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Posted By: org_Rogue_Hunter Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
What books/authors are recommended reading about civil war? Not only the war, but the underlying reasons, and politics, behind it? What about Shelby Foote?
Posted By: Pappy348 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
I picked up Foote’s trilogy in hardcover at a yard sale about 30 years ago, for $6 IIRC. Knew of him from the tv series on PBS. Took a while to digest, but I liked it a lot.
Posted By: william_iorg Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Lincoln and the Tools of War by Robert Bruce is interesting.
Posted By: Borchardt Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by william_iorg
Lincoln and the Tools of War by Robert Bruce is interesting.

Lincoln was a statist pig and got what he had coming.
Posted By: MAC Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Before he died U.S. Grant wrote his memoirs. It is a good read because he writes about the decisions he made with the info he had at the time. History has a habit of second guessing decisions decades after they happen based on info that came out long after the fact. As a military leader Grant had to make quick decisions as events were happening.

In his memoirs he talks about both the good and the bad decisions and why he made the decisions he did. He doesnt apologize or make excuses. He owns up to the bad (such as the 2nd assault at Cold Harbor) and accepts responsibility.

I fully suggest this be read by anybody interested in the Civil War. It is too bad that Lee never wrote his memoirs so we can get his side as well.
Posted By: rainshot Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
"The myth of the Lost Cause" Edward Bonekemper is pretty good. It is footnoted and researched with primary source material.
Posted By: JoeBob Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
A Disease in the Public Mind: A New Understanding of Why We Fought the Civil War


https://www.amazon.com/Disease-Public-Mind-Understanding-Fought/dp/0306822954
Posted By: IndyCA35 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by Pappy348
I picked up Foote’s trilogy in hardcover at a yard sale about 30 years ago, for $6 IIRC. Knew of him from the tv series on PBS. Took a while to digest, but I liked it a lot.

I was amazed at how young all the generals were back then. Lee, the "Old Man," was only 57. He had two heart attacks (maybe more) during the war. After Gettysburg he wanted to resign but Davis wouldn't let him.
Posted By: IndyCA35 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by william_iorg
Lincoln and the Tools of War by Robert Bruce is interesting.

I like the story about Christopher Spencer showing up at the White House with a Spencer rifle and firing it with Abe Lincoln on the White House lawn.
Posted By: sawbuck Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Shelby is top shelf along with Bruce Catton. I would start with Army of the Potomac trilogy.
Making a list. Thanks so far.
Posted By: renegade50 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by Pappy348
I picked up Foote’s trilogy in hardcover at a yard sale about 30 years ago, for $6 IIRC. Knew of him from the tv series on PBS. Took a while to digest, but I liked it a lot.
This...
It can be reread again and again and again....
Posted By: CGPAUL Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
I would 2nd Grants book.

Interesting in how many Union political favors/appointee Generals became Cluster Fugs..
Posted By: AcesNeights Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
I’ve always liked Shelby Foote. He was, to my mind, the quintessential southern Gentleman. Intelligent and well spoken with the strong air of empathy and understanding was how I saw Mr. Foote and I was saddened when he passed.

There are countless great books about the Civil War but Grants Memoirs deserve another endorsement. It’s been years since I’ve read it and beyond time for me to read them again. I just started Supreme Commander by Stephen Ambrose about Dwight Eisenhower so after I’m done with this one I think I’ll begin on Grants Memoirs again.

These threads are always illuminating. The suggestions are for the OP but us readers are the winners of these great suggestions. 👍🏼

ETA…Mark Twain spent quite awhile with Grant and stayed with him to help him finish writing his memoirs. Iirc Mark Twain spent around a month living with the Grants and he said that U.S. Grant was driven to finish his memoirs despite the substantial pain he was dealing with. He’d bitten into a peach a month or so earlier, his favorite treat, and said he felt a sharp sting in the back of his throat. That was the first indication that he had throat cancer. He chewed and smoked upwards of 2 dozen cigars a day. After his picture in the paper showed him with a cigar people from all over sent him boxes and boxes of the best cigars.
Posted By: ltppowell Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
The Civil War: A Narrative

Shelby Foote
Posted By: clockwork_7mm Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Check out:

Pryor's Reading the Man: A Portrait of Robert E. Lee (examines Lee through his own correspondence)

Paludan's Victims (about the Shelton Laurel Massacre)

Wiley's The Life of Johnny Reb and The Life of Billy Yank (classic soldier studies)

Cozzens's Shenandoah 1862 (Jackson's Valley Campaign)

Alford's Fortune's Fool (a very well done and interesting bio of John Wilkes Booth)

Freeman's Lee's Lieutenants

Nelson's The Three-Cornered War (about the war in the Far West and Indian involvement in the Civil War)

Faust's This Republic of Suffering (about death and how Americans adjust to unprecedented loss of life away from home)

Potter's The Impending Crisis (if you really want to understand the politics of the sectional crisis and the lead up to secession, this one is old but still holds its ground)
Posted By: clockwork_7mm Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by CGPAUL
I would 2nd Grants book.

