My brother in law committed suicide this past week. Really a caring, gentle, easy going guy with a good job and no addictions. No outward signs of what he was holding in or the troubles that he felt were insurmountable. Just the wrong personality to be in charge on his mothers affairs.
A brother and sister were very predatory on him. He went to a meeting with the Trustee and his brother -- never came home. Jumped from a bridge. Single income family with no kids. My sister will be having major adjustments to make going forward.
Just makes the saying you can pick your friends but not your family all the more true. Helping my sister through the estate paperwork --- just makes me feel hollow. Tragic, senseless and avoidable. Sometimes in the long run it is just better to say no to family requests and move on.
In the job I retired from I had to deal with a number of student suicides -- I could never understand the depth of dispair / torment that would cause a person to take this route. I still do not understand this.
Suicide is a hard thing to deal with. Been a cop for over twenty years and have lost many friends to it. Most were also combat vets. I've had the intrusive thoughts, gone a little ways down the rabbit hole. It seems like a relief, just to not have to fu*k with the BS anymore. I understand it but don't wish it on anyone. It's, in my experience, a spur of the moment decision. Pissed, depressed, tired, the hell with it, I'm popping smoke. sorry for your loss and wish you luck with your wife, she's got a big hill to climb. If you need someone to bounce stuff off of feel free to PM me. I've got some experience but more importantly, I've got some good contacts if you feel she needs them. Patrick
I have lost both a close friend and my closest cousin to suicide. One committed suicide before his brain deteriorated into making him into a vegetable. I can only speculate about the other death - we really don’t know why he made his choice - none of us saw it coming.
Allow yourself and your family plenty of time to grieve. Talk about it when you need to. Cry when you need to.
It's your sister that my thoughts and prayers are with. Sometimes suicide is a selfish act when people don't consider how it will impact their family.
But I've known of times when it was a selfless act when people did consider how their family would be impacted. One of my wife's uncles had fought hard to beat cancer once. A few years later it came back. On the morning he was supposed to go to the hospital for surgery he decided to end his life on his terms to spare his family.
I've known of many others who took their own lives. A college buddy whose son saw too much in his 3 tours in Afghanistan. A father who cheated on his wife and couldn't live with himself even though his wife forgave him. A mom dying of cancer who killed her 11-year-old son then herself to make sure her ex didn't get custody of the boy.
Hugh...Thoughts and prayers to you and your family. I'm in the wildfire line of work and I've had some training in suicide and stress management. My wife is an RN in Er and ICU so we've been good shoulders for each other over the years. As dodge said many times you don't see it until its too late. Keep an eye on your sister and any changes to "normal" patterns. Sometimes people want to talk about it other times they just want someone to bring them a drink and sit beside them. If she wants to talk don't feel you have to solve the problem, just listen and if you believe it would help kindly suggest you find someone to talk with. Not necessarily at Dr but someone with experience in dealing with suicide. Dodge will tell you some of the best support is from peers, they get it as they've walked in your shoes. The same goes here in dealing with loss and suicide. I don't have a lot of experience but if I can help in any way just drop me a PM. Dodge, if you ever need to vent, scream obscenities or talk about something drop me a PM.
Hate to hear this. A PM that was hired on in my from the same week as I was was a very capable person, till he married the second wife. She had to have the big house and fancy car...it drove him to bankruptcy and he declined to go to lunch with all us guys one day and we found him behind the office in his car when we got back.
One's mind is a swirling storm of emotions, questions and attempted answers. I guess I am lucky in that my lizard brain does not have that penchant for what looks like the easy out, I have some anger issues but so far have reached outward.
I have a granddaughter that struggles with depression and I worry about her someday just giving up that struggle.
Sorry for your sister's loss and this road you must now travel.
Depression is a disease that ruins and destroys life. It is only by happenstance and a 5 minute phone call with a psych nurse that i am around to post.
Sorry to hear this, help your sister, take care of yourself.
