So I have been out of the country for a few years and have to restock my my cleaning solvents and was curious what is new and improved on the market. I shoot a lot of .22, center fire with copper jacketed bullets, and pistols and lever guns with lead bullets. Also a lot of shotgun (auto-loaders). I'm looking for the easiest and best way to clean a gun after shooting and before storing for a month or two. I don't need perfect, just good enough.

What should I use for powder residue? Lead fouling in the .22s (I usually focus on the powder residue and rarely clean the bore) and center fire pistols? And copper fouling in the rifles? I used Butch's Bore Shine on my rifles before and was happy with it but have heard good things about Montana Extreme. What about lubrication before use and rust protection for storage?

Thanks in advance for any advice, this seemed like the best forum to ask the question.

I use the following:
Hoppe's No. 9
Break-Free CLP
Bottle of 1/3 ATF, 1/3 Mobil 1, 1/3 mineral spirits
Old West Snake Oil

Hoppe's No. 9
Break-Free CLP
Patch-Out
Ballistol
That pretty much covers everything I use, or need.

If I was just stocking up I would make a quart or more of Ed's Red for regular cleaning. I would use Wipe Out after long Shooting sessions. Any of the Non water based copper removers are good like Montana extreme, Butches and others. I would also get an abrasive like JB or Iosso for barrel break in and stubborn fouling. If I were shooting pistols a lot I would look into Tekrolan Sweet Shooter and treat the entire pistol. For Lubrication any low viscosity motor oil and Ed's red has some lubricant properties. Rust prevention: Eessox, Hornaday One, Corrosion X, Frog Lube. For storage Rig or Collectors which isn't greasy.

I use Kroll and Shooters Choice after a range session preferably while the barrel is still warm and leave it in the bore till I get home and clean. You could get by with about four products but like guns the cleaning products seem to multiply. Ultra Bore Coat really helps to reduce fouling and the need for cleaning. I still do it out of habit probably more than I need to.

Long answer to say there are lots of good products on the market and very few bad ones.

Ed's Red for the cast bullet guns and for powder fouling before attacking the copper in the jacketed bullet guns.

Redleg,

You are likely to get different answers from every person who responds--partly because there are many more products these days, but also partly because most shooters don't own a bore-scope so don't really know what's going on inside their barrels. Though that's changing with the recent, very affordable digital scopes.

A recent, similar thread on "Ask The Gunwriters" on gun oils resulted in people choosing around three dozen as the best they'd ever used....

For cleaner all you need is Bore Tech Eliminator..............
For oil take your pick, I have been using Lucas gun oil lately.
Never use abrasives like Iosso or JB paste, Hoppe's that so many suggest is pretty much worthless IMO

Totally agree on Bore Tech Eliminator for all the cleaning-work of carbon, powder, copper....great stuff.

I follow that up with a patch of break-free CLP in the bore before I put it in the safe.
(and a very-lightly oiled rag on the outside)

Yes but pontificating (I'll refrain) is fun, and pretty safe too. I would guess that most products do a satisfactory job for most people if you follow the directions. I can say so for my shelf loaded with products anyway.

No bore scope but judging by patch and holes in a target seems to give me a fair estimate. Though I'm sure I'd have one had the price dropped earlier.

BTW For gun oil which goes on the inside I can't remember the name of the stuff but it's a synthetic that smell and looks like coconut milk and works well with the needle point oiler. I like the smell. Exterior protectant is R.I.G. It works and again it's the smell. Reminds me of days with Dad.

Bore Tech Eliminator vote here too....

Thanks for the input. As soon as Bass Pro or one of the local shops open back up I will make the trip to stock up. I completely agree with MD on asking for opinions but this gave me a list of things to chose from depending what's in stock. I did buy a bore scope recently and only looked at one gun so far but it was very telling. I soon realized my cleaning jag was dissolving and leaving blue/green on my patch, not copper in the bore...

I was really glad to see the Ed's Red, I was hoping for a homemade, bulk option.

Thanks again fellas.

I add Kroil and orange oil to the Ed's Red, the orange oil is a good solvent but mostly for the smell. I keep meaning to add banana oil to it to make it smell like Hoppes # 9. Mystery oil makes it smell like wintergreen and doesn't hurt the formula.

Boy, some of you guys have too much fun mixing stuff!

When I was shooting competitively, I used Butch's Bore Shine followed by Hoppe's #9. I finished with the Hoppe's, not oil.

