Been disassembling PPU ball ammo, to harvest the brass, ahead of a reloading project.

Rifle is a 6.5x55mm Ruger Hawkeye African 24"/1:8 Bbl., currently aperture sighted.


Tentative powder/primer selection is IMR 4831/CCI 200 respectively. (recommended, and is also used for the .270 Win/150 gr. load)

Bullets are .264/140 gr. Speer Grand Slam (current production), w/ an eye out for some of the new .264/130 gr. Barnes TSX-BT.


So, two basic loads.


Would like these loads to be at or near .30-06/M2 pressure - 50K CUP/60K PSI, a/o 2800 fps at the muzzle.

Hodgdon Reloading Data Center says 46.3 gr. of this powder will yield 2700 fps, remaining w/in the anemic SAAMI spec of 46K CUP/51K PSI for this cartridge.

Figure (extrapolate) ~ 48 gr. should yield ~ 2800 fps, and still be under the 50K CUP/60K PSI limit.


Would start the ladder at ~ 46 gr., chrono'ing above maybe 47.5 gr. and paying a little attn. to group size.

Figure the 130 gr. TSX would used the same final charge, albeit w/ a different velocity.


Questions/Comments/Concerns appreciated.




GR

With my swede, I let the chronograph dictate where to stop. That should get you in the ballpark.


If you are set on a certain pressure, then you need to get a pressure measuring system.

Murphy doesn't sleep and there exceptions to every rule.

Have been using 140s with around 50.0 grains of Ramshot Magnum for years--and in the 21" Lilja barrel of my custom FN Mauser (which has a 1-8 Lilja barrel with a shorter custom chamber throat) they average right around 2700 fps. Might get as much as 2800 in longer shorter-throat barrels.

Ramshot's data lists maximum charges between 49.4 and 50.7 grains of Magnum with various 140-grain bullets, at pressures around 55,000 PSI--but velocities in the 2600-2650 range from a 24" barrel. Based on those numbers, am guessing their test-barrel has a somewhat longer throat, probably the SAAMI standard of a tapered throat .56 inch long.

One of the more interesting hunting stories about my rifle (rebarreled by Charlie Sisk) is the first animal I took with it was a pretty decent Montana whitetail buck, at around 35 yards--not unusual on Montana riverbottoms Reported it on the Campfire, and some guy postedsomething like: "Only 35 yards? You're not much of a hunter, are you?"

I hope you put him on Ignore.

I shoot 127g Barnes long range at 3150 out of a custom 700, 26", 8T using R#26 and cci 250 primers.

Tell him most of the time you like to slap the bucks on the hind with your hand to get them running, THEN shoot them at 35 yards or so

I am interested in the Swede, but have had so much good luck with the 6.5CM, it may be just a duplication of performance.

2800 or so w/ the GS 140's will be an honest 350 yd rifle w/ a MPBR(6") and top-of-the-back hold.

Same w/ the 130 gr. TSX startin' at ~ 2900.


Would settle for 2700/300 yards (2800 for the 130's), but that would be a bare minimum.

IMR 4831 should do it, no sweat.




GR

Pretty much--and 6.5 Creedmoors have far more consistent chamber throats. Which is partly why there's a LOT more pressure-tested (and consistent) data for 6.5 CMs these days.

RL-26 brings some interesting possibilities to the bench... but prefer a single-base powder and a more adequate ballistic envelope for this one.

Did a work-up on the .270 Win./150 gr. ABLR using RL-26... and came up w/ a 650 yd. huntin' rifle out of a 22" Bbl.

Woof.




GR

The potential problem with RL-26, as I have mentioned here and there, is that is was NOT designed as a temperature-resistant powder. Instead it happened to be pretty temp-resistant, but in my tests at Fahrenheit temperatures from zero to 80, it has not been nearly as consistant as RL-16 or RL-23, which were designed to be very temp-resistant.

