This is a Forster FLS Die. It's 308 cases when running through the die they 4 or 5 cases have came out with a ring close to the base of the case? Anyone know what could be causing this? The dies haven't seen used in a couple years. The dies were bought new and hardly used. Should I take it apart and try cleaning it out real good? Thanks! Tried to post photo but it says file is too big. There's no groove can't feel it with fingernail.

Simple, you've got it tightened down a hair too much. Back it off just a hair or so... Is it still chambering as is?

Eventually the brass will come apart at the web, if you keep reloading it like that.

Don't know if you toss a case after X Amount of Reloads, or keep using it until the case fails.

Just back the die off a little until the ring at the case bottom ( web )isn't there.

If it doesn't chamber, take some off the mouth of the case with a trimmer and it should chamber just fine.

Not a real big problem to correct.

I ordered gun waiting on shipment so I can't try it. you mean die is screwed down too far? The die is now just touching no overcam at all. I's a lot better but, I sure won't be able to bump the shoulders with this die though. The brass is once fired and some is new doesn't seem to matter.

I've screwed a bunch of dies down to the shell holder and its never scraped off a ring. Either the die is to small at the base or your chamber is large at the base is the only time ive had it happen.
Check to make sure there's a smooth chamfer at the very bottom of your die. Measure a fired case then one thats resized at the base if its more than .004 difference theres your problem.

If you are seeing a ring at the base I would be curious if you are not moving the shoulder back too far and causing a headspace issue. Are you checking how far the shoulder is moving back when sizing?
Like seafire said, it sounds like you need to back off the die.

The 308 case is a little over 1 5" long to the datum line with about.016 taper, even if he was pushing the shoulder back .015 to much he would be lucky to squeeze the case by more than .0005 at the base.

He says the gun is "on order", so probably shell cases that have been fired in an oversize chamber, but who the hell know with out pictures?

Measure a sized case, if it does it on new brass you got a bad die. The base of the die shouldn't even really touch the base of new brass or theres a problem with the new brass, measure a piece of new brass before you size it.
I size my 30-28 cases back .004 at the base its tight but it doesn't shave the brass.

I`ve seen this happen with different makes of brass too, and once fired range stuff fired out of who knows what. I`ve a 6 ARC, and PPU brass shows a partial ring, like the brass is thinner on one side, the Hornady brass does not.

If he hasen`t got the rifle yet, could be worrying about something that may not happen.

Some questions are difficult to decypher.

Oh theres a problem rifle or no rifle. Read its doing it on new brass.
Brass or die problem one or the other some measuring will tell the story which one.

Why would he be resizing "new" brass?

I'll try to get some measurements for comparison. I tried posting a photo but it said file is too large. Also, the brass that got the ring so bad was Winchester. I took some long wooden Qtips and slight oil and scrubbed inside of die. After that I started on Remington brass. The Remington fired once brass came out pretty good. But I don't know if it was the scrubbing of die, or different brand of brass? I don't have any more Winchester brass to try now. The die is barely touching base plate on my Forster Coax press.

I have been reloading for over 50 years and one thing I have learned is to never set up a sizer without trying them in the chamber of the firearm in which they will be used.
Sometimes it works out but I have been burned enough that I don't do it any longer. It also keeps you from over working your brass. YMMV.

Probably to get the necks the correct size or get dents out, new brass isn't perfect by no means.
I run every piece through a FL die no matter what, but I certainly don't bump the shoulders back unless it needs it which on the new ADG 28 Nosler brass for my 30- 28 it did.
I dont leave nothing to chance.

I suggest posting a picture of said ring

Because I don't trust the brass when its brand new... I've had bags of brass from manufacturers, in various calibers.. Some were perfect and resizing them gave NO resistance whatsoever... yet another batch from the same manufacturer in the same caliber, gave plenty of resistance.

Conclusion, guess some of their manufacturing tools need periodic adjustment that doesn't always get done, when needed.

It doesn't take much time to resize new brass, vs loading it up and then finding it doesn't chamber or feed.

I'll take the first situation vs the second., any day of the week.

And some folks have too much time on their hands

so you don't have enough time to resize new brass?

it would take less of your 'valuable time' if you just bought factory ammo ya'know....

I've tried posting picture 3 times but it keeps saying file is too big.

Screen shot your picture, crop it appropriately, upload to postimages dot com.

Use post image or if you have to use 24hourcampfire method open your picture with paint and resize.

Post image is much easier and better than the 24hourcampfire method - I always use post image now.

trying photo It's a little dark.

So you are resizing all once fired brass? Not new?

