US Army Chooses Leupold Mark 5HD for Sniper Use

The army doesn't read the 'fire optics forum apparently.

Mark 5 is probably one of the better scopes Leupold has made. It even got better reviews than the Mark 6.

Crazy!

😎

I wonder how much the unit cost is.

How good!???

How do snipers use these? Twisting turrets. According to the thread below this they don't track. Shame on the military for choosing sub par optics.

Its not the Mark5's that so many have issues with. Its every model underneath that

I'm sure they were well tested by the Army before they awarded Leupold a contract.

Mark 5 is a great scope.

Someone should let the military know.

Don't know anything about military procurement procedures or testing. I do suspect that "low bidder" plays into it at some point. Also your tv, on a daily basis, is showing legal advertising for cases involving thousands of sub standard earplugs issued to US troops in the sandbox. How hard is it to build a decent earplug? Military use is no gauge of quality in my opinion. Morton-Thiokol O-rings may ring a bell with some people.

Well they undoubtedly follow this site, and will no doubt be making changes based on the comments here.

I particularly enjoyed Leupold's "Combat Competition Hunter reticle" moniker.

😂😂😂 it just keeps getting better!!!!Haha

Thank God the Marines don't use the Leupolds.

S&Bs with a Gen2 mil on the .308s & more recently a NF with a Horus on the .300WM, last time I saw the as-issued platforms in CONUS.

What? No Super Snipers?

Super Snipers?

The top confirmed shots are by the Canucks & Brits these days, but that's a fluid dynamic, given the heftier calibers used.

One hopes that the Army with the newly acquired Combat Competition Hunter reticle on the Leupy will be able to make full use of their existing heavy cals & catch up ;-)

Cool! Don't think I'll be trying one of these out immediately though. $2500 scope might be out of place on my Salvage.

You hit the nail square on the head! Politics has a lot to do with the selection process as well. Listen to the Kifarucast Podcast with Josh Cleghorn and Butch Whiting from Kryptek #253. They discuss this very process in the Podcast. I am not criticizing nor praising Leupold, just the fact is the process is so flawed and bias.

20 pages....

Nah, 40 at least.

The Marines may have a chance...

$2400 markup on the "Combat Competition Hunter reticle" on $100 worth of cams/gears.

Took a gander through this scope a little while back. The "edge to edge clarity" at max mag is a pipe dream at best. I have better glass on $300 70 year old fixed 4x scopes.

Besides, 35mm tubes do not guarantee a repeatable wide adjustment range, except for a couple manufacturers.

Glad they chose domestic

why on earth would you buy this over a nightforce

Because the MK5s are lighter and cost less while performing very well.

I have not shot the 5-25 MK5 but have played with the 3.6-18 MK5 quite a bit.

I much prefer the MK5 to the 4-16 NF ATACR.

That said it still suffers all the problems inherent to FFP reticle placement.

OMG don't say that, you just kicked an ant pile. don't you know if its not FFP the scope is junk. but lets also remember you used to sell leupold scopes. I would have to test the crap out of it to say if its any good, trust but verify, but right now I don't trust

I still sell Leupold scopes so the bias is still worth mentioning.

Dang knuckle dragging pipe liner.

Bad enough that you convinced me to use Barnes copper solids all those years back, rather than Partitions.

How ya been, kid? All well with you & yours?

Doing well! Just getting ready to hit the hills chasing Yogi

How you been?

yo john, why don't you post the video of that 1000 something yard coyote kill, I mean how in the actual hell did you shoot that thing with a hunk of junk useless SFP scope. according to the forums here you can't hit the broadside of a barn unless the scope is FFP. you can't shoot it without a new fangled christmas tree FFP reticle, its basically taking a pee into the wind.

But then you are going to get mad at me because it was a Leupold scope.

I am in a no win situation.

I've had my own issues with Leupo, but hope the guys and gals there have the ship turned around with the Mark 5. I'd love to start supporting the local company again.

Jordan,

I don't know about the US Marines, but a friend within the US military told me regular Army is getting the Mark 5, while special units are still getting the ATACR per another contract. He also said they have a special version with BEAST turrets, that will eventually be available to the consumer market.

