If you remember, I set a new post and set up MLV's target board, last year. He has some glue horses that just won't die and they scratch their skinny butts on the board, knocking it over. Of course it is my fault for poor workmanship. This time I just helped dig the hole and let another BPCR shooter do the rest of the work. As usual, MLV sat in the van with an ice cold Coke. Either the horses die this year or we'll be back setting another post...

? How come gunwriters don't do manual labor ?

To paraphrase John Wooters:

"them as can does, them as can't writes" <G>

Ha!

I think Mike has the right idea...

DF

Gunwriters do do manual labor. When we sink posts on our farm it takes us hours to get the tractor out, remove whatever was last attached - find the post-hole digger attachment, find the new belt for the PTO, get out the grease gun and shoot the grease nipples full, start to drag tghe post-hole digger out of the barn and then notice the wasp nest hanging from the pneumatic control box, then run like hell and find the BIG can of hornet and wasp spray. After spraying the nest we wait on the screen porch waiting for the damn wasps to die and then we are too darn tired to dig holes - we can do that tomorrow!

Terry

Dang it now shrapnel you're going to get JB all spun up with that title and we're going to have to read about his Cowboy'n days & all that stuff..............:)

I bet JBs posthole digger is used so much it looks like polished chrome.
Yeah, that's it.

"... horses that just won't die..."

Obviously you're doing something wrong.

Maybe ? he can't shoot ?? <G>

You must be a budding gunwriter as I have noticed you have conned some one else to do the labor as you and The Duck supervise.

In all fairness to our dearly departed Gun writer:

Somewhere in the 80s Mr. John Wooters was writing about 'writers' and 'editors'. His quote is this:

"Them as can, writes and them as can't, edits". TNC

Both of those guys appear to have been quite successful at avoiding most all manual labor, and gyms.

Someone has to be the brains of the outfit!

You do have a point.

Think they'll find anyone?

I'm the poor soul that go conned into digging the hole and when I got down about 12 inches, I could tell I was digging in virgin soil so I think I know why the post tipped over... I think it will bust off before it falls over this time!

We almost got even with The Duck as we just about drove off with his shovel, post hole digger, clam digger, and digging bar!!! He said they were his wife's, though, as none of the handles seemed to fit his hands..

Shrap, I hear MLV is a pretty decent guy; it sure is nice of him to let you do all this neat stuff.

Good job. I hope you got lunch out of the deal, or at least a Coke.

Sort of reminds me of the Highway Dept tree planting crew: Three men. One to dig the hole, one to place the tree, and one to fill the hole back up. If one was sick the other two just had to drink Coke all day, hold the shovel, and look at the ground.

Why don't gun writers do manual labor?

Sam Clements (aka Mark Twain) explained it well in his Tom Sawyer book when Tom convinced Huck Finn that painting the fence was a lot of fun. Huck painted while Tom just sat.

I guess gun writers are just a little bit smarter than post hole diggers.

I never saw anyone farm out of a mini van before.

Mike was furnishing the tools and materials. He's management, they're labor. Sounds fair to me.

Glue horses, The Duck, Mini-van farming...

This here's a funny thread, I don't care who ya are.

Must be mountain cowboys.
At least there doesn't appear to be any Crocs on the jobsite...grin

Rest assured, most have wives, they do manual labor
MC

The way I hear it, Shrap provides the Coke.

Now, dealing coke out of a van is something I HAVE heard of.

I got away from that stuff years ago. It fizzes up on my glasses. Just can't get away from a posthole digger, though. In all fairness, though, I'm sure Mike supervised his wife loading the van, as he wouldn't want to mess up his typing finger. And Delby, welcome to the fire. If you're in Pennsylavnia some time, I'll let you dig some post holes, just to stay limber.

I suppose so, but I'd drive a PH digger (again ) to shoot with them fellers.

Posthole diggers, with which I am well-acquainted, are not technical enough for gun writers who insist on analyzing in detail the slightest minutiae of any activity. :-)

get after it and dig a friggen hole ain't no thanken thing.

Gaush

Mike's truck probably had a pair of gloves and other instruments of labor so he was willing to be photographed in the mini rather than risk being conscripted into service!


Mike

Gee, just got back about three hours ago from shooting doves in Argentina. If lifting a shotgun to your shoulder at least 1000 times a day doesn't qualify as manual labor, what does?

Do have to mention that I've done "real" manual labor for as little as $5 a day, though that did include room and board on a ranch in eastern Montana....

With the pics we have already seen for gunwriters that argues against them doing manual labor, I gotta say it

"Pics or it didn't happen!"

John, you were on the bottom of the pay scale? Relatives? The way they figured in W. Montana was since there were less rocks you got paid $1.00 per hour & lunch or $8.00 per day, whichever was less. But you damn well better make a bunch of holes. E. Montana we made less because we had to pull the rocks out of the holes, room & board because it was 50 miles to town. The ranch there figured since we were young & ate a lot that they were actually paying us $1500 per month. (Tax write off as "casual" labor)
MC

Yeah, I was probably on the bottom of the pay scale, since it was my first job out of high school. But by the next year I was working for $12 a day plus room and board!

