When you consider power, availability of ammunition, it’s chambered by every manufacturer, is there is a better Norh American cartridge? If loaded with 120 or 140 grain bullets, it’s great for deer. If loaded with heavy bullets it will take any other North American game, even the big bears in a pinch. I don’t think there is a better cartridge unless it’s a 300 Win Mag or 338 Win mag, but some people can’t take the recoil. I’m a big fan, I have four of them.

I agree except for the recoil. It does not bother me but it can be a bit much for some shooters.

I'm not a gunwriter, but Couldn't agree more....

BIL had an older Mod 700, that I reloaded for, he was not pleased with the performance, on mostly FL Whitetails and Hogs....... I suggested heavier bullets, and loaded up a box of 175 grainers for him..... he never asked for anything else again!

Agree that it is not for the softshouldered.

SADLY, the 7 Rem Mag is now mine.

I’ve never thought the 7 mag to have much recoil. I shoot 140’s with a max load of IMR 4350. It kills deer and pigs really well.

muffin

My condolences.

Jerry

It certainly occupies a useful performance niche. There's just not much reason for that much oomph around here, and lighter rounds in lighter rifles make more sense.

My late brother had a very high-tech (for the 80s) 7 RM built by Brown. Kevlar stock, Shilen SS barrel, S&B 1.5-6 scope, on a Mark X action; the metal all electroless nickeled. Very nice indeed, and a real shooter, but a good bit heavier than the pre-64 .270 I lugged around. I borrowed it once because my son was using my rifle and killed a buck with one of his hot 150gr BT loads. That buck bucked at the shot, then continued on with a doe for about 50 yards, then stopped. I had worked the bolt quietly for a second shot, thinking I'd missed, then just as I was about to poke him again, he fell over dead. That freaked his lady friend out and she took off. That deer had a golf ball-sized exit hole and his innards were mush. Amazing how much they can take sometimes and keep going.

No idea where that rifle or his other guns went when he died. His wife never discussed them, although she did give me all his loading stuff when he died, as he had instructed her. Their son doesn't hunt or shoot, so far as I know.

Sorry about the ramble.

Pappy, your experience is the same that my BIL saw, apparently a lot. After the 175s he said they didn't do that!

# 1: I have a SAKO 7mm Rem MAg and a room full of heads, and all the animals except 1 has fallen to the same rifle, I shoot 150's because that's what my rifle likes.

#2 Recoil?? Maybe I'm missing something but, to me, the recoil of the 7 mag is not a back kicker, period.

#3 270/? REALLY, when you shoot over a chrony, and really get into it, there's not a nickle's worth of difference between a 270 and a 7 Mag, until you shoot the 175's and I've NEVER found a load of 175's that my rifle likes. SHooting 150s vs 130s in a 270, No difference. Just more barrel, less rounds in the mag, more powder, slightly more recoil, and blast, all for a (Almost) theoretical "advantage" on extreme shots,
If the 7 Mag was TRULY all that, (Again, I have one and LOVE the rifle and cartridge) why didn't the major manufacturers chamber all the new long range precision guns in it and be done with it?

Both my 7.5 pound 22" .280 Ackley and 9 pound 26" 7mm Remington shoot 140's to 3200fps so I don't seen any advantage in the mag for the lower weights but again, the 175grain Partition is in another class, as I can get 3000fps in the Remmy case and lose 200fps + with the smaller case.

Those that can't find a load for 175's with the 7mm Remington need to try Rel 26.
Those that prefer 160's with 7mm caliber will also see a lift with the Remmy case.
My Oehler 35P has much praise for the cartridge.
John

For pure sweetness, give me a 7-08

My load is with RL25............

Sample of one, and with original BTs, so not a criticism of cart or bullet, just "one of those things".

When I carry a .270 these days, it's stuffed with 160gr NPs, at least until I run out. At about 2700, only one of three deer has made it as far as 20 yards. Not much room for improvement.

His was a sampling of 'scores'.........

I've killed 90% of my deer with a model 70 XTR 7 mag with a Leupold 2-7 Vari X II. That gun still fits me great and is about the perfect weight. I have bought several since that gun and killed deer with them all but that model 70 7mag was my first real deer rifle and will always be a favorite. BTW,I never had a deer run out of sight with that gun.

I did fave several 150 factory loads fail to exit on broadside shots,but all the deer fell within just a few yards.

If I had to cut down to one deer rifle it would be a Kleinguenther 7 Mag.

It hurt me to say cut down!!

would rather use my 30/06 than a 7 mag, I've had 4 and the 06 just works better for me than the mags do

Likely because of bullet weight and speed. I think a 7mm mag would do better with heavier bullets,even loaded down for whitetails.

I was reading about the birth of the 7mmRM... Les Bowman, a .270 fan, convinced Mike Walker to bring out this caliber out... Les had been using a ,275 H & H Mag. in his guiding business and loved it for elk.. But the cases were tough to get.. When the 264 hit the market Les necked it up to 7and called his a .280 magnum. He got Mike interested and the rest his history..

the 30/06 with 220 gr round nose has probably killed more deer and elk ,moose, than anything else, just saying

Seems like everyone responding uses the 7mm RM on deer??? There’s a few more animals that it’s capable of.

If I had only one rifle, I think a 7mm RM would be a good choice. Way back when I thought my ‘06 worked pretty well, but I never had the opportunity to try it on “big” game.

I dearly want to hunt Cape Buffalo and using a 7mm RM might be ‘small’.

I’m glad I don’t have to use only one rifle. With today’s bullets the 7mm might be more than sufficient, maybe it has been for a long time.

I like shooting cast bullets and I prefer larger diameter bullets than .284 for cast. But I do have a ~~ 170+ grain mold for .284.

If I was down to one rifle and cast bullets, the diameter would be at least .358, maybe 375.

Isn’t life good when you have more than a couple centerfires in the safe?

Never shot a 7mm Mag, or owned one.

The safe is full.

Send prayers.

OTOH, I'm OK with pipsqueakers for most purposes. If horsepower in necessary I have that covered. In spades ^4.

I remember reading that pard...at same time I think, Mr Bowman bugged Sierra to come out with a long range bullet, and we got the 160 SBT. They were hunting in a very hard to get to area up above timberline? I liked Mr Bowman's writings a lot. I also remember Col Askins saying that he wondered why Remington came out with the 175gr ammo first as (his quote).."everyone knows the 7mm caliber balances best with the 160 grain,," He went on and killed a big bear with the 175gr load and said it seemed to work fine ( of course, never as fine as an 8mm cal, his fave! ha)

A 7mm RM was as good as it needed to be when I only had one rifle for deer and elk and it worked well. Then one cold November day shooting an 8 point buck that scope hit me in the forehead and knocked some sense into me. A similar built Kevlar stocked 7# 7mm-08 has worked as well or better for the deer ever since.

I agree that a properly hand loaded .270/.280/30.06 will run right with a 7mm Rem mag on about 99% of game. I also believe that there never has been that many hunters who actually handload. They don't use chronos either. "Faith" is a very comforting thing...and loyalty to a caliber/factory load can be too, ha. "Most" of the folks I talk to here in Utah like the 7mm Mag as a deer/elk combo round. It is very popular, rightfully so, but there are still many, many .270/30.06 users. I used 1 Mod 77 .280 as my first bolt action, it was great up close with 150CL factory load (15yds) to 276 steps my 139gr handload. I replaced that rifle after 3 yrs with my first Mod 700 7mm Mag as an all around rifle (deer/elk) for about 10yrs in SE Texas and Georgia. From a tree stand it was a great "beanfield sniper", but as a woods walker rifle, it was a bit heavy and slow handling for me...but I was raised on a Mod 94! I might have been "tainted/spoilt". I started out with the 175 corlokts factory load ( to save meat, and it did!) handloaded later it loved the 150 PT and 160 PT. I made one hunt in CO (no elk) with it then lent the rifle/160 load to a friend who used it for elk in Colorado, I got a mess of meat for that! I found that the 150 PT acted like that 175CL but was flatter shooting...plus it was "my load", not factory. I was frustrated when I finally got to use a guys chronograph...while my 150pt actually was right at 3200fps, what I "thought" was a 3100fps 160NP load was 2950. Bummed me out. Later in life, I "wanted that 3100 or more with the 160" so went to the 7mm STW and then the 7mm RUM. My last 7mm Rem Mag was a 26" barrel Mod 700 and with R26 I finally got a hum dinger 3100fps/160 SBT ragged hole shooter. I also finally got a bit over 3000fps with R33/175 SBT. Played with a 7mm/08 in a finicky M84 Kimber, finally settled on a Mod 70 FWT 7mm Mauser. I have "access" to both a 7mm RM (Tikka) and a 300 RUM if I want to use one in a future hunt. Meanwhile, I enjoy hunting with what is essentially an English type Stalking Rfile which is better for how I hunt now. I love a 7mm "anything", and am thankful for the experience...but happy now...pretty certain...maybe..:)

For whatever reason I could never warm up to the 7mm bore, save for one very accurate 280 rem, and that one because of the accuracy and it's a light rem mtn rifle......80s vintage. Had two 7 mags that got sold, and two 7-08s that also got sold. All very nice rifles that I wish I had back.........in a 30 caliber.

This may surprise only you.

1962 minus 1906 = 56 years head start for the 06. It should have killed more game.

And I suspect the 06 is in second place to the diminutive 30-30.

Neither by itself makes either one better.

Just sayin......


Jerry

An Addendum:

I respect the 06
I like the 06
I use the 06

‘Most’ factory 06 ammo is mild but handloading certainly wakes it up. But as was also stated
most hunters don’t reload or use a chrono.

Jerry

I too am a big fan of the 7mm. When I was 12 my Father gave me his first year Model 700 in 7mmRM and I used it until I was in my 40's to take a few dozen deer and it served me well. After getting the itch to buy a few new rifles I ended up with a Model 70 Super Grade in 280 that is my main squeeze from here on out with a 308 W Sako for a backup.

I still have the 700, and a Model 70 Classic DBM in 7mmRM and will cherish them, but the 280 and my two 7mm08 get more interest these days as bullet tech has improved and the Magnum just isn't necessary for me anymore.

Back in the day,when I was greener than a June bug,I wanted one rifle to do it all. There wasn't any talk forums and the only source of info was hunting mags of all names. Growing up,I read dozens of different hunting and fishing publications every month. Consequentially when I wanted to buy my first big game rifle on my own,the best I could afford in my mind and the best caliber was a Winchester model 70 in 7mm Rem Mag.

I always had ambitions that I would buy my perfect rifle and hunt big game all over the world,even perhaps become a magazine writer. That's why the 7 mag was chosen. It was big enough to kill everything,but have still have light recoil and be light weight.

Sadly,that old XTR model 70 never saw anywhere but Alabama,but I shot it a lot and killed jugs as far as I could find places to shoot. I killed dozens of nice deer with that rifle and even shot down a Christmas tree every year for our family. I would just go into the woods behind my house. I live about a mile off the main road and there's miles of undisturbed woods all around. I would walk about a mile down to the big creek and shoot the top out of a big Spruce. I would be way up on the side of one hill shooting down into the other side of the hill and not just shooting a bullet up into the air.I never was dumb about guns.

Now,I have about every caliber smaller than that first 7 mag,but for some reason I never found a need to buy anything larger. That old 7 mag doesn't kick much more with 150's than my smaller caliber lighter guns though. I've only tried 175's in it once though.

7 mag is way more than I want for deer. Too long of barrel, too much powder burned, too much of everything. The old .30-30 is perfection for the woods hunting I do and that is said after having used everything from a .222 to a .30-06 and many in between. For hunting deer in more open country I like a .243 just fine but feel the new 6.5 Creedmoor is absolute ballistic perfection for that use and it may take over as my new favorite. Time will tell but somebody else can have my share of 7mm magnums.

I'll take the .444 or the .45-70. I can mostly hunt anything anywhere for similar recoil.

Somebody else does have my share of the 7mm magnums. I sent two of them down the road.

I love the 7 Mag but have not owned one for years.

Just the thing for iguanas.

Mike, I've never shot a 7 Mag that recoiled like a .444. It'd take me a while to count up the different 7s I've had plus those I've shot of others.

As to weight ? ? that's a whole diff story. I remember holding/carrying/ and shooting a Marlin 444, don't remember now who owned it.
Heavy is an understatement.

Sometime before '94 I went to a LGS with the intent to get a Rem 700 S S Laminate (grey/black) stock in 7 Mag. When I picked it up, immediately I was SO disappointed. The gun alone was WAY TOO heavy.

At present I have a Tikka T 3X Lite SS in 7 R Mag. With identical scopes it weighs 3 OUNCES more than my Tikka T 3 Lite SS 270 Win.

Jerry

I've shot 45-70's that recoiled way more than my 7 mag.

Someday I would like to come up there and see the deer ya'll need 7mm RM to kill.

There is a better cartridge....it's used quite a bit all over the world, it been around quite a while and IMO beats the 7MM mag....it's easily the old .30-06!

