I am looking at a short barreled rifle for deer. I have had a bunch of rifles in my 69 years but never one w/less than 20 1/2 inches. This one in particular has an 18 1/2in barrel and I just don't have any experience w/one that short. I just have never liked them. Help. powdr

First off, most cartridges used for deer today are way more powerful than needed The loss of velocity just isn't an issue as most all rifles still retain a lot more power than needed. Some will say that the short barrel will create more muzzle blast to the shooter. I can't deny that but must say it's never been a problem to me.

If you're mountain hunting where shots are long, the shortness of the barrel usually isn't helpful because you rarely are forced to act quickly in heavy brush.

If you are woods hunting the shorter barrel can be an advantage in allowing easier movement and quicker acquisition of sights. It simply depends on your style of hunting.

I like the 20 - 22” lengths on my shorter barrel bolt rifles. Though probably could learn to like an 18”.

Lever rifles, most of mine are 20”. Though, I must admit to liking the pistol cartridges with 16” barrels.

A pump rifle, I could do 18” without issue.

Mostly depends on the intended use as to my preference.

What cartridge are you considering? A short barrel on a 30-06 or WSM wouldn't excite me but a mild little round like .250 Sav or 6.5 Grendel might. Remington never did very well by putting short barrels on powerful cartridges but the Model 7 with milder rounds has done OK.

I have two 20" barrelled rifles (.250 Sav and .308) and a 21" 8x57. The first two are Ruger Ultralights and are a bit muzzle light but I shoot okay with them. In the field I don't really notice it when shooting at game. The .308 tends to jump on the front rest at the range though due to it's lightness. I have to hold the fore end to stop it. I don't mind 20 inches on a barrel but have shied away from 18.5". I've passed up some Model 7s because of the 18.5" length. Maybe other people did too as Remington later went to 20".

Give it a go. They are great to carry in the bush and you don't lose all that much velocity. You may have to alter your shooting style on the bench but that's easy to do.

Im thinking a short 6.5 grendel.

Had 600 and Model 7 in .243 win.
Slightly annoying.
Worse was my Riger #1 RSI in that.
Noticed the blast even when I shot a deer w it
The others were just used varminting.
Had a carbine 742....it too was annoying, but cool (.30-06 ).
Shame it shot like crap

Had a TC Contender 16" in 35 rem. Neat rig, except it looked stupid. If it was a straight bull 18.5" would jave looked better.

.35 rem shorty or 6.5 grendel, would be my picks.
Know nothing about the grendel except it looks physically like a cool cartridge.

Have a G2 Contender that can handle that round and MGM makes bbls for it. Ruger RAR are not expensive so may go that route.

My first centerfire (aside from a surplus .303 that I didn’t actually shoot) was a Remington 600 .308, a terrible choice in those pre-earplug days. Noisy, and the balance sucked. Since that one, I’ve not owned one shorter than 20”. Noise aside, balance is important to me, and a really short one might need a little more heft in the barrel to compensate.

The Grendel is a great idea, short barrel or not. Mine wears a youth stock, which can be lengthened in a trice with a Limbsaver slip-on pad. It has a 22” barrel, and is plenty short enough for me in cover or in a tree. Only reason I’d go with one shorter than 20” now would be for suppressed use, or an AR-ish piece like my Mini-14, which might get used in really tight quarters indoors.

20” is the limit imposed by my ears on 308-based rounds. Even then I get a occasional ear-beating if there’s structure nearby. Like others say, I could maybe see an 18” on a Grendel.

16" bolt gun with a silencer is hard to beat.

Blasphemy, most hunters I know say too much is never enough

18" suppressed .243 A.I. works well for me, also have a 16" .308 suppressed, that handles real well, just like the .243 A.I. more. Rio7

The shortest barrel that I have on a centerfire rifle is 17" on a Winchester 100 in 308 that somebody cut down from 22". It does have both a loud muzzle blast and, in low, dawn/dusk, light conditions, a blinding muzzle flash, but it sure is handy to maneuver through heavy cover when I still-hunt. Muzzle blast is something that you probably would notice when shooting off a bench or inside a blind, but when you're aiming at an animal you're typically concentrating on the animal and will automatically shut out all other environmental factors.

Had a 94 Trapper for many years and used it quite a bit. 16” .30-30 killed well, ears did not approve. Made a few tricky snap shots with it, to include a neck shot on an airborne buck. That said one of my other barrels is 42” and I prefer it here in the swamps.

IMHO, quibbling over a few ounces and inches of barrel is somewhat silly. Balance is a more significant factor.

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I had/have a Sav.99 in 308 with 16 1/4" barrel that is a handi little devil. I killed a number of deer with it, my best still hunting was three before noon one day. My nephew was the recipient of the rifle to kill his first deer and for the last 25 years also. I wear ear protection when sighting it and never noticed the sound when killing something with it. I bought it for a C-note in the parking lot of a gun show, one of my better purchases.

I packed a Rem 600 in 223 with a 18" barrel doing control work and varmint hunting long enough to wear out the barrel still shoot it with a 20" 6x45 tube on it.

I have a little Mini Howa in 6.5G with a 20" tube that is really handi hunting coyote on the MC along with a 16" barreled 223 AR, it isn't the barrel that kills the critter it's the bullet that comes out the end of it.


