Well, folks I am just about to finish my 45-70 rifle on the rolling block, so today I ordered a 9.3 barrel for my next project, it will have a Lothar Walther barrel in 1-12 twist, be 22 inches long barrel, after I tapper it and cut it down, with express sites and a hogs back stock. This will all be on an o3-a3 receiver, should work just fine. Then my next will be a 257 Roberts, ( I know this is not a big bore, but I have a bad habit of building to many firearms for myself since I got back into gunsmithing ). On the 9.3x62, does anybody have a load that I could start around with a 286gr. bullet.

Thanks
James

James,this is from Noslers web site:

286gr Nosler Partition
start max
RL-15 54.5 58.5
Varget 51.5 55.5

til later

Your LW barrel will have a 1x14 or 1x16 (can't recall which) twist as that is all they make and with good reason as that is the best twist..I have used many of them, and LW is the best...

I have shot the 9.3x62 quite a bit in Africa up to and including buffalo...I really like the 286 gr. Nosler and the 320 gr. Woodleigh. The heavy woodleigh really requires a 26 inch tube however or so I am told by Ganyana, who is certainly familair with the 9.3x62..I can get 2400 FPS in mine with this great bullet..I would also take a look at the GS Custom monolithics, and some company has purchased North fork and they made fantastic bullets..I used the cup point North Forks in my 9.3x62 on buffalo and decided it was my favorite bullet for anything from duiker to buffalo. Hope something in this posts helps you out.

The only powder I use in the 9.3x62 is RL-15..Start with 55 grs. of RL-15 with the 286 gr. Nosler and work up to around 57 or a bit more, depending on your particular rifle..I can get 2550 FPS in my long tubed LW barrel. Its max but its a safe max and I get 5 or 6 loading before a trim is needed, then I can get about 4 more loading before I retire the brass to the dumpster.

My CZ in 9.3X62 really likes the 286 gr partition with RL15.

What he said. RL15 worked so well first time out, I've never tried anything else. The 270gr Speer is cheap and works well on deer, too.

O

I've had good luck with Varget and the Speer 270 or Nosler 286 grainers.

RL15 has treated me pretty well with Barnes 286 TSX but am switching to 286 Normas because I think that the TSX is too tough for 9.3x62 velocities. I got some Norma RNs from a board member at CGN. Now to do up some test loads and see what we've got.

I was thinking either the partitions or the xxx barnes, really did not know where to start as far as what powder and the load, but I think after reading this I will probably go with the 286 partitions. I am assuming that you are using magnum primers, neck sizing and trimming your cases.
Thanks for the info.

James

My CZ likes 250 grain TSX with 60.5 Grains of Varget under it.

Spot

I have two 9.3x62, a CZ 550 FS and a Merkel KR-1. I have used Partisan 286, Nosler Partition 286 and Accubond 250, Speer 270, Lapua 285, Norma factory 286 Oryx, Woodleigh 286 solids and Hornady 286. The Speer bullets are the cheapest I've found and as said above the 270 is adequate for whitetail and African plains game. A chap on the Midway site indicated he would not use the Speer on larger plains game (Wildebeest and up). My tests on water-filled milk jugs with Speer was 7 jugs and I did not recover the bullet. Hornady are the next in line for cheap shooting. They are the well constructed interlock design and they performed similar to the Speer in jug tests. I think the issue is - what if bone gets in the way of the slightly lighter Speer. It has more lead tip exposed. The Hornady is of protected point design.
Vive la 9.3x62 - a great cartridge
At 100 yards all shot well. Seems the best liked powder I've found was RL-15 but H414 with a magnum primer works fine. Most recipes of RL-15 max at 58 to 58.5. I have taken the H414 to 65. The latter seemed quite a bit compared to manuals, but I found it on the net and I worked up from 58. Bl-C2 at 65 gr was pretty snappy for the 270 Speer at about 2500 from the 20 inch CZ barrell. Obvious disclamer: Reduce max loads by 10% or so and work up.

I switched to Ramshot Big Game from RL15 and have had good results with the 270gr Speer.

285 prvi and Norma 286 alaska's

BL-C 56grn either bullet

IMR 4064 55.5 grn either bullet

H-414 61.5 either bullet (Pretty darn stiff load if I remember)

My CZ 550FS loves RL 15 and either 286 Partitions or Hornadys. I plan to work with 250 Accubonds and Ramshot Big Game this winter.

RL-15 works for me in every weight from 232 to 286. Have not tried anything heavier than 286. Standard primers in my loads. I use Graf & Lapua brass, can't beat the Lapua. 20 inch barrel.

Rl-15 is a great powder in he 9.3x62, but I have had a little better luck (both accuracy and velocity) with around 65 grains of Ramshot Big Game and the 286-grain bullets, whether the Partition or TSX or whatever. The Partition is like some of the other really heavy Noslers in that the jacket partition is well forward. Generally ith will retain 85-90% of its weight, and penetrate very deeply. It has worked very well for me on heavier game like kudu and moose, but also expands easily on deer-sized game and kills them quickly as well.

RL-15 also works with 250's, but I have Big Game a little slow for the lighter bullets. Varget shoots 250's better in some rifles than RL-15, at about the same velocities. In my CZ (23.6") barrel Varget will easily get 2650 out of a 250 with excellent accuracy.

Anyone know where there is a nice 9.3 x 62 for sale at a decent price? Been thinking I should be rewarded for not shopping on black friday.

I see them all the time.

Saw a cool styer prohunter at a gunshop in Boulder CO the other day, cool gun you dont just see anywhere.

This is not a terrible deal on gunbroker, Free shipping and no tax!
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=117189344

This could be cool, get some one like Tip Burns www.burnsgunrepair.com

to run a 9.3x62 reamer in this one and clean it up I think you would have less than $700 in it and it would be a very nice styled 9.3.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=117121974

This is a classy looking son of a gun:
http://www.gunsinternational.com/detail.cfm?id=100061750&string=act=adv

As I said earlier Tip Burns had a nice Mark X action in the white in his shop about a month ago, he could turn into a awesome piece.

He has done quite a bit of work for me, and some of my friends and it is top notch. He likes doing big bores, he is doing a 10.75x68 for a client right now that is very nice!!!

Ed

Thanks..That Guns International also had a Zastava Mauser 98 9.3x62 Sporter.. I think the CZ 550 FS is an attractrive rifle. Just wondering if the 20 1/2" barrel might cause a loss of velocity..

Yep, the zastava belongs to one person I care not to do business again. If you biy it from Russ good luck! I left it out for a reason

I think 20.5 would be fine my 9.3x62 has a 19 3/4 in barrel, it is built like this.

http://www.blaser.de/R-93-Professional-Tracking.590.0.html?&L=1

Ed

I have a CZ 550 FS with the 20.5" stock. It shoots everything well. Love that rifle, and would HIGHLY recommend it to anyone looking for a 9.3x62.

Get one.

No that sounds like the kind of guy I wouldn't do business with. I listen to people and their testimonials..lol One reason the CZ 550 FS is nice is that it has iron sights. I would keep it that way for awhile.. Have several scoped guns and my eyes may be 54 but they still do OK. Then later if I choose..easy to find scoperings for it.. maybe even buy them now for later.. I will have to keep a look out for one..seems like the price is creeping up.

I love the 9.3x62 and I find it a better caliber than the 9.3x64 for my purposes..I can get within about 75 FPS of the 9.3x64 by using a 26" tube in the 9.3x62..

I have used the 270 gr. Speer on deer and a limited amount of plainsgame, the reason I say limited is the bullet is simply too soft for the velocities I generate in my 9.3s, so I dropped it from my agenda. The Hornady bullets work well for me on plainsgame and deer and even elk.

I like the 286 gr. Nosler for most hunting and I really like the 320 gr. Woodliegh for Cape Buffalo at 2400 FPS in my long throated and long tubed 9.3x62 with a big dose of RL-15. I believe I would opt for a 300 gr. swift or a lighter GS Customs bullet in the 9.3x62 if it were a carbine...

I also really preferred the North fork cup point for buffalo over any other bullet I ever used and I could push it much faster than the 320 gr. Woodleigh.

Just a great caliber for any big game.

