How do you do, Hunting Optics readers? I come humbly seeking your collective wisdom for a new project.

I picked up a Howa barreled action from Brownell's in 6.5 PRC (24" sporter contour) that I'm dropping into one of the blemished carbon fiber stocks that Stocky's is selling. New territory for me all around—action, cartridge, stock.

In fact, this project is a deliberate attempt to explore new territory. I've been somewhat of a traditionalist, running traditional cartridges in traditionally American hunting-style rifles with lightweight 1" SFP scopes of modest magnification for the whole of my existence. Just like my dad did, and his dad before him, etc. Can't say I've been unhappy living this life, but I believe there's value in stepping outside of one's comfort range now and again, even if it ends in spectacular failure. I can always retreat back to safety; my 270 isn't going anywhere.

So here's what I'm thinking I want to do with the glass on this gun:

-higher power (top end of 15-20x or so)
-bigger tube (30 mm—a 34 mm tube and 56 mm objective looks g.d. ridiculous and I'm not going there)
-FFP (!)
-A reticle with useful stuff on it, preferably in milliradians because let's face it, base 10 makes sense
-exposed turrets, matching angular units of reticle
-possibly illuminated

In keeping with the purpose of this rifle (mostly hunting, mostly deer and antelope, mostly on the glorious unbroken prairies of the northern Great Plains), I would like to keep this scope under 2 lbs and it needs to have ergonomics appropriate to the task. My other sideboard—this being an experiment and all—is that I want to spend < $1000.

Scopes I've been ogling include:

Sightron S-TAC 3-16x42 FFP - Mil-hash
Sightron S-TAC 4-20x50 FFP - Mil-hash
Meopta Optika6 3-18x50 RD FFP - M-Rad 1 RD
Meopta Optika6 4.5-27x50 RD FFP - M-Rad 1 RD
SWFA SS 3-15x42 - Mil Quad

What am I missing? Pros/cons? Anyone done any side-by-side comparisons of these? I looked through an Optika6 with the M-Rad 1 RD reticle today in my local Sportsman's Whorehouse and thought it looked alright, but peeping employees at 80 yards across the store is hardly a field test. Nobody local carries the S-TAC FFP scopes. Never seen a SWFA SS in the flesh.

I'm also considering going the Picatinny rail route (another first for me--told you I'm serious about leaving everything I know behind) for maximal adjustability with these goofy big scopes that have very little in the way of straight, unadorned tube. Need some advice there, too. I know I can easily drop $250 on a rail and rings, but are there some good quality options for, say, half that?

If you've read this far, thank you for that. And thanks in advance for any useful advice.

Japanese gun, get a Japanese scope. A good one.

I drive a Japanese truck, so there's some poetry in that.

I have the Sightron S-Tac 3-16 FFP mil. I like it a lot overall but the turrets move way too easily. The zero stop takes care of the elevation turret but the windage is problematic.

I agree.Japanese…

Ok, yes, the symmetry appeals to the OCD in me, but is there any more…practical reason for this suggestion? Because actual Japanese-made Sightrons cost a lot more than the S-TACs, and seem more target shooting-oriented. S-TACs are Filipino if I’m not mistaken.

Add Trijicon and Tract to your list of possible suspects. Trijicon has detailed reticle diagrams under “Downloads” on the description pages for each model. Both are made in Japan by LOW IIRC. Tract comes with a zero stop in the box. Trijicons come with two lens covers and a lens pen.

Pay attention to the eye-relief numbers. Some scopes get very tight at high magnification. Tracts seem to have constant, or nearly so, ER.

Tract, SWFA, and Trijicon are available on Amazon, but you should check the main sites for sales, which don’t seem to show up on Bezos World.

Another vote for Trijicon. I now have two and I love those for the money.

I have a Trijicon AccuPoint 3-9x40 and generally like it, so I'm well aware of Trijicons. But the eye relief #s on their higher power scopes, as Pappy alluded to, give me pause. 3.1-3.8" seems to be the norm. That is getting tight, and more concerning (to me) is the 0.7" range between the bottom and top of the magnification range. Maybe this shouldn't be a deal-killer. They seem to have a lot going for them, otherwise.

