Have been doing some homework on various pistol platforms and found a couple I don't care for. I really like the Kimber 1911 but have been spooked by the number of feeding issues I came across on the interweb.

I also came across the 45 Super and the 'ease' of converting an ACP to Super. I really like the idea of being able to shoot 45 ACP ammo - its way cheaper than 10mm.

A) Is 45 Super in the same league as the 10mm
B) Is the conversion as simple as it seems on the interweb
c) Any long term issues if the conversion is done correctly

Anything else I should be aware of with an ACP to Super conversion?

Thanks.

BIL carries a Glock 20 for such occasions. I mildly looked into it awhile back and the 45 Super made sense from the standpoint I already have dies. I was looking at a HK 45 Expert as they are already set to handle the higher pressures. Haven't pulled the trigger yet as I have been acquiring other things.

The 10mm180 grain XTP Underwood about the same as the 230 XTP Underwood 45 Super in my comparison but the 45 made a much larger hole.

John - thats my assessment as well.

I have both in the same gun...a Kimber Stainless Target II that has slides for both 10mm and .45...either caliber works fine...




The 10mm is limited to a 220 grain bullet 1200 fps while the .45 will run 255s at almost 1100.

I've settled on 200 grain Hard Cast 10mms at 1250 fps and 155/165s Jacketed, Plated and Cast at 1300.

.45 Super, 230s at 1100 and 240-255s at 1050. I pushed up quite a bit further but backed down to the velocities Buffalo Bore are getting...


As to converting a .45 ACP to Super:

Flat Bottom Firing Pin Stop
Extra Power Firing Pin Return Spring
24#+- Recoil Spring
26-30# Main Spring
Shock Buff is a nice addition

Bob

3 slides and 6 barrels?
22?


What all you have going there?

Lots of fun, apparently! It's like Legos for grown-ups.

Thank you!

A couple of really stupid questions - recall I'm a bit of noob with semi pistol modification: how tough is it to put all these parts together? It would seem a rather simple process. Any fitting required on your Kimber?

Also, I assume your Kimber doesn't have any of the feeding issues noted all over the internet? I really like the fit/feel of the Kimber 1911.............

I love my DW 10mm, but it's no 45 Super, had my 'Smith do a simple spring swap on an all steel 5" Springfield Trophy Match, had previously ordered Starline 45 Super brass, took the 230gr full metal jacket flat points to an even 1200 fps, it was a hell of an accurate and powerful load, after firing 11 rounds in rapid succession with a CM 10 round mag you definitely knew you just done something.

Probably put 3-400 rounds like that through the pistol with no ill effects, had a buddy wanting to buy it, took it back to 'Smith for a checking over, all good, sold bud the pistol, brass and remaining ammo, he's still shooting it today and that was better than five years ago.

The H&K USP is a great platform for the 45 Super and requires no modifications to the recoil system. I shoot 45 ACP target wadcutters and 45 Super 230gr rounds interchangeably out of my H&K USP Elite and it feeds perfectly with both rounds, and also is quite accurate with both.

If you want to test the waters of 45 Super, a police trade-in H&K USP 45 is a great choice and substantially cheaper than buying and modifying a 1911--although a dedicated 45 Super 1911 is on my list of guns I "need" to have and RJM's picture is not helping! I've seen trade-in H&K's on Gunbroker in the $500 range.

I prefer 45 Super to 10mm because I prefer larger, and heavier, bullets out of handguns. I'd rather have an extra 10-20gr of bullet weight (and an increase in diameter and meplat) than an additional 100-200fps of velocity for handgun hunting or field use.

Here's my 45 Super launcher:

The HK USP is extremely strong and makes an excellent 45 Super

One gun...
9mm
.38 Super
9x23 Winchester
9mm Largo
.40 S&W
10mm
.45 ACP
.45 Super
.22 Conversion Unit

Possibilities for the future:
.357 SIG
.400 CorBon
.40 Super
7.62x25
.22 TCM


http://singleactions.proboards.com/thread/24056/all-1911

Only thing that needed fitting was the oversize flat bottom firing pin stop...everything else is a drop-in...

Zero feeding problems with the two Kimbers I have...

