You would think that at times like this ......that it would have gone through the roof . What gives ?

gold is smarter than the news media

Usuall,

Good question.

Best I can tell, it was just another casualty of across the board panic selling. During the panic every asset class was indiscriminately sold, stock, bonds, commodities, even the cryptocurrencies got killed, it just didn't matter, and Gold and Silver were victims of this selling as well.

The only asset safe havens appeared to be bottled water, ammo, and toilet paper.

I am trying to find the answer to that question. Maybe a few of the smart investor guys on here can chime in. Ive read various reasons.

Based on what I know gold and precious metals have not increased as well as stocks the past 3 weeks. I like the somewhat low prices now and slowly accumulating in down turns. Probably pick up more slowly.

Try to find physical gold or silver right now .... hint - you can't. There is disconnect between wall street prices and the street.

Lots of selling pressure on gold as it gets sold to cover losses in equities. Give it a few months, I think it will rip 30% this year as global synchronized money printing goes into over-drive.

thanks for input

I haven't tried to buy any, but from what I've seen here, you are right. There seems to be a big difference between SPOT and what you can actually buy precious metals for. That hasn't always been the case.

Easy. The reason is that the COVID 19 virus is shutting down the economy, causing companies and corporations to have trouble paying their regular bills, since they are not getting their usual income. What this means is that, in order to make those payments, these companies are selling their gold and silver holdings. When lots of people sell something all at the same time, it exerts a downward pressure on the price of that something. So we have pressure in two directions operating simultaneously. Firstly, economic and monetary insecurity causes there to be a desire to acquire gold and silver, which is an upward pressure on the price. Secondly, there's a downward pressure on the price from folks needing to sell their holdings in order to pay their bills, since their usual sources of income have been cut off or dramatically reduced (think restaurants, resorts, nightclubs, and on down the line).

The upward pressure is overtaking the downward pressure, but only slightly. Once COVID 19 is gone, the need to sell gold and silver will fade as an influence on the price.

I know you cant get physical gold right now.

Or silver.

This.

Probably because in our modern cashless society, few of us have the ability to actually use the stuff. Filing off a grain here and there for a loaf of bread is a pain in the rear.

No inflation.

Gold is your hedge vs inflation. Likely have deflation in some sectors (see petroleum now).

Gold was volatile before the virus.

Sometimes +/- 100$ in 2 days.

When the market started to dive.....margin calls demand $$$$$$$ and gold was sold.

Gold and silver still available in any amount.

Maybe people are smarter than we give them credit for being?

I think the gld index on wallstreet is a futures contract market, not the physical stuff. All the local shops and online sellers are out of the physical stuff. Look at what prices are on ebay, The best price on ebay is around $1830 for a 1 oz canadian maple leaf. Within a week of the crash all the physical stuff was sold out. I had to order some when prices dropped, none available anywhere around me. Orders for gold and silver were backed up 15 business days for shipping in the big shops. Like TP, there was a run on PM.

1/10 oz gold coins $195

Nope. The GLD is physically backed with gold:

https://www.ssga.com/us/en/individu...lgE8ZWUqpAA0A6tolujdRNC-D8MaAu2VEALw_wcB

Reflecting a real price of $1,950 per oz where the rubber meets the road.

It may go up if this cshit lasts much longer.

Your link has an impassable wall in front of it, making it impossible to read.

And what do gold bugs convert their gold into ? Fiat money so they can actually buy something with it. Gold is simply a commodity. People who buy gold don’t understand a real economy or the money that it trades with. Gold can be used as a form of money but it’s a really inflexible currency and therefore a really poor one. If the economic system truly breaks down then gold is as worthless as the paper money is. Let’s hope we don’t get to societal collapse and a barter economy. Most will die if it does come to a barter economy and gold won’t save you.

Sorry about that:

"Since 2004, our gold products have provided investors a relatively efficient and liquid way to access the gold bullion market through physically-backed ETFs."

The minimum amount to redeem, is, or at least was, 100,000 shares.

I remember when I bought Krugerands for $250.00 and people thought I was nuts,but it does not matter what gold sells for if there are no buyers.

ha

The U.S. dollar is still strong and inflation is low.

This combined with a glut of metals on the market as commodities traders responded to margin calls has suppressed the listed market price of precious metals.

There is little of silver or gold available from normal suppliers due to the fact that when prices are suppressed they operate in "buy" mode rather than "sell".

Make no mistake. This is an opportunity if you can find a source to buy from.

Maybe, just maybe, people have finally figured out that all that hoopla about gold being the one true last-ditch commodity was no more than ad copy from people who sell gold.

And they've also found that gold is pretty worthless for wiping your butt - or even buying Spam.

I repeat my comment about people possibly being smarter than we give them credit for being.

