This has been a rough couple days...so I'll keep this short.

As some of you know, cuz I haven't kept much a secret, with regard to my family.....

Well, I got a call the other night...that my father was in a horrible accident and was in ICU....and not in good shape. He had been run over by a truck....etc....etc...and taken by life flight to a hosp.

Well. I had MAJOR mixed feelings, to say the least. As this was the man that made my youth a living and eternal HELL. Let's just say he was abusive...and I still carry the baggage. I haven't talked to him in going on 10 years.....pretty much after he left my mother....and got himself a new wife....and had some new kids. I picked my pieces up and went to Uni......and started my life, as best I could.

Anyhow, I was faced with a decision the other night....call him, for the first time in 10 years....or pretend like it didn't matter....ignore the message....or....or...or...

In short. I called him. I was shaking when his wife got on the phone...literally, shaking like a leaf in a windstorm!! I didn't know what to say...didn't know how to react....was pretty much shooting from the hip, with my responses.

I just needed to know if he was dead...it is sooooo hard to explain.

Anyhow, damn....tried to keep this short and it is dragging.

He wants to see me.

I haven't seen this man in something like 10 years.....but I can't help but hope he has changed and wants to apologize...and make things right....and maybe give some closure...if that makes sense.

What would you guys do? I am ALL ears, cuz...really, I am so confused I don't know what I should do.

I talked to him on the phone and it was like the freakiest thing EVER....I felt like that same vulnerable 15 year old that didn't know how the hell to get myself outta the mess, if that makes sense....but I wasn't that same vulnerable kid...I was an adult, with my chit together....and I could hear the regret in his voice (or maybe I just wanted to hear that...I dunno)...

Sorry for the blab....but some honest opinions would be greatly appreciated......

HoundGirl

HoundGirl, you do what is best for you, no-one else including myself can help with this decision.
Remember, for YOU, not anyone else.
I wish you all the best in this matter.
Regards, J Stuart.

When it comes to decisions like this,no matter which way yo go it'll be ten years or more before you finally KNOW whether you actually made the right decision.So many other things will come into play before it is all over that there is no way to predict all the permutations and combinations.Sometimes you just have to follow your gut feelings and jump in (or out) with both feet.Only you know the pain you'd like to put behind you,or the longings you hope to fulfill.
Once he passes on there will be no further opportunity to deal with either.Just remember that not making a decision is still making a decision.

I think you should see him if you are able. I don't think it will make your relationship any worse and it might do him a world of good, whether or not he deserves it.

Sooner or later he will die. If you don't see him you will wonder for the rest of your life if you should have seen him.

These are my thoughts but JSTUART is right, it has to be YOUR decision. Maybe Mickey will chime in. He always seems to know what's right. I trust his judgement better than my own.

1flier

If I can close my eyes and sleep well then I made the right decision.

The problem most have is not making a decision.

Good luck to you.

i suspect I;ll shake like a leaf.....but I'll see him/hear him.

Hard to hope for the best....but know the worst is just around the corner.

Already been down that stooopid road.

Ned thinks I should see him.

Part of me just wants him to apologize...so we can be friends...part of me knows I am in for another world of hurt.

Just not sure I can deal with NOT having that opportunity to let whatever dance, dance. I am too afraid I will regret it.

I just don't know....I feel tired and confused.

Thanks, for all the input.....I am listening!!

HoundGirl

HG
I was adopted so my "real" father I never knew and the man who adopted me and was enough of a man to be a father to me died over 20 years ago. I'd give more to see and spend time with either than anything else in the world. Just because both were my father.

But that's me and as James said, you need to do what is right for you. You didn't mention his prognosis for recovery and you need to consider that.

If you go to see him, and I hope you do, try not to dwell on scenarios of how the reunion will take place but just go as the person you are to see the man he's become. Expect little but look for all the good you can find, and you will gain from the experience. Maybe a little and maybe a lot, but you will gain more self confidence and self reliance. It seems like a big step now but big steps can bring big gains in our lives. Go see him.

[bleep] regret, that's for weak minded souls.

Make a decision and do what works for you, we always know, it's finally making the decision that is tough.

You've already been offered great advice my dear, here's what I'd add to the situation you seem to be facing.

With this caveat "Past performance doesn't guarantee future results" but it's a damned good indicator at times!

Those folks that have our number, always seem to have it to some degree.

Sounds like he has yours or had it one time and there's a part of you that still wonders if you've really broken free of that.

Wouldn't surprise me a bit as he's facing down his maker that he's some regrets about you and your mother.

Whether they're to the degree you feel appropriate, my guess is it will miss the mark some, maybe not. Maybe he'll show remorse that moves you and you can build a relationship in these later years.

But this I do know whatever you decide has to be up to you as has been stated. And you wouldn't be who you are today without the experiences you've had to bring you to here.

I've no doubt you'd be a different chick had you been the apple of daddys eye and he doted on you as fathers are supposed to do over their daughters.

But then you wouldn't be the you, that we know, and I and many others dig.

Yeah pretty is nice, but it's the stuff you post, your balls, and your thought process that makes you attractive to me.

Wouldn't be the same girl had you been raised different.

Doesn't mean it was easy or right.

But good steel is tempered by fire, not by a warming pad.

I like your mettle. Good luck HG, but know this you got what it takes to see you through regardless of which decision you make in this matter.

