What rifle cartridge would you choose and what barrel length? I’m thinking 5.56 or Wylde in 12.5”carbine gas or 13.7” mid length. More like an urban carbine.

300 bo or 458 socom. 8.5 and 10.5.
sub and super abilities.
i have a 300 BO and it is my go to daily.
would have a 458 if i could find a barrel and BCG.

KISS 5.56 10.5 brl.

Just built a 12.5” rifle in 223. Really happy with it. Currently have a red dot on it, the scope was only for testing. Debating if I want to tax stamp it into a SBR. Definitely want to get a smaller suppressor for it.

16" Wylde MidLength Gas Rifle and quit fhuqking around,before it even started. Hint...............

Got a 20” rifle gasser already. Don’t need a sniffling 16 incher spoiling things.

Who doesn't? Hint.

What does the 16" MidLength Carbine "give up",that the 13.7" pistol "gains",in like chambering? Hint..................

If you're committed to it, a 12.5" chambered in 5.56 should be pretty nice.

Myself, I have 10.5" and 11.5" both in 5.56. I thought they were pretty neato at first, but that passed fairly fast.

Having scratched that itch, I've got two 16" mid-gas barrels on the way from PSA. Gonna turn them both into proper carbines with proper buttstocks.

It's all part of the journey.

I've got 11.5", pinned 13.7", pinned 14.5", and 16" right now.

I really like the 13.7 but it's definitely a niche length. The idea is to have the shortest possible non-NFA barrel. Mine is 16" and a hair. But only some muzzle devices are long enough. I added a SF brake and needed to shim it a little. If you're willing to go SBR / pistol there's no reason to mess with a 13.7.

I've got a couple 14.5" pinned/welded uppers. I like that length a lot.

In reality the difference in length/balance between 14.5" vs 16" is hardly enough to notice. I still like it a lot.

I'll never understand the Faux SBR thing,while being forced to suffer a fhuqking brace. Balance/handling are hurt. Performance is hurt. Innards(reciprocating components) are tossed no favors. Then on top of it,they are fhuqking slower than schit. Hint.

The LAST thing I want done to a barrel(ANY barrel),is to be welding or pinning same. Those are not accuracy "enhancers". And yesssss,I suffer schit with welded trunnions. Hint.(grin)

Pass the MidLength Gas and a REAL stock,on a well balanced 16" rifle. No bullschit,no loophole to get wrapped up in and a breeze to field good glass upon. With Today's glass and Illumination,there's no "trade off" in same,while the Faux SBR Brace Bullschit is a never ending series of fhuqking compromises. Hint.

I'll never understand,but WILL watch The Circus.Hint...............(grin)

In the center ring, I have 10.5, 11.5, and 12.5 such as this, with the KAK M2 which is tooless adjustable and uses a regular carbine tube... A couple few months ago when the big pistol scare hit, they were dumping these KAK Shockwave Blade M2s for like $15, right after I bought a few at $44. Can't imagine wanting to have one under 16" without a suppressor. 11.5" just fine. 5.56 all the way. If you want some niche then go with whatever. Mine are all carbine gas with AGBs on the keepers. All nitrided Ballistics Advantage barrels which seems to be very good for the money, especially on sale. I dimpled them. Seems I have all nitrided BCGs now too, Toolcraft and RCA. Love the stuff. To me, the only place pinning makes any sense is if equipping for a suppressor QD mount system. YRMV



12.5" with suppressor is getting too long maybe. SBA4s, uhh, feels like a butt. I ended up with 3 12.5" barrels, but I would go 11.5" anymore. This is not necessarily complete here. Might trim the tube back or something or not. A shorter suppressor would be good here but I will just use this.


11.5" Much love long time. Not sure where this one is. I better look around. Perfect. And SBA4 would be good here too, however, the blades are surprisingly adequate, uhh, braces...


My 10.5" is like this PSA kit, in nitride. Pretty damned cool for the $350 + lwr it took. My SilencerCo Omega is rated for it, so... It's a pistol buffer rig, and takes a tool to adjust. With a carry handle it's just a fun short range blaster. With the Omega, it seemed quieter than a 22lr pistol, IME.