I disagree with the poster who said not to ever use JB paste. I used it, sparingly, after every 800 rounds or so. If I didn't, a carbon ring would build up just ahead of the chamber and increase pressures.

Now that I'm into shotguns, I use two patches of Hoppe's #9 followed by two of G96.

You have to use Hoppe's. It smells so good.

+1 for Ed's Red. Good stuff and you can make it cheap. I like quality. I like cheap.

Frog Lube and Hoppes #9....

Is this the recipe for Ed's Red?

I used Hoppe's #9 forever, switched to Butch's Bore Shine about 10 yrs. ago when I was shooting a lot of big bore revolver. I like Bore Tech Eliminator when I want to do a deep cleaning, also use JB paste occasionally .

Apparently it's a family secret...LOL

Ed;s Red Hot Sauce

Pretty sure this tastes a lot better than the stuff they're talking about!

Ed's Red Gun Bore Cleaner
By Ed Harris Rev. 12-27-94

Three years ago I mixed my first "Ed's Red" and I still think the "recipe" is a great idea. If you have never tried it, or maybe lost the recipe, I urge you save this and mix your own. My followers on the FIREARMS Echo think it's the best thing since smokeless powder! Therefore, I'll summarize the story again for the passing parade that didn't get it the first time...

I originally did this because I used a lot of rifle bore cleaner and was deterred by the high price of commercial products. I knew there was no technical reason why you could not mix an effective bore cleaner using common hardware store ingredients which would be inexpensive, effective, and provide reasonable corrosion protection and adequate lubrication.

The "recipe" is based on proven principles and incorporates two polar and two nonpolar ingredients. It is adapted from a formula in Hatcher's Notebook, Frankford Arsenal Cleaner No.18, but substituting equivalent modern materials. I had the help of an organic chemist in doing this and we knew there would be no "surprises" The original Hatcher recipe called for equal parts of acetone, turpentine, Pratts Astral Oil and sperm oil, and optionally 200 grams of lanolin added per liter.

Pratts Astral oil was nothing more than acid free, deodorized kerosene. We use K-1 kerosene of the type normally sold for indoor space heaters. An inexpensive, effective substitute for sperm oil is Dexron (II, IIe or III) automatic transmission fluid. Prior to about 1950 that most ATF's were sperm oil based, but during WWII a synthetic was developed for use in precision instruments. With the great demand for automatic transmission autos after WWII, sperm oil was no longer practical to produce ATF in the quantity demanded, so the synthetic material became the basis for the Dexron fluids we know today. The additives in ATFs which include organometallic antioxidants and surfactants, make it highly suitable for our intended purpose.

Hatcher's original formula used gum spirits of turpentine, but turpentine is expensive and highly flammable. Cheaper and safer is aliphatic mineral spirits, which is a petroleum based "safety solvent" used for thinning oil based paints and as automotive parts cleaner. It is commonly sold under the names "odorless mineral spirits," "Stoddard Solvent" or "Varsol".

There isn't anything in Ed's Red which will chemically remove copper fouling, but it does a better job on carbon residue than anything out there. Several users have told me, that with exclusive use of "ER" does reduce the buildup of copper fouling, because it removes old impacted fouling which is left by other cleaners, reducing the adhesion of abraded metal to the surface, and leaving a cleaner surface which reduces subsequent fouling. It appears that "ER" will actually remove metal fouling it if you let it "soak" so the surfactants will do the job, though you may have to be patient.

The lanolin is optional. The cleaner works quite well without it. Incorporating the lanolin makes the cleaner easier on the hands, and provides better residual lubrication and corrosion protection if you use the cleaner as a protectant for long term storage. If you want to minimize cost, you can leave the lanolin out and save about $8 per gallon. Mix some yourself. I know it will work as well for you as it does for me.

CONTENTS: Ed's Red Bore Cleaner

1 part Dexron II, IIe or III ATF, GM Spec. D-20265 or later.

1 part Kerosene - deodorized, K1

1 part Aliphatic Mineral Spirits, Fed. Spec. TT-T-2981F, CAS #64741-49-9, or substitute "Stoddard Solvent", CAS #8052-41-3, or equivalent, (aka "Varsol")

1 part Acetone, CAS #67-64-1.