Not for everyone out there, but you can readily have a Ruger #1 rebored and rechambered to 9.3 x62. 26 inch barrel on the #1Bs too. Recoil is lively, but manageable even with my bad shoulder. Scoped with a Leupold 6x, its no lightweight but the I have little use of the slim barreled Syntheic stocked LTWs. It is a very compact and nicely balanced rifle.

Now to find something big enough east of the Big Muddy...

1B

I think I would just get a Ruger #1 in 9.3X74. It has the same ballistics and is a traditional cartridge for single shots.

Interesting - that translates to 4114 ft-lbs muzzle energy; what load do you use for the 320?

??? better for your purposes, yet picking a longer tube to get performance the 64 'give you ???

I have a 9,3x64 DWM 98 with a 22" tube that gives me 2400 fps with 286 gr. Barnes TSX on top of 62 gr. N140 (Vihtavuori). I am pleased with this load and well more with the handling of the rifle - light & short.

I had to use the 26 inch tube with the 320 gr. Woodleigh in my 9.3x62 as I couldn't quite get to where I needed to be with that heavy bullet in the shorter barrels, but only with that one bullet..I can get 2700 with a 250 Barnes, and 2400 with a 286 gr. Nosler with a short tube (24")in my case. I might add the extra 4 inches of barrel is the same length of my pocket knife and long tubes are an asset IMO..they point better and hold better for off hand shooting, so its just a matter of personal choice, no arguement here.

I have no problem with with the 9.3x64, its a great cartridge, other than brass has been very hard to come by off and on over the years and also very expensive in the past...These problems have lessened recently, for how long I don't know! and of course I realize a long tube 9.3x64 would also pick up the anti in favor of the 9.3x64..

That all said I still prefer the 9.3x62 and I have owned and shot both, but like I said, its better for MY purposes such as easier to build in a std. action, with a good deal less modification, I have the reamer on hand, I have the loads and brass handy..There are more reasons on my part than just picking a long tube in other words. If I had a good 9.3x64 I would be perfectly content with it.

Bundukwalla,
My personal load was a stiff load of RL-15, in my long throated and lengthened magazine 9.3x62 which I just recently sold to a friend of mine and sometime back I sold my other one..I suppose when I finish my 404 then my next project will be another 9.3x62, perhaps a Manlicher with a 20 inch tube and a receiver sight since I have about 800 loaded rounds, that much brass and that many bullets, and dies, I would bet. That is unless someone would buy all my components..I think I still prefer my 375 H&H over the 9.3s or at least that was my justification for selling them both.:)

That Mannlicher with a 20" tube sounds like a great idea. Somehow I get the feeling, you do not need too much encouragement on rifle projects. Hope to see the .404 sometime.
Now, I just now can not enter into the 9,3s vs. .375 H&H - Debatte, as I am currently ruminating the .270 vs. 30-06

all the best.

Hi group,

Recently purchased a CZ 550FS in 9.3x62 and glad to find a lot of you familiar with the cartridge. Had to have one gun different from my group of shooting and hunting friends. Love the gun and having fun working up loads.

I see where a number of you are using RL15. It works for me also but 58.0 grains of IMR4064 really is the most accurate in my gun, and at 2500fps with 250gr Nosler Accubonds. No pressure issues whatsoever. Quite satisfied with the velocity, even with the 20" length. Not going to Africa but will be chasing auodad sheep and elk around our little ranch in the next couple weeks. Hopefully, I'll have my first "performance" review.

I had a CZ Mannlicher-style rifle in 9.3x62 for a while, mostly to compare to my main CZ 9.3x62, which has a 23.6" barrel. I tried 4 different loads in the "carbine," two factory and two handloads, and the biggest difference was 88 fps, which ain't much. In fact one load went a little FASTER in the short barrel, which sounds strange but isn't all that unusual when you start experimenting.

One reason I like Ramshot Big Game with 286's (and heavier) in the 9.3x62 is that is is a very dense ball powder, a little slower than RL-15. My main 286 load is around 65-66 grains of Big Game, and it gets just about 2500 in my 23.6" barrel. And yes, I have had it pressure tested and it develops right around 60,000 psi. Accuracy has been very good in several 9.3x62's.

There really isn't a vast difference between the case capacity of the 9.3x62 and the 9.3x64. The reason for the big difference in factory velocities between the two is that the standard CIP ("European SAAMI") pressure for the 9.3x62 is pretty low, while the pressure for the 9.3x64 is much higher. Load them both to the same pressure and there really isn't a heck of a lot of difference.

Thanks Mule Deer.

I am going to start moving up to the heavier bullets and will give Ramshop Big Game a try. I have not worked with it before but this will be a good opportunity.

Thanks for the info.

I've been shooting a CZ 550 in 9.3x62 for about 12 years. I have killed everything I have shot usually with one shot. I don't mean that as a testimony to my shooting but to the ability of the cartridge to perform outside it's apparent ability. I use 54.7gr of Norma 201 with a 286 gr Nosler Partition and WLR primer. It is a Norma factory duplication load and shoots to the same point of impact as Nosler custom ammo. IMR 4895 56.6 gr and a Nosler 286gr Partiton with a Federal primer also shoots to the same point. Nosler claims 2450fps for their ammo. I think my loads are about 2350. That is plenty good for my purposes.
I tried Reloader 15 but didn't get the accuracy I got with Norma and IMR.
I have used these loads in 3 rifles and all shoot them well.
This is my "go-to" cartridge if I'm not carrying a 30.06. It doesn't spoil meat but penetrates like crazy. I shot one all the way through a 220# wart hog end to end. One entered the thigh of a mature kudu,passed through the hip and pelvis,rumen,liver,lungs,heart and came to rest under the opposite shoulder blade.The front of the bullet was gone but the rear half was there. I recovered one from an eland this year that weighed 254 gr another weighed 266gr.It is a great round.

Otto Bock was on to something. Love that name.

How does all this differ from the .375 Ruger? Don't get me wrong,I like the 9.3's,have two of them,but the Ruger does seem to fill the same pair of shoes....??

Predates the Ruger, by about a century
Lower pressure
Standard bolt face
Lower recoil, with lower but still impressive and nearly comparable performance

I have shot both side by side,could not tell any difference in 'butt smack'....Lower pressure will depend on the load..A standard bolt face reletes to what?..Both are good rounds,but a lot more bullets are around for the .375......

Standard .473" bolt face. I.e., if you have a Mauser, Rem., or whatever with that bolt face, '06 family magazine, you have no changes necessary other than a re-barrel, to go to 9.3x62.

Lower pressure will depend upon the load, but on average, and esp. when comparing factory fodder to factory fodder, the 9.3 is lower pressure.

I've shot both side by side, and to me, the 9.3 recoil is less "felt", not that either is overly objectionable.

Granted, there are FAR more bullets out there for the .375s.

Can't figure what you're getting at though.

I don't think the boltface is a big deal,the gunsmith would at least reface it anyway,to open it is not that much more...
just throwing out seed for thought....maybe just part of justifing the next purchase.

The big advantage of the "smaller bolt face" is not being able to rebarrel any '06-size action, but 5 rounds in the magazine versus 3. This mayb not seem like a big deal, but sometimes it can make a difference.

If we only used factory loads in the 9.3x62 and .375 Ruger, then pressure would indeed be different. If we're handloading, then we can make pressure anything we want to.

I have owned both 9.3x62's and .375 Rugers of the same approximate weight. If somebody says they can't tell any difference in the recoil between the two, even with both loading to top practical velocities, then either that person is extremely insensitive to practical physics, or one of those who likes to not-so-subtly brag about how tough they are.

Heck, my Ruger M77 Magnum in .375 H&H weighs about 10.5 pounds (with scope) and to me it has more FELT recoil than my CZ 550 in 9.3x62 that weighs about 8.5 pounds (with scope). Can't really explain it... Maybe stock shape, pad differences... who knows... But I much prefer to shoot my CZ 550 in 9.3x62 compared to my Ruger M77 Magnum in .375 H&H.

My .375 H&H handload is a 300 gr bullet at about 2480 fps.
My 9.3x62 handload is a 286 gr bullet at about 2400 fps.

That doesn't seem like much of a difference but my shoulder can sure feel the difference between the two rifles. That's one of the reasons I've become such a fan of the 9.3x62 cartridge.