Interesting in how many Union political favors/appointee Generals became Cluster Fugs..

Both sides had a fair number of appointees. In many cases, they're weeded out of important roles before the campaigns in '64-65. (You could also make a pretty strong argument that many of the commanders with actual military educations weren't much better.) One problem that persists, though, is Davis openly playing favorites with his pre-war friends. (Bragg is the most notorious case, but there were others in the Trans-Miss and the Far West, too.)
Posted By: Crash_Pad Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
The Real Lincoln and/or Lincoln Unmasked. Non fiction on the monster that drove it.
Posted By: 7mmbuster Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Another vote for Shelby Foote. I’ve read those books probably 5 times or more!
I always said Bruce Catton set the bar, but Shelby raised it!
As to the causes, I suggest “Lincoln’s Little War”, by Webb Garrison. This book explains how Lincoln painted the South into a corner at Ft Sumter, forcing them to fire the first shot.
By making the Confederacy appear the aggressor, the divided northern states united behind the government. It’s an excellent read!
I’ve read Catton’s trilogy of the Army Of The Potomac several times as well, and have Big Hunter working on it now.
There are several others on my list, and I’ll consult my list and post some more later.
I’ve been hooked on the Civil War since The Old Man bought me “The Golden Book Of The Civil War” at the Cyclorama Visitors Center when I was 8, and American History has become a passion for me!
7mm
Posted By: simonkenton7 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
"Paludan's Victims (about the Shelton Laurel Massacre)"

Happened in Madison County, NC. AKA "Bloody Madison."

I live in Madison County. Thanks for the tip, clockwork 7mm, I just bought a used hardcover from Amazon for $7.84
Posted By: 7mmbuster Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by clockwork_7mm
One problem that persists, though, is Davis openly playing favorites with his pre-war friends. (Bragg is the most notorious case, but there were others in the Trans-Miss and the Far West, too.)
I gotta agree with this! I admire Jeff Davis, but his favoritisms in commanders hurt the South many times!
Bragg is the prime example, but there are many more.
Hood was a helluva division commander but he was completely over his head as commander of the Army Of Tennessee!
His wrongheaded tactics destroyed that Army at Franklin!
He was suffering from being severely wounded at Gettysburg, and gained Davis’ ear while recuperating in Richmond.
It’s possible that opium, taken for pain, is responsible for his discombobulation.
After Nashville that Army basically dissolved.
When Joe Johnson took command of the remnants, and charged with stopping Sherman, he said “I can only annoy him”. frown
7mm
Posted By: BC30cal Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
org Rogue Hunter;
Good afternoon to you sir, I hope the end of the week finds you and any who matter to you well.

As a bit of a student of history, even though I'm a Canuck I've read quite a bit on the US Civil War as it had such an effect on the rest of the world and Canada in particular.

If you like to get a bit of a sound bite to what the general population were seeing in the newspapers at the time - which I do because it's indicative of a few things - this ones is well done.

https://www.abebooks.com/book-searc...res/author/fletcher-pratt/first-edition/

If you've never dealt with abebooks, I've had really good luck with them over the years. The descriptions are accurate, they've all found their way up to rural BC and I wasn't enabling Jeff any more than was absolutely necessary.

All the best.

Dwayne
Posted By: earlybrd Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Lees lieutenants is a good read
Posted By: MAC Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
Originally Posted by clockwork_7mm
One problem that persists, though, is Davis openly playing favorites with his pre-war friends. (Bragg is the most notorious case, but there were others in the Trans-Miss and the Far West, too.)

I wrote a college paper on Bragg. When you dig into the matter he wasn't as bad a general as history paints him as. He actually had solid battle plans and tactics. What he lacked was the respect of his underlings particularly Longstreet and Beauregard. Had they actually followed his orders and enacted his timelines the battles very well could have had different outcomes. Bragg was a disgusting individual and a flawed leader but his military instincts were pretty sound. Had he been a better leader of men history could very well have been altered.

