This popped up in my feed, thought it might be of interest to some.

https://youtu.be/K1YH0xwmero


*Not sure if this was the best sub forum to post it in- mods feel free to move it if necessary.

Federal to their customers: "hey you stink'n customers, STFU"

I dont blame the ammo manufacturers for not investing millions to expand. This ammo shortage, just like all the others, will one day be a thing of the past. Ammo will sit on shelves and once again be stupid cheap like it was earlier this year. This would bankrupt these guys. I understand the antigun threat coming, but things will get right again.

Yeah it might be a while yet but I think ammo will be available again, this time is very similar to the Obama days but maybe a little worse.....Hb

Agreed, but now is the time to upgrade or expand if you have it in the plans at all, money is sitting waiting on product.

If they expand to meet temporary demand and then it bites them later, the same folks who wanted them to expand will say how dumb it was and how poorly managed the company is...

Never happen. No workers available.

Seemed like an ungrateful prick....Business tip #1- Don't talk down to your customers

The industry has sold, what, 100 million more guns in the last 6-10 years?? Lots of those are to NEW shooters. Hell, the POPULATION is up 75 million since the 80’s/early 90’s.

Lots more semiautos out there (consume more ammo), long range shooters (consume more ammo), AR shooters/owners (consume more ammo).

I get it, you don’t want TOO MUCH capacity. However, if you’re backlogged TWO YEARS, then it might be time to up your production capacity a bit more.

If anything, the gun mfgrs. ought to be leaning on them a bit. How do you continue to sell $500-$1000 firearms, when there’s no stable supply of ammo to “fuel” them??? How do you continue to push shooting as a “hobby”, when you can’t find ammo, and when each pull of the trigger costs $1-$2???

If companies were able to raise prices to meet the demand you'd see a lot more investment in capacity. Companies would get crucified by the gun commumity for raising prices so they keep prices low and we deal with years long shortages in exchange. Scalpers make more money per box of 22's than the manufacturers do.

That guys is a piss poor spokesman for the shooting industry.

What you will see is independent companies picking up the slack, if federal won't make it some one else will !

Except the litigation and insurance is more than most "small companies" can afford, Let one idiot do something stupid and you're spending more than your profits trying to clear your name and reputation.

The key to eliminating human error is with automation , robots don't get covid or pregnant, they work holidays and don't draw overtime or vacation time.

Did you see how dated those factories were, employees hand loading pallets and moving them with pallet jacks ?

Another bunch of sh~t was the " We are making more hunting rounds than ever" no actual numbers were ever mentioned in his little tiride.

My bull sh~t meeter was peged !

I think the guy did a great job and sounds like someone who tells it like it is....of course that always doesn’t sit well with many today.....those who think their ass should be kissed every time they want to buy something.

Guy runs a company that grosses 10’s of million dollars a year, has people working while other companies are shut down, has machines spitting out bullets and loaded ammo by the millions daily, and gets a lecture here about automation..

Jimmy...how does the company you run compare to Federal re profits and the number of employees you have on the payroll? Actual numbers now...don’t be pegging any bullsheeet meters..

Anyone who is interested can drop Vista Outdoors an email to express your disappoint with Mr. Vanderbrink at: [email protected]

Jimy and him can talk face to face..the next time they are at the board meeting to discuss future direction in automation.....

How do you ramp up and produce more when you are already at capacity? I don’t blame him, whiners will always whine. Rumors of warehouses full of 22 long rifle ammunition were all over the Campfire when the Obama shortage occurred, now you got jimmy, the Warren Buffet of ammo, as the answer man.

When will you learn to stock up in times of plenty for lean times? You had better look at your pantry also, you may want more than a package of cheese and a loaf of bread if food got a bit scarce.

😂😂

Good post. Still, I'm sure it won't deter any manufacturing geniuses that populate the forum with their, "I need it now so I want it now" mentality.

Some people don't have a clue.

All the 22 shells are sitting in some overweight 65 year old's closet...him thinking he is ready for WW3. Meanwhile, guys like me just want to go plinking and actually shoot our ammo.

