I'm pretty sure why I couldn't get one of my rifles to shoot worth a chit! Pulled it apart and I have a nice crack running the length of the stock, from the lug to the rear fastener and a little beyond. Can't see it on the outside of the stock though. Not sure how I managed to do that! Any suggestions on how to fix it?

Send it back and ask for Swirls in exchange.................(grin)

That drove to the brink of insanity trying to figure out why that rifle wouldn't shoot,when it originally was a bug holer.. Never thought to look at the stock for a big ass crack.

Stocks is easier to see than glass.................

I am sure McMillan will take care of that mui pronto...

No doubt..............

Bummer. From the Mcmillan site...

"And best of all, an EDGE is the only ultralight rugged enough to carry McMillan's lifetime warranty"

I'm getting ready to break out the superglue...(grin)

Yea, McMillan will take care of you. How tight to torque your action screws???

RH

Yep, they'll take care of it. Stuff happens.

Last year, I had a Talley lightwieght split right down the middle.

Which chambering and what was the overall rifle weight? Curious as to the level of recoil.

I don't see why you couldn't hog it out and make an internal repair with bedding epoxy about like one would with a cracked wooden stock. Though I'm not sure if you'd need to add some epoxied cloth reinforcement or a pin to arrest the lateral movement of the stock side walls from recoil. McMillan cuts this stock off for use at a specific range of chamberings, but you can be all over the map with an equally high recoil level using an acceptable chambering if the rifle is an ultra-light.

Best

Same as I tighten all my stuff. Tight.

Better get a MPI

It's a 7lb 270wsm, all up. Probably just didn't like the chambering, so it cracked. I've got it boxed up, and it'll be in the mail in an hour or so.

I think I'm about 10 deep in McM stocks, 6 or 7 of them are Edges. No plans for changing, they've done very well for me. I'm just happy I know what the problem was.

Happened twice to me. No more lite weights.

I'm looking at the pics, and notice bedding material, sorta full-length. I'm wondering if the added bedding material along the sides made it spread/crack when you cinched down the receiver bolts.

Never had that happen with a McSwirly, so I'm just speculating maybe the Edge is not up to the same stresses.

Overtightening the ring halves will do that I'm told.

MtnHtr

20"lbs is my usual. They split in the FL heat at range. Maybe just bad luck.

The only way I could see that happening is if the bedding was "soft" which doesn't appear to be the case. Odd.

Sad to see this on a $500+ 'glass stock.

I have some questions -

First who did the action bedding work ?

Second,when installing the pillars, and doing the bedding, did they check to make sure there were no high spots along the sides of the action between the front and rear guard screws?

Also, was the action bedded into bedding compound by tightening the action screws or by gravity or tension bands? etc?

The reason why I ask, is the placement of those cracks look like stress cracks from a "wedge" effect due to the action sides pushed outward in the middle as they bottom out before either end of the action out at the pillars.

The outward tension on the action inlet may not crack it right away, but over time combined with recoil/vibration it will crack the stock as shown.

Odds on favorite is the front action screw was taking recoil.

If you haven�t sent it off check for proper clearance as there should be not contact between action screws and pillars.

stuff happens basically.... they'll fix it. No one is perfect, and as long as CS takes care of it, no big deal.
its when you buy expensive stuff like a schneider barrel, and the twist is stamped wrong, and it won't stabilize the long range bullet you ordered it specifically for and they wont' make good on their mistake.. thats poor customer service and that sucks.
We know Mc is good though.

It's in the mail! I'm sure something was funky with the bedding or something like that. I bought the gun used, and it was already bedded. We'll see what McM says when they get it.

More info on what happened here, please. Never had that happen and got them on all my rem 700's.

Calvin,

No reason to exceed 40 - 45in lbs on a 1/4"-28 screw. You're right at the maximum tensile load of the more common materials used for gun screws in that thread pitch. The threads in the receiver will more than likely not give, being that most receivers are of tool grade steel and heat treated.

