Guys,

What have you found to be the ideal dedicated suppressed hunting rifle rig. This will be for general purpose hunting from Africa to Texas (eland to hogs). Custom or not does not matter, I just need some guidance and direction from those with much experience as I transition my arsenal over to suppressors. Thanks in advance, R

I just got done building my "ultimate" suppressed rifle. It may not trip your trigger, but it is great for me.

Mine is a Tikka SS action, Bartlein 8.7" twist 7mm barrel, 20" Rem Varmint taper, 7 spiral flutes, chambered in 7-08AI, and threaded 5/8-24". I mounted it in a McMillan Game Hunter, edge fill, stock. It currently has RedSnake Tactical bottom metal and uses an AI MK1 magazine, but I am going to change that out for a Mountain Tactical OEM aluminum bottom metal and standard Tikka mags. The reason is that I don't like the magazine rattle (side-to-side) that I get with the current BM/mag setup. Finally, I have a Burris Veracity 3-15X50 scope on it. I like the Veracity because it has a good mix of hunting and "tactical" features. I like the capped turrets for hunting and the relatively clean reticle that is also pretty easy to use on 3X even though it is a FFP scope. As for durability, that remains to be seen, but I got it for a pretty solid price and if it ends up not working out for me, I will probably go with a NightForce SHV.

With a 162 grain Hornady ELD-X bullet, I would be comfortable shooting any North American game animal and all African plains game.

something something .308 with a 20" proof, Thunderbeast can, and Nightforce on top

Suppress your urge for suppressors.

Yup.
Sounds like what I would do.

Christensen Arms Ridgeline. 20" 308. Silencerco Omega. Leupold vx5hd 3-15. Case or two of 165 grain Federal Fusion.

I have got such bad tinnitus that I have to protect what hearing I have left. Also, having now hunted suppressed in Africa there is no way I can go back. I doubt if I will ever shoot/hunt with any of my rifles unsuppressed ever again. Really appreciate the comments from those with much more suppressor experience than myself.
R

I set up a christensen ridgeline 6.5 20” barrel with nxs 3-15 for a bud recently. Super handy rifle. Accurate.

My advice about suppressor purchase is this.

When you buy them( note them not one) go ahead and do them all at the same time on a trust. I have 4 at home with 2 more on the way. The rimfire can is just silly fun and quiet.

Rimfire can is necessity, 30 cal can necessity

Do you need to suppress a big bore? Handgun?

Just buy them all at once and be done! You won’t regret that at all. Trust me

I'd go 18" if you can. My Montana with a Hart, suppressed is my ideal suppressed hunting rig.
16" .308

19" Kimber 7-08AI

Do you like CRF or pushfeed?

A Shilen DGR (700 footprint) build using your choice of stock, trigger, barrel, magazine etc would be pretty easy to have dandy hunting rifles..

Buying more Tikkas is simpler.

Boomer,

As you know I love the tikkas but they don't seem optimal for shooting suppressed. The t3x lite would require an adapter to direct thread to my 5/8x24 suppressor. The CTR is heavy when attached to my suppressor with a decent scope. Probably could chop barrel, install lighter scope, or change out stock on the CTR. Just wanted to see what other guys are doing that primarily hunt suppressed. I will check out the shilen. Thx

You could chop your CTR to 17-18” and drop it into a lite stock, or a manners EHT, and run the plastic lite DBM. I doubt that setup would weigh much more than a proof barreled custom

I have a few tikkas right now, including a CTR at 18”. I also picked up a T3x SS lite in 6.5, but haven’t decided whether to chop and thread it or just run the CTR. My other two lites are 223 and a 243, at 16.5 and 18” threaded 1/2”-28. I run an adapter on them with a 6” long titanium can and that makes for a handy, light suppressed hunting rifle. I’ve had no problems with using the adapter, though like you I’d prefer to just have barrels that are threaded 5/8”

Guys running kimber montanas suppressed must be using adapters, to my knowledge the only ultralight rifle with 5/8” threads from the factory is the Barrett fieldcraft

If I was going custom I think I’d do something with a Bighorn Origin, a manners elite hunter stock, and a barrel in a Bartlein 3b or similar contour at 18” or so

Walter,
That is great information and gives me a couple ideas I had not considered--thank you. My T3X lite is a 30-06 and Thunderbeast, among others, says no go with a 1/2x28 adapter. Be interested to know if you end up with the chopped CTR or the t3's with adapters. The adapters seem like a suboptimal solution if I am solely going to hunt suppressed moving forward. Maybe I am wrong? Really appreciate the comments/advice.
R

You know, it was soooo close on that T3X, for going straight 5/8-24 threads. I wonder if cutting back to 18 or 19 would have satisfied the smith that insisted it needed to go 1/2-28?


I personally see zero issue using an adapter. I am on my Montana and FN15, without issue with the Octane30. But, why do it if not needed from the start....


Are you looking to build a couple or few identical rifles in different calibers? I sure wouldn't want to hunt a CTR, a slim sporter would be the way to go.. Did you like the SWFA 3-9? Lotsa of questions, been wondering!

The Montana is an oddball, 7/16-28. The only adapter to 5/8-24 I could locate was Kimber's $45 solution.

Bought several adapter items from a a guy in Kansas with zero complaints. https://www.downrangeproductsco.com

Chopping a lite back doesn’t gain you much diameter, still have to go 1/2” or possibly 9/16”. I understand Rhettsker’s dilemma, Thunderbeast clearly says that 1/2” threads aren’t sufficient for .30 cal bore. The reason they say this is the resulting thin muzzle walls when threading larger bores 1/2”. Not so much that using adapters is bad, though an adapter does add another component to the mix that could result in a suppressor not being as concentric to the bore as it should be.

But like you said Boomer Kimber Montana’s come with 7/16” muzzle threads and we’ve all seen that many guys are using 1/2” threads with 6.5, 7mm, .30 cal bores. So obviously opinions vary on the issue of small muzzle thread and larger bores.

As I mentioned earlier, I use 1/2” threads on T3x lites in 223 and 243. No problems at all as the adapter I use and The muzzle threads are cut straight enough that everything lines up properly.

Based on my measurements with the t3x lite, even if I chop the barrel to 16.5”, i can only go with the 9/16 adapter. If I could go 5/8 problem solved but I cannot. I wish someone would a Tikka press fit like the fieldcraft- would make a fortune. Maybe chopping the ctr and dropping in a t3x lite stock is the best I can do?

