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Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained

Posted By: ctsmith

Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/12/20

[Linked Image from oi1377.photobucket.com]
Posted By: SAKO270WSM

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/13/20

Headed to Bullock county Jan 23-25 hopefully ol sad daddy will slip up!
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/13/20

That's really cool...
Posted By: Judman

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/13/20

That is cool clint, quite the difference across the state..
Posted By: SKane

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/13/20

The whole Alabama rut and restocking fascinates the hell out of me.

In looking at, say, Calhoun County (denoted 6 on the map), it shows mid-November as peak, then an area only two counties west at the same latitude shows late January.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/13/20

It's quite interesting. The map is pretty close but I think it should be noted that those are termed "peak" rut dates. I think the overlap of the areas and spread/inter-breeding of the different genetics may be causing a much longer and maybe less intense rut in some areas. Some of that may be due to heavy buck harvesting and not enough does being taken in some areas as well.
Posted By: Poconojack

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20


Very interesting.
Pennsylvania had a two decade restocking program that began in 1906. Over 1,000 deer were imported from Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky, Maine, New York and New Jersey. There are definitely different looking deer in different areas. Prime time for the rut seems to run from Halloween until mid-November.
Posted By: WL205

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Wow...half of the bucks in my area have already shed their antlers and some them bama boys just now chasing tail
Posted By: 308ld

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Heading to Union Grove Marshall County, Alabama, 1/18 - 1/25. Been hunting that area for 13-15 years. Historically that week has been right in peak rut.
Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by WL205
Wow...half of the bucks in my area have already shed their antlers and some them bama boys just now chasing tail


Something odd at a place I hunt in AL last week. Rut is kicking there right now, both according to the map above and experience. Bucks should have a lot of Test flowing right now. Last week another hunter shot what he thought was a large doe. When he walked up to it he saw two raw pedicles. Was 125 lb verified weight so it was ~2.5 year old, maybe 3.5 as a rough estimate. Had 2 regular sized external nuts, no sign of being a hermaphrodite.

It's not uncommon for us to see bucks still carrying their rack in March around here. No one can figure out what the deal is with this one.
Posted By: Boarmaster123

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

The guys hunting our lease in Greenville AL on the ground now say its not quite in. Small bucks moving around and does kicking them off.
They say its warm. Im going up on the 25th thru the 1st. My guess is ifbit cools off next week the big boys will start chasing. I think I will hit it about right. Hopeful anyway. Alabama is really a hair twister when it comes to the rut.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by SKane
The whole Alabama rut and restocking fascinates the hell out of me.

In looking at, say, Calhoun County (denoted 6 on the map), it shows mid-November as peak, then an area only two counties west at the same latitude shows late January.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]




It's BS for the most part. Too many Does coming in heat at various times extends the rut. Ones that were not breed-because there are too many and they have a second heat-young of the year that mature early because of great habitat and weather, extends the rut. It's been 50 years since the big transplant. Whatever rut time those Deer brought with them has been assimilated into Alabama conditions. You are correct: Two counties away and the rut is two months different? I guess all of the Deer that were transplanted into one county never had any offspring that moved over to one of the others. Color me skeptical....

Addition: Have seen Bucks here around home in February and March still carrying their horns. Friend had some on his trial cam just last week with racks. One of them a better than nice 10. Weather has been warm, right now it is 44F. Blood flows better to the extremities with heat vs cold. Perhaps higher temps are a factor. According to the map, the further South you go, the later the rut.
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by battue
Originally Posted by SKane
The whole Alabama rut and restocking fascinates the hell out of me.

In looking at, say, Calhoun County (denoted 6 on the map), it shows mid-November as peak, then an area only two counties west at the same latitude shows late January.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]




It's BS for the most part. Too many Does coming in heat at various times extends the rut. Ones that were not breed-because there are too many and they have a second heat-young of the year that mature early because of great habitat and weather, extends the rut. It's been 50 years since the big transplant. Whatever rut time those Deer brought with them has been assimilated into Alabama conditions. You are correct: Two counties away and the rut is two months different? I guess all of the Deer that were transplanted into one county never had any offspring that moved over to one of the others. Color me skeptical....

Addition: Have seen Bucks here around home in February and March still carrying their horns. Friend had some on his trial cam just last week with racks. One of them a better than nice 10. Weather has been warm, right now it is 44F. Blood flows better to the extremities with heat vs cold. Perhaps higher temps are a factor. According to the map, the further South you go, the later the rut.


Interesting....how much time do you spend in Alabama during these rut times in these various pockets to dismiss these claims?

Your biological arguments to dismiss it really make me scratch my head. For example, you are trying the cite Bergmann's law (I think) which refers to latitudinal variations of body size relative to temperatures. Don't think Bergmann had Alabama in mind, especially since the state from north to south doesn't have the widespread temperature variations to be noticable in body size, let alone somehow translating to a 2 month swing in rut.

Also, Texas for example, has a lot of deer, volume and density in lots of places. The rut there is pretty consistent on a geographical scale and in no way has pockets like the map shown. If the variability in rut was due to doe cycling wouldn't Texas or numerous other states have these issues? Why Alabama?
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

battue is dead wrong.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Greg,
Not looking for an argument, nor have I spent any time in Alabama hunting.

However, Bud up here in Pa is currently hunting with a muzzleloader and is finding fresh scraps which indicates some kind of rut is still going on as late as a couple days ago. So perhaps Alabama isn't as unique as they want on to believe.

Combine it with the fact, after 50 years the transplants have had more than enough time to intermingle their claimed different rutting genetics, I find their conclusions suspect. You believe if you want, but color me skeptical.
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

I'm not either. Just curious on your reasoning for your conclusions is all.
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

I live/hunt in Dale County, a good friend in the southeast corner of Houston. See the southeast corner of the map. Ive hunted Dale for 40 years and they have hunted Houston more than that. In Dale I have never seen December rut activity, its always mid to late January. In the southeast corner of Houston on my friends place the rut starts firing up in late November/early December. They never see rut activity in January.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

I mentioned the North to South variation as an aside from looking at the significant different rutting times based on the most part by location. Did the majority of the late rutting Deer get transplanted at the extreme Southern border? How does their conclusion relate to the intermingling of genetic rutting times over the last 50 years? You mix genes, you eventually getting a mixture of characteristics that become the norm.

The N to S heat variation was just thrown out as food for thought.

I'm not saying there are not different rutting periods. I am saying, by now, with a 50year plus window of genetic intermingling, other factors are the cause of different rutting periods. The map write-up said it was based on the genetics of where the transplants came from. That part I'm not buying.

Her in Pa we obviously have an extended rutting period. There were fresh scrapes in the area my Bud found them the other day back in October. Yet some were still being make a couple days ago. What causes it? That area has an overabundance of Does, and some because they were missed on their first go, go into a second heat.
Posted By: ruraldoc

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20


I have lived in Alabama all my life and have killed deer in a bunch of counties all over the state. The map is correct,it has been verified by shooting bred does all over the state and determining the age of the fetus and the date breeding occured.

The hard science of the studies agrees with what locals already knew.

Just for the record I have hunted and killed deer in Cullman,Shelby,Coosa, Elmore,Autauga, Macon,Bibb,Hale,Dallas,Marengo,Clarke,Sumter,Pickens,Greene,and Choctaw County.

