Ok, so I'm bored.

This isn't a question for the gunwriters, but I thought it may be of some interest.
Awhile back I sent an email to Nosler asking for info on where the partition was located in 7mm bullets and if it changed for the different weights. They told me that info wasn't available, so out comes the hacksaw. 😁

[Linked Image]

Left to right:
7mm -150 grn
7mm -160 grn
7mm - 175 grn
.308 - 200 grn
.338 - 210 grn

A couple thoughts:
The partition definitely moves forward on the 160 from the 150, then stays the same for the 175. The jacket on the 210 is by far thicker than the others and I could really tell while cutting it! I thought the partition on the 200 grn would be further forward based on what I've heard on here.
The 150 and 210 are newly bought and current production. The others were bought on here and are from older boxes and may not be current. I have no idea if they change often.

These are the only partitions I have, but I'd be happy to cut more if someone wants to send me some. 😁

I can't get the images to open

Thanks! It never seems to work well when I try from my phone.

Thanks, I always dig sectioned bullets. I have an assorted collection of Partitions going back to the old screw machine ones. it would take me awhile to round them up, but if you want to PM me an address I can send them as I find them. I also might (not sure) that I have first second and third generation Ballistic Tips that might make an interesting comparison.I can label and send them as they are unearthed out of the catacombs of the man cave.

Pm sent.

I enjoy seeing stuff like that. Thanks for your effort.

thank you for those.
jacket thickness on 338, 210 grain is impressive!

Absolutely! Worth building a rifle around. Oh wait, that's what my .338-06 is for! 😁

Thanks for providing info and pics. I am thinking about going to the 210 Partition for a 338-06 I gave my grandson. I pretty much been using some flavor of a Barnes X since the late 80's and prior to that our .338's and 30-06 rifles all used a Partition. But, the Nosler Partition is never a "wrong" choice and may be the best "all around" big game bullet ever made in my opinion.

For years I heard the 210 Partition had a bit thicker jacket as the bullet is typically driven faster, then I heard it didn't and so on. One of the problems and I even had this with Barnes was if you called them, the answer to your question some times varied depending on who you spoke with.

I called Speer one time and asked about the jacket thickness and recommended minimum impact velocity velocity for their .358 caliber 220 grain Flat Nosed Hot-Cor bullet. I wanted to load some up for the Big Bore .356 my wife stole from me cause she thinks its cute. Any way who ever I got at Speer said the jacket thickness was propriety information and did not have a minimum recommended impact velocity.

I am always interested in intelligent bullet talk.

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Teeder I did EXACTLY THAT a while back, and I "made my 338-06 around the Nosler 210 Partition."
I shot 200 grain Speers for my practice bullet and used the Noslers to kill things. Works great.

👍

I know it's not supposed to be a good test, but the only bullet that out penetrated the 210 PT's in milk jugs for me was a 185 ttsx out of the .338-06.

That 200 Speer is my bullet of choice for whitetails if I'm not using a 7mm-08.

Thanks for the photo / information.

Nice, seeing that sectioned bullet builds extra confidence in my pre-64 model 70 JES rebore booting the 210's out at 2800 over H-380, have to be a tough little customer.

Not intended as a criticism, I'm just curious as to how you cut them and are you sure you have a profile at 1/2 the nominal diameter for all bullets.

I cut with the side of the blade as close to full diameter as possible. If anything, the smaller bullets are shown with a slightly larger jacket thickness.
I measure schitt for a living, so pay attention to things like that.
Thanks for your concern.

