I'm in a situation that involves some back wages owed to me, and have been for some months now.

For a period of time I had been being paid at a rate that accounting (boss's wife) "thought" I was to be paid. However, that was not the rate I had been told I would receive and had agreed to work for. My records, as well as their admittance, shows a balance of just over $4000 owed to me.

I have received a substantial raise since that time period, but those back wages have still not been made right.

I had the 3rd conversation concerning this matter with my boss today, and I got the same answer as I did the past 2 times....
Quote; "I dont know, I'll have to talk to "name of wife" about it."

Again, that's the 3rd time I've been told this.

Call me skeptical or just aggravated, but it doesn't seem like this matter is a priority of concern to my boss... and I am feeling a bit blown off by lack of responsibility taken to rectify the matter.

Obviously I'd like to get PAID.
I know all about catching more flies with honey than with vinegar, but my patience (and attitude) is running pretty thin.


That said, I'm wondering if some here might have some suggestions as to "what next."

Get em together in the same room and ask again.

Is any of this in writing?

Does your state have a wage division within it’s department of labor? This might be the nuclear option if you continue to get stiffed.

Most states have a provision to file a lien. Some type of documentation would be needed. Legal advice is always good.

Talk to them both, at the same time, with any and all documentation you have about it.

This

Then yell

Are you MFer’s gonna pay me or not!!!

Conversing with both, together, sounds like the answer.

Unfortunately, No. None of it is in writing.

Also, Politely mention it is far cheaper to deal directly with you than your lawyer !

How about something like this, "Say boss, my check is wrong. I'm a dumbass for never mentioning it for the last 6 months but I was waiting to see what Jack Ryan said to do."

Do you like your job??

They seem to like you, they gave you a raise...

Can they afford to write you a check for $4000????

Could you accept the amount owed in installments??

Do you want to hit them up for interest??

Like others have said: ALL 3 parties in the discussion at the same time. Ask when the remittance will start. Offer to take $500 additional per normal check, till balance is paid if you wish... Raise the subject of interest, if you wish.....

Definitely talk to them together. Present a copy of the documentation, not the original. Tell them you need to get paid because you have bills to pay, too.

You do have legal options but that doesn't mean you can exercise them without practical impact. They can't legally fire you for it but they might find / create (and document) other reasons, so I'd say think carefully before doing or saying anything provocative unless you have already found another job. I've even seen that done by state / federal agencies (not over back-pay, but over other things) and in the private sector you're at least as vulnerable.

Tom

If you like your job and wage, be delicate but firm about it. 4K is a lot but not enough to burn bridges over and be looking for a new job if that can be avoided.

In the local market your skills are a hot item and I suspect you could start Monday for more than a few different employers.

All three of you in the same room at the same time is exactly right, IMO. Lots of property owners and managers are still waiting to get earthquake repairs done...Seems foolish for them to act that way now. Be direct but not aggressive and they should come around pretty quickly.

This would a good way to start, harsher measures if this fail. I've never been stiffed, but then nobody wanted to see how far I'd go to collect!

I laugh just trying to wrap my head around the idea of someone seeing you coming with bad intent...

Laughing!

Yes, I like my job, I like my boss, and I would like to see this resolved.

The tough part is, I believe it was a simple miscommunication that went unnoticed for too long and now I "feel" awkwardly uncomfortable, like I'm the "bad guy" rocking the boat for pressing the matter.... but in reality I know I'm not out of order and further more that I'll not receive those wages unless I press for them.

Yes.

I probably needed to hear that Art.

Bingo

The substantial raise is/was likely intended by wife to cover the initial shortage. Now, you asking for the back pay, cuts into her plan for giving you a bigger raise than they normally would have.


Pitting him vs wife is not good, therefore you need to speak to both at the same time.

FWIW

I have been in your exact situation before. It was a big annoyance. I let the guy pay me in installments after getting a decent raise. He never finished the installments, and they too became late and some shorter.

