In your hunting rifles, what do you consider 'acceptable' accuracy?

I was at the range this past Saturday and a guy came out, set up and shot 4 rounds and left. I heard him comment that 'that's what I was looking for' before he left. He wasn't there for 10 minutes.

I went down and looked at his target and he had a 3.5" group at 100 yards.

Got me to wondering what others thought made for an accurate round in your rifle?

Is a matter of context. I've got a single shot .22 that ain't worth a hoot at 200 yards.

i try for 1/2" 3 shot groups but if it won't do 3/4" with any loads after several trips, the gun goes to someone else's house.

not that it needs to shoot that well for my hunting, just that i like chasing the goal

3.5" at 100 yards isn't it....but you don't need one hole either.

100 yard groups are interesting but what they do at 300-400(as a minimum)is a lot more revealing.

Consistent 4-6" groups at 400-450 yards(which is my personal hunting max). No benchrest, shooting from the dirt similar to a hunting situation.

Haven't even shot groups at 100 yards with the last two or three rifles I've purchased. Seen great 100 yard loads shoot like chit at 400 so I quit the short range work-up.

Depends on the platform, sights or optics, intended use. A scoped big game rifle for the areas I hunt, it's nice to have a tight shooter -- sub inch is nice. In an aperture sighted ex military rifle or carbine, 3" at 100 and then limit the range of the shots you take.

1-1/2" or less at 100 yds. Most of the shots I have are 200 yds or less. Except for a deer I missed TWICE at 400 yds.

Killed this coyote at about 225 yds and that has been the 2nd or 3rd longest shot I have made on coyotes in 18-20 years of calling coyotes. Most are under 100 yds.



Killed this cow elk at about 75-100yds away. Have yet to shoot at an elk over 200 yds.

Yeah, that's sorta what I was alluding to. The .22 SS is sub minute of pig brain at 20 yards; +\- 20 yards. Other stuff is minute of boiler room or fly at longer distances. I usually remember to grab the right one, depending on the mayhem menu du jour.

ya'll gotta be careful takin advice from a rotary-wing driver, though ... they's more coordinated than the rest of us

consistent MOA or less 3 shot groups at 100yds...........Hb

I'm not certain of the above statement. I have a daughter that flys a rotary-wing and I don't think she can walk across the street without hurting herself....

consistent 1.25"or less 3 shot groups at 100yds and most of my rifles do better, with the correct hand loads,off a good bench rest,and I try hard to find loads that produce 2" or less 200 yard groups, I,m just as concerned with maintaining a consistent impact point in relation to the scope cross hairs as any minor change in group size

If my deer rifle/load combo allows me to keep my shots on a pie plate when shooting offhand at 100yds, it's good enough. Varmint rifles and rifles destined to never make it from the bench to the deer woods, then MOA, give or take, is good enough. Smallbore CF's and .22's intended for the squirrel woods had best group into 1/2-5/8" at 50yds. or they don't make many trips into those woods.

A sub-MOA high power is a wonderful thing, and a joy forever, but if the rifle's ergonomics are such that I have difficulty hitting animals with it when shooting from field positions, then its inherent accuracy is meaningless. The same thing can be said in that super accuracy in a rifle is meaningless if the dub shooting it can't hit a bull in the ass with a scoop shovel.

I consider 46 grains of Varget behind a 155 Scenar in my GAP .308 to be an accurate load......

MOA or better for 3 shots out to the 5.



Travis

Never thunked of a Pie Plate at 100yds as a barometer of anything,except [bleep] humor. Now THAT is funny!

I shoot daily,so don't fret much,as I'm always in the loop on what's doin' what and more importantly...why.

Yesterday was Krunchentickers,an Anschutz,THE Sleeper,The Hurt Locker,Hummer,Marvel Unit 1 1911,Dick Rifle and Rainbow Warrior. Didn't shoot much past 1100yds,as the winds were brisk...but did get carried away enough,that I made it back home with only 3:30 left in the 'Bowl.(grin)

Will mix it up a smidge today and gun some different platforms...looking for Pie Plates.

Laffin'!

I expect to get the game with the first shot.

Thus I record at the range, where the first shot hits from that rifles cold barrel.

Here is what the 308 Kimber did at 200 yds.

You "hard chargers" are a [bleep] riot!

First there's Pie Plates and now Dumb [bleep] Day Dreaming Don and the list of schit she almost did?!? Right on! Don,dangle a pic of sumptin' you whacked with a Montana...it'll be funny and rest assured that's a Double Dog Dare. Use as much Imagination and Pretend,that you can muster. Laffin'!