Bob

I made the decision to go with a 45 Super recently, after looking at the 10 mm. JWP was very helpful and advised what was necessary for the conversion and what velocities to expect. It was easy. I'm pleased with the accuracy and reliability of the 45 Super and with the ability to shoot inexpensive 45 acp for practice. At most indoor ranges, you can't help but lose some of your brass and I'd rather lose 45 acp brass than 10 mm brass.

Funny you post that. I found the exact same comment on the HK45 and HK 45 compact last night. I'm looking to handle an HK this week.

I also watched several Youtube videos on the conversion and it doesn't seem that tough.

Thanks.

What platform did you use?

I'm leaning 45 ACP/Super real strong.

Might want to consider the 460 Rowland

Looked at it last night. I'm not crazy about the compensator hanging out the front.

The .45 has the benefit of better bullets. You can get 220gr 10mm's from Rimrock but data is scarce.

I used a Kimber 1911. It is easy to shoot well, is reliable and accurate.

Everything I've read on the matter leads me to believe that setting up a 1911 for .45 super should start with a check to ensure proper engagement of the locking lugs. How many of you have done that?

+1

The 460 Rowland is uber-high-performance 45acp done right.

anyone set up a gen4 g41 as a 45 super? With captured springs in a proprietary assembly I wonder if its possible to shoot the super in the gen4 21 or Gen4 41? I saw a used gen 4 41 today for $525, a very good price. HOwever I believe the 41 might not be suitable for the 45 super, lighter slide.

So I have heard. I wonder if the HK 45 would do as well?

My HK45 does well with 45 Super; If I had to pick a 45 Super carry gun, it'd be an HK45 Compact.

Exactly

Do as well as what? The HK USP is very tough strong pistol and can shoot 45 Supers without modification.

Jwp, to do as well with 45 Super ammo as does the USP? The HK 45 is the newer hammer fired polymer framed pistol made by HK-in Columbus, Georgia. Looks fairly similar to the USP.

HK 45

"I'm not crazy about the compensator hanging out the front."
According to Hodgdon data the max velocity for a 230 grain bullet is 983 fps in the Super and 1336 fps for the Rowland. Clark told me the compensator was required to prevent battering the frame. There is a price to pay for the extra 353 fps.

Hogdon 45 Super data is way low a 230 grain JHP should do 1100 in 45 Super. 983 FPS is high end +P

Yessir a bud did, he's talked to me about doing my gen 4 21 a couple of times, iirc he bought a StormLake, KKM? barrel, new steel guide rod with bushing and recoil spring, I think he also said something about a new stronger firing pin spring, said he's into the conversion well under 250 bucks, he shoots 255gr hardcasts, don't remember the speeds he loads to.

My mistake.

I am getting more interested in the 45 super over a 10mm. Need to find out how to set up a gen4 g21!

If I remembered the barrel companies right, just call them, they'll send you everything you need for the conversion, that's what Bud said he did.

Also comes with a list of installation destructions.

A) yes
B) yes
C) yes

My Sig 1911 got the 45 Super transition. I run 200 gr hard cast at 1350 & 250 XTP’s at 1200 fps. The load & gun are quite accurate. It is a 45 LC in a semi auto. The cost was $8 for the Wolff Spring Kit & brass was available from Starline. It likes Power Pistol &/or HS 7.

I love the package.

I was trying to find out if the Gen 4 G21 glocks with the new recoil spring assembly can be converted. However RYG has a conversion kit and a 24 pound spring!

The Glock 41 might make a nice conversion.

JWP: Do you know what the pressure is on the 1100 fps 45 Super load? Thanks.

I believe the 41 has a lighter slide, thinner barrel and I have read opinions that you should not do that with the 41.

I tried the 45 Super with a Glock 41, and couldn't ever get it to run right. A Glock 21 worked fine.

Good to know.

Buy a 10mm, shoot a ton of .40 through it for practice, shoot and carry 10mm also. I've put several hundred .40 through my Glock model 40. It doesnt cycle 100%, but shoots just fine for range work.

There's a reasonably priced g40 in the classifieds with good sights on it. Jus' sayin'.

My Take for converting a 1911 to 45 Super;

1.) JRH Gunsmithing can increase the time your 1911 stays locked up. Cost around $100 and I feel worth it.

2.) "Extra Power Firing Pin Spring".

3.) "24#+- Recoil Spring"; I would not go over 20 pounds (Mine is 18.x pounds). While a heavier recoil spring will slow the rearward travel of the slide down, it will increase the the return velocity, which can result in failure to feed issues and battering.