This ^^^ The short silencer bug has yet to bite me. It's tough to beat a 16" AR for most things.

kwg

The pistol length thing with brace comes into play here in my state where one can have a loaded pistol in the cab of the vehicle, but a rifle needs to be unloaded.

Of course, that's best solved by inserting a mag and racking the charging handle, so maybe it isn't a differentiator.

I often forget about the crazy rules/laws,others must suffer. Were that the case,it'd still be a 16" Middy Rifle and a guy would have an excuse to buy a Truck Pistole. Hint.(grin)

Long story short,the Krunchenticker Pistol is nothing but compromise and that's never been a good blueprint foundation and never will be. I've never not been a sucker for a stock and playing Robo Cop ain't my gig. Hint.

Laughing!.................

What does the 16" MidLength Carbine "give up",that the 13.7" pistol "gains"



^^^^^^^ This. My whole reason. I can have a faux pistol concealed in my vehicle on my CCW. Rifle? Not so much. It gives me a carbine as a backup should a violent group of peaceful protesters have an issue with me. Not a big chance but there are many scenarios,unexpected, where a legally carried AR “pistol” might come in handy.

Short barrels make sense to folks with silencers.
If I can bother the old lady next door less (or shoot with her none the wiser) I certainly will.

But I live in a semi-urban environment- cattle farm situated by a neighborhood.

If I lived more remotely I'd rock earplugs and give the ATF one less person to keep track of.

Honestly dicking with the gas systems, excessively dirty chambers, poor balance- cans come with lots of tradeoffs, but I still own a half dozen or so.

Except rimfire- nothing beats a suppressed 22lr for teaching a kid to shoot.

Now regarding the 13.7 specifically- it's pretty dumb.
A 16" barrel with can direct threaded is nearly the exact same length as the 13.7 + insanely long and heavy deadair keymo.

That whole idea is Instagram sheep delusion at its finest.
Also- for those of us running "pistols”- there's a chance some folks out there might just keep a "brace" in the drawer in case of public appearances or if the ATF comes knocking- but run a stock the other 98% of the time.

Who knows? Some folks might do that IDK

If I wasn't running cans I'd start and end at 18" rifle gassers for 223.

.

Doesn’t matter what you do to to the 16”’ because you can do the same thing to the 13.7”. The shorter barrel is going to be over 2” shorter anyway.

Add me to the list of people who have tried the AR pistol for the sake of novelty, only to realize that it's as others above have described...a bad compromise for no real purpose.

In the pic below are two of my ARs...one is a typical M4 clone (right) with the adjustable stock and the other is a PSA AR pistol kit with the brace (left), with a Dead Air Sandman can on it. With the can, they're basically the same size. I learned what others already know, that the AR pistol is just ridiculously loud unless you have a can. Putting the can on the pistol made the pistol about as loud as an M4 clone without a can, yet it's not better than an M4 clone, and certainly not better than an M4 clone that has been outfitted with a can. I suppose a shorter can would make a difference, but it would also probably make the thing louder than the can I have (and louder than an M4). All things equal, I'd rather go with a carbine and add an AR can on it to get an AR that isn't a compromise.

If you perceive those two as being equally loud than I'd suspect that's an enormously overgassed setup.

11.5-12.5 middy's are pretty sweet suppressed.

Short barrels can get quiet when the gas is under control.
Even 10.5s can sound good with the right gas port-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzRQJJG9WBs

Edit- here's ray metering a 15db diff at se purely due to gas port- size.
https://youtu.be/l870SkASH5Y

Well duh, but you're ignoring the actual setup lotsa people buy a 13.7 for- solgw nox + deadair keymo silencer.

The keymo adds lots of length and weight, essentially invalidating the gains of having a < 16".

Now if you want to just run an SBR or pistol and like the compromises a 13.7 offers, go for it.

But it's not like you're saving length / weight over a 16 when you could just run a shorter can / mount anyhow.

That was the point I tried to make.

Maybe it makes sense for folks with sandman's that can't change out the adapter from keymo . . . Shoot I'd probably be talked into one if I had a sandman k.

I have a direct threaded turbo k on my 16" - adds just over 4" past the muzzle and weighs just a pinch more than the nox by itself for a handy field rifle.