In 1975 I got $4.50 an hour for driving truck during wheat harvest on a nearby farm. Got a raise from $3.50 after the first day, because when one of the combines got plugged up, instead of sitting on my ass in the truck (like most of the drivers did) I walked over there and helped the combine driver pull weeds and wheat stalks out of the header.

By the early 80's I'd worked my way up to what was essentially foreman on a custom-cutting crew. Got $7.50 an hour and room and board, not a bad deal back then, especially when you're working at least 15 hours a day without any real opportunity to spend it!

I've dug post holes, but always liked how they "build fence" in rural north central PA, near my camp. An uncle taught me that trade when I was big enough to swing a maul without maiming bystanders.

Have a pile of pointed locust posts on the wagon, ball or two of barbed wire, pail of staples, fence "plahrs", claw hammer, pointed diggin' iron and a post maul. A wire stretcher is optional fer them what's really anal about taut barbed wire.

When the frost is gone and the pasture ground is soft, but firm enough so's the Farmall doesn't "get fast", time to fix fence. Poke a hole with the diggin' iron; Waller it around to make a tapered hole in the ground; Insert locust post and drive it tight with the maul. Once the ground dries up some, it ain't going anywhere. Install wire, go drink a cold beer.

Come the next spring, drive around and whack the posts tight again, if they've loosened. Replace the broken/rotted ones.

Works well for dairy cattle. Ain't really worth much for beefers, nags or anything else with little sense for staying where you want 'em to stay.

Although we generally dug a hole for gate posts, when necessary. I usually found something else that needed done, if I suspected we were setting gate posts.

Nice van. Looks kinda "tactical"?

Wow I feel lucky, I was paid $15 a day on a ranch in central MT. Of course that was back in the 80s so the price of labor had no doubt gone up by then. I was able to by my first rifle with the money though.

First job out of high school was running a JD 7520 working summerfallow. $25/day, plus room and board. I thought it was pretty good in 1978. First day, I opened up the lunch cooler, and was amazed at the amount of food. Being young, I ate a good share of it. Was politely informed that while there would be new sandwiches each day, the large, family sized bag of chips was supposed to last at least two or three days....

Just a Hunter,

Out of curiosity, I logged onto the U.S. inflation calculator, and found out my $5 a day in 1969 was just about equivalent to $15 a day in 1985.

IIRC, first time I worked for anyone other than my parents, I made $5/hr (late 80's) I usually got fed picking rocks, but I had to pack my own lunch when I was driving trucks / tractor.

Yeah, rock-picking is often an "entry-level" job!

It's all entry level(until you die....grin).

That is the difference of a hired hand vs a farm/ranch kid, there are no wages for the kid, so $5.00 or $15.00 doesn't matter if you don't get paid...

I ain't that fussy when it comes to free grub, but would've held out for something a tad less chewy?

Hilly Ag lands in much of north central PA, seem to run about 80% rocks and 20% soil. The steeper the ground, the less the soil content.

Sam,

Yep! Though "exit level" may also apply.

The raise mentioned in my earlier post (due to helping a combine operator when his machine got plugged up) was after the first day I worked for your "Uncle Butch" in the summer of 1976 or '77. The next season I was promoted to combine driver, on one of Barney's 14-foot Allison-Chalmers, which could cut at least 2 mph in 30-bushel wheat.

Forgive me. I'm tuckered out and feelin' peckish. ;O)

JB must be drunk.....grin

14' at 2mph....

Great grandpa Barney would chit if saw how the super farmers do it now!

The first year I cut for him we'd done about 300 acres in a week when Butch showed up up with his pair of 24-foot Massey-Fergusons and cut that much in a day....

dubePA,

Please forgive me for a major mistake.

The daughter of one of the guys I worked for then was named Allison.

Actually, she still is!

Yeah, a 30'er will cut about 20 acres an hour. Keep a couple of 'em going with a grain cart and semi's and they can really whack the wheat.

We don't farm enough grain to afford a fleet of high dollar harvest equipment.

Speaking of farming. Late Spring up here, snow on the ground and mud. Gonna be another week or two at best before anyone thinks about seeding. The big farmers are getting a little nervous, more rain on the forecast.

Speaking of Allis-Chalmers combines, am I the only one to call silver duct tape "Gleaner Instant-Weld?"

Sam,

That was back when Butch and Boone were farm equipment dealers, and Butch was custom-cutting from Texas to Alberta to pay for his equipment. I don't believe they made much money at it, but they learned a lot!

I got pretty good at running a big combine, and Butch even had an 18-speed Ford that I could run through gears pretty slickly. Luckily, only two trucks tipped over during those years--neither driven by me.

300 Savage,

I hadn't heard that one before!

Does green duct tape qualify as Deere wrap?

Now I hadn't heard THAT one before . Where I work, one of the faculty is pretty proud of his PhD. One time I mentioned mine...he looked confused...and I went to the pickup and got my clamshell posthole diggers out. He wasn't impressed.

