So I just ordered in a barreled uppper reciever for my Palmetto State lower my son gave me. Total newbie to the world of AR's here. My first question is, if I choose to hunt deer with this, and want to try a different caliber besides .223, what calibers can I get and still use this lower without modifying? I'm wondering about 6.5 Grendel? I'd just purchase another complete upper as long as I could drop it on to this receiver.

Thanks guys.

Pretty sure it will work, but you'll need different magazines.

You can run anything that is in the AR 15 family 204,20 practical,6.8 spc 2,6.5 Grendel, 6x6.8,and alot more wildcat rounds.

I'm thinking that Grendel would make a decent hunting round.

If legal, where you are, 223 and good bullets will kill any deer that ever walked....

If he's in Minnesota, it would be.

Joe Bob's has what appears to be a good deal on a 6.5 upper. Complete with BCG and charging handle for $500. No personal experience with that brand.

6.5 Upper at Joe Bob's

If your deer are @150 yards or less, nothing will drop the hammer like the 450 Bushmaster. Should you run across a Moose, Bear or Velosiraptor, you're good to go.

Think blackpowder 45-70-300.

As others have said, "IF the 223 is legal and you place your shots well", the 223 with proper bullets will likely work on reasonable sized deer.
The Nosler 60 grain partition and 64 grain bullets as well as the 64 grain Winchester bullets are purpose made for big game and I am sure others have suitable bullets.

That said the 6.5 Grendel will do it better as well as others, including the 7.62X39.

Course dead is dead

I'm thinking about a conventional scope for hunting purposes, most likely a 3x-9x. Is there any advantage to the purpose-made scopes that have more of a military application? The gun will have open sights in addition to any scope I mount on it. My deer hunting is done in the woods and shots don't range out much farther that 100 yards.

My son has instructed me to make sure I don't buy any magazines without the non-tilt followers. How do I tell by the ads if the mags have these or not?

Also, what's everyone's thoughts on a verticle foregrip, considering I plan on hunting with this rifle?

the Magpul PMags are very good, and very popular. there seems to be some problems with the 20 rd mags, but the 30 rd mags seem fine. i have NO experience with the 20rd PMags.

the anti tilt followers are a good idea. there have been several revisions, so a little research will help in finding the ones to avoid.

also, the metal usgi mags are good as well. D&H, is one brand that is well received.

as far as scopes go, lots of schools of thought. the best gets expensive, and if your life depends on it, you should get the best.

otherwise, there are a lot of options

http://www.at3tactical.com/blogs/news/11491881-ar-scopes-what-is-the-best-scope-for-your-ar-15

as for verticle grips, i don't like them personally. i have a friend who is a Green Beret, and he uses this:

https://www.magpul.com/products/afg-2

keith

For hunting out to "100 or so yards" I would lean towards a 1.5-5X or 2-7X in a more compact package. I would leave the irons off of a purely hunting carbine with a scope unless it was an out of town hunt or something.

Don't think a FVG would be much help leaning up against a tree or fence post or from a sitting position. Maybe sticks or a bipod.

one can put as much crap on an AR15 as one wants, there are hundreds of suppliers with "great ideas" waiting for the next sucker to punch in their CC. Failure to understand that the bolt/carrier/barrel/LR parts kit/receiver tolerances have a lower limit of required quality and then hanging a ton of accessories on a poor base seems to be popular these days. Well it certainly will "look" good. For shooting deer a 5.56 using a 55 or 62 TSX bullet through the front half of the deer works. Different calibers are fun and more expensive, and for me don't bring that much more to the party other than trying something different. I quit reading posts where people claim DRT/hammer of thor a few years ago, shooting skill followed by leaking blood and lack of oxygen is what kills animals. Here is a .22 cal deer gun made by Colt.

I'm thinking along the lines of a 2x-7x. What about the front sight? I'm aware that I should keep the scope as close to the bore as possible, but if I do that, will I be picking up the front sight in stead of what I"m trying to sight on?

You learn to ignore the sight, its more visible on low X than high, but you can learn to ignore if if you don't have a detachable front sight...

You won't see it above about 3x.

If it does bother you, they're easy enough to shave down.

True on a bolt gun, but the unique design of an AR requires the scope to be much higher from the barrel than you are likely accustomed to, in order for the scope to align easily with your eye when coming to shoulder.

As an example, if you attempt to install standard weaver scope rings on an AR, the extra high are not high enough unless you also use a rail or some method to get them higher.