Ok, just not enough tapper. Thanks.

Just saw this. You like the Tikka stock, trigger, mags?
https://criterionbarrels.com/products/prefits/tikka-pre-fit-barrel/

The prefits are certainly an option worth exploring. I have heard they are way back ordered (not sure if thats true). Love everything about the t3x except the suppressor issues. Also like the ctr except for the overall weight and magazine hanging down (not ideal for hunting).
R

Those dB figures for the Thunder Beasts are impressive! Staying tuned.
Good luck.

Not a thunderbeast, but the Harvester on my .308 pic'd above is 1/2" threads. I have easy 500 rds thought it do far with no issues.

I bought a Savage Hog Hunter for my suppressor

And I’m sure you’re not the only one doing that. When shooting with the suppressor attached those 1/2” threads are reinforced, so I don’t know if “belling” of the muzzle over time is the issue or if it’s more about the muzzle threads possibly splitting radially and leading to the suppressor sitting crooked, and a subsequent baffle strike and suppressor damage. I’d like to see a detailed explanation from a suppressor manufacturer or rifle smith

There isn’t a suppressor issue with T3 lites. Tens of thousands use suppressors on them, without issue.


Buy the suppressor you want. Get an adapter or get it threaded to fit. Done.

I’ve shot several thousand suppressed rounds through factory barrels that have been chopped and threaded 1/2x28.... from .223 to .300 WSM.... Tikkas, Montuckys, Remingtons, and a couple RARs. I simply use a 1/2x28-5/8x24 adapter in my SAS Arbiter suppressor. I’ve never had any issues at all.

Formi and Prairie Goat,

I was hoping you guys would weigh in on this subject. However, with all due respect, you guys are directly contradicting numerous suppressor manufacturers and gunsmiths who disagree with your recommendations. Why is there such differing opinions on this topic? For example, I can speak to 10 different gunsmiths and suppressor manufacturers about threading my Tikka T3X lite 30-06 and receive nearly 10 different answers. Its very confusing and frustrating to the average hunter who just wants wants to hunt suppressed and save his hearing. Why such a disconnect?
R

Fieldcraft. Lots of rifle for the money. Screw on a scope and suppressor and get after it.

On a thin walled sporter barrel, is it stronger to barrel thread 1/2x28" and screw your suppressor direct -or- use a 1/2x28 to 5/8x24 adapter and screw your suppressor onto the adapter?
R

I read somewhere that Silencerco recommends a 9/16" thread on factory Rem 700 sporter barrels, as the barrel diameter is sufficient and it yields the best strength when combined with their 9/16 direct thread option. Kind of splits the difference on the 1/2 vs 5/8 options. Just something to bear in mind. I could see grabbing a $480 SS700 .308ADL as a starting point and then chopping it / threading it 9/16 for an Omega.

I’m not ‘goat or Form.... but I have had the same discussion with a lot of ‘smiths.

My take on it is this..... most of what comes out of old gunsmiths mouths is old wive’s tales. The majority of gunsmiths have never shot a suppressed rifle, and frankly have no use for them.

As far as the suppressor manufacturers..... much like the rest of the firearms industry, they’re ultimately run by lawyers.... and are simply covering their collective asses.

For a dedicated suppressed hunting rig.... I like an 18” sporter barreled 7/08, running 140/150 grain bullets in the 2700fps range. I’ve used mine both suppressed and unsuppressed in hunting situations.

It would be the same threaded 1/2-28 with or without adapter.

"Thousands of rounds.... never had an issue. "

'There is no issue... "

Those words are good as gold.

The threads would be the same, however I thought the adapter may provide a better shoulder to seat the suppressor against?? I am way out of my pay grade on this suppressor stuff😄

Well, an adapter with a shoulder seems to work fine and is what I am using rather than the shoulderless type on that T3X. If you want one to check out, I'll send you one. But, as long as it butts up against something, a shoulder, a lock washer or thread terminus, I just don't see it'd matter.

'Boom,

You going 1/2x28 to 5/8x24 with your adapter on the T3?

Dog,
Great comments. Thx, R

Well so far, 7/16-28 to 5/8-24 on a 6.5 Kimber, 1/2-28 to 5/8-24 on a 5.56 AR, and straight 5/8 on the 6.5 CTR.


Have others in the works that will be 1/2 or 5/8 as needed. Have to defer to others if 1/2 and 30 cal are ok? I have a 270 that might need 1/2?


Great thing to ask here cause these other guys BTDT...

I agree. When guys like Form, Prairie Goat, and Dogshooter all chime in and say good to go, that says a lot.

I had a Kimber Montana that was chopped to 17”, and chambered in .300 WSM.... I actually purchased it from ‘goat. It was threaded 1/2x28 and I used an adapter to get it to 5/8x24. Never had any issues with that rifle, and it shot like a champ. If I remember correctly it gave 26” .30-06 type velocities with 155s, 180s, and 208s.

The SilencerCo Omega can be outfitted with direct thread mounts of different thread patterns, obviating the need for an adapter, if 1/2-28 threads on a lighter barrel are required.

I’ve run a Harvester quite a bit, it has the option of interchangeable back plates too. On sporter weight barrels, I prefer the adapter over the direct 1/2x28 thread... as it feels more solid.

I bought my 1/2”-5/8” adapters from forum member john1187, they seem to be well machined parts. I’ve used this adapter with my 5/8-24 threaded 6.5mm can (SAS barricade) on 4 different tikka lites threaded 1/2”-28 with no problems whatsoever. These are 22-.243 cal rifles. It’s easy to visually check that your bore and suppressor are lined up properly prior to firing a new setup (just like manually bore sighting). You should check this whether using an adapter or not, a baffle strike due to a poor threading job would suck. Lockup has been solid as well, I’ve not had the suppressor come loose from firing or handling

To me the concern was more about muzzle wall thickness using 1/2” threads with a .264, 7mm, .30 cal bore than any worry about the adapter. This is the main issue that suppressor manufactures and some gunsmiths seem to be concerned about when threading sporter barrels. Formid, Dogshooter and jackmountain’s comments here make me think I shouldn’t worry so much about this issue. I may go ahead and thread my t3 lite 6.5 creed...

