I have a Galil Ace in 7.62x39, and want to get a bolt gun to go with it.

I'm looking at the Ruger American Ranch Rifle. Should I look at others?

Curious too. I didn't take the time to look, but didn't CZ make them too.

The Howa Mini is nice. I took a rasp and a belt sander to the stock and now it is pretty sweet.

Remington makes one in the 783 line
CZ make a couple versions
Ruger has the American Predator
Zastava-arms has the Sporting rifle M85
Savage 10FCM SCOUT 7.62X39
Howa 1500 Mini Bolt 7.62x39 mm Rifle

I have several of the CZ 527's and they are great. With the detachable magazine they make excellent truck guns. I hear really good things about the HOWA (action) and plan to get one soon. I also hear god things about the Ruger but at that price point I'd lean toward the CZ or Howa. I doubt the Ruger would disappoint though!

CZ527 with the 16.5" barrel iron sighted carbine handles way cool, best you atleast check one out. MB

Seems to me the Ruger is hundreds less, also suppressor-ready, and just as accurate.

What advantages does the CZ offer?

I have the CZ in .223 and it is a lovely rifle. I have the Ruger in 7.62x39 and it is an absolute hoot.
pavementends

Howa Mini.

The only thing I don’t like about the Howa Mini is the magazine latch. I could probably shorten it and improve it some. There is also an aluminum one they sell somewhere for about a $100 that fixes most of the problems.

I've owned the CZ 527 and would recommend it. If you want to save a couple hundred on the Ruger American, I'm sure it won't disappoint

My vote is for the Howa mini as well, but you really do need to replace the magwell with an aluminum unit. All the mag latch issues and others go away.

I like the Zastava Mini Mausers. I've got a .223 and 7.62x39 and both are great shooters.

I don't get the 7.62x39.

Nobody has hit me yet with one despite many attempts.

I have the Howa and like the rifle. The stock is as comfortable as a 2x4 and you will want it replaced or worked on by mtboomer quickly. I used a Boyd's and like it.

I bought two of the limited run Davidson's Ruger MK II stainless / synthetic rifles in 7.62 x39 around 1992 or so and still have one. Quite accurate rifles and it might be worth looking on Gunbroker, etc. for one. Pretty sure the Ruger would shoot at least well as anything else that's available.

Mine is rechambered now, but it was a Zestava Mini. A very nice rifle and with careful reloads the 7.62X39 can been a very accurate rifle.

I had a CZ American Grendel, and not being able to single-feed it without an adapter was a PITA. Lovely little rifle, and all steel. The 7.62 should be the same.

I bought a Howa Mini 7.62 for my grandson to use for his first deer hunting. The mag can drop free pretty easy, but a piece of tape will stop that, and there's a nice metal guard assembly from DIP that addresses it as well. It's extremely smooth and slick, and even the boy's 6'5 dad can use the youth stock without issue, as can grandpa. This would be my choice without question. Think I paid $349 from Darrik. Forged steel action and one-piece bolt, two-stage trigger. Incredible bargain, even at $400-$500.

I have a CZ carbine and it's quite lovely. Depending on what you're wanting to do with it that would be my first choice.

If you're not into the carbine thing, then my next choice would be to try to find an M77 Ruger.

I don't like the safety on the Ruger American anything. Not in a comfortable position to carry for me.

Lots of discussion about the CZ and the Howa being nice once after-market improvements have been made.

The Ruger American needs no aftermarket work to have functioning magazines and is equally accurate to the CZ and Howa, right?

Probably, although a piece of tape or inner tube to secure the Howa mag in the field ain't much of a modification. The Ruger mags hang down a bit more than what I prefer, but maybe other, shorter ones are available. I think the Howas are lighter than either of the others, if that matters. Can't go far wrong with any of them.

I've handled and shot the CZ, the Howa and the Ruger. The Ruger feels the cheapest and roughest by a long shot, the CZ and Howa both feel better made and smooth.

The reality is they all shoot well enough and you wont go wrong choosing any of them.

I'm not sure I've ever seen a Ruger American. Are these decent, accurate rifles?

https://ruger.com/products/americanRifleRanch/specSheets/16976.html

I heard a rumor that Ruger will announce a change from the mini-30 mags to AK-style PMAGs at the SHOT Show this year.

The last time that I looked at the current production Zastava rifles the checkering was worse then bad. Have they fixed that yet?

l was thinking that one of the mannlicher stocked mini-Mausers in 7.62x39, specifically the Zastava M85 fullstock, would make a fine woods loafing rifle, but the poor quality of the checkering has made it a non-starter for me so far.