A Mannlicher stocked 18" barreled Mini Mauser in 6.5G would be just a handi little rig and really pretty to boot. I wouldn't turn down one of the little Ruger 77 RSI's as a hunter.

I prefer a short barrel but all mine have mannlicher style stocks. The additional forearm weight balances better for me.

They work well also.

Might want to dig up hunting mag articles on "Scout rifles"

Not including 16” bbl ARs, my 6.8 SPC with 18” barrel is the shortest bolt gun I have and it’s a dream to hunt <200 yards with. I use it for hunting out of climbers and when rattling. It’s been dynamite for many white tails. I’m considering threading the muzzle for a can. My kids will use it shoot their first deer with. Even without the can, the recoil and blast are nonexistent.

I am of the camp that sees little advantage in short barrels on rifles. Any handiness gained by going below 22” or so exists mainly in someone’s mind. If you’re hunting in brush so thick that six inches of barrel makes a difference in how well you can get through, you’re in the wrong place. You won’t be able to see anything, much less shoot at it. I have rifles with barrels as short as 16 inches and as long as 26. Most are somewhere in the middle. I much prefer shooting the longer ones. I find even the couple of 20 inch.223’s I have to be unpleasantly loud.

We use a number of shorter barreled rifles and carbines but they need to balance right. The fact still remains: you want the bullet out of the barrel as soon as possible.

myself i prefer a longer barrel sometimes my shots are a long ways out ,yes i own some short barrel rifles but rarely ever use them. give me a 24- 26 inch barrel length rifle, the rifle i deer hunt with is a Ruger #1 in a 257 Weatherby mag and that has a 27 inch Brux barrel i have used for around 15 years. in the next week i will be sighting in my new long range rifle i had rebarreled with a Brux 28 inch ,7 1/2 twist , 257 Weatherby mag, contour # 4, which has been built to shoot Hammer 128 gr. bullets , i am all about better bullet performance for hunting .

they work,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

I have 3 Rem 600s. A 6.5 mag, a .350 mag, and a .30x.350 mag. All 3 are easy to carry and downright deadly. I have been told they are loud and put out a big fireball. Never noticed the sound but have seen the fireball at dusk. Don't matter since there is usually something to gut and drag to worry about.

George

This is the only CF hunting rifle I have, and will ever have, w/ an 18.5" Bbl.



... and it's chambered in .357 Mag.




GR

In 2020 I built (3) rifles and shot (3) deer.
The rifle pictured is a 250 savage with a 20" Bartlein barrel with 8" twist.
The rifle with bipod, sling, rear bag, scope, and ammo is 7# 14 oz.

Wimpy cartridge with short barrel killed a mule doe at 200 yards.

For shooting deer at 600 yards, I would need a longer cartridge and longer barrel....and it would weigh 10 pounds.

I've never tried a Mannlicher with a short barrel ( or any length, come to think of it). It seems the "only" carnine I shoot well are 20" bbl leverguns or M4, etc. I've tried the ruger Ultralite when it first came out (80's) and while it was fast in the woods, I couldn't hold it still enough from hunting positions. Couldn't hit a 2 liter coke bottle at 200yds, so off it went, brutal kicker too (308) Its one of the reasons I never tried the little Ruger RSI, it is gorgeous though. I "did" handle a Sako Mannlicher carbine in 308 at the Rod & Gun Club in GE as a soldier, but I wasn't 21 and the Captain would not sign for me.

Have to admit , I am a barrel chopper.
I only have one rifle left I have not cut down and it is a single shot and is 38" long and has a 24" barrel....still tempted.
For the record, the rifle I am using most is a .270 wcf and has a 19" barrel. It gives up very little, ballistically to the long tube and is better horseback and afoot than the others.If you are a mountain hunter anything that is not a carbine is an annoyance...in my book

This sums up my experience with barrels shorter than 22" very well.


Okie John

For a deer rifle it wouldn't matter one bit. They will kill.

I carry a winchester 94 trapper in 30-30 around with its 16" barrel and I love it for its tiny size and handy attributes. Also have one of those Ruger Scout rifles with the older 16" barrel and have used it in cross steep canyon clear-cut on elk, and hey it worked fine waybout there. And lastly my Ruger compact rifle in 338RCM is the best I have with its 20" barrel and it smashes things just fine with its abbreviated tube. The only downside under 20" length is muzzleblast noise is increased a good deal. I prefer the 20" length over all others for its feel and handling.

Short barrels are easier to carry.

Long barrels are good for magnums and Weatherbys.

I have two rifles which fall into the OP's comments on barrel length. The first is a Remington M660 that has been somewhat modified, mainly with a lighter synthetic stock. Barrel length is 20". I made the longest shot I've ever taken on a big bodied Nevada Mule Deer, 460 paces. Bullet was the handloaded 150 gr. Sierra, velocity unknown.

Rifle #1 is a Ruger M77 RSI with 18.5" barrel. target was an Arizona Mule Deer up in the Kaibab National forest about 250 yards out. Bullet was the 165 gr. Speer Hot Core at 2550 FPS. Dunno what it would be in the 20" M660 but when tested in a 22" Winchester M70 the velocity was 2610 FPS. I'm guessing the M660 speed falls somewhere in between the two.

