I recently took the plunge and bought a Tikka 22-250 with an 8 twist to specifically utilize 88 ELD-Ms. By the way, it does shoot the 75s very well. Anyway, my first foray into researching loads has been abysmal. I noticed that my Hornady 11th Edition and said app, have no information for this combination (22-250 and 88 ELD). A call to Hornady got the same result; "we don't have load data for that combination". So, to shortcut my research and to hopefully have a resource for others similarly situated, I figured I would start this thread in the hopes that others may have already experimented with this combination. Does anybody have any loads they care to or are willing to share. Yes, yes, I know the standard admonition: "these work in my rifle and may not be safe in yours, start low and work up". Starting and end points are helpful.

So, all of that to ask, does anybody out there have: a) an 8 twist 22-250, b) is loading/shooting 88 ELD-M, and, c) is willing to share your load(s) and results?

I recently went through the same thing with a 22-250 AI and settled on RL 17. I don't know how the standard 22-250 would respond to that powder but I am getting 3180 FPS out of a 22" Lilja 1-7 with the 88 ELD-M.

Sorry I'm no help on the standard 22-250 or the 1-8 twist.

BigSky,

I am in a similar boat than you... TMKs have delivered excellent results in my 1:8" 22-250 but I am willing to give the 88gr ELDMs a try!

Sierra publishes loads for their 90gr HPBT Match that can be a good reference.

Here are their two max loads with the two powders I will be trying for a start:

37.9gr Superformance for 3,120 fps
33,4gr IMR 4451 for 2,990 fps

I know it is not the same thing, but starting lower and monitoring speed I would not expect any troubles, especially since I do not chase max speeds any more.

Hope it helps

OP, let us know how the 88's work out for you. I'm pretty happy with the 77 smk/tmk, but I'm not shooting mine at 1,000 either. At 4-600 yards, you are not going to see a huge difference in the real world.. You must be intending to stretch the legs on that Tikka. I want to see some tiny groups at 1,000 yards, if you don't mind.. I just wished Tikka made a varmint model 22-250 with a fast twist barrel. If yours is like mine, it's a light azzed hunting rifle. Not the best choice for shooting 1,000+ yards. IMHO..

yes , pushed with RL 16

Tag… please share the info on the RL16 load

Bumping this one, any results wit R17, H 4350 or Varget, Superperformance etc

RL 16 36gr. 88ELD for some reason I don't have the velocity recorded but if I remember correctly it was 3000 to 3100 fps range

38.8 gr RL 16 75gr. ELD 3320 out of same gun 22" barrel 8 twist
I do not have recorded as ever trying RL 17
but I do have a note superformance did not maintain the accuracy for me..
all loads of a CCI 450 primer

I have been quite surprised at the lack of information available for this combination. Often you'll see powder recommendations with zero information on load data. Anyway, my search has come up with a few and I thought I would share them here. I personally don't know any of the sources. For all I know they could all be complete morons. However, their data at least appear to be reasonably within what one would deem sensible and safe when comparing with similar data from Nosler with 85s and Sierra with 90s. Here are the ones I was able to find elsewhere on the net. Hopefully others can provide information as you/we all move forward.

88gr eldm in lapua brass, with 3 different powders, all of which produces sub 1/2 moa groups.

H4350, h4831sc, h1000

H4350 produced the most speed @ 2956fps with my accuracy load. Started @ 33gr and worked to 35.5gr where I began to see an ejector mark. 34gr was my accuracy load.

H4831sc, to me, is the most accurate @ 2932fps with my accuracy load. Started @ 34.5gr and worked to 37.5gr where I began to see an ejector mark. 36.5gr was my accuracy load.

H1000 gave me the smallest sd of 4.1 and 2904fps with my accuracy load. Started @ 36.5gr and worked to 38gr, just began to crunch powder and hardly any room left. Luckily, 38gr was my accuracy load.

Another:

38gr rl26 and a br4’s primer with 88eldm 0.050” off the lands

34.5 grains of ADI 2209

Tag

Good info big sky. In the 22-250, I'd probably run the H4831sc, since it can be dropped right in the case from the powder measure, relatively accurately.

I have a 22.250 with a one in 7 twist, I run a charge of 33.5 grains of 4064 with an 80 gr A Max...

I dropped the charge down a grain with the 88 ELD....works fine, no pressure signs. haven't chronographed it yet due to winter weather..
It was as accurate as the 80 grain A Max and ELDs....

