Sako Also Sucks - 24hourcampfire

Or would it be more accurate to say Beretta sucks. Or maybe just the Beretta people in the USA, or maybe its the home office in Italy. Anyway as the story goes.
 
 I just received my Sako 75 7MM STW from the Beretta USA Corp repair center. What a joke they turned out to be. It appears the rifle is over 1 year old and they won't warranty a factory screwup, they made when it was put together. Seems the stock was a little oversize in the action area allowing the barrel to move from side to side in the barrel channel. Needless to say the rifle won't shoot in the same place twice. The way the rifle is made, the action must be tight in the stock. The 75 has a flat bottom action and unlike the Remington that has a round bottom action will move around if the stock is not tight against the sides of the action. At this point it will have to be epoxy bedded or it will never shoot worth a hoot. I have 2 Sako 75's now and they will be replaced by the older Sako AV's, or Remingtons. After I sent this rifle to Sako, I looked at some of the used Sako's in the gun shops near me and found this problem is not just in my rifle.
 
 Wanna buy it? $750 prepaid to your FFL
 
 Dan

If it's just a simple bedding problem,why don't you buy a $10 box of Acraglas Gel,Marine-Tex,etc and fix it?
 Just a thought...

I guess that will work, I never thought I would have to rebuilt a thousand dollar rifle in the first years of its life. We are not talking about a three hundred dollar Savage here. We are talking about a rifle that should shoot the pants off a Savage not the reverse.
 
 
 Dan

DFC I understand where you are coming from, but, any wood stocked factory rifle is capable of doing what yours did! That is just another reason why SOOO many are going to synthetics. Even the cheap plastic stocks are less likely to compress/swell/shrink/etc..
 
 I would bed it, or have it bedded, to see what hapens!
 
 $750 isn't much more than the Rem's and Win's out there, probably the cost of importation..raising the price.
 
 Don't give up on it too easily, you obviously wanted it, or you wouldn't have bought it. [Linked Image]

Mike

I've got two 75's, a .300 Wby and 7mm Rem Mag. The first thing I do when I buy a rifle is bed the action. I did the same with these two and they have been the two most accurate rifles I own. Bedding is simple, inexpensive and will probably fix the problem with your 75.

Lets stay on the topic of customer service. Or lack thereof.
 
 The fine print says all and they still have a pi&& poor warranty.
 
 The following is word for word!!!!!
 
 "Dear valued customer
 The purpose of this correspondence is to notify you that Beretta USA Corp. has received the item which you returned for evaluation and repair.
 
 The warranty period on our firearms is (1) year from the orininal date of purchase to the orininal purchaser ONLY. if your firearm meets this criteria, PLEASE DO NOT CALL. The firearm will be repaired and returned to you under warranty.
 
 Products which fall outside our warranty guidelines will be evaluated. At that time, an estimate will be prepaired and you will be notified by telephone as to our findings. Payment may be arranged when authoration for repair is given. We accept major credit cards, (Visa, Master Card, American Express) and check or money order. **NO C.O.D. 'S**."
 
 Dan

The cost of this rifle is $800.00 wholesale, add dealer markup and taxes and you have a thousand dollar rifle that won't shoot worth a damn as is.
 
 
 "$750 isn't much more than the Rem's and Win's out there, probably the cost of importation..raising the price"

DFC,
 
 I understand your anger BUT if a $10 dollar box of bedding compound will fix your problem then WHY spend 4 times that amount shipping your rifle back and forth to the distributor?
 
 I also bed all my rifles whether they are box stock factory ones or custom barreled,McMillan stocked wonder sticks.

DFC I am trying to look at the good side! If you are unsatisfied, by all means sell out...I can say that you may as well get one built by a professional or you will never be satisfied....Many on the board are coming to that point in their lives ...I am very near it myself [Linked Image]