I too have sectioned a lot of bullets. You find some interesting things sometimes. In reference to Partitions, when I fired them into the BulletTestTube, the expansion and penetration agreed with what I saw in the jacket differences.
I have said for years, and keep saying it. If your intention is to put meat on the table, a 338 Win mag with a 225 Partition is about as good as it gets. Assuming non dangerous game.
Charlie

I’ve killed a bunch of elk, deer and antelope at 340/338 velocities. Ive alway been impressed at how it would penetrate deeply on elk even at range, but still open up on the ribs of an antelope. Out of several dozen elk, I can only think of one instance where it did not exit. It was on a big bull shot through the shoulders at 400+ yards. On lung shots, it would leave racquet ball sized holes out to 550 yards. The beauty of the bullet is i could count on great penetration and expansion from up close to farther than most folks have any business shooting unwounded game.

Kevin, for a long time the 338 WM (22” bbl’d SS M70) was my elk rifle, stoked with 210 NP’s at around 2,925 fps. It’s a peas and carrots combo on elk (and anything else). I never saw the need for more bullet than the 210.

Teeder,

It's hard to explain this without using my hands, but.......it can appear the partition is forward on heavier bullets than lighter bullets of the same caliber, but proportionally they can be in the same position from one weight to the other.. A heavier bullet is longer, but proportional to it's length it has the same amount of lead in the front and rear halves.

II have sectioned all the 7mm bullets that you have pictured, and have seen the same thing. The partition of the 160g is obviously further forward compared to the 150g.

Have never sectioned a 338 cal 210g bullet though, and the extra thick jacket is interesting!

I understand what you're saying.

My main motivation was comparing the 7mm's. I didn't know if they added "beef" behind, in front of, or equal amounts on either side of the partition. I threw the others in for the heck of it. That 210 was quiet a surprise. Wish I had a 140 7mm to check, also.

Your link has an extra "http://" at the front of it for some reason. If you're copy-n-pasting into a field that already has "http://" then maybe you just need to clear that before pasting your link into that field. Your link looks like this:

http://https//www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/gallery/80/full/149453.jpg

Got it! Thanks 👍

If you pm your address, I’ll send you a 243-100gr, 257-120gr, and 338-250gr

I may have a 270-150 as well

Sent

I sectioned a couple Sierra bullets many years ago. It's very interesting to see inside them. Thanks for taking the time to post your findings.

Teeder,

Thanks for your post, but I have sectioned a bunch of bullets over the years (including Partitions in diameters up to .416) and have not only found that assumptions about how each will behave after sectioning are often wrong, but also that water-bottle testing isn't nearly as accurate as other "media," especially big game. Can provide plenty of examples if anybody is interested--but one that is that the 200-grain 30 Partition far out-penetrates the 180 .30, even though the partition is in the same place relative to the bullet base.

Also, Nosler has continued to experiment with partition placement in somePartitions, as well as core alloy. Can elaborate on that as well since many are designed to retain far more weight than the 65-70% usually mentioned.

Am assuming, from your comments, that when you section bullets you're measuring the half-thickness. I do it a little differently, putting bullets horizontally in a heavy bench-vise, and then either rasping or grinding them down to nearly half-diameter, then fine-filing and eventually sanding them down to the final thickness, which also results in a more precise view of construction. This is an image of various bullets from Gun Gack III--the lead photo for the section on bullets in the 24hourcampfire questions.

Thanks for your comments, JB. I was hoping you would chime in.

The partition on 270 cal 150g vs 160g look proportionally identical. Based on a sample of 3 elk with the 160g, and 40-50 elk for the 150g, the 160 penetrates further!

John,
It would be great to hear about any info on weight retention, core alloy, and partition position on the NPT's.

For those who do sectioning - do you ever come across any oddities when doing so - like voids in cores, foreign matter in cores, very thin (or thick) places on jackets? Just interested.

MD: What chapter in Gun Gack III? I checked my copy and could not find it. Thanks.

That's a nice job...............I deal with a lot of metallographic related analysis & can appreciate what you did.

I've killed lots of animals up through moose with NPT's and have recovered just a few. I've never been disappointed with their performance.