Today, I tried five loads from the information I provided above. I did not use H1000 or RL26 as my supply of those is below 2 pounds each and they are designated for other rifles and they are currently, extremely hard to come by. So, I used H4350 and 4831sc. I cross referenced the loads in my prior post with those for 85 grain in the Nosler manual and the 90 grain in my Sierra manual/app and determined, in my opinion, that the loads I chose were easily safe. I only did five different loads and I had zero indications of any kind of high pressure on any of the loads. My concern has always been, would an 8 twist 22-250 stabilize the 88s. It is commonly asserted on multiple forums that they will not. Based on information and assertions from Formidilosus and Big Stick that they would, I trusted them and jumped in. All loads were, Tikka T3X Lite 22-250, 8 twist, 88 grain ELD-M, new Norma brass, CCI 200 primers and seated 2.1265 BTO which was just touching the lands in my rifle. I had a left to right, full value, 15-20 mph wind. My loads and group size results are as follows with only five rounds of each shooting five-shot groups:

H4350
34.5 grains - .656
35.0 grains - .951

H4831sc
36.0 grains - .618
36.5 grains - .991
37.0 grains - 1.104

Keep in mind these were only five-shot groups and were only at 100 yards. I have not taken them to distance to true them or obtain velocity or dope and I have not run them over a chronograph. Hopefully this can help others and hopefully others can provide additional load information.

Excellent info. Thanks for sharing. You know you are going to blow the minds of the guys that have a hell of a time shooting in the wind. Let alone getting sub moa groups in the wind. According to some of those types, it's not possible. They think you need a windflag at 100, a wind sock, a flag at 50 and then one tied to your peter as well. Maybe they call that a wind cock, I don't know?? I'm curious to see what those pills do at distance in your rifle before I take the plunge and buy some. Short distance results look great though. Thanks for sharing!!

Well two things bsa, first I did have one wind flag at 90 yards which was a piece of flagging tape hung from a 24 inch stake in the ground. Second, as I stated, I have no dope on any of these loads and the wind speeds I stated are estimates based on my weather app and were not measured via a Kestrel or any other meter.

As a side note, speaking of the wind, this rifle was originally zeroed with 75 grain ELDs. With no adjustments or holding into the wind, all of my groups were right of my point of aim.

Sounds good enough to me man. I just ordered 750 from midsouth. They have them in stock and on sale. Free shipping too, so why not? I have plenty of H4831. I'll test them to at least 400 yards for now. Should see some 1" groups, if they stabilize. You are probably at high elevation. I'm at around 5,500+ where I do most of my shooting lately. I've been wanting to try these out anyway.

I worked up some loads last week with superperformance and RL 17
Sup 36 gn 2923
Sup 37 gn 3010
Sup 38.3 3100 too hot
RL 17 34.5 3020
but didn’t find the accuracy I was after at just over moa

I tried all of those slower powders in the fast twist 22.250 I rebarreled.. but I found the fastest velocity where I wasn't expecting to find it..
with 4064.... have no idea what the pressure is... but I can tell ya, over 15 or more shots out of the brass, the primer pockets are still tight..
Just suggesting to try it out... start at 30 grains and work up... 33.5 gr max is where I've loaded it too...

rifle is a Ruger 77 Mk 2, originally in 243, so it has the longer mag well... barrel is heavy magnum contour, 1 in 7, that I took off of a 223, before I sold it, and had it rechambered for the 22.250.. Pac Nor made barrel, from over here in Brookings OR on the coast.

Can’t get 4064 but Varget is close and what I use with 77s
I plan on trying that and 4350 next
I think 3050 is realistic and would be a great place to be

Any of you other guys buy any from Midsouth? Seems like a good deal on those pills with free shipping. I'm glad to see they were available.

I have bought from Midsouth a few times bsa, probably 4 or 5, and my experience was always positive. At least I don't recall any problems over the years.

Yeah, I've ordered various items from Midsouth over the years, never a problem. They or Graf's are my preferred suppliers unless I drive up to Powder Valley.

tag

Couple of days ago, saw some load data on the 22.250 with a fast twist, using the 88 gr ELD, and its max charge was 38.5 grains of Stabile 6.5 from Winchester...listed velocity in the 3500 fps MV range.

Due to weather conditions I haven't loaded up a few and tried them over the chronograph to see how that corresponds to those results...
and also looking to see how the accuracy is at that..

Was going to just start out at 38 grains and see what she gives me...

Passing that on... will report results when the weather turns around...

Got 6 or 7 inches of snow on the ground right now... that is really rare around here...

range probably closed until it melts which should be around noon-ish, but its still over cast, sort of chilly and just sloppy outside...

I shot them this morning in my Blaser k95 single shot.

Barrel is a 1:8" by Bix'n Andy cut to 60 cm or 23.6"



Altitude 2,130 ft
Temperature 45ºF

Brass: once fired Norma
Primer: Federal 210M
Powder and load: 36,9gr Superformance
COL: 2.69"

Speed: average of 11 shots: 2,933 fps
Group I: 5 in 0.6" at 100 meters (109 yds)
Group II: 6 in 0.7" at 100 meters






I plan to move up a bit, until I get 3,050 fps or groups start to deteriorate, whatever happens first.

