On a FB group a guy did some testing, albeit imprecise, comparing the CZ 457 and a Tikka Tx1 for accuracy.
This is a direct copy/paste of one reply:



I didn't want to slap this guys clams too forcefully so I simply said "I'd take that bet...."

The blossoming .22 maven replied "all day long maybe 1/2” with some wind".

Damn kids make me nuts.

You won’t find very many people shooting half inch .22 groups at 100 yards regardless of the rifle

I was somewhat impressed with his first sentence in the reply.......at least he admitted it.....

Probably with 3x9 Simmons scope and CCI Blazers.

I squeak out an occasional 1/2" group with my Ballard/Stevens-Pope but not on demand and, dammit, not often in competition. Last Schuetzen match I turned in a 5/8" group and accrued 4th place. And this with a gun that shoots 1/4" and often a lot less at 50 yards- on a wind-less day.

It's all about the wind, baby, all about the wind.

gnoahhh where do you shoot Schuetzen matches at? I’m doing a Winchester 1885 with a Birdseye maple stock in Schuetzen style and think that would be lots of fun! Great shooting gnoahhh and there are darn few people that can pull off 1/2” groups with a .22 at 100yds and not many more that can do it consistently at 50 yds - outdoors. Lots of people can type though - including some other types of primates😄

PennDog

I will say, I have a 452 American that can shoot 1/2 MOA at 100 yards on windless days, with at least a 20x target scope, with its favorite lot of SK ammo and me doing my part pulling the trigger. It's been a while since I've taken it out but it did surprise me with its consistency when the stars aligned.

I do believe that there are alot more 1/2 inch 100 yard 22 lr rifles than there are 1/2 inch shooters! And I will take those bets ALL DAY LONG. Talk is cheap. Good shooting

You are a Day Dreaming Lying Piece Of Fhuqking Schit. Hint.

Laughing!..............

You do realize that the world record for 5-5 shot groups at 100 yards in NBRSA sporter class is slightly under 3/4" don't you?You should sign up and show the big boys how to shoot!

And i'm just happy with one that will shoot 5 shots an inch or just under at 100 yards.

I have a 457 Varmint MTR and made some 1” groups on its sole trip to the 100yard line, with SK Rifle Match. No wind flags. Just getting started with that one. Have some SK Flatnose and Eley Club now too. Gonna be a while before I can do that consistently, whatever the rifle is capable of. SS 10x42 on a Area 419 rail.

It is entirely possible that any 22 can turn in a 1/2 inch 3 shot group at 100 yards. Less likely with a 5 shot group. That does not make it a half inch gun. With a 22 it is much more about the wind and the ammo than the gun.

What group is that? I have some work to do.

I shoot a lot of rimfire and with some pretty decent rifles and if i can keep 5 in, or even around 1" at 100 yards in typical conditions I feel like I'm shooting pretty damn good that day

I have a Yonkers’s Kimber that I used for rimfire silhouette that is very accurate with some ammo. This target was shot in 09 at ram distance of slightly more than 100 yards, with Wolf match target. It has a match chamber and seats the bullet in the rifling.
This rifle is hard to shoot off a bench, it slender and light. So you really have to pay attention to the rifle as well as the wind.
At 50 yds it is a ragged hole for five shots, at 100 it will shoot under an inch. At that distance the wind really comes into play.
It is by far the most accurate sporter i have ever shot and will make you grin every time you shoot it.

My Vudoo with SK Standard will do 10 shots between .9 and 1.2" at 100. Has to be a low or no wind day to do it. Its a pretty light rifle as well, really fun to shoot.

Those are very realistic numbers.I shot 3 - 5 shot groups at 100 yards with my Lilja barreled 10/22 yesterday in pretty good conditions. First group was 1.26,with 4 in 1" even and the others were .891" and .886"with Eley black box.Gun will pretty much stay in the 3's at 50 yards.

