Found a .223 Lee Classic Loader for $28.99 at Amazon and thinking that since I won't be finding anymore closeouts at wallyworld on .223 ammo, it might be a good time to start rolling my own. And I will likely add a 30-30 Lee Loader soon enough.

Both my .223 and 30-30 are target of opportunity rifles mainly used for plinking, target shooting, rocks-paper-steel at any range, along with short range deer, hogs, coyotes, etc.

The 22" '95 Ruger Mark II .223 has the antique 1 in 12 twist, so I'm probably thinking of using something similar to the 60 grain Nosler Partition, 64 grain with a flatter or more rounded tip, or lighter TSX. And probably some less expensive and more pointed 55 grain bullets for target shooting.

The Marlin 30TK 30-30 has a short 18" barrel, so I don't know how much this would affect efficiency or powder choice.
Maybe a certain weight bullet would be a better match for the short tube.

Anyway, wanting to keep inventory as small and simple as possible and acquire a single pound of powder that would work for both.
And was thinking a ball powder would be most accurate measuring with dippers. Is this correct?

First thoughts were Ramshot Tac or Hogdan Leverevolution. Would either or both of these be good options for my low volume loading operation? Or is there something equally as good or better for my application?

If you don’t have a scale, then spherical powder will be slightly more consistent with a dipper. I have loaded both cartridges with W748, it gave good velocity and accuracy. Not sure that LVR would work all that well in the .223, Hodgdon says it is very limited in application and lists no loads for it. No idea about Tac....



.

Thanks for the suggestion. Just trying to get a range of powders that would be easy to work with so I'll know when I see it if I should buy it or not. I will add W748 to the list.

Edit: I'll probably add a scale to my smalltime loading endeavor, for accuracy's sake. That seems simple enough and I don't have to mount it to a bench. Thinking digital for it's compactness. But still like the idea of a spherical powder.

748

Benchmark is a dandy in 223 and meters like water, works in 30-30 too. Others would be 335 although I don’t like it much.

Thanks. I'm liking the sound of 748.

Thanks for the reply. Benchmark looks pretty slow in the 30-30, and is extruded. But it got me looking at Hodgdon load data and it looks like CFE223 is spherical and has good velocity in both .223 and 30-30. Maybe I'll hear from someone familiar with it.

Yep it is extruded but goes through a powder measure like a ball powder. I set the measure, drop and go no trickling required.

My powder measure will look like this

Another vote for W748.
Paul B.

As others have suggested, W748 is a good answer.

It's a very versatile powder.

If you want a more modern, temp stable power etc. I'd consider Hodgdon CFE223.

I'll add my vote as well.

Benchmark is also a good powder, also BLC-2, and TAC. I use the military surplus W846 in one of my 223's.

Thanks for all the replies.

This looks like a consensus to me. Did a little research on W748 after all the replies, and it appears to be universally praised for very good accuracy in both the .223 and the 30-30. I'm going to go ahead and get a pound of this.

Still I'm intrigued by the BL C2, CFE223, TAC, and Leverevolution. I suspect that one or more of these may give higher velocity, especially in the short barreled Marlin 30-30. But maybe with higher pressure and at the expense of case life. Probably a negative if I don't plan on full length resizing.

Checking out hunting bullets now. Seems to be at least a few selections that will work in a .223 with a 12 twist. 62 Fusion, 60 Partition, Nosler 64 Bonded Solid Base, the lighter monos, and probably a few others. Gonna look around and see what seconds I find.
I don't think the 30-30 bullets will make as much difference. The 150 CoreLokts have worked well in the past. But I've got a pile of 170 Power Point factory ammo that I'll be using the brass from after it's shot. Might try something different like some lightweights for plinking since I already have enough hunting ammo and can save some back. And maybe I'll graduate to casting my own, although I don't know they'll work great with the micro-groove.

Dippers were invented back in the stone age, sure it will work but yesterday I saw a used RCBS 505 scale for $20 !!!!!!! would be a quantum leap forward for your reloading for a very modest price.

W748 will work well, so would CFE223

Yeah, I agree. I'm planning on getting a small digital scale. Just don't want a bench full of equipment.

I did exactly that yesterday..... loaded some incremental 60gr loads for my .223 with 748 using a LEE dipper and electronic scale. You can dip very consistently with 748 and add a few kernels by hand if need be. It was quicker for me to do it this way than to set up my powder measure for such few loads.
I was done in no time.....

That's what I'm talkin about. If I load 40 rounds it'll be a BIG day.

TAC hands down

Lever is the only powder for 30-30 and works well in 223 too with the heavier bullets. You might consider 2 cans of powder. Lever for the 30-30 and benchmark or 8208xbr for the mid weight 223 loads.

Bb

I’ve not found a better powder for 223 than TAC, and I have tried a bunch.