One of those special units has a Mark 5 that has had extensive testing, and was deemed good-to-go. According to him, they were impressed by that scope, but still leery since it's a Leupold. Over the years he's told me about the problems they've had with Leupolds. I think one Mark 6 was on display for awhile, as a joke. The turret mechanism came off.

NF and Bushnell are still the most popular scopes on their work and personal rifles. These are not regular .mil guys.

I'm hoping Formi chimes in. Maybe he has more info.

Jason

I still own a couple of Leupy's but don't dial them much. I do still like 'em though.

When I go hunting whitetails up in the TX Panhandle, sometimes I get to go watch Todd Hodnett & Co shoot, What a treat it is to watch snipers from all over the world shoot under instruction from the best sniper trainer on the planet. For some serious fun on their off days, they come shoot prarie dogs at 1000m, in the ever present Panhandle winds (which is why they train up there in the first place). They don't hit the "dogs on the first shot every time, but that 2nd shot......... Funny thing is that whether they are Canadians, Israelis, Rangers, Seals, or whatever, I've yet to see the first Leupold scope, and I've yet to see the first SFP of any brand.

I've also gotten to see a fella named David Tubb shoot some, as he's on a neighboring ranch as well. As even you two knuckleheads know, he's the most accomplished long range competitive shooter in history, and it's not real close (what, 11-12 Camp Perry's?). Funny thing is, I've yet to see the first Leupold on any of his rifles either, or SFP.

Have at it though, as it doesn't matter to me one iota what a guy uses, and I'm sure you two boys know more than Hodnett and Co, and David Tubb.

yeah well, I can give you crap about leupold, but make no mistake there is no substitute for experience on public lands and practical long range hunting, vs half the wanna bees who tote a 20# chassis gun, 100 yards from their truck to shoot off a fake barricade at their local gun range. there is you, huskemaw and g7, which are the only guys who really tried to sell purpose built long range hunting scopes. none of them were ever FFP. Sadly the market isn't really there either for them its all about looking the part of a seal team 6 operator. with a 3 pound 40 mm tube scope.

The MK6 was literally designed under SMU weight and length restrictions.

Had to be short enough for clip on IR/NV units.

Leupold was the only manufacturer that could meet the spec.

MK6 is a complicated build.

Formey chiming in would be 24hr Gold.

burns, and cummins, AKA real western hunters vs the FFP crowd. john, show us some video of the mules, ya know mule guys and horse guys aren't supposed to like one another. maybe we should argue about that.

You are pretty dumb.

Tubb literally only sells Leupold scopes with his goofy reticle.

How is it possible to be so wrong?


http://www.davidtubb.com/dtr-scopes

He may sell 'em, but he ain't using them when he get serious, at least on the days I was with them.


BTW Burns, Hodnett's never heard of you. I'm not surprised.

That's interesting JohnB, thanks for the info. That scope is very light, compared to other short/fast scopes like the DMR.

Jason

Well that sure is a great indicator of integrity.

LOL.

I bet that is a hoot, JGR. I'd imagine that there are a lot of 5-25 and 7-35 ATACR scopes?

Jason

Me too Jason. How much are the scopes in question and are they any good?

Mostly that's what they had 4th point. There were some others that were NF of some model but I don't know what they were. There were a scattering of S&B's but not many. Some of their "cheap" stuff was Bushy HDMR, DMR stuff. They all had LaRue detachable mounts though. What is downright unbelievable is the nightvision/infrared optics they have that the avg Joe can't buy. Evidently when a mare is pregnant their body temp increases, at least that's what they said, and I verified it with my veterinarian friend as well. Anyway, they could take their binos in pitch black and tell if a mare was pregnant waaaaay out there. He said if they marketed those to the public they would be in the $60k range.

John, dont pay any attention to jg. That mother fu cker doesnt know his azz from a hole in the ground. He thinks bone stock tikkas are the best thing since sliced bread. Ive invited him over to the moa all day long challenge here many times, but hes better off flapping his ridiculous lips, like his buddy slm. 2 good for nothing sobs that bring absolutely nothing to most threads here.

Paper Queen, I had my feelings taken out with my tonsils when I was 6 yrs old. Otherwise that would have hurt. Keep swingin' though, it's very entertaining.

Lawrence,

I don't know who has the best deal, but I see that the consumer Mark 5 are discounted at many online sites.