Lost a friend the first day of turkey season 1987. We were seniors. Took years to get past, close to 20 until a movie scene wouldn't bring it roaring back. Total shock, it still is.
Depression is a disease that ruins and destroys life. It is only by happenstance and a 5 minute phone call with a psych nurse that i am around to post.
Happy to see that you are posting. 👍🏻
This brings up a good point.
Many people not in the mental health field believe that they have the appropriate ‘answers’ for depressed people without medically understanding depression and mental illness. I have two close friends that are doctors. Both stated to me that mental illness is one of the more difficult areas to deal with. Also, many (not all) suicides could have been prevented with the appropriate intervention beforehand. I seen this overseas when a soldier put a pistol to his heart and pulled the trigger. Turns out his buddies all seen the warning signs and nobody basically did nothing. Or they thought ‘their’ advice was enough. Wrong answer.
Bottomline, only people who are trained in this area should be giving advice. If you think you know someone is suffering from mental illness, do what you can to get them the ‘right’ help.
I am very sorry for you and your sister. Suicide is very hard to come to terms with. I lost my brother to suicide. He was freakishly smart and funny as fugk. Depression and addiction haunted him.
HughW: Sorry to hear of the death and the sadness upon your sister and the family. Tough one. I dealt with suicides professionally for 29 years and NOTHING good comes from that act! Stay strong your family needs you. Hold into the wind VarmintGuy
Sounds cliche I know but I hear these stories and it reminds me I need to cut people slack and extend some grace. I never know what people are carrying.
Sounds cliche I know but I hear these stories and it reminds me I need to cut people slack and extend some grace. I never know what people are carrying.
Sounds cliche I know but I hear these stories and it reminds me I need to cut people slack and extend some grace. I never know what people are carrying.
efw; Morning sir, I hope you're all well in your section of Michigan.
Thanks for your post and a hearty "Amen" from me.
Years ago I read of a study up here where they said of every 100 Canadian men who suffered from depression or other mental issues, 10 would see a medical professional and 3 of those would get successful treatment.
The rest self medicate and deal with it with varying levels of success.
While I don't understand it, as others have said my attitudes towards suicide have changed significantly during the course of my life.
After my head injury I got a glimpse of the types of despair that can lead folks to suicide. I’m wired “happy”, just got lucky that way. But not then. That was a rough year+ and really gave me empathy for folks struggling with mental health and PTSD.
During my run as a recording studio owner/engineer I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. Recording an ambitious project is a huge endeavor and when done right, leaves the artist very exposed emotionally. It’s like giving birth. There’s a very vulnerable part to the whole thing. Aargh. Hurts even thinking about it, 20 years later. Ben was his name. Awww, Ben… why?
I hope in the fullness of time the OP can fill the hollow spot with friends and family and, well, love. It’s going to be a process. Best wishes.
After my head injury I got a glimpse of the types of despair that can lead folks to suicide. I’m wired “happy”, just got lucky that way. But not then. That was a rough year+ and really gave me empathy for folks struggling with mental health and PTSD.
During my run as a recording studio owner/engineer I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. Recording an ambitious project is a huge endeavor and when done right, leaves the artist very exposed emotionally. It’s like giving birth. There’s a very vulnerable part to the whole thing. Aargh. Hurts even thinking about it, 20 years later. Ben was his name. Awww, Ben… why?
I hope in the fullness of time the OP can fill the hollow spot with friends and family and, well, love. It’s going to be a process. Best wishes.
I was 20 when my brother took his life. It was a long time before I stopped "what-iffing" things.
Depression isn't always the triggering factor in suicide but it is the most common one.
I read a little bit about depression. I talked to people about their depression. I tried to come to an understanding of it. I think the best way for people who don't understand depression to try to understand it is to do this. Think back on the darkest days or moments of your life. Maybe a loved one passed away. Maybe you got fired from a job. Maybe you got cheated on and dumped by someone you loved. The way you felt in those torturous days or moments is every day for those suffering depression. They cannot quiet their minds. They cannot will themselves into peace or serenity or acceptance. They feel hopeless. They cannot escape the abyss.