Have also hunted without taking a deer in several other counties. The Map confirms what I have seen with my own eyes.
Posted By: Judman

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by ruraldoc

I have lived in Alabama all my life and have killed deer in a bunch of counties all over the state. The map is correct,it has been verified by shooting bred does all over the state and determining the age of the fetus and the date breeding occured.

The hard science of the studies agrees with what locals already knew.

Just for the record I have hunted and killed deer in Cullman,Shelby,Coosa, Elmore,Autauga, Macon,Bibb,Hale,Dallas,Marengo,Clarke,Sumter,Pickens,Greene,and Choctaw County.

Have also hunted without taking a deer in several other counties. The Map confirms what I have seen with my own eyes.


Thanks, best info is from folks that have been there done that.
Posted By: SKane

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by ruraldoc

I have lived in Alabama all my life and have killed deer in a bunch of counties all over the state. The map is correct,it has been verified by shooting bred does all over the state and determining the age of the fetus and the date breeding occured.

The hard science of the studies agrees with what locals already knew.

Just for the record I have hunted and killed deer in Cullman,Shelby,Coosa, Elmore,Autauga, Macon,Bibb,Hale,Dallas,Marengo,Clarke,Sumter,Pickens,Greene,and Choctaw County.

Have also hunted without taking a deer in several other counties. The Map confirms what I have seen with my own eyes.



With that wide array of deer movement, I reckon I'd be dotting the state and be more worn out at the end of the season than a rutting buck. laugh
How many tags are you folks allotted or does that vary by region?
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by SKane
Originally Posted by ruraldoc

I have lived in Alabama all my life and have killed deer in a bunch of counties all over the state. The map is correct,it has been verified by shooting bred does all over the state and determining the age of the fetus and the date breeding occured.

The hard science of the studies agrees with what locals already knew.

Just for the record I have hunted and killed deer in Cullman,Shelby,Coosa, Elmore,Autauga, Macon,Bibb,Hale,Dallas,Marengo,Clarke,Sumter,Pickens,Greene,and Choctaw County.

Have also hunted without taking a deer in several other counties. The Map confirms what I have seen with my own eyes.



With that wide array of deer movement, I reckon I'd be dotting the state and be more worn out at the end of the season than a rutting buck. laugh
How many tags are you folks allotted or does that vary by region?


No kidding right? 😄
Posted By: War_Eagle

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by SKane
Originally Posted by ruraldoc

I have lived in Alabama all my life and have killed deer in a bunch of counties all over the state. The map is correct,it has been verified by shooting bred does all over the state and determining the age of the fetus and the date breeding occured.

The hard science of the studies agrees with what locals already knew.

Just for the record I have hunted and killed deer in Cullman,Shelby,Coosa, Elmore,Autauga, Macon,Bibb,Hale,Dallas,Marengo,Clarke,Sumter,Pickens,Greene,and Choctaw County.

Have also hunted without taking a deer in several other counties. The Map confirms what I have seen with my own eyes.



With that wide array of deer movement, I reckon I'd be dotting the state and be more worn out at the end of the season than a rutting buck. laugh
How many tags are you folks allotted or does that vary by region?


Three bucks per year and depending on location / season, up to a doe per day.

Edited to add: no real "tag" system like the folks out west are accustomed to. Basically your license has a spot to track your harvests and there is an online reporting site. Pretty liberal....here's a copy of a license I had saved on my computer from a couple years ago:

[Linked Image]
Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

It makes perfect sense to me. The TX map would look much the same. Whitetails and mule deer in the far N TX Panhandle rut a full month before they do further south where I live, and even later down in far S TX. It's the length of daylight (photoperiod) that triggers the rut IME, regardless of the genetics involved. Deer evolve to their habitat....mother nature takes over, at some point.

I was hunting deer in the far N TX Panhandle in mid November and the whitetails and mule deer rut was side open. The muley rut here is just winding down, and started mid December.
Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

Originally Posted by battue
I mentioned the North to South variation as an aside from looking at the significant different rutting times based on the most part by location. Did the majority of the late rutting Deer get transplanted at the extreme Southern border? How does their conclusion relate to the intermingling of genetic rutting times over the last 50 years? You mix genes, you eventually getting a mixture of characteristics that become the norm.

The N to S heat variation was just thrown out as food for thought.

I'm not saying there are not different rutting periods. I am saying, by now, with a 50year plus window of genetic intermingling, other factors are the cause of different rutting periods. The map write-up said it was based on the genetics of where the transplants came from. That part I'm not buying.

Her in Pa we obviously have an extended rutting period. There were fresh scrapes in the area my Bud found them the other day back in October. Yet some were still being make a couple days ago. What causes it? That area has an overabundance of Does, and some because they were missed on their first go, go into a second heat.


The overabundance of does will cause a longer, more drawn out rut. No doubt about it. I need to shoot more does....I need to focus on it early in the season.

The variations of "peak" rut dates exists in AL. If a person wants to travel they can hunt the rut for 3 months. I grew up here hunting the management areas, the original stocking locations. Huge difference between Skyline (January), Little River (December), and Choccolocco (November...even late October) WMA's even though they aren't that far apart geographically. Deer have spread like crazy the past 30 years. I've wondered a lot about interbreeding changing rut dates. In most things genetic, there will be a dominate and recessive trait. I wonder how it works for the rut timing trait?

Here's an older link that discusses where some deer were originally stocked from and rut dates:

https://www.al.com/sports/2013/01/rut_report_deer_in_various_pha.html
Posted By: travelingman1

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/14/20

I have land in Dekalb and Etowah counties. Very close to the edges of 3 different zones. Has to overlap. Guess I could hunt for a month and call it the rut. Sadly, I do not hunt the land. Have a much better place available to me in Southern Tennessee, so have never hunted it. Allow a local to hunt, in exchange for looking over it for me.
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

So many variables in this discussion.....

I will say JG that Texas not only having multiple deer species, the climate and weather from Brownsville to the Panhandle is significantly more extreme than the north to south of Alabama. I'd say the rut in Texas more closely follows the north/south gradient, i.e. Bergmann's principle which would be a latitudinal gradient as you basically describe, not a giant patchwork like Alabama...
Posted By: roundoak

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

I consider what is happening in Alabama as a anomaly. When I look for rut starts thru out the United States, I refer to the USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Map as a general rule, and of course, there are exceptions.

https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/PHZMWeb/
Posted By: rost495

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

We own land in central TX and lease land in the hill country. About 125 miles apart.

I've seen a buck on a doe as early as mid September and as late as mid February.

We have buck fawns from still spotted in December to having hardened antlers protruding and rubbed off almost 3-4 inches long.

Nuts. One never knows.

The golden thing is finding a hot doe either early or late. Every buck around will be trailing. MUCH more impressive than general normal rut.
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

Originally Posted by roundoak
I consider what is happening in Alabama as a anomaly. When I look for rut starts thru out the United States, I refer to the USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Map as a general rule, and of course, there are exceptions.

https://planthardiness.ars.usda.gov/PHZMWeb/



I agree.

