At 7:15 this morning I was covered up with deer. Sitting in blind I took my 1st shot. Sounded like a cap gun, not igniting powder. I snapped 5 or 6 on same doe. I drove 20 miles to my house to grab a newer Knight that uses a shot gun primers. Back in blind by 10:00, ten minutes later had a buck on the ground. I know my old mk85 is a good shooter, and it was clean. Could these percussion caps be so old they went bad? I hear em go off, but it's hit or miss igniting powder.

if the Caps are going off and not igniting the powder I would lean toward the nipples plugged up

No, your gun is f-ed up. Either the nipple is clogged or the "flash channel" between the cap and the powder charge is clogged. Or the powder is contaminated because you didn't pre-clean the gun before loading it. I would start out with a nipple pick trying to unclog the nipple. If that doesn't work, remove the nipple and poke a few granules of powder down into the hole under the nipple, then reinstall the nipple, add a cap, and fire it. (Edit to add: note that the gun is going to make more flash and boom when it goes off doing this because you'll have powder burning where powder ain't really supposed to burn, so use safety goggles / watch your eyes for flying bits of percussion cap.) Or, if you have a CO2 discharger, discharge the ball/powder, then clean the gun properly.

Rather than snapping a cap or two as is most folks' practice before loading (to clear oil, etc out of the flash channel), I usually just give it a good shot of CO2 before loading. This clears the passage without leaving caustic residue to attract moisture from the air. By doing that, I don't have to give the gun a full cleaning if I don't actually fire it, I can just clear the charge with CO2, then swab a few times with a dry patch.

Nipple was clean. It actually shot on 7th cap as a doe was headed over the ridge. Was a miss, 8th try it wouldn't ignite again. That's when I got pissed, and left to get the newer Knight.

When I load my Thompson Renegade, I’ll load the powder/projectile, then I screw the nipple and see if I can see any powder granules in the hole where it goes. I also make sure I can see through the hole in the nipple. If so, it’ll fire. If not, I’ll sprinkle a few granules of powder in there and then replace the nipple.

If you heard the cap “pop!”, it did it’s job.

Yep.

If they are popping, they are not bad. Could be bad powder or a clogged flash channel.

Also, make sure to get all the solvents/oils out of the barrel before loading.

Yep. It will deactivate the powder.

I went last Sunday, and came home with the flu. It stayed loaded all week until today. It gave me a fit at the range trying to set scope. Cleaned it well, back to range and 4 shots no problem to set scope. It was clean this morning as far as I know. I'm gonna start using the newer Knight anyways. Got a buck at the processor, and sitting here eating dinner. Everything worked out, just wondering why I'm getting intermittent ignition.

Use a rifle that doesn't need a cap. It's called a "flintlock". I quit shooting percussion rifles over 20 years ago, and I've never had a problem with the rifle failing to fire. The myth about flinters being slow and unreliable is a shooter's problem, not the rifle's.

My dad died last year, and I'd got most of his guns over here. I hadn't brought his muzzleloader, but his box of supplies with primers was here. I had to go to mom's, get his muzzleloader, to my house 20 miles away to get primers, back to blind. It all worked out well, just an interesting morning.

I only use musket caps/nipple.

What powder are you using?

2 Pyrodex pellets. No problem out of newer gun with 209 primers

Missed a dandy buck to a hang fire a few yrs ago due to cheap 209 primers I switched to a hot federal mag primer and haven’t had the issue after

As far as sidelocks go my old man pulled the bullet and dumped the powder after the days hunt he had a similar experience same stand ginormous buck

I had a problem with Remington #11 caps that were several years old and would not regularly fire. I switched over to CCI caps and problem solved.

Wait a sec dude.
Pyrodex pellets in a side lock???

That's why.
You got no powder under the nipple in.the flash channel.
Pyrodex pellets are meant to be center ignited .
Not loose powder side ignited.

Those pellets also have like a 5gr ring around the base that is supposed to lite off easier.
Kinda like a distinct darker colored line of it.

A musket cap will touch one off if center ignited like the older knights ignition system

209 primer in the newer knights and older ones with 209 conversion will ignite pellets.
Even with some very early inline guns center ignited with # 11 caps are not meant for pellets.
Some early Austin and Halleck guns IIRC were inline # 11 ignited.
Some of those guns predate pellets and are meant for loose powder only.
A #11 is not very hot or its flame pattern really concentrated.

Side lock with a percussion cap and pelllets????
That is your problem if it is what was going on from what I understand now.

Side locks need loose powder to fill the flash channel under the nipple.
Flame under nipple hit powder under and lites off the flash channel filled with powder in its 90° turn to main charge in barrel.