Honest question for you fellas. What is it about the 7.62x39 that fascinates? Every way I look at it there is no particular magic. Odd bore size, 8 ball twist and mediocre ballistic performance. I need a clue.

I was drawn to it because of extremely cheap ammo, and stayed with it because it's fun to shoot.

If you don't get it, don't buy one.

Not everything that needs killing needs 3000 fps!

It doesn't do anything better than any other cartridge out there and in fact, in most cases, it does less. But sometimes less is more, or good enough.

Personally I like the 6.5 Grendel better but that doesn't mean I'd give up my CZ 527s in 7.62x39.

For what the Zastava mini Mausers sell for, I'd spend a bit more and get a CZ full sock.

A friend has a American Ranch Rife in 7.62x39, and its his favorite bolt rifle.

I have a Ruger American Ranch in 223/5.56, and thought I'd ask about the range of 7.62x39 options.

I have a Galil ACE in 7.62X39 and usually like to have a bolt gun that shoots the same cartridge as my semi-auto guns.

I looked long and hard at the american ranch in 7.62x39 before I bought the Howa mini, I just couldn't get past how cheap it felt.

At my local gun store the cost difference was about 35 bucks between the Ruger and the Howa.

How much are additional Howa mags?

The American uses mini 30 mags and they’re spendy.

Get the American Ranch David. It's a great rifle. If I were to buy a 7.62x39 though, I'd buy a Number One from Darrik.

Accurate? Almost always surprisingly so. Decent? That's subjective to some degree. They are price point rifles and you know it when you handle them. Aside from some magazine woes that Ruger appears to have worked out, they have been very reliable rifles from what I have read.

The CZs are nice rifles, BUT, in 7.62x39 it seems to have a track record of splitting the stocks at the tang, even when glass-bedded. I'm not a hater, I have four 527s in smaller cartridges, and like them heaps and heaps, but the stock splitting is not a rare thing. Pretty common, in fact.


I'd probably go with the Howa, or try to track down one of those Davidsons Specials in the 77mkII. I like those better than the Americans.

I got mine for $26 plus s/h from here. Cheapest I could find them. I ordered 2 for my 6.5 Grendel since it was going to cost the same either way.
https://www.shieldgroupamt.com/search?q=HPTM30003

EDIT - Looks like they are out of stock now.

My honest answer is that I really wanted another Grendel, but they were out just then. .30 WCF fans will disagree, but the 7.62 runs pretty close to .30/30 ballistics, and there is a wide variety of ammo, but not as cheap as before. I bough 100 rounds of steel-cased SSTs for my grandson to use, and according to his dad, he shoots it pretty well. It's certainly good enough for deer at 150 yards or so, and it's pleasant to shoot. Actually, the performance is pretty close to what many might load for practice or for kids to shoot with their .308s and '06s. The little Howa handles and points well and is cheap enough that if (when) it gets dropped out of a tree, nobody will get too freaked. When I get it back, I'll tinker with it a bit and might even shoot a deer with it myself.

Sun will rise in the west before I buy one. It is a remarkably limited cartridge, especially for those that load their own. The rim diameter is unique, as it the bullet diameter, thus is a bit of a narrow focus for hand loaders and one with little industry support here in the USA

Not sure where you're coming from on that 3000 fps thing. I don't have a gun that will do that with anything other than very light for caliber bullets and I have none in my possession.

Less is more, or good enough? No chitt Sherlock? If you can't read the label, it says CCI CB Short.



BC on the bullet below is in the .410 range at 1050 fps, sectional density is ,279. I can poke you in the chest at 300 yards at will and local feral swine consider it deplorable.







What I do understand about the 7.62x39 round is its limitations. None of the bullets commonly loaded or available for hand loading of the cartridge have significant sectional density or BC numbers. It is not well suited for subsonic work with suppressors for this reason. I am alive today because of its feeble performance. From a performance perspective the lowly .30 M1 Carbine is only a very short step behind with 110 grain bullets and the ancient .30-30 Winchester eats it a new rectum.

The .300 AAC runs circles around it in every regard: Faster/slower/suppressed or barking, heavy or light bullets, take your pick. I don't have one of those either, but I get it.

I have the Ruger ranch , such a great little gun. Talley light weights , etc. shoots moa easy with Hornady Black. Wouldn’t trade mine for anything.

I think it's a piece of schit cartridge but there is a large variety of cheap ammo.

Cheap....I get that part.