Some of the same things Alabama experiences other states in the South experience to a lesser extent. Georgia for example...
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

Battue does not know what he's talking about, a man from Pa knows nothing about what goes on in Alabama. The rut in this state is the craziest phenomenon in the deer world. The rut can vary by two months or more only a few miles apart. No matter where you are the rut is not very pronounced or aggresive as far as a 2 week time frame. It usually takes about a month total no matter which area you are in. I've seen bucks breeding does while turkey hunting in late March, and I've seen spotted fawns in late Sept and early Oct. The county I live in is next to the Ga state line, our rut here is just now kicking off, 25 miles east of us in Carroll County, Ga, their rut was over in late Nov. Don't make any sense, but it's true.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

Perhaps the man from Alabama should re-read what I wrote. I questioned the why of it, not the reality of it. 😉
Posted By: pointer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

Thanks for sharing this info! I've a brother that lives in AL. Long thought about trying to get in on a club/lease down there for some Dec/Jan hunting and this would help in picking a spot to look.
Posted By: jsj127

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

If I remember correctly, wasn’t Clark county the only county with native deer left when the restocking started in the 30’s and 40’s?

It’s hard to explain the crazy rut we have. I’ve seen fresh scrapes and rubs in mid August and also in early March and every time in between.

It’s changed a little on our club in the last 14years. Around 2005-6 ours peaked about December 4or5 until about the 15th-16th. Now it’s getting good about the week of Christmas to the week after New Years.
Posted By: Reloader7RM

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

I hunt 3 different ruts in LA, so see no reason why AL would be any different. My uncle lived there for decades and loved late Jan for big bucks.
Posted By: Capt_Craig

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

I was in Pickens County (Carrollton/Aliceville area) last week and weekend hunting. The rut was in full swing, but buck movement slowed a little with the warm weather and full moon, and really fired up the evening after the front and tornado went through (Sat). Unfortunately didn’t see any shooters in daylight, but quite a few at night on game cams. Shot a big azz hog left handed at 300 yds on the last evening, so I have some meat. Will be back there before the season ends to see if I can find a shooter.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/15/20

Originally Posted by Capt_Craig
I was in Pickens County (Carrollton/Aliceville area) last week and weekend hunting. The rut was in full swing, but buck movement slowed a little with the warm weather and full moon, and really fired up the evening after the front and tornado went through (Sat). Unfortunately didn’t see any shooters in daylight, but quite a few at night on game cams. Shot a big azz hog left handed at 300 yds on the last evening, so I have some meat. Will be back there before the season ends to see if I can find a shooter.


Love it when you Florida boys come up here and shoot these hogs, thanks for leaving the deer alive too. 🤣🤣🤣
Posted By: ChrisAU

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

It hasn't changed in 20 years in Henry County that I can vouch for. The rut rolls east to west across the county (southeast corner of the state, borders GA and one county up from FL). We have a lease in East Henry county where you can go watch mature bucks chase the end of December/first week of January. 20 miles west at our farm bucks couldn't care less about a doe until about the 18th-20th of January or so. Scraping/rubbing follows the same trend, you'll find them 2-4 weeks sooner on the eastern property vs the west.

Edit: I can also go 50 miles further east in GA and hunt the rut the first couple weeks of November. Its ridiculous.
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

Chris, apparently we are neighbors. Cool. Its hard for folks to grasp the rut down here. Its sounds good at first, potentially moving around the state and hunting the rut for three months. But in reality its not nearly as productive as what other northern and western states experience when all the deer in an area are chasing at once. I was amazed on a January archery mule deer hunt in AZ when I saw how a "real" rut works.
Posted By: ChrisAU

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

Originally Posted by ctsmith
Chris, apparently we are neighbors. Cool. Its hard for folks to grasp the rut down here. Its sounds good at first, potentially moving around the state and hunting the rut for three months. But in reality its not nearly as productive as what other northern and western states experience when all the deer in an area are chasing at once. I was amazed on a January archery mule deer hunt in AZ when I saw how a "real" rut works.


Yep, really close actually ha. And yes I agree, with such wide variance it does stretch it out, which has its pros and cons. Really hard to rely on any intel other than what your own eyeballs see because they may be rutting like crazy 5 miles away and have zero activity where you hunt at. Only way to know for sure is to get in the woods, which is ok by me.
Posted By: PaulBarnard

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

If a doe in heat walks a few hours from the one small red zone into the grey zone, does she not get serviced? If she does get serviced and gives birth to two does, does the mother or father determine when they when they will go into estrous? Damn my head hurts.
Posted By: ChrisAU

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

Originally Posted by PaulBarnard
If a doe in heat walks a few hours from the one small red zone into the grey zone, does she not get serviced? If she does get serviced and gives birth to two does, does the mother or father determine when they when they will go into estrous? Damn my head hurts.


I think this is why it remains so disjointed. Does have small home ranges, bucks roam. Sure, some deer will swim across deep and wide rivers, but I'd think most does never find a reason to do so. Hence the Tennessee, Tombigbee, and Chatahoochee rivers pretty well contain the state's does. Then on smaller levels all you ever have is some blending on the edges of doe populations, with the geographic cores of those initial restocks being very, very slow to grow if it all.

Not a biologist but I'd think that accounts for most of the weirdness. Their really is no explanation outside of that down here when on one side of the Chatahoochee they rut in November and on the other side in January.
Posted By: Capt_Craig

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
Originally Posted by Capt_Craig
I was in Pickens County (Carrollton/Aliceville area) last week and weekend hunting. The rut was in full swing, but buck movement slowed a little with the warm weather and full moon, and really fired up the evening after the front and tornado went through (Sat). Unfortunately didn’t see any shooters in daylight, but quite a few at night on game cams. Shot a big azz hog left handed at 300 yds on the last evening, so I have some meat. Will be back there before the season ends to see if I can find a shooter.


Love it when you Florida boys come up here and shoot these hogs, thanks for leaving the deer alive too. 🤣🤣🤣


You’re welcome Mirage, glad to help out 😉. Strangely all my local friends consider deer just ‘goats with antlers,’ and don’t mind us shooting a couple now and then. When it comes to turkeys though, it’s hands off!
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/16/20

Originally Posted by Capt_Craig


When it comes to turkeys though, it’s hands off!



Thats for sure.
Posted By: Bootsfishing

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/18/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
Battue does not know what he's talking about, a man from Pa knows nothing about what goes on in Alabama. The rut in this state is the craziest phenomenon in the deer world. The rut can vary by two months or more only a few miles apart. No matter where you are the rut is not very pronounced or aggresive as far as a 2 week time frame. It usually takes about a month total no matter which area you are in. I've seen bucks breeding does while turkey hunting in late March, and I've seen spotted fawns in late Sept and early Oct. The county I live in is next to the Ga state line, our rut here is just now kicking off, 25 miles east of us in Carroll County, Ga, their rut was over in late Nov. Don't make any sense, but it's true.