Just my ramblings and my two cents worth.... Your mileage may vary.
Cheers!
-Bob F.

Thats right - just the 9,3s walked in them for decades.

Here the dimensions behind:

Case Cap in grains water:

9,3x62 78
9,3x64 88
.375 Ruger 99

Here are some cartridges in bear camp.



left to right,

450 Alaska, 375 Ruger, 45-70 (2x), 9,3x64

Personally I see no comparison with the 9.3x62 to the .375 Ruger. Both are excellent, but in equal weights he 375 Rugers recoil is considerably more, the cross section of bullet is larger and that counts in my books for stopping power. The 375 is a more powerful caliber, end of story.

Bottom line is take your pick and whichever one you opt for is a good choice. The extra rounds in the magazine as Muledeer suggests is a good option for any DGR caliber, that is why I opt of drop magazines..

I built a walk about DGR Mauser with a drop magazine recently, it was a 9.3x62 and you could load it on Sunday and shoot till the following saturday..It weighed 8.5 lbs. and was trim and slim, and had a Williams Guide rear peep.. I built it specifically to hunt Cape Buffalo as I could carry it all day on long treks in high heat, and it had suffiecient power for the bulls and extra rounds in the box...I loved that gun but alas it never made that slated trip with me as it sold shortly after I built it to a gent that really liked the idea..I might build another but in a manlicher with a short tube. One could do about the same thing with a Ruger 375 however, so take your pick.

relevant - probably not. No animal will know the difference.



as a result of the higher velocity - +1

so in my book - .375 H&H or Ruger stretch the range a bit over 9,3x62 but I lack means to quantify any advantage in killing, given similar range and shot placement.

And just to think, I did not want to get drawn into just this dicussion.

Muledeer

(I have owned both 9.3x62's and .375 Rugers of the same approximate weight. If somebody says they can't tell any difference in the recoil between the two, even with both loading to top practical velocities, then either that person is extremely insensitive to practical physics, or one of those who likes to not-so-subtly brag about how tough they are.)
It may just be I've shooting big bores a while and not sensitive to recoil because I was taught how to to shoot a big bore proper...That was not the statement I made,I brought up a comparsion between the two rounds.As I said,I already own two 9.3's and shoot them alot,as of this week I'm waiting on my new bullet mold.I'm not sure mag/capacity matters when some of the world hunts with single shots,as you have done yourself??? What's your point?

Whatever it was, I think you missed it.

I suppose you did? I ask a question and get shin-kicked ??? WTF?
I must have stepped on some Holy Ground?

rifle,

I have been shooting big bores for a while myself. Don't know exactly what "shoot a big bore proper" means, but I have managed to hit what I've aimed at with various .375's-.470's etc. I also don't know what being "taught" how to shoot a big bore means, as I just worked my way up over the years, and learned on my own how to hold them reasonably firmly, whether offhand or shooting off the bench. Did read some stuff by Elmer Keith that helped.

I shoot a lot of different rifles in order to find out what they are like. Consequently I have shot dangerou game with single-shots, bolts, etc. Have also been along when other people used other things, including double rifles and even lever-actions. Consequently I think some extra magazine capacity is a good thing on occasion, though not absolutely necessary.

My POINT is that there are choices to make. My profession--at least to my way of thinking--is to present the pros and cons, with some experience to back them up. Certainly a single-shot will do the job, as will a double rifle, or a bolt with various magazine capacities, or even a lever-action. But each is indeed different, and I try to present the differences, based on my experience.

You presented your experience with 9.3x62/.375 Ruger recoil. Everybody else so far has disagreed with your conclusion. As far as I can tell, all who did so also have considerable experience with big-bore recoil, though perhaps we haven't been taught as well as you.

Maybe it's just me but all of my 375's seem to recoil more than my 9.3x62's (of the same weight). that is one reason Ganyana likes his 9.3x62 as well as his right shoulderhas stopped one too many bullets and it seem to be overly sensitive to larger calibers.

Well,it seems this has turned into another 'Campfire' pissing match,it seems to be the norm now...Someone relates their personal experince and get trumped on by the Gods....Sorry,John you didn't understand any of my statements about shooting,I thought you had been around some.
Before I leave,yes I shoot the 9.3's,.338,.358 and the .375's.I own and shoot .404 Jeff,.450/400,several .458's,I have owned the ,470,475 #2 and a .510 Wells.I shoot what I own,learn all I can and have hunted in 28 states and 7 countries,I know what I know.I don't need BS and Drama,I came here to relax and share a 'fire.....rifle

Well,

Might as well get into the brawl too. I just got thru shooting my Blaser semi-weight 375 next to my blaser tracker 9.3x62

My 9.3 is about 7.7lbs

My 375 is almost 9.2lbs

I was shooting 286 norma alaska's with 52.5 grains of 4064 at right under 2280 in the 9.3.

I was shooting 300 grain hornady with 65.5 grains of varget at right at 2425 out of the H&H.

The 375 belts you, much, much more!

I know it is not all apples to apples, but I will say that recoil has alot to do with speed or the bullet and powder charge.Also the recoil speed, it seems to be greater with the 375

One of the most unpleasant rifles I ever had built was a 30-378 it was 7lbs straight up with a scope and a beast to pull the trigger on.

Just my 2 cents,

Ed

rifle,

Gee, I've hunted in 12 countries (including 7 provinces in Canada), and 37 states. I also own a .22 Hornet and have eaten gumbo in New Orleans.

I don't know what any of those have to do with the relative recoil of the 9.3x62 and .375 Ruger, but your latest post confirmed what I suspected after your first on this thread.

>>>How does all this differ from the .375 Ruger? Don't get me wrong,I like the 9.3's,have two of them,but the Ruger does seem to fill the same pair of shoes....??<<<<<
Muledeer...tell me where this ran off track?? I simply asked for a comparasion between the two 9.3 cartridges before named and the Ruger.375.Has that not been done here many times before??

Muledeer... I do have to ask..do you not beleive that two rifles firing 270 grain bullets,both weigh 8.5lbs, will recoil the same?
I could care less if you like me or not, my use of the Queens english(Mothers side),that's not the point.I am not trying to sell myself to you or anyone else,but just show there are others in the world that have pulled a trigger,but you would not know that,because I don't write magazines,so you can't read about it... I really surprised you made this personal...

No, they won't, if you're talking factory ammunition (apples to apples). The Ruger has a far greater case capacity, is loaded to a higher pressure, and with more powder. Those factors will lead to a greater recoil.

If you take the 9.3, load 62.0 of powder for 2500 fps with a 270 gr. bullet (average factory load) in an 8.5 lbs rifle, you get a recoil impulse of 4.09 lbs/sec, a recoil velocity of 15.51 fps, and a free recoil energy of 31.76 ft/lbs.

If you take the .375 Ruger, load 75.0 gr. of RL-15 for 2800 fps (about the average factory load) in an 8.5 lbs rifle, you get a recoil impulse of 4.69 lbs/sec (14.7% greater), a recoil velocity of 17.75 fps (14.4% faster), and a free recoil energy of 41.57 ft/lbs (30.9% greater).

Now, stock design may play a lot in actual felt recoil, but set into identical weight and design rifles, and loaded with standard factory ballistic ammunition, the .375 Ruger recoils with greater force, and faster, than the 9.3x62. That's just simple physics. Whether some factors (stock design) mitigate the felt impact of those greater numbers to a particular shooter or not, the simple physics is still there.

And, yes, I've shot both. The .375 Ruger kicked me worse than the 9.3x62 in the rifles that I've tried both in.

But in your numbers you added 300fps to the Ruger? My 9.3 is a full size CZ and 1.5-5x Leupold,the Ruger I shot was scoped the same,weight felt the same and recoil felt the same to me.that's all I have been trying say...

Right. I used STANDARD FACTORY LOAD ballistics.

Loaded the same, they will feel close enough to the same to be nearly unnoticeable. Again, simple physics.

Though, simply, you're the only one talking about loading the .375 Ruger down to 9.3 ballistics.

+1

At least that is how I'm reading you "rifle".

My current 9.3x62mm weighs 1 1/2lbs less than my .375 H&H
Felt recoil is quite noticeable between the two (with factory loaded ammo).... with the 9.3x62mm feeling much softer on my shoulder.

