I'm looking for something that is;
1)Short enough to use in room clearing/Home defense
2)Takes hi cap mags
3)accurate out to 75 yards
4)light as possible
5)quiet enough to keep from blowing eardrums when used indoors in an emergency.

I've come up with 2 possibilities but I'm open to suggestions
1) I have a Glock lower and could install an Mech Tech upper

2)Mini 14 with folding stock

3)Sterling 9mm if I had that much money Don't you wish you could shoot as good as her?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw5_QEBWg6g

Guns are loud. I'd take that criteria off my list because it is unreasonable.

The Mini 14, in most of its incarnations and throughout most of its history, simply isn't acceptable for much of anything. I've owned a half-dozen at least, going back to 1982. The newest ones may be acceptable, but they really serve little purpose. With AR's possibly cheaper in some of their lowest-cost iterations, why not just go with that? IMO a DPMS Oracle or Sportical will fill the bill and possibly be $50 cheaper than a Mini. Plus you can get one at Walmart, around here anyway. I haven't seen a Mini in a year or more...at Walmart.

Thanks for the comment. I know all guns go boom...
If you don't realize there are differences in loud and blow out your eardrums loud then shoot a 7.5" ar 223 without protection.

Probably the only way to get a Sporticle shorter is to take off the barrel and replace it with a 14.5 barrel that has the flash hider welded on. This means a modification so you are probably not saving any money.

Ruger made a 16 barrel Mini a couple of years ago, you might luck into one. It appears the new MIni's have a better barrel but there are no spare critical parts like bolts and firing pins. Ruger continues to screw the pooch on that.

AR's are so much more versatile and the prices are coming down to pre Sandy Hook. I think Ruger continues to make the Mini's just to aggravate those folks who really think it could be so much more than an M-14 wanna be. kwg

Why not put an extended barrel/upper on the Glock frame, and a quality set of sights for the ranges you list?

About any AR-caliber platform is going to be an ear-buster indoors, so #5 eliminates most rifles without suppression. The Noveske pig seems to help some indoors from reading the posts on here, but no experience with them.

What about a pistol caliber AR-upper?

I've owned 4-5 Minis over the years, some shot great, some didn't. Ended selling all as not used, or not scratching an itch any more. I'd agree on the parts, getting one serviced is usually a long process with limited options.

Subsonic 300 Blackout loads are what I have in the house gun, but an AR so chambered will probably be more expensive than the bottom end AR's.

I have seen Mini-14's that were accurate in slow fire, if they weren't run hot, but in sustained fire they'll suffer. They are a sporting gun, and AR's are mil-spec (well, most of them, anyway).

I too have thought about a Mech-Tech upper, or a Just Right carbine. There is also one outfit making an AR lower that accepts M2 Grease gun .45 ACP magazines, and others have .45 ACP uppers to match.

Forget Mini 14 in my opinion a waste of money I owned 3 of them.

Forget #5 unless you get a suppressor

Get a Colt 6920 or 6720, an aimpoint T1 or H1 and Surfire light load it with 55-65 grain softpoint ammo, best you can do unless you get a suppressor.

Me a 45 Auto is a few dB lower than a 9mm, so I like the 45ACP.

Centerfire rifles are going to mess your hearing up.

I would recommend a Glock 19/17/34 with an X300 or TLR-1, and a DG or contour switch. This allows you to operate both the weapon and light, completely, with one hand. That way, you can use your phone to call the cops, move your loved ones, etc.

Personally, I think an AR with light, Aimpoint, Redi mag, and two 40 round Pmags is the ultimate in HD. 10.5" if you can SBR it.

The Mini conversation is really intersting to me
I have always owned one and they just sat. I would trade one off and than just seemed like I would pick up another and so on and so on.
This spring my friend bought a Mini 30 and I thought he was nuts, well than started thinking about cheap ammo and a few other benefits and thought well maybe all, of a sudden SHAZAM one was there that I could buy right with a pile of ammo mags etc
Bought it put a Redfield Revenge 2x 7 (its OK FFII better)
I have had more fun with that darn thing I keep it with me and whenever I can I run 50 rounds through it. Also I take kids out and 60 rounds 20 bucks I cant do that with much else.