Worked up a .270 Winchester load with 26 at around 65-70 degrees, then tested it from zero to 80. It varied enough in velocity to change POI 1.5 inches at 100 yards, which means around 6 inches at 400. I much prefer the consistency of more temp-resistent powders, whether other Reloder powders, Hodgdon Extremes, IMR Endurons or Vihtavuori.

SAAMI screwin' the cartridge, instead of givin' it its modern due, is a travesty.

The 6.5CM is a modern and efficient cartridge, but loaded to its strength, the Swede will leave it behind in the field.




GR

The older I get... the longer a 400 yard shot seems to be.

8>)

Probably hard to beat H4831.




GR

Bullschidt. The difference in powder capacity is only 6-8%, depending on brass thickness. Because velocities at the SAME pressures only increase (or decrease) at 1/4 the rate of powder capacity, the difference in potential muzzle velocity between the 6.5 CM and 6.5x55 is about 1.5-2%.

At velocities around 2700 fps this means about 50 fps at most, given the same pressure and barrel length. With loads around 3000 fps the difference "increases" to about 60 fps.

50-60 fps is about much velocity as such loads will lose in the first 50 yards-- Please explain how this means the Swede will leave the 6.5 Creedmoor behind in the field, especially since the difference at the muzzle will be even less at longer ranges.

Why, because I'll take the Swede, of course.

Classy cartridge.




GR

Gee, I've been shooting at least one 6.5x55 for 30 years. But also have used the 6.5 Creedmoor and .260 Remington, which do the same things. So far none of the animals have been impressed with the extra "class" of the Swede.

Might also mention that even though almost everybody in America calls it the 6.5x55 "the Swede," it was co-developed by the then Combined Kingdoms of Norway and Sweden, so both their armies could use the same round. This is why the round became known as the "Swedish Mauser" in the U.S.--far more Mausers showed up here than Norwegian Krags.

At least one(1.0) was apparently enough for SAAMI.

One would have thought they were sellin'em at the CMP.


Have heard that ~ 2700 fps is about all the 6.5CM likes to shoot in a 140 gr., which should put the spread closer to 100 fps.

And even that won't change the taste of the meat.

But it will help out a little bit on iffy range shots w/ an aperture sighted rifle.

... classy not w/standing.




GR

Are you happy w/ 2700 fps/140 gr. for this cartridge, 55K psi bein' the CIP max.?

As stated, 2700 fps is the book max. from Hodgdon/IMR 4831/51K psi/24" Bbl..

Still a solid 300 yd. cartridge.

Don't have your weather, though, but understand the desire RE: temp. stable powder.




GR

I used Magnum rather than Hunter because Ramshot's data listed higher velocities with Magnum. Am very happy with 2700 fps from a 21" barrel--and the pressure of the charge I use, 50.0 grains, would be more than the 54,800 PSI listed in the Ramshot data for the 140 Nosler Partition with 48.0 grains.

SAAMI cannot list "modern" pressures with such older cartridges because chamber throat-length and action strength various so much in older rifles, especially compared to modern rifles, which tend to have much shorter throats than older rifles. (This is also true of the 7x57--which was not only chambered in earlier Mausers than the K98 but in Remington Rolling Blocks.)

Have found 2700 fps or so fine for shooting big game at over 400 yards, when using bullets with a reasonably high-BC--and the "advanced" military load for the 6.5x55 (introduced by Sweden in 1941) was a 139-grain boattail spitzer at a listed 800 meters-per-second--around 2625 fps--from a 29-inch barrel. It was considered one of the better sniper rounds of the day, despite muzzle velocity being limited by the powders available.

Also used Magnum rather than Hunter due to finding it more temperature-stable, especially when used in a somewhat compressed load, such as 50 grains with 140s in the 6.5x55.

When Finn Aagaard wrote about the 6.5x55, he refused to call it "Swedish."


Okie John

My M70 Sporter shoot's great with Accubonds and H4831.

