I have been looking for the best round for long range hunting. Deer and elk are what I hunt and i thought about getting a .300 rum but the .338 lapua keeps popping up and I hope you guys can help me decide what is best. I want to hunt out to 700 or 800 yds.

the 338 rum and lm are just about identical ballistically.
the rum will be cheaper, and any magnum remington recvr is already set up for it. the bolt face will have to be opened to what some say is an unsafe thinness for the lm, in a remington.

Is the .338 lapua really the ultimate long distance round?

NO!!! But it is a very good one. The .338 RUM, edge, 338 AX and the .338 Ultra Maxx all run in the 2700 to 2950 fps range

My .338 Ultra Maxx gets the 300 SMK out at 2950.

If you want the Ulimate get the .338 Allen it shoots the 300 SMK at 3400fps

Just out of curiosity,

why don't I ever hear much about the .338-378 weatherby?

-Not bashing, or complainging at all, I am only wondering, as I think it's a great round, but have no long range experience, and am wondering how it stacks up!

Thanks for the info!

FMP

I believe the .338 RUM is a better designed caliber than the Lapua. I think the Lapua gets some of its novelty because some armed forces started picking it up as a sniper round to supplement the .50, and a lighter option besides hauling around a .50. I believe the design of the .338 RUM allows for more precise headspacing, which will allow better accuracy. And plain and simple...look in a reloading handbook, which shouldnt be followed like a Bible, it is there for reference only, but it will show, out of the same barrel length, same bullet weight, the RUM is slightly to its supperior. Is the Lapua cool? Would I like to own one? Hell yes to both. But I am not made of money and can only afford to have one large caliber rifle, and I will choose the RUM. WAYYYYY cheaper to shoot, and way easier to find ammo, around my neck of the woods anyway.

Oh and the .338-378 WBY it's a great one too

I think the .338 Lapua is so popular because of the Lapua brass.

The RUM allows for a longer COAL. Hence the better velocity. Once the mag issues with the .338LM get sorted out, faster velocities with 300gr bullets will be possible.

Will you explain this, I have both and this statement makes little or no sense at all.
RC828

I love being the "Devils Advocate" I personally own a 338 EDGE,very good cart but takes some dedication,it is a wildcat to start with,but is a wee bit hotter than either the 338LM or the RUM.Very accurate also.

I think the nod goes to the Lapua among the rounds mentioned based on quality of brass available, but any of those rounds would do fine on elk out to 800 yards I would think. I have a 338 RUM in a sporter weight rifle but I am getting ready to do some work with a 28" heavy barreled 300 RUM in a McMillan A2 stock. That is going to be my long range elk rig for stationary sit and glass hunts. 200 gr Accubond at 3200 fps with a published B.C. of .588 is pretty impressive for a hunting bullet.
Killed an elk in 2008 with that load at 589 yards. Through both scapulas and as far as I know the bullet is still flying!

That is why I went with the 338 Lapua. The quality of the brass is excellent and the brass is very strong and ell suited to high pressure. The 338 Lapua is CIP'ed at 67,000 PSI. I realy like mine. I get 2800 FPS with the 300 SMK

This group was shot at 300 yards




The caliper is measuring the outside of the group making center to center .747" that is.238 MOA

Yes the other rounds can do as well, but their are no flies on the 338 Lapua IMHO

No it is not the ultimate, but you will not be undergunned at 700 or 800 yards you can be sure of that. I would go the RUM route given the choice. 300-338RUM that is.

One advantage of the 338 Lapua is, if ever needed one can purchase match grade ammo from Black Hills loaded with the 300 SMK

I'd go 338 ultra and not bother edge,it has no real advantage and from barrel to barrel may have no performance edge at all.

I have never felt underguned when shooting a .340 Weatherby Mag.

Can you shoot like this with the TRG-42 or is this a custom?

Built a 338 RUM on a Savage Target action with a 32" Rock Creek barrel. Easily runs 2950 in all temperatures. With the Nightforce zero at 1000 yads, should be able to take deer size game to 2500. To date, 1600 yards with one shot kills is our personal best.

Is there better LR calibers...YES. Can I afford them? NO!

The brass for the RUM and Lapua last about the same number of firing (4-6), so, what you save on the RUM brass over the Lapua can go to other expenses...like LOTS of powder and 300 gr SMK's.

I get about 10 loadings with Lapua brand 338 Lapua brass

Mine is a custom built on a Rem 700 Action

JWP, what stock is that? I like the lightweight option of having a raised cheeckpiece...