This has the most sense of any of the statements I've read...the first thing I thought was this guy has feather for brains...I'm really only familiar with DeKalb mostly and the rut is ALWAYS ear the end of season which is 2/10! Different strain of deer for sure....ymmv
Posted By: Cruiser1

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/24/20

I have hunted in Alabama all my life; and the variance in the rut is interesting here. I now hunt in Wilcox county; green area. I just hunted 5 days 1/18-1/22 and the rut is wide open; will typically continue into Feb. Probably 40 buck sightings in 40 hours on stand; chasing, tending, cruising, grunting. Cold and windy conditions; for the most part.
I used to hunt a WMA on the Shelby/Bibb county line near my home and rut is mid-December. Only slightly to the east and 80 miles south of my Wilcox camp.
This one had been tending a doe for 2 days.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Posted By: Oldelkhunter

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/25/20

Hunted the 15th thru the 19th this year. They were chasing but not as hard as previous years. This one came out for a snack at 3pm and stayed close to the treeline for 5 minutes and was on edge the whole time. I killed one 3 years ago same place and a half hour later who was chasing . Go figure

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Posted By: Bama_Rick

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/26/20

Originally Posted by Oldelkhunter
Hunted the 15th thru the 19th this year. They were chasing but not as hard as previous years. This one came out for a snack at 3pm and stayed close to the treeline for 5 minutes and was on edge the whole time. I killed one 3 years ago same place and a half hour later who was chasing . Go figure


Oldelkhunter, Nice buck! You may have been a couple days early. I just got home from West Butler Co. It's really ramped up there the past few days. A lot of bucks seen, but none interested in eating. They are up and moving good for our area. I killed one this morning that had been chasing hard. I'll be back up there in a few days. Should be good from here on out!
Posted By: Oldelkhunter

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 01/26/20

Originally Posted by Bama_Rick
Originally Posted by Oldelkhunter
Hunted the 15th thru the 19th this year. They were chasing but not as hard as previous years. This one came out for a snack at 3pm and stayed close to the treeline for 5 minutes and was on edge the whole time. I killed one 3 years ago same place and a half hour later who was chasing . Go figure


Oldelkhunter, Nice buck! You may have been a couple days early. I just got home from West Butler Co. It's really ramped up there the past few days. A lot of bucks seen, but none interested in eating. They are up and moving good for our area. I killed one this morning that had been chasing hard. I'll be back up there in a few days. Should be good from here on out!



Thank You, yeah I had the feeling that they were about to kick in overdrive and they had cooler weather then we had for sure.
Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/07/20

Add on to this topic.....

I'm in the northeast corner of the state. Things usually start up around Christmas to mid-January here. This past Wednesday night 3/4, driving home, I clipped a young buck crossing a highway....he appeared to be chasing a doe. I can't say for sure but the doe crossed first running and he was right behind her.

Same morning my father watched a "monster" (and he's not one to exaggerate) buck chasing 2 does on his land. He said he watched the buck chasing for ~5 minutes across pastures. It was enough time for him to go get bino's and call my mom in to watch as well.

I watched the local group of does that frequent my land off and on through the season. I kept waiting to see some chasing. In February they still had this years fawns by their side....usually once it starts the young ones get driven off momma and we see the young ones wondering looking a bit lost. We've often seen young ones hanging out with our goats when they get separated. At any rate, we never saw it this year and at the end of the season 4 does still had this years fawns by their side (2 had twins).

I'm guessing it's due to a very uneven ratio of bucks to does in the area. Everyone hunts and very few of the local people will pass up a buck regardless of it's size if they see one by chance.....many of them will never shoot a doe. It really wouldn't stand out that much to me if it appeared to be one buck chasing a single doe that was missed the first couple of rounds but 2 different bucks chasing (or appearing to be chasing) really caught my attention.
Posted By: RatherBHuntin

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/15/20

Originally Posted by ruraldoc

I have lived in Alabama all my life and have killed deer in a bunch of counties all over the state. The map is correct,it has been verified by shooting bred does all over the state and determining the age of the fetus and the date breeding occured.

The hard science of the studies agrees with what locals already knew.

Just for the record I have hunted and killed deer in Cullman,Shelby,Coosa, Elmore,Autauga, Macon,Bibb,Hale,Dallas,Marengo,Clarke,Sumter,Pickens,Greene,and Choctaw County.

Have also hunted without taking a deer in several other counties. The Map confirms what I have seen with my own eyes.


+1. I agree. The map is retry accurate from my exerience in hunting several different counties in the state.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/15/20

Alabama bucks are fuqked up, I think they've had the Corona for years and we just didn't know it.
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/17/20

Interesting! Thanks for the report.

Originally Posted by JCMCUBIC
Add on to this topic.....

I'm in the northeast corner of the state. Things usually start up around Christmas to mid-January here. This past Wednesday night 3/4, driving home, I clipped a young buck crossing a highway....he appeared to be chasing a doe. I can't say for sure but the doe crossed first running and he was right behind her.

Same morning my father watched a "monster" (and he's not one to exaggerate) buck chasing 2 does on his land. He said he watched the buck chasing for ~5 minutes across pastures. It was enough time for him to go get bino's and call my mom in to watch as well.

I watched the local group of does that frequent my land off and on through the season. I kept waiting to see some chasing. In February they still had this years fawns by their side....usually once it starts the young ones get driven off momma and we see the young ones wondering looking a bit lost. We've often seen young ones hanging out with our goats when they get separated. At any rate, we never saw it this year and at the end of the season 4 does still had this years fawns by their side (2 had twins).

I'm guessing it's due to a very uneven ratio of bucks to does in the area. Everyone hunts and very few of the local people will pass up a buck regardless of it's size if they see one by chance.....many of them will never shoot a doe. It really wouldn't stand out that much to me if it appeared to be one buck chasing a single doe that was missed the first couple of rounds but 2 different bucks chasing (or appearing to be chasing) really caught my attention.
Posted By: GregW

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/17/20

I've seen 2 coues bucks over 90" rutting does hard here in southern AZ still in the past few weeks, one as few as 3 days ago.

Not Alabama but figure it's be cool to mention on this thread...

Our rut was weird this year and I'm convinced there were more does bred during the second and even third cycles this year rather than the first....
Posted By: Oldelkhunter

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/19/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
Alabama bucks are fuqked up, I think they've had the Corona for years and we just didn't know it.



I concur. I have hunted 2 large properties in the past 20 years about 40 miles apart in the same county and it is tough to pinpoint the rut. I have seen some rutted up late December and early February. Friends that live on the property see them chasing well into February.
Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.
Posted By: travelingman1

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.



Have a lot of respect for you and your experience. Unfortunately, this posts shows your lack of experience hunting in Alabama. Deer do in fact rut at different time frames here. Northern part of the state is Late November / early December. Lower Ala can can be late Jan/early Feb. Several different areas in the state with different ruts. Been deer hunting for around 40 years and have seen it repeatedly.
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by travelingman1
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.



Have a lot of respect for you and your experience. Unfortunately, this posts shows your lack of experience hunting in Alabama. Deer do in fact rut at different time frames here. Northern part of the state is Late November / early December. Lower Ala can can be late Jan/early Feb. Several different areas in the state with different ruts. Been deer hunting for around 40 years and have seen it repeatedly.



The know it all Alaskan knows more about properties we've all been hunting for 30+ years than we do. Ever been to Alabama? I forget, we're all ignorant down here. Thanks SD for educating us.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.



You just flat don't know what you're talking about.

Our turkey season started today, and I will guarantee you that somewhere over the next few weeks I will see a buck chasing a doe somewhere on one of the different places I hUnt here in Alabama. It happens every year. I hunt at least 3 different ruts here within a 100 miles of each other, two different ruts about 6 weeks apart within 35 miles of each other.
Posted By: SKane

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.





What an absolute-phu*king-gift to be an expert at, and on, everything.






Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Just relying on published work on rut timing that has been done for a very long time. It fits the anecdotal evidence you all are describing.