Looking forward to those excuses and the accompanying Whine,as well.

Wow +P+.

Depends on what you are hunting, range of your shots, etc.- maybe this guy only shoots whitetails out of a stand and over a feeder, at 100 yd. or less, and 3.5" accuracy works fine for him.

MOA at all ranges.

When doing new load development, I always shoot 100 yards. If a gun/load has a 3" 'capability' at 100, longer distances ain't gonna help it.

BTW: I can be one of those '10 min' guys. I almost always shoot to confirm zero just before I go hunting anywhere that involves a drive. I've shown up at the range and literally fired 3 shots, picked up my target and left. Takes longer to unpack than to shoot.

You sound like a guy from Maryland.


Travis

I never was one to linger myself. I'm happy to paste the LRF on sumptin',jump MPAJ and bank the reaffirmations of POA/POI intersections in seconds. Nothin' is warmer/fuzzier.

Tryin' to rig up an Anschutz 54 now,with a comb mounted videocamera,for stupid [bleep] and their Pie Plates. It's gonna be GOOD!(grin)

This schit is always a hoot.






(Addendum: for DD)

"Brisk" at 1100,is when you cain't keep a 162 launched at 3100fps+ on the 5 Mil windage reticle.

Stuff that plugs the National News daily,in regards to "weather"...is what we in these parts simply call "Tuesday".(grin)

The nice thing about Life along the Milford,is all the terrain is flat and the vegetation minimal,so the wind(s) don't really affect much.



So you never gotta contend them consequences,that others is routinely fraught with.



The toughest thing about these arrid conditions,is getting a read on the wind's direction.



It's a bitch.

OK, I'll bite. What you call 'brisk'? I know it's relative and all. Even down here wind is variable. 5-10, 90-130, it changes with the season.

Was at a match a few years back in WY and they called the match one day because the 4x8' OSB target backers were blowing away. I muttered something about 'wussies' and they didn't argue the point.



Don't know why but that amuses me.

I am never satisfied. The rifle or the girl can always do better.

I dunno 'bout that. My left foot and right seldom know what the other is doing. Even at night in a speakeasy.

You must be a rifle looney! 3.5 MOA is quite acceptable to the majority of the shooting public. 3.5MOA is actually quite good and for him to shoot 4 rounds is pretty exceptional. A Budweiser 6 pack carton at 25 yards is what I use. I figure if I can hit that I am good to go.

you use your feet to drive those flying death traps?

some of us, who havent ever driven anything racier than a cessna, are just jealous ...

Geesh! Whaddya think makes them blades go round? Beer farts?

You're a psychic too? Ho Li Chit!

My goal is consistently MOA or better with me behind the trigger. I generally tinker till "better". I don't have a bench per se. Usually working off the hood of my truck, a convenient round bale, or back pack. Figure if I can consistently group MOA with "me" shooting, the rifle and load will not be the issue.

Have never shot at game in KY over 200 yards. So 100 yard groups are GTG here. Practiced out to 550 for Colorado. At 550, dialing drop is not a big issue. However, doping wind can be a ROYAL pain...

This is the picture of my target at 200 yds fired from my Kimber 308. It did not show in my post above.

An accurate round in my main rifles?
I try to cut the acceptable numbers above in half at a minimum. They don't all make it but some do really well. A couple are .5 MOA.
If the firearm meets my minimal criteria for bench accuracy I put more emphasis on how I shoot the rifle from field positions than I do bench groups.My .338 does the best at this. I couldn't say why.

One of my simple games is to shoot five shots going from offhand, to kneeling to sitting to prone and back to offhand. If I can keep all five in a 4" circle at 100 yards I feel good to go.
I don't rush but I don't dilly dally either. Two minutes is about as long as I take to do it and I prefer one minute.

I shot the top off a squill's head once. With a 12 bore and #6 shot. Is that a good group?

Dumb [bleep] Don,

Multi-year old paper is just [bleep] AWESOME! Laffin'!

How's 'bout a picture of a Montucky victim? Or better yet,just a pic of you with a Montucky in your mitts,with your crossed-eyes and all your regal splendor?!?

Bless your Day Dreaming Do Nothing heart.

Wow...as per ALWAYS.

Laffin'!

Yep. Note I said when shooting offhand, re: pie plates.