MM

Here's 3 from a couple of different animals at relatively close & long range. Looks exactly like what they are supposed to.

anyone got a picture of a Berger bullet cut ? that might be interesting,thanks,Pete53

I'll send you a 140 gr 7mm, a 125 gr 6.5 mm, a 225 and 250 gr 35 cal also if you want. PM sent

👍

Sorry, it's actually not a chapter, but the lead photo for the section on bullets in the 24hourcampfire questions--page 335.

Thanks

My 3 Favorite NP bullets that have killed well for me over the years.

28/160, 30/200, 338/250

The 338/250 doesn't really get tested until game weight gets 800-1000 + lbs.
Comparing it to the 30's and 338/210 is not a fair comparison.

Looking forward to seeing that one sectioned.


Dry print is the only way to go for test firing.

That's my experience as well.

Have never recovered a 250-grain .338 Partition on animals up to around 1500 pounds in weight, but have recovered 210s and 225s. In fact, have seen one 210 stay inside a mature but not huge whitetail buck that a companion shot as it ran angling away at maybe 50 yards in timber. Came across the bullet when we skinned it, and he assumed somebody else had wounded the buck previously with a "smaller" Partition. But the buck only had one bullet hole, and the shank of the recovered bullet measured .338."

One 250 did stay inside an animal, a Cape eland. But it landed sideways, due to striking a small thorn-branch a few inches before landing right where I aimed, in the pocket behind the shoulder. In fact the entrance "hole" was a perfect silhouette of a 250-grain Nosler Partition. The bull ran into the neaby thornbush, and we found it in a clearing, still standing but with its head down, after trailing it for about 100 yards. I put another 250 in the chest, and it dropped instantly--but the first bullet was never found in the chest, despite considerable looking. Would have been very interested to see what it looked like!.

MD do you know how many times say the 175 grain 7mm Partition has changed. The obvious switch from the screw machine bullets to impact extruded, but it also seems like the Partition has been moved around, although I may be thinking of in comparison to the 160.

Also are there three generations of Ballistic tips, I believe so if you include the early solid basses?

I have no idea whether (or even if) the extruded 175 Partitions have changed.

If you include the Solid Bases, there are at least two generations of Ballistic Tips. As I noted earlier, some of the Ballistic Tips developed when they appeard in the 1980s have evidently not been changed, while others have.

The problem with adding a plastic tip to an already existing soft-point bullet is the big hole necessary for the insertion of the tip. This essentially turns the soft-point into a HUGE hollow-point, which expands more violently. I would guess (but don't know for sure) that's what happened when Hornady first introduced the SST--which was essentially a boat-tailed Interlock Spire Point with a tip added.

Good thread Kevin. Thanks for posting.

Here's round 2, thanks to Gunner500.



The 2 expanded bullets are 210's from my .338-06, shot into milk jugs.

I suspect the .375 300 isn't a recent model, as the later version has the Partition moved well forward--like the .416 400. The only two .375 300s I've recovered from animals retained 88% and 89% of their weight.

Man that's some good stuff Teeder, many Thanks for the legwork Sir, I just knew my 400gr partition load at 2400 fps and 500gr load at 2155 fps would be hammers on heavy game, those sectioned bullets say to me a whole hell of a lot of hurt is going to be delivered, and delivered 'DEEP' I may add ; ]

Mule Deer, would it be a major PITA for you to section a newer 375 cal 300gr Partition? I do know I bought a chit-ton of 375 cal 300 grain-ers 12-15 years ago, my load boots then out at 2680 over RL-17, haven't hit anything with them except a few deer and pigs keeping limber with a heavy medium bore for later hunts in Africa, I have no recoveries.

Good stuff Teeder.

It appears the 250g .338 also has a thick jacket that extends even further than the 210g.

Check out the Partition thickness on the 35 cal 250gr partition alpinecrick, wonder if they ran that lighter metal a little thicker to make the bullet a bit longer for a better b.c.?

My 35 Whelen puts those out at 2700 fps, would have to be a damn solid Elk load.