I had my first Mod 700 7mm Mag Mag-Na-Ported. I just wanted to try it out, having never done so before. It made the 150/160 a bit milder in bucking, but it didn't do alot when I fired a case full of H870/175 NP. It was not "bad" in recoil, but it did benefit a little from the porting. I have never been able to tell that much difference between them and the 300WM. The 7mm STW was a heavy Sendero, no brake needed at all. I had the Sporter weight custom 7mm RUM braked just so I could see my downrange hits, well, with the lighter bullets anyhow. Fit of the stock to shooter determines that more than anything, of course, but the "perception" out here is the 7mm mag kicks "less" than the 300's. Put a good brake on them and they all are easily handled even by teens. I "do" like the power of a magnum for shooting up close on bigger game or reaching a out a bit "flatter". I must add that I am a "point and shoot" hunter, I like holding on hair and detest twisting turrets. Just an old phart thingy...

You don't need a 7 to kill a deer, but it sure makes hitting them at a distance very easy.. Not all of us shoot deer in timber or over bait..


The .30-06 is a good cartridge, I shot one steadily from the time I was 15- 25... Then I tried the 7 and realized it was flatter shooting and the recoil nil... I have three 06's.. I like them, but mostly use them to prop the safe door open to get something else..

I have a 7MM RM and use it sparingly. It is set up like a target rifle and does weigh 9.5 pounds. Last time I used it I took an elk east of LaBarge Wyoming using 175 gr Hornady spire points. Recoil is not much at that weight and the good trigger and scope make this a fine long range rifle. Trouble is for all my other hunting a 300 Savage could do it all.

I've dragged my Tikka 695 7mm Rem Magnificent across several states, Mexico, and Africa. The140-160 AB and Partition simply crush game.

+1

For deer-sized game, I agree with the above. But I still love my 7 Mags for certain applications and critters larger than deer.

My 7 Wby is my favorite magnum.

Properly handloaded (pressures equivalent to modern cartridges), with bullets designed for the task at hand.....the 7 mm Rem. has little to nothing on the 30-06 Springfield! memtb

Yeah, a 7mm08...

Me too:

I also sent 2 perfectly good 7mm rem mag's down the road. Just couldn't warm up to them.

If it’s got 4 hooves and bound for the freezer, a 7mm Magnum is all that and a bag of chips. If I make it to full geezer status, I’ll downsize to 7x57 Mauser! Happy Trails

Never could warm up to 7's....

I have a problem with the 7 mag. That darned belt. I have barrels for a savage including 25-06, 270 win, 7 mag, 30-06. I have used 7 mag on deer and it certainly does the job. However, for deer here in PA a 25-06 or 270 is certainly good enough in terms of range accuracy, and power. But when I set up for the 7 mag I have to fiddle with the die to get the head space set up of the shoulder instead of the belt. That is my $0.02.

I resisted the 7mm mag for many years, believing that I was getting all that I needed from the 280 AI. This was, of course, true for deer but when I started hunting elk more often the 7mm’s ability to push the 175s became a clear advantage. To me, the 7mm mag is right at the recoil threshold that allows me to still shoot with precision. I don’t love the belt but I handload to headspace off the shoulder so it’s just an annoyance. I use 162 SSTs for deer/antelope (and 1 Colorado bull in a pinch) but prefer the 175 Partition for everything else. I’ve yet to feel undergunned with this combo.

I haven't owned a magnum now in five years but I was actually going to buy a .300 Win mag on Friday. LGS had a Mossberg Patriot for $299. Then I picked it up and noticed the 22" barrel. I don't see the sense in a 300 mag "carbine".

I don't think I've ever held a 444 that was over 8 pounds?

CDNN has Ruger Hawkeye .300 RCMs for sale really cheap. These are very nice blue & walnut rifles. That round was designed to perform in the shorter barrel, though it's probably pretty loud doing it.

IF I had a use for such a beast, I'd go for it. Hornady supports their offspring pretty well, unlike some others, so I wouldn't sweat the availability of ammo and brass.

I've owned three Hawkeyes so far; still have two that have made the keeper list, and I regret the one I let get away. Never a single issue with any of them. They are solid.

Two weeks ago I had to make a final decision between a 7mm RM and a 280ai in a Cooper M92 Backcountry at 5 pounds 12 ounces.

I chose the 280ai and I think I made the right choice. Time will tell with elk and mule deer hunts on the agenda.

donsm70

I agree. As much as I love my 7 Wby, my 280 AI is 2.25 lbs lighter. With 140’s a 3200, there’s not much it won’t do.

I think ol Bobby would’ve fainted....

I’m a solid 7mm Rem Mag/WSM and Mashburn Super fan. Besides the 338, it’s my favorite caliber and as a whole there isn’t anything I wouldn’t tackle with a good one of any of them.

The 7mm and 30 caliber magnum rounds can push the same bullets faster than the 30-06 case.....that is undeniable. Whether that difference has ever changed the outcome of a hunt is likely a matter of faith. I've got a good friend who believes it (the 7RM) kills deer better but I can't see it.

I really like the 7mag.It's a great,hard hitting,flat shooting round.There are many bullets available for the 7mm and that makes it a very versatile round.Recoil is not bad.If you can handle a hotly loaded 270 or a 30-06,you should have no problem with the 7mag.I never felt over gunned or under gunned hunting with the 7mag.I found it to be a very good all around hunting cartridge in the 7mm class.When I've compared it to the 300 magnums,they can definitely walk away from it in every bullet weight class.The one 30 cal cartridge that comes really close in bullet weight velocity per caliber is the 30-06.The 7mag has a slight edge in velocity and bullet B.C. for the same weight and like bullet,but not really that much.When it comes to shooting game,the larger dia. bullet,though it may be traveling just a little slower,may be equal or greater in energy than the smaller,faster dia. bullet.All those factors depends how hot each cartridge is loaded,but in moderate shooting ranges,I'm very happy and confident hunting with either one.So comparing the 7mag to the 30-06 really is a compliment in the world of hunting cartridges.

If one thinks its as good as it gets, then it is. Pretty simple.

For deer, fact of the matter is I could have killed probably 90% of the deer I've taken with a a 22lr if legal. Just doesn't take all that much. Just like pigs.

More never hurts and since the biggest I've shot a deer with is my 50 bmg I've no room to talk.

Any more its 308 if I feel the need to have a big round. 300/221 and 10mm for most work. If long range is in the mix I would step to something different too. But honestly 243 with the right bullet would do as much as the 308 does, I just have a nice 308 and a really accurate gun and like shooting that gun and so does Carolyn if she isn't using her 10mm.

Trying to use one gun for all, you end up being big, bigger than needed most times. IE my big gun for our place in AK is 458 win mag. I don' really want to use it for everything, but I have shot stuff as small as javelina with it.

Pick and choose for the intended use and quarry seems to fit the best for us. I"d hate to have to hunt dove with my 10 ga. LOL.

And with all that said and a couple of years hunting and a few deer taken I've learned that there is no lightning bolt round for game. And bullet choice and how the bullet works on each shot, IE it does what you intend it to, and placement, are the supreme issues. Heck even if the bullet doesn't work right, with correct placement you still have a pretty good chance at killing and harvesting.

Never owned a 7 Rem mag. Have loaded and shot plenty. Seems just fine to me for lots of things. Still own a 7x300 wtby that I wish shot as well as every 7 Rem Mag I've messed with

It's a solid choice for anything not in the "will Jolly Stomp you" category. The newer, high BC bullets in the 175-180 gr range show the cartridge at its best. If it's something a body wants to try for themselves, rifles and ammo are easy to come by.

That said, were I to pick a good as it gets big game cartridge, it'd be the boring old '06.

The 7 Mag has a stat line that’s very hard to duplicate by cartridges of both larger and smaller caliber.....

160+ grain bullet, with a .600+ BC, at 3000+ FPS.....

Nothing smaller can do it.....

and, it takes a big f’n .30 to get there (RUMish).... then there’s a substantial increase in recoil.

I have a Sendero 7mm ultra mag. It was a gift from kids for doing the plumbing on a house they built. Son in law called me up asking what caliber his friend should buy? I knew the ultra cartridges were expensive so I told him his friend should buy a 7 ultra. They were fishing to see what to get me.

Next thing I know I have a 7 ultra mag. It has more horsepower than a 7 Remington mag, but you have to burn a hell of a lot more powder to get it. A 7 Rem mag is about perfect for me. I have my eye on another early L-61 Sako. Everyone needs five 7 mags.

yup
Five is a good number,that's how many I have.I have to agree with you about the extra powder the larger 7 magnums have to burn to beat the 7mag.I have a 7STW.I usually burn around ten more grains or so powder then what I'd load in my 7mags.Recoil is also increased and very similar to the 300 Win Mag.The other thing I found interesting was what powder charge I used for the 7STW with a 160gr bullet was also the same powder charge I would. use in my 300 Win Mag with 180gr bullets.I also saw this same comparison with the 7mag loading 140gr bullets and the 300WSM loading 165gr bullets.And like the 7mag and 7STW,I usually find I load about ten more grains of powder in the 300 Win Mag than I do in the 300WSM with like bullet weights.Performance wise,the 7mag is close in comparison to the 300WSM and the 7STW is close to the 300 Win Mag.

That's a good one.

Old Capstick was apparently pretty much full of crap, but I like his crack about when an elephant gets you, they can send you home in an ice cream carton.

You have got to stop posting this picture!

I wonder if he could even be civil after that........?

He had the experience with various 7 Mags to know the truth.


Jerry

Maybe ? at insane pressures !


Jerry

I load 89 gr of Reloader 25 in my 7mm ultra mag, 64 grains of IMR 4350 in my 7 mags, both with 140 grain bullets. That’s 25 more, lots more for 200 fps

Some here know what they're talking about.

Jerry

What brand rifle is this?

Are you serious....?

I'm not BSA but that is a Win 70 Classic FTWT in 7-08.

Jerry

Well, I didn’t know. I’ve never seen one in person. I couldn’t see the bolt very good. I have a pre 64 Winchester in 264 Win mag that I like. It hangs out in the gun safe. I have three 264’s. One of the Sakos has a three digit serial number.

Big fan of the 7RM even though I now realize it is not that much superior to the 270,280, esp. 280AI and 30-06 and many others but that is pretty good company. I doubt I will ever equal my string of 33 consecutive one shot kills on game with any other rifle or cartridge combo. #34 I got cocky and it took two shots.

Did some test loads last week with a couple of powders I haven't tried before.Here's what I got.
150gr Nosler Ballistic Tip:
65.0grs Accurate-4350 - 3220fps




69.0grs Reloader-26 - 3187fps




70.0grs Reloader-26 - 3220fps



160gr Nosler Accubond
63.5gr Accurate-4350 - 3044fps

23” Rem. 700 in 7 Mag, SS 3-9, running 160 ABs at 3000... shade over 550

Good call Jerry. The picture isn't real good, but you are correct. Took it with my cell phone.. I've had 7mm rem mag's, but this 7mm08 is a sweetheart in all aspects. Shoots great, and has good enough ballistics to take NA game at any sane distance. I should be partial to the 7mm Rem magnum, as I took my longest shot with one. However, it does nothing for me. I actually prefer the 7WSM over the Rem mag. To each their own though.

Beautiful rifle, makes me want one!

Owned several semi custom 7 RM’s. Only thing I really didn’t like about them was barrel life. Have to rebarrel every year or two was really a pain in the butt.

How many rounds does it take to wear out a 7 mag barrel?

A lot...

I've only shot 180s and 195s in my current 7mm Remington. Recoil is at the upper end of what I will deal with anymore. With a long throat and faster twisted barrel, it will perform well with the heavies. RL26, Retumbo and H1000 have all worked well.

7RM with 160 NAB's in action. I never get tired of this one; photography is outstanding.

www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/8855404/1

JG seems to be moving towards the 7-08 and I'm in that camp. I have a great Brux MkV 7RM. Since I got this Bobby Hart 7-08, I find myself reaching for it more than any other; 120 NBT, my go to ammo.

DF

2 boxes is what it takes...

What load you end up using in that 7-08?

Might want to check the load data before assuming.


Nosler Load Data

.280 AI will run pretty close to a 7RM.

If I didn't already have a nice 7RM, I'd be looking for a .280 AI.

More efficient round with nearly the performance of the 7RM.

DF

I have two 280AI now, and I like them a lot.

I have owned a number of 7RM too. It is another favorite round of mine.

If I found a rifle I liked in either one I would buy it without thinking twice..

I haven't totally decided yet , but pharmsellers load of 46 grains of big game with 150gr. Hornady ELDX, looks pretty promising. I need to try some magnum primers next time out. With CCI 200's, I was shooting a hair over 1 moa 5 shot groups. Good enough for any critter around here.

What matches you shooting up there? I know there are some matches around the state, just not familiar with whats around.

7 mag last 800 rounds or so is what I generally heard, about like any mag type round and just about what the 243 can die on at times too.

I imagine barrels up there are a bit harder to come by. Easy down here. Sure wished I had time to let Nez teach me how before I move, but I wouldn't have the tools anyway...

26" barrel helps

I have about 1100 rounds though my 7mm RM.. With 140's at 3400fps, it is all I want in a nice flat shooting rifle..