We don't have elk, moose, goats, sheep, or antelope that require long range precision shooting with super accurate rifles and state of the art optics. Bench shooting for fun- wringing out a rifle, experimenting with different loads, etc. is all very satisfying- and I like to participate in that as much as anybody. The point I made in my first post was all that doesn't mean diddly squat when the gunner takes that rifle off the bench and shoots it unsupported, and can't hit anything- hence the comment about being able to hit a pie plate at 100 yds. (I don't know about y'all but my pie plates are around 5" in diameter.) How many guys do you know, present company excluded, who can take their bolt action WhizJet sub-MOA rifle weighing 8 or 9 pounds with scope, stand on their hind legs and put 5 shots into said pie plate? Not very darned many in my experience of watching people at rifle ranges. Is that rifle the very best for them for hunting, or do they need to practice more, or do they need to re-think their approach to what constitutes a practical rifle for the venue they're using it in?

The guy who can hit a relatively large target (such as a 5" paper plate) offhand with each shot has more respect from me than a guy who can put 5 into an inch at 200 yards off a bench but can't use that rifle to hit anything offhand. Broadcasting tiny groups only tells me that it's an accurate rifle and the guy shooting it off the bench is good at just that. It doesn't tell me he's a "rifleman" or not.

Self appointed 'experts' who routinely shoot at extremely long ranges, and do it well, are welcome to their opinions. More power to them- whatever trips their trigger. Those of us whose shooting ranges are restricted by space and whose hunting opportunities are limited to close range woods hunting have a different take on what constitutes acceptable accuracy in a hunting rifle. When said 'experts' flaunt their abilities, belittle people with different needs, and ignore (or misinterpret, or make light of) different opinions, they're simply showing their ignorance, or lack of education, or poor upbringing. Sad that they abound on the internet. They probably don't get much opportunity to show their true colors in real life.

I find the obsession with owning an extremely accurate rifle rather amusing ,mostly because Ive "been there" and used to be similarly obsessed until experience showed me that about 90% of the problem involved was not shooting and hitting game once it was located, but in locating the game and getting into a semi reasonable range and having the opportunity to make a shot at the vitals of at least a slowly walking or preferably stationary target.
Now I'm not opposed to taking a shot at a slowly walking elk or deer if the conditions make me reasonably sure I can accurately place the shot, but where Ive hunted for decades trees, brush and terrain tend to limit your options and ranges.
yeah! making the shots far down the list of issues , finding the game and getting into position to make the shots usually a far more difficult proposition than squeezing off an accurate shot once your into position.

Thing is, making your rifle (and yourself) as accurate as can be is not rocket science, and it's something you can do in the off-season. Not only can do, but should do. Finding the game and getting into position for a shot is not rocket science either, but you can't do it in the off-season.

Agree with both of these...

I see poor Dumb Do Nothing DontGnoahhFhukkingThing's insecurities is very WELL founded. Funny how Stupidity ain't ever a "choice",but she "thinks" it is. Bless her heart!

Killing schit is easy,for them inclined and I've yet to see a great rifle hurt ANY equation. 'Course,noon else has either.(grin) I enjoy the Whine and the Excuses the Pie Plate Clan concoct and I reckon they just gotta tell themselve's sumptin'?!? Funny schit!

It's never been difficult to cypher who shoots more than a smidge and never will. I get a kick outta them who is always looking for reasons NOT to shoot,then they wonder aloud and perpetually,why they are ALL [bleep] up. Rifles is exceedingly simplistic mechanical devices,but they reliably stump the masses,as hilariously exemplified here.

Lemme give you some "news"...a guy can have his cake and eat it too. Hint.

Just sayin'.(grin)

So what's your excuse. You shoot alot and remain a total FUBAR POS.

I am not obsessed.

Not good enough to give me confidence in a load. Of course we don't know if the guy made a scope adjustment within this shot group, but I would suspect not.

I only use 100 yards to get me onto the paper for 200 yards. Because I've seen some loads that will not hold MOA when the distance is stretched a bit. Before I decide on a load I shoot 5 shot groups at 200 yards, and I like to have all five within a 2" group @ 200 yards. Of course longer range gives a better idea of what's going on, and I would be OK with a five shot 4" group @ 300 yards.
Happy Hunting

Consistent three shots in three inches and two hundred yards.

B,

since this thread has ben stepped on........


I'd have to agree,

Killin' critters ain't no thang'



































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like most else, 80% is just showing up and having the proper tools.