While you were in your darkest moments, there was nothing anyone could do or say to make the hurt or the unease go away. While you appreciated their concern in an academic sense, their words rang hollow. It's nigh impossible to make a life changing difference to the depressed an suicidal. If you suspect they are suicidal, intervene, but we rarely know when others are thinking of ending it.
After my head injury I got a glimpse of the types of despair that can lead folks to suicide. I’m wired “happy”, just got lucky that way. But not then. That was a rough year+ and really gave me empathy for folks struggling with mental health and PTSD.
During my run as a recording studio owner/engineer I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. Recording an ambitious project is a huge endeavor and when done right, leaves the artist very exposed emotionally. It’s like giving birth. There’s a very vulnerable part to the whole thing. Aargh. Hurts even thinking about it, 20 years later. Ben was his name. Awww, Ben… why?
I hope in the fullness of time the OP can fill the hollow spot with friends and family and, well, love. It’s going to be a process. Best wishes.
don't worry everybody can tell you had a brain injury..
I was 20 when my brother took his life. It was a long time before I stopped "what-iffing" things.
Depression isn't always the triggering factor in suicide but it is the most common one.
I read a little bit about depression. I talked to people about their depression. I tried to come to an understanding of it. I think the best way for people who don't understand depression to try to understand it is to do this. Think back on the darkest days or moments of your life. Maybe a loved one passed away. Maybe you got fired from a job. Maybe you got cheated on and dumped by someone you loved. The way you felt in those torturous days or moments is every day for those suffering depression. They cannot quiet their minds. They cannot will themselves into peace or serenity or acceptance. They feel hopeless. They cannot escape the abyss.
While you were in your darkest moments, there was nothing anyone could do or say to make the hurt or the unease go away. While you appreciated their concern in an academic sense, their words rang hollow. It's nigh impossible to make a life changing difference to the depressed an suicidal. If you suspect they are suicidal, intervene, but we rarely know when others are thinking of ending it.
I don't believe it you actually wrote something very good..
After my head injury I got a glimpse of the types of despair that can lead folks to suicide. I’m wired “happy”, just got lucky that way. But not then. That was a rough year+ and really gave me empathy for folks struggling with mental health and PTSD.
During my run as a recording studio owner/engineer I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. Recording an ambitious project is a huge endeavor and when done right, leaves the artist very exposed emotionally. It’s like giving birth. There’s a very vulnerable part to the whole thing. Aargh. Hurts even thinking about it, 20 years later. Ben was his name. Awww, Ben… why?
I hope in the fullness of time the OP can fill the hollow spot with friends and family and, well, love. It’s going to be a process. Best wishes.
don't worry everybody can tell you had a brain injury..
These are the toughest threads for me to read. My heart breaks for your friend to think of the all-consuming-pain that he was silently dealing with and the hopelessness that caused him to end it all….so sad! My heart also aches for those that loved him and cared about him and are now left wondering…..wondering what they could’ve done (likely nothing) and wondering why he didn’t see all the reasons he had to live (he likely did)…..
I’ll be praying for you all and for your friend’s eternal peace!
?.. I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. ….. It’s like giving birth.
I’ll leave your experience with giving birth for a different discussion….
I’m sure that if you are 1/10th as annoying in person as you are online that you ARE the sole reason your client killed himself and that YOU are directly responsible for his death. I don’t even want to think about how many people have read your drivel and decided that enough is enough and that based on your partisan bullshit and stupid assessments that this country is a foregone conclusion and ended it like your client.
I’ll be looking forward to your experience giving birth but I just don’t have the patience today.
Thanks guys for the kind words, thoughts and prayers. I have no answers other than what efw said --- perhaps if the family had cut him some slack this would not have occurred.