OK, so it's not just a futures market. But unless you redeem 1000 ounces, you can't touch it. I wonder how you redeem it, show up at the vault with stock certificates and trade them? That would be cool to do if you were uber rich.

GOLD prices sure went up in 2008. Commodities have historically done well in recessions. Glenn Beck is sure pimping gold again. I'll give him some credit as I remember him warning about the 2008 crash before it happened.


https://goldprice.org/30-year-gold-price-history.html

Hedge funds sell gold and silver during big stock sell offs to raise cash to cover their leveraged investments or face a margin call. After s while the stocks and metals decouple and metals can rise quickly.

There is a huge disconnect between the paper market for metals and the physical market right now. We saw the same thing in 08 and 09. Spot was low but premiums on physical were high. They are much higher now and typically when the listed price and the street price are that far apart there's some major manipulation going on somewhere.

I won't be surprised to learn later that the Chinese were shorting the paper while buying up all the physical they can. I've never seen the physical market as crazy as it is now. Many items are out of stock everywhere.

If I could get the premiums I'm seeing listed I'd sell some of mine. Mercury dimes are well over $2 each at many places.

Bb

You have to have a special account with the custodian, State Street Bank, and send them instructions. It takes about 3 days to settle the trade and transfer ownership of the gold to you. Once it's in your name, you can leave it in place and pay the storage costs on in, or arrange for pickup.

On eBay there are plenty of gold coins and they are not selling unless the price is down near reasonable... if the street price was truly inflated right now one would think there would be none available.

Very few are selling even. This is the search results for completed auctions on gold coins...

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=gold+coin&_in_kw=1&_ex_kw=&_sacat=11116&LH_Complete=1&_udlo=&_udhi=&_ftrt=901&_ftrv=1&_sabdlo=&_sabdhi=&_samilow=&_samihi=&_sadis=15&_stpos=99516&_sargn=-1%26saslc%3D1&_salic=1&_sop=13&_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_fosrp=1

Times like this a person would be wise to educate themselves regarding precious metals. Lots of disinformation here.
After the 2008 crash I decided to learn what money is and how it works, it made for a fascinating and enlightening education.
Beware, the gold bugs are a main source of much info and they aren't particularly wrong but do have an agenda.
With the volume of money printing we are doing we will find out if the laws of economics still apply.

I don't recall anyone of any standing ever calling gold .

Commodites are valuable by nature. Corn can be as valuable as gold, but I don't want even $1000 worth in my pocket.

Gold is the "gold standard" for the preservation of wealth. In normal times, for the past hundred and fifty years or so, it has become moribund as a day-to-day exchange for a number of reasons. However, if it is so worthless, why is so much of it held by the big boys and when there's a margin call, what is sold to pay it off?

interesting. If there is movement probably be big and fast

how about the mining companies' stock

Its difficult to find unbiased research on precious metals economics. Most I look at are trying to sell it or have a pop up ad.

ribka,
As I said many have an agenda. I would start with researching fiat money and the history of it and the role gold and silver plays

I held stock in a gold mining company for years. It seemed that the sole goal of the company was to make sure that its stock never rose in value.

I see silver monster boxes @ about $ 11000.00.

Gold coins from Philharmonics to Australia .

I always liked the Isle of Mann Nobels about $1800.00

What you say is absolute truth.

But if you were displaced by calamity, with your home lost to disaster of any sort, do you wish to carry your wealth to your new location as rolls of toilet paper? Cans of spam?

You could carry enough gold in a pants pocket to comfortably relocate and set up housekeeping almost anywhere on earth.

Will Do. The creature from Jekyll Island certainly was an eye opening book and so were the financial books written by Michael Lewis. I was pretty naive before 2008.

Many are so conditioned that fiat is money they won't even entertain the fact that through out history gold has been money. When the fiat manipulators fail, gold will be money again.

Gold/ Silver is very speculative.

It has appealed to depression era environs.

With all the years of quantitative easing under Barry Soetoro Im surprised that we don't have more inflation.

Ribka back in the day one of my go to sources was Martin Armstrong. Much of his stuff was online at the time, so I can't recommend specific books.
He was big on the history of the Romans and their money. Many parallels with what is happening today

Gold is best for bribing the border guards. Which might not be an unreasonable thing now...

The reason inflation never took off was because the USD is the worlds reserve currency. Bretton Woods followed by the petro dollar, good places to start your research

Thanks. Always something new to learn.

We are currently in a historic deflationary period. Inflation usually follows deflation

^ Answer

You scholars want inflation................wait a bit . Coming to your wallet.

Never learn anything but BS here.

Adios

I have eight one oz gild Krugerands for sale if anyone is interested

I’ll list them in the foe sale section

No one said it was wasn't Im just surprised it hasn't already been worse than it is. Its definitely going to be worse and hardly see anyone preparing for it just like the wuhan virus. Just drove by a line around the block at the local Panera for food pick up. People out of work, no money but go out to eat?