Sorry John, class matters. As for Swedish vs Norwegian, we know where your particular bias stems from and it is forgiven, but did you ever hear of anyone bragging (or fantasizing) about spending a weekend with Norwegian twins? Swedish…

The two bullets I’ve used most in my Sako are the 130 AB and, recently, the 130 SGK HPBT. Both shoot bugholes. Both kill deer dedernhell (out to 400 yards) at the 2700 fps I’ve been happy to run them at with 4831 or 4350. (Hodgdons).

Before I invested a lot of time and money in monometels, for a 2700 - 2800 fps cartridge I’d try that SGK. Easy accuracy and it’s reputed by Sierra to be a “hard” bullet. My own limited experience killing deer with it seems to confirm the expansion characteristics of hollow point bullets I read a description of in a book I just received from some obscure publishing house in Montana of all places. Don’t have it in front of me at the moment but it’s gun something III, gun puke, gun guts…can’t recall at the moment but it ain’t a bad book.

To the contrary, getting that close is indicative of a good hunter.

DF

Loads I developed in 2014 in a Forbes rifle.

"Forbes 24B 24" barrel

Shooting 140 Berger VLD's in the 6.5x55 and burning RL26 OAL 3.150

50.0 grains .... 2,794
51.0 grains .... 2,856
52.0 grains .... 2,914

No "classic" signs of pressure, easy extraction.

RL 23 and 140 Berger VLD's

I shot one load of 47.0 grains for an average of 2,750."

Now that's funny. Typical.

I imagine I'll get raked over the coals for this question, but is there a reason we have 3 different loads for the 45-70, but not these other old but newer cartridges.

Curious, how is the Swede M-96/38 for heavier loads?

Garandimal;
Good morning to you sir, I hope that this blustery Friday finds you well.

In answering your query about reloads for the Swede, I had to dig into my reloading notes which I thought would give me some more precise data.

It appears that I started loading for the 6.5 SE in early June '87, but since I had no chronograph back then can only say that in the 96 military rifle I'd modified for my father with a 20" barrel the first load was 41gr H380 and 140gr Partitions.

Back then I was going through a bit of a "need for speed" phase and we then tried 120gr Nolser Solid Base and 120gr Sierra Pro Hunter bullets on local bucks before settling back into 129gr Hornady Spires, though I see some loads for 140gr Hornady Spires too.

When Dad's health declined, he stopped hunting and the rifle was passed onto our eldest daughter. In 2007 when she started hunting with it I loaded 48gr H4831, 130gr TSX, CCI 200 for 2658fps and that's still what she hunts with today.

With that load she's taken about 8? local mulie and whitetail bucks. We don't have a range finder but some of the shots seemed like an awfully long walk to get to the downed buck. One particular mulie stands out in my mind as I asked her at least twice if she wanted to get closer, but she said her rest was solid and as it turned out is was, as the buck made two shaky steps and collapsed.

I'll note we've never "caught" a 130gr TSX yet from her Swede and usually we'll aim to break one or both scapula. That long shot across a wide draw broke a rib going in and then hit the knuckle connecting the scapula and ulna I believe it is before sailing out onto the BC mountainside behind it.

I was impressed...

Actually more than a little impressed as a year later I unscrewed the .270 barrel on my walking around rifle built on a 98 action and had a near new Swede military barrel installed. I'll note I was looking for the deep grooves and 1:7.8" twist they had, but it wasn't the cheap way to make a Swede on a 98 for sure.

With the 98 action rifle I've got a 21" barrel and have been able to hit 2750fps with the 127gr LRX, but with just okay accuracy.

For a couple years I inexplicably quit chronographing some load development and was shooting 120gr TTSX, 49gr IMR 4831, CCI200 and Lapua cases which shot well but ended up wrecking the cases so that load is too hot in my rifle.

