Just read an article where an "expert" says not to buy Costco gold 1 ounce bars. His reasons.....
1. It is a bar but in fits in your hand!
2. Someone could come to your house and steal it.
3. ( Only half way reasonable thing stated). You have to pay over "spot" to get it and then get lower than spot when you sell.

He says to buy funds. You know the internet fantasy that could disappear in a blink. I say own some tangible assets, whether gold, silver, guns, art , property.......
The deep state wants you to put everything into something they can get and control. I have retirement accounts online too but......

Never been a fan of gold. Gold is being purchased for a chit hit the fan type of situation. What good would gold be in a situation like that? Buy ammo, food, guns ect. Chit that has real value in a world on fire type of thing imo

Gold has been a poor investment for the last 3 decades.

It is an immensely portable asset though. If you are worth tens of millions, and trying to preserve wealth, you could make an argument.

If you are trying to grow wealth don't even try to make an argument.

I see it that way also, but then again there could be scenarios far different from what we imagine could happen in the future. It could be "uhh ohh," or it could be "ohh, shit!" Or maybe something in between.

Decades ago I reasoned it out and concluded that the lowly .22 LR cartridge could become the coin of the realm in a SHTF scenario. I invested. May not ever be worth much, but then again...

As Geedub says...quien sabe?

Gold is good.

Best to think of it as a hedge, an insurance policy.....

I do believe that as "Coke is the real thing," gold is the real money, so there's that.

It's a great deal for those selling it.

Those of modest means might better look for something within those means. Rich folks can afford to splurge a bit on “insurance” like gold.

Gotta remember that the government once made it illegal to hold bullion. They might do it again. Coins were still legal to hold IIRC.

Yes, modest means.... buy silver...

Silver is a joke. I'd buy ammo.

You do realize you can buy both? silver was money... until 1964

Will everyone have to carry around a little acid test kit to prove it’s authenticity and carat weight?

You can’t have buys and sellers getting duped by that Good on a Roll crap down at the Compton’s Swap Meet.

If we get to that point, that will be the least of your worries

I like gold. I like Krugerrands.

Lead will be the new "precious metal". Especially when loaded in a primed & charged brass outer shell.

Exactly. Smart money goes to ammo

Only ancient coins were still legal. All US gold coins and bullion were supposed to be turned in. Only like 2% of gold in private hands was actually turned in, though. Banks all turned in their gold (which got melted into big bars), but private citizens didn't, for the most part. They just kept it in the family, generation to generation, till it was legalized again forty some odd years later.

It never stopped being money. Neither did gold. They just stopped being currency, or rather the government made our currency fiat, i.e., removed the backing to it. It used to be backed by real money, i.e., gold and silver. Today, it's only valuable because you have to pay your taxes in it, which maintains a certain level of demand for it. Which is why they needed the 16th Amendment before they took gold and silver out of our currency.

I’ve got some. Probably pick up more if the right circumstances and urges hit me.

Osky

Yep. Diamonds as well. But they both make lousy investments.

I won’t try to make an argument….. merely an observation…..that “the times we are in make a difference.”

I started investing in 1998. Gold was about $294 per ounce and today is $1950. So, in that time period gold has “gone up” by a factor of 6.6

In 1998 the Dow was about 9500….today it is at 33,000. So, in that time period the Dow has “gone up” by a factor of 3.5.


How much inflation have we seen on the past three years? What do think inflation is going to be doing over the next few years?

The choice of precious metals vs ammo vs real estate is not one or the other, it is a choice of diversification or not.

Y’all make your own choices…..

"How much inflation have we seen on the past three years? What do think inflation is going to be doing over the next few years?

The choice of precious metals vs ammo vs real estate is not one or the other, it is a choice of diversification or not.

Y’all make your own choices...."

My sentiments

Banks broke into safe deposit boxes to assist with the confiscation.

Janet Yellen said the dollar is strong. BIDENomics is going exactly as planned. Only an IDIOT would buy gold. Our Federal Reserve has our BEST INTEREST at heart.

I'd buy a one ounce gold bar as a novelty.

If you buy gold coins, buy foreign currency. Your own government wouldn't have a claim to it.

Experts say make Gold/Silver about 5-10% of your portfolio . Yup !!

