stupid law if thats the case. and a bunch liberals, that part I get. Damn shame its illegal to....

No. Next question.

Google ted nugent California and see what comes up.

No idea, but Sharp Things (Ron Kulas) is !

NO , Nuge did nothing wrong.

As usual, a lot more to the story.

Very old news and yes he broke the law. In SE AK the law has long been "draw blood and you are done." It was expanded to Kodiak bears at least 15 years ago.

Ted is eliding the obvious printing of the law in the book.He was not the only or first charged. millions to fight a misdemeanors? Bullshit! He was charged in Federal Courts and his repeat offender status was why...

I have no doubt that some prosecutions in the US have a major political component. Here is how it works,if your outspoken politics offends the wrong prosecutor,they can go after you in ways you can not imagine.

If you happen to get a judge who does not smell a rat in this,you are at their mercy. Even with a sympathetic judge,you can be forced into expensive and unfair plea bargains because the cost of fighting the government in court will be your life savings.

Look at the whole Trump-Biden mess and tell me there is not a world of bias infecting our system.

I disagree,I spent 100,000 in legal fees in a case that I settled. I was told by my lawyers that the cost of a lengthy trial would be several times that.

He always reads the regs......

Except when he doesn’t.

thats a good one. Laughed on that part in the video.

Its a stupid law I'll stand by that even if Art rips me a new one. LOL. BUT I get it. Must be a reason for it.

I've never hunted SE AK and have never read that part of the book. One should read before they go.

And this damn ever need to film and take pictures and post things.... I don't get it much. The less you put out there the less you odds of making a mistake.

That said I'd love to see the video, but have not googled it. Arrow bouncing off is kind of weird, maybe it never actually touched the bear but a limb in front of. I"ve seen that on elk 2 times...

I know guides typically enforce the blood you are tagged thing. And I don't even care for that, having more than a few animals under the belt every now and then one is nicked that bleeds a bit but none the worse for wear. To be charged for that is stupid again, IMHO.

Bottom line stupid or not, law is the law and its up to you to know and follow. Don't like it don't hunt that area or state etc... Fairly simple IMHO.

And then if people would follow at least 2S things would be better generally.

The Nuge and I are from the same era. Would not bother answering the door if he showed up and immediately switch channels with a screen appearance. Could be he has seen God, but his history and morals are well embedded in my memory banks. I'm not big on forgiving.

The reasoning behind the law is simply there were hunters hitting bears and not finding them. a significant number of animals, especially bears were found with old bullets and wounds.

One inconsistency among many in hunting regs is shooting from boats. It is illegal in SE for big game. Illegal in PWS and on Kodiak for bears.

Arrow hit bone and deflected in the case at hand, but they found lots of blood.

Simple question... did you break an obvious law resulting in a misdemeanor and compound it by breaking a bunch of well-known and related Federal laws?

Using the excuse he did not intentionally do something stupid is hardly an excuse, but it is all he has. He can always fight, but what would the grounds be? There is no way he wins that fight.

AK game regs are specific that " bears wounded in game units 1-5 and 8, and elk wounded in unit 8 do count toward your bag limit "

It's obviously political. Nothing would have come of it if those leftists would not have kicked up a storm.

Interesting how he has been the only one ever charged under this law.

I know a lot of people here don't like Ted Nugent but this was obviously an honest mistake and now he is not allowed to hunt in the U.S for two years. Are you kidding me?

BTW don't think this kind of thing can't happen to any one of us. We have all heard of gun owners getting in serious trouble over some little technicality. This should give us all an idea on how they are planning to use those red flag laws.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse. And then selling videos of breaking the law ? Were the courts suppose to ignore it ?

One of the reasons states like Alaska require guides for hunting some animals is to insure someone knows the laws and can be held accountable.

Not limited to bears, Art, tho those are specifically spelled out. Definition of "hunt" overs all species statewide. Heck, if one wants to interpret that reg in it's most severe form, if you pick up a gun and leave the house with the intent to "hunt", you are all done for the day. Dontcha love lawyer-speak?

I think it is designed to give Brown Shirts wide latitude in writing citations. Fortunately, most of them are pretty responsible in that area, and don't want to look ridiculous in court.