Then life happened and IMR4831 became unobtainium up here as did most Barnes bullets, so my current load is 120gr GMX, 44gr VV-N550, CCI 200 and Lapua cases for 2950fps. I've only killed one local mulie with that load and was pleased that the bullet opened up despite being one of those freak instances where it entered and exited without touching ribs. This buck was just shifting gears from trotting to their mulie bounce when I connected. He was visibly rocked when it hit him, taking about 4-5 more steps forward, then backing down the mountain for about that many steps before collapsing.

As to how either of our Swedes would do for really long range hunting I'd be guessing, but as mentioned at least a couple which our daughter hit had to be pushing or exceeding 300yds and they worked well.

Hopefully that was useful for you despite it being a small sampling of rifles, loads and field results.

All the best with your Swede whichever way you proceed.

Dwayne

Dwayne,

One of the most accurate 6.5x55s I've ever owned (and which I sold after building my present custom FN Mauser) was a Ruger 77 Mark II. The load I eventually settled on with it was 49.0 grains of Reloder 19 and the 120-grain X-Bullet, pre-TSX with out the grooved shank. This was just before Randy Brooks introduced the TSX, but I'd found that that era of X-Bullets were very accurate--though they still tended to foul the bore. Randy told me that was because Barnes was finally getting really consistent-quality copper, because they could afford it. (Also found the 250-grain 9.3 TSX shot very well in my 9.3x62.)

That 6.5x55 load got around 2950 fps, with well under sub-inch accuracy. Longest kill I made with it was a Colorado pronghorn buck at 371 yards, but also killed a few other animals, including one of my biggest whitetail bucks. Worked great!

I've been a longtime fan of the 6,5x55. Built 6,5x55's for both my kids as their first centerfire rifles. My youngest was 8 YO when he took this huge PA whitetail. The load was a 100 gr BT over RL15 for 2600 fps in the longer rifle. He was small at 8.






I've never found that a few extra FPS made much of a difference. I prefer accuracy over velocity.

I alway's get close.....in the yard.

I've loaded and hunted with the 6.5X55 for awhile with 140 grain bullets. I run my swede around 2750 fps. My son in law runs his creedmoor at 2830 fps with 140s but has the advantage of small primer brass. He's out running my swede by 80 fps and his brass consistently lasts longer than my brass. We both use Lapua. I would give the 100 fps advantage to the creedmoor

Trystan

No real contribution to the thread, but I'd be proud to be called 'not much of a hunter' for a 35 yd shot. This one was a bit closer - 25 or 30 yds which must make me a terrible hunter ...and with a 6.5x55 to boot

The original M96 rifle was designed to use 156 gr RN ammunition, so heavier loads work. The rifling twist was designed for them.

156 gr bullets are still available from a few bullet suppliers. Prvi Partizan sells them. I have used this bullet on exactly one whitetail at about 120 yards. The bullet punched through and left an exit wound a little bigger than a ping pong ball. The deer went down. Recoil was soft. The MV on these was around 2500 fps.

These bullets are more popular in Europe, but North Americans shouldn't be concerned about using them at 200 yards or less.



This is the rifle. It's a Husqvarna M38 I got a few years ago, cheap. $200.

I have 96 Swede that dates to 1899 that shoots the 155 Lapua better than any bullet I've tried in it. Haven't taken any game with it, though.

Good heavyweight.

I've reworked a dozen or so Swedish military Mausers in the 1894, 1896, and M38 styles for myself and my Norwegian bachelor farmer friend, several were rebarreled for cartridges that typically operate at pressures higher than the 6.5x55 military loads. I think that the Husqvarna M38s represented the pinnacle of the pre-1898 small ring military Mauser design in all aspects, so those are the pre-1898 action style that I prefer to build on. The only 2 downsides of that action design are, IMO, the small gas shield and that they cock on closing. When I put together a rifle on a Swedish small ring military action I always install a commercial style of gas shield, a Bold or Timney trigger with a safety, and a Dayton-Traister cock on opening kit. None of these changes are necessary, but I think that they improve the safety and shootability enough to be worth the additional expense.