Land, guns, ammo, stocks, bonds, cds, gold, silver can all be good tools in your investment/wealth accumulation strategy. Don't put all your eggs in one basket.

They sure did.

Sorry, but 30 years ago spot was $360 roughly. For the peace of mind and the price keeping up with inflation I am very happy with my purchases.

Do you want to buy half a dozen at $1,990.00 each?

I have never owned gold and never will. For those that do own it, what is the basis (how much) for the SHTF scenario?

In 2012 the average gold price was $1,668.86. Toss 10 years of inflation on that and the current price of $1964 isn't so glamorous. It has just barely held its value.

But as stated gold isn't an investment it's a hedge again a SHTF scenario. Whenever that happens...

I used to own gold and silver. Both bullion and junk. But, a tragic boat accident......

Gold & silver are speculative.

Above spot at purchase...below spot at sale. Unless trading for goods.

The best way to accumulate gold & silver .... is to inherit it.

Like the commission for going in and out of stocks.

PS You can avoid the premium, though, with gold and silver, by merely paying for services with them, based on their actual purchase price. In other words, you get your car repaired at a mom and pop garage, and you ask the owner if he would like payment in gold or silver. If he's interested, you go online and look up the going price for whatever form you own of those metals (i.e., what he'd have to pay if he wanted to buy them) and show it to him. If he agrees on accepting them at that valuation, then you make a deal. That way, you get the full market value for your coins, absent the premium you'd lose if you sold it to a metals dealer.

I wish I would have bought more a few weeks ago but i was busy buyng guns and optics. I realize gold isnt the best investment but I see it as a store of value and insurance of a sort. I stay in the 10-15% of net worth range. Good barter material once the government digitizes all currency or after the dems destroy the dollar. I also keep ammo, reloading components, and a good stash of casting alloys and food storage.

Bb

Until they say they do.

The challenge w/gold is having a "spendable" size piece to use as payment. If we're in some sort of situation where you're paying for goods and/or services with physical gold, the price of things is going to be whatever size chunk you've got. Nobody is going to wait while you carve 1/4 Oz off your gold bar, they're going to want the gold bar.

Silver coins for smaller purchases. Gold for larger trades.

You can accumulate gold coins that are .11 Troy ounce. There's also silver, which can be had in all sizes, down to silver dimes containing a mere 0.072 Troy ounce each, up to a kilogram bar, and everything in between.

Hawkeye, if you are paying for stock trades you are with the wrong broker.

No comparison as with gold ....none at all.

I have some 1/10th oz gold coins. That less than $200 a pop.

How do the brokers make a living?

even if you had 'spendable' size gold, who is going to be setting the price at the time of the transaction? For SHTF, gold and diamonds are just awful when it comes to dependability.

I keep some physical boomer rocks around mostly for the slight chance I might want to use them as a stopgap. I don’t buy into any of the common SHTF scenarios where an economic collapse in the US would happen too fast to liquidate other assets, or happen in such a way that fiat and securities become worthless.

There are reasonable scenarios where it might make sense to transact in boomer rocks. Probably fewer than in a decentralized crypto but who knows.

Having a few % of assets in physical gold or silver doesn’t really have much opportunity cost.

How many stocks have increased in value 580% in 23 years?

I'm sure there's a few. But not many.

Brokerages have more than 109 ways to make money other than trading fees. Margin loans are a big one, and securities lending for the shorts who are probably trading on margin.

The more recent one is getting paid for order flow. There are outfits that will pay them to send trades their way. A big part of the reason this has value for those involved is the data they get on what positions of what size are being taken to feed their high speed trading systems.

An absolute ton. Just an S&P 500 index fund would return close to that.

The ones that do it "commission free" or for next to nothing like Robinhood are compensated most often by payment for order flow. Basically, they are getting a kickback for poor executions. The SEC did a study and Robinhood paid a $65,000,000 penalty for making claims that their executions were "equal" to the other firms like Merrill Lynch, etc... The SEC found it would have been cheaper for the clients to pay a traditional commission vs. the "no commission" in most all of the transactions.

Nothing is for free.

I have some of these in both gold and silver. The premiums aren't bad on the gold ones but are too high on the silver ones. I only buy the silver ones when a local shop gets them because they give me a deal on them. I got a good deal on a 100g gold one from them a few years ago. I only paid a bit over spot. I bought 20g gold ones for my kids.