Nice shooting

Highly doubtful.

Kinda why I was going to load up 2 or three, and take the Lab Radar out and chronograph them...

Seemed doubtful, but loading up and chronographing several will tell the truth or dispel it.

anything I read on reloading a cartridge, I always test it out first, to see if its fact or fiction.

Some times it becomes conservative in reporting the actual results.. and other times, it turns out to be someone's pipe dream...

The rifle and the chronograph is what I believe...

Yeah, I've bought from them quite a few times. Sorry if my question sounded like I was leery about them. I was just wondering if anyone else took advantage of the sale they had on the 88's and free shipping. Seemed like a great deal, considering the high prices on everything these days. I received the bullets the other day and I am likely going to start playing around with load development. Now seafire has me thinking I need to start off with 4064. Maybe I'll sneak in some H4831 loads as well. We will see if my rifle even stabilizes them.

I have 2 pounds of Superformance, but I've found it to be tempermental in other cartridges. Thanks for posting up results though. Looks pretty promising. Would love to see how it does at 400 yards or so.

This has been my first experience with Superformance so I cannot add on your comment about being temperamental. Next day I will shoot 37,5gr with an increased OAL of 2.70" and see how it goes.

It will take some time, as I don´t have a shooting range facility much at hand but will be testing them at 300 and 500 meters as soon as I can, more to verify my turret settings than because I would foresee any odd behaviour at those distances.

Would you, if I may ask?

I plan to take them on this year's cull hunt and see how they perform side by side to the 77gr TMKs.

Thank you!

Alvaro

Keep us posted buddy. Your groups look great. I ran some 88's today with some IMR 4064 and an OAL of 2.660". However, that is .020" off the lands on my rifle. Groups were not spectacular. I did not even measure them. To be honest, I got discouraged when my new iron sight 30-30 damned near shot as well as this Tikka 22-250, and I haven't even started to accurize the 30-30 yet, and that was the first time I've loaded for it. As for these 88's, I'm wondering how far off the lands you are? Generally it is best to start close and then adjust from there, not go the direction you are going. That also brings up a good question. How far off the lands are you guys running these 88's?? Your rifle has a 1 in 8" twist, which could mean it is marginally stabilized. Because of this, I always check loads at 400+ yards to see how the bullet performs. Believe it or not, I've had issues with the 77 TMK in a 1 in 9" twist. According to the stability calculator, it was "marginal" for stability. It shot well at 100 yards, but fell to pieces at 400 yards. I mean it was shooting 1' groups at that distance. Yes, foot, not inch.. Some guys call bs, but that is what I've seen. I'd personally rather shoot a lower bc bullet that stabilizes very well, vs one that is marginal because those can do some weird things past 100 yards. I'll be finding out soon with my rifle, and I may even give Superformance a try. Looks like you are getting some great results. Mine were ho hum today with IMR 4064. I am also not one that chases the highest velocity. I'd rather find a load that shoots sub 1/2 moa CONSISTENTLY, even if it is a tad slower. That is the key to shooting further out as well. It has to be consistent. That also reminds me, the brass I was using today was new. Precision will be better from here on out, since it is now fireformed to my chamber. I don't care who makes it, it's never going to shoot as well as it will after it is fireformed for your chamber and prepped right. I'll go measure the groups and get some pics posted. Once I find a good load, I'll stretch it out to 400.

I put the ELDs at touching BSA in my Tikka. I’m not saying you have to but that worked pretty well for me while working up loads. That’s not jammed on the lands as you know, just touching the rifling.

Sometimes I’ve had to back them up 5-10 thou but I use very small jumps with ELDs myself.

Never used 4064 though, but I’d think it’d work fine, probably very similar to RL15.

Thanks buddy. I like how the 4064 performed. Didn't drag the chrono out though. Just looking at group size and dispersion. It was new brass, so I was not expecting ragged holes. I'll try closer to the lands next time out. Seafire was right, no pressure signs, but I did not push the envelope as far as he did. In the Hornady load manual I have, I believe they list max charge weight at 32.5gr's for the 80gr ELD match bullet. That's why I only went up to 32 with the 88. I was surfing the web and saw where guys on snipershide are using RL26 and also RL23. I believe I bought some RL23 a while back. In the back of my mind, I'm thinking I will see the best accuracy with H4831. Does anyone have a picture they can share of new Hornady load data for the 88 ELD match bullet? I always like going off the book suggestions first. Thanks.. Also, I should add: These are some nice long sleek bullets for a 22 cal. I'm hoping I can work up a good consistent load that shoots in the .5's. That way, maybe something may shoot close to an inch at 400. That's been my goal for most of my rifles lately.