Both rifles are chambered to the .308 Win. Both run about 1.0 to 1.5" with their chosen load.

I can't Speak for other copies of the RSI, but somehow I ended up with three of then cheap because their previous owners could not get any kind of decent groups from them. Turned out they were right in the short term but I was stubborn. I knew 1.5" or less might be attainable so I set that or better as the goal. It took a hair over two years to reach that level of accuracy and but some very good luck the load worked in all three rifle. Some tinkering with metal removal from the nose cap brought groups down to 1.25" most of the time with an occasional 1.0" or 1.5" but nothing worse as long as I do my part. On game, I try to get within 250 yards or closer. If conditions are perfect I might try 300 yards but that's as far asI'll got with that 165 gr. load.
Paul B.

This is the rifle I hunt with the most, a Howa .308 LW. Scope has been changed out to a Leupold 2.5-8X36 VX-3i. The original 20" barrel was very thin and the rifle had a decidedly muzzle-light balance, so I installed a McGowen Precision 20" Rem. Sporter contour, balances good now.

I like them short.

I like them long.

I shoot them all.





Sam I am.

I'm going short this year, 11.5".

I knew a fellow gun head who picked up a Sako mannlicher carbine in 375H&H for cheap several years ago.....he sold it for cheap also...

**I am no gunwriter** That said, I am interested in this topic, and have recently put together a rifle along the lines that CaptArab mentions.

I am a fan of Christensen Arms. What I tried to order a few years back, was a 16 inch Ridgeline chambered for 308 Win. I was told at the time, that it was an impossibility. Fast forward a few years and I was able to take a barreled action out of an MPR and put it in a Ridgeline stock. Now, I have what I was looking for in the beginning. I have a Silencerco Omega that makes the muzzle blast a powder puff. I have not chronographed a 150 grain soft point out of that little rifle, but I'm next to positive that it will make deer and pigs bad sick.

Do it. I think you should have at least one. I've owned a couple of Marlin and Winchester lever actions with barrels barely over 16 inches. I had a Remington Seven in 7mm-08 for a while with an 18-1/2" barrel. Those all killed stuff. The only possible negative I could see is the shorter barrel, even if heavy, doesn't have as much "hang" and in the Seven's case the thing was a bit butt-heavy. I could say the same for some 20 and even 22 inch barreled guns though.

The short barrels are louder with more blast than longer barrels. They don't necessarily make ideal long range setups 'cause you give up some otherwise "free" velocity. They're not suitable for every cartridge. But chosen carefully, they can be very very very good.

Tom

I have a lightweight .308 with a 20" barrel that works for me, but I often have a Gemtech Tracker screwed on the end.

16.5" barrel on my 44mag single shot works as well.

I agree ......... 20" is as short as I'll have. Any shorter and handling suffers.

YMMV

Had a collection of Sako mannlichers at one time, short barrels are handy!

This is where I fall in the discussion. I've had a 18.5 inch Model 7 in 260 Rem. Muzzle blast and jump was annoying so it went down the road. I've got a Ruger Hawkeye Compact 16.5 in 223. Very handy to carry but the muzzle blast is tough even in that small of a cartridge. I know where one is for sale in a 243, but I just don't want a barrel that short in a cartridge running over 40gr of powder. My Ruger M77 UL 223 with a 20 inch barrel is one of my favorite rifles.

I can do a 7X57 Mauser in a 20" with no problems because it isn't loaded in the 60,000 PSI range. I actually prefer 24" barrels or 26" depending on the cartridge.

I have a couple of 16" barreled rifles, and they work fine. They're nice to carry, that's for sure. My go-to squirrel rifle is a 16" for the carry factor and pointability in thick stuff.

I do the vast majority of my shooting with irons, though, so most of my barrels are 22-26" for longer distance accuracy with sights.

Ballistics and velocity aside, shooting 10 shots, standing, on the SR-1 target at 100 yards, with my carbines I'll usually shoot in the mid 70's, with a slightly muzzle heavy 24" rifle, I'll score in the mid 90's. That's quite an improvement.

I have a short full-stock 8X57 and a short full stock 9.3X57. Both of them at about 19".

I also have a 16" AR15 in 6.8SPC My 30-06 "Scout carbine" is made with a 19" barrel. And my Mossberg MVP 308 is made with an 18" barrel. I like them all. But I also have rifles with far longer barrels and I like them too.

One that's the best of both worlds is my Ruger #1 with a 22" barrel but a very short action making the gun short despite the fact it's got an average length barrel.

I have two 20” barreled 700’s in 30/06 and made the mistake of shooting a coyote with one of them from an enclosed blind with no hearing protection. Never again. Ouch.
I now keep my amplifying earmuffs on my thigh until the last half hour or so of shooting light. Then I’ll either put them on just above my ears or turn them on and put them on my ears.

This is why I've been selling things off to fund a handful of hunting rifles with suppressors and short barrels. My ears are more sissified than my shoulder.