Mike

Well I have Sako problems too. When I got my new Sako 75 in 7mm-08, I shot about half a box of shell sighting it in. Shoot once, move the scope, etc. The last 2 shots actually touched so I thought all was great. I didn't shoot anymore and went hunting. A couple of days later I decided to see how it grouped. I shot a 5 shot group about 5" (that's 5 inches not point 5 inches). I thought, good grief I can't shoot anymore. I get out my Bushmaster and put 5 shots in an inch. Hmm... something's not right. I took it back to the dealer for him to look at. He's a benchrest shooter and sells alot of custom reloads. He shoots the gun and gets 2 3-shot groups of about 4" too. Now, I'm waiting for him to get a different brand of ammo to see if that helps, if it doesn't then I guess it's off to Sako, Beretta or whoever. I'm real disappointed too. I've always heard how accurate Sako's are and have never spent this much on a rifle. Ironically, I just sold a Remington that shoots better than this because I wanted something "accurate". As for bedding, etc. that's all great if you know how to do it, but this is a Sako, noted for "out of the box accuracy" as they advertise.

GAHunter, 5" groups are hard to imagine. Have you tried another scope on it to make sure that's not the problem?

I bed anything that's not a custom rig, which means I bed almost everything since custom is kinda outa my price range.

I didn't check the scope. It's a new Leupold Vari-X III, so I don't think that's the problem, though it's possible. Anyhow, I left it with the dealer. Hopefully, he'll take care of it.

If you guys had bought a Savage you would be shooting better groups at 1/3 of the price.....ducking.....LOL

Also, check the mounts and tighten all the screws. Though I know you would not forget to check these!
 
 Actually, I would clap the rifle in a vise so it should shoot independent of the sights. That way you can determine if the problem is caused by your sights or something else.

Let's get back to the Sako 75, 7mm STW, for $650. I'll send you a check, pay COD, or use any brand of plastic you like. Just drop me an email at "[email protected]". Let me know and I'll provide an FFL for you to mail it to.
 
 By the way Dan, the reason for the 1 year warranty issue is that the newest owner doesn't want to assume liability for any of the old trashy finnish made rifles. I've offered to collect them all and store them until they can decide what to do with them, but no one ever responded to my offer. Wonder why?? [Linked Image]

Dan,
 
 I noticed a misprint in your post, you meant to say $750.00, right?
 
 Dan

I'm really sorry to see this. The older Sakos I've seen, shot, and heard about, never failed to shoot well, and impress.
 As far as bedding goes, glass bedding does eliminate the variables. I've had only one rifle that ever got glass bedded that didn't shoot better. It did close some gaps that would have allowed water, dust etc. to get where I didn't want it, so I'm not unhappy.
 I had all of my custom rifles glassed in before I shot them. It is the way to go. E

Dan
 I'll trade my my sucks 8mm rem mag for your sucks stw. It wears a 28 in. pac nor tube and mcmillan stock. Approx. 200 rounds fired. Likes the first two loads I worked up of 220 sierra's over re25 and h4831, everything else of course sucks, a genuine 1.5 in. rifle with 220gr. hornadys, 200gr. noslers over h4831, re22&25. More loads I could play with, but this rifle and I need to part ways. If Dan isn't interested I will entertain all offers. I'll even throw in dies, brass and bullets. dempsey

DFC.When you get tired of crappy bedding jobs ,barrels that foul like crazy and are only good for shooting around corners,and trigger pulls that require vice grips to pull off a round,You might want to consider a custom rig.Its not as expensive as you might think.And you get what you want the way you want it.Ive had very good luck with.
 
 Dan Dowling
 260 33.5 Road
 Palisade,Colorado 81526
 Ph# 970 434 0525
 
 This guy is a BR shooter and big game hunter and does not charge an arm and a leg.
 dave

I think Dan has a lot of custom rigs and does the work himself. I think his point is he didn't get what he paid for and the service was below par.

Dan,
 
 Dave and I don't agree on everything, but we do agree on having a custom rifle built. Case in point. I took my "long range" deer rifle to the range three weeks ago, just before I left on vacation. I figured I needed to start getting some data together so this rifle would be ready for this fall. I quickly found a promising load. After four three-shot groups that averaged .364," I decided that load was good enough and just sighted it in. This rifle is a John Rick's built 700 with 28" Pac-Nor #5. Bullets were 165 Sciroccos at 3150 fps MV. Yes, I did carefully prep the brass, but only a good rifle with a good scope (ie Leupold, sorry Dave) will provide that kind of consistency. This rifle cost me under $1200 to build, and that includes buying the donor rifle for it's action.
 
 Celt and Charlie Sisk are a couple of other rifle-builders with a good reputation.
 