At 2.70” I will be 0.02” off the lands. It is where I wanted to start but I made a mistake when adjusting the seating stem and my first cartridge came out at 2.69” and I just left it there.

I have never experienced good groups at 100 meters and bullets key holing at 500.

I am surprised it can happen since the bullet does not loose much rotational speed when slowing down which is like saying that once stabilized a bullet should stay stabilized. But then, I had never shot bullets only marginally stabilized.

I have hornady #11 no load data for 88’s 22-250. I did check to see if they pushed a new manual and they haven’t. You probably can use data for the 22creedmoore essentially same case with improved shoulder. Start at minimum and go from their. Good luck buddy!

Thanks for looking J. I appreciate it. I damned near bought a manual off of ebay. Now I'm glad I didn't.. The info these guys have shared here is appreciated as well. I'll also post up results, as I try different powders. I'll also do like beretzs said and run them closer to the lands. Damn chamois groups are looking pretty good, I may have to pull out some Superformance.. Glad my brass is fireformed now though. I know some guys hate my target pics, but that is about the best way to show how a load is performing. IMHO..

The eld-m for me don’t like a lot of jump. Will say the 75’s and 88’s are not as jump sensitive as the 80’s. I jumping mine .010 off in my 223 Wylde

Thanks J. I ran them at .010" off the lands yesterday and similar results. Tried H4831 and it was alright, but the report was telling me it was not optimum. Still no chrono. I'll only pull one out when I find a good load.

The best out of 5 charge weights:


I'm not running my precious BR2's, as I am saving those for my competition loads in my creedmoor. CCI200 should get it done well enough. On to testing H4350 today. Mainly bringing the rifle to keep my new 788 company..

Did you shoot in yesterday's match?

Don’t overlook some RL15 or similar as well BSA. They may not be speed kings with the 88’s but if I’m catching your drift you don’t care so much about top end velocity.

8208, 15, 17, etc all did well.

I checked my Hornady ap and sure nuff, no 88 data for the 22-250.

And your 10 thou off the lands doesn’t look like a bad place to work at all.

Thanks buddy. I keep thinking AR Comp, as well, since it is just a reformulated RL15. Don't get me wrong, speed is great, but if it's not shooting 1" or near that at 400 yards, It doesn't do much for me. I'd go back to 77's if that is the case.. And in order to do that, the loads need to be shooting in the .3's or so. And consistently. So far, nothing has shown extreme promise. Like I have said before, BC is great, but it is not everything.. I know, some guys don't get it.

Schidty conditions today, but much better than the other day:

The first and second shot nailed the black diamond. With the scope I'm using, I could not see it. I thought maybe I had left the turret set for 400 yards. Then after the 3rd shot, I saw one in the orange (right above the first 2). That first shot was a clean and cold bore shot as well. Goes to show you these Tikka barrels are pretty dang good.

I could almost be happy with those results^^^ When the weather gets better, I'll pull out the chrono. I worked up to 37.5 grains of Superformance, and didn't see any signs of pressure. Groups got progressively bigger after the first group shown above though. Worst group was about an inch and a 1/4 for 5 shots. I also emailed Hornady and asked why they did not have data for this bullet in the 22-250, but have not gotten a response from them yet. I'm half tempted to try StaBall 6.5, but if I do, I'll drag out the chrono. The trouble with that is the weather has been schidt. Either too windy lately or I've been getting snowed on.

Let us know if you got a chance to try that StaBall 6.5 powder with those bullets. I've been having great luck with it in my 22-250 and 69's. I may get out and do some shooting before you do, if your range is still shut down. That must suck man!!! Also, as for your intended starting charge weight, I think I'd draw the line at 38grains, rather than start there. I'm running 39-39.5 gr for the 69's and that seems to be optimum in my rifle. Yours is a custom, so it may be a little different. I'm also thinking a good place to be with my rifle and the 88 is right around 3,050 fps or 3,100 fps on a good day, but the chrono will tell the real story.

Good info BSA

There was no match at my club yesterday.

Here's a little more from yesterday. Using StaBall 6.5. This has been a great powder in recent tests with 69gr match bullets in the Tikka 22-250 and also 6.5 creedmoor. The results from yesterday were not stellar:

1. 36
2. 36.5 (ERR reading on one)
3. 37
4. 37.5
5. 38 gr StaBall 6.5

Didn't run into any typical signs of pressure, no heavy bolt lift, no swiped case head, etc. etc.