28 - How much does your Wby weigh ?

How much does your 280AI weigh ?

This Tikka T 3X Lite SS 7 RM with 4-12X40 weighs 7 lbs 09 oz. (1 oz over 1/2 lb.)




I don't own and Will NOT own a 9 or 10 lb rifle, because I don't have to tote that much weight unnecessarily.
My T 3 Lite SS 270 with 4-12X40 weighs 7 lbs 6 oz.
My point is that you don't have to have a 7 Mag that is heavy.

I haven't done that much load development YET. So far I have 139 HBTSP going 3215 with one powder. There are other powders I haven't tried yet, that will beat that.

Jerry

No idea about the popularity of the 7mm Magnum in the lower-48 States, but in Alaska it's popular enough. Not as much as the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM, but somewhat behind these tree calibers. It's a good choice for hunting moose to caribou, but most hunters choose a heavier bullet somewhere around 170-grains on the heavy end. Then 150 to perhaps 170 grains for the .30-06 and .300WM, while heavier bullet weights from 225-250 grains for the .338 Magnum. I imagine that hunters use lighter weight bullets in the lower-48, but not as much in Alaska. For example 210-grains for the .338WM are always talked about in these forums.

By the way, a belt or not on the brass has never steered me away from any of the Magnum calibers above. The belt is nothing i think about when reloading, nor when hunting. I reload my .338's ammo to fit the individual rifle's chamber and bump the shoulder back around .002". On the turret I have a Redding gage to measure the fired cases, then bump the shoulder with a set of competition shell holders. For hunting ammo that I must depend on, I don't reload more than 5 firings, anyway. Lets face it: why would anybody want to fire a 7mm Magnum all the way to a .375H&H held against your shoulder day in and day out? Use a lead-sled to develop loads, and then your shoulder when hunting

Yep, 50-75 fps.

3200 with a 140 is completely doable.

IF it is accurate as well.

I use a lead sled too. Usually when I go check zero each year, I take 8 rifles. I have 7 now that have new scopes. I go to lease #1 in east Texas. I hate gun ranges. I get the rifle on with sled, double check with bags. I have long arms so the sled isn’t awkward to me!

"26" barrel helps"


Not only a 26" bbl, but a 26" pressure test bbl with tight tolerences - a factory rifle bbl that makes those listed velocities would be a rare occurance........

Guess I got extremely lucky with my two

[/quote]

my 280 AI is 2.25 lbs lighter. With 140’s a 3200, there’s not much it won’t do.[/quote]

Maybe ? at insane pressures !


Jerry
[/quote]



My 25" barreled 280 AI overlaps my 23" barrel 7RM until you use 175s or heavier. The 280AI out runs my 7RM with 160s. Maybe a slow vs a fast barrel but more likely 7RM at 62,000 psi and the 280 AI at 65,000 psi. I like the 175s and 180s in the 7RM so it is not obsolete by any means. My 280AI has a 1 in 10 twist barrel I got for a bargain so I stop with 160s in it. My 7RM has a tight chamber and long throat so I run it at near 7 Weatherby speeds pretty easily. With older powders I was leaning on the 7RM to get 3200 fps. But with several powders like R22, MRP, 7828, H1000, R26 and others it is not hard to achieve in both cartridges. One gun writer wrote that just because you can't slam dunk a basketball it doesn't mean other can't. The "Happy" 270 can get 3200 fps with a 130 so not out of bounds at all for the 280AI to do this with 140s. In fact the 270 works so well with some of the newer powders it is chomping on the heels of my 270 WSM and my 7RM.

Mike,

It’s been so long that I don’t remember where we were except out in the country.
I also don’t remember who owned/had the rifle.
We didn’t have any scale of any sort so I won’t even guess its weight.

I DO remember the Marlin 444 ‘marlin’ was noticeably heavier than anything I had.
It was obviously a heavy gun.

It didn’t have a scope, we shot irons.

I remember I shot it a few Xs and it ROCKED me backwards while standing up.

I like the looks of the 444 Marlin but I would HAVE to handle another one to check its weight BEFORE I’d consider buying one.

None of this is intended to be mean or critical. I’ve done my best to recall more details to no avail.


IMO and IME. a good light 7 RM is a terrific compromise in recoil and performance. 140s for deer / 160or175s for Elk, Moose.
65-70 grs powder. Widely accessible ammo/Brass.

The cartridge is perfectly acceptable for Deer —-Moose —-Bear

IME the 7 RM has a better trajectory than 270, 06, and noticeably better than 308, 7-08.

As far as I’m concerned the 7 RM is tough to beat as an ALL AROUND hunting cartridge.

Thankfully I’m not limited to one rifle/cartridge but IF I HAD to be.... the 7 RM rates serious consideration, For ME.

Jerry

Yeah I found a promising load for mine with 162 hornady I was getting 2700 plus with them and RL 26. Then I lucked into a 5 digit stainless classic in a 270 that is stupid accurate. It will stack 150 part into one hole (5shot group). Still putting final touches on my 200 ab load for the 06. But hell might just use this 270 for my hunting season a 150 part going 3045 FPS will kill anything in Alaska.

A. I understand what long throats CAN do.. WBY has been doing it for a long time.

B. My next projectS are to try Rl 22 & 26

C. I've been able to beat 3100 fps in a 270 w/130s with 7828 and Surplus 4831. I haven't made 3200 but have NOT tried hard.
**All 270s I've had are 22" bll not 24 or 26".

D. Yes-- one reason I want to try Rl 26

Thnx

Jerry

All my 270s had 22 or 24" barrels but JB and others had some impressive data for 26" barreled 270s. Basically magnum performance. The 270 to 7RM slot is now overlapped at both ends but still the 7RM cranks out a bit more performance even if only on paper. Glad I started with the 7 Mag as if I had started with a 280 or 280 AI I would have missed out on the others.

R26 is like a progressive version of the old 4831 surplus or 7828 it is an ideal match for the 270 and not too shabby in the 7RM either.

I sell plenty Remington 700`s in a 7 Rem. mag. its really a very fine cartridge accurate,recoil isn`t that bad,and its what I call a grocery store cartridge just one of the few cartridges that can be found in any gun shop,hardware store,maybe a mom-pop store even another hunter may have some.the 7 Rem. mag is a easy cartridge to handload and has many bullets to decide from too. as far as shooting a long ways out yes its great for long distance too,this cartridge also has great ballistics too !

In my experience, usually around 1200 to 1500 depending on how much throttle you’re using.

3400?

Pharmseller is the best Big Game salesman on the Fire...

He may even sprinkle some on his Wheaties....

Can't confirm that...

DF

P.O. ACKLEY BOOK,VOLUME 2,PAGE 182, >>> 139 grain. 71.4 grains 4831 > 3400 fps >> YES ITS POSSIBLE GOOD STRONG ACTION AND ATLEAST A 26 INCH BARREL. > SOME RIFLE BARRELS ARE FASTER THAN OTHERS TOO AND THESE NEWER POWDERS ARE FASTER TOO WITH LESS PRESSURE TOO !

yes it could shoot 3400 fps

As much as I respect the work and person of PO Ackley and like the 7mm Mag, consider the technology of the time.

Drum brakes for example.

for an all around rifle, a 150 grain Partition launched somewhere between 2800 to 2900 fps makes sense to me. and that means 270/280/30-06; Otherwise, roll with a 150 in a 7mm08/308 at 2700-2800 for the short action fans.

any other flavor is a niche rifle.

Heart patients shouldn't read Ackley's book with all the grains of salt they would need.

That load Pete posted is also found in the Hornady Handbook Vol II listed as max. Almost positive Hornady used SAAMI minimum spec bbls to develop loads. Rifle listed is a M700 24"bbl.

I used that data back in the mid 80's to develop a load for a friend's 26"bbl Browning (Golden Medallion?). 69.3gr H4831,CCI250,R-P casings,140gr B-Tip gave 3325fps. Got a slight velocity drop when I added .5gr so went with 69.3.

I'd surely think with advancements over the past 30+ yrs 3400 should be doable.

Good Lord, man, put a Limbsaver on that rifle!






P

P

Hey Pharm

I promise that Tikka 7 R M doesn't kick that hard EVEN off a bench.

I've been shooting/hunting the 270 since 2003 with no problems.

I really wish that some of us lived close enuff together that we could shoot each others rifles.


Jerry

Yeah mathman:

My 700 BDL and those of hunter friends EASILY got 3300 fps and LONG case life.

I arbitrarily 'chose' 3300 fps as my stopping place----- using H B T S Ps.


Jerry

Interesting. I've poured the coal to a couple of 7mm Wby. mags and 3300 was tippy top end.

You guys are in STW territory with those 3400fps 140's.

Back in the 80s when Hodgd. 4831 (new manuf) showed WIDE lot/lot variation-- I quit using it.

I found 7878 to very similar to Surplus 4831 in the 270 W and have been using it ever since.


Jerry

m m - have you given the R M and Wby 7 mags CASES a close look ? They are pretty similar except for neck length.


Jerry

YEP !!

Jerry

I know that quite well. That's why I contrasted tippy top in one with easy in the other. On top of that the longer Weatherby throating allows for a bit more juice.

And the Wby has a higher pressure ceiling than the 7RM.

DF

During my magnum phase you can bet I was up against it too. (Or maybe a little past it. )

I have two T3s in 7mm Rem Mag, they both sport Limbsavers.

Shot one just last week in the 98 degree heat.





Four shots into .527”, not bad. 3100 FPS mv.





P

This is a copy of my SILs 7mmRM but his scope is a Redfield 4x12. He likes it for when they drop down into this big bowl at the bottom of a pass, that's where the bulls are on Opening Day AM. You get "one AM hunt" before they all light out for the Wilderness Area about a mile away! ...I have "peered over into that bowl"...but don't hunt it...ain't no way I want a bull that bad! And they have to pack them out in pieces...at my bolted together 65yrs, I find I'm more of a "late season cow elk hunt" kinda guy, ha. He used the HSM 168 Berger ammo in his Tikka, very accurate.

Yep, there's SAAMI pressure and then there's "Fire" pressure...

Pressure variations noted while testing the 7RM resulted in a lower SAAMI limit, evidently not the case with the 7 Wby.

But, in the hands of an ambitious hand loader, not an issue...

DF

I have owned several 7mm Rem Mags and all shot sub MOA. Back in the 90's I used 140gr ballistic tips and more recentlyTSX with very good results. I have always found the caliber to be very tolerable in the recoil department. With that being said, I have used a 7X57 the last couple of years. In my opinion, the 7mm bore is about perfect for deer.

Over time I've mellowed in my approach. Lately I rarely even load my 308's full throttle.

This^^^^^^^^

But the 7mag isn't new and cool.......

You hold a genuine "Fire" license to load'em to the hilt...

Don't leave anything on the table, go for the gusto...

DF

Seriously I've been shooting 139s at 3300 for many years -> -> -> with LONG case life.

IMO - with many firings above 5Xs and good cases -> -> you're NOT too hot pressure wise and that with several rifles.

Jerry

7RM case capacity is pretty close to the 7 Wby.

So, if you run equal pressures, performance should be very similar.

DF

True, but the "effective capacity" of the Wby is a bit greater due to the effect of the freebore slowing the initial pressure rise. So with the same powder (say IMR7828 which is good in both), you'll burn more powder in the Wby to get the same peak pressure but you'll net more gas at that same pressure and so more work (manifesting in velocity) can be done.

It's amazing what you can do with 65-70K psi...

DF

my daughter was raised in the country, bloodline Norweigan/Swede/German and at about 110 lbs. soak and wet was a cheerleader and a very pretty blonde sweety and now a doctor and she like`s using the 7 rem. mag. she said she never felt the kick or recoil when she shot deer but sure liked how the 7 Rem.mag knocked them down ! so boys if that little lady can handle a 7 Rem.mag. at full load what`s your excuse ? I also have a sniper friend who seen plenty real live action in many countries besides his Whitehouse duties,his favorite cartridge that he hunts big game a lot with is a 7 Rem. mag. and his gun also shoots 140 grain bullet 3400 fps with his handloads ,my sniper friend the only scope he likes is a Schmidt and Bender,he`s plenty fussy.

If I want to shoot 140 grain bullets, I'll use my 6.5x47 lapua. I use a SWFA scope though so I am not fussy.

How about on the 101'st round of a Saturday afternoon's fun shooting?

I could handle 101 shoots no problem even my son could, but can you Mathman ? And no Mathman we use are magnum rifles mostly to kill stuff with ,my family butcher`s,freeze`s and eat what we shoot for big game. Paper holes not that big of a deal anymore, besides this time of year its archery and trap/clay pigeons for me and my family. But next winter your free to join our winter money rifle shoots on Sundays and see how well you can do,we have had National 1000 yard bench champion join us before,yes his score was better than mine but mine was close. So let me know if you need dates ,times and directions to these winter money shoots any cartridge rifle is legal ,we shoot 100 to 500yards.

in 14 pages about a fast 7, the Mashburn has been mentioned only once. The 24HourCampfire is slipping.