As long as the pillars and bedding are done RIGHT, there is no reason to exceed this no matter type of action or caliber.

With that being said, the 270WSM might be on the verge of "too much" for the edge style stock. I really don't know, but it would be interesting to ask them, I know they have done some research.

McMillan is and incredible company that will no doubt take care of it for you. #1 in my book and glad to see this didn't spook you at all.

338 WM is the cut off point for an Edge.

I was told by one of the ladies the caliber can vary and depends on stock and action style??

Maybe Ryan will chime in if he sees this thread...

Calvin,

You said you bought it used. Any chance it came from a warmer climate?

You had it out if the stock recently, before you noticed the crack?

-Dan

99% it is not McMillan�s fault as letting the actions screws take recoil will split most any wood stock and the Edge fill is not as strong as the standard fill. This is why you cannot get an Edge without the pillars.

Not McMillan�s fault if the custom bedding let the action screws take the recoil but they are a great company and might just cover it anyway.

Good Luck Calvin. Ryan are you listening??

Much like leupold, I suspect that McMillan will make it right regardless.

Would take a lot more than that to spook me about McMillan.

I reckon I'll not have a Yard Sale either...............(grin)

I don't remember the last time I had it from the stock. I had to send the gun in to get a recrown, after I dinged it up well over a year ago, so that was probably the last time.

If McM don't fix it, or don't cover it, I won't really care. Anthony killed his first bear with it, and Johnny killed his first deer with it. Rifle got some good use..

Why are you seeking to undermine Calvin's position with McMillan on a potential warranty claim? Doesn't reflect very well on you or your business.

Nor do the B&C handles he schleps.............(grin)

AWESOME company and WILL take care of it without a doubt!!!!!!!!!!!

Calvin asked for opinions on the failure. If I thought it was a McMillan problem I would have certainly said so but that is almost surely a bad bedding job.

It would have been better to run down McMillan from a business stand point but action screws taking recoil from improper bedding is not exactly a new problem. Calvin did not do the bedding so this is no slam on him.

You can�t blame McMillan in that situation but they are really a standup company and I bet the outcome will be to both parties satisfaction.

I really don�t think Calvin was looking for a reason to get something from McMillan that was not appropriate. He just was looking for answers because some guys want to know the cause of failure to avoid it in the future rather than find someone to blame just to get a new stock.

It might be strange to you but some guys are more concerned with preventing a like failure in the field than getting an extra stock from a bunch of great guys like the crew at McMillan.

Why do you use B&C stocks on your platform,which you bill as being top flight? What advantages do the B&C handles have in their construction,inletting,fit,finish and ergo's,that sway you in this direction...from say a McMillan(who's obviously without peer)?

Why wouldn't you use the better wares(McMillan),as a means of prevention?.................

Just sayin that you can't blame McMillan for bad bedding if that is the case.

On the other hand it is damn hard (impossible) to split an aluminum bedding block no matter if the action screws take recoil.

They won�t take recoil in our stock but it is still nice to know up on the mountain that things are covered but you really don�t hunt hard so what does it matter to you, Lil Fish???

Costal blacktails from a boat are hardly a test of equipment.

Hell you get by with some pretty sorry crap and still seem to kill something.

Am I to infer,that due to your "rugged testing procedures",that you found B&C superior to McMillan? Or that McMillan has no place on a Hard Use Rifle or a Mountain Rifle,as per your "experience"? Could use please list these "concessions" and extrapolate in kind.

This revelation is really liable to upset the Custom Rifle World and your "insight" is much appreciated upon this matter.

Please expound...............

I have no doubt about Calvin's positive motivation in starting this thread and if I did, he clarified it for us all a few posts earlier by saying that he didn't care if it got replaced under warranty. I own several Edge stocks, so came into this thread with exactly the motivation you accuse me of lacking, i.e. concerned with preventing a like failure in the field.

Nor do I have any doubt about McMillan's willingness to stand by their excellent product and equally excellent warranty.

I do wonder when someone such as yourself who is here in a commercial capacity seems to have a blame-shifting reflex which puts a problem back onto the consumer, especially when you draw Ryan's specific attention to it.