1.5" groups were the norm, with the heavier charge going up to about 1 3/4" for 5 shots:


Because of how this powder worked for this bullet in my rifle, I would not use it. I am going to load up more from the other powders I used that showed promise and re-test a small lot of each one to see if the groups can be duplicated. So far the best, in my rifle have been:

1. 31.5gr IMR4064
2. 35gr H4831
3. 35.5gr Superformance (I'm thinking this one is going to be the fastest load)

I'll also bring the chrono out and get some numbers on those loads. Luckily yesterday was a fairly good day for that. Wind speeds were only in the 6-12 mph range and the sun was peeking it's head out on occasion.

I was blasting the coyote head with my new rifle. That thing is showing some great promise:

That poor dog is showing some wear^^^ Lost his ear a while back.

My question was posted 2/19, so "yesterday" was 2/18. No worries though, maybe you can shoot the next one...

Have you tried Varget or H4350 BSA?

I tried H4350. 1" -1 1/2" groups. I figured I'd save that powder for other cartridges that really love it.

Hey Castle Rock, I ran across my targets with H4350 today. Here are the results from that day. This was the best group shot:


The other loads were like I said earlier 1.1"-1.5", or thereabouts. Somehow I forgot to post that info from that day. Probably because I've been busy with some of my other new rifles. My new 308w Winchester model 70 is showing some damn good potential. Pretty happy with that rifle.

Thanks, a bit disappointing

Forgive me but aren’t charge weight/powder a product of chasing low SD/ES while maintaining the higher velocity? Accuracy lies in rifle dynamics?

Seems like you’ve cracked the code on a very stable load. Not to insult but have you chased a OAL node that runs into accuracy?

Yep, that's what I thought too. On the other hand, I wasn't too upset, as I like to save that powder for my 6.5 Creedmoors I use in competition. H4350 is always a great powder for my 30-06's, 300's and 338WM's. Kind of surprised by the lack of precision, as I had higher hopes for it. With that being said, you can always try it in your rifle. It may do better in it than it did in mine. I worked up to 36 grains, if I remember right.

Not always at all... the barrel will tell you what it likes....on the opposite end of the spectrum of what you are questioning : Low SD/ES.

My most accurate rifle barrel is a 6mm Remington on a LONG action...with a 1 in 7 twist I've tested that barrel with 15 different powders.
All were pretty darn accurate, with NOT much differences in group sizes at 100 and 300 yds. I shoot 3 different bullet weights only in that rifle..
75 HP, 95 gr Ballistic Tip, and 115 grain Berger HPs...

Hands down winner for accuracy was H 414.. smallest 5 shot group has been 0.202 at 100 yds, most others not much bigger..

Same with the smallest groups at 300 yds....with all three of the bullets mentioned above. ( not 0.202 tho)

The odd duck part of the results tho, is the extreme spread with that powder is averaging around 150 fps ES. Not what I was expecting to see, but is what the consistent results are with the powder... Kinda where I finally picked up on the clue, let the barrel tell you what it likes...not some reload manual telling you what you are suppose to see... Also learned a manual is a guide, not a Bible.

Keeps one from going crazy when the results that are claimed to be seen are not what the barrel is giving you...

Lawrence,

thanks for your posts on using Stabile 6.5. Based on your testing and results, I am going to try and work around the velocities ya got...

Will see what results I get with charges below yours and above yours... My Ruger was a 243 originally, so I can seat bullets further out than a 22.250 mag well will allow...

Kinda been swamped with taking care of other Scheiss around the place as of late.. winter, storms, trees knocked down followed by my wife with her tears about " My HOUSE !!".... and her car.... the front wheels just needed to be rebalanced...but she's learned from the other ditzes at the hospital where she works.. "that's what husbands are for"... etc etc etc.

I'll try some H 414, as a bench mark...W 760 is hard to get, but Sportsman's over in Medford has some Accurate 2700 in, which is the same powder overall... just lot to lot variances.

I see there are also some other variations labeled Stable from Winchester.. I'll have to research that...

but within my other experiences with the 22.250, I seem to get the best results with powders in the mid burn range, than the slower powder charges.
Can't tell ya why, but why look a gift horse in the mouth... might try H 380 also.. not shortage of that on the powder closet..

side note... you would figure that all the things I have learned to figure out in life, I could figure out the Campfire's " how to post pictures" formula..
just haven't taken the time to figure that out... seems like someone figured out a $10 solution to a 10 cent problem...
by the way 0.887 isn't that bad of a result... I'm sure there are more accurate combos hiding out there.. but in a pinch that will work..
sometimes I find that loads produce smaller groups at distance, than at 100 yds and under... hence why I go back to letting the barrel tell me what it likes instead of philosophizing on it.


Will keep ya posted on what I find out that may be worth posting....

cheers
seafire.

