Kodiak brown bear hunt under the condition I had to use it, wouldn't give me a minutes hesitation. I believe Remingtons quality control went down the toilet sometime in the 90s. I bought a Rem XCR II new in the box and had to have it fixed before I went hunting. I wouldn't buy another new one. Though I just bought a BDL in 7mm Rem Mag 1968 vintage. It's at Kevin Weavers getting the trigger adjusted to 2 3/4 lbs, a Decelerator recoil pad installed and my Leupold 3.5-10x50mm scope mounted Can't wait.

IE keeping the booger picker off the bang switch!

Well, that's good too.

Empty chamber doesn't work for me. I like to still hunt and jump shoot elk in the black timber. Learned a long time ago. sight picture, safety off, then and only then does my finger come off the trigger guard and touch the trigger. Once the safety is off I've already decided to shoot.

There are times a hot chamber is advisable, and times when it's just plain stupid, and times in between. I don't trust ANY mechanical safety, so pick your times to depend on one wisely.

If the one between your ears is functional, use that one, first.

My dad always said an empty gun will kill you....tell my grandson that every one in a while.

It's many years ago when I was in high school that a classmate friend of mine lost a younger brother, who was a twin of another brother, to a British carbine .303 stored in a closet with a live one in the chamber. I well recall the day as my friend was called out of school with the tragic news of his young brother's death.

It was the father's rifle for deer hunting and he never imagined any of the sons would touch it. There was another brother between my friend and the twins who had some mental issues. No parents at home that day, one of the twins (about 8 - 10 yrs old was ill and didn't go to school, so the other remained home with him. The next older brother with the issues came home from school for lunch. He somehow knew where dad kept the rifle, got it out (thinking it was "safe", aimed it at a wall and pulled the trigger. The bullet went through the wall into another room and hit the twin who stayed home with his sick brother in the stomach. He died within minutes! That was a severe shakeup to the whole community and the family never really got over it! And I believe that the young man who pulled the trigger was the one who least appreciated the full impact of what he'd done. The father, of course, grieved to his last breath!

This happened on a small Island on the east coast of Canada, in a fishing community. There were no ambulances, doctors or a hospital. I was a pallbearer for the funeral. I was 17 at the time and have never forgotten the aftermath of that tragedy.

It has been repeated here: "treat every gun as though it's loaded", and: " It's the empty ones that may kill you" (or someone you love)! Never ever let anyone hand you a firearm without the chamber being checked first!

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

exactly. The line I used teaching hunter/gun safety. A safety is a mechanical device that can and will fail. The only unknown is how many cycles it takes until failure.

I can't really recall the last time in Alaska that my rifle had a round in the chamber that the safety was on. I suppose the safety works on my rifles.

This…

I have been using the firing pin blocking 3 position Win. Mod. 70 safety for over 60 years of Alaskan hunting. None of them have ever failed me.

Using the middle safety position to field strip the bolt with out tools is a benefit. The older models also have the worlds best big game "hunting trigger" in my opinion.

Any system that blocks the firing pin.

I don’t have to concern myself with such tragedies, unless I get called to serve on the jury………which, of course, would never happen. I’ve never made it through jury selection in my life. The lawyers see it in my eyes like a neon sign.

Sorry for the loss. That’s a hard one.

I have used almost every type of safety still in use. Never had an unintended discharge so really can’t say one is better than all the others. I have found they all do the job as long as used as intended. I do have a couple of favorites. The CZ 550 3 position forward off safety being one but my absolute favorite is the old Ruger tang slide safety as on my Ruger 77 RSI. Works just like a shotgun safety of which I am well aquainted. The hardest for me to use was the Japanese arisaka twist knob style. Once I got used to it it worked fine just difficult for me to manipulate.

An empty chamber can NEVER kill you.

This is the most effective of the mechanical safeties. Not necessarily the best as there is room for considerable subjectivity in this definition. I'm not a huge fan of the model 70 safeties myself

Of all the amazing things that could be discussed about Alaska, it's not surprising that a geeky fkn gun thread has exceeded something like the Iditarod thread!

And a minute part of a fkn hunting rifle at that. Wow!

For some of you gun guys, don't u find this a bit pathetic? The least important tool amplified to the centerpiece of Alaskan discussions?

Come on man! Here some ideas:

Cessna 185 vs piper super cub.

Jet motor vs mud motor

Hunting with horses or dogs

Can-am vs honda vs yamaha atv's

Prop pitch vs load

Mountainview vs hillside

Gas auger vs electric

Village life vs road system

Ted Stevens stories

Outrageous pipeline construction stories

Placer mining vs shaft mine

Chainsaws sawmills and firewood.

Commercial fishing

Trapping

Wildlife encounters

Fish wheel construction

Gill nets

You forgot to include the Alaska Bush Company vs Crazy Horse. To bad Good Time Charlies closed up.

I am inclined to nominate the Arisaka bolt safety. It's very difficult to engage/disengage without a scope, and nearly impossible to manipulate with a scope eyepiece mounted over it. Consequently, the shooter is pretty much required to hunt with an empty chamber.

Then, the original Mauser safety mounted on the bolt does block the firing pin in two positions, so it is equally safe with the bolt locked and unlocked to permit loading/unloading withe safety engaged.