All that said I don’t think suppressor manufacturers like Thunderbeast and the many gunsmiths that caution against smaller thread diameters with larger bores are FOS. I’m thinking there’s some combination of round count, large capacity .30 cal like a .300wm, and small threads that would make something give (there’s gotta be a reason Barrett goes to the trouble to thread the FC muzzles 5/8”-24). Whether any of that is a real world concern for a guy setting up a Suppressed hunting rifle is another question.

I have 2 different rifles I cut specifically for a suppressor one is a 308 one is a 243. They are both threaded 1/2x28 and I run adapters on both. I feel a 20” balances well but haven’t tried shorter. The 308 crosses the chrono with a 165 gamechanger, rl15, and lapua brass at 2775. Haven’t checked the 243 yet as I am still playing with some loads.

I am thinking of trying a 783 HB in 6.5 creed for grins and they come with a 16.5” barrel.

Well, it sure CAN.

Thats really good to know. Its how I will set mine up.
Thx, R

Interesting. What’s UNsolid about the direct thread and fewer “connections,” do you think?

The step down from can, to adapter, to barrel seems to create a more ridged connection on the sporter barrel than the direct thread.

I'll likely be doing the 1/2x28 to 5/8x24 adapter when I get the next can in about a year. Any need for threadlocker on the barrel threads, or conversely anti-seize?

I am looking at threading all my 358 caliber rifles. Not all will be practical. But even the 673 in 350 Rem Mag can benefit in recoil reduction and noise reduction. And subsonic loads can be developed. Long for caliber bullets at slow speeds (velocity) can be hard to stop. What was the maximum range of the 45-70-500? I have forgotten how many yards that factoid would be. 3,000 + or _ ? Be Well, RZ.

6.5 Creed with 20” Bartlein #3 barrel threaded 5/8x24 for the TBAC CB.

That’ll do.

Yah, seems that'd work.

Could this have something to do with the characteristics of your barrel threads (how they were cut)?

No... I think it has more to do with the “shoulder” left on a sporter barrel at the back of the threads.

K7M
I covet your rigs! Every time I see one it looks and specs out to perfection. 😎

Marty,
Can you talk about you scope? I’m not familiar with it?

Thanks,
Mark

Premier Reticles is the precursor to Tangent Theta. That’s a 3-15x.

I thought with a Bartlein 3 contour, you only have enough meat for 5/8x24 threads out to 18”? With the 3b contour, you can get 5/8x24 at any length. Am I misinformed?

You’re not misinformed, but there may be some room to fudge (depending on who you ask, I’m not a gunsmith and I’d always say defer to a professional)

The typical recommendation is that you need .725” muzzle diameter for 5/8” threads with a proper shoulder of .050”
.725” - .625 (5/8” major thread diameter) = .100” left /2 equals a .050” shoulder all the way around.

In the past I’ve had a Shilen 4 and Brux 4 threaded 5/8” at approx 20”. These contours are close to a Bart 3. IIRC the muzzle diameters were .715-.720”. Worked fine with my suppressor, just didn’t quite have the minimum shoulder left that the folks at Thunderbeast would like to see. Technically speaking, you could have anything over .630” or so threaded 5/8”, you just wouldn’t have a shoulder left for the suppressor to lock up against.

Walt,

Yes, i think you are correct. With a 6.5 caliber and a 1” bbl shank, a #3 probably works finished at 20”.

Can't understand why anyone would think you need a bunch of shoulder. Whatever.

Ties back into my comment on the adapter feeling more solid than going straight 1/2x28 attachment. The adapter provides additional “shoulder” for the can to index on.

Do you shoot suppressors Boomer?

I send my barrels to Ecco machine in Elizabeth, Co for threading. Nick, the owner can cut, thread, and then mount a threaded collar to the barrel to provide a nice wide shoulder for the can to lock against. According to him the minimum barrel barrel diameters for each thread pattern with this method are .510" for 1/2-28, .573" for 9/16-24 and .635" for 5/8-24.

I don't have any Tikkas on hand, but I measured one of my last copies and I think you'd be able to do your Tikka lite in 5/8x24 at most any length.

On the topic of length, shorter is better for a suppressed rifle, 16" - 20", the velocity you give up is well worth the shorter length with a can installed. If you really need more velocity, I'd go with a bigger cartridge over a longer barrel, cans knock down blast a huge amount and recoil quite a bit, so the main cost is the extra powder.

I have a .30-06 X-Bolt chopped to 18.5" and threaded 5/8x24, and a 6.5 CM Kimber Montana chopped to 20" (probably could have gone shorter) and threaded 1/2x28 as my main hunting rifles:

The X-Bolt while out hunting yesterday (the elk were not cooperative).



Another virtue for suppressed hunting rifles is lightweight, Kimbers are great for this, my copy comes in at 7lb 1.1oz with scope and can.



This is what the muzzles with collars look like



Bonus pic of a Ruger 77/44 I had done the same way in 5/8x24.

Good stuff Scotty👍

Heck, I've been sending my stuff to Thunderbeast in Cheyenne lol. Guess I need to check out the local guy soon.

I've heard short barreled 6.5 rigs can work pretty well. These both go 8 pounds 10 ounces. Barrels cut at 18 and 19, both at .710 at muzzle.

5/8-24 needs 0.623" and that is barely there (IIRC 0.628 was the measurement) on the Tikka T3X Light 6.5 the OP has cut to 21". The smith that threaded it wanted a damned shoulder and insisted it needed to be done 1/2-28" because of that. Once a (3/4" long) shoulderless 5/8-24 adapter was screwed on, there was the same RCH shoulder as it would had been cut 5/8-24 direct. Damned much ado about nothing. Thread them 5/8-24 and throw a locknut behind it. But, Thunderbeasts says minimum 0.725" barrel. Exactly why is that much shoulder "required"? BS, it's not, but then, what would there be to post about...

I run std M700 sporters at 20" threaded 1/2UNF in 243 and7-08. My 308 M700 mk1 ti is 1/2UNF with a collar. I have a BRNO ZG in 30-06 at 21" and 1/2UNF.

No issues with bulging over thousands of rounds.

perfect?

I shoot a 30-06 browning boss a-bolt 20" barrel, 165g sst Hornady superformance factory ammo

I screwed off the BOSS and put on a titianium deadair suppressor

adjusted it like the BOSS and get easy 3/4' groups

2900fps, 0.447 BC

virtually no noticeable kick

what could be wrong with this set up?

