For John B. and everyone else.

I'm about to fireform 50 .257 Rob AI cases and have read of the cream of wheat method. However, I can't find the stuff anywhere here in Australia. I guess it must be an American product. So, is there an alternative substance such as wheat germ or small oatmeal flakes that can be used instead?

Alternatively, I can just load some old, very tarnished 100gn Norma bullets that I have here and shoot 'em off and fireform the old fashioned way. But if I can avoid putting 50 rounds through the new barrel and the subsequent cleaning that would be good.


Thanks for all advice and suggestions in advance.

Elvis-
Have you tired this source for Cream of Wheat in Australia: http://www.usafoods.com.au/Cream-of-Wheat-2-1-2-minute-cook ?

The physical properties of your suggested substitutes differ from the recommended granular farina cereals like Malt-O-Meal and Cream of Wheat. Fine flour can cause problems when compressed in firing. Grits seems to work about as well as farina. Corn meal compresses a bit differently, probably due to its oil/fat content. CoCo Wheats are a chocolate farina that produces a different aroma when fire forming,

--Bob

I use a light load of Bullseye with a quarter square of toilet paper tamped down on top of the powder. Has worked for 30 years with my 280AI. Much less messy.

+1 on the Bullseye and T/P, works fine. I wouldn't mess with the Cream of Wheat.

I use a pretty good load of Bullseye and a wax or clay plug. Forget the stream of wheat or TP.

You might want to try Fiber One cereal, from General Mills. I know it really cleans me out, and might do the same for your barrel.

Seriously- when I was preparing cases for my .280 Imp., I just loaded up factory .280 brass with cheap Nosler Ballistic Tip bullets and a moderate load of powder. What I discovered, after loading up those fireformed cases and shooting them, is that I could not match the accuracy I had gotten with the fireforming loads! I gave up on the fireforming and just shoot normal .280 rounds through that rifle now. Giving up 100-150 fps over the Imp version is no big deal, to me. You might see similar results with your .257 AI, if you are interested.

Some use cornmeal. Check Google.

Paul

I was going to suggest cornmeal too, just make sure it's unsalted.

For eating, I much prefer grits over cream of wheat. Only reason we buy cream of wheat is for fireforming.

I've also used shotshell filler, the fine white stuff used in buckshot loads. It's a bit more expensive than cream of wheat, but I already had it and don't load much buckshot any more.

I use full house loads of whatever powder I’m gonna load for said cartridge.... 6ai, 6.5 ai and Whelen... works great!! I’ll be go to Hell if I’m gonna run cream of wheat or anything else down my snout.

Yes. All you need is Quaker Puffed Wheat or Rice - and a small child.

<> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGpS6LHeBC0b <>

I was going to respond "Bacon and eggs."

With grits, don't forget the grits. And lots of butter.

Now I'm hungry again and might need a second breakfast. Thanks!

This is just my experience, but I’ve found that using s false shoulder to control headspace and fireform with a decent load has always given me the most consistent results. No lost cases this way. I’ve had very inconsistent results using “cream of wheat method” or jamming the bullet. Also get some good trigger time with the fireforming loads, offhand practice or shooting groups. This has just been my experience.

Grex or polystyrene beads used in shot gun buffered loads works well. Grits, corn meal, or just toilet paper can work.

I've used corn meal and Bullseye.

Hey Elvis

It is called semolina here in Oz. You can get it at Woolies or Coles.

FWIW I remember 40 years ago fireforming some .257 AI for a gunsmith named Heimo Petzl, by the simple expedient of going out and shooting some .257 Roberts factory loads. It seemed to work

Well bugger me! I know what Semolina is lol. Thanks Dan Oz.

Thanks for the suggestions folks.

Worked well for me too.

What does the cream of wheat etc, do for ya in fireforming that a load of Unique out of a cast bullet manual wouldn't.... just seems like more mess to clean up in your bore....

I think you guys who fire form overthink the situation...but then who am I to question your desires?

The first rifle I ever chambered was a 257 Roberts Ackley in 2002.
I used a new piece of 257 Roberts brass as the go gauge..... mistake.
The firing pin pushes the cartridge into the chamber until the ring at the base of the chamber neck stops it. This ring digs in and thus allows the cartridge to get too far forward. When the powder goes off, the case expands, grips the chamber walls, and then gets stretched by gas pressure on the case web.