For small silver I prefer mercury dimes.

Bb

My point exactly. They have to make it somewhere. Their living doesn't just appear out of thin air. Ultimately, it comes from the buyers and sellers of their product. It's just hidden when it's "commission free."

Exactly. Investing in gold in normal times is one thing. Hoarding gold and silver for a shtf type of situation will leave many in rough shape if chit ever does hit the fan. Society devolves into pure chaos and guns, ammo, food, fuel, water ect will be where everyone wished they put their money

The time period chosen to do a comparison of gold to any index will greatly skew outcomes.

Another example….

Do the math….. one non-gold bug financial site calculated the total return on the S&P from 2000 to today at 379.74 % … and that is with all dividends re-invested and no income taxes paid.

S&P in year 2000…about 1320….today at 4300….4300/1320 = 3.25

Gold in 2000….about 285….today at $1950. 1950/285 = 6.84


Btw…. One previous poster commented that the best way to acquire metals is through inheritance. This is pretty much true. Especially good at avoiding “inheritance tax.” Also, the cost basis for the ones getting the inheritance is fixed at the current price at time of death.

SHTF may be quite far away time wise, but that doesn’t mean times won’t get worse between now and then. Boomer rocks might come in handy.

Last comment….there has been a “market” for gold for thousands of years. This market may change in how it is conducted, but it will not go away. There may be more bartering needed than we would like, but the market will be there. Anybody who grew up near the Mexican border knows about “bartering.” If the circumstances of a barter don’t look good, make sure the other side of the transaction knows about your wing man hiding in the weeds.

Hawkeye,

Don't get into stocks ....you do not have the mental acuity.

Everybody gets excited about gold and silver when they hit peak prices. That’s when you sell, not buy.

If one has disposable wealth in bad times, by all means buy gold. In bad times is when people will be more likely to sell at an affordable price as they will be willing to unload it for a deal. (meal)

I’ll turn in my Series 7 immediately.

What is a Series 70?

It's 10 times better than a Series 7 of course.

My 1911.

Typing while driving. LOL

Understandable, but no need to turn in your Series 7. It expired 2 years after your U5 was filed.

Use Voice-to-Text feature

shît son, everbody know dat

The gold and silver I buy is a hobby. I buy Old Double Eagles and Morgan Silver Dollars, with dates in the 1800's. I just love the history with these coins. Who owned them, were they ever taken in a robbery, used in an old west poker game by Doc. Holliday. They go well with the old Colt SAA revolvers I have and cheaper than the new Gold Eagles made today.
The large gold coins are the $20 Double Eagles, mid size are $10 coins and the small are $5.

This is the best gold post ever made, pure LARP.

Very cool picture.

Indeed!

Or it's how an old 1911 guy types Series 7 when he's trying to post before the light turns green.

For those seriously thinking of buying precious metals, this web site is useful. This link is for junk (pre-64 non-numismatic coins) silver. There are categories other metals and types.


https://findbullionprices.com/p/90-junk-silver-coins-100-face-value-bag/

Love those grips.

You mean pre-65, of course. Pre-64 is for Winchester rifles.

👍

Yes. Sorry.

My Wife and I have been talking about this exact thing. She made some good points about buying gold and silver. What happens when the [bleep] hits the fan? People will want food, water, guns, ammo, ALCOHOL, medical supplies, propane, batteries etc etc. As an example in the Book of ELI with Denzel Washington he needed a charge for his battery.

I understand this is EXTREME but in a TRUE SHTF situation.Gold and silver will get you something but who knows what?
I believe it was Joseph in the Old Testament of the Bible when the famine started he took all the peoples money for food, then when the money was gone he took their animals when that was all taken it was their land. Anything to keep themselves ALIVE. I don't believe GOLD and precious metals will be all that important in an TEOTWAWKI situation.

Even during the darkest periods of the Dark Ages, gold and silver was money.

Might be in a hyper-inflationary period. Not sure we'll get there here in the US in my lifetime. Maybe...

That said I was in Zim twice during their hyperinflation. US Dollars and Rand were the preferred trading medium. Never had anyone mention gold/silver. Swiss Francs?

Bribing border guards might be it's best use.

