What is the best all around bullet for a 45/70 guide gun. I picked up a 18.5" stainless non-ported from a guy that said he bought it new about 6 years ago.

I have dies and I'm about to start loading for it. Looking for a bullet that'll expand on deer and still hold together on elk sized game. I also may end up carrying it around in bear country.

I was thinking of the Hornady 350g flat point. Is that a good place to start?

Bb

lotta guys like the Rem 405 gr jacketed...

none to be found...Speer makes a 400 gr I believe...

But I can't see any deer or elk in Idaho not dropping

from a well placed 350 gr Hornady......

The Speer 300 grain UniCor is also a good one for what you want to do.

Mine groups really well with 400 gr Speer and 405 Rem slugs.

I don't have mine anymore but when I did it liked The Hornady 350 round nose.

Mine loves the Hornady 350 FP + 59.0grs H4895 - 1900+fps

I like the 400 grain Speer bullet and the 405-grain Remington.
For deer I prefer the Lyman 322-grain 457122HP, the Gould Bullet. My Guide gun shoots this bullet well and the recoil is not intimidating. You can push this above 1,950 fps using Alliant Reloder 7 or Hodgdon 4198 - this high velocity is not necessary for deer.
The Gould bullet, when cast soft enough to reliably expand on our little white tail deer weighs a bit more than 322-grains.
I also have the the wonderful NEI gas check, solid nose version of this bullet and it will not leave you wanting for accuracy or penetration.

Find some 300 grain Nosler Partitions. Load them to 2200fps with H322 and go hunting. Outpenetrate anything except hardcasts. Go easy on the bullet use though it's been discontinued.

What he said. I still have a hundred or so of the partitions left. I used them to take bear, hogs, and 7 head of african plains game.


maddog

For the price of a couple hundred jacketed bullets get a Ranch Dog TLC460-350RF mold, a box of gas checks and a .460 Lee sizer die and a 20# Lee bottom pour lead pot. With a thousand primers and an 8# jug of Varget or IMR 8208XBR you will be able to subdue at least your shoulder and likely anything in North America. My 1894GS will put them in a big ragged hole at 100 yds at 2000fps.

I tried some of the 350g hornady flat points over 59 grains of benchmark. I always have benchmark around so it seemed like a good place to start. They chronied right at 2050 fps and with open sights at 50 yards they went under 2" in group size. I can't shoot much better than that with the factory open sights. BTW it did recoil a bit.

Bb

I shoot cast. I prefer the 330 grain Gould Hollw Point. My mould is a Lyman. You don't want a tough bullet for deer.

The best all-around price & performance jacketed bullet used to be the Remington 405gr JSP. But I stocked up on them long ago and I don't know what the current prices are, or what the competition has been up to. I've taken one Bull Elk with my Guide Gun at 18 paces and the 405gr Rem made a one heck of a big hole and Mr.Elk was DRT. I run mine at 1800fps.

When I shot cast bullets, I found that I needed a .460" diameter bullet. At first this was a problem, as no commercial casters made them, but as the Guide Gun got popular, more guys had the same requirements. I drive through Baker, Oregon so I would stop into Oregon Trail and pick up some unsized, unlubed 405gr fodder. They ran right at .461" and shot well with homemade lube. If I did that again though, I would use Lee Liquid Alox as it works wonderfully on my cast handgun bullets.

As jimone suggested earlier, if you want to have full control of your bullet supply, cast your own.

One thing to understand though, you DO NOT need a high-end bullet with the 45-70. I know there is a fantasy bullet crowd, and there are manufacturers who cater to them, but it is a waste of money with the 45-70. If you want to drill a 1/2" hole a long ways then use any heavy hard cast. If you want to make a 1.5" hole for about 2 feet then use the Remington 405gr JSP. But whether you spend 20 cents or 2 dollars a bullet, 400+grains of fairly slow moving lead is very lethal. E.g. if you would be comfortable with a 375H&H 270gr soft point @2700fps then you'd be comfortable with a 405gr Rem JSP at 1800fps as they both have the same momentum at 50yds.

The Guide Gun in 45-70 is amazingly accurate and you can achieve "one-hole" loads with a large range of powders and bullets. I personally believe the sweet spot is a 400'ish grain bullet running 1500-1800fps. I learned long ago that you can't flatten out the trajectory of the 45-70 and you don't want to screw up the "handiness" of the Guide Gun carbine.

Mine likes the 405 Remingtons. It shoots the 300 grains well. I have had to use gas check hard casts as plain based leaded badly.

i've used the 405's and the 300 HP's. the 300 factory loads do a number on whitetails here in PA.

They will bump around on you a tad. I am a fan of the 350 Grain Hornady FP's as well.

I've had a 1975 era Marlin 1895 for at least 20 years. It's got the micro groove barrel. It shoots well with any jacketed bullet load, but I never had much luck with cast. That was before I knew about gas checks, sizing the bullet to fit the bore, etc. I may try cast bullets again someday.

I've always handloaded for it using the Remington 405 soft point. Shoots great, and they hit hard. Never had a deer or hog go anywhere but straight to the ground after being hit by one.

Unfortunately Remington has gotten out of the component business and there won't be any more of these bullets for sale.

Lots of Alaskan guides use Kodiak Bullet Works bonded core bullets. They make superb heavy .45-cal bullets.

Actually that is a tough bullet.
You sure don't want a soft bullet for deer!
Horn 300 HPs are great at 1,200fps or so factory but will absolutely explode in a deer at 2,000fps.
My old stand-bye 405 Rems are now basically unavailable here in Can, but Horn 350 FPs have proven to be as accurate & tough enough for moose. They work real well in deer, poking a big hole right thru with-out grenading like the 300s do.

For North American hunting with a 45-70, there is no need for jacketed bullets unless you don't reload. This cartridge earned it's reputation for killing with cast lead bullets, and they will still get the job done. 300-350gr for deer size game and 400-550gr for larger game.

I found that out the hard way.....Replaced 'em with Speer Unicors and all is well. The Speer is a damn good bullet.

If you anticipate Elk, Moose or big bear, look at Buffalo Bore ammo. Duplicate it and you'll be prepared for anything.
In your short barrel, 4198 will probably be the best powder and there is no need for jacketed bullets. A 400 gr hardcast at 1900+ fps will handle anything you'll encounter on this side of the pond.

300 gr. partitions shoot great, but discontinued, I was able to find 200 in an old sporting goods store going out of business.

I shoot a Soft Lead bullet(WW) cast in a Rapine, Kieth design mould, that when gced and lubed, wieghs 333 gr.. Loaded to 1910 fps, has proven to be very effective on our deer. Makes a nice 1/2" hole in, and normally 1 1/2---2" hole out. Every deer that I have shot with this bullet, considering I'm allowed 6 a year, has been many. The longest shot that I have made was approx.220 yards. Every bullet has exited the deer.
Twink

Nosler and Winchester, working together as Combined Technologies, put out a 300gr moly-coated .458 round nose polymer-tipped "silvertip." I have had great luck grouping them out of a H&R Handi Rifle, and I expect they're going to love the micro-groove rifling in the 1895 that I recently bought here on the Fire. I load them in nickel cases in front of IMR 4320 with WLR magnum primers. They look sharp, and they go BANG!

The 300 grain Partition was the best 45-70 bullet ever made...IMO

What distance is this shooting -- 50 yards, 100 yards ????

I was loading 405 with reloader 7 for a while and really like the performance with said load

The only ones made that are better than the discontinued partitions, are the 250 and 300gr Barnes---the best and very accurate.

Thanks for a very interesting thread.