Sounds great man. I will look forward to hearing your results. I will also take a chrono out and double check some of the better loads that the rifle shot with H4831, H4350 and StaBall 6.5. I've been seeing more and more of that StaBall powder out there when I'm running around. I keep thinking I need to buy more. It's actually doing really well in the 22-250 with the 69's and my 6.5 Creedmoors with the cheaper Barnes match burners. The only thing I've noticed about that powder that I don't know if I like as much is it seems to be dirty. I don't think it has a huge affect on accuracy, but it's noticeable how much dirtier the barrel gets with it. For some reason, I keep thinking Superformance is the way I'm going to roll with this one. A little more testing, on less windy days, will confirm that. I'm also surprised I did not run into any traditional pressure signs with any of the powders tested. No heavy bolt lifts or unusual looking primers or case head swipes from the ejector. None of that, so they appear to be safe in my rifle. I have been at the range a bit with one of my new rifles and I had to back the charge weight down a bit on what looked like a damn good load. The only issue with it was a stiff bolt lift on a few rounds, when I tested it a bit more. Kind of disheartening because that load shoots damn well in that new rifle (308w). Even in less than ideal conditions, it was approaching 1" for 3 shots at 400 yards. I had the chrono out just for the 22-250 the other day and tested that 308w load and sure enough, it was right on book max velocity. I knew that was going to be the case because I was at book max and getting an occasional stiff bolt lift. I had to go back and check to see which charge weights were acceptable and re-load some of those and reshoot those charge weights. I also let the rifle tell me what it likes. I've always been a huge proponent of that philosophy. Like I've said before, I've seen guys fu ck around at the range with their fancy chrono graphs and get no where. I've even told them they need to just shoot the damn thing and let the rifle tell them what it likes. I honestly believe a lot of guys can't actually shoot well enough, so they have to go by the numbers they get from their chrono's.

The chronograph is the last thing I consult Lawrence...

I only pull it out and set it up once I find a lot that is awfully tight group shooter...
Then I chronograph it to see what I've got...

I don't run many of my loads at the max, more interested in making brass and supplies last longer... especially on the varmint caliber stuff...

but I am not getting any younger either, and don't want to come to the day that I pass, and my wife has tons of reloading components, brass, powder, bullets to get rid of and know she let it go for pennies on the dollar... so I'd rather shoot them up while the shooting them is good..

I like working up loads and testing them... but blowing up squirrels and prairie dogs works well also, and its a lot more fun...

and if a powder is dirty, it really doesn't bother me...that is what a bore snake is for, so I always have the appropriate ones needed...

Besides, the older I get the dirtier I seem to be.. so I fit right in with the dirty burning powder...

I looked inside the barrel and noticed that for the first 10 inches or so there were soot deposits along its bottom, like they had been sprayed and they laid down there by gravity.

They were rather loose and a couple of patches with bore Tech carbon remover cleaned them out easily.

Could it be due to the load being low pressure? The cases come out of the chamber with now powder residue but 2,933 fps may be playing it too safe? Sierra publishes 3,120 fps max load and this particular powder might need more pressure to burn cleanly...

I remember reading from Mule Deer that some Ramshot powders would not burn cleanly until getting close to max pressures and Superformance could be a similar case. I hope he chimes in.

I changed to a magnum primer, RWS 5333, and I got almost identical speed, well inside the statistical variability of the 210M load, so I thing it is time to move up and see how it goes.

Thank you for your comments,

Alvaro

That made me laugh. Your posts are always so sensible and honest and I appreciate that!!! Thanks man. When the weather gets better, we need to do some shooting together!!

Good stuff Alvaro. I didn't notice anything weird with the superformance loads I shot through my Tikka. It seemed to burn clean. Cleaner than StaBall anyway. I will say this, as I worked up, I noticed the groups began to get bigger. So, I myself like a lighter load than where you ended up, and I bet it is approaching 3,000 fps in my rifle. That will suffice and the accuracy is pretty dang good. I also did not want to approach book max for the 80gr Hornady ELD match bullets. Assuming I'd be way over max with the 88. I'll pull the chrono out again and test on a better day, just to confirm, but the other day I was messing with the same charge weight (as shown previously), but adjusted the oal back to .020" off the lands (that's always my go to on most hunting bullets) and shot a similar group size. The dispersion looked better though. No 3 in and 2 out sort of thing you see sometimes when the bullet is too close to the lands. That too will need a better look over, and in the end I may end up at .020" off the lands or keep the .010" off. We will see though, as the wind backs off and the days get better. Yesterday was a complete cluster fu ck around here for weather. it was windier than hell and spitting snow and hail. I changed the oil in my car and got more oil on me than I did in the car. Then my buddy from SWAT came over and I set up his rifle he's going to be using. I did the same regimen on that rifle as I would my own, but told him his life may depend on it and I wanted it right. Good stuff in this thread, hopefully the OP is able to get something out of it.