High profile is going to get you extra attention- best to hew tightly (and know) the regs. Nugent has been lax (deliberately or otherwise in some, I don't know) in several instances. well, there was that C'mon Deer Here" baiting incident - that had to be deliberate.

Still trying to wrap my head around an arrow hitting a rib and doing a 180

I don’t like the word poacher for his violation though. That’s a word that should be reserved for more serious violations. He screwed up, got caught, and paid the price. In his defense, it was a brand new law that most were not aware of.

It does aggravate me too, you get a speeding ticket and no one says much. And its a very minor infraction.

But you get any wildlife violation you are branded a poacher. A catch all word these days.

Do it mostly right or as right as you were aware of and still called a poacher... nope. I agree totally with you.

Lord knows if you could buy another tag Ted, had enough cash to go buy a second right away..

Then OTOH, how do you fill out a tag that you don't have a carcass for? Waste of game? I mean you punched your tag but you aren't bringing anything out with you. If you want to be technical.

Waiting for stuff to warm up, maybe I'll grab the book and read some.

Just remember it takes just one self righteous guy to make what was previously legal, illegal. I see proposals come up all the time of people trying to make legal practices illegal. We try to shoot them down in the local advisory committees, but some squeak by.

If anything, we need less laws.

My memory tells me it was not a new law in SE, but I could be wrong. I know when it came into Kodiak it had been the case in SE for some time...

I doubt it was leftists... I suspect any Federal Agent seeing an obvious broadcast violation of Federal law would investigate (unless it was a Clinton, of course) and do what should be done.

His claim no one else has been charged is a lie and was when he claimed it. Furthermore, AK has no record of the offense which means he was charged for Federal violations only.

I am remembering that it was the first year it was in effect. But maybe am not remembering correctly.

Sounds like minimum caliber restrictions coming this bog cycle.

Does SE AK have its own set of regulations? The reason I ask is I hunted around Nome in 2011. I read the regulations I got that year cover to cover. (Some really silly stuff in there.) I never saw a law in there that said if you draw blood your done. Maybe I missed it.

Different laws across the state for many different things, especially methods and means of hunting and fishing.

here is another stupid law in Alaska in this one area for moose hunting > if you harvest a legal bull moose you have 10 days in that area to get it registered in that division/area 10 days which includes Saturday and Sunday. well they went there on the tenth day which was a Sunday and they did not know Sunday`s that office was closed .their friend went back on Monday to register that legal bull moose and because they had to leave back to their home state that same Sunday . but the person who shot the legal bull moose had to do a court phone call with judge and received a small fined and some game law ticket. that is B.S. and no common sense that hunter should not have got a ticket or a fine period ! Nuge should not have got a ticket either ! > we should all be sticking up for the Nuge he does us all a favor by his willing to speak up for all hunters ! shame on anyone who does not support old NUGE !

If you think you are not a "poacher" by today's new interpretation (having never broken ANY nuance of ANY law by ANY warden no matter how over zealous) you either have not done much hunting or are incredibly ignorant, (quite possibly both) I wish they would hammer people who deserve it rather than play gotcha with [bleep] like the federal waterfowl baiting statute type of violator. Have you had your blaze orange checked lately for the legal "luminescence" compliance??? Did you ever take a #2 wearing bibs or waders?? How did you maintain "wearing" your orange during said dump????

The Nuge broke a game law and made money filming it !
Claiming he didn't know the law is no different than Hillary claiming she didn't know what she was doing was illegal.

Maybe, but they still broke the law and were planning on profiting from it.

If he wasn't doing this stuff for profit, I'd say give the guy a break. Nugent is a professional and plays the high profile TV super star game. The standard should be higher, the highest, really. It's not like Alaska passed the law the day before and he was already in the woods. It's not enough to claim it as an innocent mistake/oversight, not when you're representing an industry at that level. It shouldn't go without mention that Nugent's actions reflect on the rest of us hunters who are not an industry—on all of us who hunt for our own reasons.

IDGAF

It was a law that would be somewhat unusual in many other
places. Did Ted know? I give him the benefit of doubt.
He broke a law that didn't harm another human, he paid for it.
Over.