I like it so much yeaterday I bought a Mini 14 topped with a
VX II 3x 9 that was really also a good deal

super accurate probably not
Fun and cheap to shoot Yep
Seem to be durable Yep
small easy to have in the trunk yep

An AR probably not
it is what it is

sometimes you just want to throw lead

There was a thread a while ago SHF gun and Ringworm said SKS it stuck me and I thought about maybe he is on to something this is similar but smaller and lighter maybe? What this winter taught me Cheap plentful ammo is a big plus

Hank

OP, for the needs you describe the Mini 14 will work fine.

I would not want to fire a 223 indoors for sure. A Good full sized 45 ACP with a light on it and your better off. I am not fond of the 9mm or 357 magnum indoors either. Go to an indoor gun range and you can convince yourself pretty quick.

Thanks for all the suggestions. The 45 has my attention because of the sub-sonic loads, large bullet and I already have a 1911 in 45. The fewer calibers I have the better.
The sterling link in my OP is really one that got my attention but it's pricey. I thought the Mech Tech upper would fit the bill but at 7lbs for an upper...I don't know?
Anyone know of another model in a 45 cal with similar plane jane "pipe style" look and reasonable costs?

If you could do without high capacity mags, a pistol caliber lever might be an option.

I have 2 minis and I happen to like them.

Still looking at 45 cal carbines but does anyone have exp. with the pps43C? Looks like a pretty reliable, short, high cap gun.

You could always go AR platform in 9mm or 45

Lever action Marlin 1984C shooting 38 special ammo. Relatively quiet indoors and will drop a bad guy.

Hi cap magazine? You can top of the magazine with the rifle still shouldered.

My Mini14 is louder than my AR15.

not an olympic arms fan but they make a 45 ACP upper, not sure I would trust my life with it. A company called Double diamond makes a lower to take glock pistol mags and they make custom uppers in pistol calibers. Not sure which calibers but would ask.

This is pretty much what your looking at...

I got to play with one last week in .40 and it was pretty nice, very straightforward and pistol caliber carbines are going to be much easier on the ears than any 5.56 load without a can.

http://www.justrightcarbines.com/JR_Carbine_Products.html

Would never want a revolver for anything defensive. As for pistols, I'd take 9mm over .45 every time, for every application, except a dedicated suppressor gun. As for the report;

http://www.m1911.org/loudness.htm

no doubt 9mm is fine, be sure you have hearing protection on with any of them, the 45 ACP is a few dB lower and won't destroy your hearing quite as fast. I just shoot ball ammo out of my .45ACP I guess I should be worried about that.

I don't think 3 decibels lower is worth 5 less rounds in a double stack gun.

I 2nd the Just Right Carbine.
I have one in 45 acp
One hole at 25 yds with a Tru Glo red dot sight.
I haven`t had a chance too shoot at 50 or 75 yds.
I had some jamming issues that we`re working through.
JRC is sending some stronger springs for my 13 rd G21 mags.

http://shop.justrightcarbines.com/H...zine-Spring-45MAGSPRING.htm?productId=71

Overall it`s a very nice piece and fun to shoot.

The dB scale is logarithmic not linear. The 9mm is much worse on your ears, and if I can't hit something with 7 bullets from a pistol etc. (please don't go all Ninja 15 rounds, multiple assailants, zombies, etc., keep your 15 rd 9mm I have one as well) but mostly carry a 45 as I can hit better with it

http://www.m1911.org/loudness.htm


Sound is measured in decibels (db), much like temperature is measured in degrees and speed in miles (or kilometers) per hour. Like most other units, the bottom of the scale or 0 db, is an arbitrary setting, which by convention is set to be the level of the sound that we can bearly hear, or our hearing threshold, as it is normally known.