4.) "26-30# Main Spring"; I use a heavier main spring, do not recall the weight (but it is not 30 #'s).

5.) "Flat Bottom Firing Pin Stop"; You can leave the FPS as is, or tune it by rounding the bottom a little... if needed for function.

6.) "Shock Buff is a nice addition"; I think this is a good idea... but gave me nothing but issues.

7.) Starline 45 Super Brass; It is stronger than 45 acp brass and I would not shoot 45 Super out of acp brass.

8.) I've been using Power Pistol, works great & have had no issues. Just one option.

9.) DO NOT get 45 Super load data from the guys over at Glock talk. I would not be suprised to hear that some of them have maimed themselves by now.


45 Super conversion is a tuning process. I did the first four and use 45 Super brass. If your brass is being launched into the next zip code... you need to stop and do a little more tuning.

Your gun should also be able to run 45 acp loads just fine===> for less expensive practice.

You can do all except number one yourself, it is nothing but replacing springs and maybe doing a little filing on the FPS until it fits and then slightly rounding the bottom to tune it if need be (If you do #1 you probably won't need a flat bottomed FPS)

If it is a new gun make sure it will run 45 acp before starting.

I've run somewhere between 1,200 and 1,500 rounds of 45 Super through my 1911 with no issues; no cracks, no rattle of the slide, nothing broken.


JWP &/or Oregon45,

Isn't the HK 45 USP actually warranteed by the factory for use of 45 Super?

Jerry

Or buy a 45, shoot a ton of 45 Auto through it, and use the 45 Super ammo for heavier duty work.
Plus, the whole 40 through a 10mm doesn't work so well on 1911s.

JP,

I use both the 10mm, and the .45 Super.

While the 10mm velocity is higher--for most the most part, I prefer the Super, and typically shoot either 250 grain, or 260 grain at 1050 FPS, loaded in Starline brass.

A Glock 21 works fine, but I don't have personal experience with converting a gen 4 model. Possibly there is a recoil rod/spring assembly that is already made that would work. If not, have you looked into the small bushing made by Glock Store that will fit into the recoil rod hole in the front of the slide? If it would work, this would allow you to use a non captured assembly from Wolff.

Here is a video that might help; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-gZuS2Um6o

Of course you could just shell out the scratch for a USP. I've fired 250 grain pills in one since back in 1996, though not loaded to the higher Super pressures...

edit to add this video, which is a better, longer version by Angry Dick;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4MQGY87THY&t=335s

The more I read on this subject, the more I like the idea of a 45 Super. Very interesting stuff here.

Couple thoughts. I've had both (a 6" Springfield 1911 that I ran .45 supers in, and many 10mms).

-.45 super is almost the same ballistics as .460 rowland without all the hassle, so is a better choice for most.

-HK USP is strong, but still not as strong as an all-steel 1911.

-Overall, I like 10mm more due to capacity and factory ammo availability (and more reloading data). But don't forget that you can get a RIA double-stack .45 super for less than $1K and make up for capacity somewhat. Both are excellent choices for big jobs (brownie defense), in my view.

-If you do go .45 super, I think another reason the 1911 is the best platform is that the extra weight will reduce muzzle flip, which is greater in .45 super than 10mm. Conversely, I think a polymer such as my XDM is a good match for the 10mm. Having said that, a 1911 in 10mm is also a very good choice, and will further reduce muzzle flip, making running hot / original 10mms still very fast to mag-dump; more so than a lighter polymer gun.

-Just to reiterate, in case there are beginners here, don't load .45 super loads in .45 acp brass. Brass must be marked .45 super.

-"Buy a 10mm, shoot a ton of .40 through it for practice, shoot and carry 10mm also. I've put several hundred .40 through my Glock model 40" - this is really unsafe due to ringing the cylinder and spiking pressures in 10. It's also a bad idea because you should "practice like you play", in my view.

-Don't forget the .50 GI if you like to go big. I *really* want one of those "double 1911s" but in .50 GI:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCOQf12y3kw

In what way is steel 1911 stronger than an H&K USP with regard to the use of 45 Super? Pressure handling? Recoil absorption? Long-term durability?