I own the Ruger rifle. I bought the rifle to help train my children to shoot. When starting my girls, I start with a .22 lr, move up to a .22 magnum and then they move up to this rifle suppressed. They shoot a lot of rounds of cheap ammo in different field positions to build their confidence and proficiency. Using the Hornady 123gr SST’s it has also taken two rather large South Texas deer with no issues. One of my daughters has her own Remington 700 classic .300 Savage that she hunts with now, but she loves this Ruger. My youngest daughter won’t give it up.

Well, if the ladies love it maybe I'll buy a couple.

Guns, not ladies. -geesh-

It's easy for us loony types to dismiss the utility of something like this, but it may be all the cartridge someone needs for plinking, as a truck gun, or meat hunting for deer in places where shots aren't long. The Hornady manual gives loads for 150gr bullets at up to 2200, which based on what I've read over the years is right with a lot of .30/30 factory loads and handloads in carbines. The pointed bullets should let them catch up over distance pretty quickly. The twist listed for that SKS is 7 1/2" which ought to stabilize heavier bullets too. Twist for the Howa is 9.45", BTW.

Obviously a .30/30 or .308 is a better all-around cartridge and can be loaded down easily (the reason the Blackout has no charm to me) but the little rifles are pretty light and handy, and cheap. The CZ 527 is also very nicely made from steel and walnut, as nice a rifle as you can get at that price.

The BO is easy to download with cast if one doesn't mind the details. And it will shoot better than low power .30-30 loads.

Download? Hell, it's already there. The "details" are precisely what keeps the average joker from fooling with the stuff that winds your clock. Rifles and ammo for what people use the 7.62 for are easily obtainable. The BO ain't except in ARs and some customs from what I've seen. Maybe it should be, and maybe someday it will, but the 7.62 has a big head start and slightly outruns the BO with bullets up to 150gr, and those loads are available over the counter. Clearly the BO is superior with heavy subsonics and has more bullets available for handloading (unless you count .308s loaded in the 7.62, which seems to happen a good bit).

Something like the Henry SS in .308 or .30/30 might be better than either, more versatile, certainly. Might find out myself next year.

OK Pappy, you got the bit in your teeth I reckon. I disagree with some of your premises, but hey, that's what America's all about.

SAAMI spec for bullet diameter is .311". Spec for groove is .310". Folks may slip some .308s in the cartridge but the wisdom of doing so is scant. No quicker way on Earth to gas cut a barrel than running smaller bullets than intended down the barrel.

.300 AAC data from Hodgdon 24" barrel

110 gr bullet Lil'Gun 21.0 2,474
150 gr " 17.2 2,062
180 gr " 14.8 1,786
220 gr " 8.4 1,062

7.62 x 39 24" barrel

108 gr CFE BLK 27.0 2,471
150 gr " 24.5 2,156

My Hornady manual suggests top velocity for the 39 w/150 grain bullets is ballpark 2200 fps with a 20" barrel. That said, I see no significant difference between the two with equal weight bullets. No surprise there, the case volumes are similar. The .300 ain't "already there" insofar as down loading. It has the advantage of available components in wide array.


By "big head start" I take it you mean the variety of guns chambered for the round, correct me if I'm wrong. The RAR (2 styles) is available in .300 AAC , so is the Remington 700 (3 model variations), Ruger Mini 14, AAC Micro (3 models), Kimber and a fair number of other manufacturer's rifles. I'm talking bolt guns only, not semi-autos. Friend of mine has a SS break action rifle with that chamber as well, don't recall the manufacturer. It shoots one ragged hole with 5-10 shots using cast bullets. Some of those folks also chamber the 7.62x39 case as do some gun makers from Yurp, but I don't see the big head start?

The average joker probably shouldn't fool with guns if they aren't willing to examine the details. Thoughtless enthusiasm is the catalyst for ER visits.

So OK, ammo is cheap for the 39. Is that it? Hang in there, the prices will climb in time.

Our area of hunting differ greatly from the US, plus I don't the amount of hunting I once did due to age and health, ive also thinned the heard to these
Sako custom 358 win
CZ 527 7.62x39
19 badger

The rifle that 9 times out of 10 accompanies on my walks is the x39, just love it. The little CZ barrel is only 18 1/2" I load the CFE BLK with Barnes 123 gr
bullets for 2,540 fps. I have taken 10 sambar deer over the last two winters all one shot kills, if you are not familiar with the sambar its a big animal.
Having said that I don't shoot em in the arse and hope for the best if I can't place the bullet I don't shoot it.