Considering that the newest Swedish Mausers are now over 75 years old, there are probsbly newer action designs that would be a better choice for hot rodding the 6.5x55. Just a few years ago new Howa 1500s were regularly available in 6.5x55 for under $400.

I should have clarified myself. Heavier loads meaning modern powers at higher velocities.

I’m embarrassed to say that of the five 6.5x55s I’ve owned, the only modern one was an m695 that languished in my gun locker for years. It got little use . It was a fine rifle, but for me, it didn’t offer anything more than what I was already using.

I expect someone will be along shortly that can speak to loading one up a bit higher than the old models.

Heck, I have a "strong" modern 6.5x55 - a Ruger #1. I stick with the old load that worked beautifully in a dear departed M70 Featherweight and a string of M94, 96, 38 Swedish Mausers in the past, and a 41 Swede Sniper - 47 gr. IMR4831+129 Hornady Interlock, of which I'm sitting on maybe 1000 pieces. The same powder charge behind the 130 Berger VLD Hunting yields a skinch more accuracy, but not enough to justify the added hassle of finding those bullets, a moot point as I have a few hundred of them. 139 Scenars are superb too, and I use 46 gr. IMR4831 for them. Got a few hundred of them too. All three of those bullets allow the little Ruger to deliver well under MOA accuracy, boringly on demand.

Exclusively Norma brass back in the 80's-90's, exclusively Lapua brass now.

Could I up the performance for all of them? Of that I have no doubt, but I have zero reasons for doing so. For work-a-day paper punching at the 200 yard max range I belong to, and Eastern whitetail hunting where 100 yards and less shots are the norm and a 300 yard shot is so rare as to be unthinkable, I feel no need to up the ante in my loads. (And the 129's have knocked more than a few deer ass-over-teakettle.)

I drew a Montana deer tag, Billings area, and hopefully an antelope tag for this fall.

Shots for both will potentially be long. I plan on taking two rifles.

The 96 Swede in stock configuration and CA Mesa Titanium in 6.5 PRC.

The first two days of the hunt I plan on packing the M-96 to see what I can do with it.

I have already killed everything 5 or 10 times over and am looking to test
my open sight skills, again. I like the challenge.

I’m loading up sone 160 gr Hornady RN bullets over IMR -4350 to try out tomorrow.

No idea if this is a good powder choice for a 160 gr bullet in the Swede, but it’s what I’ve got on hand and listed as a load by Hodgdon.

Mule Deer;
Good afternoon John, I hope the tail end of the week is behaving for you all.

Thanks for the additional info on the Swede loads. While I don't have any of the old X bullets left in .264", I do have some in .224" and at least one box of .308" if memory serves. I seem to recall them being a bit bad for fouling too now that you mention it.

You might or might not recall that when I was tossing around making my .270 into a Swede you commented to the effect that you'd done that and I should go try to run some Swede ammo through it to see if it'd feed nicely.

That's what I did and that's where I ended up - with no regrets might I add once more.

Thanks again and all the best to you both this weekend.

Dwayne

RE-17 45.2 gr., 143 ELDX, 6.5x55 Nosler brass 26" Bartlein 1/8 26". Pre 64 M70. 2840 fps. Excellent accuracy

You gotta figure that the old timey loads were figured out in the dim times of reloading and just plain work. The 160 gr. Sierras used to work great for me. After they were discontinued, I switched to Prvis. Re 22 worked well with them and the 156 PPs. Before that, I used 4831, but it didn't group as well as Reloder.

I have exactly one full box of the Sierras left. I haven't tried the Norma bullets, but Prvis are inexpensive and it would be unusual to get a shot past 150 yards or so.

The temp stability issue really dogs me.

The IMR powder has been a stellar performer in the .270 for decades, and Hodgdon gives it some very favorable numbers for the 6.5x55mm as well.