I'll probably end up with three or four before it's all said and done. Hopefully not five!

I like the idea of W748 because of it's accuracy and versatility. But after some comments here, and some research, see that it won't be appropriate in the long, hot summers here.
Of course I don't really like to get out and shoot a bunch when the temps are high. And certainly don't like processing any game animal in the heat. So 748 is still in play.

Hodgdon lists CFE223 for 30-30, too. That's would I would use.

CFE223 for the win.

I been calculating this out. And I figure I'll eventually need about nine pounds of powder, roughly, to use up all the 2000 primers I'll have to buy. Maybe a little less if I load some Trail Boss or other light loads.
So maybe I'll try both W748 and CFE223.

CFE223 is outstanding in .223 and .308. I plan to work up a load with it in my .30-30 soon.

I'll second the nomination of CFE-223 as excellent in both. It's all I shoot in .223 with 50-60 grain bullets and initial experiments with it in .30-30 shows great promise. (But I've only worked with it in .30-30 in a Savage 99G with jacketed bullets. Other .30-30 work at Chez Gnoahhh is with other guns, powders and cast bullets.)

CFE 223 closing fast. This is probably the best choice for me to start out with here in Texas with CFE 223's greater temperature stability.

The .223 hammer loader will be here today. Now just need to get some powder, bullets, primers, and an electronic scale.

Thinkin fifty of the 53 or 55 TSX should get me on my way to paying for a good part of my investment, since boxed ammo for these aint cheap.
Then a hundred Hornady 55 grain Interlocks look pretty reasonable for an all around load. About $15 for 100.
And then a hundred of either the 63 Sierra SMP or 64 Power Point have been rumored to have reasonable accuracy in a 12 twist barrel.

Either CCI 400 or Tula is what they have at academy in the 100 packs. So I guess I'll give the CCI a try.
They also have the CFE 223 in stock. So I'll pick that up.

Undecided on which electronic scale so far.

30-30 is on the back burner for the moment, as I still have something north of 200 rounds with the nine boxes that came with my last rifle and three or four that I had left over.
Although I wouldn't mind loading some 110's or 125's for plinking.
Might start thinkin about loading for .243 ahead of the 30-30. Would like to try some 105hpbt's for long range target practice maybe.

Any of those bullets you mentioned, with the exception of the Hornady 55's may or may not stabilize perfectly in that slow-ish twist. Probably might, but I would ease into those heavies with a sampling before jumping in with both feet just to be sure.

53-55 TSX's are wonderful bullets but are fairly longer than the cup-n-core Hornady 55's, and it's length not weight that matters (as in so many things in life!).

Yes, I'm aware. But I appeciate the heads up. I am a little skeptical of what will and won't be accurate. I've had erratic groups trying to shoot 100 grain pointed soft points in a slow twist 243.

Barnes lists the 55 grain TSX having a 12 twist minimum. But I'm leaning towards the 53 grain.

I'm more concerned with the Sierra 63 and Winchester 64 even though their semi-points make them short for weight bullets. But seems like from all I've read, everyone with a 12 twist .223 has had success shooting them.
I had thought about the 60 grain Hornady, Fusion, and Partition. But I'm even more concerned with those not stabilizing perfectly.

Regardless, if I can't shoot the bullets I want out of this one, I'm sure I'll move on to an 8 or 9 twist eventually.

Ha! I got a chuckle from that. Don't know where you read anything positive about CFE223 and temp stability, but it's cause to doubt that source. It's one of the most temp sensitive choices you could make, in my experience. TAC is a similar burn rate but much more stable, for example.

Trying to stick with one powder for multiple cartridges is a common new reloader mistake. You've already acknowledged you'll need more than one pound of powder to use all your primers anyway; you might as well choose one ideal powder for 223 and one for 30/30, without them needing to be the same. Burleyboy's suggestion above is good.

I think you might be a bit optimistic in 223 bullet weights as well, but some of these other guys spend more time with 1:12 twists. From the last one I had in that twist rate, I had much better results in the 50-55gr range or lighter.

Thanks for the advice on powders. It looks like I may look at several more powders before I decide what I want to start with. I have a lot to learn.
90+ temps can be expected here over a six month period, so a temp stable powder has become something I believe I'd like to use.

As far as the Sierra 63 SMP, they say it was designed with older slow twist rifles in mind and it has a short length for it's weight.
https://www.sierrabullets.com/product/22-caliber-63-gr-smp/
I have read many here say they have had success on medium game. But Sierra doesn't specify it for this use.
The 64 grain Power Point is used in the ammo labeled for deer and hogs, so maybe it's a little tougher.