Thanks, BSA.

No problemo. Hopefully you don't go up too high on that charge weight, as you got some good info in the other thread you started about QL data. There's a reason I drew the line where I did:



I won't go into exact specifics on why, but sometimes you have to do like seafire mentioned in an earlier post and let the rifle tell you. A lot of guys rely on that chronograph, and they need it, but some of us here didn't grow up using one. We've done a lot of shooting too. Be sensible and safe in your handloading. Really not wise to push the envelope. Hopefully you understand what I'm saying.

I do understand and I agree with you, BSA.

I was quite happy with the speeds and accuracy I was getting, but the amount of powder residue in the barrel made me think that the load could be a bit soft for that particular powder to burn efficiently and completely in my gun. You know that all guns are not equal. f

If things doesn't work I will move on to IMR 4451.

Thank you.

Alvaro

I'd wonder if RL17 or Hunter wouldn't kick butt with that combo.

17 gives me right at 3200 out of a Lilja 22" 1-7 with 88's out of a 22-250 AI. Think it would work in a standard as well.

I could like that…

I’ve got a Hawk Hill 1-7 and a FN SA M70 action that’s destined to be a 22 CM so I’m following you Ackley fellas.

Keep us posted man. I'd like to hear the results. I drug the chrono out today and got the exact results I thought I would:




I'd say it's a pretty solid 2,950 fps AVG. ^^^

The reason the first group was not zeroed is because I was messing with the zero stop on the Zeiss V4 in the shop the other day and accidentally turned it. I still don't know about that scope. Just not a top quality scope IMHO. The only thing is does really well is track. The glass is sub par for what it is. My old Zeiss Conquest had better glass. Most of my Burris' have better glass for that matter. Now that I got that off my chest!!!


1 3/4-2" roughly at 400 yards. Didn't set up paper at 400 today, which is a shame, because a young guy was at the benches struggling to get his Daniel Defense AR with Nightforce 1-4 NXS zeroed in. I don't know if it was his Vortex QD cantilever mount that was moving around on him, or what? Something was really fu cked up though. His groups were all over the place. I let him use my spotting scope, and then he asked if I'd spot for him, so I was forced to just shoot steel at 400. I checked the Hornady ballistic app and it said 5.9 MOA come up and I set it at 5 3/4 moa and made those shots on the orange plate. That is a 4" steel plate, so that gives you an idea of how the 88 did. Not the best, but not too shabby either. I really wanted to shoot some paper at 400 today, but sometimes it's better to do a good deed instead..

I'd be dang happy with that performance at 400. Sporter shooting that well is pretty handy.

Thanks. That's what I kept thinking. It's a lightweight rifle, not a HB monster. I sure wish Tikka would get their act together and offer a heavy barrel fast twist 22-250. I won't kick this lightweight T3x out of bed though. I loaded up a couple hundy of this load to have on hand. I'll do more testing at 400 and get some on paper. Like I was telling one of my buddies on the phone today, the paper will tell me what I need to know. The smaller aim point will help to to put the bullets a little closer together. With the 77's, that rifle will lay them in there at less than 1 1/2" for 3 shots at 400. So I know the rifle is very capable for a fly weight. It runs 69's about the same as the 77's.. I was pretty happy with the results on steel yesterday, though.

I worked up the load to 3,063 fps and the powder residue came down to normal but accuracy deteriorated.

Instead of IMR 4451, like I had planned, I tried Vihtavuori N555 and 37,0 gr gave me 3,026 fps and two very similar 0.75" groups at 100 meters.

And that is what I have settled down to.

Thank you and others who contributed for your help.

Alvaro

You contributed a lot to this thread as well. Thanks for that. I'm sure the OP is getting some great info. Haven't seen or heard from him lately though. I hear you on accuracy deteriorating, the more powder you pour to it. I've seen that many times in a lot of cartridges. I relate that somewhat to a pressure sign warning. Not in terms of it's going to blow your gun up, but it does blow your groups up, so to speak. I used to load a lot of shotgun ammo for competitive trap shooting/money shoots, and I saw that all the time. The reason you load so your pattern is good, vs velocity with some powders, where your pattern is sparse with a lot of holes in it. A lot of similarities there with metallic cartridge reloading. That's why I save my targets and do a lot of comparing and measuring of group sizes. With most rifles, you'll se a definite node when you work up to find OCW. A lot of times it doesn't take many groups to prove which combination is the best either. Contrary to some beliefs.

It's becoming shooting weather. Any of you guys getting out and running any of these 88's in your 22-250's? I stepped away from my rifle for a bit. Messing with a new 308 winchester and had to whip a new 30-06 into shape and also playing with a new 30-30. I am going to have to get out and start messing with the 88's again though. Maybe slay a few of these critters with it at 5-600 yards:


400 yard shots are like taking candy from a baby..