Allison must have been cute to have you remember her this long, I used to go to brandings to meet the rancher's daughters.... Let's see there was .. Oops better forget that one. We were dry land wheat & had about 1000 mother cow operation on the Big Flat 50 miles N. of Harlem. Late 60's early 70's, then went West & worked in the trees for a while. Still have old friends & family in that country where everybody waves. I never did figure out how they knew what I was driving 2 days before I got there though.
MC

I must have had a bad upbringing. I'd be more impressed with your phd than his. (Especially if it was a good commercial type instead of my light duty home-owner's rig.)

I knew I had lived in Kansas City too long when I drove past a small-town implement dealer with a big, red "MF" sign and the first thing I thought of wasn't Massey-Ferguson.

In eastern Kentucky in the early Forties, I delivered papers all over town � on foot � supposedly for $1.00 a day (which I never got!).

In 1945, we got out of school to sucker a bumper crop of tobacco for 60� an hour. Old folks in town bitched about that being "too much money" to be paying teen-agers for simple manual labor.

Don't remember how much I got for forking wheat onto wagons � then later from the wagons into the thresher � but it wasn't much. All that I remember (not all that fondly!) are the humid heat, the dust, the dusty sweat on my glasses, and the saturated shirts.

Later, shoveling coal and milling feed were also hard physical work but seemed worlds easier by comparison.

So, tell us the story of you and the farmer's daughter.

I met Allison when she was 12 and I was 30, not too long before Eileen and I got married, when she'd made a pile of money off a lemonade stand and invested it in stock that did real well. I called her the Lemonade Queen, though she may not remember that.

She eventually became a hot-shot in promoting Montana for movie-making, and Eileen and I see her every couple of years, and always have a great time. She's a lot of fun, and smart as hell--so smart no guy has ever been able to catch her. If I were lot younger and single, she would be right up there on my list.

I used to be the captain of the university fencing team � on our way to the Olympics � when some *&^%$#@! stole our post-hole-diggers.

Only Ken H could come up with that --

A fellow in our area occasionally runs a clever ad in the classifieds:

FOR SALE: One truckload of post-holes. All or part. New, unused. Will deliver. Call for price. 555-xxxx.

Years ago, some wag advertised "pulled-up" wells that he'd chopped-up into post holes.

This farm labor stuff reminds me of how I got my reloading press. Buttreys in Glendive had an ad in the paper...Rock Chuckler combo for 54.95. I couldn't quite afford it at 18, but was going into town with the folks, and was trying to figure out a way to get one. Neighbor flagged us down...he and his brother had the railroad tie contract for the Glendive-Brockway route, and were picking up ties with the farmhand and loading them in a grain truck. Needed another hand and offered me $50 if I'd help. I told dad what I wanted, and went to work! Still think of that when I reload.

I used to buck small roundbales for 3 cents a bale, back in the early '70s. Got fed lunch, though, so it wasn't too bad. Danged old timothy hay, baled tight, and a hayloft that got plenty hot wasn't much fun, though swimming in the pond between wagonloads took the edge off a bit. That old John Deere G would just putter along at the exact right speed so we could wrassle the bales onto the wagon.

To answer the question,they do not want to break their trigger finger.

Or their "recoil shoulder."

Plus, why would they, if they can get paid for handloading, shooting and hunting?

And ALL those "free" guns.

Wtih emphasis on the quotation marks around FREE!

Yep Bad news MD,I don't have any questions for you today.

That's such bullshit. No way a big family sized bag of chips could last 2 days!

Damned capitalists squeezing the poor working man!

Are gunwriters free guns in any way related to our own "Free Classifieds"? They've cost me a couple grand over the years.

That's why I do not look in the "free classifieds."

Perhaps the better question is, "Why don't manual laborers do gun writting?"

Some do--but if they become good enough writers they eventually quit manual labor.

My old friend Bill McRae was an ironworker who came to Montana during the Cold War to work on the Minuteman missile silos. He started taking wildlife photos, partly because he ended up fairly close to Glacier National Park, and eventually started selling some to magazines. After a little while he was encouraged by at least one magazine editor to write a hunting story to go with his photos. He did, and after some years quit ironworking and became a full-time wildlife/hunting/gun/optics photographer and writer. He's mostly retired now, but still does an article now and then. The last one I saw was on optics and appeared in American Rifleman a few months ago.

Shrap, no "gun writer" here and maybe because, DID do manual labor during college, '67-'70. Convinced me to stay in school too. Worked bridge and culvert construction here in NW Iowa.

Sorry to say, the first mallard I killed met it's demise in a small explosion in the process of taking out some old concrete footings next to a stream bed. Actually, not a very efficient way to take ducks but you do what you have to do. And when you are a 19 y/o college student,..you do a little extra.

I do hope that they are socking it away for retirement as they are on their own when the time comes which can come late depending upon what they write about... My best friend growing up is running a pretty good hunting related business but I do worry about him when he turns 70. Scary for me but I am sure they do consider this in "the plans" as they generally are pretty practical folks.