Exact timing shifts every year based on the lunar cycle and some weather. To attach exact calendar dates to the rut puts you at odds with deer from the areas they were moved from, the deer that were there, and the rest of the free world. But do carry on.

I am certain finding all sorts of stuff that agrees with you will be easy, but find the stuff with some peer review.
Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by SKane
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.





What an absolute-phu*king-gift to be an expert at, and on, everything.


Is this the secret squirrel ignore?
Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.



You just flat don't know what you're talking about.

Our turkey season started today, and I will guarantee you that somewhere over the next few weeks I will see a buck chasing a doe somewhere on one of the different places I hUnt here in Alabama. It happens every year. I hunt at least 3 different ruts here within a 100 miles of each other, two different ruts about 6 weeks apart within 35 miles of each other.

"Somewhere over the next few weeks" is not proof, or even evidence of anything on the original chart.
Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Originally Posted by mirage243
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.



You just flat don't know what you're talking about.

Our turkey season started today, and I will guarantee you that somewhere over the next few weeks I will see a buck chasing a doe somewhere on one of the different places I hUnt here in Alabama. It happens every year. I hunt at least 3 different ruts here within a 100 miles of each other, two different ruts about 6 weeks apart within 35 miles of each other.

"Somewhere over the next few weeks" is not proof, or even evidence of anything on the original chart.


I'm not pushing it as evidence or even a pointer concerning the specific dates and corresponding areas listed on the map. What we're seeing is not "the rut" but it's bucks chasing does that haven't been bred yet. It's a sign of a jacked up breeding season....and it happens every season. Bucks are still carrying their antlers right now....if they still have headgear they'll still chase an unbred doe.
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer


Exact timing shifts every year based on the lunar cycle and some weather.



For real? No [bleep]. Nobody in this thread is disputing that.

Simple question. I have been on the properties noted in the southeast corner for 30 years. The two properties are approximately 35 miles apart. On one the rut always starts late January into February. BTW, I LIVE on this property and have taken over 10 good bucks during that time. The rut on the other property starts early to mid December. My good friend LIVES on this property. Its a large property and over 100 bucks easy during this time. Every single year, bar none, the rut is 45+/- days apart on these two properties. Do you say this is not the case, that this is not happening? That me, and everyone else down here in this corner of Alabama is wrong?


[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]


Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Poor ol' Sitka, always trying to be relevant.
Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by JCMCUBIC
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Originally Posted by mirage243
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Excuse me for finding a huge bit of humor here...

It has been long established a single factor has more to do with rut timing than anything else. Anyone trying to put hard dates on a calendar as rut times is clueless, period.

Unbred does will go back into rut one or two times, at least, if they fail to breed the first round.

Amazingly, the timing for these "ruts" is very regular and reliable.

I have zero doubt the map has found a difference in rut timing, but rounding off errors and anecdotal weighting of evidence has created a joke.



You just flat don't know what you're talking about.

Our turkey season started today, and I will guarantee you that somewhere over the next few weeks I will see a buck chasing a doe somewhere on one of the different places I hUnt here in Alabama. It happens every year. I hunt at least 3 different ruts here within a 100 miles of each other, two different ruts about 6 weeks apart within 35 miles of each other.

"Somewhere over the next few weeks" is not proof, or even evidence of anything on the original chart.


I'm not pushing it as evidence or even a pointer concerning the specific dates and corresponding areas listed on the map. What we're seeing is not "the rut" but it's bucks chasing does that haven't been bred yet. It's a sign of a jacked up breeding season....and it happens every season. Bucks are still carrying their antlers right now....if they still have headgear they'll still chase an unbred doe.

And they will chase an unbred doe even after they drop antlers.

The discussion was about rut timing. You told me my statements were in error so I assumed you were giving me evidence to correct my errors. I simply do not see it in your argument.
Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by JGRaider
Poor ol' Sitka, always trying to be relevant.

Uncle Rico...
Did you get an email from a game biologist this morning about this? I did. He was not arguing with me at all. He was laughing. He finds it funny I would try to challenge a long held belief system with nothing more than facts...
Posted By: Sitka deer

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by ctsmith
Originally Posted by Sitka deer


Exact timing shifts every year based on the lunar cycle and some weather.



For real? No [bleep]. Nobody in this thread is disputing that.

Simple question. I have been on the properties noted in the southeast corner for 30 years. The two properties are approximately 35 miles apart. On one the rut always starts late January into February. BTW, I LIVE on this property and have taken over 10 good bucks during that time. The rut on the other property starts early to mid December. My good friend LIVES on this property. Its a large property and over 100 bucks easy during this time. Every single year, bar none, the rut is 45+/- days apart on these two properties. Do you say this is not the case, that this is not happening? That me, and everyone else down here in this corner of Alabama is wrong?


[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]



Okkkaaayyyyyyy...

SInce your dates are considerably different from the map dates, what exactly are you saying?
Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Originally Posted by JGRaider
Poor ol' Sitka, always trying to be relevant.

Uncle Rico...
Did you get an email from a game biologist this morning about this? I did. He was not arguing with me at all. He was laughing. He finds it funny I would try to challenge a long held belief system with nothing more than facts...



Sure you did........keep trying though, you're doing good. You know as much about this as you do your "facts" about accubond bullets.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

I've hunted deer all over this state for over 40 years, you will not find a single hunter that has hunted here very long that will disagree with this map. Many, many studies have been done on it, believe it or not, they were done by wildlife bioligist. Nobody down here gives a fuqk what some jackwad from Alaska thinks about what deer do in Alabama.
Posted By: Judman

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Good lord Sitka dummy, you probably need to shut your cock holster, and listen to folks that actually live/hunt there... just sayin

Oppps, that’s right, you put me on pretend ignore years ago for spanking you and your stupidity
Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer

......................................................
Originally Posted by JCMCUBIC


I'm not pushing it as evidence or even a pointer concerning the specific dates and corresponding areas listed on the map. What we're seeing is not "the rut" but it's bucks chasing does that haven't been bred yet. It's a sign of a jacked up breeding season....and it happens every season. Bucks are still carrying their antlers right now....if they still have headgear they'll still chase an unbred doe.

And they will chase an unbred doe even after they drop antlers.

The discussion was about rut timing. You told me my statements were in error so I assumed you were giving me evidence to correct my errors. I simply do not see it in your argument.


I've not told you anything about your statements. I made a statement about what my thoughts were.

I don't know about bucks chasing does after dropping their antlers. My understanding has always been that the antlers drop when the testosterone level falls below a certain point. As I've always understood it buck can breed any time they have hard antlers....perhaps they can at other times as well.
Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by Sitka deer


Okkkaaayyyyyyy...

SInce your dates are considerably different from the map dates, what exactly are you saying?




What am I saying? The question is what are you saying?

I am saying the premise of the map is accurate.

We have already established the boundaries of the map aren't perfect, but close. The deer on my property are off one grouping from the map. They should be considered in the Green. I'm sure you realize, the deer don't have the map, and if they did, could they read it?

I will ask again, because I am not certain as to what you are saying.

Are you saying the premise of the map is not accurate?

Are you saying that the rut on my property does not start late January into February every year?

Are you saying that the rut on my fiend's property does not start in early to mid December every year?

I seriously am unclear as to what you are disputing. Here's another question.