 Blaine

You're right denpsey, this is about NOT getting what I paid for " out of the box accuracy". I can certainly bed the rifle in short order, but why should I have to. I might have bedded it anyway, just for the hell of it. I just don't like to be lied to and lead down the garden path by some foreign smartass.
 
 
 Dan

DFC, if that Sako was a .30-06 I'd probably take it off your hands. I don't have a need and don't want a 7 STW. The way you have criticized the Sako 75 in the past over at Shooters.com, I'm surprised you bought one. What gives?

Here's a laugh for ya, I have 2- 75's, one 22-250 and the soon to be famous 7MM STW. both are for sale or trade for Sako AV's
 
 
 Dan

DFC, seems your now standing in my shoes so to speak only with a Sako instead of a Remington. It's a major pisser and I'd love to gloat on your bad luck, but the truth is it really does suck to have rifles of supposedly "known quality" need more money poured into them. Made even worse by the lack of responsibility on the manufactures part. I highly doubt that if you had the same problem with a Remington that you'd get any better service than you are from Berretta. My last 4 Remington's all need money poured in to them to get them to do what they should of done in the first place. Granted, most of it is trigger adjustments and bedding, but some of it is far more expensive like replacing the POS synthetic stocks they arrive in. I've given up on factory rifles off the shelf and it's pretty much custom rifles from here on out. Damn shame a guy has to fork over that kind of money to get a rifle that is bedded half way decent, has a remotely acceptable trigger, and a stock that is a step up from a boat paddle, but it appears they don't make them like that anymore without the aid of a good gunsmith. Good luck in your ordeal with Sako 75's.

Big Sky's,
 
 A very classy post. I'm impressed!

Just get a good action of your choice and send it off to Griffin & Howe in NY and for a paltry $7,000.00 they will fit and finish the action, finish it, put it in a real pretty French Walnut stock with Horn pistol grip and end cap. All in about 2-3 years turn around!
 
 Then I bought mine from an estate and bypassed the wait and much of the Dinero.

Here ya go guy's.
 
 CLASSIC FRENCH WALNUT STOCK
 
 Price $7,000.00
 
 On your action with French Walnut classic sporter stock, cheekpiece for either right or left hand shooter, ebony forend tip, Griffin & Howe pistol grip cap and quick release trigger guard. Your action will be honed and the lugs lapped. The action tang refined and bolt release checkered. All metal parts are polished and rust blued. Hand rubbed London oil finish, 22 lines per inch checkering, wrapped around top of grip, Griffin & Howe point pattern. Finished to a Griffin & Howe pad or Niedner butt plate. Douglas Premium barrel to our contour. Hand engraved with serial number, caliber and Griffin & Howe, New York on barrel.
 
 TERMS
 
 The complete Griffin & Howe Classic French Walnut stocked rifle will be delivered approximately two and a half years from the date of order.
 
 1/3 deposit with order, 1/3 upon completion "in-the-white", balance on completion.
 
 
 
 
 OPTIONAL FEATURES
 
 Griffin & Howe 1/4 Rib, with standing bar, folding leaves, gold inlaid lines
 $975.00
 
 Griffin & Howe Express Sight, with standing bar with gold line, wide "V"
 $500.00
 