I knew he had $$$ problems and home problems, and he needed the $ more than I did, so honestly I let it go.

He was a very deeply troubled, but also a very very good man. I am sure we all know someone like him.

He lost his business (no surprise) then his house, and family, and then his life. I think he was 50.

I hope yours works out better. Just made me think of Dennis.

I hope you get your money without causing hard feelings

Maybe your husband could go talk to them for you.

Get them in the same room and get an agreement before you leave. Document the agreement and get 2 signatures. If they break the agreement go directly to small claims court and tell the judge "I did the work, I need to get paid for it". Anything beyond that, you will need the court finding that they owe you x amount. You cannot get a lien against the business for the owed money without the court finding you are owed the money.

If they won't make the agreement and sign it, or if they break the agreement, then you are working for the wrong people and burning that bridge costs you nothing, and they will not bad mouth you to other employers because you have the documentation and can go right back to the judge with a damage claim if they do.

A few friendly text reminders will go a long ways. Plus if they text you back you have something in writing. My old boss would never put it in writing so he could squirm out of it later. I did getting to text back a few times and then I had something to show the board. He learned quick though and quit texting back.

Bb

Have a letter delivered by mail from an attorney friend, on their letter head, expressing the leagle aspect, and interest involved in unpaid wages.

With nothing in writing, you're kind of SOL if they don't agree to pay you.

I would echo what others have said about getting them both in the same room with whatever evidence you have to support you (which, if there's nothing in writing, then you're kind of on your own). When you manage that, I would try to get something in writing with their signatures on it (which if they're intending to stiff you, they aren't going to have anything in writing).

I would also investigate what the laws are regarding tape recording conversations in your state. If you live in a one party consent state, then you can legally record what goes on in that room without their knowledge, which would help you in a court case.

Failing that, then is anybody else getting stiffed by these people? If there's enough others in the same boat, then the testimony of several others may be able to help make up for the lack of supporting documentation.

You may also be able to consult with your state's labor board and see if you have enough of a case to move forward.

Pay the servant, or the servant will pay himself.

rollin' here.....

Show up at bosses house with a trailer and start loading schitt from his garage.....

Schedule a meeting with your boss and his wife. Explain to him that you like working for him and that you'd like to see this issue resolved and ask how it will be so. Be ready to quit if need be.

I once had an issue with my boss about a scheduled vacation for a moose hunt. He wanted me to skip the moose hunt (1st tag in 20yrs) and work. I told him I wasn't looking for an excuse to quit. I went moose hunting and things were never quite the same at work after that.

Do you have pay stubs showing an earlier higher pay rate?

I would have the conversation once more with boss, and explain he has two weeks to make it right, or I would turn it over to your state Dept of Labor.

As an example: A local motorcycle dealership had about ten hourly employees and often worked them 50 to 58 hours per week. They paid straight time for all hours. And claimed that was understood at time of hire.

Id Dept of Labor eventually got wind of the situation. The state came in and seized all the file cabinets in the business. After examination of the pay records, the state came back with a list of employees and exemployees with amount of back pay to be awarded. The list went back about twenty years. Many $thousands were paid to many people.

1. Perhaps he does not have the cash to make you whole, and he is embarrassed to admit such.

2. If he has the cash and simply is hoping to screw you out of what is rightly yours, then do you really want to continue working for him?

3. If the answer is no, then man up and demand payment. If the answer is yes, then let him know you demand an audience with both him and his wife at the same time and to get this settled before the end of the day. Put a deadline on it. If he fails to resolve the issue by the end of the day, you need to have another job lined up, and let him know you will see him in court.

It sounds like you don’t have any documentation, that it’s all word of mouth. That makes it real simple: if they won’t do right by you, you’re screwed. Also, if that’s the case all this bs about threatening them with attorneys and court will be a waste of time and make you look like a bozo. Same goes for state labor department. If you can’t document everything, you’ll be wasting your time. You need to decide if you want to keep on with them. If yes, meet with the two of them, talk it out and take what you get. If not, find another job, then quit. Period.