(Optional up to 1 lb. of Lanolin, Anhydrous, USP per gallon, OK to substitute Lanolin, Modified, Topical Lubricant, from the drug store)

MIXING INSTRUCTIONS:

Mix outdoors, in good ventilation. Use a clean 1 gallon metal, chemical-resistant, heavy gage PET or PVC plastic container. NFPA approved plastic gasoline storage containers are also OK. Do NOT use HDPE, which is breathable because the acetone will evaporate. The acetone in ER will attack HDPE in about 6 months, making a heck of a mess!

Add the ATF first. Use the empty container to measure the other components, so that it is thoroughly rinsed. If you incorporate the lanolin into the mixture, melt this carefully in a double boiler, taking precautions against fire. Pour the melted lanolin it into a larger container, rinsing the lanolin container with the bore cleaner mix, and stirring until it is all dissolved.

I recommend diverting a small quantity, up to 4 ozs. per quart of the 50-50 ATF/kerosene mix for use as an "ER-compatible" gun oil. This can be done without impairing the effectiveness of the mix.

INSTRUCTIONS FOR USING

Ed's Red Bore Cleaner:

1. Open the firearm action and ensure the bore is clear. Cleaning is most effective when done while the barrel is still warm to the touch from firing. Saturate a cotton patch with bore cleaner, wrap or impale on jag and push it through the bore from breech to muzzle. The patch should be a snug fit. Let the first patch fall off and do not pull it back into the bore.

2. Wet a second patch, and similarly start it into the bore from the breech, this time scrubbing from the throat area forward in 4-5" strokes and gradually advancing until the patch emerges out the muzzle. Waiting approximately 1 minute to let the bore cleaner soak will improve its action.

3. For pitted, heavily carbon-fouled "rattle battle" guns, leaded revolvers or neglected bores a bronze brush wet with bore cleaner may be used to remove stubborn deposits. This is unnecessary for smooth, target-grade barrels in routine use.

4. Use a final wet patch pushed straight through the bore to flush out loosened residue dissolved by Ed's Red. Let the patch fall off the jag without pulling it back into the bore. If you are finished firing, leaving the bore wet will protect it from rust for up to 30 days. If the lanolin is incorporated into the mixture, it will protect the firearm from rust for up to two years. For longer term storage I recommend use of Lee Liquid Alox as a Cosmolene substitute. "ER" will readily remove hardened Alox or Cosmolene.

5. Wipe spilled Ed's Red from exterior surfaces before storing the gun. While Ed's Red is harmless to blue and nickel finishes, the acetone it contains is harmful to most wood finishes).

6. Before firing again, push two dry patches through the bore and dry the chamber, using a patch wrapped around a suitably sized brush or jag. First shot point of impact usually will not be disturbed by Ed's Red if the bore is cleaned as described.

7. I have determined to my satisfaction that when Ed's Red is used exclusively and thoroughly, that hot water cleaning is unnecessary after use of Pyrodex or military chlorate primers. However, if bores are not wiped between shots and shots and are heavily caked from black powder fouling, hot water cleaning is recommended first to break up heavy fouling deposits. Water cleaning should be followed by a thorough flush with Ed's Red to prevent after-rusting which could result from residual moisture. It is ALWAYS good practice to clean TWICE, TWO DAYS APART whenever using chlorate primed ammunition, just to make sure you get all the residue out.

LABEL AND OBLIGATORY SAFETY WARNINGS:

RIFLE BORE CLEANER

CAUTION:

HARMFUL IF SWALLOWED.

KEEP OUT OF REACH OF CHILDREN

1.Flammable mixture. Keep away from heat, sparks or flame.

2.FIRST AID, If swallowed DO NOT induce vomiting, call physician immediately. In case of eye contact immediately flush thoroughly with water and call a physician. For skin contact wash thoroughly.

3.Use with adequate ventilation. Avoid breathing vapors or spray mist. It is a violation of Federal law to use this product in a manner inconsistent with its labelling. Reports have associated repeated and prolonged occupational overexposure to solvents with permanent brain and nervous system damage. If using in closed armory vaults lacking forced air ventilation wear respiratory protection meeting NIOSH TC23C or equivalent. Keep container tightly closed when not in use.

This "Recipe" is placed in the public domain, and may be freely distributed provided that it is done so in its entirely with all instructions and safety warnings included herein, and that proper attribution is given to the author.

In Home Mix We Trust, Regards, Ed

Since we're throwing things out willy-nilly.

Butch's when things aren't awful. Wipe out several days/nights in a row when they are. JB for "basket cases".