Assume a property is high fenced in Alabama and the high fence has deer mostly of northern genetics. The neighboring wild deer are all natives. Are you saying the rut will occur at the same time inside the fence as outside?









Posted By: ctsmith

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/21/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
Many, many studies have been done on it, believe it or not, they were done by wildlife biologist. Nobody down here gives a fuqk what some jackwad from Alaska thinks about what deer do in Alabama.


Who the hell does he think came up with the map?
Posted By: Bull64

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
I've hunted deer all over this state for over 40 years, you will not find a single hunter that has hunted here very long that will disagree with this map. Many, many studies have been done on it, believe it or not, they were done by wildlife bioligist. Nobody down here gives a fuqk what some jackwad from Alaska thinks about what deer do in Alabama.

This...
Posted By: SKane

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Alabama (and the rut) is truly an enigma in the whitetail world. You folks in Alabama don't need James Kroll, Karl Miller and the like, you just needed an Alaskan. whistle

Below are a couple of articles that touch on this subject.

https://www.qdma.com/chasing-explanation-souths-odd-rut/

https://www.outdooralabama.com/node/2002
Posted By: Oldelkhunter

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by SKane
Alabama (and the rut) is truly an enigma in the whitetail world. You folks in Alabama don't need James Kroll, Karl Miller and the like, you just needed an Alaskan. whistle

Below are a couple of articles that touch on this subject.

https://www.qdma.com/chasing-explanation-souths-odd-rut/

https://www.outdooralabama.com/node/2002



That second map is really interesting . I did not know that some of the stocked deer came from NC , Ohio and Arkansas. I know that Georgia was pretty heavily stocked with Wisconsin Deer.
Posted By: SKane

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Genetics of three, possibly four, different subspecies of whitetails – the melting pot of the whitetail world. smile
Pragmatism, logic and photoperiod say they should all act alike relative to breeding and fawn production - while boots on the ground and research reveal large disparities.
I'll side with the latter as many Alabama residents (and obviously Alaska) have experienced this phenomenon first-hand through multiple generations.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Opinion of a jackwad Pa boy👍...

1:Cut the statewide Buck/Doe ratio closer to 1:1 and you will see most of it go away.

2: Alabama Bucks must not be much for traveling to find new stuff. They have more than they can handle at home. Thus they keep hitting the same DNA and the genetics stay mostly the same.

3: When they slammed the public land Pa does down to almost nothing, Pa Bucks became big roamers during the rut. The rule was the successful jackwads hunted the Does to find the Bucks. On private land that allowed more Does, the Bucks tended to stay home and Bucks from other areas put their nose in the air and visited and the jackwads also could stay closer to home. And the wise jackwads placed a high value on making sure they kept some Does around. The dorks kept killing them.

4: You can always tell an Alabama Deer hunter. Just don’t tell him what he doesn’t want to hear or you will be called a jackwad. grin
Posted By: JCMCUBIC

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

SKane's second link shows AL deer have been stocked from Arkansas, Georgia, Michigan, North Carolina, Ohio, Texas, and Wisconsin....and from different locations in AL. AL shares fairly large borders with 4 different states and of course inflow from those areas should be considered as the expansion of deer ranges in AL has been massive across the state over the last 30 years. It's a real melting pot....but it ends up more like a tie dyed t-shirt than an even mix.

The info mentioned in one of the articles concerning the maternal side of genetics having the biggest influence on the rut because of a lower dispersion of does is interesting. Regardless, the wide array of times does may come in is going to result in a drawn out rut as bucks are going to be breeding even if the buck isn't at his "peak" rut regarding genetics...and the uneven doe/buck ratio leads to does being bred later which further drags things out.

It is what it is and makes interesting hunting. One thing I know, I need to shoot more does......I've got to make myself do this.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Which makes the inquisitive ask....while it is obviously something unique to Alabama, and the geniuses attribute it to the transplant genetics

1: will the same be seen if the ratio comes closer to 1:1

2: why isn’t the same phenomenon seen in other States that had multiple transplant genetics.
Posted By: Oldelkhunter

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by JCMCUBIC
SKane's second link shows AL deer have been stocked from Arkansas, Georgia, Michigan, North Carolina, Ohio, Texas, and Wisconsin....and from different locations in AL. AL shares fairly large borders with 4 different states and of course inflow from those areas should be considered as the expansion of deer ranges in AL has been massive across the state over the last 30 years. It's a real melting pot....but it ends up more like a tie dyed t-shirt than an even mix.

The info mentioned in one of the articles concerning the maternal side of genetics having the biggest influence on the rut because of a lower dispersion of does is interesting. Regardless, the wide array of times does may come in is going to result in a drawn out rut as bucks are going to be breeding even if the buck isn't at his "peak" rut regarding genetics...and the uneven doe/buck ratio leads to does being bred later which further drags things out.

It is what it is and makes interesting hunting. One thing I know, I need to shoot more does......I've got to make myself do this.


Doe were few and far between this year. I shot one mature doe that weighed 125 lbs(it was dry), the other one with it was roughly the same size. I only saw 2 3+ year old bucks this year and a Bunch of 2,4 and 6 point bucks that outnumbered the does easily.

This same property years ago would have 20-30 does out in a plot at night with 7-8 bucks of all age classes there as well.


Coyotes started showing up heavily 6 years ago, the last 2 years they were quiet with few sightings and this year they are apparently back.
Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by battue
Opinion of a jackwad Pa boy👍...

1:Cut the statewide Buck/Doe ratio closer to 1:1 and you will see most of it go away.

2: Alabama Bucks must not be much for traveling to find new stuff. They have more than they can handle at home. Thus they keep hitting the same DNA and the genetics stay mostly the same.

3: When they slammed the public land Pa does down to almost nothing, Pa Bucks became big roamers during the rut. The rule was the successful jackwads hunted the Does to find the Bucks. On private land that allowed more Does, the Bucks tended to stay home and Bucks from other areas put their nose in the air and visited and the jackwads also could stay closer to home. And the wise jackwads placed a high value on making sure they kept some Does around. The dorks kept killing them.

4: You can always tell an Alabama Deer hunter. Just don’t tell him what he doesn’t want to hear or you will be called a jackwad. grin




At least you admit your's to be a wildasssed guess.

We had a long time high powered TPW biologist hunt mule deer with us a few times. This guy and his buddy Horace Gore coined the term "the Golden Triangle" in TX back when whitetail deer mgt was just started getting kicked off ( they had lots to do with it BTW). As expected, this guy had data stacked 3 feet high on whitetails/rut/moon phase, etc. His data showed that whitetails in a natural environment will travel great distances during the rut, as it is nature's way of spreading genetics. Same is true for muleys actually. I do know that on our whitetail/mule deer places we have seen bucks 7-12 miles from where we saw them just a day or two earlier.......all 100% private ground

It is really very easy to tell a know it al, jackwad deer hunter from a legit one.
Posted By: SKane

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by JCMCUBIC

It is what it is and makes interesting hunting. One thing I know, I need to shoot more does......I've got to make myself do this.



