I was trying to explain something regarding recoil to my sons the other day, and I realized I was wading into some pretty deep weeds. I figured I would lay this all out to you guys and see what comes of it.

First off, I have noticed in my 40 years of shooting and hunting that my reaction to recoil is a very subjective thing and it is constantly changing. I was never really bothered about the recoil of my 35 Whelen in the field, but at the bench on a hot summer day, it was getting way too stiff for my liking. This is despite the fact that my best hunting blind pretty much duplicated the dimensions and ergonomics of my bench-- purposely.

Some years, I come away from turkey season feeling my shoulder. I shoot a 12 GA 3" load that has about the same recoil as an elephant gun. Some years I've felt my shoulder clear to Labor Day. This year, I walked away from season with no lasting ill effect.

What is it about some days where a couple rounds out of a 30-06 make me wince and other days I could not care less? Same gun, same load-- I know it's just me, but what is it? Why is it that some days I'm fighting a flinch and some days I'm pool-cued and unfurturbed?

Somebody must have thought this out. I know there is something going on inside me-- it isn't the rifle or the load. I just don't know what it is.

For me it is simple enough, I hold it easy and move with the recoil, if I attempt to hold it tight and soak the recoil it makes my teeth and bones ache.

From a bench I handle recoil best when my torso is vertical, getting a shorter seat or taller rests or from a standing rifle rest.

Recoil will affect you differently based on shooting position. Shooting off of a bench will feel differently than laying prone. I've also noticed that I'm not the same day in and day out when I shoot. Some days, I feel pretty solid. Other days, I can't seem to settle down.

Im with you on the shotguns. I can shoot a much higher number of shotgun rounds that recoil way more than any of my rifles, leave me bruised, etc. and not think twice about it. Even if like you said, it’s a turkey gun and I’m using it like a rifle. Recoil never crosses my mind. I have never gotten as comfortable with the recoil from a more-than-mild rifle.

Bench position is critical in “felt recoil”, as mentioned! However, my opinion/findings differ from JSTUART on holding the firearm. When I first got my .375 AI ( 60 ft/lbs recoil) , I attempted the “light hold” method! It kicked the crap out of me and my 3 shot groups ran in the 1 1/4” to 1 1/12” range. When I went to a very firm/tight hold.....felt recoil was lessened and my groups shrunk to 3/4”!

I suspect that the “light hold” allowed the rifle to get a “running start” and hit me pretty hard. The “light hold” also allowed the rifle to jump quite high off of the front rest as well as the rifle “torque” (twist) a great deal. I think that a “tight hold” helped minimize all of the above....helping me shoot much better! JMO. memtb

Mismount of the gun always made recoil very noticeable.

I don't own any big bore rifles - closest I get is a 12 gauge. Was snow goose hunting. Extended magazine stuffed with Kent 3.5 inchers. I want to say there were 6 and I unloaded as fast as I could. Winchester Super X2 is pretty soft shotgun but that shook my teeth.

Never again. I stepped down to 3 inch and shot MUCH slower.

YES !!!!!

If I try to STOP the rifle’s rearward motion
It gets my attention and CAN hurt.

I like as upright as I can be AND leave my
Arm, Shoulder, & Back RELAXED....
I will then rock or rotate WITH the rifle
Instead of trying to stop its motion.

I don’t notice recoil TILL my 8 mm Rem Mag.
80 grs powder, 200 or 220 gr bullets @ 3100 FPS.

I’ve used my Tikka T3X Lite SS 7 RM each year
since 2018 and NO problems.

Jerry

I’ll add this to my previous post. I do not try to stop or limit my body from moving during recoil......I try to relax my upper body as much as is possible, while pulling the rifle firmly into my shoulder and holding the rifle down with my non-trigger hand (placed on top of scope) to minimize rifle jump and torque! memtb

Thanks for all the comebacks.

I'm particularly concerned with an effect I notice that doesn't seem to have any relation to the ergonomics. Some days, my body just seems more sensitive to recoil than others. Anyone else notice this? What's causing it?