I'll look into Tract. Thanks for the input, and keep it coming!

a strong vote for TRACT

As someone who does work with Meopta and has used almost everything they make in the field, I will suggest the Optika6 4.5-27x50 RD, Optika6 5-30x56 RD, and a scope that can be had for a discounted price right now, the ZD 6-24x56 RD. The ZD is the best bargain of the bunch right now and will give you the best glass and features for the shooting that you want to do. Best of luck making a decision, there are a lot of great choices. Adding the pic rail is also a great idea, it will definitely make mounting a scope easier and precisely where you need it.

The Tract Toric 2.5-15x44 is a nice looking scope, with a nice looking reticle. But for $200 less, I'm gravitating toward the Optika6 because it doesn't seem like I'm giving up much.

I'm surprised nobody's chimed in on the SWFA SS 3-15x42.

I've only had (2) Optika6's and both were pieces of fhuqking schit. No tracking,repeats or zero retention. 'Course...I bought 'em with my own money. Hint. Fhuqking LAUGHING!

I've multiple SWFA 3-15's,in both SFP and FFP. Never had a mechanical bobble and they get fhuqking flogged on. Hint.



On a Howie,I'd simply go Burris Extreme 2pc flipper bitches(410600's) and SWFA Low 30mm rings. Hint.




The Athlon BTR Gen2 2-12x FFP Mil/Mil Lit Bitches are killer,for killing. For Giggles,the 4-20x version of same,could be argued. Hint.



I muchly prefer the 2-12x. Locking turrets(windage and elevation),mechanical zero stop,great parallax control,35+ Mil's of erector and nice illumination,in a handy parcel. Hint.







Just sayin'.................

What Stick said.

I have the 3-15 SWFA and four 2-12 Athlons.

Both are rugged and good. The Athlon is more intuitive for hunting big game because of the illumination and dot.

The 56mm tube is not ridiculous if you hunt in dark places. If you are in wide open and well lit country, most any scope will do.

I'm sure you're right, but I merely said they look ridiculous. I'm not budging on that.

nor should you....

Tract
I have the meopta 5 3-15 on my dads 300 win mag

Stick, do you recommend the 2-piece bases because of the ejection port clearance? I've never used a full rail, but I could see it getting in the way.

That Athlon BTR Gen2 does have some nice attributes. It's a shame they don't offer that AHMR2 Mil reticle in the 4-20x version—seems like the most functional hunting reticle they offer.

Does the SWFA 3-15x42 have locking turrets? I'm guessing that's a negative, or they'd advertise it.

Tough decision... Thanks again for all the input.

Out of the choices listed i would suggest the SWFA SS. The Sightron MOA reticles are thin for much more than punching paper. You would be better off getting a SIII on sale at Cameraland or getting a STAC in duplex.

The cited 2pc bases will mount low,granting objective clearance with caps,along with nice ring spacing,to hedge a bet. Said rings play nicely,are both low and light,while offering copious surface area on the tube and (6) cap fasteners per each ring. On top of that,the 'port remains clear,to aid in .532" feed/function...as they can want to leave the boltface at odd angles,as compared to .473". The '12x saves a coupla ounces of weight,but with a killer reticle and 35+ Mil's on the erector,"reach" is hardly a problem for killing. Hint.








No joy on 3-15X locking turrets,but soft stops are easily incorporated and I do. Next to a 3-15x here. Hint.



Nothing else has locking turrets,mechanical zero stop,35+ Mil's on the erector,illumination,FFP and a reticle that's so easily discerned through it's zoom range. With a 250yd modest zero,in a modest atmosphere,8 Mils on the reticle is 1150yds. Hint.

Now if this is a Play Toy Giggles Rifle and you've good eyes,you might prefer the '20x and it's finer reticle. For killing,the '12x is simply splendid,amazingly well rounded and FAST. Hint...............

Soft stops? Enlighten me.


(Well, I guess I can stop thinking of nicknames for it.)