I still keep a big bottle of Hoppes around for cleaning semi-auto shotguns as it's a great nitro-solvent and a lot less expensive than others.

Approximated the Ed’s Red concept with stuff that I had readily available.

I just tried some products from KG Industries and was very impressed. I used KG-1 carbon remover, KG-2 bore polish, and KG-3 cleaner /degreaser. Bores cleaned up quickly and were bright and shinny when checked with a borescope. I have used butchs, bore tech, wipe-out patch-out, J-B"s bore paste in the past with decent results as well. None of those seemed to work as quickly as the KG industries products though.

Like ed’s red for rimfire, cast rifle/revolver, and shotgun bores. Also thorough cleanings of old gun finds. Be careful with camo finishes, though, such as newer shotguns. Ed’s may eat/loosen it. I like that not only does it perform excellently, but never run out.

Montana extreme for jacketed centerfire and pistol bores. Wipe Out if, again, old used gun find’s first thorough cleaning.

Ballistol for above for general lube/wipe downs, except semiauto shotguns actions, for which prefer “whatever” oil.

Ed’s red on bores, and clenzoil generally, on fine doubles, levers, etc.

Old west snake oil, while sorta similar to clenzoil or ballistol, i think rehabs neglected antique stocks as well as anything and doesn’t stink.

Pistols aren’t picky, i use whatever's appropriate on bench. Same with AR’s.

Has anyone used the injector cleaner like Seafoam or Marvel's MiracleOil for the carbon around revolver and pistols? I was in the auto parts store and saw it and thought it would be nice that you could pour a little out to dip a tooth brush in and scrub the frame and cylinder to loosen the carbon.

i'm just a hunter, so don't shoot my big game rifles as much as some. since around 1965 i've used hoppes #9, some clean patches, a bronze brush, and 3in1 oil. never had a problem with accuracy or rust, including 3 years in alaska and several trips back there in years past. i'm sure there are numerous products out there that will clean a rifle barrel, but i'm content with plain ole hoppes for my needs. ymmv.

tag

MPro-7 for cleaning, Break-Free CLP for lube and corrosion protection and field cleaning when away from home base. Tipton bore cleaner or one of the bore foams when you need to knock out copper and lead fouling.

Excellent response!

With all the products available now, the most important thing is to actually use them. It doesn't matter what you buy, as long as you take a few minutes after you're done to give your rifle a bath.

I can't understand people not trying Ed's Red. It is economical and works well. I'm working on my second gallon of it for cleaning. The second batch doesn't have the lanolin so won't hold its surface tension as long. I am going to use the lanolin with the next batch. Use gloves with this product and get washed up if it is on your skin. Keep good ventilation as the acetone isn't good on you. Just a rehash of things. Why do you want to put more value on something if it costs more? You can use a straight weight Mobil One for lube if you wish. I have for a long time. Also pay attention to the synthetic stock. Protect them absolutely. I have messed up some "pretty" camo jobs. and it will dissolve plastic pistol grips. If Mobil one isn't good enough use 1:1 ATF and Mobil One with some marvel Mystery oil poured in for the SPECIAL smell. YMMV. Be Well, Rustyzipper.

Because it has little-to-no activity on copper or lead, and it is a PITA to make; while there are many easily found products that simultaneously do well on copper, lead, and carbon.

I did try some Seafoam on carbon fouling this weekend and was impressed. I used it on a autoloading shotgun but was paranoid about getting it on the stock. It did work well on teh piston and internals (bolt and trigger group).

I also took the stocks off a couple revolvers and a 1911 and tried it there. I brushed it on the carbon and let it sit about five minutes before hitting it with a clean brush. It seemed to do a good job and was cheap and easy. I dumped the rest of the bottle in my Jeep since that's why I bought it anyway.

Yep. I hate cleaning rifles, partly because I would much rather be shooting. Consequently I use powders that don't foul much, and may even contain a decoppering agent, so don't have to clean rifles very often. It's also the reason I use Dyna Bore Coat in barrels that tend to foul more than others.

When I do clean rifle barrels, I also prefer one solvent that gets everything out, or at least most of it. Most barrels do not shoot as well when perfectly clean as when slightly fouled.

Used to love the Gunslick foaming bore stuff to pull copper out. Couple of patches with Hoppes #9 to get the powder out, fill with foam, spray again 30 minutes later, wait 30 minutes and clean with Hoppes. That stuff, for me, worked like a champ.

Just found out recently that they discontinued it.