One has to wonder, on those days did you drink… milk?
Cereal question.

Does stock fitment have any effect on felt recoil? Seems I read something about that.

Stock design does and fitment.

Used to shoot an old Nobel 12 gauge. Was too short for me and every time I'd fire - my thumb would come back and hit my nose. Usually bleeding at the end of a round of trap.

Kimber's design of the Montana stock seems to do a very good job at mitigating recoil. Certainly better than the M7 I had in the past.

Confidence is everything, if you are thinking about recoil, then you:

Raise your head up off the stock

slap the trigger instead of steady pull

Jerk the trigger, which is different than a slap

loose focus of your sight picture, with no idea where the cross hair was when the gun went off

Inconsistent grip with either hand and shoulder pressure

IN 1986, a gunsmith introduced me to a muzzle break on my 375 H&H, and 338 Win mag....jeez....where had I been all those years? Head in the sand for sure.

Next was a brake on the 35 Wheelen, then 30/06....then all varmint rifles down to 223....

Shotguns are another can of worms. I was shoot a lot of 3" mags on pigeons where the average shot was 50-65 yards with them flying 70 mph, and Coyotes with 3" #4 buck. Gave up the pumps, and Benelli SBE, got to the Beretta's 390, 391, Rem 11/87's...home sweet home!

Recoil is a darn accuracy killer, and going down in caliber size and bullet weight is a huge help, amazing what a 243, 6 Rem, and AI's will do with Nosler partitions and tripple shocks, and pass the 100g Hornady BTHP and BTSP.

A 22 Creed and 22/250 AI shooting 60g Partitions is a deer slayer.

I'm not being smart or critical. I thot that was a given.

I won't keep a stock that doesn't fit me. It either gets adjusted or it's down the road.


Jerry

Bingo. You never want to lightly hold a magnum or heavy kicker.. Also allowing the rifle to push you back a bit, as in "follow through". In other words, you don't want to be like a brick wall, but you do want to pull the rifle in tight to your shoulder pocket..

bsa

What do you call a heavy kicker.

My 8 RM & a 338 WM that I had & a
375 HH I played with are my heavy kickers
of experience.

I hold all of em more lightly than ‘tight’ & hard.
No problems.

? ? ? ?


Jerry

One of the best pieces of advice about bench-testing harder kicking rifles I've read over the decades was Elmer Keith's: Hold the forend firmly with your front hand just behind the front rest. This definitely cuts down on felt recoil, whether the stocks "fitment" is correct for you or not.

On the other hand, the biggest advance I've encountered in recoil abatement over those same decades was using smaller cartridges with better bullets.

Limbsaver recoil pads help a lot.

Gripping the forend of my 338Fed Montana is how I ended up taking that rifle from snappy to pleasant.

Time of year and weather is big too. Much more comfortable shooting with a jacket than with a t-shirt.

Gain weight…. I’m a rail…. But I’m 45 pounds heavier than when I shipped off to MCRD San Diego in 2004. I got sick in boot camp like everyone else and dipped down below minimum weight standards during that first couple of weeks. Now I look back on it and can’t imagine myself with 50 pounds less on my frame.

Posture. Being upright on the bench is much better than being hunched over.

Wear good hearing protection.

Shoot big stuff. I hunt doves with a 12 gauge Fox Sterlingworth pin gun with a plastic buttplate. My friends think I’m crazy, but I smack doves with it and don’t care about the recoil.

Shoot little stuff. Have a 223 Montana to go with my 338 Fed. They often go to the range together.

Recently got into reduced loads. I’ve found that getting comfortable with the rifle before it goes off with full loads has helped.

At this point in my life I’m looking for something bigger, and even though I’m still a youngster to most of you, I’ve never been a fan of hard kicking rifles. Now I’m starting to like it.

As a side note… when I was 11 I saved up chore money for several months to buy a REM 700 ADL 270. Had a wood stock and plastic buttplate. I probably weighed 85 pounds. That is where I developed a flinch. When I was maybe 13 I had my mom take an old dish rag and sew it up into a type of recoil pad. My dad called it a wuss rag. Then around 14 or 15 I swapped out the buttplate for a pad. That would have been helpful when I was 11.

