Am in the process of sorting out what I want to setup on a new DR.
I was a tad surprised on the add-on for installing & setting up rings & bases on it when they build it. I take it there is a different procedure for regulating it? Trying to comprehend the procedure involved on it. I am envisioning a few R&R's on the mounts, or something of that ilk, judging from the price, which is about 20% of the total so far.
So, I thought I'd ask if other people had done it, after getting the gun, and what issues they had run into in tossing a scope on their gun.
Plan was to have rings and bases installed/supplied and also the 3 leaf sights.
Any experience on this sort of issue out there?

ICK! And Why?

Scoping a double rifle is like painting your Ferrari with a spray can. Some do it, but it never looks right. Ruins the balance and handling fo a double gun as well. If you want a scoped DGR, have a magazine (Bolt action) rifle built.

My opinion, anyway.

Truth in what you say alright, but, eyes do deteriorate and this one won't be a DGR, so, I thought I'd have it set up with the option of a scope if I determined I needed it down the road.

What company are you looking at?

Cost may be so high to "suggest" going w/o mounts and scope on the double.

I am with safariman - scope never look right on a double to me. Here many have them for drivehunts - set up with lowpower variables...

I always think, a bolt might work better for these guys...

Doubles for me with open sights only. That said - I doubt, I will ever be much of a doubles man.

Levers & Bolts for me...

Eyesight is an issue... bummer.

Perhaps look at one of the euro companies (Blaser, Krieghoff). Scopes are regular to them on doubles.

I have enough bolts and singleshots, in fact this may be the same cartridge as on one of the singleshots, I want a DR!!!!!!
I looked at Merkels and Blasers,Chapuis, Don't turn my crank.

So - what company does?

Hi,

If Merkel, Blaser, Chapuis don't turn your crank you can go to Krieghof, Heym, Verney Carron, Browning. If these ones don't do it i wish you good luck and heavy wallet because you will need to go to English or Austrian gunmakers....

As Karl wrote in Europe some DR are scoped for driven hunt mostly because of eyesight's problem with aging hunters.

Be careful with scope mounting on DR. Better ask for when ordering, with zeroing and regulation being done by manufacturer. Some doubles can loose regulation when scoped because of weight transfert and vibrations. The modern over under doubles from Merkel, Krieghof, Blaser and Heym are the easiest scoped ones. They are made for by design.

Calibers are generaly restricted to maximum 9,3x74R.

The bigger caliber models are mostly made for close quarter and work with open sights.

Always have in mind that regulation is mostly done at 50m excepted by Browning (60m) and Merkel (75 for scoped model). Some DR are equiped with an adjustable system but zeroing double to hundred meters is a long and expensive job if you want it first class.

Good luck

Dom

Agree. If your eyesight isn't good enough to shoot open sights, why use a double rifle? Either get real close and use the double with open sights or buy a bolt action rifle and scope it.

+3

Gunner

I think there is nothing wrong with scoping a double, say in 375 H&H (Flanged) or a lesser caliber. I'm contemplating a second rifle in that caliber configuration. I own a 450NE Verney and in that caliber I would not consider scoping. Also the guys at Verney say the prefer to regulate WITH the scope on. jorge

I'm sending my Searcy 450 NE back to Butch to have mounts installed.
Cheap.. No

Effective.. yes

Needed.. not yet.

I do have a Chapuis scoped and it's a pleasure to shoot. The others still wear irons only though.

209...what are you thinking about for a caliber? A long time friend has a scoped Chapuis in 9.3x74R that he has had on several safaris. I know he made one shot on a planes animal in excess of 200 yards with one round. He also took one elephant cow with a side brain shot at something like 10 yards...

One thing you may want to look at closely is that if this rifle is going to permanently have the scope mounted is that you get a higher comb. There is nothing fun about shooting a large caliber double and not having a firm cheek weld. Doubles are setup like shotguns, to look right down the barrels over the sights. Put a scope up one to two inches over the bore and your face will feel the difference.

If you go over to the Accurate Reloading Forums and look for NE450No2 he can probably give some sound advise about scoping a double.