But I admit that is hindsight and hindsight is a dangerous beast when it comes to history.
Posted By: Crash_Pad Re: Civil war reading. - 02/17/23
There is a great book, Fifteen Battles That Changed History. Gettysburg might be the 16th. The forces that clashed, the ideals and assumptions, cultural differences, immigration and the industrialization of the North versus the wealthiest people in the world, cotton planters and the South's stagnant social system/economy. If there is an honest academic book dealing with those basic forces, the arrogance of the planters as opposed to the psychopathic pathology of Lincoln, that would be the one to read. I may be wrong about Foote, but he seems like a PBS light weight, entertaining and approved, but not particularly well informed. The South could never have won. But they didn't have to lose. Zero strategy. Zero intelligence or understanding of strong sympathies in the West and general indifference in the main, their natural allies in other words. And miscalculating the determination of a mad man. Lost cause indeed.
Posted By: nyrifleman Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
James McPherson is the definitive authority on the Civil War.

Battle Cry of Freedom or Ordeal by Fire is where one should begin.
Posted By: CopperSolid Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Start from the fuqhing beginning, so to speak. Then you move on...

https://cdn.mises.org/Conceived%20in%20Liberty_Rothbard.pdf
Posted By: riflegunbuilder Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Read War Crimes Against Southern Citizens'. Helps to understand the horrid acts Yankee's were capable of. We have a good friend that is a Yankee, she tried to say she wasn't because she has been here so long. I had to explain it is genetic and can't be resolved.
Posted By: 7mmbuster Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
For a glimpse of the life in the ranks, John Billings “Hardtack And Coffee” is hard to beat.
Also “Company Aitch” by Sam Watkins. Watkins served through the war in the Army Of Tennessee. His eyewitness of the battles and humor make this book another favorite of mine!
7mm
Posted By: earlybrd Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Originally Posted by riflegunbuilder
Read War Crimes Against Southern Citizens'. Helps to understand the horrid acts Yankee's were capable of. We have a good friend that is a Yankee, she tried to say she wasn't because she has been here so long. I had to explain it is genetic and can't be resolved.
We call them transplants
Posted By: earlybrd Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Originally Posted by riflegunbuilder
Read War Crimes Against Southern Citizens'. Helps to understand the horrid acts Yankee's were capable of. We have a good friend that is a Yankee, she tried to say she wasn't because she has been here so long. I had to explain it is genetic and can't be resolved.
Yankee neighbor of mine from Martha’s Vineyard claims hes confed now since he’s lived in Virginia 20 yrs.🤣🤣🖕don’t hand me that fugkin bull schit unless it’s been bleed out by your ancestors 👍
Posted By: clockwork_7mm Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Originally Posted by simonkenton7
"Paludan's Victims (about the Shelton Laurel Massacre)"

Happened in Madison County, NC. AKA "Bloody Madison."

I live in Madison County. Thanks for the tip, clockwork 7mm, I just bought a used hardcover from Amazon for $7.84
It's very well written. You'll like it.
Posted By: simonkenton7 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Company Aitch. A great book.
Posted By: renegade50 Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

This is a really good and documented, referenced read.
Probably one of the least known union generals.
But one of the most important in the eastern theater.

Politically hounded for his non conformist beliefs about how to conduct the war and how to treat the southern states at the end and after the war.
1 example was his objections to Burnside about shelling Fredericksburg.
After 3 bombardments ordered by Burnside to no avail to drive a regiment of Mississippians out of the town and the rubble which gave them better protection from the artillery.
General Hunt was the one who came up with idea to do the amphibious Assualt and organized it.
Burnside told him if it fails Hunt would be responsible.
It succeeded and Burnside of course took credit for it..

General Hunt also organized the union artillery on Malvern Hill.
Organized and conducted the Artillery seige of Petersburg.

Everyone recognize,s the picture of the dictator rail car mortar.
Gen Hunts creation
At the battle of the crater General hunts artillery sealed off both sides of the attack from confederate counter attack.
Infantry attack plan changed.
Took out the Black Division to lead attack 2 hrs prior to crater explosion and replaced it with unrehearesed white divisions.
Cause grant and Meade were worried how the press would report the attack if a black division was slaughterd.
Didn't matter....
3 divisions IIRC including the black division all went into the crater, Hunt had to shut his guns down.
Attack went in 20 mins after.
2 union generals drinking whiskey in a Bunker while their men are getting slaughtered.

Gen Hunts unvarnished scathing report after the crater battle haunted him for years political enemy wise....

Like many officers on both sides many served with each other in the old army and the Mexican War.