I can't tell if you're being serious or sarcastic.

A suppressor needs a decent shoulder to stop against because that's what aligns it to the bore. Relying on a tight thread alone for alignment is not enough, especially if/when fouling builds up in the threads (mostly an issue when swapping between different thread lengths). A locknut is OK for a brake, not good enough for a suppressor IMO.

On a sporter weight 30 cal barrel I personally always choose and recommend 9/16"-24 rather than 1/2"-28 if possible. A larger thread is almost always better when it can be done right.

If a guy is having special adapters or collars made, you can have an adapter made to shoulder on the muzzle instead of a barrel shoulder; this lets you go with a larger thread size. I've done more than a couple barrels this way myself and machined adapters to match.

Can you post examples of your work?
Thx, R

If you're referring to my comment about shouldering an adapter on the muzzle, I don't have any pics handy of that, sorry. I'll try to remember next time I do one.

I looked at having my barrels set up to index the can of the muzzle, TBAC will thread your barrel specifically so that their brake indexes off the muzzle. The downside is that it is fairly specific to a certain type of muzzle device, limiting your use of different cans, and direct thread mounts (which I prefer). For my uses a locked on threaded collar, turned square is a superior solution, I can use any can or muzzle device with that thread pattern. POI is very repeatable out to the 400 yds I practice at with these rifles. The wide shoulders (in my case on the collars) are critical too a good lockup, something factory threading jobs often skimp on. I've hiked many, many miles in rough country with my hunting rifles (even fell off a log onto my rifle on a frozen pond the other day) and I've never had a can come loose. In contrast, my Tikka CTR, incredibly accurate hammer that it was, had an inadequately small shoulder and my DT cans, including my hunting can, would constantly walk loose just while shooting during range trips.

Very nice rigs! Our rifles have probably been passing each other in the mail mine going south, yours going north. TBAC is right down the road from me, the guys often shoot at my range, testing new stuff, they are all really cool. If I standardized on their cans, I'd send my stuff to them as well. I have a few different .30 cal cans though, and more on the way, so I needed a thin barrel solution that would work for all of them.

Scotty,
That is really interesting and helpful information. Thanks for sharing.
R

Different than a brake? You need clearance for your bullet to exit, no more, certainly not less.

But sure sure, shoulders are great. You're right. And I suppose that's what the smith's reasoning was. But, you absolutely don't need 0.750" to make 5/8-24" threads and you certainly don't need a 0.050 shoulder to align anything. Screw it on, if you're aligned, you're aligned. If you're not, your threads suck balz. If you're not sucking balz, a locknut would be just fabulous, if you are aligned ehh?

That looks handy as heck!!

Interesting. Thread 1/2-28", get a quality shouldered adapter, locktight the bugger on, and rockon. Or use a 1/2-28" brake. EZ peasy. Don't need a bunch of custom chit. Back to what the guys said before, no issues, no problems.

No. Pretty much everything you said there is wrong. You clearly don't know much about suppressor mounting or barrel threading, and don't seem interested in learning. Good luck on that, you're going to need it.

So - what makes your suppressor so much different than a brake? Do tell. The bullet flies through there. For example, my Omega 30 has an exit of 0.408" roughly. Sure as hell got clearance for the .264 and .224 bullets to pass, ehh? If your threads are crooked as chit, sure, you're screwed.

Suppressor mounting. LOL Fugging screw it on .

Lefty loosy, righty tighty?

Righty tighty... Wow, it's mounted.... Didn't even need custom adapters that shoulder on the muzzle. LOL

When you righty tighty.... what does the can bottom out on?

End of the threads on the barrel.....

End of the threads in the can....

End of the barrel....

By bottoming out on a shoulder... you’re protecting all three of the above.

Now I get it........thanks for that. My first can is still in jail so I'm trying to learn all I can before hand.

Shoulder on my adapter. Which is bottomed out on the shoulder of the barrel. Pretty simple chit. Main point being, that 0.750" barrel is not needed. What complete F'ing nonsense.

So, riddle me this, anyone. As indicated previously, the OPs 6.5 CM T3X Lite could achieve a 5/8-24 thread at 21" with just a tiny amount of what could be called shoulder, but, let's say it's just threads on the barrel terminating (on the end toward the receiver, no 0.050" shoulder....) If screwed on snug, righty tighty, (LOL) AND of course - if and only if - alignment is good to avoid any strike - what's the problem? The end of the barrel threads are inside the can's threads, the extra threads inside the can are just there per usual, and the crown is not touched, again per usual. What's the perceived problem?

Well, the fact that most rifle suppressors are 8"-10" long compared to a 1"-2" brake, for starters. Alignment is more critical for a longer suppressor.

This stuff isn't that hard to understand, but it's not so stupid simple that you can ignore the important details.

It's always amazing to me that some guys form such a strong opinion on something they know so little about. If you never learned this stuff, what makes you think you know it? Are you just so awesome that you automatically know things the rest of us have to actually learn?

Good grief man. If it doesn't have a shoulder, what is it tightening against? Do you have any concept of tolerance in threaded applications?

Instead of making up your own ideas, take some time to actually learn this stuff. There's a whole industry involved in suppressors and suppressor mounting, and lots of well established principles and knowledge that are freely available if you're willing to learn.

It would bottom out on the termination of the thread, tighter than chit. Like anything else. If you want to hurl insults PISS OFF.

Rephrase question above, anyone want to answer besides Yonderprick? Recall, alignment is good, not bad. Duhh.

Couldn't one use a jam nut?

No, Yonderprick says that'd be all F'd up. But, if you got alignment, then WTF not ehh? Recall he suggests having adapters custom made to shoulder on the muzzle. Yah, that's the ticket.

But, my question posed today is solely for discussion as the proper solution has been offered many times, thread 1/2-28 and use a good enough adapter. Then no whining is required.

I am also trying to learn all I can about suppressors and suppressor mounting also. Great information being shared here.
Thx, R

I can put up with using a thread adapter if I have to, but I'd rather just have the barrel threaded to the final desired pattern if I can. My X-Bolt was easily threaded 5/8x24, the cost to have a good collar permanently installed as a nice, wide shoulder was negligible, so there was no reason to settle for 1/2x28 thread and then adapt up.