What does any of that have to do with the old chestnut about recoil while shooting game?

THAT is the premise that I and a hunting pard used when we ‘began’ loading for the 7 RM back in the 80s.
It works.

Incidentally, my load WAS in Hornady’s manual TOO.

Jerry

See my earlier comment re the comment you quoted.

7-mm Mag: Big brother to the 270 Win.
Or, is it the little brother?

It's all fun and games. Have fun shooting and hunting.

Too Hot here to go shooting. Over 100' F all week.
It is summer time.

Take care

Pharm

Yes, I read it and understood and agree.

IF a fella wanted, he could have a 7R M throat free bored and .....

Jerry

That's a different animal, and I believe BobinNH checked that one out.

I’m not sure there’s anything that COULD be done w/7 Mags that Bob didn’t do or try.
I sure miss him.

I’m satisfied with the 7 RM and 300 WM so I haven’t ventured into the Mashburn.

Jerry

I didn't mean the Mashburn, I think Bob had a long throated 7mm RM built to basically be a "common brass 7Wby".

Understood.

And you’d need an action & mag box long enuff to accommodate proper loading.

But we are not saying there isn't faster 7mags,it's more about what you can get out of it for what you put in it.

7MM Remington Magnum being a standard very common magnum cartridge is just a very fine cartridge and for the average joe who wants a magnum that's has a little less recoil ,ammo is easy to fine, is very accurate even out of the box with most factory standard rifles and for us FFL dealers is a great rifle cartridge to sell in a rifle or ammo ,its a money maker always !

I have a Remington 700 with a 25 inch Lilja barrel in 7mm RM. It's a nice rifle and quite accurate. I've mostly used it for hunting medium game in open country and it's great for that. I prefer my 30-06 or sometimes a .300 Win Mag or .338 WM for elk hunting in the mixed terrain that I usually hunt, but I'll have to use the 7 RM for elk one of these years. It's a fine all around cartridge but I tend to use my .280 and 30-06 more, partially because those are in lighter rifles.

From what I understand in reading Bob Hagels book, the 7 RM was developed, at the time, as an easy to shoot, effective long range, again for the time, rifle/cartridge combo capable of delivering about 2k foot pounds of energy to 300-350 yrds utilizing a 160 grn. bullet at about 3100 fps. When sighted 3" high at 100, PBR is about 325yrds, which means, for the time, a hunter didn`t have to "hold over". In that reguard I believe it succeeded. IIRC, 7 RM loading dies remain in the top 10 yet today.

In reading his book Practical Ballistics etc, I wonder what he would think of the advancements in technology we have today. Are we still "Riflemen", or computer geeks?

Ha ha.. You are probably right...

One thing we can all agree on: The 7mm is a damn good bore size.

Now, that's what I'm talking about. Now I may just back off the charge weight a bit when I make the switch to the CCI250's. I was real impressed with that powder, but didn't realize it's a ball powder until I opened the can. It drops effortlessly out of my powder measure. I'll bring my Chrono next time I take said rifle and loads out to the range. Accuracy seems to be damn good with the multiple charge wt's I've tried. However, not nearly as good as your Tikka. It's a model 70, I won't expect it to shoot quite as well as a Tikka...

My first Magnum was a 7mm Rem and my A-bolt in 7mag still goes with me as a back-up when I go out west. A couple of decades of reloading for maybe 1/2 dozen different rifles has taught me that with a 26" tube, I can usually work up a safe load that will give Roy's version a run for the money with less powder. I have a buddy that is a little recoil sensitive. When he bought his 7mag, we loaded some 139 Hornadys that shot well inside an inch and he has no problem sitting at the bench with me and running a couple of boxes through it. For the most part I've outgrown me desire for magnums. Now days 90% of my hunting is done with a 7mm-08 or a 25-06 (the 270 comes along occasionally just so he doesn't feel left out). Since I discovered how well a 140 Accubond out of my 7-08 Steyr tips over deer, and leaves tight little cloverleaf groups in paper, I just don't break out the 7mag that much anymore. Like BSA said, hard to go wrong with a 7mm.

Yes. The best IMO.

DF, I know about “pressure variations or ‘excursions’ “ in the 7 RM as well as the 243. That has been discussed sufficiently here and M D has relayed the evidence observed in pressure labs >>> so I will not argue.

Now I’m not saying pressure variations do not occur. I don’t know of ANY load I have shot in MANY 7 RMs that has NOT been in 1 or more reloading
Manuals. Many or MOST of my loads are AT or very CLOSE to max from those sources. No denial / No argument.

Obviously I can’t shoot every round over the graph but I’ve shot MANY rounds of MAX loads and thankfully I haven’t turned ONE rifle into Shrapnel.
In 43 yrs of handloading I have ONLY blown 2 primers — using diff lots of H 450 in 270s.

Therefore it seems even the older manuals were NOT over blown.
With pressure variations being real they MUST - be small OR - farther up the loading charges. I Don’t Know.

From my perspective - if you’re shooting 270 equivalent loads in a 7 RM...you might as well shoot a 270.
I don’t apologize for shooting 7 Mag velocities in my 7s.

Jerry

Big fan of the 7 Rem Mag and have been around plenty of game that's been shot with it, but it seems as though most of the folks I hang around are drifting to the 6.5's rather quickly. Maybe we're not tough enough for it, though.

They'll come back to the 7-mm Remington Mag.
It's a great round. And, so are a lot of others.

I have one 7-mm Mag. Getting ready to build another. I'll prolly give it to my son when it's done.

Here is a little history of this great cartridge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8S3wXF9XDs

I O W - too many are pansified ! YEP

....................................................... my ideas and feelings are not PC so unposted.! !

Jerry

Jerry,

Who started that rumor about you not being P.C...??



DF

D F

I really don't know but a 'few' folk come to mind.

I'm just trying to be careful, ya know.

Jerry

The current term for those uncomfortable with 7 RM levels of recoil would be "dainty handed fancy folk". Please try to be more sensitive in the future

Okay.... but I think you are being too KIND.

To those of you dealing with Age, Injuries, & other Health issues are NOT considered in my descriptions. I really am sorry for any liabilities that prevent folks from hunting/shooting what they want.


Whiners, Criers, Wimps, Wusses are the most P C nice descriptions I can think of off hand. Others come to mind quickly tho.





This T 3 X Lite SS 7 Mag is my newest acquisition, 2/2018 so I am anxiously looking forward to hunting it this Fall.
I know I'll start the season with it and MAY hunt the whole season with it. I have a couple of other rifle/cartridge combos that I haven't killed many deer with SO I'll cross that bridge during season. My Win 70 Black Shadow 300 WM may very well get out this yr.



The last year I hunted any 7 Mag was 2014. During the season I drug this (Left) 700 Syn 7 RM out just because I wanted to.
I took the scope off of it and put it on the Tikka.





The first morning I hunted the Syn, this Old 'cull' came out and I felt obliged to remove him from the herd. (fraudeen slip - grin)
He is laying on a hillside and I moved him around for the pic,






Yeah, I know, I killed him TOO DEAD !


Jerry

The 7mm Rem magnum is a historically great round and the first of the magnums I played with during my magnum mania days. I eventually settled on the 160 grain partitions and a max load of about 58 grains of IMR 4350 if my memory serves. That combo shot well in both rifles I had at the time.

Eventually I moved on from the 7 mag and spent years playing with both the 280 Rem and 7mm-08.

These days if I were to go back to hunting with any of these rounds I would surely pick the 7mm-08. But with my featherweight 6.5 x 55 Swede in my hand I don't feel the need to do that.

All good stuff.

I'll go with the (tried, true and universal) 30-06. It'll do anything the 7mm Magnum will - and then some (with heavier bullets).

Nice old deer. He did need to be removed from the breeding pool.

Still an interesting deer.

DF

Thnx D F.

I've killed multiple deer (Doe & Bucks) every year on the 70 acres I'm hunting. Every buck I've shot was the FIRST time I saw it (them).
I can't tell the Does apart <grin>.
The property is surrounded on 3 sides by other owners. The deer come and go at will.

Last year I shot this guy while he was trailing 1 of 2 Does. He was 20 or so yards behind them with his nose on the ground.



I didn't know his left antler was broken till I killed him. My 98 in 284 did him in. I wish he hadn't been broken but he makes an interesting buck as well. He was a fighter.

Jerry

Some years ago, I killed a nice young buck with one antler. We cull hard and if we don’t want’em breeding, we eat’em.

This buck had broken his antler, wasn’t a genetic cull. I felt sorta bad, but ground checking them tells the story.

I’d rather cull first, ask questions later.

DF

Neither was the buck in the last pic. I was on my sticks looking at him with his head down coming toward me on a hard angle. I knew he was trailing 1 of the does but I didn't see the broken antler.

The buck in the first pic was a diff situation. He was in an open pasture with his head up. I could tell he was an adult with good mass BUT
was narrow & high. I had to look CLOSE to see a 3rd point -- we have 3 pt on 1 side minimum legal buck. I did NOT see the little eye guard on his left side but could see the right one.

Both bucks weighed in the 170-175 lb range. I recorded their weights but am going from memory.

Since I can't control anything OFF the acreage I'm hunting, I can't do much good culling but I do what I can.

This year I NEED to remove quite a few Does. My relatives told me yesterday that they were running over w/Does and babies.
Maybe I'll get to ring out the Tikka 7 Mag.


Jerry

Not questioning your probable efforts, once I learned Wby’s like deeper seated bullets my accuracy attempts became much more predictable.

My favorite.... Burgess/Milliron 7mm Rem Mag.

If you are thinking that I am running my loads on the ragged edge, I’m not. I don’t do that. That 140 load @ 3200 is very docile & a pleasure to shoot. It has a 23” barrel.

280 AI weighs 6:15
7 Wby weighs 8:4

My 7 Wby runs 140’s @ 3400 without indigestion, .75 moa. It has a 24” barrel.

Doubt it.



Yeah, 180s and 195s around 3000fps are a lot more fun to shoot than 140s at similar speeds. Real men shoot 338s and bigger.

Why would you "doubt it" Maybe I should sell it to you--- Not-
Or, You're not that smart. You have no idea who I am or what I can do.

I doubt they'll come around because not one of them has mentioned grabbing their custom 7s over their 6.5s since switching to the 6.5s.

I don't know you, you don't know me, and you don't know them, but please tell me I'm wrong again.

Happy B day Whitebird.
I’m STILL waiting for you to sell that 6.5-06 to ME.

Jerry

All right !! A Wby 7 Mag at 8.4 is pretty good IMO.

My 700 Syn 7 RM WAS 8 —9oz scoped.
**My T3X Lite SS 7 RM. IS 7 —9 oz, same scope.

Your 280 AI at less than 7 lbs is good IMO.

There is only 10 OZ diff between my 7 RM & your AI. (Using diff scales)

Jerry

I have run several 700 - 7 RMs at 3300 using IMR 4350 and no problems plus good case life. I never tried other powders attempting 3400 FPS.
(139 HBTSP). 2 of those belonged to me and 3 or 4 others belonged to guys in our lease.

Jerry

ps: Memory kicked in and I’ve had more than 2 700s, there were 2 I forgot about.
sorry

The natural progression of load development with the 7 Wby, accuracy being the goal, led me to 74 gr's RL 22 with the 140 TTSX. Took my first/only Elk with it.

It's pretty hard to get a true lightweight from a Mk V. The action is a serious chunk of metal. But, I still like it.

I can appreciate how that one would be your favorite.

Really nice.

DF

7mm Wby is one of my favorite cartridges, never had one that did not shoot beautifully. Unfortunately most lump them together with other 7mm's

Both my 7mm Weatherby’s seem to like 72.0 gr of MRP behind a 150 gr TTSX @ 3,220 fps. Accurate load as well. One has a 24” barrel and the other a 26”. Neither particularly lightweight. Happy Trails

Too bad they can't put the 7WM in the six lug action like they do the 257 ( I think they have before). I think it is funny how people get bent out of shape over 10 ozs difference. Just take one less beer along and your 2 ozs ahead.

Weatherby vs 7RM, cases are within 1-2 grains capacity if you don't count the neck. The pressure difference is the main thing along with the free bore. But look at the RWS 162 grain 7RM at around 3,150 fps. this is at Euro pressures as for some reason they don't get the pressure spikes like we do or they ignore it. The European chambers may be longer if they follow the example set by the 7x57 so they are almost free bored. Most use American type chambers now.

That's fair. I under stand your point.
Take care.

Nope. The 6 lug doesn't have the diameter to accommodate those belted mags.

Is the light weight the Mark V action? Thought it was the varmint action.

The standard 6 -lug action is for standard diameter cartridges. The only Weatherby Magnum cartridge chambered in a 6 Lug action is the .240 Weatherby. All other belted magnums from .257 on up are chambered in the 9 Lug magnum action. Yes, both are Mark V actions. The lightweight models trim weight elsewhere not from the action itself; bolt, barrel, etc. Vanguards have a 2 Lug Howa action. Happy Trails

I bet there are a lot of 7 mags out there, probably more 06’s and 270’s.