Nice looking gun there 30338

5 into half inch at 50 is good enough for me.
100 yard game......would just have me pull out my hair and spend a lot of money.
Aint even gonna try to go sub MOA at 100.

But yeah, even at work I hear of standard production sporters doing it, all the time LOL
None of those guys ever shoots in a league or match. Go figure.

Maybe 35 years ago, shot a one inch five shot group @ 100, with a Win. M320. Rested, front and rear bags, no wind. IIRC, shooting Mini Mag HPs, because that's about all I ever shot in it back then?

My buddy looked through his spotter, shook his head and told me they were all in a one inch FO target dot on freezer paper, We'd been shooting 22-250s and 6mm Rem. varmint rifles that day and had multiple target dots on the paper. Popped five down range with the 22, for the helluvit, before we moved to the 300 yard range with the center fires.

He asked me how the hell I'd managed that? No idea. Rifle had an old Weaver K2.5 on it at the time. I'll go with dumb luck, having no better excuse to offer. Later put a Weaver V12AO on that 22 and never came close to anything better than an inch and a half at 100 with it.

We have monthly 100 yard cast bullet BR matches at our club and they have a 22 rim fire class, no plated bullets. Some of them can do close to an inch with a 22, if the breeze ain't a factor. Guy that usually takes the 22 class, has a Win. low wall he had built years ago. Unertl scope, heavy barrel and pretty damn nice trigger.

Last time I shot a 22 at 100 yards, managed around two inch groups. I'm happy shooting them at 50.

I'm not saying it shoots .5s all day long. I'm saying it can when everything is right. Let's say outta 10 groups, 3 or 4 will look like .5 clusters.

I enjoy some 22 long range, but never really got the bug to chase rainbows with the round.

Yes, it can impress under fair conditions, but most times the wind is gonna own that little bitch.

.22 Firearm Owners

Anybody that claims 1/2 MOA at a hundred yards from a .22 long rifle is full of more crap than a portapotty on a Mexican brick crews jobsite.

I don’t see a group by that specific name- can you share a link to it?

Columbia Schuetzenverein, an ASSRA affiliate, we shoot just north of Frederick, MD. Three weekend-long matches per season. First match this year is the weekend of end of April/first of May. Some very stiff competition- I sh*t you not, 3/4" at 100 (which I consider mighty fine shooting, and about the best I've managed) won't buy any better than maybe 3rd or 4th place. You're up against Ballards, BSA Internationals, etc. Mind you also, the matches are re-entry so you can keep submitting targets until you're tired of it.

My competition rifle, a Ballard with what I think is a Pope-Stevens barrel although it's not marked "Pope", just Stevens- it has Pope-style rifling. I figure it was one of the barrels they turned out after Pope left Stevens using his rifling but not giving credit (and for which Pope got in a high dander and threatened them with legal action if they didn't cease and desist), along with a couple 10-shot 50 yard targets I made with it. On a dead calm day it'll turn in 1/2" at 100- if, and only if, conditions are perfect, but if those conditions prevail it'll deliver. Heck, Steve Voorheis from over on the Savage forum knocked out a 1/2" group at 100 with it at the Rendezvous in Noxen last summer with a bunch of witnesses, and he never shot the rifle before. I'll cry when the last of that lot of Eley Tenex is used up.

"Modern" Anschutzes and the like really don't have nothing over on some of the stuff the old masters turned out. The difference between then and now is the ammunition.

Thanks gnoahhh........I’ll have to look into that when I get that rifle finished up. That rifle you have looks awesome and you are right about those vintage rifles.....some of those men really knew their stuff! I am embarrassed to say I haven’t shot the one I’m working on as I bought it as a barreled action.....but I am keeping my fingers crossed. It has a single set trigger and the bore appears excellent so maybe?!

PennDog

I've piles of 22LR's that'll shoot .5 MOA at 100yds. Martini's and the like,simply cannot begin to hang. Hint.