But, at the same time, given the popularity of the Extreme Powders, can't believe that 2.5 gr. more of H4831 in the .270 Win., and a coupla grains in the 6.5x55mm, couldn't be worked to produce at least a better than adequate precision and velocity load.

IMR 4831 - is listed as 1.10 fps/°F.
H4831SC - is listed as 0.08 fps/°F.

That's almost the Song of the Sirens.




GR

Thank you for the well constructed and though out post.

Much appreciated.

Am rethinking both velocity and powders.




GR

Find myself hunting the Western Soviet Provinces time to time... that fiat them.

As mentioned, have a nice pile of Speer 140 gr. Grand Slams already, that boast a G1 BC of 0.498... but don't believe it.




GR

Interesting, thanks.




GR

..If you aren't happy with IMR-4350 & those 160 gr. Hornady RN's, ( although you may be), Try IMR-7828, either regular or SC with that bullet. I love that powder behind that bullet. At least in my my old Kimber sporterized Mod. 96. Not my go-to load in that gun but it's dead nuts accurate at 100 yds. My go-to is a half grain below Gnoaahhh's previously mentioned 47 grs. of IMR-4831 & that same Hornady 129 gr. Hornady Interlock ( #2620). IIRC it chrono's about 2620 fps and shoots flatter than the old 160 gr round nose.

A trustworthy source has reported that's not a reliable bullet.

I have seen two of the swedes Kimber remanufactured with the action blow apart at the barrel tenon and both parties required left hand surgeries. Don't know if it was plug barrels, judious loading habits or simply luck. but it was enough for me to steer clear

H1000 works good with 140s. 2800 fps and not compressed or any pressure issues.

Way back in the Stone Age I religiously believed in the 160 Hornady RN when I got my first Swedish Mauser, a M94 all-original carbine. I for the life of me can't remember what powder I used in it but I do remember the brass: I made it out of .30-06 brass because 6.5x55 brass was pretty thin on the ground where I lived. What a revelation that first box of fresh Norma 6.5x55 brass was when I chanced upon some. No longer did I have that worrisome bulge above the case head from firing that undersize cobbled together brass in that Swedish chamber.

My then best friend moved out of state in the mid-80's and I gifted that little M94 Carbine to him as a parting present, as he had coveted it from the instant I showed it to him. He's since passed on and his middle-aged sons wrangled over who got The Swede.

gnoahhh;
Good evening to you sir, I hope the week treated you acceptably and you're well.

Thanks for your contributions to the thread and for sharing the photo of your No. 1. I've had a soft spot for them for years, likely due to the fact I used one as my horse hunting rifle for over a decade, but your 6.5x55 looks like a wonderful arm.

We truly do live in a different time regarding components these days or at least we did up until the beer flu mess set in.

When I built Dad's 96 I managed to get in 3 boxes of Imperial factory 6.5x55 before they closed their doors. Then one day down in a small gun shop in Oroville, WA I found a box of Privi Partisan. My daughter still uses that brass in the heirloom rifle she inherited.



It's running a 2-7 Compact now, but otherwise I think it's the same more or less.

The money pit 6.5x55 I built got a new paint job after last season - it's not pretty, but it's about the right weight for a guy who turns 60 this year to pack around in the mountains all day.



Again thanks to you and the rest for the input on an interesting thread.

All the best one and all.

Dwayne

Have read where that's a good, accurate powder for the heavier 6.5x55mm loads, especially for the longer Bbl's, and the temp stability looks good as well.

Was figurin' to use the same powder for my heavy .270 Win. loads, but that may be a hair slow, given that rifle's 22" Bbl.

Thanks.




GR

Sounds interesting. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread to see your progress. Sounds like fun. I'm also assuming you are scoping the rifle. Seems there is a lot of talk of 350+ yard shooting going on.. Sometimes I wish I could load my m96 hot, but its such a sweetheart with mild loads and it is pretty dang accurate, even with irons..