Bob

For me, I would want my rifle set up with a set of Recknagle or similar swing mounts and regulated for scope use. I sold my first one because I couldn't mount a scope on it. I've only had two doubles and a couple of drillings. There is a romance about shooting with open sighted doubles and they do handle a lot nicer, but to be honest it's hard for me to shoot well with open sights. I shoot my double a good bit, and I still wouldn't be comfortable shooting beyond about fifty yards with the open sights. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot to 150 with the scope. One of the things not often considered is the varying light conditions when shooting in the field. I've noticed that I shoot better in good light with open sights. I shoot somewhat less well when the light is not just right. That's not a problem at the range, on safari, it could be a problem. I believe it is my responsibility to put the shots exactly where they need to be. I can do that with the my double, but I can do it further and more consistently in all kinds of light conditions with the scope on it.
Bfly

Some of the answers here help make some sense of it. I don't necessarily want to use a scope on it, just thought it would be practical as an add on, til they told me the price, all said & done with a scope would be close to 3500.00, maybe 4000.00. That is with EAW claw mounts, and say a Swaro or Kahles or Zeiss 1.5-6.
Whether or not they will build it in the cartridge I want, remains to be seen. Could maybe put an NECG aperture on it if necc.

What brand of rifle and caliber are you considering?

He seems undecided. The question was put forth above and remains unattended.

I agree, a scope on a double rifle is sacrilege.

They need a 6.5-20x50mm BSA! Youze guys don't know nahting.....

I just lost my appetite for the rest of my breakfast. Thanks a LOT, Karnis old pal.....

Only if it has the illuminated miledots! YUP, I call 'em 'Miledots" 'cause I can then use it at that distance!

A "Dubble-Barrel-Snapper-Rafflle!!!!"

And what is this based on?

Looks?

Or making it more useful for less than perfect eyesight?

How many DR's do you or have you owned?

Yes; based on looks, tradition and the fact that you don't need a telescopic sight on a gun designed to shoot at the relatively close ranges doubles are meant for.

How many doubles? None. But if I did it wouldn't have a scope but no need to fret excessively because you're welcome to have one on yours. You can even paint your car with a paintbrush if you like. It's all personal preference.

What's the matter with having the rifle become more than a short range rifle?

Eyesight!


Slap a scope on them and you'd be surprised how good they are!

Well, the original notion was a matched pair of VC's, a 300H&H and a 450/400NE 3". The scope would perhaps have been on the 300.But, they won't do it. Apparently the 300H&H could have extraction problems. Corporate structure thinking I guess. They chamber their hammer gun in 7mag and 300Win mag.

If this is your first one, I'd suggest getting a Chapuis 9.3X74R from Dale Nygaard. http://www.heirloomarmes.com/)(It's almost up to a 375 Flanged for power and a great all around cartridge. They do make other claibers too.
Chapuis makes a fine rifle. Nygaard is cheaper and as fast or faster for delivery. Chapuis will regulate the rifle with a QD swing off scope mount. Others don't. A local buddy here shot a moose at 286yds. Lazered too. These aren't short range rifles.
Mine wasn't my first DR but it's one of my best!


Edit; I just looked and they also build the 300H&H as well as the 375H&H..

I think I will check out Krieghoff, they are a bit more than a VC, but, they do regulate their guns at up to 100yds, and offer the same options pretty much. See how that turns out.I thought about the 9.3x74r, but, I have the 450/400 and a 300H&H and a 338Wm, so, I think I will check out a 7x65R. It would likely make a nice option to my 7-08. The Classic has some interesting features and nice lines. Other option might be a Searcy, that is gettin' up there though on the base price gun. Then after this one is done, I will get into something like a 450-400 or a 375Flanged, likely the 450-400 as I have all the stuff for it.

They may regualte them at 100 yds but the regulation shouldnt be different at 50 yds either.
FYI I really like my Searcy 450.

$3500? $4000? Good lord, I don't know where you been looking but the last time I checked Searcy charged $595 to build in the mount at the time you ordered the rifle and he supplies the Talley QR rings that fit. I had this done on my 450 NE and the design is clean and well hidden. Never added a scope to this rifle yet but talked to Butch at SCI about possible regulation issues once the scope goes on and he told me in his experience it should shoot the same.

AkMike already mentioned Dale Nygaard and his advice is sound. NO ONE beats Dale's prices or ordering terms or his service. Chapuis UGEX rifles come with built in scope base cuts. I think the ring system is like $300 or so. Chapuis will also regulate your rifle with a scope on at 100 yards if you like. I better any builder would if you asked them to when you ordered the rifle.

Then you have the Heym PH rifles. They are built with a cut in the rail (for no extra fee) that allows you to add a red dot sight without altering anything.