Anschutzeseses have the lock time,trigger and stocks going for them,as well as being easy to scope,with SOUND optics,if only for starters. Hint.

Mechanics tend to matter.

Hint............

Sometimes it's not about pure accuracy, rather the joy of playing with aesthetically pleasing vintage equipment that also happens to shoot very well. Different strokes, and all that.

Looks like a Fecker scope you have there gnoahhh. How do you like it compared to the Unertl and STS?

Have a few of the latter mounted up on 52s and older Annie's....but no Feckers

Some day

1/2" groups at 100 yards is easier to do than you think. A good rifle with a batch of rounds it prefers. Hand select the rounds for consistency. Find a warehouse or building with a long hallway. Pull the trigger meticulously three times.

On an average range, grabbing random rounds from a box, with a keyboard commando on the trigger? Don't bother measuring.

With a little Vudoo and the right conditions, one can put together some decent groups.

60 yards. Ten shots each. Sporter configuration, 3-12 LRTSi scope





uncommon cute boy names

Nice shooting there. What ammo? Shots 9 and 10 start stressing me when I see that type group in scope lol.

I like it as much as much as the others, based on my small collection of 2 Feckers, 2 Targetspots, and 3 Unertls. The Fecker is a bit easier to fine tune for parallax with said adjuster in the middle of the scope barrel, when sitting in position at the bench, instead of having to reach the whole way out to turn the objective bell. Very small convenience, admittedly.

Those groups I pictured were shot from a freshly opened box of Tenex. That lot of Tenex has proven eerily consistent weight-wise and rim thickness-wise so I won't bother sorting rounds of it. I will sort stuff when headed to a match, but I honestly don't feel it does a whole lot of good- but anything for a teeny edge. I think the whole sorting thing works best for mid-grade ammo.

1/2" groups are possible at a 100 yards with a 22 LR even by me. I shot about 30 groups that day & this was the best, but several more hovered closely.

Folks that say it can't be done, may not have the necessary equipment. Or.......

Anschutz with a 36 Weaver, benched & bagged. Federal Gold Medal 900B ammo.



My best 50+ yard group, Wolf Match Target.

I do what I can, when I can........

5 Shots


5 more with my silly 10/22


Only 3 this time, running short of ammo I was. 10/22 again


Up close and personal...one shot, one hole. Still the little porker is holier now that when we met.

I don't think anyone said it couldn't be done-just that it isn't going to be done consistently. Occasional group-absolutely! 5- 5 shot groups that agg. under 1/2" at 100 yards with a .22 rf?-Hasn't been done yet,at least where targets were officially measured. I have shot a lot of BR-50,ARA and NBRSA group shoots,have sorted ammo every way imaginable,owned and shot Anschutz 54's and 2013's,Rem. 40x's,Win.52's and Calfee XP100's with factory and aftermarket barrels and don't recall seeing back to back 1/2" groups shot in competition,and I shot with some of the best rf shooter out there, albeit 20 years ago.

I've shot some tiny one-hole groups at 50 yards out of my 452 American and Lapua Pistol King ammo, but I make no bones about it, it was more accident than skill, especially with a cheap 3-9 scope on it. OTOH, I've got better scopes on other rifles and can't do any better than I can with that rig, usually a lot worse. That lot of Pistol King is long gone, sad to say. It IS a lot of fun trying to shoot tiny groups, though.

Good to know. I spread the love for good optics.. modern and period

I enjoy the older externally adjustable sights for bench work.

I use to get a lot of grief for mounting em on the older target guns....but the tables have turned and others are following suit. (grin)



History lessons..

Cool photo - nice to see youngsters enjoying the shooting sports!!

PennDog

Thanks Dogg

It's all about the children. We find they take to it with the right lead. I know I did at that age.



Unfortunately one of them thinks she owns my Vudoo now...

Hope I don't have to get Jill on the phone for a replacement.

You won’t do it...