For me it doesn't reflect very well on you or your business.

Right now I think our stock is the best thing going but I do have a pattern at McMillan and when I can get it done we will have the add options of the lighter Edge and the great gel coat finish at a slightly heavier version for those customers who wish either option.

Right now we simply offer the wonderful A-3 to those customers who feel the McMillan product in either the standard fill with the gel coat or the lighter weight Edge is more in keeping with their goals in their custom rifle.

Lil Fish you are truly gold and for that I thank you.

What are the particulars that would leave you to believe,that a B&C is better than a McMillan? Is it construction technique,materials,inletting,fit,finish or ergo's,that have you denote them as being second fiddle in your "experienced" opinion?

How do you conduct your stock "testing" and what were/are the McMillan weaknesses in the B&C extrapolation,as per your findings?

In what AO's would you quantify the McMillan as having a "disadvantage" and for what reasons?

This is very "enlightening"..................

I love it! A rifle builder who sells bottom tier schitt at a rediculous price, giving his opinion on top shelf equipment. Maybe you should think about adding a McMillan to your "platform". You could at least raise your outragous price another couple grand! grin

Holy Crap Dude,

My job is not to get Calvin a new stock. That being said I suspect with my involvement he will be treated fairly and McMillan will most likely give him a new stock.

Anyone who has bedded more than 5 stocks can see from where the crack starts at the front action screw that the screw took recoil and McMillan is not responsible for a bad bedding job.

You act like the guys at McMillan would not know this unless dumb ol me pointed it out. They are total pros and bed way more rifles than you can imagine. They would have very quickly seen the problem and addressed it properly.

I do not run McMillan but my guess is properly for them would be a new stock. If I am wrong and I have screwed Calvin out of a new stock then I will make it right myself.

Are you now happy???

More important, I think to Calvin is how to keep this from happening in the future. Check to make sure your actions screws are not taking recoil. Might just save a hunt instead of simply a replaceable stock.

Groovin' HEAVILY on how your "involvement" is germane and a "bargaining chip" to boot.

Mighta just pee'd a little on that one!..................

I actually believe you there.

Depends are made for fellows like you.

Look at the pics in the first post in this thread.

Ever seen a Bell and Carlson or H&S precision with an Aluminum action block split like that just by using it as intended??

The day you see a thread started about Mr Burn's B&C stocks breaking like that under normal use is the day you can call them "bottom tier".

Until then, you can continue licking the sweat off McMillan's balls..

You seem to be missing (or ducking) my point. Perhaps it would help if you could explain your intention by posting the following...

Can't say that I have seen that... but I have seen that all the benchrest rifles these days have gone to aluminum bedding blocks that are not skim bedded on top of it, and are all the rage and setting new range records, probably as we speak. Looks like B/C stock value is skyrocketing due to this new trend too.

Groupies.

Lame retort, Rost.

But since you brought up BR guns..

A lot of record setting/match winning Bench guns have had LAMINATED WOOD stocks as well. And,those same laminated wood stocks would be pilloried by some here as "inadequate" on a "top shelf rifle".

Nothing about an aluminum bedding block prevents a rifle from shooting it's best. Nothing prevents it from being skim bedded for top accuracy, either. Even McMillans still need to be glass bedded to shoot well and as this thread shows, they STILL can crack- even when pillar bedded. Never seen that with an Alumnium bedding block. So much for using "the best".

And BTW, Mr. Mousegun shooter- No standing open Benchrest records have been set with AR-15 platforms,either. By your logic above, that must mean they are all inaccurate,substandard schit ???

Is (or maybe was) the bedding slightly above the pillar in the action area?

I'm thinking that maybe it was originally bedded and not tightened down to the pillars (or pillars not evenly aligned). Once hardened, the action sat a little higher in the stock and the sides were "closer" than originally inlet...and like Mr. Burns said the screws could be off a bit or pillars slightly off making the screws (and/or pillars) take recoil rather than the lug. If Calvin went farmer tight on it the tighter sides could be pushed out a little as the action was pulled closer to the pillar...the outward push on the sides of the action inlet (due to the little extra bedding - result of not bedding to pilliars) caused the crack as they were seperated.