I had a boss try to screw me once.

He was paying straight time AND under the table on all overtime, on government jobs with prevailing wages. The guy was such an azzhole he had to hire a front man for his business because people hated him about 30 seconds after meeting him. I worked for him for three months and when I quit I wanted to get paid for my overtime, a grand total of 8 hours. Yes, 8 hours.

He refused, so I turned him into the state labor board. He got investigated on not just on my wages but all employees, along with the fines and all the BS that goes with a govt inquiry. I can't imagine what it cost him when they found out he was cheating his employees on govt jobs, but I got my 8 hours overtime pay.

I wouldn't screw around with your boss, something's hinky and you're at the bottom of the food chain. If he won't make it right, turn him in, period. Even if you don't have documentation they'll make him wish he had just paid you.

I had an insurance business owner try to screw me out of $25K in commissions. He didn't pay me until months later when the Insurance Commission sent an investigator out to interview all of the employees about irregularities in the way he handled collected premiums. He ended up losing his insurance license and his business. I got out of the insurance business and started pipe lining.

Absolutely correct.

Dont threaten anything you dont have in your pocket already.

Have a back up plan.

Personally, I've been there and I would be looking for another job, he's probably counting on you liking your job and not going south on him. He probably has another side to him you may not be aware of, dick boss is pretty common.

I'd let the money go and steal $4000 worth of stuff. Because I am part gypsy. I have to control myself from stealing stuff now from a company that treats me great.

wrong......make HIM do the loading.....

With nothing in writing, I think one is screwed if he elects to exploit our legal system. Get everyone in a single room and try to hash it out. Deciding to burn bridges just depends on alternative opportunities in your region.

We have an old saying in pipeline . . . "I was looking for a job when I found this one!"

The number one way to piss off an employee is screw with their money.

Can't stand a man that lies.

Alaska is wide open for recording anyone.

In this economy with his company he should be as flush as it gets right now. There is absolutely no shortage of work.

That is fact!

According to these cost of hiring new employee figures it looks like it would probably be pretty much a wash financially for your present employer as to whether to pay you the back pay owed or let you simply quit and take a chance on hiring a new replacement that may or may not stay for long..

How to calculate cost to hire (and why it’s important)

The True Cost of Hiring an Employee in 2019

Consider these costs before hiring a new employee

YOU propose the solution to your boss:

"Starting with the paycheck on February 1st I would like a separate check for $200 enclosed, and I want that to continue for the next 20 paychecks"

Change the dates and the amounts to what you feel is reasonable. Don't be punitive, but aim to get your money in a reasonable amount of time.

How much time elapsed before you questioned them?

All well and good for average businesses... people to do what he does in the current market here are in very high demand and he has options. His employer will not find an easy replacement and would likely hire all the folks like him he can find. I think the boss is dealing from a position of weakness.

I'm not saying you should jump into this, but I once got in a situation where 6 weeks' wages were owed to me. I was in one of those sub-contractor-of-a-subcontractor situations. Everyone was paying everybody except the check wasn't getting to me.

I went to my father for advice. He said that I should announce that I was filing a worker's lien against the client. He who owns the hole, is ultimately responsible for paying for it being dug. The "hole being dug" in this case was a major PC/network/server refresh in one of the big downtown offices of Cincinnati Bell. The courthouse was on the other side of downtown. I contacted everyone and said I needed the check by 1PM or else I was going over to the courthouse and file the lien. I was told to patiently wait.

I had the check in my hand by 4PM.

I lasted another few months on that job. The general contractor hired me directly until the end of the project. The subcontractor filed for bankruptcy a few weeks after the incident.

In your case, I'm not suggesting that you go down this road immediately, but a worker's lien is a powerful tool when you need it.

Unfortunately this scenario is not uncommon in a small company where husband and wife are involved in what an employee's wages are. If the agreement with your boss was only verbal and you have nothing in writing, it looks like you're screwed. If you've discussed the situation with your boss three times it seems unlikely that things are going to change. Move on, leave on terms that don't burn your bridges, you never know when animosity may come back to haunt you.