If I found that he blatantly and repeatedly poached (killing too many,
Out of season...) that would be different.

Anyway, why does this even matter.
Old, old news.

I’ll disagree, Brian.

The regs should apply equally (ir)regardless of who is affected. Nice should be no different than a resident.

The ironic part I posted above.

You mean there are only two things you dislike about him?

His face?

Honestly, I know little about him. He’s hell on a guitar apparently, I like what I e seen of his 2A stance. Don’t have cable so I’m deprived (some say depraved) otherwise.

I'm not arguing the regulations shouldn't apply to everyone equally. I'm arguing as to whether Nugent should be shown leniency in punishment, as he seems to argue in the video. Nugent also seems to blame the regulations for his predicament. The stakes are higher for Nugent, because the stakes are higher for Nugent. He shouldn't get a pass because the stakes are higher.

Regarding whether Nugent is a poacher, I'm not prepare to answer. I will say that the act of poaching in and of itself requires intent.

I’ll agree with with that.

Like you have said before, so many other things can be involved. Same with this. Like I've said that arrow may never have even hit the bear. Hell if it didn't have blood on it why did they even look. An arrow cuts flesh IE if only the broadhead, its going to have blood, hair, fat etc... on it.

I'm not saying this to brag at all, but I quit counting deer/pigs taken with archery gear in the 90s. I was only born in the 60s. I was over 100 at that point. So I have put a few arrows through, past, over, under a few animals.

Animals CAN be quick enough to divert the direction of an arrow as it enters. I've seen plenty duck/whirl/move before an arrow gets there. I've seen arrows deflect off unseen and stupidly enough, seen things.

Like I said earlier I have not even looked for the purported video.

I have seen arrows shot from higher up, aimed down, IE out of tripods and the like, end up exiting HIGHER than the entry wound. I saw one once enter what should have been a perfect basically broadside lung shot get tweaked somehow and end up breaking the neck of the deer and exiting the TOP of the neck.

All that said the argument here is not if it was illegal. It was. Plain and simple. He was wrong, and he got caught. I dont' care for Ted much. One of our nephews loves him. I don't see the attraction. Loud mouthed and so.... I BUT he was wrong, and he was caught and paid the price.

What I would have done after the fact if I was offended, is to seek the intent of the law, heck I might have had an attorney seek it before the court date. WHY is the law in effect. What is the purpose, what is the goal of such law. And follow that up with was the intent of the results broken or not. IE what I'm assuming is to prevent a lost game animal rotting in the woods and not simply going out and continuing to shoot animals until you can find/recover one. I"d say the video should have...shown the animal was not worse for wear and that a fracas with another bear would have been likely much worse of a wound. End intent would be more to change/clarify/remove said law.

That being said wildlife laws are TOUGH. We have antler restrictions in TX. Goal is to allow bucks to mature more before being harvested so we would get more does bred. IT did that. Plus a LOT of other positives to the herd down there. That said it does not allow for the harvest of older bucks that don't meet the criteria of the restrictions. IE width. If you are trash antlers passing on your DNA and you never get to 13 inches inside spread, you cannot ever be harvested/removed from the DNA pool. There is almost NO way to write the law better. Maybe but not certainly anyway. Thankfully most of the local wardens more or less say if you are sure of age, then do what you have to do and just lets not talk about it again. Makes sense to me because folks that are mindful of quality know more about their deer than the wardens do actually.

Really need to make time to read those rules if you are going to whatever area.

I know the fishing rules on the Talkeetna/Su folks would ask me. My answer is rules. I carry a book in my left back pocket and an attorney in my right back pocket. Its not quite that bad but there are a LOT of rules.. and they change from one side of the river to the other etc... one creek to the next. One goes 1/4 mile up a creek, another 2 miles, but where do you measure the start? Oh they have GPS points... LMAO but to be right you have to follow to the T. Suspect as much as I laugh about the GPS points at least they are black and white so to speak.

After all that, there isn't a single person out there that has not broken a law at some point. Not intentionally likely for most of us, but its been done. Again why folks demand to publish tons of their own stuff publicly is beyond me. Yes I put a few pics on facebook, not to brag but to show folks that cannot make the trip, whats around up here.