My best guess but only a guess. Whatever the problem I'm thinking McMillan will take care of you.

JCM

That is exactly what I alluded to on page 3 of this thread.

It will be interesting to hear McMillan's take on what caused it.

Regardless of the cause, I agree with you that odds are Calvin will be treated well by McMillan.

Few things better than the clueless,pretending they ain't.

You go girl!...............

Have you ever seen a Ramline or Butler Creek break under "normal use"...IMO, there really isn't any comparison between a Micky and a B&C. Just by the staggering number of options available (barrel contours, bottom metal, action inlets and all combo's of same) you couldn't put a B&C in the same catagory as a Micky.

Every bedding block oughtta ship with a Cough Silencer and a jar of Vaseline............

Those "sheep" hunters are gonna need a defib when toten a 10 lb rig.

WOW! Why does everyone get so pissy!!

Calvin, keep us posted on what Mcmillan says reference a cause for the failure. An Edge is a good stock for its weight, but that is a double edge sword as it is also a weakened stock due to its light weight. I'm sure that its price does not include a built-in chip sensor that can detect a barreled action chambered for 338WM or larger and suddenly it triggers an absolute and immediate stock failure. I'm sure there is a gray area which is often crossed with light rifles using border line chamberings along with variances in production QC and inletting/bedding techniques of the end builder. I don't think there is enough evidence presented on this thread to make a definitive judgement on an exact cause, but it is certainly definitive that the stock did fail.

I think it would be helpful to discuss such a failure as this to better help those using an Edge on those light weight borderline chamberings to help prevent such future failures. At some point you push the envelope too far for the strength of that particular stock, but maybe there is a leason learned with Calvin's stock that will prevent his as well as others from failing when used on a rifle with the same or similar level of recoil.

As to the B&C such as the new 3rd Generation Extreme Weather made for SC Winchester, it would be much stronger than this Edge stock due to the 1-pc 7075-T6 chassis that runs from the wrist to forend tip. But as a result, it would be heavier and bulkier, so I don't see that as being relative. You could further say that a standard fill McMillan would be stronger than the Edge, but it also would be heavier and in a different class. These heavier stocks have little bearing on a person looking for a very light weight stock that is strong enough to work on a mid-bore magnum chambering.

Best

I've never seen an injection molded stock crack. Does that make it better too? You must feel special... Greybull's no. 1 cheerleader.

meanwhile...half the people on this site are a fan of the B&C "Ti" stock, which is just a fancy name for Carbelite.

But they's expected to puke,due to Heritage and do...less "suplize".

I'd wager that the Faux Ti Mantra is an exersize in stretching a lightweight buck and billed in those accords,as opposed to being flaunted as being without peer.

Just sayin'...................(grin)

Just caught up on this thread... Glad to see everyone can still get worked up over a "Crack"... Good thing hunting season is over... This problems has caused lots of men problems over the years....no matter what the name....

Don't wanna sleep to close to the crack,or you'll catch cold..................

As I understand it, the McM Edge is made with graphite, which is alot stronger than fiberglass.
As far as the one piece aluminium bedding block stocks go, I understand that some of them, up to 40% of them using the older designs that Remington once used in their varmit rifles, develop accuracy problems under certain conditions. What happens is the much different materials used in such stocks have ezpansion ratios that are quite different. When such stocks get much warmer or much colder, they set up internal stresses that can do odd things to accuracy and the rifle's zero.
I hjave such a rifle. It, apparently, is one of the 60% not so affected. Or, perhaps not affected so far as I have used it. E

Eremicus, you forgot the most important attribute of the bedding block......it will stop your scopes from streching...

Dang...beat me to it.

Tough crowd.