One of his students the confederate artillery commander at Gettysburg. Pendleton IIRC.
Both talking at Appomattox.
Pendleton told Hunt.
I know my artillery at Gettysburg was seen by you as a total failure.
And how he wondered for almost 2yrs what Gen Hunt thought of it.
General told him that in fact it was and 80% of his shots were high and hitting in the rear areas 1/4 to 1/2 mile behind the Infantry front lines.
He told him if he would have slowed down his rate of fire and observed it and not let the guns tails dig into the ground causing his high shots his artillery might have been more effective.
Gen Hunt told pendleton he was instructed to leave 2 batteries of 30 pd parrot rifles he had modified with wheels on their gun carriages in storage.
They both had a discussion about the effect those 30 pd parrots might have had long range wise on picketts charge.
They both agreed as soon as the confederates left the tree line that day the parrots would have broken up picketts charge well before Emmittsburg road by being constantly under long range fire then mid and close fire from napoleons and 3 inch ordinance rifles.
But hind sight by both didn't change what went down..

LT hunt went to Church with Captain Lee.
Just one example in the book of both sides officers knowing and serving with each other in the old army.


Much much more in it.

Gen Hunt then Col Hunt guns covered the retreat from 1st Bull run as last unit rear gaurd.
His guns also turned a Confederate Brigade level attack at Blackburns Ford IIRC during 1st bull run.
A flanking attack many don't know of per history.
If it had succeeded the union would have had its retreat route completely cut off with a confederate infantry Brigade in its rear.






It is a good book if you can find it.
Posted By: CRAGGAR Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
The above mention Sam Watkins. Best firsthand account by a Southern soldier I've ever read.
Posted By: clockwork_7mm Re: Civil war reading. - 02/18/23
Originally Posted by MAC
Originally Posted by clockwork_7mm
One problem that persists, though, is Davis openly playing favorites with his pre-war friends. (Bragg is the most notorious case, but there were others in the Trans-Miss and the Far West, too.)

I wrote a college paper on Bragg. When you dig into the matter he wasn't as bad a general as history paints him as. He actually had solid battle plans and tactics. What he lacked was the respect of his underlings particularly Longstreet and Beauregard. Had they actually followed his orders and enacted his timelines the battles very well could have had different outcomes. Bragg was a disgusting individual and a flawed leader but his military instincts were pretty sound. Had he been a better leader of men history could very well have been altered.

But I admit that is hindsight and hindsight is a dangerous beast when it comes to history.

Actually, if you go back to the original commissions, Beauregard ranked Bragg. Regardless, Bragg was a disaster as an army commander. His subordinates were definitely sniping at him, but that wasn't unusual in Civil War armies, it's how Pope and Hooker ended up in command (albeit briefly). And lots of other commanders still managed to work successfully with subordinates who didn't like them.

Some of the issue with the Confederacy is that there was zero continuity of rank from the old army. Those initial two clusters of senior generals all got commissioned *almost* simultaneously... and all thought they should have been the most senior. And some of it has to do with Davis thinking he could general better than his generals. Davis almost immediately has problems with Johnston and Beauregard due to micro-managing. But then he babies Bragg and others like Theophilus Holmes and Sterling Price. And then he (and Lee) don't really step in when Jackson is having his issues with Garnett after the Valley Campaign (everyone knew Jackson was wrong, but no one would do anything about it).

The breakdown of professionalism on Bragg's staff is really on display at Chickamauga. Hindman can't stand Bragg (for the same reasons no one can stand Bragg) and Longstreet just isn't very good in independent command. He's a hell of a corps commander when the Army of Northern Virginia gets its initial restructuring with Longstreet and Jackson each controlling a wing. But that was also quite common: lots of guys were great at the brigade or divisional level and just couldn't hack it as a corps commander or an army commander. (Hooker is a good example. Not the guy you want controlling your army but he could lead a corps, especially if given aggressive orders.)

That said, Stones River is mostly on Bragg's decision making, re: Bragg snatches defeat from the jaws of victory. He has Rosecrans dead to rights, assumes Rosecrans will retreat, is stunned when he doesn't, and then delays for 24 hours (hoping Rosecrans will magically disappear from the field), allows the Army of the Cumberland to entrench, and then gets his men mowed down attacking fortified and reinforced positions. The siege at Chattanooga unraveling isn't really on Bragg -- he's just outnumbered and outclassed by Grant, Sherman, and Thomas, at that point -- but it also never should have come to that. Had he taken care of business at Chattanooga, Thomas never would have been back in Chattanooga that way to begin with.
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