Don't pay any attention to some of these guys trying to talk you out of mounting a scope. It might not look as classic but it can add another demension to your "short range" rifle.

I am currently waiting for my Chapuis UGEX in Blaser 30R to be delivered. Ballistics about 100 fps less than a .300 Win Mag. I have every intention to put a scope or red dot sight on the rifle within a year or so.

VC wants 2094.00 & mounts to install and sight in without the scope.
S&B 1-6z42 is 2000.00, Z6 is about the same. In actual fact the VC XA model comes out to about 13,5 or so set up that way.

I looked into 30Blaser as an alternative to the 300H&H, I get the impression it is something in the vein of a takeoff of the flanged 300H&H??

By the way---what is a 375RVC altogether, something different or a fancy name for the 375flanged?

Not a lot of info around on either one.

Any input on these?

http://www.clarkcustomguns.com/DblRifle.html

Price seems more reasonable if they shoot well.

No experience with them, but from the pictures on the web site, the front sight on the DR looks a little out of proportion. JMHO.

I noticed the 'cut' on one of the rifles on Heym's web site. Looks more like and opening for a turn-in dovetail. Any additional info on this 'cut'.

The English made a few nice SxS doubles for use with scopes but very few.
As many have posted here, they somehow look out of place on heavy doubles
At least on SxS doubles - but they work fine on O&U's if you can come to grips with them. Plus they are easier and cheaper to mount on an O&U

Kind of like a supermodel in a Moo moo dress, they don't look good until you take it off ...

The Clark guns are a Huhlu SG conversion. The SG's don't have a stellar rep but Mr Cark does.
IMO at that price point there are other options. Chapuis being my first choice.

The O/U's are definitely cheaper than the SXS's,but. I can't quite wrap my mind aeound them. That pesky bug says it has to be a SXS.
I have a couple of CZ shotguns, apparently made by Huglu, no issues with them so far, but neither one has 200rds on them yet.
The Heym 88B is a nice unit, but it's getting up there, see they seem to be in the 17 & up range, I sort of set my boundary at 15 and am trying to stay under the 25 range for the two of them.
Apparently Searcy started out on building his on the Browning/SKB SXS's, he seems to have done well by them. I see there is an -06 at G&H (?) in the 8-9 range. Looks decent.

Bascially your correct. It is supposed to drive a 180 grain bullet 2,800-2,850. But much of the speed depends on the individual rifle regulation. You can buy new brass at Huntingtons or Dale Nygaard sells once fired.

If you want to keep your cost under 25K for two rifles that is pretty easy. Buy a Chapuis UGEX, add the ring system and a nice scope, $6K tops. Then pick a bigger rifle from either the same or different builder. Easy to stay within $15K for the larger one for everything if you go with another Chapuis or Searcy or Verney Carron.

Visit the double rifle section on the AR forum for better advice.

Don't know what to say other than this "cut" allows you to mount a Doctor red dot sight. Clamps on, pretty easy and sturdy. Email Heym if you still have questions. Chris will answer you right away.

+4 - I think doubles look ridiculous with scopes or red dots.

Everyone is entitled to their own oninion. I prefer function over looks any day of the week.

By your standards does a bolt gun look silly wearing a scope too? Or is that different some how?

Some answers may be useful:

Chapuis, Verney Carron, Merkel, Zoli, Heym, Krieghoff, Browning, Rizzini and most other makers regulate their doubles from 50 to 75m, depend on makes and if scoped or not.

Most of them will accept a special order for 100m regulation at a price to be defined with customer.

Most of the double are pre-equiped to mount scope or red dot. These are the cut in the rib, filled by a metal piece, you remove to instal claw or EAW or Recknagel or other maker scope mounts. Quick detach one.

Good work is expensive believe it or not, cheap as nothing to do with doubles but the price may vary.

Modern over under are easily scoped and some are designed to use battue scopes or red dots (Blaser, Merkel, Heim, Zoli)from the start.
Some of them are specialised rifles for driven hunts (euro way) with independant cocking.
Some have build in regulation system that allow to adjust when you change bullet weight, make or shape. Not something to fool around every day at the range but effective when you know how to work them.

Most of the big caliber(over 375H&H)SxS are not designed for scope but if you pay and ask for, manufacturers can do it.

About the 30R Blaser: it is a bit more potent than the 30-06 equal to the 300H&H flanged magnum. We use it mostly in driven hunt in double or drilling but also in stalking single shot break open.