Yes I know there are a LOT of 7s but I’m not sure IF the majority are still used......
many around here at least are turning to lesser cartridges.

ATST I’m sure there are more 06s & 270s in use. I honestly don’t remember why I bought my 1st 270 back in 75/76. I really didn’t know that much about it except JOC used one. Also I don’t remember being aware of the 280 R at the time.

In the intervening yrs. I’ve been up & down the scale of rifles & cartridges. Speaking for myself only, I sure could have done ALL my deer hunting
and killing with one 270, 06, or 7 RM. I’m not so impressed w/the smaller (lesser) cartridges. They will kill deer, elk, etc but the larger cartridges
will give more assurance on larger game AND at long range. (If the hunter is competent with them)

The 7 RM deserves serious consideration as an ALL AROUND hunting cartridge.

Jerry

It’s really good if you handload, using a starting load gives you 7mm 08 performance. If you need more, it’s there if you need to go faster.

I just got a Mossberg Patriot in .300 Win Mag. Now I'd rather have a .300 over the 7mm Rem Mag normally but being that this is a 6.5 pound rifle, I'd rather it were a Big 7. I suspect I'm in for a ride. Good thing my heart issues healed up.

The 7 mag is and has been popular, because it just, plain works, with light, or heavy bullets. I have owned three over the years and killed many deer with it and a number of elk and one moose to boot. I got my first one in a trade and otherwise, would probably have been a 30-06 fan. The 7 was my only rifle for many years and never had an issue with recoil and never an issue getting a load to shoot. I never had any issues with the belt, either. I have two in the safe right now. One is tuned for 139 Interlocks and the other for 160 Partitions. The 139 is loaded to a mild 3100 fps and is fantastic on deer and antelope. The 160 is loaded to 3000 fps and elk definitely do not like it!

I have run the gambit of normal cartridges, including the 6mm Rem, .308 and 30-06. All performed their tasks as well as expected. I have now moved on to become a 6.5 fan, enjoying superb accuracy, slam dunk killing power and super-light recoil. I am pretty much done hauling elk meat off the mountain, so with the additions of my Creed and .260, my 7 mags, along with the other rifles, have started spending way more time in safe.

There is a plethora of rifles that will do their jobs admirably-including the ho hum .270. Some just fill a really good spot in the line up and that is what the 7 mag has always done, and will continue to do.

Since acquiring my first chronograph, my counsel to friends looking for an all around rifle that don’t handload was a 7mm RM. For those that do handloads, I remain a fan of the 06. New powders and bullets make the 06 more versatile. Personally, I’ve not owned the RM as I skipped over it to the STW. 160 Accubonds at 3300+ are awesome on deer and adequate on elk (I prefer 340/338 and 210 Partitions for elk). I did pick up a 7mm-08 for my boys (youth model) and it is dead reliable on deer (I’ll even admit to using it myself now and again). I’m a growing fan of the 270wsm and 140 Accubonds at 3200+. It may prove to be my favorite deer/prairie goat rifle, and know it work on elk in a pinch.

At any distance I'm likely to shoot while hunting, when Moose, Black Bear or Deer stop dying when hit with 150gr Partitions or BT's from my .280 Rem or 7-08 for that matter I might ramp up the 7mag.

We'd all have a hard time finding rifles, and ammo if....
Everybody liked and used the SAME firearm.


Jerry

Then, what would we have to argue about...?

DF

and not get to display good looking rifles .

30-06 and 7mm Rem mag are my two favorite rounds and nothing is even close.

I have a 270 WSM also and also shoot 140 bullets. It’s very very good, less recoil than the 7 mag in my opinion. It’s a Remington 700

My gun shoots faster, flatter, & harder than your rifle.


Jerry

Not everyone can handle, or even want to, a 340 Wby or 338 Win Mag.

I would argue that most people don’t need to, either, but that’s another subject. If you can handle the recoil, why not.





P

How does it feed? I had 2 700 CDL-SF's in .270 WSM a couple years apart. The idea was good but for me they were the roughest feeding rifles I ever owned ... out of a couple hundred. I hoped the first one was just a problem gun. The 2nd was no better, maybe worse.

I hope yours is better.

Tom

It feeds just fine. I have a couple, no issues at all.

Man. I shot an elk with my xxxx caliber and it hit him SO HARD, I saw it KNOCK the ticks off!!


Jerry

Yeah but it didn't split and quarter him like my xxxxx did

yeah but we don't have elk in Ms so I need a really long range rifle so I can hunt without leaving my yard.

I watched my dad shoot a 4x4 bull with his .30-06 several years ago. We were hunting in the rain. I had my scope on 6x, I was maybe 100 yards from the bull. When the 165 grain bullet hit him I saw the water from his hide just explode. It was cool.




P

It had been raining early that morning I shot this Buck and he came out of a thicket.
He was wet and the ground IS wet in the pic.



Seriously, Honestly, at the shot I saw hair & moisture like a puff on his off side. No Kidding.
Similar has happened a few times under the right conditions.

Yes, it is cool.


Jerry

Yeah...but my rifle makes "red mist" fly off 'em! When my Marine SIL came home from Iraq in 2006, the following Feb I took him with me on a cow elk hunt. The road was closed due to a big snow so we went to the desert, shot jackrabbits. I had given him a 22-250. It was about 4 deg were we were at, and at sundown (shooting into the sun) when he hit a jack it blew a 'cloud" of steam out the other side! Crazy cool.

I’m beginning to feel the deer Season opening excitement even though it’s a 100 degrees outside. It’s 2 1/2 months until bow season starts. I have 6 or 8 rifles I need to sight in before rifle season starts.

Well, don't tell anyone (shhhhhh), it is good to read and discuss something other than.......


xxxxxxx ! ! ! (edited, I'm sorry I wasn't P C)


Yeah, I'm really looking forward to hunting my T3X 7 RM. We are HOT in the Wx department and when it's reasonable I have some load development to try and get the scope properly sighted.


Jerry

I need to load some 300 Weatherby’s soon. I have one, buying another.

Sorry, I just lost control for a minute.

Jerry

I have at least 40 rounds loaded for my BLACK SHADOW 300 WM. I sighted it in last Winter with plans to hunt it some
this season. With the new T3X 7 RM ready, I don’t know where the 300 stands right now.
I like the 70 Black Shadow & 300 WM - it AIN’T goin nowhere!!

Jerry

The 7MM Rem. just doesn't give enough extra velocity over the 30-06 .270, .280 class of cartridges to justify the extra recoil and ammunition cost. if you want more penetration, " killing power" etc. The medium bores, (the .375's, .35 Whelen, 9.3X62, 9.3X64 or even the .338) make more sense. Besides after about about 1968 the 7 Mag. had become overwhelmingly boring to me.

I'm late to the conversation about the subject, but have been hunting with my 7mm rem mag for a long time. Was given to me as a college grad gift. Bought the Browning Abolt II Medallion with the boss the first year the boss came out. I think in the early 90's. Was told the brake would help with recoil and the tuning and all that. I don't use the Boss anymore, well because basically its way to loud. I have been using the CR for a long time. Like others mentioned, I have dropped more deer with this rifle than any other in my safe. When I go, its my go to gun and roll on. However, this old shoulder is starting to feel it (old college baseball injury). I swear the Browning recoil pad must be made of granite. I just recently installed a limbsaver recoil pad for it but have yet to shoot it to feel the difference. But all things considered, I have had only 1 deer take more than 5 steps when hit with this gun. Also as others mentioned, it does have a long barrel. I'm in the process of having the local machinist make me a thread protector to cover the threads and remove the boss completely. Would cut down on 3" of basically unused barrel length and basically have a 24" barrel.

Agreed. I have 3 of them. Also like a 270WSM (have 2 of these) which has ballistics almost identical to the 7RM but just not as much variety of bullet weights for handloaders or as much ammo on the shelf at stores.

Just recently acquired a like new Sako A7S (stainless fluted barrel ST stock) in 300WSM and i must say it shoots lights out and with the Zeiss Conquest DL i just put on it, it will be seeing a lot of field time this year!

A 162 grain bullet with a G1 of .631 started at 3100 fps gets it done, and gets it done for a long way. I don’t see much more recoil than my .30-06 loaded with 180 grain Partitions.





P

The 7 mag hits hard and will shoot a long way. It’s hard to beat!

Has anyone been using or have tried the Hornady precision hunter 162 eld-x round? I'm thinking of trying these out.

After years of listening and reading, I have come to the conclusion that the 7 Remington Magnum is in company with a lot of other cartridges. It is a fine cartridge and serves well, but is neither better than nor worse than any number of other cartridges in its same general class.

Yes, Indeed. And a 140 HBTSP at 3300 fps ain't shabby either. ( a load I've been shooting & killing with for years)

The 7 RM shoots better B C bullets at HIGHER velocities than the 270 and esp the 06.
The subsequent flatter trajectory does show up past 300 yds.

Jerry

My go to bullet is the 160 Partition. Great performance on everything I've taken with it from Alaska/Yukon moose to Coues deer.

And reduced wind drift uncertainty, too...

Jwall, in my old 7, I have a load that shot 3400fps.. Haven't checked it for a while, but it was checked a number of times... Shot in 3" high it shot a bit less than 24" at 500 yards.. I could still go up about a grain and a half.. We have killed everything from coyotes, antelope, mule deer, whitetails, elk, caribou through moose with this load.. I use 140 gr. BTBT.. Lately, I have been shooting a .270 quite a lot.. Great caliber, but a 7mm mag. it isn't..

I use these bullets in my handloads. One big 6x6 bull, one big cow elk. One shot each, dead within feet of impact. I think the factory stuff is 120 FPS or so slower.

That’s the load I was referencing in my earlier post.





P

W C H - I have been very pleased with the 139 BTSP on WT. I've shot them as close as 12' straight down- out to as much as +/- 400 yds.

The 270 Win is one of my favs and it ain't shabby but with 150-160 gr bullets the 7 RM is out in front.

Most, I repeat, Most standard calibers CAN'T keep up with the Mighty, Magnificent 7 R Mag.


Jerry

Reading is great but ......

Have you used the 7 R M much or at all ?

The proof is in the USING.


Jerry

Thanks. Must have missee that.

I run a 280AI, 162 ELDX’s on top of a full case of RL26 and CCI 250’s. No need for a silly belt.

Yeah them F Is is full of pixie dust.
Amazing it is how fast a few grains is in a little more space.


PRESSURE ? ? no matter


Jerry

I got to have a belt or my pants will fall down!!

I hear with sharper shoulders of an AI you can get suspenders that work just as well as belts. All depends on what’s in style I guess. 😜

Never did get to ask any dead animals if they knew if they were hit by a 30-06, 7mm Mag, 270.....etc. thinking all they ever knew was that they were hit.

You can often interview the ones hit by a .270 if you can catch back up to them.

That’s a poor attempt to discredit ANY cartridge.

38 Specials kill just as dead.

25-20 kill just as dead.

The ‘quantity’ of dead is not the question.


Jerry

And saying the 7mm mag is the messiah is just flat out retarded. With that it does push very good quality high BC 7mm bullets to a very good velocity which makes it damn near perfect for 99.9% of all North American hunting. But, it’s more about the 7mm than the Remington Magnum. I can get factory 7mag velocity out of my AI safely all day long. So do several other cartridges. Not saying that the 7mm Rem Mag is [bleep] but it doesn’t hold sole ownership of that velocity gap with same weight 7mm bullets nor was it the first to do it. The Mashburn was and is a far better design. Would I do a 7mm RM ? maybe. But, I would pick and choose the rifle it was in and, it would likely wear a custom barrel with a custom chamber to avoid all the drama.

To add, I can’t think of any animal a 7mm Rem Mag can cleanly kill with factory ammunition that a 270 or 30-‘06 couldn’t kill cleanly with factory ammunition and they are just as popular. Again, not saying it isn’t a fine cartridge but, it sure isn’t the one and only nor the best. As that claim is and always will be an opinion and that is and always will be a variable.

yes we can all build custom cartridges to be bigger and better than a 7mm rem. mag but here`s the deal 99.9 % of sporting good stores,ma-pa stores even some grocery -gas stations that have rifle ammo will have 7 mm rem. mag.. so try and find some custom ammo if lost,forget ammo or ran out of your super custom ammo ? its always best on a hunt away from home to use a grocery store type cartridge its the indian not the bullet who brings home the meat.

Simply post ONE quote of anyone in this thread who said that ! 1

Talk about retarded


Jerry

I do remember Jack O'Connor saying something like "Try as I might, I could never detect any differnce in effect beween the 7mm Remington mag and the .270"

The title. “ As good as it gets “.

And there is nothing that a “good Indian” can’t kill with a 30-06 or 270 that he can with a 7mm Mag. Thinking Ma and Pa Kettle have more ‘06 ammo to boot. I hear it’s even killed a buff and elephant or two.

7 RM feels like wearing suspenders and a belt, the 280AI is more like spandex yoga pants with plumbers cleavage to boot. The AI can't equal the 7RM mag. with 180s just taint so. And if run at equal pressures taking away the AI lead the 7RM will always out run the AI maybe not by much but it will.