Yep. And I think that's what battue is getting at - and with sound reason.
Growing up, I had a strong aversion to shooting does mainly because we didn't have the overabundance we do today. Well, that and it wasn't the manly thing to do. laugh

It took a bit to get passed that but now I'm just as happy in filling the freezer with does. And if I don't see something with antlers that makes my socks go up and down, I'll use my buck tag on a yearling doe too.
Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

We should have been shooting more does off of that whitetail property as well. Our ratios are in the 3:1 range now, but the bucks still roam a huge area during the rut. On the years we didn't shoot bucks (due to drought years) we should have whacked some does. I've helped my buddy cull whitetail does on his place the past 3 years rather aggressively (killed over 40 myself.....great bullet testing), and it already shows it's helping. His bucks travel a long ways as well, as the neighbors have pics of several of "his" bucks.
Posted By: Oldelkhunter

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20



EHD outbreaks
No season limit on Deer(including bucks) that finally changed
Severe Droughts
Development
Temperature extremes during the Rut
Heavy Hunting Pressure
QDM implementation

Despite all the above the rut is still irregular in many parts of Alabama. Years ago there was really no reporting system in place for deer kills, the last few years have been different and that is why these statistics are what they are.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by battue
Opinion of a jackwad Pa boy👍...

1:Cut the statewide Buck/Doe ratio closer to 1:1 and you will see most of it go away.

2: Alabama Bucks must not be much for traveling to find new stuff. They have more than they can handle at home. Thus they keep hitting the same DNA and the genetics stay mostly the same.

3: When they slammed the public land Pa does down to almost nothing, Pa Bucks became big roamers during the rut. The rule was the successful jackwads hunted the Does to find the Bucks. On private land that allowed more Does, the Bucks tended to stay home and Bucks from other areas put their nose in the air and visited and the jackwads also could stay closer to home. And the wise jackwads placed a high value on making sure they kept some Does around. The dorks kept killing them.

4: You can always tell an Alabama Deer hunter. Just don’t tell him what he doesn’t want to hear or you will be called a jackwad. grin


1- you can kill a doe a day here in Alabama, makes the legal possibilities over a 100 does per year for each hunter.

2- about 3 years ago a buck that was a resident of my farm got killed almost 11 miles away. There is no doubt it was him.

3- not a lot of public land here to hunt.

4- you can always tell a yankee jackwad, he's the one telling Alabama hunters what they already know. 😂
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by JGRaider


At least you admit your's to be a wildasssed guess.

We had a long time high powered TPW biologist hunt mule deer with us a few times. This guy and his buddy Horace Gore coined the term "the Golden Triangle" in TX back when whitetail deer mgt was just started getting kicked off ( they had lots to do with it BTW). As expected, this guy had data stacked 3 feet high on whitetails/rut/moon phase, etc. His data showed that whitetails in a natural environment will travel great distances during the rut, as it is nature's way of spreading genetics. Same is true for muleys actually. I do know that on our whitetail/mule deer places we have seen bucks 7-12 miles from where we saw them just a day or two earlier.......all 100% private ground

It is really very easy to tell a know it al, jackwad deer hunter from a legit one.



It's a guess, but I'm not about to accept it to be wildasssed....


Now here would be another guess....define it as you will.....but it is far from wildasssed....

The Deer management philosophy of the last couple decades has been enlightening at minimum.....However, I question how much the data they obtain and make conclusions on are based on Whitetails in their natural environment. In fact one of their goals is to keep the big boys on the home grounds....to breed and to shoot.....Old David Morris and the boys do their best to keep the genes at home....You want to get data on Whitetails in a natural environment, and not Deer who are fortunate to live and die in a controlled honey hole, then you best study the Adirondacks or the Maine Great woods. Year round supplemental farming and feeding pales to their natural environment. Combine it with the fact, damn few individuals get to manage a piece of private ground where Deer can stay on it and still travel 7-12miles.


However, since most of us today, North and South, mostly hunt smaller parcels, their work is relevant to most of our situations....


Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by mirage243
Originally Posted by battue
Opinion of a jackwad Pa boy👍...

1:Cut the statewide Buck/Doe ratio closer to 1:1 and you will see most of it go away.

2: Alabama Bucks must not be much for traveling to find new stuff. They have more than they can handle at home. Thus they keep hitting the same DNA and the genetics stay mostly the same.

3: When they slammed the public land Pa does down to almost nothing, Pa Bucks became big roamers during the rut. The rule was the successful jackwads hunted the Does to find the Bucks. On private land that allowed more Does, the Bucks tended to stay home and Bucks from other areas put their nose in the air and visited and the jackwads also could stay closer to home. And the wise jackwads placed a high value on making sure they kept some Does around. The dorks kept killing them.

4: You can always tell an Alabama Deer hunter. Just don’t tell him what he doesn’t want to hear or you will be called a jackwad. grin


1- you can kill a doe a day here in Alabama, makes the legal possibilities over a 100 does per year for each hunter.

2- about 3 years ago a buck that was a resident of my farm got killed almost 11 miles away. There is no doubt it was him.

3- not a lot of public land here to hunt.

4- you can always tell a yankee jackwad, he's the one telling Alabama hunters what they already know. 😂



When a hoarder and an idiot calls you a jackwad.....it means nothing.....
Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by battue



It's a guess, but I'm not about to accept it to be wildasssed....


Now here would be another guess....define it as you will.....but it is far from wildasssed....

The Deer management philosophy of the last couple decades has been enlightening at minimum.....However, I question how much the data they obtain and make conclusions on are based on Whitetails in their natural environment. In fact one of their goals is to keep the big boys on the home grounds....to breed and to shoot.....Old David Morris and the boys do their best to keep the genes at home....You want to get data on Whitetails in a natural environment, and not Deer who are fortunate to live and die in a controlled honey hole, then you best study the Adirondacks or the Maine Great woods. Year round supplemental farming and feeding pales to their natural environment. Combine it with the fact, damn few individuals get to manage a piece of private ground where Deer can stay on it and still travel 7-12miles.


However, since most of us today, North and South, mostly hunt smaller parcels, their work is relevant to most of our situations....




Wildassed at best. Just because "few individuals get to manage a piece of private ground where deer can stay on and still travel 7-12 miles" does not mean this type of deer movement doesn't happen, which is one of the premises of your guess. Like I mentioned previously, my biologist friend had stacks of data on the subject, including free range herds from all over TX, parts of Oklahoma, and Old MX, as natural as it gets. These were not HF in a "honey hole" environment. Whether you choose to accept it or not, keep guessing, or whatever is up to you. You'd really have your head spinning if you read his no moon/full moon data.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

You miss read me or I didn't explain it good enough and if that is the case, I apologize....But if you want to get an attitude, have at it, because you can't keep up when we start going there....We have had no problems in the past, but if you want attitude then you best go home and get yourself some....

No doubt they can travel that distance and will when conditions are correct or the mood strikes. It does happen and one of the reason we kill so many on the roads here. However, I tend to be skeptical of some of the data that comes out of intensively managed Deer properties as it applies to free range herds and more than a little..Nor do I think you are one of few that has all the answers based on who you know....You may think you have an inside tract on being the Deer Whisperer, but others of us have been watching them for just as long....

Nor does my head spin, or am i guessing when I know what can be done with supplemental feeding and Deer behavior modification. I can have 5-9 in my yard within 30minutes just by yelling come on....


What can be done on large properties with unlimited feed, water, refuge areas and winter cover has little resemblance to the natural habitat Deer evolved in. Which was my point...The Deer in Pa drifted from the the Northern big woods down South to the farmlands and better habitat. You tell me why....
Posted By: JGRaider

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

You must have entirely missed the point that it isn't my data, it's from a lifetime professional biologist who wrote the book on whitetail deer management, with data from decades of personal experience to back it up. That was good enough for me, apparently not for you.