This is definitely a Maxwell's gettin' weird rifle project, but if I like it, and the cartridge, I'll drag it along chasing muleys and antelope. Inevitably, and in spite of pre-season visions (delusions?) of 600 yard prone shots with my finger in the wind, that'll involve a lot of shooting inside 150 yards at lower power. So yeah, a practical reticle is a priority.

Well,I reckon if forced to "guess",it'd go like this. Hint.(grin)







Or locking turret caps and mechanical stop. Hint.

Locked.



Unlocked and of course windage behaves same. Hint.



Just sayin'..................

soft stops are garden hose rubber washers.

Check out Vortex Razor LHT 3-15. Perfect zoom range IMO, excellent glass, excellent illuminated reticle (just the center dot lights up, not the whole reticle - which I strongly prefer), locking elevation turret with capped windage, and a really nice size and weight. I have 5 and they have been dialed a bunch and have been perfect.

Haha your talkin about saving a “couple ounces”??? Lmfao😂😂

Follow

What distances do you expect to shoot out to?

How are your eyes?

Trijicon accupoint

Eyes are good. Some of the best parts I have left.

My hope is to get more comfortable with shooting at distances over 300 yards. If I can become confident in my setup and abilities by shooting paper/steel at 500, 600, 700 yards, maybe more, I'll be better equipped to take longer shots on game (I currently consider anything over about 350 yards a long shot on game) when there's no way to get closer. I don't imagine pushing things past about >600 yards on animals, though. I don't want to start an ethics argument, but it seems clear that uncontrollable variables start to take over as you get much beyond that. A lot can happen in a second.

So long story short, distances will be <1000 yards, and hunting distances probably <600 yards.

Are there any Trijicon AccuPoints that meet my criteria, or are you just lobbing names of scopes out there?

The SWFA SS 5-20x is solid and meets your criteria (sample list right around $1000), though it’s a bit big for a hunting rifle. The Bushnell DMRII Pro can likely be found in your price range, and is a great scope, but has 34mm tube and is big and heavy.

If you can find an LRHS or LRTSi 3-12x or 4.5-18x, that would be a great option, as well. I have positive experience with the Trijicon Accupower, but haven’t used the higher magnification models so can’t opine there.

For that type of application, I typically look for an LRHS or grab a SS 3-9x. The SS 3-15x would probably be my choice from the options you’re currently looking at. The lack of reticle subtensions from 0-1 MRAD in the Athlon isn’t ideal, IMO, neither is the MIC origin. Not major issues, but would push me to the SS 3-15x if I couldn’t find a LRHS and 9x wasn’t enough.

SS HD 5-20x MQ. Hint.



DMR II. Hint.



LRHS G2(MUCH prefer G3) '18x. Hint.



LRTS G3 '18x. Hint.



LRTS G3 '12x. Hint.



LRTSi G3 '12x. Hint.



3-15x MQ FFP. Hint.



A wee bit of extrapolation,with a 2-12x FFP Mil/Mil Lit Bitch. Hint.



2-12x compared to 3-15x FFP MQ. Hint.




For killing,pass the 2-12X. The 3-12x G3 LRTSi is Skookum,but not as...due illumination and reticle differences. Hint.

Just saying.....................

Impressive collection, Stick. Size comparison is helpful.

Ok, I'm narrowing it down. I just looked through a LRHS 4.5-18x44 with, I believe, the G2 reticle at a local shop. Liked the scope all around, and really liked the reticle. $999.99, NOS. They have 2 of them.

However, I also have a line on a used SWFA SS 3-15x42 Mil-Quad for quite a lot less.

Is the LRHS that much better? I'm kinda frugal, and I'm kinda leaning toward the SS.

Side by each extrapolations,never ain't not handy. Hint.(grin)

My first LRHSi '18x (G2),was a steaming pile of fhuqking schit. Hint.








A pard wanted out of a 2nd one,for $400,so I rolled them dice. It behaves. Bushy offered ZERO intel on the maladies of the first(above) and flung me an LRTSi '18x. All of my LRTS/LRTSi's and DMR II's have been fhuqking exceptional and the 3-12x LRTSi Gen 3 STEALS the show. Hint.