I have discussed 1/2x28 threads on .30 cals with TBAC's engineers, and the concern is not hoop stress or belling of the muzzle during firing, it's that with such a small thickness between the thread root and the groove, there's a concern that if you fell or otherwise smacked the can really hard, the high bending moment could cause a fracture through that small thickness. I'm not sure how much of a concern that should be, it's been a while since I did any fracture mechanics calculations like that, but I can see where they are coming from. Using a tightened adapter changes, but doesn't necessarily improve the forces the thread root closest to the shoulder would see in a situation like that.

I don't mind the 1/2x28 thread on my 6.5, it gives nearly 0.1" root to groove thickness, which is an often recommend practical minimum. 9/16x24 gives a similar thickness on .30 cal, and is what I would personally use on something like a Kimber with a bore over 6.5mm. If someone wants to chamber everything 1/2x28 and adapt up, that's fine, it's not what I do, but they'll probably be fine.



It is quite handy, it's not my most practical rifle, but it sure is fun, and that was the point. I'll be working on more coated, heavy bullet loads after hunting season, but I have a few good loads already with 305gr cast HPs over CFE Pistol, and 300gr XTPs over Longshot. Shooting some of the XTPs into jugs at 100 yds, I was actually pretty impressed with how much damage those slow, fat slugs did, and the fact that there were bullet fragments in the bottom of the jug (must have opened up fairly well).

The sound level is very tolerable with the can in short configuration, and surprisingly quiet in long configuration.

Are you saying in your first paragraph, that something like a threaded disc was installed up against a minimal shoulder present after the 5/8-24 theading? Welded, soldered, or pinned or such? Potentially trimmed on a lathe to be very concentric with the bore? Appreciate it as in your pics before, it just looked like a shouldered adapter.

What is this magic alignment that just happens without a shoulder? There is so much you don't understand about this, your ideas just make everyone dumber for hearing them. You already said your own suppressor threads up to a shoulder, but you're insisting it doesn't need it? Why don't you have that shoulder removed and see how it works? LOL

I only suggested an adapter to shoulder on the muzzle for cases where a barrel is too thin for an external shoulder. There has to be a shoulder (either square or tapered) in the system one way or another. A traditional external shoulder is the easiest way most of the time, but there are exceptions where an internal shoulder makes more sense.

Whackem - a jam nut can be OK for a brake but generally isn't adequate for suppressor alignment. Keep in mind that small amounts of misalignment in a suppressor can cause accuracy problems even without being bad enough to cause baffle strikes. It can be done if the jam nut is fairly long, like 1.5-2x thread diameter, to avoid canting. The collars on Gtscotty's rifles in the pics above work in a similar way; they are long enough to hold square on the threads. Difference with those of course is they are probably loctited to the barrel and then the shoulder trued in the lathe after installation.

Yep, that is the concern with small threads that leave a thin muzzle. I've tested that a bit myself, threading scrap barrels and applying some bending load; the concern of fracturing a 1/2"-28 30 cal at the thread root is valid and doesn't take as much load as some might think. It's one of those things, IMO, that's fine right up until it breaks.

The other concern about accuracy is more for precision rifles, a slightly expanded bore from turning the muzzle too thin is not helpful to accuracy, and that's why TB and some others offer 3/4" threads or even larger for some precision rifle stuff. For hunting rifle accuracy though I haven't seen it make enough difference to matter.

Fact is you act like a prick, here and elsewhere, and that's nothing new.

I just took mine, loosened the adapter up. There is nowheres near enough slop to not be adequately aligned. It'd be aok with a lock washer, even unspec'd Ebay threads on this adapter. Get it? If there was 0.010 shoulder and alignment was ok, it would be ok. No shoulder, big f'ing deal, if it is aligned. You know, it's alinged, all 10" then WTF would the problem be? None. Right Yonderprick? Remove the shoulder, you mean have the barrel turned down to 1/2"? Now why the hell would I do that? Prick.

Example. The cut thread protector (black with flats) represents a lock nut. Theaded adapter (SS with flats) is doing nothing here but reducing thread size. Snugged up, righty tighty, there's zero play and it's damned well aligned with the bore. There's zero problem. On this barrel a 1/2" endplate would forclude an adapter, or forgoe the demo locknut and use the 1/2 to 5/8 adapter of course. But, obviously on a rig barley over what's needed to thread 5/8-24 a simple nut may sufice, if and only if, alignment with the bore proves satisfactory which don't take no rocket surgery to figure out prior to firing ammo. To claim a barrel must be 0.750" in order to use a 5/8-24 threaded muzzle device is ludicrous. To assume alignment with the bore is, or is not, achieved from across cyberspace is likewise absurd.


For the T3X Lite, surely threading 1/2 or 9/16 is F'ing simple. No custom horsechit necessary.

Just to blowhards who have big opinions with very little knowledge; I've got very little patience for that kind of willful ignorance. You know almost nothing about this stuff, but are convinced you know better than an entire industry of suppressor manufacturers and gunsmiths. You must be a pretty amazing dude.

BTW nobody said .750" is minimum for a 5/8-24 thread. You're not even doing your math right on a point you keep bring up over and over, and that's just the most basic thing you've gotten wrong here.

You're a prick. Earlier in the thread it was reported, and can be seen on their website, that Thunder Beast declares just that. Prick. They, certainly expurts, declare 3/4 f'ing inch is needed to mount their 5/8" F'ing muzzle device. So take your ignorance and shove it. You're a blowhard. This is easy chit and does not have to be your way, it just has to work. Adapter shoulder on the muzzle, LOL.. A lockwasher can indeed work just like with a damned brake. Prick. Which earlier you claimed it can't. So, piss off, Prick. Never said it's best or will always. Prick.

TBAC actually states 0.725 min for 5/8x24

Thanks for the correction. Calling for 0.050" shoulder is sure nice. It'd help keep yahoots from shooting their suppressors. Anyone care to speculate on minimum acceptable actual shoulder desirable, unless 0.050 is truly it? I'd guess, in my ignorant fog, that about 0.030" or even a little less would do the trick. Why wouldn't it? Thus a T3X Lite, threaded 9/16-28 would have enough shoulder to satisfy... (Going off memory of the 0.630" (or 0.628") measurement at 21") to align a 9/16-28 (or - 24) to 5/8-24 shouldered adapter. It would satisfy the shoulder fan, the more material fan, compared to 1/2-28" threads, and still not require any custom expenditure or proprietary BS.