Why do they always discontinue any thing that I like?

It works great on plastic fouling in choke tubes and rifled slug barrels.

BreakFree CLP for general cleaning. It has just enough copper remover to show traces on the patch used to remove it from the bore after storage. Never had a gun rust with BreakFree on it.

Ballistol is good for so many things I'm never without it. Mixed with water 1-4, it's my favorite cleaner for real black powder and 777.

Montana Extreme Copper Killer is what I finally settled on for metal fouling. Safe and effective. JB for mechanical removal of stubborn cases.

I use a lot of 91+ % isopropyl alcohol for wiping powder residue out of barrels, degreasing, and cleaning bore brushes.

I guess I'm in the minority: On the outside I use whatever is handy on the same old remnants of a cotton flannel shirt I've used since college...a long, long time ago. I told my daughter that when I die, do NOT throw that away. By now it contains every concoction of cleaning solvent, grease, and oil known to man, and is definitely an environmental hazard. The bore generally gets a dry wipe-out if I'm going to be shooting again in a day or two, or Hoppe's/Kroil mix about four times per year. I'm one of those fellows who'd be stunned looking through a bore scope, I'm sure. I might have to get one just to satisfy my curiosity.

John (MD): did you put Dyna-Tek in the bore of your Kilimanjaro?

Does anyone know when products used to remove copper fouling became de rigueur?

Mike,

No DBC in that one. It cleans up easily without it.

Poconjack,

Well over a century ago, as as soon as smokless rifle powder and jacketed bullets appeared. In fact, it was a far bigger problem back then, partly because one of the most popular earlier jacket materials was cupronickel, an alloy of about 75% copper and 25% nickel, which REALLY fouled bores, sometimes to the point where the fouling built up so much, pressures did too--and barrels sometimes split.

If I recall correctly, the British found ammonia would dissolve the fouling, and Townsend Whelen was the first American shooter to publicize using it over here.

MD, appreciate the info.

Yep, as many good products as are available today, anybody that even remotely thinks they need to re-invent the wheel & mix something up is either really ignorant or just doing it to be doing it.

For my everyday needs, using Butch's to clean the loose stuff out followed by Bore Tech Eliminator works just fine; most of my barrels are treated with Dyna Bore Coat too.

MM

50 BMG for copper remover and Break Free or Rem Oil to lube and for protection

The 50 BMG can be left in the barrel over night and it will not harm it, it gets the copper out
better than anything I have used in the past

I tried Gunslik foaming bore cleaner and Butches Bore Shine and Bore Tech eliminator out does both. You can use a lot of patches if you don't take your time.

Had an old 77 with the tang safety that I had cleaned for years and to my thinking all was good the first time I used Boretech eliminator on it I pushed 60 patches through it. I was amazed at what came out of the barrel. For 20 years I thought the rifle was a 1 to 1.5 MOA hunting rifle and that was good enough 18" bbl light weight etc. The first group through it after cleaning with BTE was 1/2 MOA. Its water based no ammonia so there's no major odors when you take it to the bush either just plain works for me. Butches bore shine will damage oil finished guns if allowed to set on them.

Good luck and shoot straight y'all

This is my formula,has worked well for years.
3 ounces tomato juice
3 drops Tobasco sauce
1/2 teaspoon of Worchestire sauce
1/2 tablespoon of horse radish
2 ounces of Vodka
1/4 teaspoon celery salt
Add- celery stock,pickled green bean stock, lemon wedge, or more for garnish

Drink a few, then go clean your guns. Hoppe's no.9

You are very wise, but in the minority, I'm afraid. I hope most people will read and heed! You're smart, yet most folks are dazzled by marketing and go to stores for their cleaning products. Don't be fooled by store bought cleaners! They are overpriced and don't work well.

All companies hire scientists, but not for research and development, or safety. They are hired because they went to university and learned a lot of cool sounding chemical names and/or complex descriptors for common things like ethyl ether (acid and alcohol), tapolene (water), glucose or dextrose (sugar), blunt force trauma (being beaten by a revenuer). They also have letters after their names. That impresses people and, when you're young, is a great help in picking up girls.

ethylene glycol monobutyl ether (EGME) or C3H8O2 aka 'Shine - If you think of a fancy mixed drink like a Pina Colada, you'd be on the right track for what this is. Instead of rum, pineapples, coconut creams, fruit and ice, just think of a bunch of alcohols mixed together.

