Don't know much about the Forbes rifles,was looking at a 20B in 308. Looks like a nice lightweight rig, In pros or cons on them and how would you rate it compared to a Kimber Montana or Kimber Ascent? Thanks Jerrad

just curios what store you saw one in

It's essentially a NULA marked down 65%. Hard not to love that, unless you really, really want some custom options that Forbes doesn't offer.

When Forbes starts cranking out all stainless rifles, I predict a lot of Montanas in the classifieds. Just a guess, though...

Forbes is an M700 action, in SS with a chromoly bolt and 21" barrel... for those of us that like an actual SS rifle, longer barrel, 3-pos safety at $300 less.. I doubt it.

You tell him Brad. By the way, WTF is a "Frobes" rifle???

Cmon bsa . . . from the guy that designed the LUA

Guess I'll try again...

There have only been 10 20B's produced so far. I've not seen or held one..

With that being said, I will own one soon. I did own a 24B in 270 as soon as I could grab one. I was extremely impressed with the rifle....especially the out of the box accuracy.

Both Kimber and Forbes have their pros and cons. I'm not a hater of either. If I had to put rifle pink slips on the line and out of the box accuracy was the determining factor, I'd not bet against the Forbes.

Just talked to the engineer @ Forbes today with a bunch of my own questions.

He said that there have been a few 20B's in .308 floating around out there, but that the first actual "run" just went out of the factory the other day, IIRC 25 guns, all .308!!! 7mm-08 will shortly follow.

I asked him about the possibility of things like "fast twist" .243's, etc. He said they were initially limited to 1:10" twist but planned to at least offer a "run" of 1:8" twist rifles in the not so distant future.

He said demand for the 35 Whelens has been low and that it might be possibly dropped in the future if things don't "pick up" for that offering. He said that the 24B 6.5x55's have not been shipped yet because of a "wait" for a couple of the components. Interestingly, he said the orders in for the 6.5x55 have been limited as well, but that an overseas ongoing sales committment from New Zealand will keep the 6.5x55 in the catalogue!!! (Sounds good to me!)

He said the 24B .270 is the #1 seller by far.

He also said that the SS action does in fact require additional engineering R&D, and likely modifications to make the Forbes action "safe" in SS vs CM. Maybe Melvin knew something all along! SS barrels... no problem!

He hinted at other new plans/ offering for the future... said to watch facebook early next year (2014).

Finally, he reiterated that the new Forbes rifle is about offering a mass produced, quality product, at a given price point. Sales, consumer feedback, and a little "loonie-ism" will dictate catalogue offerings in the future! They are very aware of the shortcomings and missteps associated with the CLR project of the past (SACO Defense), and Titan/Forbes wants to avoid that path.

Todd

I had both the Kimber Montana 84L (5# 10oz)and the Forbes 24B (5# 9oz)in 30-06 at the same time. Essentially the same comparisons can be made when comparing the 84M and the 20B. I posted a long review of them last March side by side with photos but since took the photos down. There are small but not insignificant ergos differences in stock and safety design. Both stocks are darn near as good as you are going to get. The Kimber has a more "open grip" compared to the Forbes, which has a tighter radius grip curve. I had to made a slight modification to avoid a trigger guard rap on the middle finger. Obviously everyone has their own opinion on these subtle differences. If you are a strict CRF guy you will have to make concessions with the push feed. If you are a traditional 3 position safety believer than you must accept the modified 3 position safety on the Forbes.
The two Forbes I had were wickedly accurate. Clearly Melvin knows how to accomplish this and I believe in large part due to full length bedding and by not using a pencil thin barrel.
There has been a lot written here about the accuracy potential of the Kimber. I've had a couple of bad ones but most get to perking very well with a skim bedding job and a few little extra loony type tasks. See "Brad"s recent posts on his pre-range list of common sense tweaks.

Will the difference in price, $300 for the Forbes make a difference? Maybe but the best scenario would be to see each in person. Both Kimber and Forbes represent some of the best in mass production rifles.
Good luck.

I don't think I'd enjoy shooting a 35 Whelen is such a light package.

I have not held or seen a Forbes. Yet. It does fall right in line with what I want in a hunting rifle though and would be at/near the top of the list to choose from.

There's no reason to believe they will make an all stainless rifle as they clearly intend to use a chromoly bolt in a stainless action.

Personally I'd just get a Forbes with Chromoly action and stainless barrel.

I don't like the 21" barrel on the SA's... minor nit to pick for sure, but it should have been 22"+ as most of us would have preferred. I was a carbine fan for years, but in the last 10 years have gone to longer barrels, mainly for hearing's sake. But I'd not be dogmatic about the 21" M20 until I have one in my hands to feel how it balances.

I think bigwhoop made the case why most of us Montana fans won't be dumping ours for a Forbes.