I am not sure what the optimum shoulder width is, but I do know one thing it is good for that hasn't been mentioned, that I saw. The larger the shoulder the larger the bearing surface that mates with the suppressor. This is good as it helps to prevent the suppressor from loosening due to thermal changes or recoil.

As Boomer pointed out, this can be accomplished with a locknut or something similar, but then you are taking a chance that it will lock up out of alignment with the bore. I know there has been been a lot of back and forth regarding that, and I see where people have gone back and forth, but I think there is a fundamental misunderstanding of why relying on the threads being concentric to the bore will allow for good alignment. In order for two threaded members to actually thread together, there has to be some "slop" between the surfaces. Otherwise you would end up with some serious galling. That is why, when you are threading the suppressor on the barrel, before it locks up on whatever shoulder you provide, it has some wobble. Just using a jam nut, lock nut or adapter that is not set against a surface that is perpendicular to the bore means that it could still be out of alignment. Maybe not enough to cause a baffle strike when tight, but when added to the fact that we no longer have that bearing surface to keep it tight, it could become a big problem.
All of this goes out the window if the adapter is mounted semi-permanently (loctite, Rockset, etc) and then trued up with the bore, or permanently attached true with the bore.
Also, as pointed out, even if it is not true with the bore, it may not be a problem. If you are using a .308 can on a 6mm and it is 0.005 off of center, it is only going to be around 0.020" off at the muzzle of a 10" suppressor, which, as pointed out isn't even close to the amount of extra space available for the bullet to exit. It may affect your accuracy, it may not.

The one point I do agree with fully is that a 1/2" diameter thread pitch on a .308 barreled rifle will leave a very vulnerable spot in the minor diameter of the thread and the groove inside the barrel.

Interesting. Someone before mentioned potential to loosen being reduced with more shoulder IIRC. Oh, it was he'd noticed a tendency to loosen on a CTR that's factory 5/8-24 threaded with not much shoulder... Chit, my 20ish" SS CTR measures 0.785"!

Also the 0.750", oops, 0.725" that Thunder Beast recommends for 5/8-24 threads covers 22 to 33cal.

So, how's about 9/16-28 (or 9/16- 24) threads and 30 cal? A bit less meat than industry accepted 1/2-28 and 22 cal, depending on one's math prowess .. Ok? Can we work with that on the T3X Lite?


So, this is the 6.5CM T3X Lite mentioned. It's threaded 1/2-28 at 21" where it measures about 0.630" and has an adapter up to 5/8-24 that was in anticipation of a 5/8-24 threaded suppressor which was not in hand. Nor was anyone that I recall thinking .a shouldered adapter wouldn't look like ass waiting for the suppressor.... Obviously the consensus would be not use the shoulderless adapter, but a shouldered one. Or, a 1/2" threaded suppressor. Or, cut it back, thread 9/16, and then use a shouldered adapter. Or, what's to be done here?

If you made an effort to learn this stuff instead of trying to make it up on your own, you'd see that 9/16-24 threads are an industry standard size for hunting profile barrels, as well as 40 cal pistol barrels. As I already said earlier in this thread. And it's right there in that TB thread spec a few posts above, and a couple other manufacturers publish specs for them as well. A shoulder of about .660" is generally recommended. But I'm sure you'll need responses from a couple other people before you listen...

When you're are a prick, generally nobody gives a damn what you say. Haven't you noticed that on the many other threads where you are a prick to people and they tell you that?

Go ahead and type all you want, you're still a prick. You've already made it clear.


But it sure is nice to have you confirm a.050" shoulder ain't needed. What a damned relief. Ok, the prick says, no problem with the 9/16 threads on the 30 Cal TikkaT3X Lite. Besides coming up with that 0.660" shoulder!

To him a discussion board is, he speaks and you damned well better listen. Piss off Yondeprick.

You know why that doesn't bother me? Because the people who get upset at me are the blowhards who want everyone to think their hot air is worth listening to. I don't have much patience for a blowhard, and the opinion of a guy like that just doesn't mean much. It says a lot about you that you've gotten so worked up about this when it's something you obviously know very little about.

BTW you must really struggle with basic math. .660" diameter gives about .050" (.049", close enough) shoulder for a 9/16" thread.

Dearest Yonderguy. I have no feelings for you so couldn't possibly be upset. I just don't care for the way you are a prick on the Fire. That's your deal though... .


Will, try again here, directly to you with the full picture since you are looking down from that really tall horse...


The intense f'ing math is important here. In this case, the 30 cal T3X Lite barrel in question measures 0.628" or 0.630" at 21" OK? Not 0.660". Options discussed include 1/2 threads with lots of shoulder and not much internals (don't think anyone is promoting that as ideal or even reasonable.). Or 9/16 threads and less shoulder than you say is recommended but otherwise ok internals. Or 5/8 threads and basically no shoulder, which we've already been through ad naseum. Focusing on this.... Have any input? For a 5/8 threaded suppressor....

Here's the deal. I posed the question, and do so again just for you. That for such a barrel, is saying screw the generally recommended shoulder and opt for the 9/16 threads to maintain the internal, going to be AOK? My ignorant opinion is hell yes. Of course alignment with the bore will be varified. (Just like it was with no shoulder example, but I digress.) Got it? Recall, please by god recall, its not 0.660"!, it's. 0.630"... And ideally a solution is sought that doesn't require custom work beyond the threading and is not proprietary.

So, anything workable here with off the shelf parts?


If you feel that you have already addressed this specific example, well do point it out as your math comments seem to indicate that you missed an important point in the discussion....

6x45............

30-06
Barrel measures 0.630"
Suppressor is threaded 5/8-24
Solution? Preferably with no custom work beyond threading.

1/2x28.... good adapter.... rock on....

Schitt ain’t that hard.

I would go with 9/16" threads and then put a 5/8"-24 adapter on it that has a machined shoulder on it that the suppressor can lock up against,with that adapter locked in place with Rock-set. But, then again, I am a belt and suspenders kind of guy that has crap luck, so I do everything I can to reduce Murphy's influence in my life.

My feeling is that you could do exactly what Dogshooter recommends and be just fine, however there is a risk.

Ok, I am almost convinced. LOL

After thousands of rounds.... I’m almost convinced too.... laffin...