The one piece mounts made by various makers such as Burris, Primary Arms, LeRue, etc are the best way to go. With such mounts the only thing you need to be concerned about is the diameter of the tube, not the height needed to clear the barrel with the objective bell.

Actually I have a couple of guns with just extra high rings and no riser and they work fine for ME.....

But I have the rest with an extra 3/4 riser and then normal rings or so... seem a bit easier, the just EH rings I do have to have a snug cheek weld, which isn't a bad thing either.

This is good to know as I've been digging around for a set of high Weaver style rings. I'll just buy a set of the ones mentioned above. Thanks for the info guys. We are really lucky to have such abundant resources to refer to in our members here.

The rest of my build came in today. A quick watch on YouTube on how to assemble the BCG and the charging handle, and I had the gun together in about 10 minutes. No scope for now, but am really looking forward to getting it running real soon. I've got 150 rnds of ammo set aside, and plan on building up a stash before the election. What bullet weights are best suited for a 20" 1 in 7 twist barrel?

anything 55 grs or heavier should be fine. the 1/7 twist is necessary for the heavier bullets in the 75gr+ weight.

congrats on your new rifle!

Just might sneak out to the range with it this morning.

Well done. Now get ready to spend the rest of your income building your "next" AR. There always seems to be a next. LOL

I haven't even fired it yet and I'm all ready thinking about the next one. This one's entry level, the next one will be built for long range varmint sniping.

First trip to the range with the new AR today. I had hoped to do it outside where I could stretch it out a bit, but it's raining cats and dogs, so we'll be indoors at 50 yards. Going to make a day of it and take good care to break the barrel in slowly. Should be a good time!

I have had a few scopes on my ARs, but currently I'm running a Bushnell 4200 2.5-10x50 on my 6x45, a 1.75-6x32 VX3 on my 7.62x39, a 1.5-5x20 VX3 on my BCM Mid-Length and a 3-9x40 VX1 on a heavy barrel 5.56.

The two VX3s are my favorites on the AR because they are smaller and don't throw off the balance as much as the heavier scopes, also their profile is just a bit lower than the others which is helpful with the higher mounting systems found on ARs.

Three of those are in cantilever mounts, my favorite being the DNZ Freedom Reaper. I have the Nikon P223 mount but it's not nearly as well finished or thought out as the DNZ.

The other is in a set of Burris Extreme X-High rings, which work, but are bulky and heavy and frankly very ugly.

The lower powered and lighter Leupolds would be my choice simply because they don't effect the balance as much as a heavier scope will.

Aero Precision makes some really nice AR scope mounts. Mine are the "right" heights and are pretty much bullet proof.

http://aeroprecisionusa.com/scope-mounts.html

kwg

I'm starting out with the open sights, but will be mounting a scope eventually. I can see why the raised mounts are necessary. What's everyon'e opinion on QD bases? I was thinking it would be nice to drop the scope in a hurry, but just about anything from a coin to a screwdriver, to the back edge of a knife will fit in the slot of most mounting screws. Will they stay locked up tight (the QD's) and will the scope and ring assembly hold point of impact?

I put QD rings on my in line ML to make cleaning easier, and on my AR for the reasons you mention. Have had one 8 years the other 11, never took either off yet.

It was rainy up here all morning, so I went to an indoor range which goes out to 50 yards. At 25 yards it prints one little hole, all touching. At 50 yards it's about 1/2" group. I need to adjust the elevation, but just chose not to mess with it today. One glitch identified it's self. The first round out of the magazine into the chamber via the charging handle was an FTF. It did it three times. I tried slamming the charging handle, and pushed the forward assist but it still did it. I was working with 5 rnds in the mag. Any thoughts or suggestions? Looks like an extremely light primer hit. Barely a little scratch on the primer. I'm shooting factory ammo.

if you get that dent tiny, and it doesn't go bang, IMHO you were never chambered. Especially if the rest of the rounds went bang.

Not sure why... but the charge handle ain't going to help. FA will if you pound it generally.. just pushing it generally does nothing.

I'd get a brush and clean the chamber out really well first thing... that may well eliminate it in the futuer.

Thanks for the suggestion Rost. I'm on 6 days this week at work, so don't know when I'll get a chance to shoot again, but I'll see how that works.

The little dent is from the free floating firing pin coming forward and hitting the primer during chambering. Inertia causes it to come forward and tap the primer.

You cannot "slam" the charging handle forward.

To properly load the first round into the chamber: Make sure the carrier is locked to the rear and the charging handle is pushed forward until it is latched. Insert the mag, then pull on it to ensure the magazine is locked in. If the mag comes out, it's not locked in. If it's not locked insert and again pull. Do not slap the bottom of the mag. Slapping the mag can drive it too deep in the magwell and cause you problems. Then, simply hit the bolt release.