I think the Forbes is likely a terrific rifle. Its stock geometry isn't my cup of tea, but something one could undoubtedly adapt to (like most rifle minutiae).

The 6.5x55 is the one that would have my interest.

Can't argue with the Swede as a great choice. But for some reason, if I get a Swede it needs to be in a fine walnut stock. Don't know why, just fits my thinking.

First "run" of 25 guns. I don't think I would call that mass produced. Unavailability of what I wanted when I had the cash has been a major drawback for me for both the Montana and the Forbes. I often thought of getting a Montana in 7-08 or 260 but never wanted to plunk down cash to a dealer for who knows how many years. I guess I just don't need one that bad, but if anything hurts the company in the long run, it will lack of availability for what people want.

If Forbes would have had plenty of stainless short action guns to sell with the initial announcement of the company, they would have went like hot cakes. Desire follows attention but when attention begins to fade after a few years, so does desire. It would seem that to sell what is essentially a custom gun, in non custom chamberings, at the price point Forbes is attempting, volume would be necessary, and they have failed at that. They have also failed at advertising to anyone outside of a handful of gun nuts on the web. 99 out of a hundred average big game hunters and shooters have never heard of a Forbes but a large percentage of them know what a Kimber Montana is.

I'm not sure the Forbes will ever be "mass" produced. It's my understanding that they have actions on the shelf. They shared a post on FB a while back about selling actions to gunsmiths.

Stocks will likely be what keeps the production limited....and remember these rifles are individually bedded. If Forbes goes to full mass production, quality would likely suffer. Each rifle receives lots of individual attention now.

We can't deny that Kimber has experienced some issues over the years. Kimber Montana's need a little tweaking out of the box to achieve their full potential. I like the Montana, but I know I'm going to do some tinkering when I buy one.

Personally, I hope Forbes keeps their current niche, adds a few chamberings and doesn't get into the mass production game. If they continue to produce quality, the word will spread.

I really don't expect many new announcements from them at SHOT. I expect them to focus on filling current orders. I do expect if things go well, we'll see more options in years to come.

Hmm, I wasn't aware of that at all. Good to know and thanks for the info.

If my memory is correct R. Mann said shooting a 24B in 35 Whelen was like "getting kicked by a mule with a tooth ache". Not sure how he knows how hard a mule with bad dentition kicks?

I agree on your points. I just hope that niche is large enough to for them to stay in business.

I just saw on facebook where Forbes will be fluting the bolts. Lame idea.....it does nothing but provide a path for crap to get into the magazine. I let them know

100% agreed.

More gimmicks for bubba...

I told them I wanted faster twists and a 22" barrels last year soon after they were announced.

My opinions didn't carry any weight with them! They probably knew I'd still buy one anyway...

Fixed it for you.

They also posted on Facebook that they are raising prices in 2014. Their price point is already 1700-1800 in Canada before the stainless guns. That will probably keep me out of their market.

And call me Bubba. I like that fluting.

Check out this question and reply from the Forbes facebook page...

Me - Can I order one without the bolt fluting? My experience with bolt fluting is that it is nothing but a path for debris to get into the magazine.

Forbes Rifle LLC - Unfortunately we are only making them fluted now. I can tell you Billy, the flutes on this rifle are very slight. So slight in fact that they didn't even change the weight of the rifle. We decided to flute it from customers requests. For example our AK and Canadian customers needed it so they could clear debris like ice in the winter, and that fine power sand found in TX. for our southern hunters. Also, the fluting on this rifle has the phosphate so it won't wear off and gives you about half of the raw steel exposure than with the old jeweled bolt. I hope this helps your decision to go with Forbes Rifle.

Slight? Hmm. Look fairly un-slight to me but I don't have any experience with fluted bolts.

http://store.prophetriver.com/forbes-m24b-270-win-fluted-bolt-kevlar-stock-talley-rings-ss/

Wow, it just gets worse.

Mass production is a relative term I guess. One could consider it "mass produced" relative to the NULA's I guess which was the likely goal anyway.

Prairie Goat, the 6.5x55 with the long action, 24" 1:8 twist barrel was the one that caught my eye as well in the current offerings.

I could really care less about the fluted bolt thing, kind of like adding fancy rims to a "work truck". I do care if it drives the price up however. Just makes the CLR with upgrades more appealing for me. Raise the price and the mass production becomes even less likely!

Todd

They're still a good value when one considers you'd most likely spend more money turning a basic production rifle into a semi-custom that will weigh significantly more as well.

Price out a Remington, Winchester or similar and figure out what you'd stick into it with a McMillan, better trigger, glass or pillar bed, action truing, new barrel, cerakote or similar and it becomes obvious.

I realize not everyone gets that done, but even just putting one in a Mickey will cost you close to the same.