Handgun HTR,
Do you know or can recommend a gunsmith that does the type of work you mentioned above. Any pics?
Thx, R

Rh, I am pretty sure the recommendation is not smith work beyond cutting the threads. Unless something needs, or is desired to be timed, or see below, to verify alignment.

Good threads cut 9/16-24.
Done
An adapter like this, with Rockset (or another high temp thread lock).
https://www.brownells.com/rifle-par...adapter-9-16-24-to-5-8-24-prod86836.aspx
Done
Verify alignment with bore. (Your smith could surely do this and trim the shoulder of the adapter if wanted or needed....)
Done
Good to go.

Anyone claim that ain't no good? Please explain.

Same company as linked above but may be a different size.

Rockset...... never done it.....

“Check bore alignment”...... never bothered.....

9/16-24.... why by two adapters....

1/2-28.....quality Smith.... quality adapter.... “righty tighty”.... and many,many, many thousands of suppressed rounds through at least a dozen different rifles and cartridges.

No problems..... ever.....

Hey, even from over here on the couch, it'd appears to only take one adapter.

Nope...... most .22 CFs are threaded 1/2x28...... so if your can is 5/8x24..... and you thread some schitt 9/16x24..... you need a 1/2x28 - 5/8x24 adapter to run your can on the .22CFs..... and a 9/16x24 - 5/8x24 adapter to run your sporter barreled ‘06 (or whatever other schitt you threaded in that pitch).

Hence.... the necessity..... for two adapters.

If it ain’t 5/8x24..... thread it 1/2x28.... then you only need one adapter.....

Savvy....... or should I get the crayons out?

I think he's going to have multiple rifles with their own suppressors, and adapters.... It ain't my money. LOL Oh hell, what if if we got a Montana in the mix, we'll need three!

Lol, its only money.😀

And good times were had by all....

Hope you have many great hunts. Please share lots of pictures of far away lands and piles of critters and the stories to match!

You are right about that for sure, this stuff aint that hard. .630" shoulder = use 1/2-28 threads. Not enough shoulder left to do anything else unless you use a custom made adapter to shoulder on the muzzle. The stupid crap about using no shoulder at all isn't worth considering.

The comment about .660" threads above was in reference to what a 9/16-24 thread needs for adequate shoulder.

Also a 9/16-24 to 5/8-24 adapter as shown above is bad juju, they are too thin, minor diameter of 5/8-24 is too close to major diameter of 9/16-24, been there and done that, had it unwind like a spring.

Yondering,

So are you saying 1/2x28 threads with a 1/2x28 to 5/8x24 adapter is better than threading 9/16 and running a 9/16x24 to a 5/8x24 adapter? This on a T3 30-06 finished at .630

That was the reasoning behind much of the previous questioning as it's been suggested both ways, now by the same guy.

Don't do it! Just do it!. LOL

Now it's 0.050" shoulder is perfect but 0.034" ain't worth a chit. No way you can get proper alignment with that. Screw that adapter on there and it'll be all f'd up crooked.... And of course 9/16 to 5/8 adapters ain't worth a chit. Funny Brownells sells them since they're garbage. Fuggin Brownells anyways. Real rocket surgery ain't it.

Yes that is correct Rhettsker, if we're talking about a .630" barrel diameter.

9/16 is good for some hunting rifle barrel profiles IF you're using some sort of muzzle device suppressor mount, direct thread to 9/16, or an adapter to something larger than 5/8. The 9/16 to 5/8 adapter is too thin unless it's extended so one thread is in front of the other and not overlapping, but that's generally undesirable since it's longer. It needs more shoulder than a .630" barrel provides anyway.

No, I never said to use 9/16-24 threads on a .630" barrel. I did say it's an industry standard thread size and needs about .660" diameter to work well, and that it's a good size for a lot of hunting rifle barrel profiles.

Interesting, I have never heard this before. I have a dead air keymo mount, so using the keymo as a suppressor mount would change your barrel threading recommendation from 1/2x28(direct thread recommendation) to 9/16 if using my keymo suppressor mount?

Yeah if you're using a mount of some sort (flash hider, brake, etc) and your barrel has the diameter for it (about .660" or so), 9/16-24 is a better choice than 1/2-28 just because it leaves more wall thickness around the bore. Not all companies offer mounts in that size, suppressors on hunting rifles haven't been very popular or common until the last few years and the "tactical" stuff is generally either 1/2" or 5/8". But more companies are starting to offer 9/16" threaded devices as hunting rifle suppressors become more common, so if that works for you it's a good way to go.

Note - my earlier comment in this thread about shouldering on the muzzle was in reference to mounts like this, I've made them and have seen some commercial mounts but don't remember who made them (maybe ThunderBeast?). If you go that route, a .630" barrel can be threaded 5/8-24 and use a mount that shoulders on the muzzle. FYI some 9mm pistol booster pistons are made that way too, Liberty does them that way for example so a long thread with no shoulder can index on the muzzle.

However, back to the 9/16 threaded mount - the shoulder requirement is still important, so if you're talking about a .630" diameter barrel I think that's a bit small for suppressor mounting. (That's enough shoulder at 9/16" for a brake, I've done that a few times, but a suppressor mount gets loaded more in bending & vibration and ~.035" shoulder is pretty marginal IMO.) I definitely would not go with a shoulder that small for a direct thread mount (repeated installation is hard on a small shoulder); it's arguable whether you can get away with it using a mount that's loctited in place but it's definitely pushing the limits. If you go ahead with that, I'd suggest very tight tolerance barrel threads that are cut to match the muzzle device.

If you have the option when the barrel gets threaded, adding a shoulder as gtscotty's pics show above is smart. It can be smaller and less obtrusive than those pics, but regardless it's a fairly easy thing for most decent gunsmiths to do. As long as it's locked in place well (loctite, solder, epoxy, etc) and then trued up it's a solid way to go.

About that 9/16-5/8" adapter - the minor diameter (meaning bottom of the threads) for 5/8-24 is .574", while the major diameter of 9/16"-24 is .563". That only leaves about .005-.006" solid material between the two threads so the adapter is not very strong. I had one fail when it was tightened down; it unwound like a spring and caused some minor damage to the suppressor threads, so it's not worth taking a chance on IMO.

Hope that helps.

Post above clarifies...

Ok let’s get back to rifles. My open country suppressed setup:

That one checks a lot of boxes. Nice rig.