Wish I had one as a kid..

338'


I didn't write it down or measure the targets but I believe it was Federal Gold Medal Ultra Match. The red circle is 1" and the white circle is 1/4.". Targets are custom made...30 opportunities per sheet

Unfortunately UM ihas been discontinued. It's the one premium ammo that performs very well in all my rifles.

The Vudoo also does well with Center X and Midas +

Center x works very nice in my Vudoo.

I have a Don Smith custom CZ 455 which carries on it a 20.5" Lilja barrel (I had it cut back from 24"). Found out on Friday evening I have been invited to compete in the NRL22 National Championships near Nehawka, NE, Memorial Day weekend. I have 1-1/2 bricks of it's favorite lot of Lapua Center X i've been saving along with a case of a recent lot of Center X I shoot in monthly and regional NRL22X matches. This morning the plan is to go to the range and shoot five 10-shot groups a 100 to see which one will go to Nebraska. I'll try and post pics later today.

Alan

Looking forward to the report.

Well, got to the range, it was decent conditions. Was able to shoot one group each lot # of Center X and it started snowing but the wind picked up and was blowing from 10-11 o'clock about 8-10 mph. Packed up and went home. Hope to go into work early and shoot the groups in our "100 right" indoor range before my swing shift starts.

Alan

How were the groups ?

Shot these a few hours ago, before my shift started. To my eye, the 2nd lot ending in 911 shot better even though, taking the entire group (flyers and all) in account, they both averaged 1.24". The first group from each lot was the center group. I hadn't started placing the front legs of the Atlas bipod against the window yet. Once I did, the groups settle down.

Alan

Nice shooting and a helluva nice range setup you got there!

was this 2 seconds of self realization when your sobered up briefly any time recent?

asking for a friend....

I would have to witness that to believe it. Maybe one lucky group out of a hundred was that good, but not consistently. Heck, groups that size could win a lot of benchrest competitions if you could do it consistently....

Bob

I would have to witness that to believe it. Maybe one lucky group out of a hundred was that good, but not consistently. Heck, groups that size could win a lot of benchrest competitions if you could do it consistently....

Bob


This is reality....

Yep... not throwing any shade at all on GSSP, but his results are much more realistic.
He was shooting with a custom rifle,very good ammo and most importantly, indoors

And his real world groups were 1 1/4ish

1/2” or less outdoors at 100 simply isn’t happening with any sort of consistency

Got a Win. 69A that have had many years and with a Leupold 2 x 7 can kill crows all day at 100 to 115 yds if on a calm day. Easy to do if you can shoot.

So that's my problem, I can't shoot!

Took the CZ452 American out today, and shot two 5 shot 100 yard groups of 1.5". I was reasonably happy.

My thought is that given all the stuff stacked against you shooting groups at long range, I want to concentrate on making as many hits on stuff instead. Clay pigeons, golf balls, poker chips etc, or a flipper target of some sort should be fun, challenging, and not too stressful.

Good post. The great majority of 22 shooters are happy if they can make a pop can bounce at 100 yds, sometimes we get so far down the rabbit hole that we forget to have fun.

drover

Often at the end of our shooting sessions, my buddy and I take out the 9422's and shoot the dueling trees, or just skip some ammo boxes across the range area for awhile. Gets us laughing like little kids again and relieves the stress of concentrating on shooting groups all day....

A range buddy and his pal have multiple dot shooting competitions every week, one shot each. Lot of psychological warfare goes on between them. Then my friend heads to the 100yard line and wangs steel offhand with .22 pistols and rifles, mostly with irons or red dots.

Pop, tink, smile.

I just got back into 10/22’s and have one rigged up with a 16” factory barrel and a Romeo 5 red dot. Another I installed a Feddersen 16” threaded, contoured barrel. A buddy loaned me a 6X super chicken to test out the barrel.