I bought 4 boxes of the 35 cal 250 Partitions several years ago. They are still in the boxes because I have yet to find a problem with any of the commonly available cup and cores as far as expansion or penetration goes. I might load some up if I ever hunt elk in western Washington again.

I'm going through a bunch of 250gr seconds I bought at Midway a few years ago, almost certain they're Hornady Interlocks, that load runs a tic over 2600 fps with RL-15, really cant figure what that load wont take.

Gunner,

No, not a PITA at all. I may even actually have one sectioned already.

At any rate, will get to work on it.

GREAT! Thank you Sir.

Saving this photo. Great info and nice piece of figured wood for a backdrop. I like it.

I'll tell you, it was very noticeable when I started sawing on the .416 and .458 bullets! Stout SOB's!

"It appears the 250g .338 also has a thick jacket that extends even further than the 210g."

Yes, it is further up.

I got another package of bullets in the mail yesterday from lhead71. I'll try to get them on here tomorrow.

After 40 years I have acuulated a few of the Partitions, and they all came out looking just like they were advertised. A great bullet I have used them extensively in my 300WM

NICE! down in the Express Rifles and Big Bore forum under the Big Bore rifle porn thread there's pics of my 98 Mausers in 416 Taylor and 458 Win Mag, both rifles are syn stocked, cerakoted with rain cap and duct tape around the scope tubes for the muzzle, they are ALL weather, ALL game anywhere rifles, i'll bet the cost of the hunts those 4 and 500 grain Partitions will do the heavy lifting with ease.

Thanks again Teeder.

I wonder if the 9.3 also had the centre pushed forward....
Thanks Teeder, awesome work!

No, they were designed with the Partition well forward when Nosler started producing them around 20 years ago. They typically retain 85-90% of their weight.

I saved it, too. Cool photo; thanks for the effort.

With Partitions being hard to find and prices thru the roof, you guys shooting quarter bores need to check this out. I don't think you'll find better prices on Partitions, maybe not ever again, considering our current political climate. Not sure how long they'll last, were still available when I last checked.

https://www.shootersproshop.com/loading-reloading-bullets.html

DF

Thank you.

Awesome to see the uniqueness of each bullet and add the information into the thoughts that go into bullet selections. Thanks, Teeder!

Teeder,

Here's an excerpt from the chapter in Gun Gack II about "Killing Power":

"Eventually it occurred to me the diameter of .338 bullets is only 3/100th of an inch larger than .308 bullets, which ain’t much. After experimenting a little with a Starrett digital micrometer, I found that wrapping a .30 caliber bullet in a single layer of stiff business card resulted in a diameter of just about .338 inch.

It also occurred to me that an expanding bullet’s initial diameter isn’t what kills big game. Instead it’s the 'mushroomed' diameter, which punches a much larger hole. So I opened the over-sized tackle box containing my collection of recovered bullets from half a century of big game hunting, and took out all the .30s and .33s.

The bullets included a pretty comprehensive list: Barnes TSX; Hornady Interlock and Interbond; Norma Oryx; Federal Deep Shok; Nosler AccuBond, Ballistic Tip, E-Tip and Partition; Speer Hot-Cor; Swift A-Frame, and Winchester Fail Safe. I measured the width of each bullet’s mushroom at its widest point, then measured the next-greatest width, averaging the two measurements.

Since there’s only .03 inch difference in unexpanded .30 and .33 bullets, I didn’t expect the average difference in expanded bullets to be much larger, and it wasn’t, turning out to be just about exactly .05 inch. But the .30s averaged larger, not the .33s!

This seemed odd, so I looked closer at the results and discovered the reason: Two kinds of .30 caliber bullets expanded very widely, Hornady Interbonds and Norma Oryxes, all averaging over .7 inch across their mushrooms, while none of the others measured over .668.

None of the .33s were Interbonds or Oryxes, so I eliminated those two bullets from the .30 caliber results, then re-averaged the rest. However, this still came out slightly in favor of the .30s, .631 to .620. Obviously, results might be slightly different for other batches of recovered .30 and .33 caliber bullets, but my results indicate there’s no major difference in their expanded mushrooms."