I'm actually hoping for improvements across the different product lines. I was listening to one of the product managers at Leupo, who said that they are trying to make improvements but Leupold has become a slow moving ship. People want to make changes, but it just takes time. I can buy that. Leupold wants to be all things to all people, and a business like that may not be able to react as quickly as companies like NF or Tangent Theta, who are specialized for the most part.

Jason

BSA's name is Lawrence?

Apparently they never read formidous posts ?

That's a pretty safe bet.

Thanks for the info, JGR.

Very interesting as my buddy says the same about S&B getting phased out, and LaRue mounts getting a lot of love. The LaRue comment cracked me up, as that has been an ongoing discussion we've had.

He also says that a lot of those special unit dudes apparently love the HDMR/DMR, and are willing to take them anywhere in the world for work. They're an old designs, and don't get much love by recreational shooters anymore, but are still highly regarded. I think Tom Fuller led that project for a scope for .mil use, after his time at AMU, and it seems to have gone well after all these years.

What I find interesting, is that I don't get any feedback or info on the LRTS scopes. They seem to be completely off their radar. I thought it might be due to OAL for NV, but the 3-12x LRTS is a short scope.

Jason


.

Jason, I may be up there trying to shoot a turkey and some pigs this weekend. Next time I run into TH I'll ask him his opinion on the LRTS and LRHS for that matter. I'd be curious to know myself.

You Chuckleheads understand that Billy G got the mount contract, right?

JohnB, I'm referring to dudes that buy and use what they want. That said, I don't know anything about the Billy G contract.

Can you fill us in on the details?

Thanks,

Jason

That'd be great. I'd love to hear what you find. Good luck on the turkey birds.

J

I’d go along with this statement. ^^^^^^.

Several months back, I missed buying a ANIB Mark 5 that I could have snapped up for $1250.00. I was on that Leupold fence, thinking $1250 for a possible tracking issue, or $1250 for a NF SHV F1.

Glad to hear the Mark 5 is a decent scope. 😎

Beaver,

Out of the local options to us in Oregon, Leupo, SIG, and Crimson Trace, I'm still rooting for Leupo

You may already know this, but several of the Leupo guys went across town to Blount to wait out their non-compete agreements, then went to SIG Electro-Optics. I'm not sure if they were part of the problem, the solution, or neutral in terms what was going on in Beaverton. I don't have a background in optical design, so don't know.

However, it would be interesting to see what scopes were designed by the defectors, and what has come from new blood if anything.

Maybe ILya can shed some light on this.

J

I do know that I've gotten good feedback on the military version of the SIG Tango6T.

On the flipside, two SIG Kilos that my bud's have gotten can't keep up with my old Leica 1600b. One replacement still sucks. Haven't seen the other yet.

Obviously the military T6T and consumer LRF are different animals.

4th point: I do to!
Great choice there, Army.
Buy American.
Long live Leupold & Stevens Incorporated!
A fine American company.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Bsa’, keep posting target pics adnauseam and patting yourself on the back, it’s all you’ve got.

yeah, its not like the US Army decided to piss off 24 hour campfire, by purchasing Leupold Scopes on contract..

good for Leupold !

Hey J, just saw this, for some reason I don't get email notifications for threads anymore, and don't see where the option to enable them is.

Not too shabby, been playing around with an old 7x57R, lots of fun stomping around the lake pretending to be grumpy!

Oh...and it loves 120gr TTSX's a hair over 3", go figure.

Almost mounted one of my mini Hubble FFP Henny's on it, but couldn't decide whether the 34mm or 35mm would look uglier, so I slapped on a period vintage 4x, been rediscovering the joys of a German #1 after all these years.

I meant to pick yer brains on a couple "Scout" rifles that I haven't handled yet, need to take a young 'un to get his very first rig.

I'll take this over to PM/text.

Good luck & have fun with that Yogi...I hear today's Level 3 clad bruins don't go down unless you step up to well above a .338 cal ;-)

About the poor reliability of the Mark 5? Pretty sure no one has read those posts by Form, because they don't exist.

I too was aware that some of the design guys headed across town. It’s was supposed to be some of the better team members that left and found a home at Sig.

I dove headfirst into first base with this knowledge and bought a couple Whiskey5 hunting scopes and a Tango6 scope that was like new.