A couple years ago I had a CZ550 FS. Sans scope and rings it weighed almost 3 pounds less than my .375 H&H. Felt recoil again was noticeable between the two. Again, the nod went to the 9.3x62 for being milder.

If you honestly can not discern a difference in felt recoil between the two "rifle", then your threshold is indeed quite high and not the norm!

I don't think my threshold is any higher,different maybe.I can tell a difference in my pre-64's in .338 and .375 from the bench,but from shooting sticks,fence post or hind feet,not really,but let's maybe add the 9.3x64,that some gentlemen have thrown in, to the math against the Ruger..really any difference? I do not own the Ruger I shot last week and they were handloads the shooter had at the range.Simple load of 270 grains running 2400fps.My CZ was pushing the same.I just didn't feel any difference.I learned years ago not to let a rifle hurt me twice..........What can I say,I'm an outcast.

Well, there's the explanation.

OK you guys have had your fight now its my turn....:)

CMG,
I know the demensions of the 9.3 and 375 and thanks for the pictures but in a stopping caliber I personally put a good deal of importance on cross section of bullet and I respectfully disagree with your analysis that it makes no difference..If you think about it the difference in a 505 and a 375 or whatever is very little to look at, but in the field and on big bad black bulls coming your way I will stay with the cross section of bullet as one of the best options to get the job done....

Not saying who is right or wrong but simply stating my opinnion..

Lets keep it civil as it really doesn't make a s--t one way or the other on these discussions IMO.

Hello Ray,

before I go on, I put my faceguard up. My name is Carl. I am pleased to meet you.

Of course you are right in your analysis, that bigger cross section rules in a stopping rifle.

All I mend to illustrate with the little picture is the difference 9,3 to .375 in cross section as I feel thats pretty much same class or ball park.

Now, .510 and .375 is something different.

I never had big black bulls come my way. I have, however, enough background to conclude - crossection & sufficient weight of a properly constructed bullet at sufficient velocity and, paramount, good shotplacement will sort anything out - big and black, brown and growly, fast and yellow, spotted air or tusks and trunks.

If ever you thing me smart alecky - that may be age-related. Maybe I am to young still. It may also be language related. My english is not mothertrained.

Which ever way, malice or disrespect is not my intend.

All the best,

In my experience stopping power comes from first - bullet placement and second- bullet performance and bullet performance is related to it's Toughness, Sectional Density and Diameter,( basically in that order) and finally impact velocity/energy ( if you shoot them hard off the muzzle then that is muzzle energy but otherwise it is energy at the distance where they are shot.

Argueing over the 9.3 and 375 is even sillier than the old 270 vrs 30-06 argument.The bore diameter of the .375 is .366 and if anyone thinks the difference of .009" makes any recognizable difference in performance on game I have some rifles to sell them.
Even Kenya recognized that when they required the 375 for dangerous game - unless you were already using the 9.3.

458WM,

you have no way of knowing, but mentioning the .270 vs .30-06 debate was my (unsuccessfull)try to avoid being drawn into this debate.

Thank you for your "principle component analysis" on the stopping power ingredients.

I have a 9,3x64 set up quite like "Old Ugly".

Glad for the opportunity to discuss things here and hope to meet you maybe sometime.

cmg, I have always thought a M-95 in 9.3x62 would make a pretty fair, very fast operating, DG rifle.

458Win...I appreciate your comments and respect your background.I have enjoyed your 'been there,done that'stories.I think a teacher to us all.
My comments were not to argue this and that,but simply state that 'my first contact' with the new Ruger was even with my 9.3
and asked for thoughts on a comparision from others...
Where the personal attacks came from,surprises me,but it seems to be the growing nature of the Internet.Some of the things said on this board,I believe would start a hell of bloody bar brawl.
To cmg,I hope your comment was not aimed at my mother.I am proud of her background and heritage,God rest her soul...
To the original poster,my apologies for my part in putting a bend in the river.....rifle

458Win,

I agree. Sweet project-if one had time. Occasionally I have hunters tote one in 8x56R around.

Rifle, no. Though, I do not even know which comment you mean. Basically just bashed myself.

I appreciate the above posts and I know the subject is argueable or so it seems, however I do believe there is a difference in the way the 375 kills as compared to the 9.3x62, at least on buffalo or elephant, as well as I believe the .416 kills better than the 375 on these animals..

Granted I base this on my own personal experience and that may be flawed by circumstance, such as better shot placement with the .375 for instance or a number of other things. But we each fly by the seat of our pants when it comes to stopping rifles or rifles in general for that matter..My head is made up, I will not deter, I am old and sot in my ways. but I appreciate the good conversation and the quality of expertise that is posting on the subject.

I do respect each of the posts and at no point considered it more than intelligent conversation between gentlemen. That is the way these posts should always be conducted.

Ray,
You are entirely correct. My mind is made up about the round-has been for years. Like you I can pick the one I want today. I like the low recoil and penetration. I can shoot a Lott or 450 Dakota or a Rigby but why do I need to unless I'm after buff or elephant(and that ain't happenin'). I like the 375 H&H and have several but just prefer the 9.3. I'm really not into pain and like blonds. Some guys like to be beat up and like redheads. All in your preferences.

Ray, I should have known that when I said I had a rifle to sell to anyone who believed that the difference in diameter of only the rifling would make a difference in stopping power that you would call me on it - if only to see what the rifle was.

rifle,

I did not mean to make it personal.

I recently had some difficulty with a couple of other posters and it made me prickly. Consequently your first post (to me) sounded like you have a battle-hardened shoulder and above-average knowledge of how to shoot a hard-kicking rifle. I reacted to that, and shouldn't have. Usually I am much more even mannered.

It turns out that you weren't even really firing a "true" .375 Ruger, but one loaded down to under .375 H&H levels. Fair enough. I wish you had said that earlier.

At any rate, I have been a little out of sorts since my run-in with two serious troublemakers a few days ago on another forum. I apologize for offending you. You were just reporting your experience.

Mule Deer, accepted and understood....I was misinformed as well about the loads I shot,which led me to believe what I said.When I called the shooting buddy to ask for a re-shoot this week,I'm bringing some store bought....
Sorry 'bout them other posters

..Keyboard Kowboys seem to be everywhere these days....

Thanks.

You'll be able to feel those factory loads, especially if they are 300's. One thing I decided about my .375 Ruger (the African model) was that for African hunting (where I'm dressed in a thin shirt) it would need more recoil pad!

Indeed you will.
I've been shooting some heavy stuff lately and wondered why my usual sore shoulder wasn't there. Today I looked and the recoil pad is "Pachmayr White Line" put on by the previous owner. It is an amazing pad. Very Soft. Best I ever used.
FYI

GOOD to know! That's what's on the Fajen stock of the custom 1924 Yugoslavian Mauser I bought yrs ago. It was a .25-06 w/26" bbl but it's on its way back from Clearwater Reboring as a 9.3x62mm w/a 20"bbl.

Phil,
I thought about it and decided it would be out of character for me not to gig you at least once this year and thought I'd just go ahead and get it over with..I supppose the only disagreement you and I have ever had was over that certain bullet, and that ain't never gonna change! even if your right! what would we have to discuss over a campfire if that ever happened. BTW, those Hornady DG bullets are the berrys, they really work, both solids and softs.

..... I'm really not into pain and like blonds. Some guys like to be beat up and like redheads. All in your preferences.[/quote] .....I know, I know, but even knowing it's killing you, you can love the trip along the way! One of the proudest accomplishment of my life is that I've survived three red headed girl friends. My 338 Win Mag lightweight rifle is a pussycat next to those gals, who were more just plain p---y... (I sure hope this is an adult forum)..

Ray, I was afraid those Hornady bullets were going to be so good that we wouldn't have anything to argue about. I plan on using them a lot this next season. Some of them in a Jeffery 450/400. Maybe I'll decide doubles are great and you can take the side of bolt rifles and we can still have our tiffs.

Was it Paul McCartny who wrote :
"I once had a girl
or she had me.."

Hey Phil, when you switch whole-hog to doubles keep me in mind for that 505. It'll save me building one myself!

Are the DGS/DGX available as components? I'm thinking about them for my 416 for the upcoming trip for the bad cow.