Can also post a later portion of the chapter, about why I (along with some other experienced hunters) think calibers (not cartridges) larger than .338 up tend to kill quicker.

Mule Deer,
Could this average expansion be due to the average .308 cal bullet having a thinner jacket or softer construction than the .33 caliber?

I sincerely doubt it. FAR more hunters use .30-caliber cartridges as all-around big game rounds than use .338 cartridges.

Plus, I found the same thing with "monolithic" bullets--or those that work in the same basic way, such as the Fail Safe. Killed a LOT of big game with them in the 1990s, before Barnes solved the accuracy problems with the original TSX with more consistent copper, and especially the grooved-shank TSX.

Might also mention that in the early 2000s I went on a gun-writer nilgai hunt in South Texas, where 15 hunters got to shoot both a cow and bull nilgai with the then-new .270 WSM and 140-grain Fail Safes--a now discontinued bullet that worked just about like the Barnes TSX.

In case you're not familiar with nilgai, they're about the size of elk, but the bulls have far thicker hide and shoulder bones. For a number of years they were reported to be the hardest-to-kill (and most bullet-resistant) of any game animal in North America. In fact, many Texas outfitters suggested a minimum of .375 Magnums for hunting them.

The year before the hunt I mentioned (which was my second nilgai hunt), a similar group had hunted the same ranch with .300 WSMs with the 180-grain Fail Safe. When we showed up with .270 WSMs, the outfitter and guides thought they'd be chasing around a lot of wounded nilgai--partly due to the mere mention of ".270".

Instead, by the end of the hunt we'd killed 30 nilgai quite handily, perhaps because the shooters on average shot better than those on the .300 WSM hunt (which may or may not have been due to recoil). But the outfitter and guides decided on the basis of that evidence that the .270 WSM was a BETTER nilgai round than the .300 WSM.

Of course, a .30 caliber round should kill big game better than a similar .270 caliber round, especially with a heavier bullet. But that didn't happen.

Which is one reason, among several, that I tend to doubt generalizations about cartridge/caliber/bullet performance on big game.

And also why I tend to doubt generalizations about bullets, especially when I know Nosler (and other bullet companies) tend to tweak bullet construction, even of the same caliber and model.

All very interesting, enjoy this kind of stuff.
I managed to get some failsafes in 270 140 grain I want to try.
also some 140 grain in 7mm I want to try in my 7-08 from an auction.

JB, your last two posts were outstanding. Well shared.

Excellent info MD!

Specifically, how do the 200 PT'S and 210 PT'S compare for expanded diameter?

My assumption is the 200 expands narrower, but drives deeper.

Thanks!

As I've mentioned before in my writings, one of the advantages of being a gun writer is getting to see a LOT of game killed by other people, and not just primarily relying on the animals I've personally taken. I've been able to observe a lot of hunters using a wide variety of cartridges bullets over the decades, at first due to guiding for some years in Montana, along with accompanying Eileen on most of her hunts.

But around 2000 more bullet/ammo companies decided to start actually "field-testing' new bullets and cartridges extensively, partly by inviting gun writers to do considerable hunting/culling in different places. This was about when some South African landowners (and some in Europe, and other countries) realized that instead of paying "cullers" to shoot excess animals, American hunters would actually pay to do the same thing. Consequently I got to go on a LOT of hunts where a LOT of animals were taken--and tried to accompany as many other hunters as possible, and also spent considerable after-hunt time in the skinning shack, where the animals were processed. The biggest was a month-long hunt on RSA where almost 200 animals were taken, from springbok to Cape buffalo. I only personally shot around a dozen animals, but got to personally observe a bunch of other taken--or the results. But went on a bunch of others, such as the 30-nilgai hunt just described.