I MUCH prefer the 2-12x to both. Hint...................

I Had the same experience with one Bushy LRHSi. The elevation dial just locked up - complete failure. Bushnell also sent me a LRSTi - no answers as to why the failure. I bought mine from GAP and I think the later models had poorer QC - at least that is my theory. The rest of my LRHS's have been stellar. Solid bargain.

I'm not oblivious to your hints, and everything about that Athlon makes sense. If it were made anywhere else, one would already be in the mail. Objection's got nothing to do with the quality or design of the product.

Yes, I'm typing this on a Chinese-made keyboard—I'm aware. No choice there.

'Bout to push the SS 3-15x42 button...

I'm simply a Realist and it's a Global Economy. Athlon is upfront and Reupold and the ilk,ain't. It is,what it is. Hint.





Locking turrets and illumination,sure are soothin'. Hint...............

I'd pull the trigger on that LRHS. Yes, the LRHS is better than the SS - not because it's more reliable (I think both are about on par in that regard) - but because it has a better feature set. Stellar zero stop, low-profile elevation turret and capped windage, for starters. I also really like the G2H reticle (it's a preference thing). I've had a bunch of LRHS/LRTS/DMR/XRS/etc., and I've yet to have a tracking or zero retention issue. I think Stick's tracking problem was pretty darn rare.

You could always buy both that LRHS and SS and sell the one you like least.

Also, keep in mind that the size comparison in Stick's picture shows the LRHS and LRTS scopes with sunshades installed, making them look longer than they are.

Oh, and in terms of mounting I'd simply go with a pic rail with appropriate inclination and a set of Burris XTR Signature Med rings.

'18x LRHS here on newest 223 CTR(20"),I slapped together the other day. Hint.



I've LOTSA Bushy Faith,in all of their good stuff that ain't LRHS/i's. Hint...............(grin)

Spent primers teach lessons, for sure. I'll point out that the LRHS and LRTS are two peas in a pod, with slightly different makeup. The LRHS/LRTS/DRMII/DMRII Pro/XRSII have been dead-nuts reliable for me for thousands of rounds and a bunch of cooked barrels. I think that first LRHS you had was an anomaly. In fact, your failure and the one reported by Akbob5 above are the only two cases of LRHS/LRTS failures that I can recall.

Having said that, I much prefer the 3-12x version to the 4.5-18x, but they're getting pretty tough to find these days.

BTW, I figured you had a pic squirrelled away somewhere of a LRHS/LRTS 4.5-18x without the sunshade.

If I have a LRHS dazzle,I'll of course report same. Hint.(grin)




It woulda been a BUNCH warmer/fuzzier,had they simply related what they found. Hell...even Reupold does that. Hint.................

Huh. Ok. Answer me this: do they have it priced right? Would you spend $1000 on an LRHS?

Not for me. If it was $500,I'd buy a 2-12x instead of. Hint...........

My finger is not on the pulse of the US market for these scopes, but I have paid $1000+ Canuck Bucks several times.

Haha, if the 2-12x had a reticle that extended to the center and was not MIC, I'd probably own a bunch of them by now. But that's just me and my hang-ups.

Midway had DMR II's thusly,last year and they DESTROY the LRHS. Hint.



The 2-12's reticle,is simply sensational for Killing. None of my Anschutzeseseses or Vudoohoo's wear one,for KYL. Hint....................(grin)

142yds on 12x,out the kitchen window. Hint.




1137yd on 12x snag,from the front porch. Hint.



I'd shoot more,but have PPV brewing. I'm not sure,what Critter could possibly "escape"?!? Hint.................(grin)

3-18x50, 4-24x50, 4-16x50

Wilder granted my $75 PPV bill and Caleb's KO mighta' even been better. Hint.

As to Trijicon Accu's,it's tough to swoon SFP,schit reticles,50mm obj,a minimum of 27 ounces and only 60 MOA on the erector. Hint.

Fhuqking LAUGHING!..............