A lot of what you can get out of a 7mag depends on the barrel,bullet and powder used.There are some barrels that are fast and some that are slow.Some powders reach their peak with less than desired velocity and some powders are just outstanding.You match the right bullet with the right powder,a fast barrel and you have an awesome 7mag.

Well brinky, dinky, doo




That’s a long way from being messiah.

Jerry

Just use a 7mm Weatherby mag and you'll leave the .280 AI in the dust. Friend of mine uses a 7mm STW. Better yet.

And even a 7mag with 180’s don’t make it a serious big bear gun. Just taint. Not to mention that ammo ain’t on the Wal Mart shelf. Anywhere you find 7Mag in assortments you’ll likely bumble into 300 Win Mag. Just saying. Again for the umteenth time, the 7 Remmy Mag don’t suck. It just isn’t magical in doing what has already been done. And saying it is “as good as it gets “ doesn’t ring true. Period. Good yes. Very good, highly likely. As good as it gets, No damn way!
And saying my handloads suck in my 280 AI running 162’s an RL 26 at well over 3K with ease is the same as saying premium 7mm Rem Mag ammo blows.
For everything on this continent less big pissed of bears the 7 Rem Mag is ideal. But so are a lot of cartridges and they do it just as well. And in previous posts made by many others the 7 Rem Mag has it’s issues that can make it undesirable to many. Out.

Bob Hagel had the 280 improved 80 years go.. He found the belted 7mm case a better round, faster, flatter, and harder hitting.. In these days before range finders and turrets they were important to western hunters.. For shooting deer in the east a .30-30 is pretty good... Unless you choose to hunt where longer shots are possible... if a 7 mag isn't a big bear gun a 280 sure isn't as good!!!!

Yep. Hagel dug the Mashburn. Which is what the Rem Mag should of been. And if I were to go belted magnum that’s what I would do. However I went with the 280Ai for a couple reasons. I had a 30-‘06 I was bored with and wanted a 7mm. I wanted a little more than a 280 Rem. And I had about 800-1000 premium, Lapua and other sorted,weighed and turned ‘06 cases laying around. It gives me the performance of the 7 Rem Mag at factory spec on ‘06 brass. And it will kill anything on this continent light of angry big bear without issue at any range I will shoot at. One would need to shoot an awful lot of game with both to notice the slightest difference between the two.

Well if and since 458 Win ( Mr. Phil ) says the 30-06 with proper bullets is good and dependable Brown bear medicine.......

the 7 RM with proper bullets IS a little better.


Jerry

What’s well over 3k... 3600-3800?

I carried a 7RM when a fishing guide in Alaska. Only rifle I owned at the time. Never had to use it but it was sure a comfort to have for several close encounters. I figured the bears didn't read the gun rags and would probably be more than slowed down by a 175 Nosler partition. The locals used 243, 25-06 and even 22 Rim fires on both the brown ones and the white ones so I figured I was good to go. I would need bigger cajones to try the 22 RF on a Brownie.

Now I would skip the 300 and go to the 375 if given the choice. The 175 Nosler will usually out penetrate a 180 30 caliber but the 200 .30 will usually out penetrate both of them.

If I could hunt the Big Bears I wouldn't stay home if all I had was a 7 Rem Mag. And I'd feel pretty well armed actually.

Hooooly Mooooly -

There is hope for you yet ! ! !
Who'd thunk ?


Jerry

LOL! I didn't say I'd rather have a 7mm over a 45-70 ya know.

CRAWFISH ! !


Jerry

I wouldn't either, but if I had the kind of money to hunt big bears in the first place I'd take a minimum of a 30-06 and 200 gr NPT's . Good enuf for Phil it's good enuf for me. I'm only 63 and been shooting the 06 and 7 mm Rem Mag since I was 15. Don't see either lacking using the right bullet. Les Bowman who basically invented the 7 mm Rem Mag that Mike Walker fine tuned into the 700 in 1962 shot elk and G bears with it. Another argument that needs to desist until most understand the nut behind the butt needs to be up to the job before worrying about picking nits.

When I made my first trip to South Africa, '96, my Afrikaner friend/Lay Minister/professional Hunter "hated" the 7mm Rem Mag! When I pressed him on just "why", it was the bullet. At that time, some of you will remember< Remington was pushing the 162(?) Extended Range Ammo. It was just a simple thin jacketed, hollow point, soft bullet meant to open at long range. Two hunters, two trips back to back, came with the same ammo and would not listen to his recommendations of 300WM/180 grain. He was forced to shoot/finish every bigger antelope that they shot. Cape eland, zebra, hartebeest and several Blue Wildebeest. He used a 300WM and the old 180 Speer Mag Tip bullet. All their bullets had broken up and were found barely through the hides. They were all shooting shoulder shots he said. I brought him the first Barnes he had ever used, the 180XBT for his 300WM and I was using the old Barnes 250X/35 WAI. I only found two bullets from the Whelen after about 2 1/5 to 3 ft of zebra and Kudu! I shot Impala/Blesbuck/zebra with his 300WM/180XBT.It was pure poison and didn't ruin any meat. I told him a 7mm Mag with even the 150-160 Barnes would do just like His 300WM. He was still soured on the 7mm Mags! Some folks are hard to convince. Wait a minute...did I just say that Afrikaners are "hard headed"...? lol

Nothing wrong with a 7mm pushing bullets at speeds that the 7mm Remington Magnum is capable of. Never said there was and quite frankly I think those speeds are quite ideal. I would be contradicting myself if I said there was because that is what I get with prudent loading of my AI. However I disagree that the 7mm Remington Magnum is as good as it gets. And that has been my sticking point from post one. The 7mm Remington Magnum has a lot of baggage with it as far as case design and erratic pressure. TO ME that is enough for me to steer clear of it. I can count the number of boxes of factory ammunition I have bought in my life on one hand. My dad was a machinist who loved to load his own ammunition and so have I since age ten or twelve. What’s on the shelf means squat to me. Factory ammunition that I have looked at for the 7mm Remington Magnum in any weight spec out at the same or very close with what I can get with my 280 AI. The SAAMI spec 280 and the 280 AI are far more efficient than the 7mm Remington Magnum and that is more appealing to me. And at the end of the day the 7mm Remington Magnum won’t do anything noticeably more than my 280 or 280 AI. If I were to go to a bigger belted magnum it would likely be the Mashburn,Weatherby or better yet a non-belted Dakota with a custom barrel and chamber to avoid the issues that the Remington suffers in factory guise.

Funny to here a guy bitch about “erratic pressure”... then proceed to load his AI at 70,000+ psi....

Whatever you’re doing with the .280 AI... you could do with the 7 Rem... but at sane pressure.

Hear ! Hear !

That’s been my contention all along. As Well, one of our Profs & Mentors has testified moren once that
the 280 AI does not = 7 RM velocities EXCEPT at HI pressures.

Jerry

A lot more wear and tear on your rifle to load at high pressure.

Not really when you compare book or quick load data for the AI and then factory Remington or Hornady loads for the 7mm Rem Mag. Last I looked at a box of Hornady 7mm Mag 162 ELDX precision hunter ammunition It is running at 2940 FPS out of a 24” barrel. The Hornady manual shows three loads getting that from a Kimber Montana in 280 AI with a 24” 1:9.5 twist. That’s with RL19,RL22 and H4831. Quick Load shows RL26 running the same bullet in the AI a wee bit faster over the 3K mark. Now I know you can hand load the 7 Mag hotter , that’s a given. But if you’ve been paying attention from the start I have said that I can get 7 Mag factory performance out of prudent and safe loading with my AI. And many others for years have reported pressure spikes for supposedly no apparent reason with the 7mm RM. Is that due to piss poor quality control of the rifle? I don’t know. But I have no need to venture down the 7mm Remington Magnum road when I can get just as good of performance and hunt the same game at the same ranges as effectively with what I have. If I wanted more out of a 7mm I would skip by the Remington and bypass the drama.

Keep telling yourself bro.....

If you’re running 3k with a 162 outta the .280 AI.... then you could run the same bullet at 3150 outta the 7RM.... given equal pressure.

I know.... I know... AI fairy dust and unicorn farts make it “more efficient”..... but that’s straight bullschitt.... there’s no replacement for displacement.

I’ve owned and shot the crap outta several .280 AIs, none of them could hang with real 7 Mag loads.

Well, look who showed up! This thread will be over in a heartbeat now that Mr. I wanna argue with every single person I possibly can is here.

Let the name calling begin and self appointed heroes be recognized! Seriously dude! Whatever in the Sam he'll is wrecking your world you need to root it the he'll out of your life start living man!



Trystan

And in what universe does 150fps make a chit bit of difference when hunting critters in North America. That was rhetorical, none. Not even when considering what cartridge is as good as it gets. Any difference between the two is purely lost in the field and is only evident with a chrony. I’ll run an AI because it makes sense with the performance it gives me and with over 800 pieces of high quality brass I have on hand, more loads per pound, efficiency, etc. You can stick with your 7mm Rem Mag that makes you feel better for whatever reason that feeds your fantasy. If it makes anyone feel better I’ll make sure to tell all the dead animals that I shot them with a magnum so they don’t feel cheated when they fall over dead. Now off to the shop to load some dangerously high pressure rounds that will only bounce of critters because there ain’t no belt to make’m go fast nuff.

Good thing the inter web and this forum wasn’t around when Bell was toting his 7X57 around killing critters in Africa or when Hemingway was knocking over Kudu and Buff with his loley ol’ ‘06.

Says the dude who calls everyone “cowards”......

Yes, no and maybe all at once.
Less than Big Bear.... as in polar, coastal brown and pissed off interior grizz you are, in this day and age, over gunned for 99% of what you are doing. The true American Hero in that sense is likely the 6.5 Creedmoor. It will dispatch Moose Elk and most other heavy hoofed cud chewer on the North American continent with relative ease and with much less racket and recoil. Ammo can be had and any Wal-Mart in the country. Designed from the ground up to be efficient, reliable and accurate you can't knock it, even with the 7mm Remington Magnum. The darling Big 7 is a hot mess when you look at efficiency, ease of loading and any other category for that matter. However, ran in safe mode with factory ammo it will get the job done on anything in NA even with all it's baggage. But at that speed it is no more and no less a 280 Rem or 270 Win. in any practical hunting scenario.

For the Great Bears; Not very many get to hunt those boys anymore and if you do I'm sure you wallet can get you something with a little more dazzle than the lowly 7mm Remington Magnum. "In a pinch" rumor has it that spray works better on an angry grizz.

You can have my share of the Gaymoor. I don't wear a man bun or Chic jeans..

The #s don't lie. The lowly 270 Win is AHEAD of the 6.5 C for at Least 600 yds before it catches up

The 7 RM even more than that.

They are NOT in the same class. Less is NOT more


Jerry



rant over

Jerry: you sound like a good guy...stubborn, but good.

I agree....with real 7 Mag loads. The problem is 95% of hunters don't load their own and most are using factory ammo. Some I've seen is only 100 fps faster than 280 ammo with the same bullet and I know Federal has 150 Partitions for the 270 that are only about 100 fps behind their 160 Partition in the 7 Mag.

Doesn't matter to me what someone uses, but I hear too many around here who shoot factory ammo talk up the 7 Mag like they have a real advantage over someone using an '06, 270 or 280 when it's not really doing anything the others aren't.

I have some Fed TBT's to try. These 160's or the140's should be interesting in the 7RM.

www.midwayusa.com/product/369466/fe...grain-polymer-tipped-boat-tail-box-of-50

DF

Yeah ! He who stands for nothing.....

will fall for anything !


Jerry

Yep. The 7mm Remington Mag will be a helluva good gun up to Moose and elk at any practical range. And like I’ve said no less than five or six times, it isn’t anything magical or special. But some people, no matter what figures you put in front of them think it kills things deader. There’s a sucker born every day I guess especially when it comes to the magnumitis belted cartridge cult. I guess case design,efficiency and functionality don’t hold water.

Should we bow to your superior knowledge?? Have you hunt most of North American game or is this an internet jockey???

I’ve heard good things and they look like they would be ideal. Only problem is they always seem to be on back order every time I order bullets and Hornady 162 ELDX’s end up in my cart.

W C H

None are so blind as those who will see..

None are so deaf as those who will not hear..

None are so ignorant as those who will not learn..


I quit 'trying' to talk to a fence post.
There's no substitute for experience.


Jerry

And I suppose you are because you hail from the great “out west.” What I do know and,anyone with an eighth grade education could figure out is, that if factory 7mm Mag ammo is the “ideal” for everything load than anything that duplicates said holy grail is it’s equal. A 7mm Mag factory load moving a 162 gr. bullet at 2940 FPS (Hornady Precision Hunter not some outdated chit) and a 280 Rem or 280 AI handload doing the same or bit better SAFELY will do the same job. For that matter any cartridge that can take North American big game up to moose and elk at like distances as the 7 Mag is just as good. Anyone that has the coin to chase the big bears ain’t doing it with a 7mm Remington Magnum.

It's amazing how many guys feel threatened by the 7mm Rem Mag. I know one thing, Big Bears keep getting kicked around here and I'd sooner have Remington's Big 7 in that situation than a 270, 280 AI, or 30-06 even.