I,for one, Have greatly enjoyed the give and take, the spirited discusion, the strongly held opinions - and most of all - a chance to read and reflect upon the words of men with so many years of combined experience. From reading exchanges like this - we all can learn so much. Well done!

The fact that I can converse with gentlemen of your own experience and stature on a forum such as is greatly appreciated.

In fact, due to my being able to converse and discuss things with men of your experience - I end up shooting more, dreaming more, and buying more magazines when I see that they contain articles written by those of you who write articles professionally.

In short - thank you!

Mule Deer & 458 Win...

Since your both in on this discussion would you give us your thoughts on the 9.3x62mm Mauser as compared to the .375 Ruger? Starting with they're both medium bore cartridges that fit into 30-06 actions...

idahoguy101

John Lennon. Norwegian Wood.

BR549?
Isn't that Junior Samples phone number?

Back to the original topic, the 9.3 X 62. I have two, and shoot them with utmost satisfaction. Felt recoil seems much more pleasant than the .375 H & H. The lethality seems out of proportion to the paper ballistics. I've got several Cape buffalo, LD eland, leopard, sable, and a host of others that will verify that the 9.3 X 62 is an effective killer.

I use 60g of H414 with the Barnes 259 TSX. R15 groups better, but the H414 meters so well, and has been effective every time, I just don't have a reason to change.

idahoguy101,

The 9.3x62 holds five rounds in a standard magazine; the .375 Ruger holds 3 rounds. The 9.3x62 can be made up into an 8-pound rifle without kicking all that hard. The .375 Ruger has much more noticeable recoil--still not anything like a .416, but it's definitely there. The 9.3x62 isn't legal in some African countries for most dangerous game; the .375 Ruger is legal in all African countries for dangerous game.

While the 9.3x62 is perfectly capable of killing about anything on earth, so is the .30-06. While the .375 Ruger is a slight step up from the .375 H&H, it isn't a .416 or .458.

My personal notions always tend toward wretched excess, which is why I have three 9.3 rifles. One is a 9.3x62, another is a 9,.3x74R double rifle, and another is a 9.3 B-S, a wildcat on the .350 Remington Magnum case. All three get pretty much exactly the same ballistics. I also own a .375 H&H, and used to own two--plus a .375 Ruger. I also own two .416's and a .458.

All of this means nothing except that I like rifles a lot--but I am also not forced to make any decisions except which one to take on any hunt.

If I were forced to own only a 9.3 or a .375, I would make the decision on whether I was going to hunt African dangerous game. As noted earlier, the .375's are legal over there, and generally the 9.3x62 isn't.

The 9.3x62 is a great cartridge for the larger African plains game, even in open country with a 250-grain bullet handloaded to around 2700 fps (an easy thing to do). But it isn't a .375, either legally or ballistically.

Personally I kinda prefer a .416 for Cape buffalo, the dangerous game most hunted in Africa. It hits them noticeably harder than either a 9.3 or .416, and its heavier bullets also get through really heavy bone just a little better than anything lighter. I have twice seen good 300-grain .375 bullets do weird things when hitting heavier buffalo bones. This isn't common but I have seen it happen--and haven't seen it happen with .416 bullets.

In North America I would happily go with the 9.3 for any kind of big game hunting, and have.

JB,

Allow me to point out that the slight larger base just ahead to the extractor groove that the 9.3 X 62 (and the 6.5 X 55) enjoy over the '06 case, will preclude the loading of 5 rounds into some customized Mauser actions. (ask me how I found out, twice!)

Of course, the CZ does not share this quirk.

"In North America I would happily go with the 9.3 for any kind of big game hunting, and have."

Couldn't agree with that statement more.

hatari,

Thanks for noting that. I haven't built any 9.3x62's on a 98 action--but have encountered that very problem with the 6.5x55!

Of course, 4 down is still one more than the .375 Ruger (or .375 H&H) gets in a standard action.

Isn't it amazing how so many such ancient rounds work so well? Which is why they're stil around....

JB & All,

Great thread for us beginners!

Have a LH .375 Ruger waiting to be picked up this weekend. Dies, brass bullets on the way. Think I'll load slightly above 9.3x62 levels to start with. Can always go full-house later if Africa becomes an option.

An excellent idea! The .375 Ruger should be very flexible when downloaded, just like the .375 H&H.

The 9.3x62 makes up into a really nice light minimum Cape Buffalo caliber and when used properly works very well on them..I have shot seveal Cape Buffalo with the 9.3x62. My rifle had a a 26" tube and with a max load of RL-15 and a 320 gr. Woodlieh it killed them...Personally I would prefer the 375 Ruger or the H&H anyway you cut it and better yet a 416 or 404..

There are no miracle calibers out there. there are good and better and bigger is better on DG anyway you cut it when the distance gets short..

IMO one should use the biggest caliber that he can shoot comfortably and accurately without ANY regard in his mind to recoil. To me personally, that equates to a 416 or 404, 450-400 and a 450-3.25 at the very top end...Others can handle more recoil comfortably, others just "claim" they can and these are the boys that get you in trouble....

If you are uncomfortable with a .375 Ruger or H&H then use the great little 9.3 x 62....its the next best choice down.

I see quite often that it is mentioned that the 9.3 is not legal in some places, are the only 2 S. Africa, and Tanz.?

I know the 9.3 is legal in Zim,and Namb.

In CAR, Camaroon, and Benin is'nt the min just 338?

Is it the P.H.'s call in the other countries like Zambia and Botswana? I have never hunted in those countries.

So if true just 2 African holdouts! Viva the 9.3!

Ed

Just a note , my 9.3x62 1917 Enfield holds 6 in the mag.It weighs 8.5# with a 1x4 Leapold. --- Mel

Just tried my Yugoslavian Mauser and it'll hold and feed 5 9.3x62mm's.

The 9.3 is legal in several countrties--but only the bore size, accompanied by an energy minimum that effectively rules out the 9.3x62, but allows the 9.3x64. My understanding is that this is the case both in Zimbabwe and Botswana. Of course a lot of officials can't tell the difference, and often the PH doesn't care and will allow the hunter to use whatever he wants, within reason. I know two people that have used .338's on buffalo in countries where 9.3 or .375 is the minimum, and one woman who killed a buffalo (quite neatly) with a 7x57 in Zimbabwe. Her PH gave the OK....

Whenever I turn to the Big Bore section of this forum, it's in hopes of an interesting read and exchange on some really fascinating bore above .40 that's lately been resurrected!

However, I must admit that the 9.3 X 62mm is fascination enough!
I have to go to a meeting just now, but will be back in a couple hours to see how this is developing. In the meanwhile, if you care to, you can read my blog on some of this at www.bigbores.ca

I tend to agree, This board considers the 9.3 and the 375 large bores where most consider them heavy mediums, but heck if I can talk about 9.3's and hunting who am I to bitch!

I could not pull up you blog.

Ed

I couldn't either.

505ED;

I couldn't either from this site. Not sure why. It is the correct address and works from other sites and you can type it in if you want up at the top of this page in space provided. That'll work. Then click Go.

It was the period at the end. This will get you in:

http://www.bigbores.ca/

Thanks Ron;

It's been fixed (removed the nasty period)!