I would have been asking questions at Paycheck #1! You didn't do yourself any favors here.

That is a problem.

Do you live in a state that allows for recording your own conversations without advising others? If so, then structure a conversation with them that gets them to admit they owe the money and record it.

This would sorta be my take as well.
If you can't let it go, take your chances with legal options and move onto another job.

Don't just hang out with a eternal ax to grind.

I was in the situation many years ago, worked for a guy that told me one thing, his wife was cutting payroll and she did another. It was a new relationship and I chose to let it roll for a few weeks just to test them and see what they would do.

I brought it up and the situation was corrected but I was never reimbursed for the retro period.
They failed the test, I may have let it go but I never forgot it.

We eventually became business partners and enjoyed many prosperous years.
Knowing what he would do if given the opportunity paid off well in the long run.

I never robbed him or did him wrong in anyway, but I never put him first in any given situation.

If you can look at it as information paid for and continue happily working for him do it.
If not, move on, life's too short to stress very much over 4K.

Forget legal nonsense. Go to your state labor department (or whatever it's called). If they think you have a case, they'll investigate for free. You will be immune from being fired over such whistle blowing, though your work situation will be awkward, and you will probably have to quit eventually.

If you don't have a case, apply elsewhere and get a job offer. At that time, approach your boss and seek satisfaction. If he won't, quit right then.

You've been had by a shyster.

Find another job, then stand there staring at the secretary and her husband till she gets the co checkbook out and pays you your due, a man doesn't need to associate with weak wish wash anyway, total waste of time in the long [career] run.

.........with your lawyer beside you...

My wife works for a Dr and that Dr's wife handles the business of his practice. There seems to be issues quite frequently when it comes to pay, benefits, or reimbursement. I warned my wife when she took the job that I've never had good luck in the employment situations where the husband has the wife running the books. I'm not sure why but I've seen a lot of issues with those types of arrangements. I don't know if it's just communication problems or what. Usually in that situation the husband is either beta or just not organized enough to manage his own business. So, he's either telling his wife one thing and his employees another to keep some perception of peace or he's just unorganized and doesn't take others issues serious. Either way the best way is often to communicate with the wife directly or to get them both together at the same time.

You can be direct without burning bridges if you stick to the facts and keep calm. No need to run to lawyers or make threats until you've told them both directly. After that you might step it up if they don't respond right because if they screw you over you don't want to work for them anyways.

I had a boss screw me out of $2 an hour at a job while I was in college. He finally started paying me what we agreed but never made up the back pay. I should have quit right them but I really needed work that summer. He continued to try to cheat me in other ways so I finally quit. He was my best friends dad and it ended up damaging my friendship. I should have wit the day it became obvious he was deliberately screwing me.

If you stay and try to get yours by milking it or any other way you risk making yourself look bad. Bosses that are always trying to cheat their workers end up with workers that try to get even. In the end the worker usually ends up looking bad. My biggest career mistakes were staying with unethical employers. They are poison to your soul. Your first thing would be to determine if it's just poor communication or organization or if they are deliberately trying to cheat you. If it's deliberate I would look for other work.

Bb

+100
Basically the old "good cop/bad cop" act or a wife actively undermining the husband's decisions.

Tax time is approaching rapidly. No employer wants the feds, or their counterparts on the state level poking around their book-keeping system.. You might mention that to whomever writes the paychecks.
Jerry

I would tell them for 2k now, let's call it good.
You let the situation ride without correcting it, so bear half of the fault.

Maybe she wants some “special” attention?

I sure figured Ringman would have weighed in by now on this.

I think he worked for months for a company without getting paid...

This is a good idea.




P

Get them together, leave emotion out of it, declare your case, and see what happens. Get paid or walk depending on the outcome.
I prefer business agreements to be done in writing.

Wanna blow it ALL up?

Did they take his stapler? It was a Swingline.....