Even if you end up feeling like you make the wrong decision (whatever that is) you'll get through it, you either got the right stuff or acquired it along the way. Best to ya darlin'

I didnt have the same kind of childhood that you did.So I cant relate the feelings you have.But.......you and only you ,really know how you feel.Can you forgive him and see him?Can you forgive yourself if you dont?

I know how I treat other people who treat me wrong.I act like they dont exist.I dont say hi to them.I dont talk to them.I dont know if its the right way or the wrong way.But I am happy with thatWhich ever way you go............I wish the best.

Dude, that damn near brought a tear to MY eye.

Should add, I've believed for awhile now that you have LOTS of moxie.

I have FAITH in that, so should you Jane.

have a quick snort Scott, I've used it as a cover for a tear in my eye on occassion. (grin)

one of these days we'll do a few together and see who can make the other cry first by swapping lies and war stories!

I'm a soft touch....

THAT...RIGHT THERE...is my fear! Sorta sickens my stomach, to the nTH degree.

Problem is, I'll never really know unless I try. Bigger problem is trying to figure out if I am making 'hopes' outta hamburger....cuz if I've learned anything in the past couple of years, being home...and trying to help mother, is that a snake is a snake.

Not sure why, but there is a part of me that can't help but hope....and can't help but see the best in ppl....even if their best isn't even there.

My struggle...and, in the end, my short-coming. Sure wish life was simple.

Live and learn...and this is looking to be a big one.

HoundGirl

It's only a short-coming if you can't overcome the effects, which I know you can.

Remember, no good deed ever goes unpunished....

If you go for an appology, you'll probably be dissappointed. The best he could muster doesn't sound like you would accept. I don't know what your situtation is or was but I do know that everyone wish's they had what they precieve to have been a normal relationship with their parent's and/or children. You know what the score is, don't expect anything else. That usually leads to dissappointment. You can carry around these feelings you have or not, that's up to you, but only you can rid yourself of them and that you should do. Likely as not from what little I gather here, he won't help you, at least not in a way you would recognize. If you go see him, he's just a man, just like all other men. Some are very much different than other's and some we just can't accept. Sounds to me like first you have to accept you! Once you do that, dealing with him is just dealing with another person. My son's mother shuned him for many years when he came to live with me. Zero contact. Today he's 34 and still struggles inside with why his mother can't be someone he can accept. She's not and he doesn't have to but he does maintain contact now. The only good that may ever come of it may well be after she's gone he'll know he's done all he could. That's all anyone can do. It seem's obvious to me that you'd really like to go see him, for whatever reason. Do it but do it as an adult, not the kid it sounds like he intimidated. If you can't do that, you'll only hurt yourself again.

Ever have something that rattles your world. Something you THINK you ALREADY have figured out and in it's place? And it up and dances on your 'happy' parade...when things are going really good. When things haven't been easy but the choices you have made are actaully starting to make sense....things are starting to fall into place and make sense to ya?

That is where I am. I am confused and tired and sorta pizzed off at it all. Actually, sorta REALLY pizzed off.

Freaks me out that I use to beg God to take him.....use to think of ways to kill him....just to turn around and melt at the thought of him 'going' before I have a chance to....I don't know....maybe just to see the regret in his eyes....or maybe to give him a chance to ask me to forgive him....or maybe, just maybe, see him as an equal....as an adult...and have it all played out on an equal playing field....were I finally have a voice.

Not sure where this venture will end...and I have no plans on letting it shake my foundation...although, it sure as hell has shook my walls.

Musta looked like a deer in headlights the other night. It's been an INSANE few days.

HoundGirl

Hound Girl,

You and I have not had the opportunity to converse here at the campfire in any real way. I just wanted you to know that many here feel as I do. You are STRONG, girl...you can be very strong! That is just one of the things we most enjoy about your individualness!

I'm guessing that you are the same age as my daughter; possibly younger. My Sara is thirty. When I read your post I was just torn up inside. I couldn't imagine having a non-relationship like that with my Sara. It would kill me. I hope you don't mind my notes here below. I mean nothing but the best for you.

Peace, dear girl,

Mark... aka Bearhuntr



Sure it makes sense. Sounds like you are still pizzed and hurt (rightfully so) yet are full of pity for him as well. I'm thinking that he mighta said some of these things to you on the phone? He shoulda...and that's what a man should do.

It's human nature to, when faced with one's mortality, to CONSIDER an attempt at "righting" some wrongs. It's MORE human nature to want people to feel pity for you when the thought of dying is so near. Somehow, the guilty mind, rather than being embarrassed by admiting guilt, chooses to push that confession aside in favor of seeking pity...thus turning the tables away from self. This is as selfish as it gets. It would be the "thermometer" I would use to gauge one's response.

H.G...You are not in anyway to blame for any of this. This "gentleman" made many bad choices in life and continued up until you did all you could do...leave. You will ultimatly make a choice one way or the other.

If you choose to go and see him...you will do fine. Yours is the moral center of this thing. If you choose not to, there should be no regrets. Your decision will be based on how he handles himself from now on...what he says and how he says it. You are equiped with the stuff that it will take to discern and judge. This I have seen (and observed) from your posts. You DO know how to handle yourself. You will find your confidence

ps. my wife read this over my shoulder and said that you sound like quite the girl...and that was high praise coming from a librarian of 30 years!

Ditto on the others advice ..only you can decide what's right.

Just remember you can be in control of what buttons get pushed ..your not a kid any more your a very cool chick that seems to meet life head on and tackles what gets thrown at ya with great flourish.You'll be ok.