If your loading pellets into a side lock

That cap flame has nothing to ignite for probably almost 1/2 to
3/ 4 ths inch in the flash chamber.
And it might not even be around that little booster charge ring for ignition of a pellet due to actual breech design recess and that pellet booster ring setting slightly behind the actual flash hole into the barrel.



Dunno ...
I might have read this wrong in pellets in a sidekick and misunderstood you.

Yeah, no pellets. Musket caps still work better.

I used remington # 11,s in my TC renegade 50 for 16 yrs.
Any cap with a darker area in the middle was not used.
Any cap where the green explosive had a line around its circumference where it dried and shrank off the walls of its cap was not used.
Only ones I used had a consistent green shade across it all and no shrink lines off the wall.
Learned it during range sessions.
Started examining caps.

Probably about 20 25 out of 100 would get tossed out of a new tin

Never had a misfire, always made sure I had powder directly under niple with nipple wrench, in crapola weather I would wrap a baggie over the capped nipple and tie it off in front of trigger gaurd.
Snip off excess with small pair of scissors.

I am no guru on this subject. but knowing that I would say you were still blocked with grease oil or something and finally heated up and burn out. what little I know about old black powder stuff is more limited to the revolvers. and anytime you get one out that's been cleaned and put away properly you want to fire a cap or two through it before you ever load it to clean the grease and oil out of the nipples and cylinders...

It's an inline knight I was having trouble with. One I killed deer with was newer break open knight with 209 primers. Would post pic, but you know I haven't figured it out yet.

4-F BP priming powder doesn't need a blowtorch to light it off. A flinter loaded with 3-F in the chamber and a well-tuned lock and a sharp flint will fire about one time out of 5 tries with NO powder in the flash pan.

Caps not the issue. Nipple or contaminants. Check your pellets. Check to see if the nipple can be easily seen through.

Ok now that is cleared up.

An older one with # 11 ignition system???
Does it have a conversion nipple for musket caps same thread into breech as the # 11 nipple???

Those pellets are meant to be loaded dark igniter ring down to flame source also.
Could you have loaded the 1st one backwards???

You still have a jump to the base of that pellet depending on internal breech design.
That gun was around before pellets and is meant for powder.
It probably has a recessed breech to hold powder right next to the base of the nipple like a deep half moon.
And that gap is dissipating the flame from a #11 when with powder it would be filled up and instant ignition.

Hence the half moon scrapers that are used to clean that recessed area in most powder guns side locks and inlines.


Straight 209 is the way with any pellet.


A nipple pick between shots is a good thing also.

Those early and mid 80,s knight inlines over the course of a decade had like 3 or 4 conversion kits for the ignition systems made after market and factory for em
11,s to musket cap
11,,s to 209,s
Musket caps to 209s
Breech plug adapters for pellets with 209,s IIRC.

Seen the whole evolution of it at grandpa,s store in clarksville .
Probably had like a 10 or 12 ft aisle just filled up with knight ml parts and kits.


Think midsouth shooters supply even carry,s some knight ml stuff still.

Yup, the channel is either plugged or to narrow.

Finally figured out how to resize pic, but don't know how to get it from gallery to here.[img]http://17707553[/img]

I got a thumb hole knight wolverine that uses the red things over a nipple for 209s.Pure bad ass muz ldr I retired after the trigger wouldn’t work for some odd reason.I found my encore used with leupold heavy duplex for $350 😉 and never looked back

I once had a patch role on me and covered the touch hole

It was on a Rock gun not a cap gun but it would do the same.

We ended up fusing the hole by packing 7F powder into the touch hole creating that fuse effect

put some powder in the pan and everyone stepped way back while I let the Rock hit the Frisson
And



WWWWWWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHH
BOOM
Gun was cleared


Anything obstructing the touch hole can block enough spark that will not ignite the powder making a non shot

Sucks when you have something in your sights.

Hope you figure out what caused the misfire.

Are you using Black powder or one of the newer types?

I had problems with Jim Shocky's gold crap.

Went back to black and had no problems.

No offense

Pellets suck balls……and ass


How old were they and did you pack ‘shiny side’ down on?

And how old were your primers?

As for #11 caps, been 25 years since shot those little pos things. I learned to always get a fresh tin every fall. The remington brand had a little crappy ‘foil’ like cup that flake off and block the flash hole if you kept them for a couple years.

I most certainly would not use pellets on a sidelock percussion. Granular only.

Went smokeless 2010 for those reasons of garbagy muzzleloader powder and products.

Do they make Black Powder in pellet form? Because ya know…in the body of the thread he said pellets.

Im assuming pyrodex, substitute

Well i guess i just missed that.

Must try better next time.

Great post.

Pure genius.

That’s ok

It happens…

EVERY
FOUCKING
THREAD


👍😃🤨