That is a Rem Sendaro stock

Im still cant make up my mind what i want. I like the rum's because i know more about them i guess, and i like the lapua because its cool and few folks own them. I can assume that .338 is better than .300 at long distances due to bullet weight. I already hand load everything and have a bunch of 30 cal bullets. I guess adding 338 is not a problem and i have found they dont sell as quick and some are still on the shelf at the old pricing. lapua brass is expensive i know but how many times can it be loaded? i have the dough to buy but lack the marbles to determine what to buy. when i do though ill post pics...any suggestions on the optics i should run? keep in mind that i need something user friendly. my long range as of now is a 300 mag out to 400 yds with leupold vxiii 4-12x40ao

Nightforce is a great place to start for long range optics

I realize the quality with NF and S&B, but wouldn't a 20x Leupy with turrets get the job done?

To most (including myself), I'm thinking 500-1000 would be their 'long range' definition. I realize there are some shots (recently the 1900+ yarder on a muley) longer, but one has to think that a scope less than 3 grand might get the job done....or am I way off base?

Yes it would get the job done,alot of guys use them for long range

Yes if your willing to sacrifice extreme dependability. I cant recall how much internal adjustment a vxiii has but it could be a factor necessitating a canted base. As far as optical quality I like the Leupold just as much as the NXS. I have never been overly impressed with nightforce glass. It is good glass just not overly impressed. Now nightforce internals have always impressed me. I have only had to send one back for not holding zero.

I have used S&B, NF, and Leupold for LR shooting with no complaints from any of them.

My definition of long distance when i started this project was 700-800 yds but after reading some of the stuff you guys are pulling off i would love to shoot farther. i have the places to do it and with time and the right equipment i know i can pull it off. gosh, i spent forever looking at optics last night after i got the night force suggestion and still cant decide. i wish there were guys around here that shoot long distance like some of you do so i could see how your set ups are. man, i find a scope i want and then is magnification, then this, then that, then mil dot, then freakin varminter or big game reticle. i look at brass of this and that chambering, bullets, then stocks, then do i build one on a this or that receiver, or do i just buy a complete rifle minus optics...crap, i have a lot of rifle, mounts, optics, and stock decisions still yet....and YES its getting to me... can anyone tell..but its fun..THANKS guys for the input so far. it does help

I have owned 3 of the 5 calibers mentioned and might be able to offer some feedback. While I don't own and 338-378 or a 338 Ultra mag, I have owned and 300 ultra, a 338-300 Ultra and a 338 Lapua.

I will say that in my experience the 300 ultra is not the way to go when you are comparing it to the 338/330 Ultra (AKA 338 Edge) or the 338 Lapua and especially when you are looking for a true long range caliber. I am not saying it is not a good caliber but in my opinion it is not in the same league as the Edge or Lapua when it comes to long range work.

So with that said, I would say that between the Edge and Lapua there are pros and cons to both which most have been mentioned and it really comes down to cost of components for the most part. However in my humble opinion you get what you pay for and I have found the Lapua brass to be a better choice. You can't go wrong with either one of the 338's. I chose the Lapua in the end to get the better brass to eliminate as many variables as I could.

Here is my Lapua...





Here is an example of how she performs...






Here is a link to a video with another example of how she performs...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWyOtb6ycLY



and yet another example of the Lapua's...




Here is a picture of my Edge...






The key here in my opinion is to get the best that you can and practice, practice, practice! You have narrowed it down to a couple of good choices. I would push you toward a 338 vs. a 30 cal cartridge but either way, you need to pick what you think will work best for you and practice, practice, practice. Spend your summer shooting and learning your rifles and your personal limitations before pursuing game in the field.

Good luck with your build!

Oneshot

Im pretty sure that helps and i keep leaning toward the 338 lapua. I guess practice means more than anything especially for me cuz i have been used to 100-40yd shooting. im gonna have to get the wind speed thing down and all the factors involved. i see myself buying this thing and wondering how in the world im gonna use it but i need a challenge and as long as im squeezing the trigger once in a while im happy. who chambers 338 lapua in a good factory rifle? and are there any sites one can go to that helps with calculating wind speed and other factors and/or scope adjustments

Any of you guys looked at the Allen Magnums? mtmuley

yep! looked and own three.

joecool, I had the privledge of shooting some of Kirby's rifles with a friend that was interested and wanted to purchase one. What a blast! Unbelievable rifles. Check out his new Raptor. mtmuley

yes he builds a nice stick.

Yeah there are a few that chamber the 338 Lapua. I would encourge you to look in to a Sako TRG-42. Just make sure it is a recent build and it has the 1-10 twist barrel not the 1-12.

As for the tools to help you with reading the wind and making adjustments, nothing can top doing it and learning by shooting in the wind but you should plan to pick up a Kestrel and I would also look into a pocket PC and the Nightforce software.

Kirby builds an awesome rifle, a big Allem Mag is on my wanted list. Most likely the 338AM.

Raptor?

The Raptor is an action

Damnit your one up on me....but I started building my own and can't make myself pay Kirby to build another.