Good choice

Dom

Here is an exception.

My friend wanted to have pre equipment on his 577 Atelier Verney Carron heavy stopping rifle just in case of.
So they made it.



But most of time they don't. Note that for the moment it's a fixed sight stopper....The rear base is not even mounted but can be easily done.

Right there, in that pic, is generally what I had in mind to have on the gun, if I wanted to use the scope,I could. On the one gun only.
Ok, 30R Blaser, notion is beginning to gain some traction in the line of thought for the one gun, bit tough to find info on, a lot of it is in some form of fureign lingo.
Nothing about doubles or big bores is cheap, and I am inclined towards a better action/handling, moreso than the bling, having the regulation done right, not having to question what I am getting for the quality of the product. And I want somrthing that shoots decent, not 1/4" MOA, just would like it to hold, say an 8" circle at 200 fairly consistently. But, I have some limits as to how much I will spend on it, which in the case of these guns, is enough, that it lets me have something decent, I should think.

A fairly good way to convert foreign language website is to use google translate.

http://translate.google.com/#fr|en|

Just set the languages to what you need and copy/paste the sites address in the box and click translate.
It's not perfect by a long ways BUT you'll get the general idea.

I've bought about a dozen guns from Dale over the years and some insert barrels for combo guns. I bought a Chapuis UGEX still NIB from someone who had just taken delivery of it but suddenly needed to raise money (I know that problem all too well, myself).

The second shot I took broke the stock wrist. I called Dale to see if he would sell me a butt stock. He had me send the gun back to him, re-stocked it with even nicer wood, and sent it back to me at no cost whatsoever. Trust Dale Nygaard!

As to scopes on a DR, the two Chapuis in 9,3X74R that went through my hands both were scoped and factory regulated with EAW swing mounts and 2-7 Leupolds. They were regulated with 232gr ammo. With the scope off and using factory Norma 285gr loads, they regulated well at 50 and 100 yards. With the 232s they just crossed at 100 yards.

This is pretty darned good for a moderately priced DR or for any other one for that matter.

There seem to be a lot of people happy with the Chapuis. The vendor I was talking to, had some issues with them not being properly regulated. I can p/u a UGEX for 5-6000 off him. He has VC Azur PH's in stock also for 13,000.
Getting one out of the US is a last resort, due to the export laws down there, it can be done, but, it is a pain.
Found 30R Blaser info on a French forum, copy of what appears to be an RWS or a Nobel data book. Haven't researched brass or ammo for it yet though, as to avail up here. May have to check into getting it out of Europe direct.
I can get into a 9.3x74R really easily, but, it isn't what I want to get into. I'd buy a 375 first.

New England Custom Guns http://www.newenglandcustomgun.com/ seems to have EAW mounts for double rifles and others. Might be worth a look.

http://www.newenglandcustomgun.com/ this page is focused on the mounts.

Some salesmen are just like a car dealer VS another brand dealer. Ours is better, NO ours is better . That brand is a pile of doo-doo.

Take it with a grain of salt.

EAW Swing Mounts are not reliable for anything bigger than a 375 H&H. jorge

Oh??? Doo Tell?

They're great on my 9.3. But that is under a 375.

For 30R Blaser ammo info go to www.rws-munition.de and play with their web site you will get some info about bullets weight, speed and so on. You can go to Blaser also and look for their ammo (made by Ruag group, could be RWS or Norma or arsenal de Thune in Switzerland).

It's a powerful round for most big game even big bears with the right bullets.

web sites have an english version.

Dom

Hi forgot one thing about 30R Blaser: it's a high pressure cartridge nothing to compare with 9,3x74R or 8x57IRS.

CIP datas:

standard pressure: 4050 bars or 58740 psi
max individual allowed pressure: 4658 bar or 67551 psi
proof pressure: 5050 bars or 77240 psi

These pressures show you how robust and tough are modern double rifles.
Most of them are used in driven hunt in Europe and some shoot a lot during season and practicing running boar target shooting.

Dom

I'll stand with George on this one. IIRC, I read on the EAW web site their recommendation not to use the swing mounts on anything larger than .375.

Thanks for that info! I'll check it out.

Edit: I just found out that the ones with the Chapuis emblem are made by Recknagle.. I'm good to go!