I don't own the metals for an investment. I own them as a means of exchange if and when the SHTF.
I think it's prudent to have something that has historically carried value if "normal society" breaks down.
If it never does, what am I out? What I have bought in the past is worth a hell of a lot more than I paid for it.
That doesn't mean that that I ignore the other important things like food, water, guns, ammo etc....
They are not mutually exclusive.

BTW, if the SHTF and you come to my place and want to buy some of my beans and flour what are you going to use to pay for it? I already have a shovel...

Why are these arguments and all or nothing equation ?
The owning gold & silvers purpose in a survival shtf situation is to preserve wealth.
You better have your beans, rice and ammo before thinking about buying gold & silver.
The goal is to survive and come out the other side in a strong financial position.
So the argument you can't eat gold is flat stupid.... and there is a very good chance silver will buy you necessities in a shtf situation

Yep.

Gold and art, that's what the rich have used to come out the other side on good terms for millenia. You can cut a painting out of a frame and roll it up and you can take a few chests of gold. Not as am investment, but to be ahead of the game on the other side.

This is true. I started buying heavy in 2008 when silver was around $9. I tried to get friends to buy some and was even selling quite a bit at gun shows. I'd buy 3 monster boxes to get a lower premium on days when it dipped and then I'd wait until it came up a buck or so and sell most of it keeping 100 or so ounces each time for myself. At one point I had 6000 ounces then I listen to Dave Ramsey and sold a lot off to pay off debts.

Around 2010 to 2011 the price really started to rise. When it got up to about $40 an once it seemed like all my friends and family started to call me and tell me they were finally taking my advice and getting into silver. I told them all to stop it that they were supposed to buy 2 years ago when I did and that there was a good chance this was a temporary spike and it would crash soon. I'd pretty much quit buying at that point except for a few big deals I did quick flips on. My average cost on my silver was sitting at about $12 because I'd really slowed down my buying as it rose. When all the people that thought you were nuts for buying start buying that's usually a good time to sell.

If you buy at $22 now and it goes up to $50 just be sure not to try to sell it on the fire for say $45 or the fairness police will call you a scalper and every dirty name in the book for asking under current market value because they know you paid less so many years ago.

Bb

Lots of discussion here for and against, but I see it as a hedge, to preserve one’s net worth. Precious metals, arms and ammunition, food, water and shelter are not mutually exclusive, and neither should they be.

"At one point I had 6000 ounces then I listen to Dave Ramsey and sold a lot off to pay off debts."

Dave says that buying silver and gold is stupid.

The eagle with the snake in his beak, the symbol of Mexico.

My "investment guy" prefers gold over silver, but doesn't scoff at silver.
Gold is a good way to carry a large sum in a small package.
Silver prices fluctuate at a higher rate than gold.

Diamonds are a pizz poor investment. There aren't that many people who can reliably assay diamonds.
All you need for gold or silver is a scale.
The metal market will determine the value.
I got into metals a bit late in life.
We have quite a bit of silver we paid $12/$13/oz for. We've never paid over $20/oz for any silver. Yep, been a while since we've bought any!
First gold we bought was 1/4 oz coins. Paid less than $150/ea. They're now worth over $250/ea.
That's not a bad investment! 😉

wonder if it will hit 2000 today

If it does the big players will naked short it down to 1850.

Years ago when I worked at a gold mine, once a year that had a "gold sale". You could buy nuggets and specimens that the geologists had collected throughout the year. We paid spot price and I believe I dropped around $1k buy 3-4 nuggets and a couple specimens. That was in 2002 when spot was around $300/oz. I wish I'd bought more. Still kicking myself for not buying a couple Kuggerand at that time.

I also got into collecting silver rounds and other coins various mines minted. Silver was around $5/oz back then. Again, I wish I had bought more.

Silver is a higher risk asset vs gold, but makes massive gains more likely, due to volatility on both the way up and on the way down. In other words, when gold is down, silver is way down vs its 20 year average, while when gold is up, silver is way up vs its 20 year average, therefore the same amount of money invested in silver when it's at long time lows will generate a much higher profit (10X isn't unusual) than can be had by investing in gold when it's at its long time lows.

The key to knowing when to get into silver is to take note of the gold to silver ratio. Above 80 is a great time to accumulate silver, while below 60 is a good time to stop accumulating silver, and below 50 is a good time to start accumulating gold.