Tell us more about the economy and inflation the average person doesn't know.

For those that follow currency there is still a shortage of dollars and despite all the printing of dollars there’s still more demand for the world’s reserve currency than available supply. The dollar continues to surge and I will bet that it will accelerate in the future. The Euro is very likely to actually disappear as the EU disintegrates. The Euro was the only other widely traded currency and it may well vanish. There is no viable alternative to the dollar.

That makes sense with the recent brexit deal and this virus looks like it will aid in the break up of the European Union.

Because we're not in an economic crisis, we're in a medical crisis with economic consequences. The economy was "mostly" sound prior to the pandemic. The thinking is we could have a sound economy again in a couple years. Metals don't fit in that scenario.

The cleanest dirty sock in the hamper.
The question we should be asking is why is the USD the reserve currency and what if anything will change that?

We. didn't have a sound economy before the virus we just had the least bad economy in the world so investors flocked to the US with their money.

The problems of 2008 were never fixed, just pasted over with more fiat. Can't print your way to prosperity

People aren’t paniced enough for metal prices to really rise. Usually when they go up a lot it’s befause people either fear inflation or an apocalypse. I think the consensus is more that in 6 months things will pretty much be back to normal

I have no gold, I do have lead...I'm ok with that...

True^^^^
the thing is you don't want gold to go parabolic... that would mean an economic collapse

Gold is a proven hedge in inflationary times though.

We had as sound of an economy as has existed and still do relative to the rest of the world. There will obviously be contraction as long as we artificially stop the economy but it will recover quickly and I expect it to be stronger within a year of the end of the effects of the pandemic. As we bring some of our manufacturing home available dollars for trade will be even more restricted and dollar value will raise.

Should A nation's debt be factored into the overall health of its economy? I don't enough to answer this question completely.

Absolutely it should.

Well that's a separate issue, I'm just responding to the "real-world" thinking of the OP's question.

In the land of blind, the one eyed man is king. I don't think anything changes the US as a reserve currency for a long time. China is a lying cheat and the world knows it. EU if fugged, I guess there is always zimbabwe , they seem pretty solid

This China virus might very well bankrupt Italy, Spain, and a handful more EU countries, they are pretty close to edge as it is.

Yes.

That's why I answered the way I did.

Everyone on this forum seems to think Trump is the conservative's super-hero, but his tax cuts made the debt worse. He is no conservative, just an alternative.

He never has been. But they don't seem to notice.

I think part of the drop of gold and silver is that it is used in almost all of our electronic devices. If the demand for them goes down so will the demand for both of them. The parallel drop could be considered "economic capitulation" which happened after 911 and the '08 mortgage crash. You can't put Trump into any political label other than pro-America. That's good enough for me.

The lesson to be learned from this by the world is that giving up control of your money supply as a country like the Europeans have done with the Euro is brain dead stupid. The lack of liquidity and the ability to inject liquidity is going to collapse the weaker southern countries economies and will end the European Union. The whole of the Europe is [bleep] by chaining the the economies together in monetary policy. What’s good for the Germans and Dutch is poison for the Italians and Spanish and possibly even the French.

Debt is caused by borrowing more than you have and spending above your means, not tax cuts. If you are going to blame Trump for debt, then blame him for signing on to record level spending, not tax cuts. Go look up base line budgeting, its been going on for decades, both parties of which are responsible.

Fed debt closing in on $30 trillion +, consumer debt over $14 trillion +, corp debt $19 trillion +, future unfunded liabilities in excess of $200 trillion.

What were you saying about a sound economy?

You get it ! It’s just a commodity with limited usefulness. You also get Trump.

Completely meaningless.

Yeah, sure.

AOC thinks the same, ....and she even got a degree in modern economics theory.

So long as the WORLD economy continues to grow at a pace that the demand for dollars doesn’t fall behind US debt issuance it’s meaningless. If it does it will spark dollar inflation and that will be temporarily painful but will wipe out the value of US debt and the real economy will keep on going. Static investments will be wiped out but continuing business will come out stronger.

Opinion only: Gold markets are up and they are down. Whether they are up or down depends in large part, upon what central banks and large institutional banks want. The “paper market” rules and sets the price. The buyers of physical.... for delivery... gold... are generally “price takers” up in that they must “take” the paper price.

The physical market for coins, 100 oz and even 400 oz bars, is on fire right now. That is why a physical one oz coin commands a $180 per ounce premium over the “paper price.” Most European mints are shut down and the supply of coins and small bars is restricted.

Remember, there is no shortage of gold in the world. Banks have thousands of tonnes. If they want the price to go down, they can do a couple of things.... they could simple sell into supply and perhaps also drag the paper price down. If they want the price to go up, the same thing in reverse. They can also support or lower a country currency price.