And I'll add this. Laws here are as ignorant as in Texas at times. Heck the community I used to work for did this same STUPID stuff.

Went and read some of the regs for unit 1 until I found the wounding wording.

Guess what word is NOT defined under the definitions in the rule book.... Flat amazing. Well for .gov actually not really.

Have been looking for wording on caliber/power stuff on bison too. I"ve heard 50/70 sharps not allowed. Can't find that anywhere yet. But would also be "amazing" since the big 50 and its bigger brother took how many bison in the years...

For micromanage and convoluted fishing regs, it's hard to "beat" the Kenai.

So you punch your tag without a carcass to seal and then what?.....you get a ticket for wanton waste?......and another ticket for not having your bear sealed within the required amount of time?.....obstruction of justice (great catch-all for any undefined or imaginary laws)?

I’ve never so much as received a warning let alone a ticket because I follow the law nor do I really give 2shits about the Nuge but being honest and self-reporting with the expectations of leniency hasn’t proven to be a smart move in Alaska......filming your mistake and then airing that footage is an even dumber move.

In today’s politically driven game management system where laws are so numerous that everyone is likely breaking some law I tend to view the pious keepers of law and order with a very jaded eye. There’s more than a few known brown shirts as well as blue shirts that are great poachers that deliberately push the boundaries because the likelihood of them getting in trouble is very small. Just because it’s a law doesn’t mean it should necessarily be followed. INOW.....not all laws are just or legal.

Fixt it for ya...

Are there different regulation pamphlets available? That could get a NR in trouble even though he thinks he has the regs right.

regs have all units in the hunting book. 1-27 IIRC possibly.

LOL. Now you gonna make me find my fishing regs and read the kenai. Or not. Maybe shouldn't confuse my brain

Guilty, "ignorance of the law" and all that. Shouldn't have been prosecuted, though.

Also, boring. There was no penetration.

Link to the bouncing arrow video??

Hey, I had the back half of a NP 210 .338WM at 100 yards apparently do the same thing on a moose shoulder blade. The front portion turned into tiny BBs throughout the near lung, never penetrating to the off side lung. I looked, but never found the back half, so I think it "bounced" back out the entry wound. Weird things can happen to projectiles.

Exciting times when he jumped up again when I was 10 feet away. Last time I ever used either a 210 or a frontal approach....

I will say the second one basically up his nose worked.

I will therefore not positively say an arrow can't act the way Teddy said happened. But then I know jack all about archery.

I recently asked a Fairbanks enforcement Trooper about punching your tag if you believe you shot a moose, but did not recover it. It took him two days to chase down what he believed was the correct answer.

According to him it is not illegal to keep hunting moose if you shot another moose and did not recover it. He said it used to be illegal, but attorneys got involved in having it changed. Reason I asked him is because I knew a guy whos two kids shot and lost two moose the last two years.

One needs to be well versed in keeping up to date on the current regs for the species one is hunting in a given game unit. When in doubt, call Fish and Game and get an answer.

Personally, I don't know why there has to be a law against it. I was brought up knowing if you shoot and animal you punch your tag whether you recover it or not. I taught my children that and make it clear to any one I hunt with. Compared to many I have had a mediocre hunting career, but I believe that approach to hunting is why in 54 years I have never shot and lost a big game animal. I am disgusted with those that think it is ok to loose an animal and keep hunting for that species in the same season.

I also think if you are an international hunting celebrity and filming hunting shows you should know the rules an, just like everyone else is expected to. What was his intent, that is now a credible defense, right?

That dont sound right.

There was a F&G bio that shot a moose, that was not recovered. A day or two later, shoots a moose he thinks is the one that was wounded. It wasn't..

Ticket and bit of chit storm was the result. This in the last year or three.

I do not know about anywhere else. But in Idaho, you tag recovered game. And only recovered game counts toward bag/possession limit.

Tagging a lost animal sounds pretty ridiculous to me.

OK....I did....and have to say that he pleaded no contest to two misdemeanors, neither diminished him in my eyes.

He claimed in that case a lack of knowledge of the law... Why should that excuse work anywhere?