I am not an experienced big game hunter. I do have a CZ 550 FS with 20.5 inch barrel, 7 lb 12 oz and a CZ 550 American with 23.5 inch barrel, 8 lbs 12 oz. Using 59.0 grains Varget, 286 grain Nosler Partition, I get 2399 fps (59 F) and 2469 fps (94 F). If you adjust one foot-per-second for each degree, the difference is some 35 fps. The original 70 fps isn't much to worry about either.
About this recoil thing, my CZ 550, .375 H&H weighs 10.5 pounds, 25 inch barrel, with scope and pushes a 300 grain Hornady RN at 2625 fps, using 70.0 grains R-15. My .375 Ruger African, 23 inch barrel, under 8 lbs, gives 2615 fps with 83.3 grains H414. My 8 lb .416 Taylor, pushes a 400 grain bullet at 2150 fps, using 68 grains RL-15.
Recoil goes from a low of 35 ft-lb and 16 fps in the heavier 9.3x62 to a high of 60 ft-lb and 22 fps in the .416 Taylor. The general recoil of the .375 H&H and .375 Ruger come to some odd 54 ft-lbs at 21 fps for the 375 Ruger and 37 ft-lb and 15 fps for the similar but much heavier .375 H&H. Those who favor high magazine capacity might note the CZ550 holds five .375 H&H cartridges, at a cost of some 2.5 lbs of weight compared to the scoped CZ 550 American in 9.3x62. The decision to scope or not to scope can make up half the difference between these two classes of cartridges. Changing barrel length and stocks can account for the rest of the difference in weight and recoil. Leave a quarter pound for action differences and most of the story would be told in my mind. I don't like to shoot heavy recoiling rifles in endless strings from the bench. Zero the rifle, check zero at practical shooting ranges and leave the rest to field position practice suits me. I don't shoot my .458 Lott, 68 ft-lb at 22 fps, that much with full loads once I confirmed the setting of the factory sights. Bolt action .45-70 level loads can be fun too! An 8 lb rifle has lots to recommend it for big bores, light enough to carry, heavy enough to shoot. If someone would carry it for me, I'd take the 10.5 lb .375 H&H, even from prone it is relatively painless to shoot.
Speaking out of turn around my elders in hunting and shooting, I see the .375 H&H and .375 Ruger as too much for non-dangerous medium game and not enough for heavy weight dangerous game. The versatility of the one gun for one man situation is the major issue. I am too much of a rifle junkie to not take them all hunting and shooting. I'd go with one carbine with iron sights and one rifle with scope, both in the same caliber, if I could afford the extra airline shipping costs and was going somewhere where ammo was scarce and simplicity was paramount.

For those building a 9.3x62 on a 98 Mauser. On mine I found that substituting a 1903 Springfield magazine cured the problem- five cartridges in the bottom. Not true for the standard 98 magazine.

Phil,
You will have to catch me just right, as I am double guy one minute and a bolt guy the next minute, so we can get it on, and just to keep it simple, I will, out of my great respect for you just take the opposite postion for the sake of good gun conversation, and we won't have to just sit there and agree with each other while the fire burns down, damn that gets boring....:)

As to bullet cross section, here is what I tend to believe, based mostly on observation and I realize circumstance can lead one to bend in either direction...

1. The difference in cross section between any of the big bores is precious little, but the results seems to be a factor in stopping power IMO. I might add that all the big bore doubles shoot at the SAME velocity, but the bigger the hole in the tube the better they kill is pretty much the accepted measure. Now if that is true I have yet to decide, but if it is then I place that difference on the cross section of that big bullet. I won't swear to it but I am of that opine or at least to the extent that it is a viable factor..anyway that's what I "thunk"....:)

2.As I move into my curmurdeon stage, I have more and more respect for the old ways and the knowledge that those old hunters of yesteryear learned based on shooting big bad stuff, wonder why that is? My head is made up! I earned it, paid my dues, and always have been a little hard headed and I don't want to leave this world with a mistake hanging over my head!

Just got back from shooting my 375 Ruger LH 20" Alaskan @ 2580
with a 300 Gr it kicks more than my 8# 9.3 X 62 with 286 gr at
2400 FPS. They both shoot around 1", Now which one to take to Kodiak in 2 weeks. Shot the 9.3 first then the 375 in my mind the 375 kicks noticeably more.

No dog in the fight, but if the ruger is new and 9.3 an old friend, I would suggest the 9/3

Randy

One has to be carefull when offering advise on the internet, but I think I would be safe in saying that in TAnzania and Zimbabwe if the game scout says you can use a certain caliber or your Ph says so then your good to go..at least I have always been..Africans are a practical lot, most realize that caliber is not an issue but bullet placement and construction is..They also realize that you have backup with large bore rifles.

We have had many clients in both Tanzania and Zimbabwe shoot buffalo with 9.3x62 and 74s..The 9.3x62 can be handloaded to strictly legal in Zimbabwe btw as they have an energy figure and the 9.3x62 and 64 can reach that figure with handloads.

It is not uncommon for a youngster or lady to shoot their buffalo with a 7x57 or 30-06, and they always have a couple of backup huters..I have never seen or heard of this being questioned except by internet bloggers who might go upside down on it.

I even witnessed a nice lady punch and elephant through the heart with a 7x57 175 gr. solid, and the elephant ran about 100 yards and hit the ground dead, and the blood trail almost required rubber boots to walk in, blood spewed for 10 or more feet on EACH side of that elephant like a water hose!! I was pretty impressed btw..

I wouldn't recommend that practice but it does show that bullet placement and a proper bullet is more important than caliber. Still I prefer to stay with my beloved 40 caliber magnums like the 416 Rem or Ruger and the great 404 Jefferys.

Oh yeah, since this thread is about the 9.3 and 375, if I have a 9.3x62 or a 375 Ruger or H&H , I am perfectly content when I am amongst them...

Why does it seem odd, that the guy behind the trigger is as much a part of the equation as any other to make a good, clean kill?

Ray is right! First thing a new to the game hunter should be asking, is "Where do I put it"? He should have already prepared the right bullet for the intended game and conditions. Never ask opinions of guys that haven't put this species of game on the ground, about what bullets work best. Ask the man that has done it, and hopefully more than once.

I found 2 9.3x62s
One is a Zastava Mauser factory stocked and the second is a CZ Lux Medium.
These are both internet purchases so I cannot physically compare the 2 rifles
Does anyone have any input on these 2 rifles?

I was waiting for that, Mel!

Ted

Kurt, you know you want to take the 9.3, so just do it!

I have killed some awfully big stuff, including bears with mine. Getting ready to do it again tomorrow. Just loaded up some 286 gr Hornadys with 57 gr of Re15.

Ted

John,

Isn't that a given with all Ruger rifles with any amount of recoil? Both my #1H and RSM (458 WM and 416 Rigby respectively) got new pads and, mush to my surprise - at least the first time I saw it - I found the "Goodyear" tire logo printed on the inside!

On the topic of the 9.3s, if this is a custom project, you might want to consider the 9.3x64 Brenneke. Though you would have to open up the bolt face and do some work on the action rails to feed the slightly larger cartridge, it would yield quite an increase in performance. Close to 2700 fps w/ 285 gr bullet is nothing to sneeze at.

All that said, the 9.3x62 is a nice cartridge and easy to shoot.

Curious to know what you decided on and how it worked. I've only shot one brown bear. I used a 375 Ruger Alaskan with a 300 gr TSX and don't think anything can kill a big bear deader. Gave me religion for sure.

Probably a 9.3x62 can do it too, but dead is dead, can't argue too much with that.

This thread certainly makes the 9.3x62 appealing. Dobt that there's any need to get rid of a 375 but, still, this is a nice cartridge.

About to start shooting the 9.3x62. To me it seems to fit in the same class as the 35 Whelen. Is this the wrong way to look at this great metric cartridge?

Carson: Please don't take this the wrong way because I understand what you are saying,but excessive number crunching can lead to these types of....uh...."conclusions"...

On the one hand the theory states that the smaller stuff is somehow "too dead",and that the larger,dangerous game is not quite "dead enough".

The fact that the 375 and the 9.3x62 are so highly regarded in Africa for "killing" all manner of things flies in the face of the Theory.

I've frequently given the 9.3x62 matter a good deal of thought;but with an 8 1/4 pound 375H&H,and the ability to throttle back handloads with a 300 gr bullet,to 2300 fps,I am left wondering what I'd use 9.3 for; unless, of course, I had a very nice 30/06 -length Mauser hanging around.

First I wish to thank all here who expressed their considerable expertise. This forum is blessed with many excellent members and I thank you.

This quote from Ray raises a question in my mind. If one needs the approval of a game scout for his caliber I just don't see how one can plan ahead? Long ago the .375 H&H was approved in many places. Correct me please if I am wrong.

In the field, it will do everything a .375 H&H will do. The end result shows the 9.3 X 62 to exceed the on paper ballistics.

Well, with a nice 1917 action or Remington commercial equivalent you could have more rounds in the magazine, should you ever need them!