I have about 18,000 .22's in Short, Long Rifle and WM. Giving 500 LR to each of my SILs as Christmas presents again this year.

Wasn't long ago that buckets of 1400 count Remington .22LR were about $80. I bought three even though I already had thousands on the shelf. It is called "planning ahead.

[Edit to add]
I'll be 70 early next year. Weigh the same as I did 40 years ago when I was a skinny guy. Guess I still am.
[end edit]

Great post!

I feel sorry for no one that has been shooting for any length of time. Ammo was almost being given away the last few years.

Vanderbrink is a good guy. He does tell it like it is. That’s a good thing.

One thing that everyone is forgetting - raw materials. None of the ammo manufacturers have enough raw materials/components to meet demand even if they had the manufacturing capacity to ramp up production.

They’re all busting their butts to source the things they need and their suppliers are doing the same.

This.

Count me in as another one who doesn't have a problem with Vanderbrink's message. Most factories are set up for peak efficiency. For example, Proctor Gamble's plant here cranks out toilet paper 24/7 - 3 shifts a day, 7 days a week. Before the COVID crisis, toilet paper consumption was very stable in this country, only changing in proportion to population numbers. There is no way for a company like PG to increase their production much, as they already run things at peak efficiency. And massive investments in additional machinery could be catastrophic if the market drops in the future.

If you don't like it, roll your own. Ammo, not toilet paper.

I shoot it, I don't collect it...and I cannot handload 22's.

What you don’t seem to get is the people that stocked up are still shooting. You want to go to the store and buy ammo when you need it and don’t understand why it isn’t there when they are out.

Maybe you should try quilting.

I spoke to three LGS and a reloading shop in the last two weeks. They all said right off the bat that millions of new shooters want ammo to practice with.
Some have now become hoarders along with some of the existing shooters. Two have not had 30-06 ammo in the store for over a month. 30-06!
The reloading shop said it's a trickle-down effect as components are being diverted to retailers. All 4 shops agreed this is worse than anything Obama caused.
HOWEVER, read (I should get the link-up) what Biden and Harris have in store for you. Of course, a black rifle ban, < 10 round mags, UBChecks,
a "mandatory gun buy back", no "gun show" loopholes, a $200 tax for certain firearms and ammo purchases (unclear as to how), and NO INTERNET SALES OF FIREARMS OR COMPONENTS.
Elections matter and if the Democrats defraud two more senators out of Georgia, they will "run the table" from Congress to the Whitehouse for either Biden or Harris to sign anything anti-2A.

What happened to the Tula primers?

I will take those if Federal can't keep up...

1. I don't care about finished ammo; I want components. But, the video is effective in conveying where I am as far as prioritization.
2. I have a hard time believing there's a PR professional alive who wouldn't cringe at this performance. A+ on sincerity; D- on script & delivery.

Honestly, I appreciate him getting out there and doing it without a script and some "polished" delivery...came across as a lot more sincere and direct.

This ^^^^^^ He may be a "good guy". But, bush league move. Bad look for Federal and for Vista...

At first glance it's blunt. But if you get the chance to buy Federal ammo you're now going to pass on it because he didn't sugarcoat the truth? Not likely. He knows it. You know it.

I don't have a problem with his message because he's telling the blunt truth. I sell building materials and everything is on backorder. I listen to upset customers everyday because we can't get something. They act like I'm making this schit up, but it's been this way since March. Most people are clueless about the availability of certain things. People are building a house and they wait until the last minute to order stuff and they can't understand that they can't have it for 4 to 6 weeks. They sit home at night and watch the MSM tell them that the economy sucks. Then they wait until the material comes in and they think that they can just add to their order and snap their fingers and make it suddenly appear. When people get upset or mad about it, I look them in the eyes and tell them that I want to sell it to them worse than they want to buy it. I don't make a dime unless I sell material. Then I ask them if they've tried to buy toilet paper recently. I went to Costco yesterday to see about buying paper products for the office and they had zero toilet paper still.