There have been a number of factors contributing to the fall in the price mentioned in this thread. All have elements of correctness to them.

Banks and governments don’t want panic now, they do not want a rush to gold that will shatter the average joe’s confidence in the economy. Yes, we have deflation now, but those trillions and trillions we start to work into the economy and perhaps two things will happen.....a severe recession and joblessness for sure, but inflation as well. Then there will be huge demand for the financial security provided by gold and the price will rise, perhaps in dramatic fashion.

I talked with a gold dealer today. He reports he is making three times the number of monthly sales As opposed to four months ago. He also reports that the average buy might be $5000 to maybe $50,000. Now he is processing many orders of $250,000 and on up. But, he has run out of “normal “ coins for sale. This is why there is a premium over spot is way high.

So, I asked what is coming next. He said he did not know.... if the Coronavirus situation is handled well, maybe a modest rise. He said those folks out there wanting to buy $500,000 of gold are still there and will be hungry of gold for quite a spell. Demand for physical is strong.

But.... he agreed that inflation is on the way and some “private heavy hitters” are getting frustrated with lack of delivery.... ok, but what can they do? I was surprised by his answer....He said all it will take (to ignite a price skyrocket) is for some Arab sheik to say he is ready to take delivery of $2 billion of physical..... at $2000 per ounce.... It seems that a trigger like that is what ie required to shake the strangle hold of paper gold prices. Seems that the world has quite a few skittish multi billionaires.

I don’t understand all this. But, it seems to me that economic convulsions are coming..... cash, gold and real estate would seem to do well.

Some folks will say that the “paper gold” vs “physical” gold is a bogus thesis. I don’t hold to that. Seems a paper contract that does not yield delivery is nothing more than a derivative. The paper gold system seems to be like trading derivatives.

We’ll see.....

AOC is an idiot but the debt is not the problem. It’s the moral hazard of free money without purpose. People without purpose stagnate and die. Both literally and metaphorically. Socialism is a cancer that kills both the real economy and the human spirit.

For years now, I've been lectured that gold was the best SHTF commodity. I've always replied that when the SHTF, you'd be happy to trade your gold for SPAM, ounce for ounce.

Well, now the virus has hit the fan, and the trade is now evens for TP or bread.

You gold bugs can eat it or wipe your ass with it. Hope you're delighted.

I thought that we went on the .22lr standard back in 2008.

Yeah,well one day you’ll be able to buy everything with just the flip of a gold coin. People won’t trust cash and want something REAL. You’ll be owned by those with jingle in their pockets!


Love,

Glenn Beck

😂😂😂😂

What is the proper way to count back change in gold? I am sure that this will be terribly important.

prefer to eat something better than spam in the future so trying diversify my investments. Maybe 15 per cent or so in precious metals if it gets really bad. I don't think it will be depression like conditions but there will a pretty deep recession I think worldwide. Id prefer not to live like a pauper in the future before Im too old to do anything. And do a lot of out of state and some out of country hunting and fishing.

That is the role of junk silver. A silver dime is worth approx. $2.00 .... think about that
Gold is to store wealth, silver is for trade, just like when it was considered money

That is good to know, but still wonder about the all-important count-back - exactly how will it be worded?

Geez Rocky, not often we see this side of you. Why so angry?

Stocks and fiat can and have gone to zero....... gold and silver never have

Makes one wonder how much about 20 lbs of silver coins would be worth today.

Some USA and others older Mexican coins they are the size of silver dollars.

Under the gold standard all gold is owned by the government and worth about $800 an ounce.

Golds a useless metal when the end is near. Buy ammo lost and lost of beautiful Ammo.

And then sit back and read Milton's "Paradise Lots".

Ammo and garden seeds......

Many decades ago ( when I was a kid ) I was on a Bus for a trip of some sort . I got to talking to the kid in the next seat . We talked and talked and he told me he was from Germany and that he and his parents escaped from Germany during WW2 . I asked where he lived and he said on a 500 Acre Farm in Upstate NY . If you're from Montana or Wyoming 500 Acres aint much , but NY is different even in those days . I asked him how his parents could afford to buy such a Farm as refugees . He told me they converted all their holdings into ( I think ) Platinum which was then formed in parts for their car ...... I think he said nuts and bolts . Not sure where he said they crossed the border . Sometimes Commodities do work in dangerous times

ONCE THE HIPPIES GARDENS ARE RIPE AND THEIR GOLD IS BRIGHT I’M GONNA USE MY AMMO!!!! Crying laughing, hint

If we were to return to the gold standard you would have to take our total wealth and divide it into the gold supply and revalue accordingly. Gold would be well north of $10k ounce

More accurately, some figure north of $10,000.00 in notes would be redeemable for an ounce of gold.

Nicely played!

I've got a few of those. That one would be redeemable in a gold eagle $10.00 piece, about a half ounce of gold.

Like this.