I'm not one of those guys who offers advice on deer hunting in places I've never hunted, or better yet never been to, unlike many here. I have no clue what your deer do or why. As for the "attitude", you need to lighten up some as none was intended.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

JGR, not sure what all he hates, but guys that hunt in Alabama, and people that have stuff in stock for their family, are definately on his sheit list.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by JGRaider
You must have entirely missed the point that it isn't my data, it's from a lifetime professional biologist who wrote the book on whitetail deer management, with data from decades of personal experience to back it up. That was good enough for me, apparently not for you.

I'm not one of those guys who offers advice on deer hunting in places I've never hunted, or better yet never been to, unlike many here. I have no clue what your deer do or why. As for the "attitude", you need to lighten up some as none was intended.


It’s not the fact that’s it’s your data or some professional. My only point again would be I’m skeptical of transposing managed Deer data to unmanaged. Now when you start replying with my responses are wildassed, then the attitude flag has been raised. However, if none was intended then I accept I took it wrong and we will go on.

Now old mirage thinks Alabama hunters are on my shiiit list. Far from it, and I find their Deer rutting characteristics not only interesting, but something I didn’t know about. And enough of them have verified that to be the case, that I admit my initial thoughts were in error. The why of it, if their Deer travel so much, and the transplanted DNA gets mixed, then becomes something else I think about.


Now Mirage admits to being a hoarder during the .22lr shortage. Then he admits to being a medication hoarder during the current covid crises and tries to justify same by saying he is a capitalist. I don’t care where he is from, he is a shiitpoke. .

Addition: In fact his being so blatantly obnoxious re his hoarding, has a similar ring to what us up here are so often accused of. It seems the line has little to do with it. At least in his case....
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by battue



Now Mirage admits to being a hoarder during the .22lr shortage. Then he admits to being a medication hoarder during the current covid crises and tries to justify same by saying he is a capitalist. I don’t care where he is from, he is a shiitpoke. .

Addition: In fact his being so blatantly obnoxious re his hoarding, has a similar ring to what us up here are so often accused of. It seems the line has little to do with it. At least in his case....


You can bet your sweet ass that I am gonna hoard my medication that keeps me alive, especially since the plant that makes it is in Wuhan, China.
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/24/20

Originally Posted by mirage243


I did the same thing, I take some BP medicine, I've got a years worth and just had my Doc call me in another 180 days supply.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/25/20

Originally Posted by battue
Originally Posted by mirage243


I did the same thing, I take some BP medicine, I've got a years worth and just had my Doc call me in another 180 days supply.



Exactly . . . . . .you need to borrow a few, it's pretty obvious I got your BP way up. 😂😂😂
Posted By: alwaysoutdoors

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/25/20

I have only skimmed over this thread honestly. But I’ve noticed that Alabama has similar characteristics to TN regarding the Whitetail Rut. In TN, the “experts” believe that it attributed to the “mix” of Whitetail stock . They were brought in from other states as well. It’s kinda cool that they carried their home range rutting traits . I’m pretty sure Virginia and Wisconsin whitetails were used to restock TN . (Maybe more) that big sum bitch I killed in 2018 had to be from up North bloodline .
Posted By: battue

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/25/20

You are such a fine example of what is wrong with this country.
And you do a better job of proving it than I ever could.

Keep up the good work of showing the rest of us what irresponsibility looks like.

Back on topic:

It would be interesting if we could transplant a cross section of Alabama Does here, and see what the would happen. However, perhaps we should leave will enough alone.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/25/20

Originally Posted by battue
You are such a fine example of what is wrong with this country.




You're right, maybe I should have waited on .gov to give me my 30 day supply. I paid for that sheit with my own money, no co-pay, no medicaid, my fuqkin hard earned money.
Posted By: RifleDude

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 03/25/20

I would've never believed it had I not seen it in person. Alabama indeed has the weirdest rut in the whitetail world. I hunted with a buddy in AL in late Jan, 2009. He was telling me the timing of my visit was perfect because the rut was at its peak. I didn't want to call him a liar, so I just smiled, kept my comments to myself, and went along with what he said. He did invite me to hunt his place after all. Sure enough, when we went out that first morning, there were fresh scrapes everywhere and bucks chasing does like crazy. Damnedest thing I ever saw! He assured me this was the norm. He also had some hunting property about 50 miles east of that place, and he said the rut peaked in Dec. there!
Posted By: Judman

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 05/28/20

Here ya go. 4 months of rut...
[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Posted By: RemModel8

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 05/28/20

Originally Posted by ctsmith
Originally Posted by Sitka deer


Exact timing shifts every year based on the lunar cycle and some weather.



For real? No [bleep]. Nobody in this thread is disputing that.

Simple question. I have been on the properties noted in the southeast corner for 30 years. The two properties are approximately 35 miles apart. On one the rut always starts late January into February. BTW, I LIVE on this property and have taken over 10 good bucks during that time. The rut on the other property starts early to mid December. My good friend LIVES on this property. Its a large property and over 100 bucks easy during this time. Every single year, bar none, the rut is 45+/- days apart on these two properties. Do you say this is not the case, that this is not happening? That me, and everyone else down here in this corner of Alabama is wrong?


[Linked Image from hosting.photobucket.com]




A had a good friend that lived on the other side of the river in Georgia and deer there were hard into rut around Halloween.
Posted By: Todd_Bradford

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 06/01/20

I have lived and hunted in Alabama my whole 54 year life. That map is pretty spot on. I am hunting in the southern half of Wilcox County and the Northern part of Monroe County. Our rut doesn't kick in until late January.

And no I am not seeing a secondary rut for does that didn't get bred the first go round. We see no bucks chasing does earlier than mid to late January. There is no increase in scrapes and rubs until mid to late January. And if that isn't enough for the doubters a study of the does in this area by wildlife biologists determined that the "AVERAGE" time of conception for the does in this area was about the first week of February.

By contrast I have friends and family who live and hunt in other parts of the state where the rut is totally over by the start of January.

This Sitka blowhard talks about laughing at such claims. Here's what I find funny. People who have never stepped foot in, much less hunted, a state trying to lecture the people who have hunted that state for generations on how the deer behave there. Now that's some funny s#$t.
Posted By: mirage243

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 06/01/20

Originally Posted by Todd_Bradford


This Sitka blowhard talks about laughing at such claims. Here's what I find funny. People who have never stepped foot in, much less hunted, a state trying to lecture the people who have hunted that state for generations on how the deer behave there. Now that's some funny s#$t.



He's a fuqking idiot, and everybody knows it but him.
Posted By: Judman

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 06/01/20

Careful now, there is nothin Sitka dummy doesn’t know, just ask him!!! 🤣🤣

Poor dumb bastard thinks weather “starts” the rut!! Haha
Posted By: Cruiser1

Re: Alabama Rut - 3 Month Irregular Rut Mapped & Explained - 06/01/20

Originally Posted by Judman
Careful now, there is nothin Sitka dummy doesn’t know, just ask him!!! 🤣🤣

Poor dumb bastard thinks weather “starts” the rut!! Haha


Hell; I can't get it up sitting in stand below 30 degrees?
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