I did make several nice shots on deer with that rifle though. I’m not experienced with the truly big kickers, but the 270 was mind over matter, even when I was 11. It gave me my first flinch, and I also learned how to beat the flinch with that rifle.

Dad has always been a loving and caring father. His wuss rag comments were in a joking manner, but they helped toughen me up nonetheless.

You'll get over it.

Probably. But I won’t know until I try. My next rifle will be either a 338WM, 9.3x62, or 375H&H.

Lately the 338 has been what I’ve daydreamed about most.

I agree that the way you hold your rifle makes a difference to whether it knocks you about. I've always found that holding it fairly firmly in both hands helps - holding the forend in particular tends to control the jump, which not only keeps the comb from smacking you put also helps your accuracy. You don't want to be holding it so tightly that you induce muscle tremors, but a good firm grip and pressure against the shoulder.

What I also find helpful is adopting a position which allows you to rock back with the recoil sitting up straight rather than hunched down behind a bench, for example, or even kneeling or standing behind the rest. This allows me to "roll with the punch".

I suspect that there are a couple of factors which also come into play. Some have been mentioned. Stock fit is a big one: I had a Mauser .30/06 for example, which had too much drop and a sharp comb, and knocked me about as a result, while with the same loads a Browning Stainless, despite being lighter, is a pussycat, and even a Rem 700 Ti, lighter still, was not at all unpleasant even with 220 gn loads.

I think that your state of mind also comes into play. If you are focused on dropping a critter you tend not even to notice recoil, nor the bang, whereas if you have time to think about it when slowly taking up the slack on the trigger at a target you notice it more. You can also put it out of your mind too, I've found, by reminding yourself that the impact is actually not going to hurt you - you get bumped a hell of a lot harder in a any number of other sports.

It took me years to figure out how to lick the the flinch. It's easy, just shoot til your arm feels like its falling off, then shoot some more, LOL! Sort of joking but the more I shoot and the more often I shoot the less it bother's me. Shooting from a bench is my worse case. Hunting I hardly notice it. Shooting at the bench for groups I just relax and control my breathing and squeeze the shot off. The more I relax the less it hurts and the better I shoot.

OK. I beginning to see that folks are just not experiencing this the same way I am.

Most days, I'm just fine shooting a 30-06, my 8X57 or even my 35 Whelen. However, some days the recoil feels noticeably worse--same gun, same layers of clothing, same bench, same ammo. I started experiencing this maybe a decade ago (around age 50+). I chalked it up to aging.

I don't think it's the way I'm holding the rifle. At least it does not feel this way. I'm doing everything I can to minimize change from one session to the next.

Milk? I drink about 16 oz every morning at minimum.

I was just wondering if anyone else noticed this, and if anyone had figured out what caused it.

I guess not. Thanks anyways.

I shoot my .35 Whelen quite a bit off the bench during the off season, since having both shoulder's rotator cuff repaired I have done two things to help with felt recoil. First I installed a Pachmyer Decelerator recoil pad and second I developed a load with a lighter bullet. Previously I was shooting a 225 gr. bullet over IMR 4064 and recoil was moderate, now I shoot a Ken Waters Pet Load that features a Hornady Inter-lok 200 gr. RN bullet over IMR 3031. Not only is this load outstandingly accurate in my rifle it also is very effective on whitetails. The last bullet that I recovered on a raking shot @ 100 yds. was perfectly mushroomed and retained 66% of its original weight. Hope these suggestion are useful, they certainly helped me.

Now that's interesting: I had a buddy of mine get back to me. He's not on the 'Fire, but I asked him pretty much the same question. His answer was that his sensitivity to recoil started after he got Diabetes. He finds that when his Glucose is in a good range, he has a much better tolerance for recoil. This would make sense for me as well. I'm diabetic, but normally keep it well managed. However, there are times I stray out of the zone either at the end of the day or while my meals are settling. I'd not made the connection.