Yep, the replies have remarkably good counsel, with wisdom that comes from pain experience. I think you'll be glad you gave him a chance to ask forgiveness by at least seeing him, but like others have said, his MO is pretty well set so don't get your hopes up for anything. You're going to have some twisted psyche for awhile no matter what you do, just from reviving the memories. Grace is the operative word in your title. Grab onto some. You'll be strong in my mind over the next few days.

HG

If you want to go, go, but don't expect any more than that you gave him one last chance. If it goes better than that...great. If not, you did your part in trying. I'm sometimes willing to go more than half way in these type of situations and afterwards, wonder why. But at least I gave it a shot.

I'm not as optimistic as some of these folks and I don't want you to set yourself up to get hurt. But pain is just part of life, so long as you can handle it, so what the heck.

Having some idea of what you went through, I'd tell him to screw off and not look back, but that's just me and that's why you're probably a better person than I. Whatever that means.

Your husband knows you better than any of us (except maybe for Steely ), so you should give particular attention to what he thinks is best for you.

However it comes out, you will still be what you are and that's pretty good. Don't expect any more than the opportunity for things to go the way you hope.

You probably should go, but you don't have to. I won't think less of you if you don't, that's for sure.

Best wishes are with you, regardless.

HG,

This reminds me of my father and how hard he was on me as I grew up. We put distance in front of us for over 15 years. When we finally started to communicate we never really addressed the past.

Two years ago at the age of 79 my father had a fatal heart attack before we ever had that talk.

If you have it in you, have that talk before it's to late..............................My guess is that when he see's his beautiful daughter he will be brought to tears.

I forgave my father...........but I never conveyed that to him personally. I regret that!

I wish you the best, stay strong!


From the woods of Maine,
Mark

Houndgirl-I think you are a remarkable lady, and I wish you all the best with your decision on this tricky matter. If you choose to go, go with your eyes, head, and heart wide open, but still guarded. My overriding thought here is that somewhere, sometime,down the road, you'll be at pease with the thought that you went to him in his time of need. He may not want to see you, but at least you made the effort. On the other hand, if he's going to meet his maker shortly, he may want you there to attone for his past. My prayers go out to you, 'girl. I pray that you find the wisdom, strength, and courage to make the decision that's best for you. Godspeed, 'Girl.

Hey Sis,
I reckon your gonna do it.I reckon ya feel ya gotta.
Keep in mind that xpectations often lead to resentment...and keep an open mind.You won't regret it.
Lotsa love,Me.

Do what ya will but I say [bleep]'um,being on deaths door 'aint the time to make things nice,had he come to this revelation on his own without the Maker tugg'in at his shirt tails may be a different story.Do what's best for you and makes YOU feel right, and I'll say an extra prayer or 2 for ya for peace of mind on which ever road ya take.

To me it sounds a lot like that tooth that you recently had to get pulled,.. and caused you all that anxiety.

It didn't bother you anymore afterwards, did it?

Go get this tooth pulled.

Sounds to be a tough decision. I haven't walked in your boots so I can only offer this...A person can pretend to care , but they can't pretend to be there.....I hope all works out well...

+ 1,000...

I'd go see him...

HoundGirl,

I believe that this has happened at this time in your life for a reason. You are a strong, well centered adult now and facing your demons could be the final step in closing the chapter on that part of your life. Whatever you feel like on the inside, he does not need to see that, You are able to control how you act on the outside and show him what a powerful and capable woman you have become despite the treatment he gave. If the worst happened and he wanted to see you just to rattle your chains one more time, you are strong enough to walk away knowing that you did the right thing. I think that if you did not see him that you would end up wondering all of the rest of your life if it was the right decision or not. In the end you have to have peace with how YOU treated others not with how he did. Regardless of whether he deserves it or not, you have to make sure that what you do is the right thing for you and the thing that will make you feel that you are not shortchanging yourself or acting out of spite. Steelhead is right about his behavior shaping you though. You would not be you if you did not go through life as you did, good or bad. I will pray that the right decision comes to you and that you are given the strength to face it.

BigMamma

+1

My dad had this relationship with his father. He didn't go see him. And I don't think he ever regretted it. Personally I don't think you are ambivilant...and as such you still want it to get better. If you want that then give it a chance. You are strong and even if he spits in your face you will survive. You will be fine and you will get over it.

Give it a shot good luck either way!

I respectfully disagree, all though I do understand the sentiment. I feel that God often uses a near death experience to shake people into reality. For some it is the only thing that works.
He says to "Do what's best for you..." What is best for you? Forgiveness. I feel that you have forgiven him or you would not even consider seeing him. And having forgiven him you are hoping for the best and for a major change in his personality.
My sister has been estranged from my family for years. She and my father clashed constantly in her teen years. She left at 18 never to return home. Dad hired detectives and found out where she had gone. Then spent more than he could afford flying around and attempting to bring her home. My sister, being a pathological liar, has never really changed. I have not seen her in over 20 years but, I have talked to her often.
My point in all this is that, even though my sister has not changed, I have forgiven her for the trauma she has caused in my family over the years. I have tried to turn her around. I have tried to get her to forgive dad for whatever wrong she feels he has done, real or imagined. I have done my part and even though not successful, I have done all I could. Maybe a near death experience would knock her into reality?
The Bible instructs us to forgive or we will not be forgiven. Even if you don't believe in God or the Bible it has a lot of wisdom that even the atheheists could live by.
My best to you. Matt. 6:14&15

HG, Go I have been exactly in your shoes,remember this, YOU are not the same person he used to abuse,you are much stronger and wiser now! You are much more able to handle that crap now. If it's the same old stuff all over again,walk,what I learned is now you don't have to take it,YOU are truly free! What a great feeling that you don't have to listen to that stuff any more! whatever you do it's for YOU! Best wishes Dave

HoundGirl,
I don't know the whole background but my wife went thought a similar issue last year. Her old man went into the hospital for a serious heart attack and did the same soul searching after about 17 years of NO contact. I told her the same things others are telling you: YOU'RE the only one who knows what's right and whatever you do is the right thing. Since I'm kind of an SOB (according to her family) I also told her that she didn't have to be nice if she did see him, but she could say her peace and be done with it.