9.3x62 threads (oughta answer a lot of questions):

Reloading the 9.3x62

9.3x62 Experiences

9.3x62 Shooters

? for Mule Deer 9.3x62 CZ 550 FS loads

This has been an interesting and entertaining thread to keep track of, though I have to admit I'm surprised that with all the energy expended (pun unavoidable) on the merits of the 9.3x62 versus the .375 Ruger, nobody suggested taking a look at the 9.3x66 (370 Sako/Federal magnum). Just like the 9.3x62, you can have 5 down and 1 up, and energy and velocity (comparing factory loads) are enough above the 9.3x62 to sneak a bit closer to the Ruger.

Back to the gent who started this thread - I have two 9.3x62s on 03 actions; one is a double heat treated Springfield and the other is on a Remington 03 (not A3). Both feed slick as can be and are a pleasure to shoot; the only game taken to date have been blacktail deer over on Kodiak Island.

Let us stir the pot a bit...

The 9,3x62s claim to fame was its inability to drive heavy (286gr) bullets (hint : sectional density) above ~ 2250 to 2300 fps target velocity - in essence below the tensile yield limit.

In short - its bullets did not fail...

This feature it shares with all other classic cartridges, that somehow, mystically, kill better than their paper rep. would indicate (says something about paper reps.)

Check these combinations (cup and core only):

.30-30 170gr. FN
.30-06 220gr. RN
.318 Westley Richards 250 gr. RN
9,3 x 62 286gr RN

In all there is lesser bullet weights available - fame came to just these combinations. The Sectional density theory was born.
It is a lot nicer to say: "Cartridge fires a bullet with high SD" than to say "go up in bullet weight until they do not blow up anymore". This not to say that SD is a fallacy; it just does not tell the whole story on bullet performance, as indicators seldom do.

To get back to the 9,3x62. A cartridge still in wide use in our parts for red deer, wild boar, roe deer, fallow deer and mufflon.

It works - why would it not. I shoot 286 gr. Barnes TSX at 2450 fps out of 22" barrel of my 9,3x64. This chambering allows me to reach 9,3x62 performance with the heavy and long copper bullets out of a short tube - lets compare:

9,3x62 : 286 grain TUG (Torpedo Universal Bullet-flow steel clad, two cores of differing hardness) at 2400 from a 25" tube
9,3x64: 286 gr. TSX at 2450 fps from 22" tube.

This works. Backed up a client on brown bear with it. Why would it not.

In real life - the 9,3x62 is everything the .35 Whelen is, and a bit more perhaps, as slightly heavier projectiles are the norm.

And that is nothing to sneeze at.

By my book, only guys who do not need a 9,3 are those who have Whelen or a Holland. These poor souls must "want" it.

Carl, glad to see you say the 9.3x62 is equivalent to the 35 Whelen. I've shot the Whelen quite a bit and I'm about to start shooting the 9.3x62, but the ballistics seem very similar. By the same reasoning, the 9.3x64 seems very similar to my 358 Mag, a 250 gn bullet at 2800 fps from a 22" bbl and the 285 gn Swift AF around 2550 fps. Although most compare the 9.3x64 to the 375H&H, the 358 Mag comparison seems most apt to me. I confess a bias to the 35s, so maybe that's influencing my thinking. What do you think?

Moe,

I do not have firsthand on game experience with the .358 Mag. For that we should turn to jpb. The number do point in the direction you described.

Best of luck with the 9,3. You owe it to yourself to own one...

Although I've shot the 358 Mag a bit, so far I've only used it on 1 bull elk, with a 250 grain Hornady SPIL. It worked well enough, but it needs a tougher bullet, esp for close shots and heavier game. I've always wondered what it would do on the big bears? Maybe we'll find out one of these days.

458 has gone into the Bush so we probably won't be hearing from him until November unless he slips into town for supplies and weakens to the internet vacuum/magnet...

He doesn't know that my latest aquasition is a little gem in that its a Jefferys 450-400 double with a rare indeed Daniel Leonard action, and 20 inch barrels he would crawl up in a ball and cry, its just his kind of rifle.

Long live the 9.3x62 and I misquoted my velocities with it and correct them as follows:

26 inch Lother Walthar barrel, Fed 210 or 215, RL-15
320 gr. Woodleigh 2409 FPS av.
286 Nosler 2553 FPS av.
250 BX 2691 FPS av..

Fully intend to try JB,s recommended powder this summer.

Since cast bullets are all but impossible to find for the 9.3, can 375 just be sized down to 9.3? Or is that a bit much of a press?

The Noslers are very tough bullets in the 9.3x62 and I drive them at 2553 FPS in my 26 inch tube..The kill deer well enough but don't do a lot of damage, but enough to kill them and not blood shoot a lot of meat...

Probably the best bullets for the 9.3x62 are the Woodleighs that are velocity specific for the caliber.....

The 270 gr. Speer is a bomb in my gun and lacks penetration, but is suitable for deer if you don't mind meat being blood shot all to hell..They are just really soft IMO..

I also like the North Forks and they perform beautifully as do the lighter weight GS Custom bullets.

I have use all the above on game a good deal...

My 9.3x62 (a custom-stocked CZ 550) has a little shorter barrel than Ray's, 23.6". I get about 40-50 fps less velocity with 250's and 286's of various makes, probably because of the slightly shorter barrel than Ray's 26".

Generally I load RL-15 or Varget with 250's, and Ramshot Big Game with 286's, and expect 2650 out of the 250's and 2500 with 286's.

These ballistics beat the .35 Whelen somewhat. And yes, I've had them pressure-tested. They all came out around 60,000 psi.

Hmmm............... those in a 9.3x57, or a 9.3x.303Brit would be interesting..........................................

BTW, I have my 9.3x62 Brno Mod 21 double square bridge for sale at a very good price in the classified section as of today..pictures to interested parties at your email. $2650 plus S&Ins. It is a fantastic rifle.

You may have noticed that I have sold a number of rifles in the last two weeks here..I am not going out of the hunting or shooting business just rounding up enough money to buy my grand daughter a cutting horse, she was rookie of the year this year in high school rodeo It is her freshman year, and some points in cutting could get her to the All Around next year. So I do what granpaws do, and with more pleasure than one can imagine.

Ray, that's really neat. I am only into cutting horses to the extent that I like to go watch the local trainer and competition, but a bunch of rifles don't come close to having a kid riding well and enthusiastically!

I have chased a few cows on horseback over the years, but never in competition....

If you need to sell a double rifle for a horse, I'll need to stay away from that enterprise! Glad my daughter swims.

Hey this is the third double rifle and a bunch of nice bolt guns that I have sold to keep these kids in good horses, but it has kept them off the streets, the grandson is a pro class team roper and calf roper and the granddaughter, a freshman in high school, was Rookie of the Year in High School Rodeo and both went to State Finals this year, both qualified to go to Fallon Nv. I also rope and when they are busy we all rope together..It just doesn't get any better than that.

"A double for a horse"? I never found double rifles necessary for horses...they rarely charge.

My wife got "charged" by a zebra last year in Africa. Actually the stallion was pretty much dead on its feet from her first shot, but it came stumbling down a slope at her and her PH--who wasn't carrying a rifle. Eileen wasn't using a double rifle, but managed to whack it again anyway with her bolt-action .308, thus saving her PH's life. (Or so they both claim. HA!)

Maybe I should get a a double 9.3x62. I was charged by a raccoon, porcupine and praire chicken, and that was just last year.

I think I would rather have Ray's 9.3x62. Its a beautiful rifle.

ddj

Too good a thread to let it disappear. Will be looking for a 9.3x62 just becuse it's a pretty neat round.

I agree, this is a good thread. I've been trying to decide between a 338 WM and 9.3x62 as my next rifle. I bought a box of ammo for each, just to see how it looked with my 7x57.

So, which couple is the best looking?

Couple A:



or

Couple B:




If, I can't decide soon, it will have to be a three-some!



No real point to this post, just checking out how photobucket works.

Scott

P.S. It also seems I have a habit of contributing the last post to a dead thread. So, I wanted to try and keep up my string of dead end posts.

I'll try to help you out with the last post thing,,,,


Go with couple B...You can't have a Belted and non-belted case paired together. Nor can you pair a metric and english calibers paired up! For safety's sake, Stick with 7x57 and 9.3x62.


Think of the consequences of a mismatched pair..... a .338x57?

Go with a 35 Whelen...