The primary difference being you can get a Mcmillan in the style and LOP you like. With the Forbes, you're stuck with what they give you. I'd like one, but they are way too short for me.

Yea, but the more they raise the price, the better the Montana looks, not even to mention, fluting, shorter barrels, and no stainless.

i bet all manufacturers raise their price in 2014 not just forbes

You can count on it.

That is true, and I'm not knockin' the Mickeys as I have a few myself, if you're not of average height/arm length they're probably not the best choice.

I'm 5' 10 1/2" w/unusually short arms, so they feel quite good to me.

I noticed this year that my trusty M7 mag w/the MCM Mountain Rifle stock w/ the standard LOP is a bit long in the butt section with my hunting clothes on, luckily an easy fix though.

I'm not huge on fluting either, but I bet Kimber raises their prices this year also, and it's still a lot of desireable features for the money if it fits your stature as prairie goat pointed out.

To me they are worth a try, sent an email to the company today to reserve a 7mm-08 with stainless barrel. Awaiting a response from Rick.

We will see

Maybe a guy could buy a Forbes, sell off the factory stock and send the barreled action to Melvin for a custom-fit stock without spending a ton of extra coin?

I called Melvin sometime back and asked. It's a no-go. He doesn't work on them.

I don't think you'd want to sell the stock...

While not a 20B, I have a 24B in 30-06 and a Montana in 243. I have also owned an older Montana in 308 and Classic in 260.

Both the 24B and 243 were purchased new. The Montana is about 2 years old, and I just received the Forbes a few weeks ago. Here's a quick synopsis and comparison of them.

Out of the Box -

The smooth metalwork finish on the Kimber is more refined than the rough phosphate finish of the Forbes IMO. While stout, it reminded me of a Rem 700 ADL. I think that the stock on the Forbes is a bit nicer than the Kimber, although my Forbes stock had some small cosmetic imperfections. I appreciated the Decelerator pad on the 24B, especially on a light 30-06! The Forbes came with rings and a hard case included, which helped to narrow the higher $225 cost of the 24B over the Montana.

Functioning -

The Forbes has been flawless. It loads, feeds, and fires perfectly. I mounted the scope, and in less than a box of ammo I was rocking and rolling. My Montana had multiple issues that needed correcting from the start. With the help of folks on this forum, I was able to fix the feeding issue, light primer strikes, and accuracy issues on the Kimber.

While the finish is nicer on the Kimber, the metalwork itself seemed a little bit better on the Forbes. The action was smoother and tighter, and just felt higher quality. Pretty subjective, I know.

Accuracy -

I was able to get sub MOA on the Forbes. Out of the box the Kimber gave me 2-3" groups. I later got that down to around 1 MOA after rebedding the stock. Even though my rifles are not apples to apples the same, the Forbes is easier for me to shoot, and shoot more accurately. Go figure. The two rifles were both ridiculously light; even though the Forbes was a long action with a 24" barrel, it was within a few ounces of the 243 Montana. Honestly, I am just not interested in getting a lighter rifle than either of these! Also, some of the earlier Forbes rifles had a "tire rubber" recoil pad, just like my Colt Light Rifle. The thick Decelerator pad, that is now standard, made a huge difference in reducing felt recoil.

Customer Service -

I have not spoken with Kimber recently, but about 5 years ago I called on some problems that I'd had with my 308 Montana. The woman I spoke with was rather surly and somewhat condescending. That was some time ago, however.

Forbes has been great. Calls and emails were always answered. When I told them about the paint imperfections and a small nick in the stock, Rick at Forbes immediately offered to have me ship it back to him to be repaired. Since the gun shot so well, and with me being too lazy to send it back, I decided to keep the rifle as-is. Rick then offered to send me a touch up kit with the OEM stock paint. Nice.

Overall -

These are both nice rifles. Although it is early to tell, and my sample size is small, in my opinion the Forbes is a better out of the box rifle.

Bring up Kimber Montanas here on the Fire, and many people get emotional about how awesome or crappy they are. I think that the Montana is a great design, and they look awesome. Out of the box, you might get a good one, and you might not. If not, from my experience and from that of others, you can usually fix them up to work well. All three of the Kimbers that I owned eventually shot just fine, but all had multiple issues out of the box. Both action designs are great, either a mini Win 70 CRF or a shrunken Rem 700.

Based on my experience with Titan in Maine (Forbes Rifle, LLC), and Melvin Forbes at NULA, I have little doubt that Forbes Rifle will have great products. While I like my Montana in 243, and think that it is a good value for the money, my next lightweight rifle purchase will probably be another Forbes.

Good Luck!

I'd much rather bed S/S,than suffer CM...even if it had 82 [bleep] Trick Moves and Gregorian Monks chanting over the piece of [bleep] schit.