I really believe that the brother and sister feel no remorse - had they this would not have happened. Predators exist and in this case by BIL needed to walk away as he could not handle the situation. Unfortuantely the way out for him has made it much more difficult for many.
Personally I am fine and will provide the support that I can while also looking for signs that my sister may be headed down the same path.
All the best to all of you and especially those that have had the same experience in their past.
?.. I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. ….. It’s like giving birth.
I’ll leave your experience with giving birth for a different discussion….
I’m sure that if you are 1/10th as annoying in person as you are online that you ARE the sole reason your client killed himself and that YOU are directly responsible for his death. I don’t even want to think about how many people have read your drivel and decided that enough is enough and that based on your partisan bullshit and stupid assessments that this country is a foregone conclusion and ended it like your client.
I’ll be looking forward to your experience giving birth but I just don’t have the patience today.
?.. I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. ….. It’s like giving birth.
I’ll leave your experience with giving birth for a different discussion….
I’m sure that if you are 1/10th as annoying in person as you are online that you ARE the sole reason your client killed himself and that YOU are directly responsible for his death. I don’t even want to think about how many people have read your drivel and decided that enough is enough and that based on your partisan bullshit and stupid assessments that this country is a foregone conclusion and ended it like your client.
I’ll be looking forward to your experience giving birth but I just don’t have the patience today.
Sorry to hear that. Your sister needs some support big time.
Had to be something really messed up in your BIL,s head per those siblings of his to do what he did... They sound like a couple of pieces of work from your brief outline of the situation. Probably $$$ stuff and inheritance stuff
Just speculation... But we all know how $$$ and inheritance brings out the worst in family
Living in Wyoming , this is a way larger problem here than people want to except. I volunteer for The Suicide Prevention Coalition here and have know too much about how it effects everyone involved. You Sir have my sincere prayers for your Whole family. The stress of life does seem to effect people differently. I tend to thrive on unrealistic expectations , My wife gets overwhelmed by the smallest tasks. Looking for early signs is key to all of this and being willing to help the person is a deep personal commitment. With all I know of this my wife is currently in a facility to get meds straighten out and to get a grip on what is and what is not in her control. Family issues are a major contributer to this.
I have known 4 people who took their own lives in my lifetime. As I grow older, I choose to remember the good times we had rather than dwell on the decisions that they made.
I was 20 when my brother took his life. It was a long time before I stopped "what-iffing" things.
Depression isn't always the triggering factor in suicide but it is the most common one.
I read a little bit about depression. I talked to people about their depression. I tried to come to an understanding of it. I think the best way for people who don't understand depression to try to understand it is to do this. Think back on the darkest days or moments of your life. Maybe a loved one passed away. Maybe you got fired from a job. Maybe you got cheated on and dumped by someone you loved. The way you felt in those torturous days or moments is every day for those suffering depression. They cannot quiet their minds. They cannot will themselves into peace or serenity or acceptance. They feel hopeless. They cannot escape the abyss.
While you were in your darkest moments, there was nothing anyone could do or say to make the hurt or the unease go away. While you appreciated their concern in an academic sense, their words rang hollow. It's nigh impossible to make a life changing difference to the depressed a suicidal. If you suspect they are suicidal, intervene, but we rarely know when others are thinking of ending it.
Dang that’s was well put, and I think of some comfort to those who have lost people they cared about. Suicide struck my family too and it might be hardest on those left behind.
Really sorry to hear about your BIL. Everyone carries thoughts in their heads, some good and some bad. I've been between a rock and hard place most of my adult life. I love my life enough to stay here but live a life of discontent, stuck. My mind is always going 1000mph and if I don't do positive things, it does negative things but a person can only stay so busy. It's the reason that I drowned myself in drug addiction when I was a young adult. I'm glad to be out of that mess but sure do miss a quiet mind, wondering if this is as good as it gets until my body gives up someday.
My brother in law committed suicide this past week. Really a caring, gentle, easy going guy with a good job and no addictions. No outward signs of what he was holding in or the troubles that he felt were insurmountable. Just the wrong personality to be in charge on his mothers affairs.