Here's a bullet length list I found. And length is often correlated with ability to stabilize with a certain twist rate.
https://www.jbmballistics.com/ballistics/lengths/lengths.shtml

The Speer 70 grain Semi-Spitzer shows a length of 0.808".
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1010619848
This bullet has a similar design to the lighter 63 SMP and the 64 Power Point. The Sierra is 0.755.

53 grain TSX, 0.792.

Hornady 60 grain Spire Point, 0.750. 55 grain is 0.715.

Nosler 60 grain Partition Spitzer, 0.790.

Nosler 64 grain Partition Protected Point. 0.800.

And the Nosler 55 grain Ballistic Tip is 0.810 inches. Longer than any of the heavier bullets above. So I'm somewhat optimistic.

Edit:

Also found this calculator for stability on JBM. Says between 1.3 and 2.0 is the goal.
https://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.1.cgi

60 grain Hornady SP at 3100 fps in a 12 twist is in the green at 1.412.

63SMP at 3000 fps is green at 1.439

The 53 grain TSX at 3300 fps was below optimum at 1.091

70 grain Speer semi-point at 2750 was just below the green with a 1.280 score. So this would probably be ok at short range.

Yeah, if you are concerned about temp stability you should look at TAC, as Yondering said. It is a spherical also.

As to the 63 Sierra, ask Ingwe for a testimonial.

Give BLC2 a try.

Old school powder but works in MANY cartridges....from .222 to .30-06 and up to the .35 Whelen.

You might be surprised how well it does in both .223 and the .30-30.

Best

Heavy

If looking for temp stability, H322 and Benchmark are both part of the Hodgdon's extreme line. Technically neither is a ball powers, but they are very fine and meter like ball powders.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed.

Starting to look at small grain extruded as an option. Hodgdon Extreme powders in particular for their temp stability.
Also Tac. My local range is a Ramshot dealer. I had thought Tac was only for extra heavy bullets. But looking at the burn rate charts, it is faster than Varget, BL-C(2), W748, CFE-223, and Leverevolution...and close to Benchmark, H335, 2230, and H4895. Also, Sierra lists it as the top hunting load for the 63 SMP.
http://accurateshooter.net/Downloads/sierra223ar.pdf

748 is one of those old school powders, that is still on the market, because it works and works well, in a wide variety of applications.

Thanks for another vote for 748.

What I have learned since starting this thread is there are a lot more powders that work well in the .223 and 30-30 than I had known about. W748 seems to be very popular. And it appears to have lower pressure full loads than many others. But according to Hodgdon load data, BL-C(2) looks to have a little more velocity in the bullet the bullet weights I'm interested in. W748 must have excellent accuracy though, with all those who favor it.

I may just start out with what is easily accessible. I know they had BL-C(2) and CFE-223 at the local Academy. And I can't remember, either H322 or H335. And possibly W748 and Benchmark.
Probably have to order the bullets I want.

Research Ramshot X-Terminator. I think it will check all the boxes for you. I just started playing with this powder in my 30/30. Last week I shot it out to 50 yards with a peep sight in the back and a blade up front and it shot just under 1" for 4 shots. I'm taking it out to 100 yards within a week to confirm my 100-yard trajectory, then I'll probably chase javelina with it a few days after that.

I remember those days, I also started with a Lee WhackaMole for a .30-30.

I have to use this a lot, now.

748 has been good for me in the 30-30. That cartridge was the first rifle round I ever loaded for. I used Sam Fadala's load back in the day, and still do. Puts a 150 grain out of a 20" M94 at 2300+ FPS. The modern made 748 performs identically to a jug I have left from 30 years ago. Winchester did a good job of keeping it consistent.

That's not to say there aren't plenty of new powders that are also great. 748 having worked great for me in no way means other choices won't. Failure to recognize these kinds of facts are one of the most common "behaviour problems" here on 24CF. ;oD

Rex

W 748 here also.....

I've had great success with 748 in the decades
I've been loading. I bought some TAC when
748 was scarce here, but never got to do any
extensive experimenting so far. It does look
pretty good though. Just me- I never had
the great success with Lever that everybody
reported. It was ok, but not as consistently
accurate as 748 for me.
Good Luck

Leverloution does both 223 heavier bullets and all 30-30 well. If you want temp stability and better with lighter 223 go 8208xbr but you'll give up a bit of speed on 30-30.

Bb

H335 is spherical powder that will measure about as good. It has a burn rate close to 3031 and that is all I ever used in a 30-30.Years ago 335 was sold as a surplus powder same as the old 4831. It came in a plastic lined paper bag. I loaded a lot of it in the 30-30, but also in a 30-06, .308, 7.65 Argentine Instructions that came with it said to use 3031 loading data. As mentioned BlC-2 will work too.

With today's short supplies, you might have to use what you can find. Work on finding primers first. , Bullets are a lot easier to find, and you can compromise on the powder type