But "proprietary" oughtta be in there somewhere.................(grin)

Which BR rifles would those be? -Al

The T.I.C. sarcasm was/is copious and you might wanna reread objectively,in that mindset.............(grin)

Don't worry, if your scope stretches, it can always be shaved a little....

Valid point. It is an easy, and quick way to get into a lightweight rig. I had a faux Ti, was a nice little gun. Sadly, I get bored easy, and buy and sell my [bleep] too often.

I did wake up at the crack of Dawn once....

BTW, don't think I've seen a tupperware crack either....guess it is "top shelf too" ?

Pretty lame on several accounts.

FWIW, I learned long time ago, during my trial by fire learning curve in investing, that if you see a CEO of a company in an internet chatroom, defending or bragging up his company, you best short the stock real soon, or just punt.......

Tony

I never was one to wonder about wares and tend to horde...if only in the interest of R&D and fairness..................

Never have knowed a Gun Plumber to not happily answer queries geared the particulars of his efforts and substantiate the why and the what of same.

Smoke & Mirrors gets hinky and fast.................(grin)

Sure would scare me if I was you, but I ain't

And flatter yourself with the very notion...................

If you are saying that the front action screw pounded the pillar backward and split the stock like a splitting wedge, I ask you what you think the tightly bedded recoil lug was doing while this was going on? If it was caused from the front pillar being driven back, why did the web between the mag well and trigger mortise crack as well?

This was a simple failure from recoil when the magazine mortise bows outward under recoil and the filler, which has very low tensile strength splits.

Wow,

You total grasp of gunsmithing is truly exceptional and I sir stand corrected.

Well done.

My ego is a little on the big side, but what the heck Lil Fish, I do scare you and that is kinda fun.

The only people you scare are the informed, because you take advantage of the opposite!

Despite you railing about 'em so shrilly,

looks like 6 more of his rifles going out to the "uninformed"..

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/4955202/6_ready_to_Ship#Post4955202


It must really piss you off

Jim, do you make a commission on every sale?

I say kudos to Jim for standing up for a Campfire sponsor against a bunch of people who feel the need to denigrate a product they have never held let alone shot.

I hope Greybull sells ten thousand rifles this year and ups their support of this remarkable forum.

The T.I.C. missed me wide by quite a margin. I'll need to adjust my windage, accordingly. -Al

Stupidity ain't scary,it's funny and in fairness...you've got it in spades...............

Taken in context,it do speak volumes and is beyond refute...which only adds to the humor...................(grin)

The Mc Edge has aluminum pillars.. I sure McMillan will take care of it..

No.

Merely responding to JessG's posts on this thread which slam Burn's character and his rifles out of sheer avarice.

Tell me HuntKY...

Do you or any of the other Anti-Burns ankle biters get a check from competing riflemakers for slamming Burns?

It makes one wonder.

LOL.

Not a Burns ankle-biter Jim, why don't you look back at my posts. I asked you a question, that's all.

On the same note, I haven't said a thing about Burn's $6,000 "system". I don't need to.

The quotation marks around "system" define your ankle biter status.

Not surprising your denial of what you are actually doing by making such posts.

Character assassins usually do like to disguise their distasteful work.

Find where I have ever made derogatory remark about Burn's "system".

I suppose if you're going to regulate everyone that takes exception with Burns, or has absolutely no interest in what he's peddling as "ankle biters", then the same analogy should be inferred about you...., as you seem to eagerly sniff out every thread and yip incessantly like a clueless little lap dog.

You just did. And in the post before that.

I can read English.

Quotation marks denote sarcasm.

Am I wrong?

Please explain your intent or learn to write better. LOL.

Not "regulating " anyone Fosto. Or anything.

No more than the Burns haters are trying to "regulate" what kinds of rifles may be built in this world , who builds them or how much they cost.

So, the only thing you can cite are the use of quotation marks?

....and you want to call me an ankle biter? Yet, you are on every Burns thread defending him. So what does that make you?

....an azz-kisser?

Poor dumb '62,likes to feign a [bleep] clue.

It sings................