1) At no point did I say anything about not buying any additional Federal products. Have a goodly amount on hand. No qualms to purchase again in the future.
2) Having worked for a couple large multinational corporations that took multiple bum raps in the court of public opinion: It doesn't matter how stressed out you are. It doesn't matter how pizzed off you are. It doesn't matter how much truth you are speaking. You don't run your mouth in public trash talking your customers...

As far as the challenges he is facing due to Covid and the current market environment, tough chit. As SAS said, everyone else is facing the same issues. Time to put on his big boy panties, stop whining, and go figure out how to profitably make more ammunition...

i wanna go on a another personal day tour with a good friend at Federal Cartridge again, had a great time and education too ,would like too go down to test fire area and shoot rifles some more. was a really great ammo factory to visit. THANK YOU Federal Cartridge,Pete53

Spoken like someone who’s been there. Amen.

Who in their right mind emails and calls a large company like Federal and complains about not making enough ammunition? I doubt that anyone here would do such a thing because you understand the situation.

That said, I don’t believe he is trash talking his customers because the type of person that bitches the loudest is unlikely to be a customer at all. So what if they get pissed off, he was not cruel, just pointing out a business that is doing all it can to meet demand.

I have bought Federal ammunition and would still buy it, as his comments weren’t pointed at me.

I understand all the logistics in getting a product to market, adding x% production volume can’t happen when you already are running at 100% capacity.

Short term adding a production line can’t happen either, 6 months to build and install a line wouldn’t be uncommon, assuming you even had floor space to do it, maybe longer in the ammo world.

All for a demand that might go away in a year.

That said, he sounds like a whiny little bitch at the first of the video.

His obligation is to the company. The company's obligation is to their customers (and shareholders, depending on the situation). He already has his big boy pants on... he's simply asking the whiners to open their eyes and knock off the zombie bunker conspiracy stuff. He isn't badmouthing normal customers. Just people who think Federal isn't distributing above board. So if you aren't a tin foil hatter emailing customer service, he wasn't even talking to you. (When POTUS takes this approach it's "calling it like he sees it"... not "bush league.")

End of the day: you're saying it's an amateur PR move and a bad optic, but if it has no bearing on your demand for his products, who cares?

Its be terrible if half the gun owners stopped buying federal and their backlog went from 2 years to 1 year. Just terrible.

I'll try and wrap up by saying this: If you've served on the boards of for-profit companies which I have, poor judgment (especially by a CEO) is like a gun that doesn't run right--it doesn't fix itself. I sort of think of it like a metastatic disease which will inevitably show its ugly head when you last want, or expect, to see it. If I were on this guy's board, I call my fellow directors, whom I think would agree with me, then the Chairperson would speak to him and he'd never do something like this again or he'd be history. It was childish, embarassing and unnecessary. YMMV

All of the manufacturing geniuses on here should get together and start an ammunition company, nothing stirs business more than a little competition.

Oh, that's right, it would cut into your time here at the campfire giving your expert business advise.

Give him a some credit for at least trying to give an explanation, weather you like it or not.

I have no problem with the way he presented that. I did notice that he didn't use the word quality.

When the shelves are sagging with primers, bullets, cases and loaded rounds....I’m sure they will quickly return to normal from sales to shooters who aren’t so sensitive they need their feelers polished.

And, I’m thinking most likely he didn’t out of the blue call up a film company and do this on his own.

This was was most likely cleared and scripted by some one other than him... someone who didn’t get their MBA at Campfire University.

He did a much better job than the two Leupold guys who tried to BS their way through explaining that Leupolds don't have a tracking problem.

drover

I would be surprised if they didnt just have their own social media people work with him on this.

They have an ad agency....and this type of publication is most likely screened and reviewed by more than one of those who sit in the gold room...Feelers....there is the word again....go out to various others on how they think it will be received....Myself, I find it more along the lines of sitting around the campfire talk...."Let's not bullshiit eachother and open up to what we really think."

Of course here feelers are something that often need polished.....