I tried about 100 ways to avoid getting that crack behind the shoulder.
I settled on 10 gr or any pistol powder, filled with cream of wheat or instant cream of wheat, and the case mouth plugged with Ivory soap. This forms a partial 40 degree shoulder on the brass, enough to stand up to the firing pin on the next load.
I sometimes put moly grease [50kpsi grease] on the case side and neck.

The other 257 Roberts rifles I chambered in 2002 got 0.004" of interference with a new piece of 257 Roberts brass as the go gauge. Those rifles have never needed any cream of wheat.

In the last month I have chambered (2) rifles in 280 Ackley; 1949 Win M70 and 1980 Savage 110.
For those rifles I used a 280AI go gauge and store bought Nosler 280AI brass.

Seafire,



I usually fireform brass by loading up some bullets and shooting a bunch of ground squirrels or prairie dogs, easy to do here in Montana. But over 80% of Americans live in major urban areas, where just going to a shooting range is not only time-consuming but expensive. Using the COW or Bullseye-and-plug technique can often be done at home, whether in the garage or basement, and the formed brass then loaded with various powder charges and bullets for the limited range-time available to those shooters.

Which is why I've experimented with non-bullet case forming: Many readers can't get to the range very often, and when they do their range-time is often limited. So I try stuff to see what might work for them.

I wanted some 250 savage brass . I have lots of 22-250 brass so decided to fire form. I did not have cream of wheat so tried an alternate.
I did have some of the meal left over from making alcohol. The farmers use it for cattle feed . Close enough i figured .

Worked like a charm . Seemed too clean the barrel also. But I did give it a proper cleaning before using bullets ,

Yondering-that is impressive. Are you from the South? I didn't think anyone north of the Mason-Dixon knew what Grits are unless they were from down here...lol.

I guy down here used milo to fireform. I think he used bullseye.

Yep, mostly Mississippi but all over really. Love me some grits, as well as black eyed peas, greens, and other things these Northerners don't know about.

Plus ++++, I love poke salad and collard greens also. I like the fruit of the PawPaw Tree.

How about rice? You end up with free puffed rice. Commercial tag line, "It's shot from cannons!

Just kidding of course. Dirty work but someone's got to do it.

ipopum,

In my experience with quite a few .22-250's and .250-3000 Savages, just running new .22-250 brass into a .250 die works fine. The shoulder angle is supposedly slightly different, but in new cases I've never found it to make any difference.

"I want my Maypo!" Anyone else remember that?

That could get messy:

Amazing the lengths people will go to not shoot.

I tried the corn residue that I used to fire form the 250 Savage cases in an old military 8 m/m today.

Loaded some shotgun powder and then a cloth wad and then the course ground corn. The barrel was noticeable cleaner and brighter after about 3 shots.

Hmm I wonder what else needs a few corn round down the barrel ?

Unless the parent case is long enough to form a false shoulder sized to jam the case head against the bolt face while forming with Cream of Wheat, etc....you're probably going to get a better fire formed case by loading a real round and seat the bullet long to jam into the rifling, and keep the case firmly against the bolt face. Look at it as practice/plinking ammo. You also may be surprised and find that these fire forming loads pretty damn well. Trigger time, is never a bad thing.

Yes rather amazing actually..... amazing folks put shiit in their barrel l I ke cream of wheat.....

I believe the COW method and usefulness is when stepping UP several diameters,

I blew out 50 rds of .30-06 cases to .338-06 in a relatively short period of time and don't understand what all the crying is about, it ain't like COW is going to hurt a steel barrel.

Mike

Tell that to my former Homer bucket that had been filled with wadded up newspaper, old beach towels, etc.

Every 338/06 case I have made has been from just necking up 30/06 cases, using a tapered expander spindle that RCBS sent me for free....probably 500 to 600 plus....

certainly a lot cheaper than Cream of Wheat, primers and powder to do so,

I've never had to use filler on any reduced loads, and I shoot a bunch of them.

but hey, whatever way works for each member... don't let me get in the way...

Iv use this method for the Gibbs and it does a good job ....

One of the cases I used to fireform was a 35 Gibbs and necking up and making a false shoulder was the best method for me.