George

I agree with Ricky. Go without expectations (difficult to do, I know). If he begins to slip into his abusive mode, leave. Remember, you are in control, not him.

I think if you don't go, you may regret it later (perhaps after he has died, and there is no chance of talking to him face-to-face).

Pray as you are able, even if it's just to cry out to God. He will accompany you on this journey, give you strength, and hold you up when you need it.

My prayers are with you.

Penny

HG,
Quit worrying about getting an apology, mending the past, or somehow finding a decent relationship between your father and self.None of that may ever happen.


Just forgive him in your own heart for his failures and abusive treatment and LET IT GO.

You can call him, write him, and tell him so or not, but this is essential for YOU to do.

IF you don't, the "sins" of the father will trouble you, your husband, family for years.
No matter how strong you aspire to be.... hate and anger will twist you and trouble-influence you so much of what you really need and want in close relationships is tainted...

Let it ALL GO.
Forgive, and inasmuch as is humanly possible with the Lord's help:

FORGET
( refuse to remember) even as our Lord does for any who ask forgiveness of Him.
He forgives AND chooses not to remember past failures.

That's all I have to say.Jim

Jane, if I were in your place, part of my wanting to go talk to him would be to show him that I had triumped... in SPITE of his abuse... and grown up into a reasonable, successful adult. I would want him to look at me and say, "Wow." Call it ego or vanity (I always struggle with both of those things), but I would want to "show him."

And that's okay... it's prefectly all right to feel that way. And also, part of my wanting to go see him would be to see if, finally, we could have a relationship similar to what I had longed for so long ago.

Here's one last thing that I shared with a prison inmate once: forgiveness does NOT mean that what the other person did to you was okay. Forgiving and condoning are two very different things. If you find yourself at a place where you think you might be able to forgive your father, remember that forgiving him does NOT mean that you're saying what he did to you was okay. Sometimes the distinction between those two things gets blurred, and it makes forgiveness even more difficult than it already is.

Sending you my love and hugs, and praying for you...

Penny

HoundGirl,

Do what's right for you and yours.

The worse thing you could do is to see him and revert back to where you were when you last saw him. Be the strong individual that you have become, and do not expect anything (or at least keep your expectations low).

If you decide to see him, go to hear him out. Then do what's best for you.

My wife always had a rough relationship with her Mom, who was not much of a mom. It wasn't until my wife really came to terms with their relationship, felt really comfortable with who she had become, and decided that you can't change history and sometimes can't even make up for it, that she is able to deal with her mother. Now she deals with her Mom on her own terms. And although she would love to have had, and have, a mother/daughter relationship with her Mom, she had to make peace with the fact that it may never happen. Mostly now they have a cordial relationship.

Oh yeah, you better give Ned a big hug, as I'm sure that he is carrying his share of the weight on this.

Be strong,

Chris

I can't disagree with anything anybody has posted HG. Great advice here. But I might add this also; keep in mind that when you were 15, 14, 13, etc., etc., it probably was sort of hard to come up with an alternative, where as now, if things aren't real swell, or start out swell but turn south, you can shut the door. There might be several feathers here for your collection too. Still, you know more than any of us about what's right for you to do.

There is a lot of good advice. I do not know if this adds anything, but I too would do what you feel you should do and I would include Ned. I would not plan on looking for more than what you have gotten in the past from your father, but look at this as an opportunity to clear your past. What do you want out of the reunion, not what you are looking for him top do. If you want to show your father that you have survived and moved on in spite of this, then do it. If you want to use this as your opportunity to say goodbye, then do it. I think the comment about making this a positive experience for you was dead on. If you honestly believe that nothing good will come out of this for you, then why do it. This may sound selfish, but you have spent a lifetime recovering and attempting to put this all into perspective, why waste all that effort on a selfish SOB. While I do not know your past, I grew up in a strange situation and have been forced to face many abuse issues with my sisters, parents, relatives and close family friends. Everyone chooses to handle them differently, but the one thing I can say, is that his actions had nothing to do with your actions at the time. This is an opportunity for that all to change. Even if he is a jerk, you will have demonstrated to yourself that you can overcome that control. Outside all this rambling: If you can make this a positive experience for you, then go, if not, why drag up all the hate anymore than you have to.

Whatever you do....Do it on your terms....

HG, you know what YOU need to do.... if he's an ass..adjust his chart a little.. you know, like schedule him for a circumsision and leave... 721

Hope it all works out for 'ya, Lady.

Will do a little quiet prayin' for that over here.

Trust your instincts, and don't drop your shields entirely.

GTC

In a word OUTSTANDING and very Sage Advice! At the end of the day you always want to say "No Regrets". If you can sleep well at night then you have done the right thing but in the end do what is best for YOU!

