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Posted By: PAndy receiving primers ...haz mat - 04/28/21
If someone is dumb enough to ship me primers without haz mat permits at his end, is there any risk to me (other than the primers not arriving)? Everything I read is about regulations for the shipper, but I don't know what the deal is for the receiver.
That's a darn good question and appropriately phrased. I don't know the answer but am interested in what those that do have to say.
Rex
I would think it would be on the shipper not on you, but I don't know that.
I am very sure it is on the shipper.. I asked the post office about someone shipping ammo, and was told it is up to the shipped to make sure it was shipped legally..(I was shipped loaded ammo through the post office many years ago) I never bought anymore from that seller.. I don't have his address anymore so don't bother reporting me , it was over 40 years ago.
I would think if you knowingly receive illegally shipped items from someone you have some exposure.
Originally Posted by 1Akshooter
I would think if you knowingly receive illegally shipped items from someone you have some exposure.

But to "knowingly receive" primers shipped to you could simply mean the primers you ordered showed up at your door with no HAZMAT markings. At that point, you open the box, see they are the primers you ordered, and note there was no HAZMAT protocols followed. What then?
So all someone has to do is ship some using someone else's name and address, and Postal Inspectors will be showing up on their door step instead...

maybe something to do to the democRAT up the street?

Asking for a friend of course...
Posted By: Huntz Re: receiving primers ...haz mat - 04/30/21
Originally Posted by TRexF16
Originally Posted by 1Akshooter
I would think if you knowingly receive illegally shipped items from someone you have some exposure.

But to "knowingly receive" primers shipped to you could simply mean the primers you ordered showed up at your door with no HAZMAT markings. At that point, you open the box, see they are the primers you ordered, and note there was no HAZMAT protocols followed. What then?

Start reloading.
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"
Posted By: WMR Re: receiving primers ...haz mat - 04/30/21
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"


Actually, he doesn't have to say anything in his defense. The burden of proof is on the prosecution. His innocence is presumed, until proven otherwise.
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"


Actually, he doesn't have to say anything in his defense. The burden of proof is on the prosecution. His innocence is presumed, until proven otherwise.


Obviously, in a court of law, the receiver doesn't have to say anything in his own defense. I was simply illustrating how the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.
Posted By: WMR Re: receiving primers ...haz mat - 04/30/21
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"


Actually, he doesn't have to say anything in his defense. The burden of proof is on the prosecution. His innocence is presumed, until proven otherwise.


Obviously, in a court of law, the receiver doesn't have to say anything in his own defense. I was simply illustrating how the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.


10-4. I agree. Just wanted to remind folks that the investigating officer is not the one you need to convince, The jury is. Investigators are looking to make arrests. Perhaps especially now in a gun related issue. One might want to keep his yap shut, as what you say will most definitely be " used against you".
Who knows what is in the box? The shipper has to make that disclosure. Are you thinking that the carrier might open your box along the way. I don't think so. Once it arrives at your door, the door is shut as far as I am concerned - no pun itended.
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"


Actually, he doesn't have to say anything in his defense. The burden of proof is on the prosecution. His innocence is presumed, until proven otherwise.


Obviously, in a court of law, the receiver doesn't have to say anything in his own defense. I was simply illustrating how the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.


10-4. I agree. Just wanted to remind folks that the investigating officer is not the one you need to convince, The jury is. Investigators are looking to make arrests. Perhaps especially now in a gun related issue. One might want to keep his yap shut, as what you say will most definitely be " used against you".



An arrest for what exactly?
Posted By: dassa Re: receiving primers ...haz mat - 05/07/21
Do most of you guys have a cop sitting at your house watching you open the mail?
It happened to me once, I just kept my mouth shut and nothing came about it.
Posted By: WMR Re: receiving primers ...haz mat - 05/07/21
Originally Posted by GeorgiaBoy
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"


Actually, he doesn't have to say anything in his defense. The burden of proof is on the prosecution. His innocence is presumed, until proven otherwise.


Obviously, in a court of law, the receiver doesn't have to say anything in his own defense. I was simply illustrating how the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.


10-4. I agree. Just wanted to remind folks that the investigating officer is not the one you need to convince, The jury is. Investigators are looking to make arrests. Perhaps especially now in a gun related issue. One might want to keep his yap shut, as what you say will most definitely be " used against you".



An arrest for what exactly?


Nothing, in this case. Just meant as a general rule in interactions with LEO. Was a general reference, not referring to this case. I can see why it might look otherwise. Sorry if I mislead.
Originally Posted by dassa
Do most of you guys have a cop sitting at your house watching you open the mail?

For 38 years and two children, now.
Originally Posted by Theo Gallus
Originally Posted by dassa
Do most of you guys have a cop sitting at your house watching you open the mail?

For 38 years and two children, now.

laugh

DF
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by GeorgiaBoy
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
Originally Posted by WMR
Originally Posted by HoosierHawk
The receiver has no control over what the shipper does. None. Therefore, the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.

All he need say for a defense is, "The shipper told me he was going to ship it Hazmat. How could I know he was lying?"


Actually, he doesn't have to say anything in his defense. The burden of proof is on the prosecution. His innocence is presumed, until proven otherwise.


Obviously, in a court of law, the receiver doesn't have to say anything in his own defense. I was simply illustrating how the receiver cannot be held legally liable for the actions of the shipper.


10-4. I agree. Just wanted to remind folks that the investigating officer is not the one you need to convince, The jury is. Investigators are looking to make arrests. Perhaps especially now in a gun related issue. One might want to keep his yap shut, as what you say will most definitely be " used against you".



An arrest for what exactly?


Nothing, in this case. Just meant as a general rule in interactions with LEO. Was a general reference, not referring to this case. I can see why it might look otherwise. Sorry if I mislead.




I savvy. Have a good one.

GB
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