Any updates on this thread? Anyone else running the 88's with some good info? Looking like this yesterday at my house, so it will be a little while longer before the whistle pigs start coming out again:

I will get back to it soon, been fishing a lot and in the process of moving house

Look at 22GT load data, has about the same case capacity as the 22-250! Just saying!

22-250, 22-250 AI, 22X47,22 GT, 22 BR and its improved models seem to be more alike than different. There is more to be found in velocity but they all seem to work pretty well.

Keeping this one close to the top, since the weather is getting slightly better:



This one is pretty much confirmed in my rifle.. I don't know how much more improvement one can get on a lightweight skinny barrel rifle?

This^^^^

John

👍🏻👍🏻. Velocity?

John

John, I'm running them right around 2,950 fps avg:


I worked up to a higher charge weight, but lost accuracy. That was 37.5gr and 1 3/8" 5 shot groups at 100 yards: The reason I settled on 35.5 grains. I generally shoot for 1" groups at 400 yards these days and as soon as they extend the range out to 1,000 I'll probably not touch the 400 yard range anymore. Here's another group shot at 400 yards with that load. It seems to be pretty consistent:

tag

Bringing this one back to the top, as it's a good thread. Wondering if anyone else has been messing around with this combo lately? The weather is getting better, so I'm assuming guys are getting out there and shooting.. Anyone else care to post some info?

Yes, the yote looks like a blob way down there at the 400 yard line...!!!

I've been back several times and taken in what has been provided. I've not done anything beyond the loads I provided in my third post. They were great loads with components I have so I've done no further experimentation with the additional information provided. I do agree that this has been a great thread.

Cool deal. I just bought 8 pounds of AA3100 powder for cheap. I'll bet that would probably work to launch these heavies. Probably would not get the velocities I'm wanting, but we might just see...

I got back on this one again and have come to the conclusion that my rifle just doesn’t like the 88s, it will consistently group 77 TMK and 80 ELDM to the .6 to .75 range but it always double groups or throws a flier with 88s to average about 1.5
All are 5 shot groups and the pattern is very consistent, I even duplicated your load exactly BSA for the same result
The Range here is less then 100 feet above sea level, maybe that has something to do with it

I am almost through a box of 88s so I won’t bother wit these any longer, the 80 ELDM is the sweet spot for me and it is a great hunting bullet in the 22/250, along with the 77TMK.

If groups aren't round,your rifle is SCREAMING "mechanical!". Hint.

Describe the particulars of your rifle,including scope,base,rings and ammo components. This schit is VERY fhuqking easy,if you Start At The Fhuqking Start. Hint.

Kiss,find pressure and rock on. I shoot 88's in a "few" '250's. Hint..............

It isn’t mechanical

I'm VERY "surprised" that your bedding turned your rifle into a Smoothbore. Though admittedly,I'm "unfamiliar" with the "particulars" of same,whether in OEM or Speedmire. Hint.





You've got the "gift"! No fhuqking wonder none of your schit shoots! Hint. LAUGHING!

Base/rings matter. Component selection matters. Undoubtedly you've botched headspace,along with seating depth and such things matter. If groups aren't round,your rifle is SCREAMING "mechanical!". Hint.

Bless your heart,for doing your best.

Hint.

Fhuqking LAUGHING!.............

Stumpy,

Does the rust on all of your rifles help out with the fantastic accuracy claims you are always making?

Maybe you could do a tutorial on where and how to rust your rifle and components to get the most accuracy, close up and at distance...

If a pic of one of your rifles doesn't show rust, its evident its a new one and hasn't been shot or used outside yet by you.

I took one of my rifles and have been cleaning and washing it in the creek and then letting it drip dry, along with the scope on top etc, and as soon as it started rusting, and especially in the bore, I've noticed my groups have tightened up dramatically. The rifle is also much more accurate at longer distances now.

Had some profanity engrave on the barrel, and that tightened up my two shot groups even tighter. At 1000 yds, I am getting 5 shot ONE hole groups...

People need to read your posts more often and deeper.. and do like you say... Read it, then read it again and then one more time.

I've also shaved my head, grew a foo man chu, got fat and started doing the Babble course of Genuine Alaskan Trailer Park Gibberish, and my thousand yard groups of one hole are even getting smaller, with I use a smaller bore bullet.

People need to learn, you've got it ALL figured out...Yesterday I even managed to get a 1 hole group at 1000 yds out of my Ruger 10/22, and rust on the bore made it all come together... I am eternally grateful for your eye opening lessons and posts. YOU"RE the MAN....

Does it even get better if I did this being drunk, like you do??