Many use the x39 in CZ & Howa on goats & pigs the123 gr Hornay SST seems the pick. I think its a love/ hate thing, we have not seen the new CZ with 20" barrel I think I would like that also. Its a good round with good powder and projectiles and very accurate in a good bolt rifle. I have'nt shot the Ruger but handled one and did'nt like the feel that's just a personal preference, buy it enjoy it

Johno

Okay Dan, let's see if I can cover all this.

I had no idea that there were that many factory rifles available for the .300, mainly because the round is of little or no interest or use to me in its subsonic dress, which as how I first became aware of it. For the same reason, I had no idea how much factory ammo was available for it, but a quick check at Midway shows there's a bunch. Clearly there's no contest as to the number of bullets available in .308 as opposed to .310-.312. So, I have to agree that despite a slight velocity advantage for the 7.62 the .300 is a more versatile and useful round than the Russkie, even in pure factory dress. That doesn't mean, however, that the 7.62 isn't a good choice, if maybe not the absolute best, for the uses it's usually put to, especially for someone like Mr. Walter that already has other rifles so chambered, which is how all this got started. I already explained how I came to buy one, and eventually I'll get it back and and see what kind of fun I can have with it, since it's already in hand, not because I especially wanted one myself. I expect that I'll enjoy shooting it because it's a handy little gun with a nice trigger that's cheap to shoot even without reloading and doesn't kick a lot. I might even work up a good load for turkeys or play with .308 sabots if they don't rattle down the barrel too badly.

When I mentioned details, I was trying to point out that stuff like those lovely heavy cast bullets you posted a pic of are totally off the radar for the person who just wants to shoot a bit, not get involved in the wild fringes of this business. You work on some wonderful stuff and keep us amazed and entertained with your toys, but it's the shooting equivalent of a guy who hybridizes tea roses or breeds raptors. Sometimes our enthusiasm keeps us from seeing things from the viewpoint of those not so heavily involved or invested.

I'm good with that Pappy. I don't know anything at all about tea roses.

Did them damn raptors tell ya I was breedin' 'em? Lyin' little bastids. Was it the T-Rex or them little buggers?

Guy on the Fieldsports Channel raises eagles, hybrid falcons, and I think, Redtails since he uses them on game. Trains them with drones, puts cameras on the eagles while they hunt, even splices in replacement feathers using carbon shafting. Neat stuff, but too much fun for me; inseminating a big killer bird worth thousands while keeping your eyes and flawless complexion, using imaging equipment to keep track of the chicks in the eggs, etc. I can barely keep a dog.

My bad.

I thought you were talking this kind of raptor.

Those are even tougher.....

Pretty sure my HOA has a rule against them too.

Dan,

Top handload for the 7.62X39 with a 150 grain bullet is 2,200fps (that's in a 16 inch barrel by the way)===> so much for the 30-30 eating it's arse.

30 carbine with it's 110 grain bullet at 1,900 fps (not to mention it's a round nose... you were going on about BC above)===> is a hell of a lot more than a short step behind it.

I've got a couple of 300 BO's and they do not run circles around it "Faster". But it (the BO) is a much better round for suppression.

Might add Hornady's 300 BO velocities from a 24 inch barrel are a little disingenuous, not many 24 inch 300 BO's around===> might be pretty 'Quiet' unsuppressed though.

Jerry

the american is a great little rifle. I have had one for almost a year now.. it is my favorite rifle to take to the range. shoots the hornady stuff inside and inch all day. I might have gotten a good one, but I hear almost all the ruger americans shoot well.

Shooting Federal Fusion at 200 yds.



With federal's $5 a box rebate, i'm not going to reload at 60 cents a round delivered. Fun little rig, quiet and shoots like a BB gun. Haters gonna hate, but the little ruger commie carbine is where it's at.

Mine is a great little shooter, love the 10 rd mags, inexpensive rifle, cheap ammo, accurate just seems to belong in my 86 CJ7.

Color me a bit skeptical, kinda like the orangutans. If you're getting 2200 fps with 150s out of the 39 please shoot at least 10 benches away from me. I see a few loads that approach that, all maximum according to the books, none that get there. There are numerous loads for the 30-30 that wander around the 23/2400 fps range and one I'm aware of that runs 2500 fps+. Like the BO it has options for heavier bullets which the 39 does not. That said, I'm not going to quibble much about the numbers. They are all functional cartridges within their realm, but the 39 is saddled with oddball dims and does not have the wide range of options available for the others. That was my point about "running circles". They can all shoot light bullets at decent velocity, but the 39 takes a chitt after 150 grains. The BC numbers I referred to related to the heavier bullets that are useful to the BO, .30-30 and my cute little Sneezer. Pointy noses is a small part of BC calculation in case you didn't know that. MV doesn't matter nearly as much as impact velocity and that matters less than bullet construction and form when it comes to imparting destruction and mayhem.