A 22" barreled 308-based round in a bolt gun will seldom give me problems. A 22" short-magnum has, on a few occasions. A 20" lever gun in 30-30 or .35R also doesn't seem so bad, due to the lower pressure, like JWP mentions above. I've noticed that same effect with centerfire youth or reduced-recoil loads. They aren't ear ringers, even in 20" barrels. Full-house loads can bump things up to a more notable level. That's why I don't encourage anything shorter than a 20" for a kid's gun. It might be fine with lower-power loads with that 16-18" tube, but it'll be blasty if they move up to full power loads. 21"-22" is actually a good spot for a kid's bolt gun in something burning 40-45gr of powder.

Thanks so much guys. The cartridge is the 6mm and I feel some don't think it matters but JPro brings up some good points. I don't do loud very well and anything less than 20 feels awkward in my hands but I'm 6'2 1/2" and weigh 295lbs. A gun has to have some heft to it for it to feel right in my hands. Thanks a bunch guys, powdr

Powdr, I didn't read the entire thread, but shorter than 20" does get a mite loud. My Remington .308 carbine had an 18.5" barrel and it did work well for a tree stand one and done deer rifle. My 24" 7mm RM barrel hits near everything as a tree stand gun, but was ideal out west. I like about a 20" myself though it would depend a lot on the cartridge and what you intend to do with the rifle. Guys get pretty hung up on barrel length and velocity and with a chronograph it would be one more thing to mess with. I don't own one so for me it doesn't matter as much as what I intend to do with the rifle.

A 6mm might be okay in that 18 1/2 barrel, but I bet it will get a touch loud.

Be a handy booger though.

What are your intended plans for it?

Got a little Ruger RSI in 243 with a 18.5 inch barrel. Very handy little rifle that points very well. Don't get all the hoopla about muzzle blast. I don't find it to be a problem at all. At least not in 243.

I find 19” to 21” on a short action to be about right and really like a 23” on a long action.
Magnums usually get a 24”.

I shoot a Remington 760 Carbine in 30-06 with an 18 & 1/2 inch barrel, it's been my favorite deer rifle since 1979.
Fantastic stalking and treestand gun, it comes up to the shoulder and points like a fine custom shotgun and is excellent in tight quarters like the thick brush in the northeast where I hunt.

I don't much get it about the muzzle blast either, at the range I use ear protection and other than that, it's a shot or 2 at a deer and I don't seem to notice muzzle blast or recoil when I shoot a deer.

Probably my only complaint, like 260Remguy mentioned earlier is the muzzle flash shooting a deer at dawn or dusk, it's about 3 feet long and blinds you for a second but I can live with it.

Mine isn't bad either. Have shot other 20-22" guns that seemed louder but my Carbine '06 isn't all that bad.

Very nice looking Carbine too!

I tried that too, MPR to Ridgeline (in my case McMillan) stock, bought new BDL bottom metal, magazine, etc...found out it won't feed. CA tells me that MPR does not have internal feed rails and will never feed with my BDL set up. Just last week ordered DBM bottom metal with M5 inlet, off to smith this week for fitting. Hope it works!

Barrels ain't hard to chop and thread.
I send mine to LRI, but any competent Smith can do it.

LRI has a 5 axis, so they can do weird stuff like #1s and T/C single shots too.

A hot 147 ELDM out of a 16" Creed will make it nearly 600 yards before dipping below 1800fps.

16" is really all ya need for typical hunting.
If no can, might as well go ~20"

We have the same gun in 308

The shorter the barrel the closer the muzzle blast is to your ears and face--that's simple physics. Usually it translates into greater perceived muzzle blast, and I think it can contribute to flinching or anticipating the shot. My observation is this may be especially true with youngsters first starting out on centerfires. I have a 25" bbl 270 and several 22" bbl 270's. Same bullet and powder are a bit louder with the 22". And I wear plugs AND muffs at the range.

It must have been a thing in the 90's, because twice I guided clients with short barreled 300 Wthby's. A guy hasn't lived until he experiences the muzzle blast of a 20" bbl 300 Wthby....

Truth.

I watched a youngster shoot a rather short barreled 243 and it didn't kick him hard but he was greatly put off by the blast. It was bad. Yes, he had hearing protection.

It wouldn't surprise me if he developed a long lasting flinch.


Forgot to mention not only is the muzzle closer, the exit pressure is higher too. Double whammy.

Those are just nasty in general. A friend of mine has a 300 Weatherby with a muzzle brake on it, and it makes my teeth hurt standing 10 feet behind him when he touches that thing off.

Try being a couple of benches to the side of a 30-378 with a Swiss cheese muzzle brake.

Hard pass. 😬

I quit shooting at the nearest range to me because guys shooting muzzle brake fitted .950 SuperExploder Magnums was becoming more and more common, and that range has concrete overhead baffles. Hard to focus when your boots are getting blown off your feet every 10 seconds.

I was next to a 338 Lapua with a shark gill brake and it was quite pleasant compared to the 30-378.

Short barrels suck, end of story. Mb

I'm not entirely sure about that. These were shot from a 16" barrel Henry carbine with open sights at 50yds. It isn't unpleasantly loud out in the field, and it's easy handling in thick spots. It does make a pretty good flash in low light, though.