Which ones are you shooting? I have the 338AM and the 270AM, and I built myself a 7mm/338LM just because I could not force myself to let Kirby build me a 7MM AM.

Tango Mike!

I'm running the .338AM 270AM and the .338 Ultra Maxx which is the 270AM necked up to .338.

I was thinking about getting a lathe and start building my own as well. just because I can.

The quality of the brass ot to be good at $2 a copy.

The quality is excellent and the cases last a very long time

I know Remington chambers the .338 Lapua. On my budget, I'd have to go with the RUM. Besides, I like all the RUMS, except the 7mm. If I had no budget, a Kirby Allen rifle in .338 AM or .300 Express. A buddy of mine has been messing around with a .30-.338 Lapua IMP and 177 gr GS Customs. Pretty impressive, but the bullets are a PITA to get. mtmuley

You are wrong on that, Remington chambers a 338WM and the 338RUM. They dont chamber the 338Lapua or even produce a bolt face that will fit one.
RC828

No your wrong, they do make one and its on the standard 700 action.

http://www.remingtonmilitary.com/m24a3sws.htm

jc, Thanks for putting that up....thats a sweet looking ready to go setup. Anyone seen, handled, or shot one?

your welcome

Don't want to hijack, but what scopes are you fellas running? Looking at the 8X32 NF for the .338L, but it's alot of scope. I ran the 6.5X20 Leupy, but it left me wanting more X's.
Thanks.
R.

You've got enough power,resolution and clarity is another story

I have a 375 AM in the making. It should be done any time now, I hope! I'll be running the Nightforce 5.5x22x50 NPR1.

JC544,
tried to click on your link on two different computers and no go, I guess [bleep] you in the mean time, have to see it to believe it... be cool

Well I saw one in person at the 2006 Shot Show in Vegas, so [bleep] and and your incorrect assertion


I also have a 338 Lapua made on a 700 Action


Here's one that was on Gunbroker


http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=148366109#PIC

easy guys ...i looked at the link last night myself and its written in a paragraph under the pic of the rifle that it was chabered in 338 lapua..no i dont want in this argument.. it took me a while to find it but its there....anyway, i started this thing thats now six freakin pages and you guys have helped me quite a BUNCH but one question left. my paper research tells me the 300rum is flatter shooting than the 338's. i have heard all my life that the 338 wm is better than my 300wm. honestly, is it just the energy factor or is there something im not seeing by not owning one? my choice is to go with the lapua but i keep falling back to 30 cal cause it looks so good on the remington factory ballistics charts.

The TRG is a fantastic Out of the Box rifle. Best Trigger I've ever pulled. That being said I sure don't want to be toting it up a hill! I had a 338 RUM in a Sporting Weight Rifle based on a Ultra-Mag length actioned M-70. It would be the one to hunt with.

That being said you really should start SHOOTING at 700-800yds LONG before you start HUNTING at 700-800yds. Buying the best rifle in the world isn't going to make you hit targets that far off without developing some skills...........................DJ

Trajectory is a known quantity and easily compensated for. The 338's have the advantage of heavier bullets and the SMK 300 Grain has a BC of .768, the wind bucking ability is better as is the slap on the animal at lloooonnngg range

see i told you im a beginner...wind drift..,huh,.. im not sure if a person that forgets wind drift will make a good sniper ...anywho...thanks guys. problem solved, and ill let you guys know how it ends up. thanks for all the input as you guys are cool and pretty darn smart. dont stop this thing on my account..as i may have more optics questions...

Well I can see your a class act... just pathetic.

If I am going long distance on game it will be either a 7mm cartridge or a 338 cartridge. The 30 cal is not really in the mix for me.
My two favorite LR rigs are 7mm Dakota and the 338AX (338 Lapua Improved).

Sorry JWP did not realize that the fawn you smoked at 500 yards with your 338 Lapua was a Remington

First you tell joe to get"[bleep]" and now you insult me. I guess that is how you try to make up for your lack of knowledge and class.

Unreal isn't he, just keeps sinking lower and lower . The link work last night and when I posted it. I guess if it's not working for some do a search for Remington Military and you will find it there.

Some people hate to be wrong no matter how much proof to the contrary one can provide. That Remington rifle has been available for quite some time. A search on longrangehunting.com should turn up a thread by a guy that ran one through its paces shortly after they were available. mtmuley

If folks can't get to the link, here is the ad and most of the pics:

Extremely rare and hard to find.

New in Box Remington Model 700 Police 338 Lapua bolt action rifle. It has a black synthetic stock, a 40x adjustable trigger, built in muzzle break and it comes with 2 (two) 4 round detatchable magazines.