I have a friend who has one that shoots that ammo, just like that.

Hence the "need" to get one.

What Pappy348 said about the CZ 527. If you want a well finished blue steel & walnut rifle it's a good choice for the money.

I just got one and the only real negative to me is having to mount a scope a little higher because of bolt handle clearance. On the plus side for me it comes with decent enough open sights and the receiver has integral bases. If you wanted to use receiver sights NECG makes a good quality adjustable receiver sight that fits the bases perfect with no d & t work.

James Calhoon makes aftermarket CZ parts that include a bolt handle that will allow lower scope mounting.

Again, it seems like the CZ is good if you sink a bunch of $$ into it post purchase, while the Ruger seems OK out of the gate.

Bolt handle clearance issues on a brand new factory rifle that is made for a scope? Really?

43Shooter,

Current 527's come with a modified bolt handle, no need to go aftermarket. I assume yours is an older model like mine are? My new Grendel has the lower handle. You can order the new handle and retro fit your older models. I run older Burris Compact scopes on my 7.62's so I don't run into issues with clearance. Newer scopes with their huge ocular bells definitely benefit from the new handle.

The only 7.62x39 I have is an old Norinco SKS.

While I have not taken any deer sized game with it, I can vouch for the little round being able to take a Javelina.

As for Rifle makes. I do have a Mini Howa in 6.5 Grendel. I also have RAR's in .223 & .22-250. The Howa action is much smoother than the RAR.

Just buy a 300 Blackout. This isn't 1974.

Can't argue re the bolt handle clearance issue on the CZ while the Ruger is probably good to go out of the box and it costs considerably less. IMO they're both good rifles.

If there is a reason I can't shoot heavy 308 bullets out of a suppressed 7.62X39 ruger, please tell me.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...-grain-hollow-point-boat-tail-box-of-50#

Otherwise, the 300 BO argument falls on it's face against the better available 7.62X39 cost of ammo for general purposes.

http://www.accuratereloading.com/76239.html

https://www.ar15.com/forums/armory/...Anyone_have_any_good_recipes_/42-325375/

Your google-fu doesn't have to be very strong to find loads that will fit in the AK or mini-30 magazine

Another argument against the 300 BO, in my opinion.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...13286789/gonew/1/300-bo-in-a-5-56#UNREAD

z l r,

Thanks for the info.

David,

The RARanch 7.62x39 is twisted 1:9.5, While the 300 BO is twisted 1:7.

The BO WILL stabilize your subsonic heavy bullets.

The 7.62x39 may not. Try it without your suppressor first to insure it stabilizes the bullet, so as to not risk damage to your suppressor.

Jerry

Barrel they ran those tests with was almost certainly a .308" groove. If you want to have a 39 so barreled go for it. The SAAMI spec twist for the 39 is probably OK for all .308" bullets. The barrel dims are the issue.

That isn't an argument. It is however a perfect illustration of the consequences of not paying attention whilst toying with a deadly weapon. Would imagine one can do the same with a rifle chambered in 5.45x39mm by use of a 7.62 round.

Food for thought perhaps, a picture of terminal phase performance. The left pair is the after/before with a 510 gr paper patched .45-70 load with impact velocity in the neighborhood of 1200-1300 fps in soft damp sand. The middle pair is a 185 grain .308 (30:1) that was recovered from a similar medium with impact ~1000 fps.

On the right is an AP core from a 7.62x39 that struck a helicopter at about 50 yards, penetrating 3/16" of fiberglass, a very thin aluminum sheet metal form and then a 1" diameter aluminum tube with walls about 1/16" thick before striking my boot heel. It spun like a top for a few seconds on the cockpit floor and I filed it away for future reference.



I truly endorse the cartridge if you want to plink at me in a chopper.

Thats rubbish about sinking lots of dollars into the CZ, $40.00 for a bolt handle swap that both CZ and Calhoon provide or 10 minutes and some cold blue if you have the older rifle the new ones have a much lower bolt handle.

Johno

That's sound advice.

So, bullets matter more than headstamps?

I've heard that ......