Any gen 4 glock can use a gen 3 recoil spring assembly with the addition of a little bushing at the front of the slide. That is very common and done by a lot of people.
It works for both captured and non-captured gen 3 assemlies, even the stock gen 3 spring (but why bother?).

you ever used a rock your glock 24 pound captured ss recoil spring assembly? Its made for the gen4.

Not that particular brand, no. I use 24 lb ISMI springs on a gen 3 captured rod with a gen 4 bushing adapter, which is nothing more than just a little stepped collar. Using a rod with that collar captured in the unit is even better, but I already have mine and haven't felt the need to buy another.

Yes.

I have a Ruger SR1911 I've converted.

Changes are:
30# mainspring
Xtra power Firing pin spring
20# Recoil spring
EGW Flat Firing pin stop.
I also added a Wilson Multi Comp. It replaces the barrel bushing but is not as efficient as a barrel mounted comp. My main objective was more slide mass. Before this addition, ejection was 8 to 10 feet, now it is about 6 feet, which tells me slide velocity is in the typical 45 ACP range. .45 ACP dribbles out.

The load is a Montana Bullet Works 250 grain LBT LFN GC at 1050 fps.

I also had the barrel done where I could lengthen OAL without jamming bullets into the rifling.

Yes you can, I called my Bud today and ask specifically, he has gen 3 and gen 4 21's in 45 Super, he said something again about a bushing for the gen 4's stainless steel guide rod.

Bob you forgot one where is the 9X25 Dillon. Cheers NC P.S. I have one

Bob you forgot one where is the 9X25 Dillon. Cheers NC P.S. I have one

9x25 is a possibility but fairly well down the list....

Just found this over on the 1911 Forums...

https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=994458

Ya'll are getting me VERY interested in .45 Super! I have three 10mm's at the moment - two EAA Witnesses and a RIA 1911, and three .45 ACP's - a Sig 220, a Para "Expert Carry", and an AMT Backup. From what I'm reading on this thread, seems I could just find a good HK 45 and shoot .45 Super in it? I once "converted" a Springfield .45 1911 to .460 Rowland, but got rid of it because it was so darn loud. Would this be a problem with .45 Super? Could Super rounds be fired in a good "stock" .45 1911, without all the spring changes?

Thanks for any help on this.

Mike

Yup, most direct way into a .45 Super is an H&K USP 45. No modifications required.

Yep. 45 Supers trumps a 10mm

The 45 Super is not louder.

I suggest you NOT run 45 Super in a stock gun. And, I highly suggest you use a 1911 with a heat treated slide.

After this thread, I now own both a 10mm and a 45 ACP. The 45 is a Rock Island. Anyone see any issue with doing the conversion to 45 super on a commander size RIA?

I read somewhere on an a site that didn’t recommend the RIA. It might of been on the 460 Roland site, idk.

HK customer service told me they did NOT recommend shooting .45 Super in ANY of their firearms.

Mike Holmes

I doubt that any manufacturer would.

Not surprising, but that doesn't mean 45 Super doesn't run well in H&K USP 45's and HK45's.

Check out this thread for some extensive reports on 45 Super use in both HK platforms: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?16503-HK-USP-45-field-pistol

Just like Ruger says not to shoot anything but standard pressure 14,000psi loads out of their .45Colt's. Manufacturers are always going to be liability-conscious.

Springfield chambered the 45 Super at one time.
I remember, some at least, were ported.

Because the slides are not heat treated.

I set up my Lone Wolf Timberwolf frame with a G41 slide, RMR, LW barrel, Zev drop in trigger and 460 Rowland comp. It shoots tight groups at 25 yds with Underwood 45Super (230g JHP) or Double Tap 450SMC (230g JHP) ammo if I do my part. I just bought a Phalanx Defense Systems OWB compact holster for taking it hunting. Seems to word. I will be doing more testing of the holster this month.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...t-sights-6-mags-650-shipped#Post14038185

A great HK .45 Super launcher in the classifieds...

gunner, I thought about trying that with my TRP, but have yet to act on it.

Since RIA has several models of 10mm, I can not understand why a .45 Super would not recommended in their guns....is there really going to be that much more stress on a properly sent up gun?

Bob

Idunno, Bob. How hard are those slides? I know I read somewhere that RIA slides are not thoroughly hardened, but I don't know if that's true. What I do know, is that the Underwood 255gr heavy acp load recoils about like a 10mm. So I would expect the Super to be harder on the locking lugs - but I'm just sorta guessing here.