Powder, the OP asked for "thoughts on short barreled hunting rifles". I expressed mine you don't have to like it , got it? Mb

Below is a lineup I had over 30 years ago - from top to bottom, 1957 Savage 99 EG 24” 308 Win, Ruger 77 RS 19” bbl. 358 Win, Ruger 77 RSI 18.5” 7x57, Ruger 77 RSI 18.5” 250 Savage, Ruger 77/22 20” 22lr.

Brought the show and tell to point out I’m obviously not averse to carbines, but I was also younger then. Now I value my hearing as much as I should have then, and no longer own a carbine anything. In fact, the last short barreled rifle I had was a 21” M70 30-06 I built in 2004, and that’s as short as I’d ever go with any cartridge, barring the 22lr.

You sound unsure of yourself, señor Roberto.

Sort of fail to see how cloverleafing with irons qualifies as sucking, though 🤔 Not sure I got whatever point you were trying to make with that magnificently eloquent post, beyond maybe instigation.

Those full length stock 77s are pretty. How "blasty" was that 358? I'm sort of kicking around the idea of building a shorter (18-20" barrel) 35 cal on a Savage 99 one of these days.

The shorter the better

I have never owned a short barrel rifle but as most of us I shoot what I prefer.

Not unsure at all both my m94 Marlins precrossbolt models in 357 and 44 easily shoot at 50 yds like that with select loads of course. Like Brad said I value what little hearing I have left. I have a right to my opinion and short barrels suck. Got it? Powdr solicited our opinions he didn't ask for a bunch of head nodding and jumping on the [bleep] wagon to be part of the crowd. I think short barrels suck got it? Mb

Great minds think alike That's a cut down Howa mini in the scabbard. 16 1/4" barrel is very handy and the Grendel performs great in a short barrel.

Not sure I got it, maybe you should keep asking.

I have a Model 70 with a 18" barrel i a full length stock I really like, even with a bit of muzzle blast and extra recoil. My only other short barreled "rifle" is a Comtemder with a carbine stock and 14" .44 mag barrel- but I have a suppressor on that one that reduces both blast and recoil - especially with sub-sonic loads. My favorite "hog rifle".

Mike Holmes

Nice Bike, nice rifle!

Never been a fan of short barrels but I'm tall with long arms so barrels or 24"+ seem normal to me. I like 24' for non-mags and 26" for small bore mags, 24" for anything over 7mm. The primary thing I notice with short barrels is the balance is to the rear of the rifle and the barrel tends to float, not settle on the target as quickly. If I were going short for a box stand type rifle a Ruger #1 RSI would be my first choice, short action, traditional barrel.

i only hunt with carbines. pumps, bolts and levers from 16.5" to 19.5" in 30/30, 35 rem, 350 mag, 35 whelen, 45/70, 450 marlin, 30/06 and 308. i like the handling and maneuverability in the thick stuff i hunt in PA. muzzle blast is not as bad as it would seem since i wear powered muffs even when stand hunting.

My kids shoot the following and have routinely taken game from 100-300 yards. Coyotes to Elk.


16.25" Ruger Compact .243




16.25" Ruger Frontier 7mm-08





18.5" Remington 700 .243




I don't see the velocity loss as an issue within typical ranges, even on bigger game. I will say that I had a Ruger Compact in 7mm-08 identical to the .243 in the pic and it was a jumpy miserable SOB to shoot. The Frontier has a much heavier barrel and is very pleasant with a warm 140 grain accubond load.

Looks like your kids know what they're doing, and I sure wouldn't want them shooting at me! Nice stuff Med, love the pics.

It is a balancing act for me.
I like short barrels, I won't muzzle break a barrel, it must be a chambering that works with a 22" barrel( max) under 8 lbs and capable for Elk and Bighorns.
After trying some of the newer short/ fats , migrated back to the .270 wcf. It meets all the criteria, so does the .280 and 30/06.
A carbine style rifle is a must, climbing with both hands free and the rifle across my back. It must be 300 yards capable and trouble free.
Back to the future ...

Any idea what the muzzle diameter is on the 2 stubby Rugers?

I am wondering if there is enough meat there for threading.

Relatively short rifles are great - I've gone to a .375 WSM 20" for a large portion of my hunting, and while I'm giving up about 100 ft/s by doing so, I don't miss it. I can still hit the classic 2450 with a 300gr, and that's good enough. The weight reduction and improved balance are well worth it.

For the most part we have an over abundance of speed and power. Relatively few shoot irons anymore to utilize the longer sighting radius. So it really comes down to what you like and feel works best for you.

The stainless compact is .526"
The Frontier is .629"

Nope, 16 inch barreled AR type house guns, hearing and blast will be the last on ones mind if they're employed, nothing shorter than 22 inches for standard hunting rifles, save one 20 inch M-94 30-30.

My favorite rounds are 7mm-08, 30-30, 338-06, 308 etc. I've used everything from 18" to 24 " and my favorite rifle right now is a 20" 7mm-08. I also have a new to me 7mm-08 with a 24" tube and after I carry it a few times may become my favorite. For me, how does it carry, handle and balance. The best ever was a 24" Weatherby SBGM in 338-06, a precursor to the ULW but in 338-06 had a modified #2 barrel. 30-30's and lever guns, 18-20 seem to be the sweet spot.

I had a 7600 carbine in 30-06 for a couple of years, never liked the handling.