Also as a result of those hunts, I was able to fiddle with a number of different kinds of "test media," to determine which kinds resulted in similat results to actual hunting of big game. Eventually settled on a couple of kinds of media, one for testing for "softer" broadside chest shots, and one for testing that simulated hitting heavy bone.

But my main point is that a LOT of bullets/cartridges/etc. work on big game, though in different ways--often due to the limits of certain types of bullets. Recently wrote an upcoming article on typical cup-and-core bullets, and realized while looking through my hunting notes that while I've taken a bunch of "deer-sized" game from Montana to South Africa with the 7x57 and the 160-grain Sierra GameKing handloaded to around 2675 fps, ALL have exited. This is because plain old "cup-and-core" bullets have always worked well when started at moderate muzzle velocities, though sometimes not when pushed to 3000+ fps.

There's always something to learn....

I actually don't know how their expanded diameter averages when shot into big game, because have never recovered a 200-grain .30 Partition from any animal, whether it was shot from a .30-06 or various .300 magnums--and have used a bunch of 'em since 1977, when I started using the original lathe-turned "semi-spitzer" or "blunt-nose" model. One did stay inside a Colorado bull elk after a "raking" shot, as Elmer Keith called them, at close to 400 yards--but never found it after tracing the bullet's path through the guts into the chest cavity.

But have never been able to see any difference in how both bullets killed when shooting a number of animals at various ranges.

Good enough for me. 👍

Yeah, I started using the "turned" version if the NPT's in the 270 & 338 in the '70's as well & have stayed with the NPT as a primary bullet in just about all my guns.

I've used a variety of other, newer bullets from various makers, but have never been let down by the NPT in any caliber.

I really don't recall a single (genuine hunting) rifle over all that time that didn't shoot them well enough for all hunting purposes to 500 yards either.

This is the typical performance over a range of animals, close & far, that I've managed to catch..............most exited. These are both 270's with 130 's on the left & a 150 on the right.

YMMV

MM

Without a doubt Partitions are the schitt and they shoot lights out. If you own a rifle that dosen't shoot a Partition well schitt can it.

I agree. I can't think of a rifle that didn't like the partition. Some shoot much better than you could ever imagine.

Great thread!

I probably should do a round 3 follow-up. Pretty sure I have some PT's that weren't cut yet.

Some may find the following both interesting and having some significance: I have two .338-caliber, 250gr Partitions retrieved from a bull moose. From 165 yards the first went through the broadside chest behind the shoulders, sending lung tissue and blood about 20 yards across the bushes. The 1000 - 1100 lb bull staggered but wasn't going anywhere. The 250 Partitiion left the muzzle of my .340 Wby at ~ 3000 fps (many chronographed before the hunt). So impact was around the .338 Win Mags published MV. I sidestepped a few yards for a better angle and the bull saw me for the first time and started to swing away. I gave him another that hit behind the short ribs as he was swinging away and he went down in a depression, out of sight. But I was ready to give another if he got back up, which he didn't until a few minutes later when my son arrived from a blind 350 yards away. He got too close and the bull stood in a very wobbly condition - and wasn't going anywhere. But I'd closed the distance to about 35 yards, and when he stood all I could see was his rump facing me whereupon I gave him another in the rump and he went down to stay. My son saw the bulge of my second shot on the offside about 4 inches from the exit wound from the first shot. He dug it out with a knife. That was the first 250gr retrieved. The 250gr from the third shot into the rump was also found by the butcher in the front part of the chest cavity. Before the carcass was delivered to the butcher 36 hours later (we had to wait until the following day to finish matters before leaving camp, then a 1000 mile drive home, then the following morning the moose was delivered to the butcher). So the moose had been field dressed and cut in two aft the short ribs to fit on out trailer. That bullet, as stated, was found by the butcher in the front portion of the rib cage.