You can’t beat a 7 mag, it has speed and power with out insane pressure.

I don't care what anyone uses. Most hunters are using factory, check out some of the ammo sites and their listed velocities...I'd like to chrony these and see if they are even as advertised as some I've chronied was a solid 200 fps less than they claimed. I'm just not sure exactly what the 7 Mag will do the others can't?



I'd agree...when loaded to it's potential. But since 95% of hunters are using factory...really not much real world difference other than in their minds. I know one guy I hunt with has told me about how powerful his Big 7 is...I think I'll pack my chrony next hunt and run his factory loads through then watch the look on his face. Another who hunts with a 270 bought a 7 RM because he "wanted something a lot more powerful". He shoots factory too....

A 280 is about the only one of the more common 7mm’s I don’t own. I couldn’t see having a 280 when I own several mags.

my 7RMs stay in the safe cause the 280 does all I need done.

I think that one has to clarify how a fellow is going to "use" a rifle....."point & shoot" up to a realistic distance and or/ use Kentucky windage/holdover or dial in for longer distance/windage correction" type hunts/shoots.
For "Me", I'm a "point & shoot/Kentucky windage/holdover guy." I think the majority of guys are too. I want to zero my rifle at a known distance, measure the drop out to 500 and "holdover" or "subtend with reticle". The "ideal" is a flat shooting round with good energy/bullet performance" at the target. Before we had the lighter weight monometal bullets or Premiums, we got best results with Magnums, for their speed with a mid-weight to heavy bullet with good BC. Now, we "point & shoot" guys can do very well with smaller rounds that use 110s-130s that can shoot through elk broadside at 500yds, most of the time. We can reach even further out by using the same weights/styles projectiles in a Magnum, again, for more speed.
Drop back to dialing them in, and you can kill game over 1000yds with some very small rounds...but this is a special skill that one really has to study/develop in. Its 'still" dang hard to know how fast the winds is blowing in a short grass prairie just by using "indicators, ha. It eats my lunch and pops the sack in my face, I admit it! But I can/have made some 375-405yd kills. I like to hit animals with enough mass/momentum to break them down, so I use more "powerful" rounds than some do, but they do OK. I just "don't want him that bad" to chance gut shooting him...but again, that's my "choice". So, in my mind, again, the 7mm Remington Magnum with a 120TTSX is one flat shooting monster...and the 140-150s factory loads get er done pretty well. More powder, more speed with the same lighter weights, "in my opinion". Being a "finite" creature, the more I know the more I realize I don't know, so I "can" be wrong...:)

The 7RM is more gun than the 280 to me. The 280AI it is almost a wash and I doubt many could tell any difference in field performance with the 160 grain and under bullets. For longer ranges the magnum has an edge with 168 and heavier bullets.This edge may be more under the cap than in reality but it is there on paper and in actual performance.

Guys, the following quote comes from another thread per a diff subject but the truth applies to a lot of things, THIS thread not withstanding.





It's NOT hard to tell those who HAVE experience from those who DON'T.


Jerry

There's an old saying that goes; "Not every 7mm mag owner is an idiot, but every idiot owns a 7mm Mag."

While there are certainly plenty of intelligent sorts who have hunted with the 7mm Mag, when these threads come up and the round is defended by guys like ClarkM, jwall, and pete53, it's pretty clear to see that the saying holds true. The only potato who seems to be missing is Ringman.

160 gr+/.600+ BC/3000+ FPS...... is what defends the 7 Mag... the numbers don’t lie. That’s rare air.... suffice the other mid-7s (WSM, Bee, Mash, Rocket Fuel loaded .280AI, etc), there’s only a handful of cartridges that can meet/exceed that trifecta..... and they all recoil WAY more.

And an argument can be made with modern bullets and powders that the numbers for the 7 RM/WSM/Wea/Mash/etc jump up to 180 gr+/0.750+ BC/2950+ fps...with very reasonable recoil and component cost.

You two make good points, and I'm not denying the 7 Rem Mag's effectiveness. Same thing with BobinNH and JGRaider.....guys who also used the 7 Mag to take lots of game.

It's some of the other users who make the 7 Rem Mag hard to love.

I love the 7rem . Love the creedmoor too. Both cartridges merits escape you. Sad

Here’s a hint.Both of the cartridges merits are the same. Both have short OAL in regards to their action length , both push high bc bullets at speeds impressive enough that they will beat cartridges that burn double (or more) powder at twice the recoil .. I know it’s all so confusing

Yeah, I know, I killed him TOO DEAD !

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

that is just one of many WT I've killed with 7 R Ms. As I said in that post, I moved him for the pic-- I only turned him 180*. That is where he was standing and fell. I rotated him so his back was on the uphill side.

Notice the red (blood) line angled away from his right hip. That is where the bullet drew ,sucked , or blew blood and mucous from his off side.

My comment per "too dead" was sarcasm. I give most people credit for knowing there's no such thing as "deadER"

** What I like about the 7 mag and other Hi Speed rounds is Flatter Trajectory ** Out to 400 yds. there is NO hold over the back line.
Out to 500 yds the drop is +/- 24" With an 18" (at least) depth, you need only to hold a FEW inches above the hair line to put the bullet in the boiler room. FLAT TRAJECTORY.

Jerry

I have two 7 mags. A Browning 1885 High Wall in 7mm RM and a Remington 700 Ti in 7mm RSAUM. The Browning is basically a safe queen now, but it shoots 145 Gr. Speer Grand Slams darn near in the same hole and has accounted for my longest west Texas muley kill at 603 yards. I've got some old factory Federal Premiums ammo that used the 150 gr. Sierra BTSP that I've clocked at 3150 fps and they shoot as well as the Speer GS. It was too pretty a gun to be hauling around in the jeep so I bought a Model 7 in 7 RSAUM, but never did like the 20 inch barrel and thought I was giving up too much velocity. I finally found a 700 Ti in 7 RSAUM and traded off the Model 7. That Ti shoots 140 gr. Barnes TTSX's at 3050 fps and consistently under .5 MOA and has accounted for more west Texas muleys and whitetails than I can shake a stick at.

Neither rifle has been a mule kicker.

Sadly, they are BOTH safe queens now. I've used a 700 CDL in 7/08 with 140 gr. Accubonds and took a good whitetail at 302 yards last year. He just spun around and fell over. Now, I've purchased a Barrett Fieldcraft in 6.5 X55 and that will probably turn everything into safe queens.

rosco1 - you think so...... The Following is from a Thread in Ask Gunwriters 2/15/18






There is MORE in that thread VERIFIED by another Friend of BobNH. I can pull it up! ! ! I can also highlight the 6.5 C's deficiency.

I'll keep my 270s & 7 mm RM

Thank You Very Much

Jerry

Why is the Creemoor interjected into almost all topics? Do it's proponents have some sort of short cartridge inadequacy they have to expound on whenever possible?

It's a great cartridge but for the average Joe others like the 25-06, 270, 6.5x55, 6.5&7 SAUM, 280 & AI and many more beat it from a little to a lot within typical hunting ranges.

The 7RM has the magical 30 degree shoulder and if it only had a longer neck it would be as modern and good of a design as can be. The belt is not worth rehashing.

On a windy day a 7RM with 168-190 grain bullets would clean most Creedmoors clocks at 1000. Long term the Creedmoors may come out ahead as they are more shooter friendly and more consistent.

Not damming by faint praise but the 6 & 6.5 Creedmoor are one of the best Ladies and Youth cartridges around, the 6.5 especially if game larger than deer is on the agenda. For larger game it doe's have at least a theoretical advantage over the other contenders like the 243 & 250-3000 which are also great rounds for young hunters.

Bob Brister wrote that the 7RM was the best long range cartridge around for the average hunter (circa 1970-80? CRS). This after Bob and friend Jack Carter had shot a couple Cape Buffalo with the 7RM and thought it may have dropped them more quickly than the 375 they were using before on Buff. Things have changed since Bob made that statement but not that much. In fact with better bullets which Jack Carter helped with by introducing the Trophy Bonded Bear Claw the 7RM is even better. Bob Brister was pretty much a straight shooter no BS type of person. He was not given to hyperbole. Jack Carter when I asked him what he would set the limit on for one of his 175 TBBC in a 7RM his reply with no hesitation was Eland.

Tejano

“ Why is the Creedmoor interjected into almost all topics ? “

In this thread the 7 RM is old and the 6.5 C is the Blonde Daughter a lot of people wanted.
It is also the Newest Fav and nothing old can compare. ( I know it’s been around a while)
It is the “Darling” of the WANNA B in crowd.

However numbers don’t lie ! We have trusted veteran hunters & shooters who’ve put it down range and LAUGHED.

I can learn from others.

I ALREADY know what my 270s and 7 RMs DO and have been DOING for me.
I certainly can go on but some will never admit the C is not the Be All End All.
I say go for it, have at it. Be GLAD I’m not competition for your components.

Also, I’m not afraid to shoot the 8mm Rem Mag, 375 HH, or 416 Rem Mag.
Incidentally - Belted Cases don’t give me hives.

I really can CONTINUE.........

DONT shove it down my throat.


Jerry

Amazing really

I haven't got on board with any of the 6.5's. But then I never got on board with any of the 6mm's either. I've had a number of 270's but I don't generally stray below .30 caliber. I may get another 7mm eventually though.

The ss M7 in 7 mm RSAUM I bought has a 22" factory barrel when do you they lengthened or shortened them? MB

Agreed. After all the hullabaloo buying components, working up loads, burning up powder, etc. trying to make the 7 RM “all that and a bag of chips”, the 7mm Weatherby is already there and will shoot the velocities printed on the box.

The gas station ammo argument doesn’t hold water. I’m sure the brand/grain cartridges that you find in Bumfuque, Montana will hit the same side of the barn as those the rifle was zeroed with. If a fella can’t keep up with his ammo and spares, maybe he ought to stay on the porch. Happy Trails

Agreed - but I'm NOT saying all Wby factory ammo does this but we have seen pix of brass AFTER they were shot.....

too hi pressure -- NOT reloadable. Some... is 1 shot is all you get in the brass.

I'm NOT a Wby hater by a long shot.


Jerry

Yeah, my bad. It was a 22" barrel. It's been so long I couldn't remember. I wanted a 24" barrel anyway.

Barrel stretching tool from Brownells, 119.85. Catalog number DH-276890

After reading this thread through It looks like a grade school debate. A lot of noise and no one paying attention. The 7mm Remington Mag has been called a good cartridge by most all involved if anyone has read past the first line of a response. It is. And been called “ideal” by those who don’t even shoot it. What is truly amusing to me is that even though it’s ballistics have been praised by all sides it is debated that it is the only cartridge on the planet that can do it. And, that game can only be killed by the 7RM. I don’t understand how one can praise one 7mm running a 160 class bullet at 3K but condemn another that does the same when those loads are both within safe operating limits. I’ve owned and shot a few 7 Rem Mags and they have done well. But, nothing magical. I’ve had 300 Win Mags, WSM, Etc that have done just as well and with quality stocks don’t kick that bad either. A few 25-06’s 7-08’s 270’s 280’s 280 AI’s 30-06’s 8 Mags and on and on. Never had an issue killing anything. Now I shoot a 6.5 Creedmoor mostly and it does what I ask. I shoot it a chit ton and I know exactly what it will do and at what range. It is effective up to moose. So is the 7mm Remington Mag. Is the 7 Mag flatter,faster more powerful etc? Yep. But I don’t NEED a 7 Mag. Nor does anyone else to hunt south of great bears. “As good as it gets “ is a variable and an opinion. Everyone has one and it’s different. Is the 7mm Remington Mag as good as it gets? Yes but, it’s not the only one and it’s not any “better.” When you don’t appreciate and respect other’s opinions your opinion doesn’t count. You only end up looking like an ass and your point is lost.

Geez, where do you come up with such nonsense? I have never seen nor heard of “one shot Weatherby brass”. We’ve all heard of unicorns and dragons yet never documented actually seeing one! LMAO

I had good life from my 7mm Wby brass, and in those days I was not under loading it.

I have not been gentle with my 7mm and .300 Weatherby loads and have stoked up some pretty hot loads using previously fired Weatherby brass. I have had a couple of loose primer pockets after 5 or more firings of mild to wild loads working up new loads, but some of my brass has 8 to 10 firings with no ill effects. Weatherby brass made by Norma is pretty good stuff. Never had a case head separation or cracked neck, unlike a bunch of Winchester and Federal brass in my son’s 7mm RM. Happy Trails

Try RE Reading what I said. Pix have been POSTED here on the 'fire' w/in the past couple of years.

I have NO reason to lie, I like Wby rifles and have NO ax to grind.


Jerry

ps: just because you have not seen it does NOT mean it doesn't exist.

I’ve only had factory loaded Weatherby blow primers in 270,7mm and 30-378.. in fairness the 7mm was loaded by Remington.

It’s not uncommon. And you can get nearly 3 loads out of the latest Norma brass before its shot, that is if you can get a primer in it to begin with.