 Griffin & Howe Front Sight with 3/32" gold bead and detachable Hood
 $300.00
 
 Griffin & Howe Barrel Band
 $145.00
 
 Griffin & Howe quick detachable Top Mount, with 1" Rings
 $625.00
 
 Griffin & Howe quick detachable Top Mount, with 30 mm Rings
 $875.00
 
 Extra Griffin & Howe Top Mount Rings - 1"
 $250.00
 
 Extra Griffin & Howe Top Mount Rings - 30 mm
 $350.00
 
 Griffin & Howe quick detachable Sidemount, with 1" Rings
 $405.00
 
 Extra Griffin & Howe Sidemount Top Half, with 1" Rings
 $225.00
 
 Griffin & Howe quick detachable Sidemount, with 30 mm Rings
 $525.00
 
 Extra Griffin & Howe Sidemount Top Half , with 30 mm Rings
 $345.00
 
 Pop up Peep Sight
 $225.00
 
 Burnish bolt, follower, and raceway
 $225.00
 
 Alter bolt for low scope
 $150.00
 
 Furnish and fit three position safety and shroud assembly on Mausers
 $325.00
 
 Checkered Bolt Knob 2-panel Tear Drop
 $260.00
 
 Checkered Bolt Knob 5-panel with Rose Petal
 $475.00
 
 Trapdoor Butt Plate
 $100.00
 
 Trapdoor Grip Cap
 $625.00
 
 Fleur-de-Lis pattern checkering
 $325.00
 
 Recoil Bolt, fitted and engraved
 $325.00
 
 Extra Synthetic Stock, including extra guard screws
 $675.00
 
 Gold Oval, fitted and hand engraved with 3 initials
 $300.00
 
 Silver Oval, fitted and hand engraved with 3 initials
 $250.00
 
 Custom engraving, gold inlays, higher grade wood available by quotation.

That seems reasonable. I may have to get two!!!!( BIG grin)!!!!

Blaine.Ive owned 28 Leupolds.Some of the very first ones are pushing 25 years old now.Im down to 21 now and have weeded out some of the junk.Ive shot some of my very best Aggs. under a Leupold but with high volume shooting like BR you really have to keep an eye on them.Jim Borden will tell you the same thing.He recommends Swarovski for hunting.Its alot easer to tell when a Leupold takes a dump on a BR rifle than a deer rifle.All my 36X BRs have been modified with a locking pin on the erector tube.Its the only way.I kind of look at it like this.You spend the money for a custom barrel, stock,trigger,action work, and the smith to put it all togeather.And then go and put a production built scope with Asian glass on it.Why? Becaues it American?I think NOT
 Ill stick with the Euros for my hunting.
 dave

OK. Dave. You aren't happy with Leupold. What makes you think S&B, and Swaro are any better ? E

Dave--I was just fishin' for ya'....think I got a bite.
 
 Blaine

Big Sky,
 Thanks for the good wishes on my problem with the Sako 75.
 
 To put this in a proper perspective, you can buy 2 Remingtons for the price paid for 1 Sako 75. Having said that, one would expect the Sako to shoot twice as good from the box as the Remingtons do. I didn't need the rifle when I bought it, I just wanted it. It has set in the safe in its box for over 2 years, never had a scope on it or had a round fired through it. Here's another twist in this story, the stock now has a ding in it that wasn't there when I sent it to Beretta. The box is intact and the ding didn't come from shipping, so they must have dinged it while they were looking at it. In all the years I have messed with firearms, this is by far the most frustrating thing that I have come across. I'll end up bedding it, and will bitch about it for the next 20 years to anyone that will listen.
 
 
 Dan

DFC,
 
 The WSM's will become "famous" long before the STW ever will.

bearstalker,
 
 You may have missed the drift of the statement "soon to be famous".
 Bad publicity for Sako was the meaning.
 Or this rifle will be famous, for being a pain in Sako's a$$, or Sako will wish they had bought it back this time next year when I'm still raising hell with them, or, or.
 PS, I don't think the WSM will replace any of the top cartridges. Hype only goes so far, and the short mags have been hyped out. I'm ready for the next wave of super cartridges.
 
 
 Dan

Well, I broke down and bedded the damn thing, nobody wanted to buy it, can't imagine why.
 So now its not for sale until I shoot it. I think it knows at this point its chop-saw time if it don't do its thing.
 
 Dan

I�m sorry to hear about the piss-poor quality of that Beretta/Sako. I think your right. You should be able to count on better quality for that kind of money. Then again, the amount you spend doesn�t always mean anything. I�ve got a buddy who consistently shoots tiny groups with his Weatherby Vanguard. I think he got it for around $400.00.
 
 I can�t agree on the �Beretta sucks� theory. I�ve got a Beretta Mato, in 7mm, and couldn't be happier. Shoots straight and accurate every time. I�ve got the composite stock on mine. The only change I made, after opening the box, was the addition of a Vari-x II in 3x9x50. I�ve had it out at the range ten or so times, thus far, and never had a problem. It�s going into the woods Monday. Hopefully, I�ll have the chance to prove the quality after I line it up on a nice bull.
 
 Of course, I haven't had the displeasure of dealing with the Beretta customer service.
 
 Take care,
 Jim