If the picture is of a once fired piece, the ring is the pressure ring formed at the bottom of a fired case, and IME, cases fired in different chambers of different rifles, and resized, could show this "ring". If you section a piece of brass, you will see it just in front of the case head. You will also see where the case has streached to fit the chamber it was fired in. A potential problem of case head seperation in YOUR rifle.

Be careful if this is indeed once fired stuff.

I`ve never seen this with "new" brass and a new die, when ironing out kinks in the new stuff, but maybe I`ve been lucky over the years.

Good Luck.

How many times has that piece of brass been fired?

I'm pretty sure it was fired once. I don't have any brass that was fired mor tha twice. None of the rings can be felt by my thumbnail. The Remington brass came out without any bad rings. Most of them are pretty good looking.

Any idea if both were fired in the same rifle?

4 different pieces of brass, 4 different cartridges, 30-06, 6mm Remington, 204 Ruger and 22-250. Obviously fired in different guns.

I think it's just the transition of your case head to the walls of the brass.









image hosting upload

Are you familiar with the bent paperclip check for incipient head separation?

I've never heard of the paper clip test?

https://bulletin.accurateshooter.co...ad-separation-how-to-detect-the-problem/

You could take the worst one and cut the brass off about 1/2" above the ring and see if the ring is visible inside of the brass.

Or toss it if history is unknown. Do you still have the rifle this particular bradd was fired in?

It's easy enough to just bend a paperclip.

Thanks!

All of the brass was just sitting for 3 to 4 years in plastic ziploc bags. It was also primed but since sitting so long I wanted to resize/ deprive. Just looking into the cases I could tell they were new primed cases. Also after depriming the pockets looked brand new. I'm going to find a paper clip and try testing with it.

Why haven't you taken any measurements before and after? Calipers will get you close.

Four rifles, four different cartridges, four different dies and all once or twice fired.To me, it looks like the normal expansion of the case. When the cartridge is fired the pressure expands the body of the case to fit the chamber but the brass is too thick at the very bottom of the case to expand it that much. Then when you size the case, the die only contacts that portion of the case that has expanded out to the chamber walls.

If you look very carefully at a fired case before you resize it, you can see that ring on a fired case too. It just hasn’t been burnished bright by contact with walls of the dies and the little tarnish on the cases makes it more apparent.

Unless those primed cases have been in pretty adverse conditions, there’s no need to deprime and size again.

Just haven't got around to it yet. I'm not going to load cases until I check chamber fit when new gun gets here. I'll take some measurements although I don't have any unfired brass to compare with. I'll have to look up saami specs.

Saami specs are .002 tolerance before and after is what matters. Without measuring everything else is just a guess.
What your cases are getting sized back to is what I would be concerned about first.
Dies should size back .002-.0025 at the .200 line, stranger things have happened with dies.
Your brass should be around .469 at the .200 line after sizing

Measure .200 up from the case and try to mark that spot, then measure with the thinnest part of your calipers and see what you get.
I would also measure where the shiny ring is also if its not on the .200 line

0.466- 0.467 is what I am getting where the rings are at.Its the same at the .200 area.

If you look at 308 reamer prints there .471+ at the .200 line, it looks like you have a pretty small die.
Call Forester and ask them what there 308 FL die sizes at the .200 line. Don't tell them you think you have a problem untill the tell you the answer.

Ok, I'll do that Thanks!

Would be nice to measure with a mic if you live around a machine shop have them measure 2 0r 3 cases or if you have something you know is a true measurement like a pin guage to compare your calipers is good

Yeah that would probably be better. The calipers I bought are MITUTOYO brand. Don't remember what model they are but I've only had them a few months.I have another set I could measure again with.

I have Mitutoyo ones to there good from my testing maybe .0005 of which I believe is in tolerance.
I would start by a phone call now to Forster

I just got back from Academy with a box of Remington Core-Lokt. I've measured 5 of those and they are 0.465- 0.466 at the .200 line. Now I'm confused, my Hornady 10th edition book shows 0.470? First box of factory ammo in about 10 years lol!

Factory ammo will be small at the base, and shoulder because they use new brass.
Sizing back as much as your dies are doing is just over working the brass, there is a few cartridges were it does have to be sized back by .004 like the PRC, 20VT and my 30-28 to avoid clickers with Lapua and ADG brass because that brass is really thick at the web
Factory ammo has to also fit every gun out there.

You can also see .010 short at the datum line on some brasss especially belted brass its why Peterson makes longer 300WM brass.

I think I'll get another FLS Die maybe that will clear up the problem.