Put this on a label, and watch the retail price of a bottle of 'shine' go through the roof! Of course, it's an organic solvent, just like pappy's corn squeezin's. It will strip or thin paint. Or you can use it as a spot remover. Some folks call it Mountain Dew or White Lightning. But please, don't drink it! The store bought stuff will make you sick or blind you! It's not purified like pappy's corn squeezin's!!!

Just remember, companies cannot charge big bucks if customers find out their gun cleaner is made from potato peelings and/or fermented plants. So they get all fancy, hire a scientist, and call the peelings, sugar, etc - hydrocarbons, and other $25 names.

See your local moonshiner for inexpensive, effective gun cleaners that you can drink!

All of my barrels have been treated with Dyna Bore Coat. Cleaning is with a 5/50 mix of Shooters Choice/Kroil, and then Montana Extreme Copper Killer with nylon brush.
I just read on another forum that some are liking this product, but I have no first hand use. https://www.bulletcentral.com/product/thorroclean-bore-cleaning-system/

Used Hoppe's No. 9 for many years, lately I like Butch's Bore Shine. I also use Bore-tech Eliminator and Break Free CLP. For long term storage, rust prevention and after cold blue I use Birchwood Casey Barricade/Shield. Once a season or so rifle bores get a detail cleaning with JB Compound. Tried many others over the years, but these products fill my needs at present.

I am consistent with that, but thinking in more detail:
1) Get a new barrel or clean a barrel as clean as new. Go through the Bore Coat procedure. This forum seems to be the repository for the procedure.
It looks like it is available again https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1019547645

2) Moly coat bullets. Procedure involves cleaning the bullets and then tumbling in a bottle inside a Thumler's Tumbler.

3) Use anti Copper fouling temp stable powders; IMR-4451 or IMR-4166 Re 16, Re23, Re26 or temp unstable anti Copper powders like CFE223

4) Clean out Copper starting with
a) a powder solvent. I use KG2 on a patch, but anything will do.
b) Followed by an alcohol patch followed by a clean patch.
c) a Copper solvent. I use KG12 on a patch, nothing else is as good in dissolving Copper, per repeatable testing. It can dissolve a Copper bullet in half. Unlike Ammonia based solvents, it will not make pot holes in steel.
d) Followed by an alcohol patch followed by a clean patch.
e) followed by Witches Brew ( or Kroil and FLITZ} on a bronze brush for 5 stokes
That bronze brush must measure with calipers to be bigger in diameter than the grooves of the barrel. 10 or 15 strokes may take a brush down a caliber size.
f) Wait 5 minutes for Witches Brew or Kroil to creep under Copper that was etched by KG12.
g) followed by Witches Brew ( or Kroil and FLITZ} on a bronze brush for 5 stokes
h) d) Followed by an alcohol patch followed by a clean patch.
i) Look into muzzle with a light. If any Copper is visible, go back to c) and start over.

5) Do not exceed the speed limit of 3400 fps.

Clark,

I wrote the original directions for installing DBC years ago, after fooling with it for a couple years, because the company eventually asked me to. Think they still use some of my suggestions, but haven't opened one of the new batch they sent me maybe 6-8 months ago. The company contacted me then because they wanted some other company to possibly take over the sales, promotion, customer service, etc, as the manufacturer has become busier with bigger things. (DBC and their other gun products were always sort of a sideline.) I suggested a couple of companies that might take DBC over, one of them Midway, and that may have happened, but dunno.

I don't bother DBCing new-to-me rifles unless they prove they need it. Many if not most don't, partly because I use a lot of decoppering powder these days, and even factory barrels have improved considerably in the last several years.

Never saw any point in moly-coating bullets after getting into DBC more than a decade ago, as found it essentially eliminated the need to clean the bore, or greatly reduced it--without having to coat every bullet. Just coat the bore instead, and be done with it.

Have found Montana X-Treme Copper Solvent and Copper Killer do a pretty darn good job of getting rid of powder fouling along with copper fouling, perhaps because they can be left in the bore for extended periods without any bore damage. (This is determined by examining bores with my Gradient Lens Hawkeye scope.) Wipe-Out also seems to be pretty good as well. So also don't bother with an extended cleaning operation using several products.

I don't even know what I use, let me go check........


Bore Tech carbon remover
Bore tech copper remover
Gunslick foam If I have plenty of time
JB for tough stuff
Lucas gun oil for lube

Looks like I could use Bore tech eliminator to replace the carbon remover and copper remover when I run out.