I don't think I'd put a scope on 375 & up for myself, the big boomer will be a 450-400ne 3" as I already have all the brass and bullets and boolits and etc I need for that. The gun that gets the scope will be either a 7x65r or a 30r Blaser. I know I can get 7x65R here in town, would only need dies for it, which are easy to get. Only question I have to solve on the 30R Blaser is getting some ammo to get the brass. Appears to be about the same price as 450/400 ammo (read cringe!!). However if I can get the ammo without too much hassle, I may opt for it. Dies can be had easily enough.
Sounds like I ought to see if the Recknagle mounts are avail on the guns avail in 30R.
Learning some useful stuff so far. Thanks!!!!

Here are some pictures of scoped doubles (scope or red dot sight). EAW, Maklik, Recknagel, Poli and other make pivot mounts. Recknagel mounts as EAW are available for 99% of double rifles and good gunsmith can adjust them for the 1% left. They sell also all the parts for claw mounts.

Dom

Zoli double with Leupold Hog scope and Recknagel mount


Haenel double with Aimpoint Hunter34 and Merkel mount


Pair of Chapuis with Recknagel and EAW mount, SwaroZ6 and Aimpoint 9000


Merkel141 SxS with Zeis Victory and EAW mount


Express Merkel B3 30R Blaser with Merkel mount and Leupold VX7

I think you are short-changing yourself by not scoping a 375 or even a 404 or 416. Point being, I've taken game with same from distances ranging from 25 to 350 plus with a scoped 375. The caliber BEGS for a low power variable and in fact, I just upgraded to a Zeiss 3X9. jorge

I hear what you are saying Jorge. Zeiss, 'eh? I've been thinking either that in the 1-6x42 or maybe an S&B. I may have to settle for a Swaro. I remember seeing you were thinking of getting a 375 Flanged, is that what the 375RVC actually is, or is it something different again? 375RVC doesn't search well to get info on it.
At this point I am researching 30R Blaser ammo. Lousy results so far in N. America. And it ain't cheap in Europe , either.
I may yet change my mind on getting two SXS doubles, and get one in an upgraded version. A 375 would be far more versatile than the 450/400 if I go that way, at least for hunting around here with it.

I don't think the Zeiss of S&B have ANYTHING over a comparable Swarovski. Yes still thinking about ordering another Verney-Carron in 375 Flanged to compliment my 450NE. jorge

Well, 30R Blaser RWS brass is avail over here, not terrible pricing, not great, either. So, that is in play for sure. Thinking about a pivoting rail mount vs rings.Looks nicer.
Wondering if a person should stick with a 1-6x24 or go to a 42. My only doubt, is on scope height vs stock comb being high enough to be practical. I have a 1-4x24 Swaro, would prefer the 6x,have a hankering for the S&B flashdot reticle.

Noooo! Don't do it for DG gun! Maybe for your deerstalker in mild caliber and a light rifle, but there is something fundamentally wrong with a scope on a DG double.

As alluded to above, would you put a mustache on this and throw a burka over it? Granted it would still perform, but some of the romance would be missing.

Only Ruag (RWS) makes 30R cases. RWS never was cheap company for cases or ammo, but quality has a price which include quality itself plus brand name and reputation. You get what you pay for.
30R is not DG caliber, you can scope such a double, but do yourself a favor don't over burden it with too heavy a scope. A double is not a bolt action magazine rifle, weight transfer, vibrations, harmonics can change when scoped. On the very big caliber, mounts don't stand recoil most of time except if claw mount.

Zeiss Victory 1,1-4x24 Varipoint are a good choice with other Swaro, Schmidt or Kahles but not cheap too.
The new Victory HT with its fantastic glass will even be better.
As i already wrote better scope an O/U than and SxS. Generally their stocks better fit scope mounting, the way barrel vibrate and work when shot, too.
You can have very well made leather removable cheek pad to use with scoped double. They don't alter the rifle's esthetic and give you better head position when scoped.

More than any other rifles, doubles are all in compromise between, caliber, balance, weight, sights, stock shape and regulation. Some eat different types of bullets, some only one! No matter how you try and handload. No need to save on rifle or scope if you spend money in components trying to do them shoot...

Don't be fooled by some who say the contrary: that's the true. I'm in contact with most of the euro double rifle makers and they know what they speak of.

Cheap is never a good approach there, but no need to take mortage on your house to buy one.
Define your real needs, what you like, find some to take in hand and try if you can, then have the scope mounting job made by a really good gunsmith, go hunting and enjoy.