That is a very cool concept! I really like the Carl Gustav M96, and I have shot various vintage military matches with several different configurations of original or CG/63 match rifles.... I've hunted with scoped sporters, but not original.... Realistically it's plenty accurate, so I definitely want to hear how this goes for you!

GR[/quote] H1000 works good with 140s. 2800 fps and not compressed or any pressure issues.[/quote]

Have read where that's a good, accurate powder for the heavier 6.5x55mm loads, especially for the longer Bbl's, and the temp stability looks good as well.

Was figurin' to use the same powder for my heavy .270 Win. loads, but that may be a hair slow, given that rifle's 22" Bbl.

Thanks. GR[/quote]

Why wouldn't Magnum work well in a 22" barrel?

Have found it to work well in many cartridges, some with even shorter barrels, such as the 21" 6.5x55 already mentioned. In fact, it works great in the .257 Roberts with 120-grain bullets.

Yes! Keep us updated on that. In my retirement firearm downsizing the last few years I sold both of my all original matching numbers Model 96's and only have the Mod. 96 sporter now. I miss those two stock Mod. 96's already; both are great shooters.

I like it too, I have a 1918 year with an excellent bore, and it is!

I'll report back to you this fall.

While have a VX1 2-7x33mm that is currently on the 9.3x62mm, tend to enjoy this rifle light and aperture sighted.

The M38 that isn't.

Shooting generally < 2.5 MOA with an aperture sighted rifle makes a 350 yd. shot doable, given a solid shooting position.




GR

Not that it won't.

Ballistics - is a fascinating physic.

Slower powder generally means more powder, longer burn, higher velocity, more recoil due to the mass of that powder, and possibly more muzzle blast as well...

... until it is too slow and velocity is lost due to lower pressure a/o lack of adequate Bbl. length.


But less slower powder works.


Double base powder has less mass to begin with, compared to a single base equivilant powder, and would add less per pressure increment as well.

But is burns longer.

And then there is load density and pressure/burn efficiency.


So, absent any mandate, tend to prefer single base powder of the lowest charge weight, that results in > 90% load density, and produces good velocity for a given bullet weight, low std. deviation, and acceptable precision.

Given that, Magnum seems like a better choice for a heavier/higher velocity/longer Bbl. problem.

Why I prefer the 4831 powder over both 4350 and 7828.


But that's just me.

8>)




GR

GA,

Just about any modern rifle powders, designed to work at pressures of 50,000 PSI plus, will burn within a few inches in front of the chamber--even the slowest-burning. This doesn't mean ALL the powder burns--but all that powder that's GOING to burn. Generally a 99.5% is about the best possible.

Once the powder burns, all that's driving the bullet faster is the rapidly expanding gas. This means that no matter the length of the barrel, the powders that result in the highest velocities with a given load will do so regardless of the length of the barrel--whether 16" or 26."

You'll have plenty of strength with the Ruger, i use:

09 DWM custom, 140gr npt's at 2780 with RL-22

NH model 70 custom, 147gr eldm's at 2960 with H-1000

Lapua brass for both.

Thanks.

That 147 gr. ELDM load is smokin'.

That kind of velocity w/ the 143 ELDX would be an outstanding long range hunting load.




GR

The multi-variables in the calculus of cartridge ballistics are considerable.

Case volume/bore area/powder charge/burn rate/bullet mass/bullet friction/etc...

Area under the curve, to me, seems to explain the process in the easiest way.

More, or higher energy powder, creates a bigger gas bubble, which increases pressure for a given case volume.

Enough powder energy and the pressure exceeds max.

The bullet, accelerating down the bore, creates more volume, which, in turn, lowers pressure.

So, an ideal charge would be one that creates a gas bubble, at max pressure, that expands at the same rate as the volume created by the available bore area from the accelerating bullet.


The artificially low max pressure is the interesting variable in the case of the 6.5x55mm.