A brother and sister were very predatory on him. He went to a meeting with the Trustee and his brother -- never came home. Jumped from a bridge. Single income family with no kids. My sister will be having major adjustments to make going forward.
Just makes the saying you can pick your friends but not your family all the more true. Helping my sister through the estate paperwork --- just makes me feel hollow. Tragic, senseless and avoidable. Sometimes in the long run it is just better to say no to family requests and move on.
In the job I retired from I had to deal with a number of student suicides -- I could never understand the depth of dispair / torment that would cause a person to take this route. I still do not understand this.
Living in Wyoming , this is a way larger problem here than people want to except. I volunteer for The Suicide Prevention Coalition here and have know too much about how it effects everyone involved. You Sir have my sincere prayers for your Whole family.
God bless YOU for your service to those in need! I find few things more admirable and honorable than those that give freely of themselves in service to others!
I like the series Yellowstone and I find myself able to identify with a lot of the dialogue but one particular scene hit me hard and made an indelible impression on me because I think there’s a lot of truth in it. It’s the episode where Jamie is distraught and he takes the lever action Winchester and sets off to kill himself but his dad, Kevin Costner, finds him and sits down to talk Jamie out of shooting himself. During the conversation John Dutton (Costner) says, the thing about suicide is that your entire life and everything that you’ve done is boiled down to how you left. The only thing people will remember about you is that you killed yourself…..I’m paraphrasing and probably poorly but there is some truth in it.
I don’t subscribe to the notion that it’s a selfish act. I’m sure there are times it’s a selfish act but most times I don’t think selfishness has anything to do with it and it’s just a simpleton’s thoughtless answer that takes no mental dexterity to arrive at. The despair and pain can be overwhelming and it does NOT feel temporary, it feels permanent and all encompassing with no chance of ever escaping or getting better…only worse, harder and more painful. Suicide to some feels like they’re doing their loved ones a favor, “they’ll get over the pain soon and be free of the burden I’m causing forever”. They’re wrong because we never get over them and they each take a little piece of us when they choose that but the darkness hides the truth. My heart aches for those suffering from that level of pain and suffering, ESPECIALLY our veterans! I wish that as a society we dealt with suicide and mental illness in a more compassionate and a more effective way rather than the way we ignore it now or pretend like we’re offering them “services” when the reality is that it’s treated more to assuage society’s guilt than to treat the individual in need. Some individuals need intensive care and treatment but they’re walking around untreated and deeply sick. Sorry for my tangent.
After my head injury I got a glimpse of the types of despair that can lead folks to suicide. I’m wired “happy”, just got lucky that way. But not then. That was a rough year+ and really gave me empathy for folks struggling with mental health and PTSD.
During my run as a recording studio owner/engineer I had a client kill himself. I still wonder if there’s anything I did, or said, or could’ve done differently. Recording an ambitious project is a huge endeavor and when done right, leaves the artist very exposed emotionally. It’s like giving birth. There’s a very vulnerable part to the whole thing. Aargh. Hurts even thinking about it, 20 years later. Ben was his name. Awww, Ben… why?
I hope in the fullness of time the OP can fill the hollow spot with friends and family and, well, love. It’s going to be a process. Best wishes.
And the taxpayers been picking up the tab for your mooching off the .gov entitlement tiddy ever since...
You, your sister and the entire family have my sincerest condolences.
I lost a brother-in-law to suicide 16 years ago. My wife comes from a large, extremely close-kit family – with nary a stinker in the bunch. His death and circumstances around it still haunts each of them to this day.
I hate ladders so much. We have many safety incidents when people use them. I had a guy break his arm and [bleep] himself when he fell off one. I had to go buy new underwear so he could go to the ER. I had to explain to HR why it took so long for him to get to the ER when the incident document shows exactly what time he fell. That was awkward. I hate ladders.