The two bullet retrieved: The second, found under the hide by my son next to the first exit wound = 173 grains (69%)/ .61" avg diameter/ .58" in length. The last shot (3rd) into the rump, found by the butcher in forward part of chest cavity = 175 grains (70%)/ .70" by .62" expansion/ .45" in length, from 35 yards impact velocity was 2900 fps yet it epanded more, penetrated more and was significantly shorter! Of course, impact velocity was about 250 fps faster than the first two shots from 165 yards.

A 286 Partition was retrieved from a black bear shot frontally in the chest. In skinning it was found just poking through the hide in the right flank just in front of the hip. That bear went over an embankment and found dead at the bottom. It's retrieval is another story, but:

The bullet had tumbled with some "wings" on one side pointing forward. Nontheless, it retained 74% of initial weight (211 grains). MV from my 9.3 x 62 (1/14 twist) = +2600 fps. From treestand to bear = 68 yards as it faced me.

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

I'd be all eyes to see that.


Great info. I shot a few elk with the 250 PT's from the 338 Win with a 2780 start speed and never even came close to recovering one of them. 210's whistled thru elk pretty easily as well.

Anybody have sections of (or the ability).257/115gr & .277/130gr Partition? Very curious about their construction similarities - to me they have acted identically on game.

Who was that dude that said "load Partitions, shut up and go hunting " ?

I've only ever caught a single 210gr Partition out of a 338 Win Mag. Exits on deer, elk, bison. But caught one in a doe pronghorn...

HA, I have heard of them getting snagged on smaller animals and breaking apart on bone, but in my experience they are giant killers. I'd imagine it was a long shot through the antelope? Meaning a steep angle.

Yep. In through the breast bone and broke the femur, under the hide. Shot was at about 65yds.

I’m sure you could see the reaction on that hit.

Sorta. By the time I came out of recoil it was down and not moving. By the time I walked up to it there was still hair falling out of the air. LOL.

I bet! Holy smokes!

I wonder how the 250's would work out of a. 338-06? They look pretty stout. What's the minimum velocity for reliable expansion?

I wouldn't be scared taking about any of the PT's down to 1800-2000 myself. Seem like the front end is always pretty soft on them. I think there are a few folks over the years I have heard who had great results from the 250's in a 338-06.

[/quote]I wouldn't be scared taking about any of the PT's down to 1800-2000 myself. Seem like the front end is always pretty soft on them. I think there are a few folks over the years I have heard who had great results from the 250's in a 338-06.[/quote]

Was told several years ago by Nosler that they the same relatively soft lead-alloy in ALL the front cores of Partition, but the harder rear core alloy can vary, depending on the specific bullet. But like some other bullet companies, they're often tweaking bullets.

That's also why the percentage of weight retained varies from the smallest to largest Partitions. The largest also have the partition moved forward to retain a higher percentage of weight. Don't know exactly which models that's done with right now, but highest percentage I've had any retain was 95% from a 400-grain .416 shot into a big Botswana Cape buffalo that was angling away. It entered the rear of the left ribs and was found in the right shoulder. Muzzle velocity was right around 2400, and the range maybe 60 yards. Also have a pair of 300-grain .375's from a buffalo, started at 2550 from a .375 H&H, that retained 88% and 87%, if I recall correctly.

Another statement directly from Nosler (also made a few years ago, so it could have changed) was all of the larger, heavier Partitions are designed to retain around 75% of their original weight, even if they lose the front core. The least I've seen retained by one of them was 74%, a 286-grain 9.3 that broke the shoulder-joint of a blue wildebeest that was quartering toward me at around 200 yards--which lost the front core and almost all front jacket as well. But another one (same velocity, from the same 9.3x62 load) retained a little over 90% of it weight, after going through the flesh behind the big joint on both shoulders of a very bid-bodied British Columbia bull moose.

The least percentage of weight I've seen from a recovered Partition was 54%. It was a 150-grain .270, which Eileen put into the left ribs of a quartering-away bull Shiras moose, which we found under the hide of the right shoulder--muzzle velocity 2850 fps, range around 125 yards. The bull took a step-and-a-half and folded up. (It was an average sort of meat bull, but was still as large as any bull elk I've seen on the ground.)