Very good possibility….. in the short term, the gold market is either “rigged” or at the mercy of the “big players.”


I have never been very good at picking short term high and low points in the gold market. Just can’t do it.

Once I started to buy at what I thought was a low point….. turned that the gold price kept going lower and lower….I would buy in again and again at ever lower and lower prices….. losses began to pile up….then, after a number of months, the long term trend came back and this short term “buy in increments” strategy paid off pretty good.

For me, the long term buy and hold strategy works well for physical.

I will once in awhile play in gold stocks or options. For stocks, one has to be a judicious stock picker….For options, usually only go for long dated calls so I can hold long enough for the long term trend to show and provide profit.

Note: One will not care very much if he bought gold at $1600 or $2100 when the gold price is $3200.

Gold just exceeded $2,000.00.

This. They don't like gold to climb above 2,000 because it harms their US Dollar denominated investments. But they can play that game only so long, and will eventually lose the ability to suppress gold.

I thought it might.

The Kitco page shows it at $1989.

APMEX says it just dropped back down to $1,999.70. Was above earlier this AM though.

APMEX now says back above $2,000.00.

Some big players are trying to push it down below, and it's bouncing back up again on its own steam.

Up $19.60, just in this morning's trading.

Provident metals shows $2000.17/oz.

Up $26.00 is this morning's trading alone. Now $2008.10.

Provident metals shows $2000.17/oz.

APMEX is a much bigger player in this market, and they have spot currently at $2,005.70.

https://goldsilver.com/blog/things-...ontent=279202103&utm_source=hs_email

I'd rather be a year early than a minute late.

Yep and I have written before if one is not comfortable learning and understanding equities, or anything else for that matter, do not do it. If I was putting my money in gold over the past 39 years rather than Fidelity I would have a pittance to what I have gained in equities.

It’s truly hilarious , the equity gurus, touting investment virtues , while being ignorant of the strategy of PMs in a portfolio.

Gold is a hedge, not an investment.

Just look at the stability of gold vs equities during the Great Depression , and you’ll understand why most prudent portfolios have some exposure in PMs .

Hence my question of what percent of one's "investment" should be in a hedge like gold? Yours?

About 10%
Your amount percentage may very

I'm fully diversified. Guns, knives, ammo, food, water, gold, and silver.

👍👍

Roosevelt in January 1934, the Act was the culmination of Roosevelt's controversial gold program. Among other things, the Act transferred ownership of all monetary gold in the United States to the US Treasury and prohibited the Treasury and financial institutions from redeeming dollars for gold.




In my life I saw Nixon legalize Gold, then it 1980 it overshot up to $800/ ounce, before settling down to $400.

In general I have noticed that:
a) Gold, guitars, and guns appreciate at 3%/ year compounded
b) Real estate appreciates at 6%/ year compounded
c) Stocks appreciate at 9%/ year compounded
d) Big tech stocks appreciate at 20%/ year compounded

I get more excited when it goes down than when it goes up. I look at it like it's on sale when the price goes down and I can get more for my buck.

Bb

You guys are doing it wrong.

For a SHTF scenario I buy whores. The best currency ever.




P

Where can a guy get a couple good whores to own?

Target has them.

K-mart too if you can find one. Red light special…

Just be sure to not get them confused with the blue light special whores. It's a trap.

I believe the paper gold and silver markets are holding down the price of precious metals. There is a lot if not most of the gold that is owned on paper that does NOT exist anywhere. The only gold and silver that might help you out in a SHTF scenario is what you can physically lay your hands on. In that case silver would be of more value due to its lesser value per ounce allowing for smaller purchases. And pre 1965 coins would be accepted without assay or suspicion anywhere silver is accepted.

If gold was priced in relation to its true supply without the fake paper gold (and silver) there is no telling how high the price would be. That cannot be allowed due to the exposure of the worthless USD and other fiat money.

Well said. The fake paper gold and silver create the impression to the market that there is many times the amount of gold and silver in existence vs what actually does exist, thus suppressing its value.

Isn't paper currency backed by gold and/or silver fake paper gold and silver?