I think that you should go and see him and take along some of the good advice that has been offered by others here. You may well not get forgiveness as he may not fully understand or appreciate the impact of his past actions. My father made a living hell for me and my siblings, we are all dealing with it in our own way. It took me well into adulthood to forgive him and realize that he was reacting to his own upbringing and abusive parents. I have tried to break that cycle with my own child, hopefully I have been somewhat successful. I miss my father now that he is gone and choose to focus on the few good times we had that almost exclusively have to do with hunting and fishing. As was mentioned earlier you are the one in charge now so go see Dad with no fear or expectations and show him the great person you have become.

HG
Some classy stuff has been given to you here!

Sorry to hear of this in some ways, but it is an opportunity for you. Rolling with it will not be your problem, nor will saying your piece. It is all about what you come away with and how that gets shaped over time. Expect no instant fixes and you will be better off.

I assume by now you have seen him... I know you did/will because head-on is the only way you roll. And that is probably best for you right here and now.

The only thing of substance I would add is the need to make sure any apologies he makes are laid bare for exactly what they are. If you allow him to skirt the issue he might feel he repented like a streetwalker in confession and you might have missed it completely. Not saying you need to hang him up for interogation, just make sure and lead him the easy way to saying what is right.
art

Have forgiven those that have tresspassed against me,but still say [bleep]'um your outta my life now...thats just my way I guess,don't have any tolerance for those that abuse women and children

My girlfriend actually just went through a similar situation with her real father. Although he was not in an accident, and they had more contact that it sounds like you and your father had but they had been talking more and they met in San Fransisco for vacation recently and it actually turned out very well. She got a lot of questions answered that she didnt understand when she was younger. Whatever you decide to do just make sure its what you want and to try to keep a level head about it. Whatever you decide I wish you the best of luck.

I saw your point. We can forgive those who have done us wrong and move on. Forgiving does not mean we have to trust, condone, or have anything to do with that person.

We can forgive for our own well being. To shake off the dust of the past. Simply lay down that baggage and refuse to carry it one more step. Someone already said forgiving does not mean condoning. One can forgive a small slight and continue a relationship. One can also forgive and let God judge / condem. Some times forgiving does include saying Puck'em and walking away.

This is a tough decision you have facing you HG. But don't fret too much I have no doubt you'll make the right choice.

HBB

I simply can't thank you guys enough for all the great advice and well wishes.

He is going to live....although, he has a long road of rehab and recovery ahead of him. He was run over by a truck. From what I understand, the lady accidently put her car into reverse and hit the gas like she was in drive. The truck wheels sucked him under and the truck ran over his entire body, including his head. He has bruised kidneys, spleen, liver...etc...countless broken ribs and serious head trauma. The doctors said it was a miracle that it didn't kill him. Ironically, the head trauma has affected his memory....and he isn't very lucid....but should recover, for the most part.

In short, I suspect I will go and see him. I will go withOUT expectations...and with my guard up. After all, this is the man that use to beat the livin chit out of me and toss me around like a rag doll. The same man that use to make me watch while he kicked/punched the dog...and every time I'd scream he'd kick her harder. The same man is still in there....as is the same skinny little defenseless kid is in me. 10 years may have passed....and he may be doing better with his new kids.....but it will never change the past....NEVER.

I got a lot on my plate right now....but I am going to keep the same promise I made to myself when I left....'I'd rather be dead than let my past keep me from my future'....nomatter how crazy and scary it might feel....

Thanks, again....for all the thoughtful advice and direction. You guys are the bestest!!!

HoundGirl

HoundGirl,

There's some sage advice in your post. Don't ever forget it.

Best to you and Ned,

Chris

PM Sent.

Keep your chin up, sweetie. You'll be fine.

HG,

....'I'd rather be dead than let my past keep me from my future'....

That is a very telling and profound statement!! It says alot about who you are and the spirit you have. It may not be fun, but you will get through this and life will go on.

Best wishes to you and Ned

Jeff

Go see him, without any expectations. Don't be dissappointed if it goes south. You will always wonder otherwise, and let him add yet another regret to your baggage. He's your father, and that should count for something, if only for a chance to make his eventual passing better than the past several years.

The term father is used too loosely. A father is someone who raises and nurtures ya, being a sperm donor don't make ya a father...

Hey Girl, I'm sorry I didn't find this thread last night! I can't add anything any better than has already been said, but know that whatever you went through growing up helped you become the girl we all know and love now. You've handled it well, to say the least. If you go see this person expecting an apology, you may not get it; but that's got nothing to do with who YOU are. Stand tall, and if you need a hand to hold, we're here...Ken & Mrs Bulletbutt.

True.

Atta girl, wish more people thought like that! Learn from the past, don't live there.

HG, I've lived through some of the same stuff. Once my father became a broken down old man I couldn't hate him anymore even when I tried. I stayed pizzed for a lot of years even after the threat ended but it finally reached a point where there was no point to continuing anger or hatred cause it sure hurt me more than him. Regrets are hard to express for anyone. Just make yourself realize he can't physically hurt you like he did before and he can only jerk you around if you let him. Best wishes, Ward

HG; Sounds like you have already made up your mind.

If you don't go, you will likely be "what-if-ing" for the rest of your life.

Good folks here: it sounds like you've pretty much gotten everything you need before I arrived on the scene, so to speak.

I have to say, though, that I disagree with the folks who say only you can know what is right. I don't think that's the way right works.