Why not just shoot all of them and pick the one you like?

I spent 25 years enforcing the fish and game laws and I had an unhappy experience with him.

Please tell us about it

Cat scratch fever?

Art you could not possibly be more of an opinionated sack of shït if you tried. But in your defense lots of guys here have forgotten about you ripping people off and loosing your mod spot. LOL.

What have you added lately that has had any value?

I believe you are talking about the case on the kenai pen.? If so he got in trouble because an aircraft was used in looking for the moose/recovery of wounded moose. Much different circumstance than what is being discussed in this thread.

What have you added lately that has had any value?[/quote]

Plenty of value in reminding people that Sitka Deer ripped people off. And to be careful of such an active member on these forums.

Cat scratch fever can make you pretty queasy sometimes.

I can see differing laws. For example, if you can take 5 black bears, whats the deal with loosing one if it happens? But if its a moose where there are few, or a brown bear where you get one every 4 years or such...

Obviously I hate to loose any animal. And I lost a deer last year. If we were in an area I could have used my dog, IE way to many burrs and he simply could not walk anymore... but we looked for that deer for a full day before we had to be back at work and found him the next weekend. Made me sick to my stomach. But it happened. In our case we need to take more deer than we do to control numbers so did not tag and were not required to.

Brings another question. One you can't legislate in words IMHO... well you can but it ends up being this one drop of blood law. So what if you KNOW there it is not a vital hit and will recover. It happens to folks. In fact sometimes you see the animal the next day or days and cannot get another shot. That happens. Animals receive far worse wounds at times due to nature and its cruelty.

I am not up on all legalities but another thing comes to mind. In Teds case mentioned here, if AK did not charge him with a violation, and thats what I think I recall reading from Art on this thread, then how can feds charge him with a Lacey act type violation. IE AK was ok and nothing illegal happened or they would have charged him. Feds can come in( would not surprise me as I worked for low level .gov until I got sick and tired of how crooked or not caring it was) and decide he did violate a STATE law even though not charged, so we'll charge him. Or can the feds charge against a state law first, then follow up with their ad ons?

Again not really taking sides so much here, just throwing out thoughts.

I've had the exposure to be able to shoot deer that were shot hours before, days before and weeks before. Doing it mostly out of curiosity. Amazing what animals can survive. Like even a hole through both lungs. Just flat amazing.

Bottom line if you don't like a law you have three choices. Follow it. Break it, get it changed. Easiest is to follow. Its what we do.
And one has to realize the fish and game folks are not perfect in anyones eyes, but they have a super tough job to do. Heck I'm not perfect either so its the way it is. We and they do their level best most of the time, and one has to applaud them for that.

The Lacey Act gives options to prosecutors when they cannot go after nonresident violators at the State level. I know of many where the State did not file charges. Within the statute of limitations the State can file charges but when someone fights it is easier to let the Feds do it.

Ted was undoubtedly given the option to deal with AK.

What a dumbazz if so. I'd take the state before the feds any day. Chances of a bit less corruption if it was there at all.

A smart lawyer would likely point out the Feds could still get him after the State. Two different offenses, no double jeopardy... even if they promised not to.

I am not an attorney or even close... so you are ahead of me in thinking for sure.

I have a friend that video graphs for a cable outdoor show. He spent a week remote with Nuge and company on an AK bear hunt. After it was over he told me the guy was the biggest azzhole you'd ever meet, said he would never go on another trip where he was involved. I didn't ask for specifics but find it interesting people that have had a personal experience with him have nothing good to say.

It speaks volumes...

Ha!

I have guided a number of hunters who knew him and asked if we were interested in having him as a hunter as he wanted a brown bear.
From everything I knew and what I had gathered from talking with his friends I decided we were full.

Phil. Thanks for that info. I"ve been telling my Ted worshipping nephew I had a bad feeling about him not at all being what the nephew worshipped. Now I'll show him this.
Guy is supposed to be doing us all good according to some. I"ve never liked him from what I've seen.

Ted is an egomaniac. It is very apparent and should be no surprise that he does what he feels like and feels entitled to do so. He is a good guitar player and loves hunting and shooting.

Ted is welcomed at my campfire anytime.