Only when not 100% backed. Paper gold and silver has only a tiny percentage of backing. During the classical gold standard period in the US, there was a 100% backing requirement. Each note stated on it that the bearer had the right to a particular coin, whether a silver dollar, a $5.00 gold piece, a $20.00 gold piece, or whatever, which had been placed in reserve for them per each note. The contracts for paper gold and silver, however, don't state that. They state that the contract can be settled in gold or silver or US currency.

But, yes, when a gold/silver backed currency doesn't actually have the full backing of gold and silver in reserve for the bearer, there is a similarity, in that it does also create the false impression to the market that there is more of it than there actually is, thus suppressing its perceived value/purchasing power.

Our U.S. dollar paper currency is only backed by the full faith and credit of the U.S. government. The diminishing value of the dollar is reflected in what it will buy which value will fall precipitously when the time comes.

If not for some serious fakery and maneuvering the dollar would collapse now. You might notice that the rest of the world is looking for an alternative (BRICS and others) right now. When those unwanted dollars are returned to the U.S. look out.

I know that. My point was that paper is paper. If an entity (government or not) issuing the paper says that it's backed by a commodity, in the end it is all based on the trust that the entity will back it.


In fact I'd rather trust a contract with a private entity than a country. At least a contract in a county that has good contract law. Governments can change the rules and there's little anyone other than other countries can do about it. De Gaulle knew this and that's why he took gold rather than US backed gold dollars as France's reserve.

Prior to the Federal Reserve, our paper currency was backed by private banks with gold and silver. If you were stupid enough not to investigate whether yours was fiscally responsible before putting your money in it, you lost your money when it went under. Seems like a good system to me, as it rewards the prudent and punishes the reckless. You could even choose to deal mainly or exclusively in real specie coin, if you wanted to be super cautious.

High maintenance and a short shelf life. I would avoid this investment.

I really like finding and selling it…buying??? NEVER

Pics or never happened

His screen name is Middlefork Miner.

I’m betting on him.




P

High maintenance is a myth. And the ROI is phenomenal.





P

If it flies, floats, or fuggs, rent it!

ROI = disease and bankruptcy and sometimes insanity. You could ask Al Capone if he were still with us.

From the J R Ewing School of Business. I’d add horses to that list.

A local car dealer says at the end of every commercial “We’ll trade for anything that don’t eat!” I think he’s on the right track.

At one point after Biden was installed by his puppeteers in the white house (lower case intentional), Pelosi was asked about the billions of dollars in pension & 401K accounts. She replied, “Oh yes, we are well aware. We just have NOT YET figured out how to get our hands on it.”

Yes, it's unfair that some people planned well in advance for a comfortable retirement while others have not. That money needs to be redistributed.

They'll likely seize retirement accounts when Social Security collapses. The Obama boys and their puppet Bidet have a long history of punishing people who act responsibly and rewarding those who don't.

Bb

Pelosi, Biden and the rest of the rats figured out how to steal it already, they just print money. No new taxes needed.

I'm guessing sarcasm but you would be surprised at the number of people who feel exactly like that. One day I heard a lady on NPR state that it was unfair that some people had more than others. She suggested the only fair thing was for the government to take hold of the assets in the country and redistribute them. And she was as serious as a heart attack.

Oh, I know. That's what my sarcasm was intended to illustrate, i.e., that this is actually the view of a huge number of Americans. Which is why such mechanisms for retirement savings aren't at all safe.

PS In the old days, we'd teach kids about the grasshopper and the ant. In the modern world, we merely get government's to steal what the ants have put away for themselves, and redistribute it to both grasshoppers and ants equally.

Of course it’s sarcasm

JFC
JFC
JFC

stop being old

HARD COMMODITIES... PHYSICALLY HELD...

“The Survivalist “ is on right now. All about what can happen when the bad guys come calling.

Good flick.

Easily bartered items like ammo or reloading components.

Knew a rancher who would tell you, "Decide what you can spend on a horse, then go buy that much gold and put it on your mantle. You'll be much better off 5 years down the road!"


"... Our U.S. dollar paper currency is only backed by the full faith and credit of the U.S. government. ..."

Toilet paper is worth more! 😡

Keep your valuable toilet paper and send me your worthless $usd if they’re so useless or I’ll swap you pounds for pounds.

"Pick up the phone, call today, and mention HANNITY for 10% off your first purchase...."