We don't get to decide what's right: what we do get to do is measure our character against what's right and see how we come out.

I'm not particularly concerned about how you'll come out. But Penny and I will keep you in our prayers.

HG, I didn't read the whole thread, but it seems like there is plenty of good advice. I'm adopted, have never known my biological parents, and have absolutely no interest in meeting them. They mean nothing to me, because they were never a part of my life. If I found out one of them were in a bad accident, I wouldn't be compelled to visit them.

I lost my dad this spring, he had a relatively short bout of cancer, was diagnosed around Christmas time. He was in and out of the hospital for awhile, but then we managed to make it down to visit for a week, a month before he decided to no longer be fed through a tube. I talked to him a few days before he finally passed away. That was a very meaningful time to me. He was a good man, and I was blessed to say without any remorse that we were at peace with eachother before he passed. It would have been harder for me having not seen him before he went.

As to your situation, that's a tough one. You need to do what is best for you. It sounds like seeing him again is going to open up alot of old wounds. He's the sort that would rub salt in those wounds. That will be tough on you, tough on Ned, and others in your immediate family. If you're strong enough and have healed enough to face him and say, while there is nothing he can do to make up for his F-up's, you forgive him, then it will help you heal.

But considering how torn up you are about this, you might not be in the state to face him. And if he died before you got to see him, I'd see that as the Lord's way of protecting you from someone who hurt you in the worst possible way, and might just do it again as a matter of his nature.

I can't see much good coming out of making contact with such an individual. He's more than failed on any and all obligations he's had as a father.

HG
Walk in like you got the biggest set of go-nads in the town. Speak from a position of strength and not fear. You might be filling your drawers but don't let him know. Don't be afraid to look him in the eye and let him know; without saying it, you got your act together and you can't hurt me no more. I've moved on, how about you? I think after a few minutes he'll figure it out. You aren't 13 anymore. kwg

HG, remember Dad's are the ones that raise you, fathers are just sperm donor's. Les

Hello I don't really know you or him. My suggestion would be to look inside yourself really deep and ask yourself if you CAN forgive him. Many times forgiveness is not a two way street. If you cannot find it inside to forgive him without his asking you, you will most likely never be able to fully forgive him. If you do, look at it from all angles and possibly find out if you can what it is that made him the way he was when you were younger(nothing is an excuse for abuse, but there may be a reason he became that way) He may even have changed possibly. Maybe even your leaving and his losing you may have been a catalyst for that change. Possibly you could empower yourself and do some research into his behaviour the last 10 years to see if there is an arc of changing and repair. It really sucks but to get past it you may have to decide to be the bigger person and gird yourself against him and go and see him even if just to put that behind you and "check that box"in your emotional development. If you do go and see him make absolutely sure to go with a most trusted friend and not alone. That will give just that more of a shield against feeling alone and trapped in the situation. From your writing that seemed to be an aspect of what you feel when you return in your memmories to that time in your life.

But as I said I don't really know you or your history so I cannot really give you perfect advice if such a thing exhists.

I will pray for you that you find a path in the coming days to walk with out fear.

Hit em' Hard
Matthew

Under similar conditions and an identical situation I forgave but never forgot.

He was being treated for cancer and before we could arrange a meet he up and died.

The only regrets I have are the miserable life he created for our Mom and us kids.

I did not attend the funeral.

Cut people like that loose, never look back...

Family can be cull, been said before, and I'm all for it....

What Scott said. You did it once.

Any sumbitch that would hurt a child deserves the worst that can be imagined. Saying sorry so one feels better at the end of the day is chit.

He hurt you in a way that we'll never know. Don't give him any satisfaction. If/when you see him, walk in with your head up and look the bastid straight in the eye so he knows he didn't break you. If calling him everything but a white man makes you feel better, do it.

I wish you and Ned the very best.

Mac

A lot depends on the type of abuse. If he is only verbally abusive...well hell, I get accused of that all the time (without merit, I might add). If he's physically abusive, that ain't likely to be the case anymore, and he might regret it and you could end up finding some foregiveness in your heart. If he was sexually abusive - that's a real tough one. I think that in the end, you gotta make your decision based on whether YOU are capable of forgiving him. If not, nothing positive can result from the meeting. Good luck.

HG;

Be careful.

Make sure that if you let him back in your life, you're ready to have what he was, and might still be, back in your life.

Think about that before you tell him, or anyone around him, where you are and what you're doing.

Good luck, and yeah, you've got more moxie than most I've ever met.

Hat's off to you, girl.

VA

Glad you mentioned it. It never occurrd to me that HG would actually let him back in her life in any meaningful way. I absolutely would not do that. If Jane wants to, its up to her, but I can't imagine doing that.

I'd listen to BD and SH before I did anything other than try to make peace and move on.

HG
You've already proven that you can turn out fine with him out of your life. No need to let him back into your life, if you find out he'd still be detrimental to your happiness and peace. You've got Ned, and a life of your own.

About 20 years ago I came to the conclusion that "Sooner or later, we all have to stop hoping for a better past."

I suspect you are there as well...and if you are, you will have the strength to deal with this episode.

Goodness and strength to you. Always feel free to call...

DN

Sometimes one has to drive through the ghetto...or not. If you do, do so with windows up and doors locked.

Be friendly and polite, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

Go with your gut, mind and your heart. All three seem to have served you quite well thus far !!

I appreciate every single post on this thread. I appreciate the thoughtful PMs. Most of all, I appreciate the friendships....and the honesty.