Muzzle blast and flash could be a deterent but never seemed to have an issue with either. In my typical hunting areas, velocity loss is not an issue, 99% of the shots are under 150 yards

I've had a few short barreled rifles including a few lever rifles. I have a 358 Win Remington 700 that has a short barrel and I wouldn't be afraid of using it on most anything in the lower 48, same with my short barreled Marlin 45-70.

I like my short barrel rifles and I hope you do too. I do not think I have had an issue/problem with a longer barreled rifle either - even in thick woods. It's not like the barrel is going to hit tree branches, it's the short barreled rifles seem to me to get on target a little faster.

I just got back from a Wyoming hunt and the cow I shot was at 350 yards. I'm glad I didn't have a 18 inch barrel on my 270. I had no idea what the forest or open range would look like until I saw what I wanted to shoot. I had the drop figured out by a shooting ap on my phone, but the wind was something else. I didn't know the MPH of wind and had to guess. The velocity drop with a short barrel might have come into play.

To me a short barreled rifle is a "specialty" rifle, that is for a definite purpose. Good luck.

And if you don't have enough speed and power with a short barrel, just go to a bigger case and get it. With the advent of magnum propellants like Rl16 that will burn completely in a very short barrel, you don't even get a big fireball.

I like the looks of the Ruger Frontier rifles, but the muzzle blast would turn me away from buying one

I bought my son and daughter Howa Alpines in 6.5 Creed and 7mm-08. To be honest I absolutely detest the 20" barrels on these guns. For starters the balance to me sucks, the muzzle rise on both is a bit much for the cartridges, they are louder than they should be and the velocity loss with both bothers me. I would be much happier with a 22-23" tube.

I have a R700 Varmint in 308 that I cut back to 20". Besides the improved accuracy that balance on it is incredible.

I've been hunting with a centerfire rifles since 1968.....started out with a Mauser 98 8mm Mauser carbine after that year took it to Metal Shop and cut it to 18" all the hunters in camp including my Dad just shook there head at me....
I've only owned one rifle that I hunted with that the barrel wasn't cut down a Weatherby 300 at 26"......if I use it to hunt with the barrel is cut shorter....
Wife has a Browning BAR 7mm Rem Mag its a Belgium rifle came from Browning with a 20" barrel it has shot a train car load of game animals....I even had to cut the butt stock down to 12.5" because she is a small woman just 5'-0"....

Do them a favor....get them a suppressor. Solves all sorts of kid problems.

Ruger Hawkeye Compact, never seen one that wasn’t a tack driver

The difference between 20" and 22" in 7-08 shooting 120TSX/V-Max is 50FPS. 3000fps via R-15 in a 20" Vanguard Youth and a SS M7. 3050fps from a 22" Kimber MT, Rem Mt Guide, and M70 Ranger. Gotta be an awful long ways away before 50FPS makes the difference between a hit and a miss. Doesn't even gain you 50yds of effective range if you subscribe to 1800fps minimum impact velocity.

My present favorite short barreled hunting rifle…



It has taken a couple mountain lions and some small game. Chambered in .223 and cut to 16.25”.

I have a 21” 7-30 Waters Barrel that May get the same treatment. Too light and whippy for shooting very far unsupported by a dream to pack and would work well from a stand.

A bit over 18", but then it was built for the 'can'....

I like short barreled carbines while hunting out of a portable climbing deer stands.

I had shoulder surgery back in November of 2020, so recoil is an issue.

Here's a T/C Encore 20" barrel in 25-45 Sharps (25-223). Loaded long I'm getting 2,720 fps with an old school Rem 100 gr Core-lokt.

Perfect for southern deer.

In the 7mm-08 I am running the 120TTSX. I'm getting 2900 fps with RL17 and that's very close to max. The 6.5 creed is shooting Hornday 120gr GMX factory loads at 2725. To me the 7mm is about 100 fps short of what it should be and the 6.5 is 150fps off. Does this matter? Not really, but it does drive my old nuts.

The kids are using these guns primarily in the mountains and they are packing them all day by themselves. As such the added weight of a suppressor just isn't desirable. I am outfitting their prarie dog guns with suppressors in the near future.

Picked up a Savage Axxis 2, chambered in 350 Legend.... 18.5 inch Predator contour barrel..

its awfully handy in things like Brush....

Loaning it to a handicapped friend who will be road hunting with it, as a passenger in his brother's truck...
due to his lack of mobility, supposedly he is legal road hunting...

I'm using 16 inch barrels on bolt and autos in 5.56 (mostly with a can) to kill deer and hogs. I really like shorter guns but the blast may be too much for some without cans...

I prefer a shorter tube for my hunting. for positional shooting, back packing and especially horseback.
I am not a shotgunner, so balance, swinging into shooting position means little to me.As a matter of fact, although I am over 6' , I even shorten l.o.p. on most of my hunting rifles.
I seldom see idealic shooting conditions, I shoot off a backpack, a stump or what ever aid I can find.
Shorter barrels are more inclined to be more accurate....Benchrest rifles have short heavy tubes.