While you're at it, place a few drops of lube in the exhaust ports of the carrier. This is the most important point on an AR. Then, lube your trigger hammer assembly, especially the pivot points and sear engagement points

Okay, so bear with me as I'm just learning my way around this gun. I want to make sure I'm understanding this correctly. I would use the charging handle to lock the BCG back, and then push the charging handle all the way forward? I'm sure I was starting with the BCG forward, and cycling a shell up into the chamber with the charging handle. I'll try it the way your instructing and hopefully that solves this little mystery. I really doubt that there's anything wrong with gun, as it cycled every single round besides the first one in the mag just fine. I'm pretty sure this was pilot error from not knowing any better.

Thanks for everyone's input here. Man, this gun's gonna be fun.

I may have misunderstood what you meant by slamming the charging handle forward. To me, it sounded like you were using your hand to quickly push it forward while attempting the chamber a round. Perhaps you meant something else.

The other method you can use is what is called the "Slingshot" method. To use the slingshot method, insert and lock in a loaded magazine. Then, pull the charging handle to the rear and let it fly. Do it right and your hand will snap backward a bit.

The biggest problem slingshoting the charging handle like that is the tendency to let your hand creep forward before the release, or not drawing the charging handle all the way back. Both can lead to the round not being fully chambered.

I hope this clears up any misunderstanding

In a properly working gun, there is no worry about letting the charge handle creep forward a bit before releasing. Or not drawing it all the way back either.

I'm convinced it's something I'm doing. For one thing, I just need more range time to familiarize myself with this platform. All my centerfire experience prior to this has been with bolt action or lever action rifles.

i ordered this for myself today.
a 223 wylde in 18 inch ss barrel from Palmetto.
been thinking about it a year. they finally got it back
in stock.
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...mod-upper-no-bcg-or-charging-handle.html

http://palmettostatearmory.com/medi...33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/7/7/7779760.jpg

What's the difference between .223 and .223 Wylde?

Wylde is the type of chamber reamer, 223 barrel, with a Wylde chamber...

I like the Wylde chamber.

So does .223 run though a Wylde, or is that a seperate round?

You can shoot 223 or 556 in a wylde chambers and they are more accurate than a 223 chamber or a 556 chamber.

I think they are more accurate than a 5.56 NATO chamber but a tight cut 223 chamber will beat a Wylde when done right.

The NATO chamber has more free bore to reduce pressure in high pressured NATO loads. The Wylde has a tad less, 223 even less.

I just told my son and his friend what I was wanting my rifle to do and his friend said 223 wylde is what I want for some of the reasons you guys have mentioned.

I wanted a little longer barrel.
I like the stainless.

Gopher like you I am new to the AR game. Never really was excited by them but decided to get one before the November election excitement. Still a bit skeptical about it but what the heck. Mine is a flattop with no sights, but despite having no sights the stock design requires a high sight line. I bought a set of weaver see thru quad locks and they worked quite well. My brother has also been dealing with his new AR which has an A2 style front sight. We tried the mounts on his rifle and they provided enough clearance so that with a std. 4x style hunting scope the front sight isn't visiable thru the scope. I now have another set of the see thru mounts on order for me. The other nice thing is they are under $20 on eBay.

What rings don't do is provide enough eye relief and you wind up with the ocular bell hanging over the charging handle and you're head canted back to see through it.

Of course this leads to the use of "tactical" extended charging handle latches and the end user never really cares for the AR cause it just doesn't "fit" him.

The best thing to happen to the AR platform is rails. With all the rails you can put on an AR, you can get the most from it with all sorts of accessories...

There's an ugly old Mauser up here in a gun shop with a hay fork welded onto the bayonet lug.

I do have a couple of questions as I too am pretty new to the AR game.

First do any of the various chamberings ( Wilde, 5.56, 223 )have impact on reloadability of the spent cases. For example a friend gave me some once fired cases from his remington 760 that were expanded to the point they wouldn't go into the sizing die. Do any of these various chambers have similar issues.

Second, What is it about the AR barrel/ upper that makes it so interchangeable regarding barrel and bolt mating, i.e. headspace. I read a lot about people that interchange different upper configurations using just one BCG with no headspace concerns. Is there something about the bolt lock up that compensates for different chamber variations or is it that most don't reload so a slightly stretched case is no concern.