Dom

NEGC makes bases and claw mounts for fitting scopes to double rifles, drillings and cape guns.

[quote=hatari]Noooo! Don't do it for DG gun!

Why?


Do you have scopes on any rifles?
Are they more useful at longer ranges thta iron sightd\s?

At this point, I am in the hurry up and wait for answers on the gun mode. Likely it'll be a couple more weeks before I make a firm decision on which gun and cartridge it will be for the light one.
Could be the 30R, could be a 7x65R. The heavy one will be ordered after I've shot the light one for a bit, likely next spring, 98% sure that will be a 450/400NE 3". I have come to the conclusion I will set up for a 1-4 or a 1-6x24, on a rail mount, on the light one.Which likely means Swaro, probably a Z6.
I agree an O/U would likely be simpler, and a whole bunch cheaper, but, that would be simple. I just can't do the easy thing and I want a SXS. I have set up a meeting next month with a fella that knows a bit about DR's, he has committed to helping out in the areas he can.
I am enjoying all the sawdust burning and researching for now.

Hi,

Most of NECG bases and scope mounts for doubles come from Germany made by Recknagel, EAW and may be other makers because they are use to produce quantity of different systems adapted to high number of doubles made there by continental and british gun manufacturers...

Dom

Not to hi-jack this thread, but does anyone know if the rib on the Sabatti is solid or hollow? (No Sabatti bashing, PLEASE !!)

Normally it's a solid one. And generally they are pre equiped for scope mounts (EAW/Recknagel)
Sabatti double in 8x57IRS, 9,3x74R most of time are very well regulated and accurate.
Sabatti is making it's own barrels (very good ones) i have an Alpine LR target rifle from them in 6,5x47 which is a constant 1/3 to 1/2 moa if i do my part and read the wind right from 100 to 600m, max distance i shot it yet. So no Sabatti bashing for sure...

Dom

Sorry WiFowler i forgot to add: the SxS Safari big bore don't have pre equipment for scope, being destinated to hunt with fixed sights.

Yes and no . . . . the rib is D&T for an included Weaver-style base. The intent of my question was to find out if the rib would 'endure' the dovetailing process for a dovetail mount. I envision a reflex sight - Burris FastFire, Trijicon RMR, Leupold DeltaPoint, et al, on a dovetail mount thus decreasing the height above the bore(s) as compared to the Weaver-style base, and the Weaver-style clamp on reflex sight. Just thinking out loud . . . .

You can mill out the bottom of the Weaver base so it fit's very low on the rib.

Was not thinking of Weaver bases, your right. You better go on single pivot mount base to put in a dovetail on the rib, flush with it and use a corresponding interface for Docter sight that can be quickly removed in case of need. Made by all the German mount makers. The new HMS mount is even better, no need to pivot it, lock with a strong lever, hold on well, easy, fast, to remove.
You'll can have it also for MicroH1 Aimpoint, easier to zero, tougher, very long battery life.
We mount such bases in Europe on most good SxS without problem. Bit more expensive than Weaver but efficient, light and nicer.

Dom

Why didn't I think of that?

Taking this a step further . . . will a Trijicon RMR mate up to a Docter mount and Docter sight mate up to a RMR mount? I know (I tried) that the Leupold DeltaPoint fits on a a Trijicon mount.

One thing everyone missed, I believe, is that in scoping a DR you want The Lightest set up you can get to do the job!!!!

It will have the lowest relative effect on regulation...scope on/scope off.

I like a Leupold 2-7 for a DR. They hold up fine and are sufficient for the 300+ yard shots.

Well, it is going to be a Krieghoff Classic, 30R Blaser, 600mm barrels, with 3 leaf express,white bead frt, regulated with a demo scope & 180gr to 100yds, swing mount with rings setup, alum case.
I have the 1-4x24 Swaro I can try out on it. Quite possibly could have it in time & ready to go shoot something with it in Nov.
Doesn't look as though I will bust the budget to get both guns.The other will be the VC Azur XA in 450/400ne 3",600mm barrels and the 3 leaf express sights with the white frt bead as well. Unless I buy another scope for the 30R.
I got some 30R loads from Western Powders, a few from WF, and will have to try the ones off the Tirmailly forum in Quickload to see how they look.
This certainly has the makings of an interesting year.

The 30 Blaser R is a great choice, IMO. It was designed expressly ( pun intended ) for a combo or DR.