Just curious about accuracy from owners. I built one about 3 years ago just because it sounded like a neat cartridge. Hard for a north Mississippi deer hunter to justify so I won't try.

The part that amazed me was when I went to sight in the rifle how accurate it was. At 100 yds with most 3 shot groups the holes touched each other! I went back and bragged about it on a few of these forums and most everyone seemed to think that was pretty normal for this cartridge. I just never expected the rifle to be so accurate. It's an old mil-surp M98 action with a 21" L-W barrel.

Terry

This is my 550 after the reshape of the stock and new sights added.The stock lost 1/8" to 1/4" in girth all the way around and the forearm was shortened.The cheek piece was reshaped and stock hollowed at the butt.At first, my only regret was not cutting the barrel to 21"-20",as I like carbines.
However, after shooting now for a couple years,it hangs well for off-hand and balances well on the sticks,I'm happy with it.I used NECG sights and barrel band to complete the barrel set-up.

Nicely done!

As posted on the Ruger 9,3x62 thread here is my new 9,3.


Have not yet shot it, but hope to get out in the next few weeks.

Jason

I may have missed your post..Is that a new barrel? or re-bore?

Here's mine. I did the stock myself which made it almost affordable. That's a piece of Claro walnut.

I'm not much on recoil so it's about as "big bore" as I want.



Terry

It is a L. Walther barrel.

TC1,

That is nice!

Jason

Very nice rifle, TC1.

I like that stick of wood!!..Makes mine look like a baseball bat.....

That's a really nice rifle, great job.

Thanks guy's. You get a lot of wood for the buck using Claro sometimes.

That's what the women say about me.....

Beautiful wood.

Nice rig Terry. Personally I'd take the hood off the sight and keep it in the spare parts drawer, but that's the only thing I'd do to it. Nicely done!

Go with couple B...You can't have a Belted and non-belted case paired together. Nor can you pair a metric and english calibers paired up! For safety's sake, Stick with 7x57 and 9.3x62.

Think of the consequences of a mismatched pair..... a.338x57?


Or they could have a 8x57 and that seems to work out in various situations - combat and hunting for example.

The 338x57 or 8.5x57 might not be a bad round. Chuck Hawks had an online article on the subject. http://www.chuckhawks.com/338_OConnor.htm

I guess the another option would be to get a 375 H&H and forget the 9.3 or 338.

Scott

Rifle:

What does your 9.3 weigh after the stock reshape?

Scott

TC1:

Wow! That is a great looking rifle. How does she shot and where did you get the walnut?

Scott

Right at 9 lbs ready to shoot....The stock lost about 5 oz.It was not lot,but it feels better in MY hands.I wish I had darkened the stock more,but I was not thinking.The checkering is a little finer than factory as well.I'm still thinking about a better looking recoil pad,but too many projects.....

You missed the point.......

Great lookin rifles there...I also use a 9.3x62 but mines in a 1895 Winchester lever gun,Danny at Cutrifles did the rebore and chamber for me some years ago.It has taken a number of critters.286gr.Woodleigh p.p bullet.Up here in Alaska were i guide at.Here's a little story and pictures on my buddy's web site. www.bgoodeknives.com/alaskahunt.htm

Nice link and photos there.

Nice bear Jim. But it looks like it's about time I went after another ram with you - pretty nice! Are you still in AK or back down in the USA?

BTW, I finally broke down and picked up a short 9.3x62.

I bought the wood on ebay. It's a very accurate rifle.

Terry

False choice. You can go beltless by choosing the 338-06 and have a handsome threesome...

Can anyone say "gun lust"?!?!?!!?

Is that a Win '95 w/ the moose?

Hubba hubba.

More gun lust... good 'ole American gun lust... not that European stuff I experienced above...

For what its worth I will pass my judgement of some of the bullets that I have take game with...

1.Noser 286 gr.: A great bullet but tougher than most think, you don't a whole lot of expansion on deer size game but it works well enough and is one of my all around favorite.

2. Speer .270 gr.: I have had this bullet come apart like a bomb on too many ocassions on deer size game..I have no use at all for it.

3. North Fork softs are fantastic and the North Fork Cup Point is one of my favorite buffalo bullets, in fact I use it exclusively on buffalo, no need for a soft or a solid if you use the cup point.

4. Woodleigh 286 ge.: Like all Woodleigh bullets they just work on everything but they are velocity specific, so I would pick according to your load and/or your barrel length and try them first..Always a great choice.

5. Northfork flat nose solids: always a good choice for buffalo, but again I prefer the cup points as they kill better and penetrate as well as a solid.

6.250 gr. GS Customs ( I suspect the same would apply with the Barnes) a great bullet at 2700 FPS in my 26 inch tube..shoots flat and works on about everything..I get great expansion with these but don't go heavier with a monolithic.

7. The 320 gr. Woodleigh Soft point holds a special place in my love or bullets for the 9.3x62 or 64, it is the devastator and works on anything you shoot with it up to and including buffalo, but it requires a 26 inch tube and max load to perform in the 9.3x62. It will work fine in the 9.3x64 on buffalo with any barrel length from 22" I suspect to 24 inch as ideal..I have shot a number of buffalo with this bullet in the 9.3x62 and two in the 9.3x64, both worked well so far...

I believe these are the only bullets that I have used on game as best I recall..The 9.3x62 is a grand caliber and can come close to duplicating the 9.3x64 but it requires RL-15 and a 26 inch barrel to do so...I have not tried Mule Deers load with Ramshot but I certainly intend to.

Ray,

When countries establish "minimum calibers" like 9.3 or 375, do they also designate a ft/lbs minimum in place that'd stop me from bringing, for instance, a 9.3x57 out after black death or some-such?

efw,
Some do and some don't..Zimbabwe made he 9.3x62 legal but only with a handload that reaches some nebulas number..The true fact is nobody is going to pull your bullets and check it out..I doubt if any of the established game scouts have a chronograph and if they did they wouldn't know how to use it and would first have to learn how to read...

The locals in african use the 9.3x62, mostly in Namibia it seems, but a smattering in all of the African countries, and nobodys looking..African is like that.:)

I know its always best to abide by the laws of Africa, but I have on many ocassions used a 9.3, 338, and even the 8x57 and 30-06 on cape buffalo as has every PH and local African that lives there. Many buff are shot each year in every camp by women or young boys with lesser calibers than the law requires..Keep in mind the game scout can allow it if he wishes and the PH can prompt him to allow it as a rule,They are for the most part a pratical bunch.

Keep in mind also that things work differently in the 3rd worlds, but don't try to join in without the proper knowledge or advise of your PH who knows the rules of edicate in the princely art of bribery..:)

I remember one time when I was about 100 lbs. overweight on my returning luggage..I asked the manager if I could buy his mother some tea to solve her age problems and he said thank you and that he would be grateful for such a nice favor and passed my luggage to the plane..As I was boarding the plane he came running out yelling stop Mr. Atkinson, whooops, aw crap, He approached me and handed me a receipt for 20 lbs. of tea. I near passed out!

Welcome to Africa, ya gotta love it.

Blooded a rifle with the 285gr Norma Oryx factory load. Through and through a bull moose at short range, breaking a bunch of ribs. No recovered bullets or parts. Would use again. And the rifle shot under 1.25 MOA from a field rest when I checked zero. Sounds good to me.

The bottom line, cutting through the stuff, is that the advantages of a 9.xx62 are it can be made very light and thats a great advantage in the hot African bush towards the end of the day, it is sufficiently powerful to kill a buffalo and recoil is that of a maidens caress..That is a hard combination to beat...

As to power it does not have the power of the 375 and up, but its close enough to suit me and it works well enough.

So take your pick..no harm will come out of either.

The bottom line, cutting through the stuff, is that the advantages of a 9.xx62 are it can be made very light and thats a great advantage in the hot African bush towards the end of the day, it is sufficiently powerful to kill a buffalo and recoil is that of a maidens caress..That is a hard combination to beat...

As to power it does not have the power of the 375 and up, but its close enough to suit me and it works well enough.

So take your pick..no harm will come out of either

And if you don't believe me then I will sell you either my .375 or my 9.3x62 and keep whichever one is left! hows that?

Ray, you are an eloquant gentleman.
Randy

Medman,
The problem is I just keep repeating myself! age related no doubt.