223 chambers have a shorter throat than 5.56 and Wylde is a split between them in simple terms. The 5.56 has a longer throat to run higher pressured ammo safely, the Wylde is more accurate yet still handles pressure better than 223.

The 760 probably has a very loose cut chamber.

The head space is set by the barrel extension, the barrel extension is screwed into the barrel and pinned, then the chamber is cut to match a bolt. Bolts are pretty close across the board and just looking at the loose chamber in your friends 760 shows how loose tolerances can be and still be safe. Not optimum but safe.

I prefer to run one bolt with one barrel due to how the bolt wears into a barrel extension. It's kind of like lapping the bolt to the barrel extension.

I don't think that's right. Compared to the 5.56 Nato, the Wylde freebore is longer, but smaller diameter for better bullet alignment (.224" Wylde vs .226"-.227" Nato).

This is what the chamber specs say, and matches my own experience with these chambers. For example I've never had a Wylde chamber that I could load to touch or near the lands at mag length.

The Wylde chamber was originally designed for the longer 80 and 90 gr bullets loaded for single shot use, hence the longer freebore.

Could be, I've only had one Wylde chamber and it has always been referred to as less free bore. Maybe less equals diameter and not length.

But regardless, the case bodies use the same dies.

Here, this is always helpful when comparing different .223/5.56 chambers.

Thank you everyone, like I said I'm pretty new to the AR in fact to semi auto rifle except rimfire. Being a reloader I was never much of a fan of the generally oversized chambers that are common in many models. I was also puzzled about everyone's general lack of concern about headspace and will agree that if you shoot factory loads a little too much isn't necessarily prohibitive as case stretch is really mostly a problem in reducing case life for the reloader if they keep bumping the case neck back.

This isn't quite correct. It's like saying the 30-06 has greater case capacity to run higher pressured ammo safely. The reality is, the longer leade allows more powder to be used to increase velocity without increasing pressure.

223 spec ammo is not loaded to lower pressure. It's loaded to make full pressure in a 223 spec chamber. Pressure is measured differently for the SAAMI 223 than it is for the NATO 5.56 and do not directly compare.

Another thing to remember, just as all commercial 223 is not loaded to the same pressure, neither is all milspec 5.56

I did say "in simple terms" but if you guys want to pick apart everything I say then at least find something meaningful.

Try running 5.56 NATO ammo in a true 223 chamber and you'll probably pop primers. So given the leade is the main difference in 223 and 5.56 chambers any other reason is semantics. Pressure equals velocity.

It's not semantics, it's correct. I never suggested using 5.56 in a SAAMI 223 chamber. Critical thinking time: If the longer leade of the 5.56 allows 5.56 spec ammo to use more powder to drive bullets to higher velocities without raising pressures, it follows that using 5.56 ammo in a chamber with a shorter leade will result in higher, possibly dangerous pressures.

Pressure alone does not equal more velocity. A smaller capacity case loaded to the same pressure often results in less velocity because there is less powder, thus less fuel (energy) available to accelerate the bullet

Thank you for proving my point.

We are talking 223 vs 5.56 so the case size is the same. Pressure equals velocity.

I wish people would quit repeating that foolishness; I understand simplifying things for the ignorant but that's oversimplified to the point of being meaningless. Do you get the same velocity from full pressure loads of different powders? Of course not.

Pick'n nits and splitt'n hairs.
You guys are a riot.

I'm a technician. That makes me a professional picker of nits because if I don't get it right the first time, 200 people will suffer a fiery death at 30,000 feet.

TWR, if it were pressure alone, why does a 300 Winchester Magnum need a larger capacity case (combustion chamber) to make more velocity than a 308 Winchester? Why not just increase the powder charge (and thus, pressure) inside the smaller 308 case until 300 WM velocities are achieved? Because it leads to dangerous pressures. For higher velocities, more powder is needed, but the more powder used means case capacity must be increased to keep pressures at a safe level. For the same pressure, the larger capacity of the 300 WM produces more velocity.

Increasing case capacity is just one way to increasing the volume of the combustion chamber. Another is to use longer leade. When the primer ignites, it quickly builds up enough pressure to push the bullet into the rifling which will stop, or, at least slow slow down the bullet's forward motion. That's about where the pressure spikes. This creates additional combustion chamber volume letting the extra powder burn within safe pressure limits. It's a trick Roy Weatherby used back in the fifties to get more oomph out of his cartridges

I am just a follower of directions, 5.56 load data is different than 223 load data. Go to Barnes load data and look up 5.56 and .223.

Western Powders (Accurate, Ramshot) also list both .223 and 5.56 data on their website.