So says the gutless coward who is too afraid to shoot against Burns in Montana.

Go frost cupcakes and jerk off with your cans of Krylon.

That's your speed.

Didn't mean to horn you up,yet again.

You just keep tellin' yourself that you've a clue.

Laffin'!.................

My name is Jim62 and I'm a "ankle-biter".

Them that bitch the most,do the least and she do ring alotta bells.................

You just described yourself, puzzy.

Fixed that for you.

BTW, "KY" in your handle must mean something other than Kentucky.

I dig facts and quantify same.

You do Estrogen fueled rants...though I dig the humor!..............

Nice spin Jim, that's all ya got.....I think someone is slamming Burns in the Long Range Hunting Forum....hurry along!

No need to go elsewhere.

It's fun tormenting a loser like you.

Have fun with your KY.

Estrogen pretty much defines your reaction to a shooting challenge by Burns.

In that case, you are outright feminine.

For all the world to see.

you're back.....ankle-biterJim

There you go.

Corrected it for you.

We could do this all day if you'd like.

Picture of you licking JeffG's feet, no doubt.

Stop with the animated pics of yourself, you're an ugly little [bleep].

Am not

You Sure look that fugly in your portrait..

I live in the World,which admittedly is an unfair advantage.........................

A world in which apparently ,you are the QUEEN.

Pick one that don't shine brightly. Prolly a pun there..............

With you shootin'em, the only way they'd "shine" is via the gay azz paint jobs.

You must have run out of rooms to redecorate with the old lady.

That is some overtly homosexual stuff your're doing there.

It takes courage for you to come out of the closet like that.

I'm sure your buddies in San Fran are impressed.

What's next, Rainbow stickers?

So taking it in the azz at the tune of $6K a pop for unknown parts ain't queer.........

Jim62,

I don't know you at all, but you can believe me when I tell you that you are coming across as a real idiot.

Anyone who chases Stick around the Internet with pathetic 'one liners' as you are attempting to string together is as idiot.

Dude, grow up, use the 'Ignore' feature, and pizz off.

Dear Numbnutz from NZ,

If you'd look at the actual trail of posts, you'd see that "stick" does the chasin' around the forums.

As you seem to be doing here with me.

Why don't you cuddle up to the lice ridden goat that is your mother, and go [bleep] off, mate.

Funny, never seen him mention mothers. Piss poor tactics from a drowning man without a prostate.

Didn't mean to horn you up,but it'd be tough to slight your taste in men.

Rainbows can be arranged................

I've already seen your posts about your parents, so it's funny that you'd give a schit.

Please continue with your web etiquette hypocrisy, Steelhead.

You are the king.

Actually Jim62, I came across this thread because the title was of some interest to me.

And please do tell why you think that I am "chasin'" you around the forums. Please show where I have ever posted on a thread where you have posted and been critical or questioned your post.

My post was a comment on your antics on this thread. I have thought about my previous post, and realised that asking you to pizz off was not the best thing to do.

Please [bleep] off you grumpy old [bleep].

Sometimes I miss it totally too... grins.

Free country and all... yet if gas is 3.50 a gallon but someone is selling it down the street, but yet lower octane, for 10.50 a gallon, I would not call those that buy the 10.50 a gallon educated.

So if 10.50 floats yer boat have at it. Doesn't guarantee its the best of anything though, but then again it may well do just as good as 3.50 a gallon version does.

I'd say thats a simple enough comparison.

Funny though that when fuel companies raise prices, everyone gets in an uproar over it...

Amazing how a thread about a crack in a McM became a thread about Greybull...

She's cracked and the correlation concise..................

Man that took a long time to read!

I'll admit i did laugh out loud a couple times.

Calvin, i think i remember reading your stock is already on its way back to us? If so, i'll take a look at it as soon as it arrives and we'll get back to you. We'll take care of it.

In fairness,I bet I laughed too..............(grin)

Let us know when its back and good and ready, then we can let it die...

I'm thinking the McMillan Edge should be called "McCracker Fill" from here on out..