I was feeling pretty sexy about the scope buys with knowledge of the Exodus of team Leupold until Form crushed my dreams by saying they’re almost junk.

I kept the Whiskey5 scopes, but moved them to varmint rigs. So, far no lenses have fallen out, but I’ve got only a little under 200 rounds fired underneath both scopes combined. The Whiskey5 is or was Sigs highend hunting scope.

I sold the Tang6 scope because the reticle was duplex. That T6 scope was a heavy girl and all levers and knob functionality was very good to excellent.

I actually sent the Tango6 scope to one of our hardcore LR member shooters with the instructions to use the scope however he wanted, except as a hammer...

The member had it for 4-5 months and said it seemed like a solid scope with good glass. He hated the duplex windshield obviously, aside from that, he didn’t find any tracking issues with it.

😎

That's rich! John Burns has posted proof of himself being a successful "real western hunter". You've posted one picture of one coyote...

I got to spend some time with a platoon from Team 5 in 2002. What they had then was scary awesome and just as expensive. Can't imagine what they have now....

I was fascinated with their gear teal, for sure. That's been a year and a half ago too. I will also say that the Seals and Rangers I was around, although relatively briefly, would dang sure make you proud to be an American. Unlike some of these clowns around here like BSA who loves to run his mouth and post numerous pics of his paper punching prowess, these guys demanded respect by the way they carried themselves, conversed, and mingled with an avg Joe like me. Those Israelis, I was told, were just stone cold killers and didn't care what anyone had to say about it, showing little emotion. Which reminds me......one of those Israeli guys was commenting about the onslaught of these Central Americans and Illegals demanding entry into our country seeking asylum. He says...."you know how we handle that where I'm from? We issue Ruger 10/22's and shoot the first liners in the kneecaps. That sort of takes the desire of entering our country away from the ones behind them". He had a good point.

The gentlemen met and were friends with in the TEAMS were all very professionals in that regard. Good dudes. Some better than others - everyone has their own personality but I enjoyed my time with them over a year or so. Was fortunate to have that experience. One guy, was a former BUDs instructor loved to say "Why be a Volkswagon when you CAN be a Ferrari" - I pointed out he drove a 75 Bronco, neither one of those things...

Good dude, none were "Hollywood" with us at all.

I’m sure many on here are waiting to hear from the Oracle of Form’ before they run their little necks out on this one! LMAO 😂

LOL

(snip)

The MK6 was literally designed under SMU weight and length restrictions.

Had to be short enough for clip on IR/NV units.

Leupold was the only manufacturer that could meet the spec.

MK6 is a complicated build.

Formey chiming in would be 24hr Gold. [/quote]

I'm going to disagree with the bolded statement above. While the MK5 maybe the one that Leupold produced to fit those specs, they are not the only manufacturer able to do that. Not by a long shot. They may be the only American manufacturer, but not the only one in the world.

I'm not sure why it's germane to say the MK6 is a complicated build, since we are talking about the Mark5 here.

For instance, March has a scope that is superior in almost every way compared to the Mk5 5-25X56. This scope is the March-FX 5-42X56. Right away, you see that it has a greater magnification range with an 8.2x zoom, compared to the 5x zoom the mk6,
The March-FX is 14.1 inches long compared to the 15.67 inch of the Mk5.
The March-FX is 33 oz compared to the 30oz of the Mk5, but is has features not found on the Mk5 than could be removed to lower the weight some, and 3 ounces is not "significant."
The March-FX has 140MOA of elevation adjustment compared to the 120MOA of the Mk5.
The March-FX has 14MIL of windage compared to the 17.5MIL of the Mk5.

The March-FX has a 26 degree eyepiece that provides 30% more FOV at any magnification compared to standard riflescopes like the Mk5. For instance at 100 yards @ 5X, the FOV for the March-FX is 26.19ft. At the same distance and setting the Mk5 has an FOV of 20.5 feet. This will be the same at all magnifications, well, up to 25X because that's where the MK5 stops while the March-FX keeps on going to 42X.

Now, Schmidt & Bender have introduce a similar scope the S&B 5-45X56 High Power. It's a little longer than the Mk5 at 17.1 inch and 39 ounces, so it's possible that's what you're thinking about.

I'm actually glad that the US Army has selected an American scope, but let's be real when talking about the competition.