I have a 6.5 PRC that i shot the barrel out of, was at my local gunsmith yesterday, we put a 18" barrel and 1 of my cans on it, shot it this morning, about 1/2" AT 100 yrds, and about 3" at 500 yrds, and it handles real well with good balance, that's good enough for anything i will use it for. Rio7

16" 358 shoots 180 Barnes ttsx into one big hole

I only have two cf bolt guns with barrels shorter than 20". My AR's all have 16.0" barrels.

The first is an 18.5" M600 Remington in .243. It is the last of my rifles for getting folks started in deer hunting. Muzzle blst is not too bad. Performance has been excellent which I partially credit to the reduced velocity of my 100 grain handloads which get around 2750 fps. It had a companion M880 Mossberg I had cut to 19". Same same.

The second is a Ruger Scout rifle in .308 Win. I sold my first, 16.5" one to a friend. He loves it. I prefer a little more tube as I like 2700fps+ with 150's out of a .308 Win.. The 18.3 with the brake is not bad for recoil but I take it off to hunt. I am planning on a can for this or I likely wouldn't own it. It is handy for a tight cover gun.

Frankly, for most uses a .30-06 with a 22 In barrel is my favorite. I can manage it in heavy woods and thwy are good to 300 yards easily. About the farthest away I will start shooting.

On hunting rifles, without a suppressor, 20 inches is my limit and I wear hearing protection every time I shoot anything. I have a couple of rifles with shorter barrels like a Marlin Marauder in 35 Remington with a barrel a little over 16 inches that I might shoot at the range, but I'll double up on the hearing protection.

To me it's just not worth putting up with the increase in blast and loosing a couple of inches in barrel length just doesn't make the rifle that much more handy.

Get it and shoot it suppressed, you’ll most likely love it.
Have a 19” 308, and actually chopped a 6.5 creed, 6.5 SAUM, and 300 WSM to 20” - i shoot all of them suppressed.

And PS, if you’re looking at a 18.5” Fieldcraft and don’t want it, I’ll call dibs on buying it!

Short = loud. Larger bores, faster powders and charges under mid thirty grains all seem to have less blast.

I don't really notice an advantage to short barreled carbines in the woods. 22" is short enough.

Just curious what kind of velocity your getting and what you're seeing for "on-game" results? Cool little rifle!

I have tried a few and don't like how loud they are.
I agree with urbaneruralite, don't see any advantage of shorter than 22" in the woods.

I'm with the 22" crowd. I've got sissy ears.

Lately I've put a fair number of rounds through an 18.5" 6.5 CM Sig Cross as well as a 22" 6.5 CM Fieldcraft. I wear cheap ear plugs and muffs on top while shooting. The difference in the 18.5" and 22" is very noticeable to me.

I shoot 22", 21", and an 18" .223AI's. I can't tell a difference between 22 and 21.....18" is noticeable. Same for me on the 16" AR's.

I shoot a 21" .358 along side a 22" .308. Neither are bad but the .358 actually seems a tad bit milder on the noise. Expansion ratio, etc....

Kinda think anything under 20" should be suppressed for me. I really am a candy-azz regarding my ears.

Same here I detest the blast from short barreled rifles in high intensity chamberings

It's often apparent just how "right" a 22" short action sporter bolt gun is, as a jack of all trades. Not really cumbersome, but also not too blasty.

Mac I haven't chrono'd this rifle. Figure it doesn't really matter for what I would do with it.

Only game I've killed with this rifle is this years bear. Two shots, holes 2" apart on the entry side, same exit hole about 2". Bear went about 5 yards.

I can't understand the desire to shoot a rifle without a suppressor...and a 16.5" tube just makes the gun handier with the can.

Shot a deer Monday with this 20" Krieger barrel in 260 with a 3.1" chamber.

I sighted it in, and it shot a 1/2" (3) shot group at 100 yards.

That is the third rifle the barrel has been on. It started out as a #4 taper. I re tapered it to #2b and shortened both ends and cut new threads.

False. You have to shoot a long barrel for accuracy.

LOL

In my experience, short barrels are too loud, have too much muzzle blast, and are usually harder to shoot off-hand because they don't have enough forward balance.

These tradeoffs just aren't worth it. IMO a graphite stocked 24" barreled bolt gun with a sporter weight or slightly thinner barrel might be just the right porridge for me. Maybe 7-7.5 pounds all up with a light 4x32 on it.

There's good reason about seven pounds and 24" is considered 'standard' in a bolt action hunting rifle. I could go a bit lighter if the balance is still a bit forward, but still want the barrel length. Certainly nothing shorter than 22".

Can run around in the woods all day chasing grouse with a 26" barreled 20 gauge 870 pump thinking it's short, quick and handy. But a 24" rifle is too long and too slow in the same bush?

Very sensible response......

I don't have any problems with short barreled rifles. Yesterday morning....17.7" barrel:

Since most use scopes today I don't see the "quicker acquisition of sights"

19" 6.5x55 and it balances pretty perfectly. I don't find the muzzle blast bad at all with just plugs in.

Pugs is right on that count. I fired that rifle where that pic was taken (I had to step back so my mug wouldn't wreck the pic) and it fights way outside its weight class, in terms of handling and muzzle blast (and accuracy too, I presume, as we were only shooting steel swingers).