Boobs reliably fawn Fluff,which never ain't not [bleep] funny.

Pardon my knocking the new off schit.

Wow.

My guess would be he'd cut his own throat by doing so (killing demand for NULAs)? He works on the CLR, so that is the most logical reason I can come up with. Did he offer anything different when you spoke?

Because it's been bedded to that specific rifle?

IIRC, he builds them. I may be wrong, but I think it's the same stock as the NULA.

It is the same stock. Curious as to why you wouldn't sell if you were going for one with a custom fit, though.

I'm thinking he'd use the same stock, just add, shorten, paint, bed, etc.

It's all academic, as he won't work on them. Didn't say why, but I'd imagine there are contractual obligations, plus like 8Snake said, he would be cutting his own throat. Why buy a NULA if you could simply buy a Forbes and send it to Melvin for custom whatever?

When I called the Forbes a "mass produced" rifle, I didn't mean in quantities like a factory pumping out donuts on a conveyor belt. When I spoke to Rick @ Forbes LLC, he called it a mass produced rifle in so far as it is as many as THEY can turn out.
Plus, "mass" means there are NO custom features allowed other than a few paint colors.
I contend that flutes on a rifle like Forbes is a gimick. Just another step that slows down production and adds to the cost.
I hope they sell a million units and have great success!

From what I understand, Forbes Rifle produces the stock for their guns themselves. They are each individually fitted to an action. NULA produces their own stocks as well. The design of both stocks is identical.

The stock on my new 24B had a few small paint "blobs" on it, and a small nick in it near the butt plate. I asked Rick to send a stock for me to swap with, however he said that their policy was to bed all stocks to the individual actions, and that I'd have to send the whole gun in. Not sure I buy that, as he was going to repair my existing stock, but oh well. He stepped up and was willing to address the problem.

I called Melvin at NULA a few years back, to inquire about a replacement stock for my Colt Light Rifle. He was willing to sell me one, and said that it was a complete drop in, and that no bedding was required. I decided to keep my original CLR stock, which is absolutely identical in shape (but obviously not construction) to my Forbes.

It makes complete sense that Melvin doesn't want to work on Forbes Rifle (Titan) guns. He wants to keep the operations, and brands, completely separate.

Really! I was considering a Forbes, with the assumption I could send it back for a stock with a 14.5 inch LOP.

Looks like, 70's, 77's and 700's in McM's for me or a NULA....

I'm late for the party...already discussed.

Recent article in Rifle Shooter about the Forbes 24B, by Layne Simpson. All the details about how it's made, etc. Will answer some of the questions posed here. Good read...

http://www.rifleshootermag.com/2013/08/16/forbes-model-24b-rifle-review/

So I have a Forbes left hand 24B at my house right now I'm reloading for (my brother's) the fit and finish is great IMO. Rackin' the bolt in the action is the best I've felt from any rifle even the single stack Tikka.

But the trigger is HORRID, are these adjustable at all? I am sure they are but before I go taking his rifle out of the stock I figured I'd ask.

My 24B came in with a 5.5lb trigger pull. I have not played with it yet, but they are adjustable Timney triggers. I called Forbes and was informed that are easily adjustable with the screw on the front side of the trigger guard.

Cool. That's the first LH I've heard of being delivered. What is it chambered in? That trigger should be an easy tweak.

Pics would be nice...........

How much $$$$ for a Forbes 24 270 WIN. stainless barrel total?
AMRA

I'd post a pic but it'd be wrong to show a forbes with such inferior glass on it right now. Currently he has a Redfield 2-7X33 on it....Its a purdy rifle and I think we'll adjust the trigger before shooting the reloads I made up the other day today. We'll see if it prefers Sciroccos or Bergers here in about 3 hours.

Thanks for bringing this one up guys. For a all ss in 280 rem I'm going to be waiting till early 2015. I already have brass, bullets, and primers. And a scope.

Ha! I don't blame you. He blew his wad on the gun? Glad I haven't done that this week...........yet.

Ain't like none of us ever scavenged a scope until funds permitted something else. Go ahead and post her up.

Almost all gun manufactures use a chrome moly bolt in their SS actions because of galling.

My Forbes 24B 30-06 trigger was 4.5 lbs but it took only a few seconds to adjust the "Timney" trigger to just less than 3 lbs. I have had many rifles in stainless and actually prefer the finish on the Forbes.

Does anybody know if the Montana bolt is in fact all stainless ?

4.5 pounds??? Really, this Forbes 24B is 5 plus pounds on my scale and 6 pounds 5 oz with a 11 oz scope and talley rings on it....you must have gotten and extra light Forbes?

It is.

That's news to me, though Remington I believe does. Ruger, Winchester and Kimber definitely don't.

I think he's referring to the trigger pull weight, not the weight of the rifle...