I will keep you all posted.

Life is good...and I plan on keeping it that way. Keeping the promise, as mentioned earlier.

You all are the bestest of the best!!!

HoundGirl

I'm not much for forgiveness, and even less for sentimentality so TTFWIW: You don't owe him even minimal respect or consideration. He owed you. He had his chance and blew it. I had the best dad in the world but his father was a violent, hateful prick. I watched my father try to come to terms with my grandfather and I became convinced that he would have been far better off if he'd just cut the cancer out of his life. Some things I just don't get.

He screws up your life and now that the grim reaper is outside the door he feels guilty and afraid of that final judgement. Why let him clear his conscience?

HG Bart's advice is the best you can get. Dang them Texans are always short and to the point.

Pat

HG, i find it very difficult to go see my father, he was and still is the biggest azz I have ever known, he is a biggot and a hypocrit and I really never got along with him. But i do occasionally when I cannot come up with a good excuse go see him. i still have thesame feelings I had as a kid towards him but he is my father and for some morbid reason I feel I must see him. Thank goodness my sister has him and not me. But then I have not seen my oldest son in seven years his sister has not seen him in five years, this is one disfunctional family. Thank god for my present family with out them I probably would have turned into my father. Go see your dad on your terms then leave on your terms. No other way to keep sane.

Bullwnkl.

I'd be a liar if I didn't admit that I have those same feelings. I mean, what right does he have to get to CHOOSE when he gets to bounce back into my life, regardless of his circumstances. No doubt.

No doubt I'll carry the bill for HIS decision...no doubt I'll come out short, in the short term. No doubt he is reaching out for selfish reasons. No doubt the only reason he is willing to even see me and revisit the the sick chit he did...is for selfish....self-serving reasons. No doubt.

Does he deserve the opportunity that I may, or may not, give him? In human terms, prolly not. In the eyes of the Lord, yes. It is a hard dance...and a struggle for me, to say the least.

What I do know...is what I need. I am a simple girl and closure, good, bad, or indifferent....is still closure...to me. I also know what Grace has afforded me thus far. It is something I bank on...and it ALWAYS pays off.

Just wanted to say, though, I understand the 'go on and never look back' theory. I have made the last 10 years out of it. I am done running and I am ready to face the ugly, as I have since I hit back home two years ago. My father is the last leg in the race, so to speak....and I wanna SHOW him that he didn't bury me....he just made me stronger.

It is hard to explain...but when someone beats the chit out of you for years and years and years....tells you that you are dumb and ugly...and not worth anything....and tells you day in and day out that nobody is ever gonna love you....and you ain't never gonna be able to take care of yourself....and on and on and on...and all the head games....it might feel DAMNED good to face that same person, your father...the person(man) that is suppose to protect and love you....stand tall and SHOW him ALL the BEAUTIFUL things you managed to scrape together in light of all the abuse.

Validation....and on some level a respect. Not for him but for me....ME. Nothing more, nothing less.....just the [bleep] TRUTH...in his face....to chew on.....like the [bleep] chit he left ME to chew on.

Damn. Now I am in pizzed off mode.

Thanks again....for all the insight...it makes me think. And I got a whole lotta thinking to do.

HoundGirl

Normaly, I stay out of these type of threads. But since reading this one again tonight, I'll give you my 2 cents. Based on the fact that he was abusive, both physicaly and verbaly, instantly makes we want to say forget his ass. But, I strongly suspect you do indeed want to go see him, before he dies, possibly. So I'd go into ICU and give him the first words.

I have no time for abusive sons a bitches like that. For a man to act that way and do those things to his own daughter is beyond disgust. How a man can be like is beyond understanding to me.

Were it me, I'd call him on the phone and tell him to [bleep] off and die.

Were I you, I'd go there and give him a chance to see what comes out of his mouth.

I did not read everyones posts. My response is based purely out of the facts you made mention of - his abuse to you - and my personal hatred towards bastards in this world like him.

Very good luck.

May the light of this new day bring you peace........

Stay strong,

Mark

...Nobody's ever going to love you?

Heck: take Ned with you, and also a copy of this thread!

Sis,
Takes alot of courage to revisit the dark-side.Gotta do it though...to put them demon's to rest.
Kinda like a [bleep] diaper...it stinks to high heaven...but it gotta be taken care of.

Going in to this expecting someone else to do the right thing is setting yourself up for major disappointment. Doing it because it's the right thing for YOU to do and not expecting anything in return is more realistic. Anything that may be resolved would be a bonus, but the true purpose is to do the right thing in your own mind. Others can't let you down if you don't expect too much... Best of luck with your decision & do what you feel is right. While it will be a very tough decision, it may bring closure to old wounds.

Them dang xpectations keep rearin their ugly heads eh.

I never even met your father and I despise him. Don't know how your deal will pan out but I remember my dad trying to make the Hump see how my father had amounted to something after all. The "See? You were wrong--I am successful with a great wife, family, house, and dog" gambit always backfired. My grandfather just took credit for making my dad the success he became. I suppose, in a perverse way that was true, but the Hump never deserved any thanks for it.

My dad should have (metaphorically) buried his father the day he moved out of his house.

Why not?

Penny

YES!!!! You go, girl!!! You've got it...

Penny

Yep. You will never regret doing the "right" thing.

HG,

He was dead wrong. You are very valuable to us. We all find you to be a wonderful person and a very witty woman who knows who she is. I think you are one of the best. You are a winner. He is the loser. It would have been an honor to have had you for a daughter. You'll never know how much joy I get from reading your posts. You have such a way with words.