That 150 PT is a good'un in my book. One of the more easy accurate ones too. Been alot of 270's over the years that have done excellent.

It's good to read about rifle loonies being so interested in bullet performance. I don't feel so lonely in this world anymore.

Anyway, on my next deer hunting trip to Admiralty Island, (where the shots are short and the bears are thick), I'll be taking my 338-06 and 250 grain Partitions. Meat friendly and good bear medicine if I get in a pinch.

Yep!

Just bought some "overruns" from Nosler's Pro Shop, which have cannelures, indicating they might have been intended for Federal factory loads. Suspect they might shoot very well in my new-to-me pre-'64 Model 70 Featherweight.....

Probably a fair chance they’ll do well. One of the easy accurate bullets through the years. Plus they match up well with the old Bitterroots I like to use.

Would be interested to hear how your hunt goes.

Hopefully next year. I go about every other year.

I’ve heard several guys talk very highly of that bullet

It’s one of the Partitions that seem to punch above it’s weight class but really it’s just a great balance between anticipated impact velocity & bullet design which seems to make all the difference with most bullets.

I’d be interested in seeing 130, 140, 150, & 160 grain 277 partitions. It seems SPS has had a lot of 270 Partitions for sale over the last couple of years. I ended up with some in each weight.

As far as the discussion with the different bullet diameters. It seems to me that at one time; as the diameter of the bullet increased so did the thickness of the jacket and perhaps the change in the core. That is a 338 bullet would be built “tougher” than a 308 bullet. I don’t think that’s necessarily true now.
Bullet technology has changed so much. Compare what we have for choices today to what was available before Nosler designed his partitions.

You apparently haven't read my posts, or book chapters, that mention how Partitions definitely do vary depending on caliber/weight.

In fact posted one on this subject on this thread, last evening.

What in the world made you make such a comment?

Did I say they didn't?

For someone who seems to say that he knows what people think. You sure don't seem to know what people think!

Gee, sorry--but this statement in your post prompted my comment:

"It seems to me that at one time; as the diameter of the bullet increased so did the thickness of the jacket and perhaps the change in the core. That is a 338 bullet would be built “tougher” than a 308 bullet. I don’t think that’s necessarily true now."

Is that not what you meant to type? Or did you mean something completely different?

For anyone interested SPS is showing 30cal 150gr. Partitions in stock $30

I remember this cool thread, good stuff Teeder.

This has been an excellent thread. Thanks to MD and Teeder and everyone else.

I haven't sectioned one, but....

Here is a 100gr Partition, .257 Roberts. Started out at 3200fps + or - a bit. Deer angling away from left to right at 160 yards. Impact at about 2800fps, in behind right front and caught under the hide of the left front shoulder. Expanded to .408, and retained 61% weight.

It's important to note, I think, that the first shot (broadside) gave complete penetration with lung tissue and blood scattered across bushes for approx. 20 yards. That was a penetration of at least two feet. The next shot angled from behind the short ribs to just under the hide against the offside shoulder, leaving a bulge immediatelly seen by my son, which would have been a penetration of close to four feet. The last into the rump, found by the butcher in the forward part of the rib cage, would have been close to six feet. Little wonder that full penetration on elk would be expected by the 250/.338 hitting slower on a lighter animal... I think.

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

MD,
Any idea why Nosler didn't just leave the rear of the partition copper alloy? It seems that would have made manufacturing easier (and cheaper) and accomplished the same goal. That would have made the rear slightly less dense, but time has shown that hasn't been an issue for monos with penetration.

Maybe accuracy with different metals/density on front and back half? I would assume accuracy would be best when the entire bullet has the same jacket and cores?

thank you for that - I just received some of these.
I didn't see these 30 cal 150 partitions in the sectioned bullet pictures, but I suspect these will work just fine ; - )