Ruger customer service emailed the dimensions as:

BORE .300
GROOVE .311

0.003" difference? I'll bet the bullets can't tell.

Although, further research finds a number of people who slugged their barrels reporting .309 groves, which would make sense for a rifle set up to shoot .311 or .308 bullets.

I'll take that bet, and if you start shooting undersized bullets your barrel be trash in short order. It's called gas cutting.

Almost every flat based bullet will expand to fill the whole bore. I don’t think this is a concern.

https://www.quora.com/What-is-it-called-when-a-bullet-expands-in-a-rifle-barrel-when-fired

No need for Google, I've used both of these garbage rounds in real life. The 300 Blackout is slightly less garbage, because they generally have quick enough twist to effectively stabilize subsonic heavies. If not using subsonic heavies, just shoot a 223.

Praire_goat,

Can’t hunt big game with a 223 in WA State, where I live.

And, I already have a American Ranch in 223/5.56.

The 7.62x39 will be a “fun gun.”

David, the assumption that jacketed bullets obturate has little basis in fact. Be it lead or copper the minimum force/chamber pressure required for obturation can be reasonably estimated by multiplying BHN X 1422. Depending on jacket alloy you're looking at 35-40 BHN. There is little way to know what the lead core alloy is but it can range from 6 to the low 30s. Yes, given enough pressure it can work out within reasonable parameters but the SAAMI max for the 39 is 45 KPSI. That translates to the minimum pressure required to obturate bullet material in the 32 BHN realm.

With that said I wish you luck with your choice and you have my thoughts.

If the rifle is just for fun, then use a 223. There will be zero difference in fun out to the ranges where most fun is engaged. Plus you already have the other rifle, which pays for a lot of fun 223 ammo.

That makes sense. I've been trying to get less rifles, more trigger time for years.

We have a couple of the Ruger Americans in 300 Blackout. They are among the most accurate rifles we own. We shoot 110 grain Hornady GMX bullets at 2,395 fps. So far we have killed half dozen hogs and deer and have not yet recovered a bullet. One hole groups at 100 yards when I am up to it.

Where the Blackout shines is easing through the woods or down damp sandy hardwood bottom trails where walking is quiet. The 16" barrel and short stock on my Ruger American make it a very light and fast handling hunter with no recoil to speak of. Easy to spin a bullet through a small opening in thick cover with that excellent accuracy. I can do the same thing with my 308, but with more weight and more recoil that these old bones do not need unless it is necessary. Sometimes less is more.

I would not mind having the same rifle in 7.62 x 39 and take advantage of that cheap ammo. But I have the Blackout and it is so accurate with my reloads I am not about to give it up.

David,

I like my RAR 7.62x39, a lot of fun... BUT I've got to agree with the above, You could buy quite a bit of .223/5.56 ammo for what you would have in the Ruger.

For hunting here I am loathe to take it as there are a lot of instances where the distance is a bit much for the 7.62x39. At which point I have to ask why even own it?


The RARanch 7.62x39 will shoot (at least some) .308" bullets well. I've only tried it with the Barnes Barnes 110 grain blackout bullets though.

Jerry

I certainly understand the appeal of another rifle, but agree with you - I've been trying to do the less rifles/more trigger time thing as well. I think the most fun I've had shooting was back when I just owned a few guns, and spent more money on ammo. Slowly getting back there.

Less guns is never more fun. Sorry....

Ok, enabler here. What’s the best bang for the buck rifle? 7.62x39 ammo is cheap.

David.! 7.62

seven six two

Enough said

If you want a very fun and accurate rifle to shoot cheap Russian Wolf ammo into sub MOA groups, get the Ruger.

I have one, it shoots Wolf 123gr HP ammo ($.022 per round delivered) usually at 1/2" for 3 shots at 100yds.

I've got a SWFA 6x Mil Quad on top and it's super fun to shoot rocks out to 600 yards with.

I enjoy not having to reload for at least one rifle.........

Good to see you posting again. Comrade

I was just gonna say Rancho has a killer little commie setup.

Ruger American Ranch fo' sho'!

Here is mine.

This guy says that the 7.62x39 is okay fine. First deer, taken this morning by the fruit of the loins of the fruit of my loins.

[img]https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/galleries/13300564/deer-3[/img]

In campfire tradition, I'm not going to address the question.

If a short light mild 30 caliber round for deer is the question.

Winchester answered it 125 years ago.


I have looked at the little CZ in 7.62 for a long time, and thought it
would be cool. But then, the 30-30 pops into my mind.

Going suppressed changes things. Too cheap to go that route.