Keep your chin up and have no regrets. Be the one in charge. You can do it. No doubt there. Remember......you're the winner.

Jim

Funny thing about the past - as much as people try to change it, they can't.

I know one thing, and that is that scared 15 year old girl would not even consider visiting him. You are not that 15 year old. From what I've observed in my brief time here, you are one very strong woman. In the South, we call them "Steel Magnolias".

You are the one in control now. He can no longer hurt you unless you let him.

It takes a lot of courage and character to do what you are about to do. That is a rare trait these days.

You are about to face one of your greatest fears in your life, and you will prevail. You may feel you are about to venture into the valley of the shadow of death, but you are the one with all the cards here. If he starts in again, let him know he is not going to hurt you anymore and he has no control over your life. You are giving him a rare chance which most people who have wronged others would never get. If he throws it away, that is his decision, not yours.

Hang in there and remind yourself that he is weak and you are strong.

God bless you.

Actually you can change the past. Events of the past obviously can't be changed, but our perception of them and how they affect us can be changed.

I'm glad glad Jesus doesn't pick and choose whom he will forgive,your father may not deserve forgiveness but if you will forgive him I believe you will be the winner in the long run!!

HG
I know I am new around these parts, but from what I have seen from you, you are a wonderful LADY .
I have just read this entire thread, and I have bounced back forth quite a bit on what I think. Let me say this FWIW.
My oldest is a boy we adopted. Both the Sperm Donor and Incubater that birthed him were physicaly and Sexually abusive to him from toddeler age till he was taken out the "home" at age 8. He suffered horrible things at thier hands. Many nights he still wakes with tears or screams ( even now 8 yerars later) thinking he was back in that awful inviroment YET he still wants to see them again at some point in the future. Every time I have heard him ask if this could happen I cringe inside. I HATE the thought of MY child suffering more at thier hands, but the answer I have always given is this. If when you reach adulthood YOU truly want to go see either one, you certainly may . And you can do so knowing that I will be at your side for every step if you want me. No guilt trip from me here at all just a teather to his new reallity and a safety valve if things start to go wrong. As some one said earlier once a person figures out how to push yuour buttons they can ( and likely will) do it forever.
I think it is important to have that grounding / safety net there with you. Perhaps this would be Ned for you or maybe someone else who has always been a source of love and comfort as you have grown into the good woman that you are now. But whoever it might be Iw ould strongly advise not going alone.

Sounds like you have a real good handle on the situation. The one question that needed to be asked, and sounds like you already have answered..would he have called if he wasn't on his back in the hospital?

Take solace that this time around he will be the one shaking, looking into your eyes & knowing. Hear him out, but give him nothing, he has a lot of work to do. Will he work at it, or is he looking for a quick & easy "get out of guilt card".

The worst that can happen? Well, maybe him trying to explaining to you why you or Mom were party to blame; about that time the only question you have left is where you and Ned are going eat on the way home.

Good luck to you, you'll do fine.

She doesn't have to see him to forgive him....

a point that seems to have been missed

I have no beef with Jesus forgiving anyone.

Nope. I didn't miss the point, and it was a valid point he made, no doubt. Can't argue against the fact you can forgive him without seeing him.

That said, seeing him...and confronting him physically...as an adult, might give some closure. That is what I am struggling with....whether or not it is worth it...and whether or not it better serves him...or I. Hope that makes sense.

Truthfully, a part of me wants to see him vulnerable and broken....desperate....and discouraged. A part of me is not a nice person...and I get off on the fact he is 'physically' hurting....and struggling with the fact he is, indeed, trapped...without choices and direction. Not nice, by any means...but if I were to be honest....there is some sort of validation in the way life has played out for him, AND my mother...for that matter.

Like I said...not a moment has past in the last week that I am not struggling with 'what' I should 'do'....and whom, and for what reasons, I am doing it.

May seem all clear as a bell for most of you...but it is proving to me a real struggle for me...on many levels.

I just don't wanna make a mistake....cuz when I make them <mistakes>....they tend to be grand...

Thanks, again, for all the great input and perspective. I am truly listening....and I truly appreciate all the different experience that goes into all these posts.

HoundGirl

You have a "bigger dog" in this fight ......... (grin)

Blessings to you.

HG... I'd go see him, but like folks said not expect much.

Could be that the best way to leave all that crap behind is to forgive him anyway.

Birdwatcher

HG. you will feel a relief of pressure from your soul when you see him. forgiving someone that has done you bad is the most enlighting thing you can do for yourself and its what god wants you to do .

I can't describe the feeling it gives you as I am not educated enough to know the right words. but trust god on this one and you will get to where you want to be..

So many times in life you reap what you sow...........................He is now reaping from all the pain he dished out..!

Sometimes being the "bigger, better person" takes courage. Seeing him will take that courage and likely you will gain far more than you give.

From all that you have said , you are the "bigger, better person"...........Now show him that you are everything that he said you could never be.....and more !!!!!



Mark

My dw will confirm that I can hold a grudge with the best of them, I'd be quite likely to send him a bouquet of excerement & wish him none of the luck in the world, just me but if he did me as wrong as you believe he did to you thats as much contact as I'd want.

Very well said.

+1

VERY well said.

Bob

Taking the liberty to change the post to "folks that HAD your number".

The adult person that you are now will Not let people jerk them around by their emotions.