If you run factory ammo for the 7 Rem Mag all you have to do is get Hornady Superformance. A 139 at 3,240.

Well then READ this:




WAM - when you BLOW primers - there is[/b] NO reloading the brass.[b]

I'm restraining myself -- THIS TIME. I'm NOT a liar. I won't be so nice next time.


[/b]THANKS ROSCO1[b] I know you didn't have to post that. I really appreciate it.

Jerry

f this I can say.....the 7 RM isn't worth 32 pages of discussion on any forum.....it is what it is.....an over glorified .270 Winchester.

Jwall,

Not calling you or anyone else a liar or intentionally insulting anyone. Blown primers on any factory ammo are pretty rare indeed. I fired many rounds of Weatherby ammo before converting to handloading and have never heard of blown primers. I have been on more forums than this one and it’s the first I’ve heard of blown primers being common. I could give a chit what Roscoe or anyone else says.

Counterpoint: your original comment did not say pics have been posted on the Fire, you said we have seen pics....

Don’t worry about being so nice to me on the Fire. Keyboard commandos and cyber ninjas don’t frighten me one bit.

Just stick to the facts as you know them as opposed to other folks chatter. Don’t be like the Fake News networks....

I'd take the 7 Rem Mag over the .270 or .30-06 for all around hunting every day of the week. And I've owned and used multiple examples of all three.

Take whatever you want.....it doesn't change the fact that the 7 RM is simply an overglorified .270

What factory ammo gives that performance? 95% of hunter's aren't getting this "rare air".


And they have a 270 load with the 130 at 3200 fps. If I was going to use the 7 RM with this ammo, I'd go with the 154 or 162 grn.


+1...the true potential isn't available to the majority of hunters who are using factory ammo.

Hornady 7mm Rem Precision Hunter Factory ammo stat line is: 162/.631/2940.....that’s pretty f’n bad ass.... and awful tough to whoop.

Id love to see a factory .270 Win load that can hang with that....glorified or not.

Nosler LRAB 150g @ .591 is close with 2960 FPS off the shelf. Subtract 30 FPS for hype and barrel differences, still 2930 is right there. And, it’s happening in a flaming flyweight 270 WSM rig...Rainbows are nice to see while hunting. 😎🌈

.270 WSM can hang...... it’s also the 7mm Rem Mag’s Gay Cousin....

DS, you crack me up! 😂

Happy Trails

180 grain ELD, .796 bc, 3020 fps from 25" 7mm Rem Mag barrel
195 VLD, .751 bc, 2890 fps from 25" 7mm Rem Mag barrel

The ELD had issues for me when hitting at over 2600 fps. The VLD not so much. The 180 Scenar has proven to be a very good killer. Its splitting hairs, but I don't see a 270 keeping up with those two loads.

.................................Cannot really argue too much with the above.....EXCEPT imo, the 7mm Rem suffers from toocommon-itus. Not the cartridges fault. It is a great round. Been around almost 60 years. The majority who own 7mms, probably own a 7 Rem Mag.

The 28 Nosler.....Power? Ammo availability? Brass availability? No problem......Chambered by every rifle maker? I don't care.

Toocommon-itus? Nope. Which is why I have a 28 Nosler....

Fact is,you don’t know much.

What the heyyyy...., Who Died and made you the Queen or are you a [/b]Natural Queen ?[b]

[/b]You CAN'T and don't have the Right to tell me or anyone else WHAT to do.[b]

It's one thing to be IGNORANT, it's something else to be WILLFULLY ignorant! !
I told you about the pix of UNloadable brass from factory Wby ammo.---- You denied !
Roscoe said HE had EXPERIENCED it in more than 1 cal/cartridge.... You Rejected his testimony. You are [/b]WILLFULLY IGNORANT.[b]

You obviously don't understand "context".



In THIS discussion ON the Campfire -- WE have seen pix -- the CONTEXT altho unspecified, is HERE.

AND after another poster saying He had experienced it..... you still [/b]refuse to accept the FACT.[b]




Try RE Reading what I said. Pix have been POSTED here on the 'fire' w/in the past couple of years.


THEN I specified the PIX were posted here on the Campfire > > > You [/b]WILLFULLY choose to DISBELIEVE (IGNORANT)[b]

I repeat, just because You have not SEEN it Does NOT make it UNTRUE. You Willfully Reject the evidence.

And so Roscoe is RIGHT again......



I will NOT waste this much time and effort on you again.


Jerry

Not quite 3+K but close enough and that is a damn good factory load. The same line has a 145 load for the 270 that will hang with it. At 400 yards the drop is only 0.2" more and at 500, 0.7" more. That's pretty bad ass too.

Been a happy .30 caliber hunter for 20 years but I've just talked myself into a new 7mm Remington Mag M700 sps. I wanted a new mule deer rifle to sit between my 243 and 30-06. I was initially thinking 270 but have settled on Remington's big 7. I figure it's like a 270 but with an extra gear if I need/wanted it.

Willfully ignorant.

I’m gonna use that some day. It sounds so much more polite than stupid on purpose.



P

You forgot the " ", don't steal but you MAY borrow.

Jerry

https://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/gun-nuts/2013/10/270-versus-7mm-rem-mag

Here's what Petzal has to say.

Yep.... that’s as bad ass as a .270 has ever been. But it still gives up .100 in BC, 20% in drift, and 20% in energy at 500... though it certainly has an advantage in the recoil department.

To me.... logically.... the 7 Rem Mag just makes a lot of sense. You can go to several extremes.... like a 120 TTSX at 3400++.... or a pert’near .800BC at 2850+.... and do it in most factory rigs. That covers all bases from 40’ to about 3/4 mile.... on just about anything you’d ever punch a tag for....

Jwall and Roscow1

Please keep your word and not waste your time responding to anything I post. I’ll gladly reciprocate.

Live long and prosper with your blown primers. 🤣

Enjoy the bliss.






Jerry

Another good one would be deliberately obtuse. That one is borrowed from The Shawshank Redemption.

Here's a Mauser 98 7mm Remington Mag I used to have. My other Big 7 was a Ruger 77.

Good history lesson on the 7mag.
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...0F965B552A66A35DE0A&&FORM=VRDGAR

Both have practical applications to the anecdotal expert postings here.....

Interesting!

I think it's less than that, around 15% give or take, but I never paid attention to energy to measure terminal performance. Their Superformance line has ammo for both that's even flatter.

The loaders are the one's getting the potential, the 95% of hunters who don't, aren't for the most part and not a whole heck of a lot over what else is out there. That's unfortunate. And the 270 has always been bad ass and why so many rounds are compared to it, it just keeps getting better and better. Not bad for a 90+ year old round.

I'd actually think you can do a lot more than 3400+ in the 7RM loading it with the 120TTSX, I get 3500 out of the 110TTSX in a 24" 270. I have a bunch of the 120's for my 280 but I seem to have to lean on it harder and think with limited shooting, am around 3200 fps. I'll have to try a few other powders out in it.

A F A I C. everyone has the CHOICE to reload (handload).

Everyone COULD make the most of ANY cartridge. Don’t whine.

Over the past 43 years I have NOT bought 10 boxes of CF ammo.
I have NEVER bought 1 box of factory 7 RM ammo.

The few boxes I have bought were to get brass immediately w/o having to order it or make a special trip of Xtra miles to some GS that handled
reloading supplies. To the best of my recollection, I can only remember buying 270 W & 300 WM ammo to get the brass. I did LOOK for some
284 W ammo a couple years ago - for the brass - didn’t find any, anywhere.

I’m not trying to put myself up or anyone else down. WE choose what to do.

Jerry

For clarity & the record.

Mike I did not direct that at you.

Also the 270 ammo was WW

The 300 WM was Fed Blue Box

Jerry

Agreed. If we're talking about "as good as it gets", then we should be talking about the 7RM living up to its true potential, not hamstrung by factory loads.

No one's whining, but the fact is the vast majority of hunters using it shoot factory ammo (and most I know, Rem Core Lokts or Win Power Points) that handicaps them from the true potential of the round. Yes we know we all have the choice to make the most of it by loading it, but most do not. My 280 falls in the same category.



+1

Regardless of whether or not the masses mostly buy factory ammo for their 7mm's they're still pretty well armed for whatever they happen to be hunting.

Very true! Happy Trails

I am going the other way.

The 6.5 CM led me to the 7 mag (WSM).



My 180 ELDM and my 175 ELDX handloads, Shoot the same speed and accuracy as the 162 factory loads as well. I will continue to use both.


That'll do for both velocity and accuracy if I can put 6 shots in there and have that kind of SD from a factory load.....if you can read my chicken scratch







Hard to argue that either the 6.5 CM or the 7 mag doesn't work, but the 7 does step things up a notch which is why I chose 7 WSM instead of the same thing a bit faster in 6.5 PRC.

+1

P[/quote]
Another good one would be deliberately obtuse. That one is borrowed from The Shawshank Redemption.[/quote]
.

[/quote]

Which is better than belligerently obtuse, which I have been quilty of on occasion.

this one just finished......sighted in this morn...start load work for Horny 162 ELD's

Rem 700 1982 low rd donor action.....1970 trigger tuned by Neil Jones...wayyy back when.....

Proof Research 9 twist carbon fiber barrel & brake....27.5" total length

Stocky Stock.......Bushnell 4200 Tactical 6-24x50 w/20 MOA rail & Warne rings

weighs 9# 6 oz empty as shown.....local guy chambered it & set it up

belongs to my SIL in AZ.....I get the early load development work

Two of my Tikkas groove on 69 grains Reloader 26 with 162 ELDX. Close to 3100 FPS mv, great accuracy.

Two elk, two shots.





P

until I get some slower stuff.....

all I have on the bench is N560 & H4831sc

Another good one would be deliberately obtuse. That one is borrowed from The Shawshank Redemption.[/quote]
.

[/quote]

Which is better than belligerently obtuse, which I have been quilty of on occasion.
[/quote]


How about willfully belligerent?





P

This one is best.


Jerry

Whats your impression of the Stocky Stock? Is it their carbon offering?

Yep, I read that treatise then and just reread it and a few of the comments. I always figured if you had a .30-06 with a 24” barrel, you didn’t need the little extra that the 7mm Remington Magnum brings. But since we live in a day and age where picking nits is more important than the subject at hand, it is not my first choice although it is still a great cartridge. I’ve been pretty satisfied with both my 7mm Weatherby Magnums.

When we bought our Platoon Sergeant in Charlie Company, 75th Rangers a going away present to Alaska in 1973, the gun shop guy in Columbus, GA told the guy buying it that “it will kill any living thing on the planet”. He may have not been far off the mark. Happy Trails

WAM

I sincerely appreciate & thank you for your Service to OUR country ! !

Jerry

Jerry,

I humbly accept your thanks on behalf of all those who served.

Happy Trails

Yes, Thanks for defending our country! Service people do not get enough credit and are disrespected at times. My boy was in uniform in the Chicago airport. Some piece of cshit spit on him. He had more restraint than I would have. I would have been in jail.

A N D the other xxxx would have gone to E R.

Jerry

Good thing I read the entire thread - was going to inquire that same thing.

What Gives? I didn’t read the whole thing. Highlights?

Kingston-
Just meant I'd have duplicated Beav's question had I not read.

Has it been answered? That’s what I’m looking for. So x3. Grin.

Skane and Sir Kingston, No answer came forth-Only the lonely echo of my post coming back at me...So, I started a “Stocky Stocks” thread of my own to find the answer...Short version: Stocky farms out their carbon fiber stocks to AG Composites. Their CF stocks are high quality with tight tolerance fitting. Customer service from SS is excellent. Price point for CF stocks is below other well known manufacturers. They have inventory ready to ship, especially for Remington 700 LA and SA. 😎

Why hasn't anyone mentioned the 6.5 Creedmoor Magnum? Superior ballistics. Better bullets. Sexier name.

Here's the standard Creedmoor beside the super sized Creedmoor.



Pic courtesy of Dissimulator Press

Because -

A. The thread is ABOUT the 7 Rem Mag.

B. Some of us are SICK of the FAD. One of our regular's here called it Creedmoor Fatigue ! ! !

C. There are OTHER cartridges BESIDE the CRAPmoor.

D. Need other reasons ?


Jerry

Addressed to S R :




"needmore" reasons ?

Yes, Jerry, I do.

Take your Testosterone supplement. lol. That redness in your face can be cured by purchasing a Creedmoor.

While your head is up your butt

JUMP ! you'll then disappear.


Jerry

lol

Watch your blood pressure. You'll pop like a zit.

Because people want to have a pat on the back for their clever purchase of a new rifle.

Definite CBHS case here.

m m

here's once that we disagree. In my count which is NOT specific, this is in the minority.


Jerry

Just joined the club with this new M700 SPS left hand. I put a Leupold 6x42mm in Talley lightweight lows. With sling it's ready to hunt at 8lb 2 Oz. I'm excited to try it this fall as my high country mule deer/black bear rifle. I pulled a moose tag here in BC this November I may let the Big 7 take a crack at moose too.

Alllllright Luke ! !

Good Hunting Bro.

Jerry