I own a bore scope and has been very enlightening.

I DBC my barrels and it has made cleaning very easy.
I screwed around with applying moly to bullets, but gave it up. Now days, I just buy some Ballistic silvertips if I feel the need. The combination of DBC and Ballistic Silvertips makes for very easy cleaning, when I feel the need.

The efficacy of moly combined with BDC is a question that will never be resolved with a replicable double blind study.

That is why some discussions devolve into a joke; bore cleaning, barrel break in, accuracy rituals, Covid 19 masks, and Ford vs Chevy.

After a lifetime of designing tests and policing out of control variables, I am now being treated for Glaucoma by a woman doctor 1/3 my age, that changes my medicines two at a time.

I should just accept that for some topics the truth is down in the noise. It does not matter which of the shotgun pellets knocks down the bird.

In 2009 we independently measured Copper solvents, and if we google search "best copper solvents" in 2020 we get top hits of information that seems ignorant of the testing
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/our-own-copper-carbon-solvent-test.689/

The universe is devolving ................accept it.

Clark,
I noticed that your list included using a bronze brush in your DBC coated barrels (step 4e). I thought DBC did not recommend using bronze brushes to protect the coating.

Shinbone it IS difficult. Buy a steel one gallon gas can. Pour a quart of the four ingredients into it. It is a terrible inconvenience. You would probably rather pay ten times the price for a tiny amount. It is your money. Manage it any way you want.

It doesn’t hurt the coating but it’s not necessary, either.

Yep.

The company recommended against using bronze brushes when DBC was first introduced, mostly because they didn't whether it would hurt the coating. But eventually they found out DBC wasn't affected by bronze brushes. But as Jordan noted, there's no reason to use them, since both powder and copper fouling come out easily.

In fact I rarely use bronze brushes even in rifle bores that aren't treated with DBC, because I use oil-based solvents that can be left in the bore forever, and the fouling normally comes out with a few cotton patches.

surprisingly funny, completely irrelevant................!!!!!!!

Good to hear that the bronze brushes are not harmful to the DBC. Thanks.

Jordan Smith got me started with DBC and molly.

But I do not wear belt and suspenders.

John,
What about a scrub with JB paste, will it remove the DCB?
By mistake I JB'ed a barrel that I wasn't supposed to, and am not sure if I should reapply or not...
Thank You,
Alvaro

Hi Alvaro,

I doubt JB paste would remove DBC, at least very quickly, but don't know for sure. DBC is a LOT harder than copper fouling.

LOL from one who has tried, NO and Hell NO. JB paste will not remove DBC. Once cured if you want it gone, put on a new barrel and use the other as a tomato stake.


but haven't opened one of the new batch they sent me maybe 6-8 months ago. The company contacted me then because they wanted some other company to possibly take over the sales, promotion, customer service, etc, as the manufacturer has become busier with bigger things. (DBC and their other gun products were always sort of a sideline.)

HA HA 6-8 mos. The company has lied about customer service and an info page for damn near 2 years. Zilch on both. Hell of a sideline, sell a product and then won’t support it or back it. The owner must be related to Schumer or Pelosi.

I thought that all gun cleaning products HAD to be complicated home mixtures based on Kroil and involving such things as eye of newt and ground unicorn horn.

Time = money, and I manage both well. Thanks!

They must be complicated. How else are you going to clean corrosive or mercuric primers, powder deposits and grime? Or copper? One day, we'll have priming compounds and propellants that aren't so hard on metal. Or non Copperized bullets!

And you certainly shouldn't be buying commercial cleaners!!! They are too expensive and incapable of getting the gunk out. You cannot trust any commercial company. None of their employees are qualified to come up with a proper cleaner anyway. Better to go to Pep Boys and get the right stuff yourself!!

Thank you, John.


Swifty,

No, I do not want it gone. Actually, I am so happy with it that my question was more focused on wether I needed to reapply it after the JB scrubbing or not.

Swifty52,

You have been carrying this hatred for the DBC in your heart for far too long.
Don't you know that this poisonous hatred of DBC is consuming your heart and mind and will lead to your doom?
Forgive the DBC and go forth with a free and happy heart and know that the DBC has no ill will toward you.
I hope that you quickly recover from your DBC madness and rejoin the ranks of the sane.

Amen

Clarkm,
Thanks for the link to that copper cleaning experiment!
I'll be buying some KG12.