Compare the .270 Win./140 gr. to the 6.5x55mm/130 gr. (Barnes/TSX), or .270 Win./150 gr. to the 6.5x55mm/140 gr. (Speer)

Similar SD.

Case Volume per Bore Area favors the .270 by 8.36%
Bullet weight favors the .270 by 7.69%

So, loaded to the same pressure, any given powder's charge wt. will generally reflect this amount, ~ 8%.


But the Barnes Load Data changes powder, and posts Magnum as the high velocity powder for the 6.5x55mm, and Hunter for the .270 Win.

Because a slower developing gas bubble allows the bullet to create volume at a rate that limits the peak pressure of the bubble.


So, the Magnum powder choice is based on the lower pressure requirement, and not for a higher velocity, given the same area under the curve.




GR

GR,

Gee, thanks for the explanation. But no, the difference is NOT due to the 6.5x55's "artificially low" pressure limit....

You might want to check out Ramshot's data for the .270 Winchester. Their Magnum data generally provides more velocity with 150-grain bullets than Hunter. The difference isn't much, but it's there.

The Ramshot data is interesting, partly because they test a variety of bullets with each powder, so there's a good indication of how pressure varies with different bullets.

I started using Ramshot powders 22 years ago, due to being one of the first writer-group invited to attend their introductory event in Miles City, Montana, which included a tour of their facility, including the piezo pressure lab, along with some prairie dog shooting. At the time only TAC, Big Game and Magnum had appearered. Hunter didn't show up until a year or so later, when they decided to plug the burn-rate gap between Big Game and Magnum. I was invited to help in the pressure lab when working up the first test-loads--and was also invited to use their lab to test other handloads whenever the need arose for my articles.

Have also become acquainted with several pressure labs at other facilities, include ammunition and bullet factories. One of the interesting things is that so far nobody at any of the labs has ever mentioned "pressure under the curve," even though it's been obvious on their computer read-outs while doing the shooting. Instead they're concerned with the consistency of the peak pressure and muzzle velocity.

FWIW, the highest velocity I recorded from any of my 6.5x55 rifles, with 140 grain bullets, was 2930fps (plus or minus fifteen or so). This was from a 26 inch barrel, throated to accept 140 Matchkings, and using 50 grains of VV165. A good load but one which produced over 1 moa of vertical at 900M so I went back to a slower load (2800 fps) using 4831sc. GD

Thanks.

2740 fps, w/ the 140 gr. GS bullet, appears to make a good 350 yd. load.

Am leaning toward the H4831 powder, and will look for a precise load from there.

Calculate 49.3 gr. from a 24" Bbl.




GR

The deer can't seem to tell the difference! The swede feeds nicer IMO as well and for those who have a passion for a fine feeding rifle that's a beauitiful thing to behold. I don't have a swede anymore but if I found a nice wood stocked swede I'd be very tempted to get another one

My Hawkeye African loves 140 gr npt’s with RL-22. I bought the 6.5x55 because I missed out on the .275 Rigby’s as they sold out so fast. Later on was able to find one on Gunbroker that had a decent buy now price. After developing loads and shooting both I prefer the 6.5 over the 275.

The only problem with the Swede... is that is was the Norwegians that did most of the development of the cartridge.

Yep--but American handloaders aren't generally concerned about the minutiae of history. But then neither are most humans.

Personally, I really like Ramshot powders. I use a lot of TAC and True Blue.

My only wish was that Ramshot would show load data for bullets heavier than 140 gr in the 6.5x55. Strangely, none of the powders in the Ramshot v8 guide show a bullet heavier than 140 gr in the 6.5x55.

Also, having been an engineer involved in pressure vessel design I've never in any way, shape or form discussed or even worried about "pressure under the curve" Peak pressure is what I'd be concerned about for failure under pressure load.

Was referring to performance, not failure.

Of course peak pressure would be the determining factor in that regard.

But area under the curve will express the aggregate force exerted on the bullet over time/distance in the bore.

F=MA




GR