Best,

GWB

if I can hit a plastic picnic spoon at 10 full yards I know the winderage and elevator are perfect.

What I consider an accurate load depends on the rifle and its purpose.

Prairie dogs or clay pigeons at 500-600 yards require pretty good accuracy or lots of luck. I prefer accuracy.

For larger game, I prefer an inch from my bolt guns but most do better with handloads. For the levers, 1.5� at 100 yards makes me smile and even they will often do better.

When iron sights come into play, all bets are off if using standard buckhorns. Some days I see them pretty well, other days less so. Accuracy is according, but I can�t blame the guns.

Accuracy is only relative. Precision is where it's at

For loads, yes.

You'll wanna start paying attention. A Wise man stated above and plainly:

"Lemme give you some "news"...a guy can have his cake and eat it too. Hint.

Just sayin'.(grin)"

Just sayin'.(grin)

For killing chit too...

Still waiting on the killing pics.

All depends on the rifle and game hunted

For me I have way too many rifles but have a few that I use regularly.. I like most strive for the best group possible but I am looking for that load that shoots under an inch in cold or hot weather. I have only found a few loads like that and those rifles tend to be my go to. 4895 in the 06. 3031 in the 22 250. And 748 in 223 Although I have found more accurate loads. These tend to shoot well ever time. More of a confidence thing,

Purty good day today. Tried to wear my Reloading Press out,gots a video camera adapter built for my Anschutz and some sorta cap thingies showed up too.





Wayyyyyyyy over built and ROCK solid.

Playin' arounda few minutes ago,in the yard. Treeline is 800yds and small change away,10x Fixed [bleep] and zero zoom on the camera.




For conversation.



Tidbits for a scope or two and a leetle sumptin' for the day Dreaming Do Nothing Dumbfhukks to further Whine about.(grin). 'Monkey sent me some wrong ones...though I'll make due.



Be nice to be able to film trace/impact in conjunction with the reticle and help others with Wind Readin' and the like.

Film at 11:00.(grin)

OK.

Them swamp deer?

less than .4" at 100 yards with a 4 shot group consistently.

They are all of that. Had a collision with a .30-30. Left one just fell over. Right one ran into a tree and fell over.

Twins

Depends if I am shooting this:



or this:



With the .50 BMG, "just" shooting MOA at distance would have been disappointing.

With the single-shot 44 mag rifle, a few inches at 100 yards put two deer in the freezer in less than twenty seconds.

Despite all the internet chest-puffing in this thread, the answer really is "It depends..."

How about I show these guys a pic of a short little [bleep] that looks like he's strung out on meth. I can get the one you sent of yourself when I bought that rifle from you. What was that you told me, you never shot targets with it so you don't know how it shoots. You "only shot rocks with it". What a [bleep] loser, just like your short [bleep] butt buddy boxer.



How do rocks taste dumbphuck???

Man, I'm jealous. We got no rocks to shoot down here. We have to improvise. Mostly I find a spot on a palm tree and blast it. Light has to be just about perfect to see the spots.

Laffin', that mean your not posting any?

And your point is?

bsa',

You Do Nothing Whining Kchunt...you've a seriously unfair "advantage,in that Stupidity ain't an act for you. Laffin'!

Keep the Excuses and Whine coming,it's a [bleep] riot!

Bless your heart.










DD,

No trees or rocks here,either.



Mebbe bsa' will continue with her Imagination and Pretend,so a gent can "live" vicariously,with all she "does".

Laffin'!

These are acceptable...

Yes sir, I'd say they were.

FWIW

I�ve owned numerous firearms in various chamberings over the years from 17 ackley hornet through 458 Lott (around 57 different chamberings IIRC). For each of these I�ve developed loads that were shot over a chronograph measuring and contrasting velocity vs. accuracy and the bullet I wanted to use. I usually shoot three shot groups. Some say less than 5 shots is not a group, and that�s fine.
However, after all is said and done, my goal is to know within a half inch, where, if I do my part, the bullet will impact game at any given ranged/known distance, first shot out of a cold barrel.
An example. I�ve an old Winchester push feed/post 64 model 70 in 270 Win. However the person that owned it before me happened to have it bedded, a trigger job done, and a custom Shilen barrel screwed into the receiver. Many years ago I ceased load development when I happened on 60 grains of H4831SC and 130 gr. Nosler Ballistic tips. That has been my go to load in this rifle forever.





The two shots in the picture above were fired approximately one hour apart. To my mind that is definitely acceptable.