I went out after work and shot the Feddersen at 50 yards with the 6X on it. Both guns have Volquartsen triggers in them. I shot on a cramped table with too low of a bag and got 1” and just under 5 shot groups. Then I grabbed the red dotted gun and shot a 2” group, then started picking off small pieces of clay targets, wood chips and anything else I wanted to hit.

It reminded me I hate shooting groups and love blasting stuff. Maybe I never will grow up...

free image host

Well I guess since I got one scoped and one with a red dot, I can. But I still hate shooting groups.

Sweet looking Vudoo! I am waiting on two now.

LMAO!

I did it twice! I am so weak and pathetic I called Foundation too. So if you see me on the side of the road please throw me a nickel or two.

Creek those two brokedicks ain’t gonna throw you nothing that isn’t black with 2 heads on it so don’t hold your breath

I'mma bitch slap Cert with my Creed purse.

Nice moves Creek...what you gunna scope those with?

Shortly after I Vudoo’d I took a hard look at the foundation.

Tell me about your barrel contour and length.

You may have motivated me to give them a call since my sisters wont

LMAO!

Right now? What is the cheapest scope I can buy?

Tell me about your barrel contour and length. 18" Kukri.

since my sisters won't. I thought you had brothers! LMAO

The 17 HMR will most likely get a 6X SWFA.

Not sure yet on the 22LR.

I can never tell... they’re always going into the gender neutral bathrooms



Mine is an 18” MTU and always thought it may look a little goofy with such a short barrel in the foundations long forend. looks aren’t everything though

You boys are killing me!

Liking the Bushnell 3-12 LRTSi...Midway ran a sale a year ago or so we snagged a few...

Looking forward to testing out the DMR of the same but on something else. Need to find the right rifle to put it (them) under (grin)

There was a real nice rifle I screwed up and missed.....from a good dude..Beanland. Would have been perfect. Some girl snagged it and fired it never.

Come on He hasn't shot it? Maybe I should have put a big blackdildo in the box with it!

He’s probably worn out the rest of his

Another geezer was at the range this morning shooting his 455 American Varmint at 200. Said he was plunking Geco into about 4” and was happy as a clam. Have to give that a try next time out, now that my .410 Turkey gun is dialed in. Did manage to try out some of the Club I found, but only at 50 because the 100 was getting some maintenance.

Y’all are nuts. But I'm buying into it. Had my 452 varmint out the other day. It shoots well and all I have on it is a little Nikon rimfire. Shoots 2” in a bad wind. Now I have to try 100 with no wind. Damn. I’ve gotta buy good ammunition.

It’s a slippery slope man... I started with a 452 and I thought eley club was good Ammo.


Now it’s Anschutz, 40x, 52D, Vudoo with SK, eley match, lapua.... and I don’t regret it one bit

Pappy I bought several bricks of geco and geco match back when it was fairly new on the scene. Made in Germany, I had high hopes for it as a mid-level priced option. Kind of a sleeper ammo like TAC was for me.
Unfortunately it just didn’t perform very well. I dont think it ever really caught on because it seems to have dropped off the market fairly quickly.
If I recall I paid 40-50 per brick at the time and towards the end i remember seeing it as low as 22-25. While it was by no means match grade for me I wish I would have bought a couple cases at that reduced price

Get after it rooster!!
Get yourself a good scope and some quality ammo and it gets better by leaps and bounds

I totally appreciate what the benchrest guys can do but I'm with you on relaxed plinking and having fun with a 22. That being said, I'm curious what my Volquartsen Summit and 10/22 could put out at 100 now!

😎

I can shoot a tennis ball at 100 pretty regular. I thought that was pretty good for me. I never tried to group anything with a 22 over 50 yards. Never really cared to. I have never been a accuracy freak. Knew better. That crap will drive you nuts.

Ammo is really a factor with a .22lr. Now step that up to a .17HMR and all the sudden those 1" groups become very common and 1/2" groups are not all that uncommon.