Yondering,

Very helpful explanation--thank you. Kimber7man, what are the specs on your beautiful open country rifle?
Thx, R

Omega pattern 9/16x24 DT mounts have been scarce for a while with SiCo often being out of stock. Energetic Armament has come out with a run of 9/16x24 Titanium DT mounts that will work with cans with the 1.375x24 mount thread like the Omega 300, Vox S/K, Nomad 30, Rex MG7, etc.

Omega/Nomad/Vox 9/16x24 DT mount

Just wanted to give other suppressed hunters a heads up, looks like a limited time thing, so I ordered mine right away.

Thanks for the heads up!

I killed 7 pigs with suppressed loads last weekend, they are fun to shoot, no noise, no recoil!

Spot on with information that wasn’t asked as per usual. Can you tell us now about which wax you use on your boat?

R,
Thanks, That is a G.A. Precision Xtreme Hunter 6.5 SAUM. Only upgrade from the standard model is I went with the Jewell trigger. S&B PMII 10x42 fixed scope, in Talley lightweight lows. Several guys here on the campfire have them. George Gardner, Pat Sinclair and Scott Shreve started us off with brass trimming and load development back in 2012/2013.

I took the Vias brake off, bought a custom 1/2x32 to 5/8x24 threaded adapter from Mark at TROS, and screwed on the Ultra 7 6.5 CB.

Thanks very much. Just a beautiful well thought out rifle.
R

Nice rig Kimber7Man. Be Well, RZ.

Hanco and a post with substance... surely you jest.

This one just joined the family last month 5 more days an well see how well she fits!!!!

Nice looking rifle. What caliber and what suppressor?

Nice flavor!

Why does a suppressor need a solid shoulder seat well but the adapter needs no such shoulder?

Late to the party but when I decided to try a 6.5 Creedmoor I went the cheap route and bought a T/C Compass. I slapped my .30 cal Thunderbeast Ultra-9 on it and damned if that sucker doesn’t shoot big holes. I will also highly recommend the Thunderbeast suppressors

Bigger than 6.5?......

According to my interpretation of our discussion here, an adapter does need a shoulder as well. However, it can be less than a direct mount situation requires when permanently, or semi-permanently affixed. That way there's less wear on the small shoulder than there would be from repeated mounting. The wear would be on the ample adapter shoulder, not the slight shoulder on the barrel. Subsequently less risk of getting askew and going to hell with a potential baffle strike or cockeyed inaccuracy potential and other bad chit nobody wants to experience.... Essentially, the shoulder for the adapter, and/or the suppressor is necessary to ensure absolute proper alignment with the bore. Don't shoot your supressor.

Goodness, I hope that's right, or I'll, PUN alert, hear about it.

Yep......you're ass is grass and Yonder is the lawnmower.

Nailed it!

The Russian judge gave 'Boomer a 10 on the explanation.

Did you do paperwork for one?

...whheewww..... are y’all finally done with all the skull [bleep]?

Yes. Check was cashed first of April. Just waiting .

Well done ‘Boomer.👏

LOL


Just made that chit up.
Any chance you'd share some hunt pictures?

Just made that chit up.
Any chance you'd share some hunt pictures?[/quote]

I sent you all I had.😂. Besides, I can’t figure out how to post a pic.🙄

Well, it's a start! And I'll take that as a hint. Here's a few more... I can't find any others though I recall one of a a pile of impala or gazelle or something? Fantastic fun it looks like.

Here are a few more then I am done boring everyone and back on topic.😀

Yah, that center picture. So boring... LOL

Wouldn't want any thread to stray around here this weekend....

Btw,
I took Gtscottys recommendation and sent a T3 to ecco machine. Very impressed with the result so far.

Fast turnaround! Looks like the best of all solutions. Awesome.

So I had my Dakota 280 threaded 1/2x28tpi for .600” and didn’t have them add a collar or shoulder and my Texas suppressor company outrider is in jail what to do now!?

TSC shows it comes with a 1/2x28 to 5/8x24 adapter in the box.

Here’s my latest hunting set up. I ruined a very nice pre-64 model 70 in 30-06 by having the barrel cut back to 20” and threading for my griffin armament Recce 7. May have ruined the value, but I’ll get much more use and personal enjoyment out of the Rifle now.

I hadn't seen this post, looks great! Ecco does nice work.

GAP 6.5 SAUM chopped to 19.5", Jager suppressor(adds 4.5")

139 scenars at 3020fps

Gtscotty sent me to ECCO Machine as well and Nick did an awesome job modifying three of my four AAC rifle suppressors to eliminate the ridiculous 51T and 90T QD mounting interfaces.

My "best" suppressed hunting rifle setup is a Kimber 84M with a Proof carbon fiber wrapped barrel chambered in .308 Win sitting in an AG Composites stock. I have CDI Precision bottom metal and can run either the 5 or 10-round AICS magazines. The suppressor is a SilencerCo Harvester but if necessary I can screw on a SilcencerCo Omega or AAC MK13-SD. I'm using the Hellfire adapter system from Area419 which is really slick. They offer a self timing muzzle brake and thread protector that work with the Hellfire universal adapter. The weight of the rifle with the 22" barrel shown and without scope/rings is a little under 6lb. My thought process going in was to shoot a 175gr Barnes LRX bullet and want as much velocity as I can get so I kept the barrel on the long side and will be screwing on a 24" Proof barrel soon. This set up has proven to be very accurate with 1/2 moa or better 5-shot groups being the norm on sub zero temp days. I shot a nice mule deer last November using my POF P308 with a Premier Reticles scope mounted and SANDMAN-S suppressor attached. That's a heavy piece of kit to drag around so this will be a nice rifle to use for deer/elk this fall.

I haven't figured out the finish yet but once everything is where I want it I'll probably have the whole thing dipped. I'm not sure what optic I want to run on this set up. The Zeiss HD5 shown with RZ800 reticle is a good hunting scope, but I have a NF NXS 3-15x50mm F1 and a couple of Vortex Viper PSTs to consider. I want to keep the weight down so the NF is probably out.

[/quote]

The other concern about accuracy is more for precision rifles, a slightly expanded bore from turning the muzzle too thin is not helpful to accuracy, and that's why TB and some others offer 3/4" threads or even larger for some precision rifle stuff. For hunting rifle accuracy though I haven't seen it make enough difference to matter. [/quote]
[quote=Yondering]
+1