So when the hoglet pictured above presented himself at 120 yards, give or take, the task of placing a bullet between his ear and shoulder was no big deal.

Groups are fun, but in my mind they are not the end all and be all. Making meat from a critter, cleanly and efficiently dispatched is.

I had an old insurance mentor who had a saying,
"when you know you know, and you know you know, confidence replaces fear".

Load development and trigger time are hard to beat and definitely build confidence.

Best,

GWB

Musta been something in the water after '64. The 270 groups you see are a '69 PFM70, factory tube, restocked in a rattle canned Winlite (which I hate), LW's (shimmed rear with 2 layers of soda can), M8 6x42. Blurry pics on purpose. Trigger guy was on vacation the day they made this one 'cause it takes two to pull it. But, 2 tears in a bucket.....

Lots'o truth right here ^^^^

Two inches at 100 yards would not scare me. Shots here are very rarely over 100 yards. I usually stop load development if I get 1.5 inch at 100 for 3 shots.

I'd lose my friggin mind. Hell, I'd sell the loader if that were the case.

I'm a handloading hobbyist. Three into an inch and a half is nice at 300 yards.

sheeyut

Must be a kimber afficianado.

Is that better than 3 in 1/4" at 100?

I dunno.

Cantaddferchitt

Is that Minute Of Palm Tree BD?

Minute Of Rock is a bit more.

220 swift, Sako AII scoped it with an older 2.5 x 8 vari x III scope.





43 gr. h-380, mv @ 3,910, 3,920, 3,919 fps.



I guess you could call it 3 and a quarter.

Quien Sabe as the Messicans say.

Best,

GWB

Same here.

Well let's see in working up a load for my most recent acquisition a 30-06 savage I started with a beginning load of AA4350 that I happened to have available and some 150 gr power points . I weighed some loads thrown using my lee scoops and found them pretty consistent and then loaded up 20 rounds and went to the range. Used about 8 rds zeroing the scope and then found that three 3 shot groups averaged just over an inch. The largest was 1.2 " the smallest .9. That left 3 rounds to launch across the crony and they ran around 2760 fps with a spread of 43fps I figure I'm good to go.

Recoil was fairly mild as was muzzle blast and quite frankly I don't shoot enough lately to have the trigger control I once did. The bench at this range were designed by a moron. The seat is fixed and way too high to the shooting platform so if you can imagine trying to shoot off a English racing bike using the handle bars for a rest with you rear about as high as your head there you are.With those conditions I figure 1.2 inches with a load that is easy to throw together is good to go. Maybe I'm just getting to jaded about shooting any more.

A soliloquy in regards to your post, and this is just one man's opinion, and as we all know, opinions are like noses. Everyone has one, and many of them smell.


one hole groups,even at 100 yds., other than those as the result of firing one shot, would seem to be an aberration from a "commercial chamber", even a Savage.

I'd say your judgement is realistic, tempered by experience. I find that I'm not near as anal about miniscule groups as I was 20 years ago.

The enjoyment of firearms and all that goes with that can be an addiction. I try remember that this is for fun, albeit many times with a purpose, such as developing an acceptable load with a new powder/bullet combination for next season's hunt. For hog or deer sized critters, a load as described above launched at the velocity you described would seem to be optimal for making meat without waste at any reasonable distance.

Best,

GWB

Actually met a fella once without a nose but I get your drift. We were both in the ER at DaNang commiserating about our bad fortune. His native tongue was Vietnamese and he was damn hard to understand.

Thing I notice about groupage these days is I spend a lot less time getting wee versions that in the past. Convenient that, since it doesn't drive me the way it usta. Even my BB gun shoots bugholes.

Gonna steal the "3 and a quarter" concept. Good marketing concept right there.

D

One that will put the FIRST round out of a COLD, CLEAN barrel where the crosshairs are EVERY time.

I remember about 30 years ago shooting an accurate 25-06 off a bench, comparing loads that ranged from 3/4 - 1.5 inch. A guy a couple benches down was shooting a handgun and shooting at paper plates. When we stopped to change targets we looked at each others groups. He mentioned that mine looked pretty nice; showed me his plate that, by comparison were scattered on the plate. Wasn't too impressed at first, til he held the plate in front of his chest. I chuckled at how effective his would have been for the purpose they were designed for. Been using that as a reminder that groups on paper don't meen squat in the real world.

Drive for show, putt for dough. Getting outdriven with a 5 iron will turn a guys putting to schit.....