Simple solution to the conundrum of length vs. performance: switch to a single shot. The lack of action length allows a much longer barrel on a rifle the same length as a bolt gun with a short barrel. Example: a pre-64 Model 70 '06 with 24" barrel is 44 3/4" long overall, my Browning Low Wall .223 with 24" barrel is 39 3/4" overall. I would have to fit a 19" barrel to the M70 to bring its length in line with the Browning. Conversely, I could fit a 29" barrel to the Browning and still be the same OAL as the M70.

Pugs;
Good morning to you sir, I trust all is going according to plan thus far today and all in your world are well.

Thanks so much for posting the photo of one of my favorite rifles ever to appear on our cyber 'Fire. The lines on it to me are "just right" and I'm guessing it'd be as close to the proverbial magic wand for hunting the mountains behind my house as it is in your part of the world.

As we've discussed before too, I'm making a fairly educated guess thinking that, as we've been fooling with carbines in that chambering for close to 40 years here.

This is the 1903 Carl Gustav 96 which I reworked for my late father in the early '80's, which was passed down to our eldest daughter who continues to hunt with it today.



That one has a 20" barrel and since we load it to 96 pressures it's very well behaved to shoot. I was so impressed how it worked on local mulie and whitetail bucks that I unscrewed the .270 barrel from my walking around rifle and had a 21" Swede military barrel grafted onto it, which isn't a frugal, practical or logical thing to do with a 98 action, nonetheless that's what I did.



She's been running 130gr TSX in her carbine and we've yet to catch one. All the bucks she's shot have needed exactly one bullet too. My 6.5x55 has accounted for 3 local mulie bucks since I had it done, that took a pair of 120gr TTSX and one 120gr GMX to accomplish by the way.

Anyways to the OP, we've been playing with short barreled hunting rifles both on the Saskatchewan prairies and in the BC mountains for close to 40 years now. I believe if we thought they were a handicap in the applications we've used them for, we likely would have stopped but as always there's a lot of skidder trails and logging roads headed towards Mecca.

All the best to you Pugs, thanks again and Happy Thanksgiving.

Dwayne

A rifle that has a small cartridge and a large bore makes more sense to me than a rifle with a large case and small bore. For instance, a 358 Win with a short barrel seems more logical to me than a 243 with a short barrel or to a further extreme; a 300 blackout with a short barrel makes more sense to me than a 264 Win with a short barrel. It's all about expansion ratio...

I really liked Remington 600 308's and I had maybe a half dozen of them, others wanted them when they shot them and they didn't want to let them go. I didn't much care for a short bull barrel 22-250 I had - it was very accurate, but the blast was not so nice.

I have 44 magnum Marlin with a fairly short barrel and I like it.

Bugger;
Morning sir, I trust the day's behaving for you and you're all well.

Regarding your short barreled Marlin in .44 mag, I've had a bit of a thing for carbine length lever guns since I was a kid and my buddy's dad had a '92 in .44-40 that we'd handle and drool over.

Up here while we can't be trusted taking our handguns anywhere besides a range, thus far they'll allow short barreled rifles and shotguns as long as they're manually operated.

A buddy just bought one of these in .44 magnum, but I've not shot it.

[Linked Image]

It's a 12" barrel so I'm guessing it'll be more "barky" than my off season truck gun which is a 16" .357.



While they are certainly short barreled and rifled, I don't really consider them for hunting though they surely could to that in a pinch I suppose.

All the best to you all and Happy Thanksgiving.

Dwayne

Man, I bet that thing carries slick. I've got a 16" Henry carbine in 327 Fed, and as nice as it is for brush, I've thought to myself several times I bet it'd be even better carrying if the barrel was about 10-12".

zcm82:
Morning sir, hope you're well and the day is behaving for you.

The buddy in question works in a placer mine in the middle of nowhere Yukon when it's not frozen solid. It's meant to live with him on the machines he runs as they are in grizzly, black bear and wolf territory.

The Yukon by the way, has perhaps 43,000 people in total, with 24,000 of those living in Whitehorse, so it makes Alaska look like downtown and crowded on a good day and if one has wildlife issues one will either deal with them yourself or become a statistic.

There are Conservation Officers for sure, but by the time the sat phone reaches them and they charter a helicopter - if there's no forest fires using them all that morning - well you get the picture sir...

I'm interested to see how barky it'll be for sure, but I suspect that they're usually wearing ear PPE or have it close by on the machines.

From folks I know and trust who work up there, while it doesn't happen often, every once in awhile they have to deal with a problem animal that just won't listen to reason.

One seldom hears about it in the media however, since all mining and most logging and even exploration companies have an extensive assortment of track hoes, back hoes, etc.

All the best and Happy Thanksgiving.

Dwayne

Thanks as always Dwayne for your considerate and thoughtful posts. Gnoahhh (Gary) and I are headed out for the MD Saturday opener to western MD and I'll enjoy carrying it around the woods. With any luck a deer won't show up and get shot and ruin the trip but if it has to it has to.

Fireball- That is one rifle that would work super well over track and trail!

Yeah, pesky deers ruining an otherwise perfect day in the woods!

Dwayne, would that all the denizens of the Campfire were as glad-minded as you are!

I'll be guarding the trees with either a Ruger 1A 6.5x55 or Browning Low Wall .223. I'll make the final decision that morning as I'm lacing up my boots.