Barrel length 26 inches

Order number 25645

Mine is the 2008 Remington factory version with HS DBM. Model M700P MLR 338 Lapua Mag and order #25645.

xphunter, Is the 338 Lapua Remington action the same overall length as a regular 700 Long Action, or is it based on a new size?................DJ

Same length as the standard long action. The bolt face is opened up and they have a sako style extractor.

I just posted the pics from the Gunbroker site to show that Remington really makes a 338 L Rifle. Some folks said they couldn't get the link, so I copied the the pics and posted them here to settle the discussion.

I'm sorry, but I do not know the answer to your question.
I do not even own one center-fire rifle of any kind

All this flap over a DOD sniper round. There are several commercial (starting with the .340 Wea Mag) cartridges in this caliber and velocity clatch already. The .340 Wea Mag and the .338 RUM both meet the criteria for accuracy, bullet weight and velocity of the military request.

For the average marksman or shooter, these rifles are expensive novelties that will never have more than a small dedicated following of militaria buffs and those who truly wish to hunt with a high performance rifle.

I always thought I was above average, and now, according to you, I find out I am!

Thanks?

R.

Hahaha + 1

Interesting. It seems like it would be tough to get that fat of a round to feed well in a std. 700 action. Are the magazines single stack?......................DJ

They are center feed.

You can buy a .340 Bee or a .338 RUM and get almost verbatim the same performance. Whe would one pay the whopping premium for a proprietary case that gets less then 50 fps per bullet weight (if you are a handloader.

Plus, I like my rifles with a certain amount of style and maybe a nice walnut stick to look at. I have (3) tupper ware stocks and they do nothing for me esthetically, compared to the 9-10 walnut stocks that I own. I would much rather have a wood stocked Mark V Deluxe.

I guess that is a sign of age. I care about my esthetic tastes more than conventional marketing trends.

A 340 Weatherby??? and pay the whopping premium for a proprietary case.

.........And not be as good of brass as Lapua's is....................DJ

Not to metion no useless belt and no silly radius shoulder to deal with

That is what I am thinking.

Hornady is making $1 a piece 338Lapua brass now. Hoping to get some soon.

I am fooling with a RUM right now and the 240SMK will go over 2700 and is still about 1100 or so at one clean mile.

That is mo better than any of my optics or range finders will do so I am over driving my headlights so to speak right now.

I like the 300 RUM very much. From what I read from the Sierra manual that 240SMK is as good as any 338 Lapual load I have noticed as I compare the trajectory tables on EXBAL.

I hope to shoot this factory barrel out real soon and get a 30" AI set up going. That ought to do it for me.

The down side to the 300 RUM is brass quality and availability as compared to the 338 Lapua.

jwp475,



Two things:

Useless belt? Never a headspace problem.

Silly radius? The wildcat before the wildcat I am working on now cost an extra $20 to get those cute radii.

Who you trin' to kid? Silly radius.

Never have a head space problem with a Rum or Lapua, they head space perfectly on the shoulder as shoould the belted rounds. Why would one want to pay 20 dollars extra for a silly radius????

Built a 338 RUM on a Savage Target action for my shooting buddy. 32" Rock Creek barrel provides 2950 fps with a 300 gr SMK over Retumbo.

If you want a truly ultimate long range round, consider the Kirby Magnums.

Dont buy too much of it as you will find that the quality is not up to par with the Lapua brass.
B

That's damn speedy for a .338 RUM, That beats the edge and the Lapua and it's right in the velocity range of the improved edge and Lapua improved cases, with 30" and 32" barrels.

jwp475 and others,



I didn't pay $20 extra for a silly radius. I paid $20 extra for some cute Weatherby radii on a small case.

Not sure if you have decided yet, but if you have not...The Lapua is a great choice, the 338 edge has a slight advantage. I have two edges, my heavier edge shoots 1/4 moa at 100 yards. In my opinion the Edge is the best 1200 yard gun you can build, the Lapua is a very very close second. My 14 yr old son shot his first bull elk this year at 940 yards with my edge. I've taken many elk at 800 yards plus with this gun. My ten yr old boy hit the 1,000 yard target with my edge this year on his first shot, he weighs 75 pounds wet. I'm sure you can do the same with a good Lapua.

My next leap in the shooting world is beyond 1200 yards and out to 1 mile (1760). The gun for this is the Allen Mag (408 cheytac necked to 338). This gun will be ready in three weeks and it should also be a 1/4 gun. I will top it with an NXS scope.

You need to define your objective (what your ultimate range of killing will be and then define your budget and go from there. Your optics will be just as key as your caliber selection. I use night force 5x22's. I sold my 4 1/2 by 14 long range luepold with target knobs to upgrade to NXS. When your are shooting 800 yards plus, you really need good optics as well.

hope this helps....Also, as you search for gun info, check out longrangehunting.com....It's a great forum with some of the best shooters as coaches

chow