That would explain a lot as well. It isn't just recoil that sometimes throws me for a loop. Sometimes a jumping down from the porch (all of a foot or so) can really rattle me. I've learned to step down slowly.

Anyone else seeing this?

If one of these hurts ya, try the next one on the left.



Or have a couple shots of whiskey.

It’s called degenerative disc disease. Normally occurs as we “age”. 😁

I have been shooting a Tikka T3 Lite .270 WSM a lot lately. Not a hard kicking rifle, but with 140 grain bullets at 3200 fps it is snappy. The factory recoil pad on a Tikka does next to nothing to tame recoil. I replaced it with a Limbsaver pad, and the difference is dramatic. I can shoot 20 rounds off the bench with no ill effects on my shoulder.

You got what you paid for. Trick is to find some useful bargains out there. None are 3" long.

Gas operated shotguns take out a LOT of felt recoil, add a Limbsaver Air Tec recoil pad. Beretta 391 with the shock absorber in the butt is an awesome addition, all you feel is a push.

I do that as well and it helps a lot.

I find that as I get older, I just don't want to deal with heavier recoil as much as when I was younger. I can do it, I just don't want to.

The only "magnum/big gun" I own now is a 9lb 300H&H and it's not bad at all. Nothing over 30cal.

LOL, truth here. My 9 pound suppressed 6.5x47 shooting 140 grain bullets around 2650 seems to kick quite lightly. Its some kind of miracle.

Amazing that many never catch on to this.

Any of this have to do with summertime bench shooting in a T-shirt versus cold weather coat or jacket?

Im 6' and 190 lbs.
Used to be 175 and no fat.
Shot everything like a varmint gun and took the swat.

Pushing 60, less muscle ( weigh 185 ).... and arthritis.

I can shoot the big stuff, w just a T shirt.
But I feel it next day, at half the round count.

Always shoot from the bench pretty upright.

Get a little tender these days, but hell I wake up sore when I havent shot anything.

The gas operation and the shock absorber in the stock are "slowing down" the recoil event and the gun itself before you start to feel the recoil. A recoil pad does the same to some degree. The thicker and squishier the pad, the longer time it spreads out the recoil and the more it slows the gun before you start to feel it.

Ft/Lb of recoil doesn't tell the whole story. Recoil velocity needs to be accounted for as well.

If 12ga 1 1/4oz shotshells produced 3K FPS instead of 1250-1300fps NOBODY would shoot them.

It just might be that somehow age has something to do with it. I usually kind of stretch the rifle between my hands when I shoot 30-06 or bigger rifles, I notice my left hand stays in place better and the weight of my arm helps slow the recoil down. On the old age thing, some days I just don't shoot well.

My father has a patent on parabolic taper hydraulics for constant recoil force during recoil in artillery.
I have a spiel about spreading recoil over time and area so a no point will any skin see more than 20 psi, the threshold of pain.

But no advice is better than than throw other recoil pad brands in the trash and only use Limbsavers. .... not the NItro grind to fit model. It is thick, but the compliance is too low.

Limbsaver Air Tec is unbelievable!

Shame they don’t make them in red

I recently shot a friend's suppressed 6.5c and 223. Being able to see the trace and spot your own hits/misses can not be overrated. Combine low recoil w/ a reticle that allows you to make instant corrections and magic happens.


mike r

One summer I got I to sporting clays a bit.
Did some skeet too. All just fun.

When I got my relatively light 300 mag to the bench,
it had never been so pleasant to shoot.

So, get something that bunps you decent, but bearable for 50+ rounds.
Then go shoot 100 or more rounds a week.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Shaman,
When shooting from a bench, I try to transfer as much of the offhand body position as I can. For example from the bench, face your chest and/or chair toward the gun rather than down range.
Arrange the bags so the elbow of your trigger hand is held up high enough to form a shoulder pocket for the recoil, as when you're in the standing position with your elbow at shoulder level.