One difference between the decibel scale and most of the other units we usually use in our everyday life, is the fact that the decibel scale is not linear, but logarithmic. In a linear scale, like velocity, if someone's car is moving at 100 mph, we know that he is moving at twice the speed of someone else who is doing 50 mph, i.e. 2x50 mph is double the velocity of the second car. In logarithmic scales a sound which is only 3 db higher than another, has twice the energy. For example, if you look at the table below, the 9mm Para cartridge at 160 db has twice the sound energy of the .45 ACP cartridge which is measured at 157 db.

Another complication is that the human ear does not hear linearly either. Although loudness is subjective, most people perceive one sound to be twice as loud as another, when there is a 10-fold increase in energy, or a difference of about 10 db. So a 60 db sound sounds twice as loud as a 50 db one, although there is 10 times more energy in it. Also, it is interesting to note that most people cann ot discern any difference in perceived loudness of less than 3 db. That means that the energy in the sound has to double, before someone can notice any difference.

A Mini like this one, will satisfy all the OP's requirements except the noise level. I don't think anything fired indoors will be 'quiet'.

Any time this comes up I find the responses a little amusing.

I have two mini's one folder one standard stocked. I like them well enough. The wood stocked one is way more accurate than what the 'net would have you believe. I've not shot the folder off a bench but the irons have worked on coyotes many times. Mini's are as reliable as it gets, and yes even more so than AR's.

Ar's are all the rage, plentiful parts, mags, and support companies. A short barrel collapsing stock with a light would be just as handy as a mini, not handier. They are virtually identical.

The purpose the OP asks about is always going to stir conversation. Choice of weapon can be very dependant on location, situation, and heaven forbid, experience & training.

Overpenetration, children in rooms, proximity of neighbors, etc. should all be considered when making these choices. Real training & practice would be my recommendation over picking a particular firearm. I use pistols to get me to a rifle. I like shotguns for clearing rooms but they are not good for much else that I do. Nothing wrong with a short barreled 12ga with bird shot for close up. Buckshot will go through lots more than you think.

As for noise, if you are ever in a real situation you won't think about noise or even notice it until it's over. The only way to quiet shooting is with a can as was previously mentioned.

How about a used G.I. M1 Carbine ???? I don't trust the commercial copies.

Not a bad choice at all. This one is a USGI, Quality Hardware Carbine. Bushnell dot sight, and Remington 110 SP.

that would be my choice over a mini 14! Nice!!

I like the Mini cause I love the mini-garand action. If you're gonna go M1 carbine, better off to go Mini-14 IMHO cause you can shoot .223 ammo.

I can't speak for others on this. I was the first to respond though. My experience with Mini's goes back to 1980 or '81. I owned the second stainless one I saw, whereas my good friend owned the first. I've owned more than half a dozen examples since, not counting two or three Mini 30's. My experience DOES NOT extend to the newest of the Mini's because after extensive experience with them I made the final switch to the AR platform with cost being the last straw.

The new Mini's are said to be much more accurate. So that may satisfy anybody's needs on that score. I don't know of anybody who wants an inaccurate gun regardless of the parameters they set on an internet query. The only thing I can think of is that even an accurate Mini is inferior to an AR and even one of the low-end AR's is superior to a Mini. When you factor in the cost of getting a Mini new enough to be even remotely competitive I can't see it myself.

People like Sam that have lots of guns and don't mind spending some to get something different may like the Mini. I just don't see the practicality or frugality of it.

In 1980 Ruger had the home defense, self defense, prison rifle and LEO .223 market sewed up but let it slip away by being so stubborn about making he Mini better and parts more accessible. Now, without spending lots of money, it will never meet it's potential. You can only assume Ruger wanted it that way. kwg

Thanks for all the good info and suggestions. I decided to go ahead and be happy with my sig 238 and my mossberg 410 home defense shotgun. It is the one with the vertical foregrip and spreader choke. Loading it with slugs or pumpkin balls will suffice.
For a toy I decided to get the Century Sterling type 2. I love the hi cap mags, OAL, folding stock, 9mm caliber... It is also accurate out to 100+ yds. It is the one with the full shroud just like the opening post link I pasted.