Capt',

You SWEET Talkin' SOB...everyone KNOWS an 18" Rifle Gasser is MY Favorite. Hint.(grin)

Now back to the Pistole Brace Fhuqktitude. A 16" RIFLE is an easy fhuqking choice,over ALL things Krunchenticker Pistole. Doubly so,if one is fretting it actually being used in Defense. The RoboCop Bullschit is a fhuqking farce and using a sock as a glove,is even dumber than it fhuqking sounds. Hint.

I find it an interesting "stance",to schlep a Wagon Load of STUPID(Braced 13.7" or other "Pistole"),over a 16" rugged/reliable REAL rifle. How/why folks "get" there,remain a Mystery to me. I can see it(shorter barrel lengths) in SBR,but not in Barbie Doll Bullschit,especially as Defense. Hint.

Fretting less than 3" of barrel,for curtailing a Riot within a Soccer Mom Bitch Mobile,just "MIGHT" be fhuqking humorous!?! Pass the Grock and hold The Fluff. Hint.

Here's hoping the OP's Woketitude,simply dissipates and Reality returns. Hint.

Laughing!....................

It may be as you say, I'm not well versed on the issues of cans and semi auto gas settings and I certainly haven't fiddled with anything (the truth is that the Sandman is from my bolt rifles). I should prolly learn more about the gas part of the equation, especially since I have a YHM Turbo about ready to be sprung from jail and it will be the designated AR can. Thanks for the heads up.

I handled a 13.7 and 16 with identical muzzle devices today. The difference is noticeable in the hand. For the same reason a 16 is handier than an 18. That being said, it really doesn’t make a lot of sense for most folks.

As for the OP, when I hear “urban carbine” I think being in and out of vehicles a lot and enough accuracy to hit 8” targets at 200 yards, but most of the shots being 35-75 yards. There’s no reason to go longer than 11.5 with a dot for that.

You grasp the meaning of my words. Thank you for not veering off into the land of SBRs and fixed stock rifles. That has nothing to do with my intent or questions.

You mean Stinky is an expert on urban settings? LOL! Guy is a fugging tard!

I musta' overlooked,where anyone even began to hint at a fixed stock?!? Hint. Pun be intended. Re-hint.

Reality is,there's no way to talk a Faux SBR(Pistole) purty,if only due the simplistic facts that they are a series of concessions,that eek no goody. Hint.

'Course I do not begin to understand the Phobia(s) which fuel the path to begin with. Though I'll happily defer Trybone her due,in besides being a CLUELESS Fhuqk,she just also "happens" to be a Lying/Thieveing Piece Of Fhuqking Schit to boot. Hint.



What were the "odds"? Hint.

Fhuqking LAUGHING!..............

LOL! Fug Stick, try as you might you are just a broke stick MFer who doesn't even know how to scope an AR. LOL!

Should have been “butt stock”. But who cares. Some opinions remain irrelevant. hint 😂 laffin’

I’m done. Let this thread be officially declared totally foolish. As the current yutes say Peace…out.

TryBone,

How come ALL of your Outdoor Photos,were taken by me...you "lucky" kchunt. Hint. Congratulations?!?

Imitation is THE most Sincere form of Flattery. Hint.

bless your heart for trying.

Hint.

Fhuqking LAUGHING!.......................









'tem,

But you were doing "GREAT" with Faux SBR,on your way to The Riots. Hint.

Laughing!................

Fug Stick, you never fail to make yourself look stupid. Most people feel embarrassment when they post stupid schitt, like that AR setup of yours, but that is sorely lacking in you. Maybe you are just too stupid to feel embarrassment.

I guess it's a good thing you don't hide your stupidity so everyone knows what they are dealing with in you.

TryBone,

You are of course welcome to your Delusions and fortunately for you,Imagination and Pretend are free,so even you can "afford" to "contribute"...you "lucky" kchunt. Hint. Congratulations?!?

No need to cite that all you can do is guess,as such things are more than a "touch" transparent. Pardon wares that exist,as you "get" to set on your Couchbound Kchunt,read my EVERY word and gawk(steal) The Splendid Pixels. Hint.



Bless your heart for trying.

Hint.

Fhuqking LAUGHING!.................

How much velocity does the .223/5.56 retain when fired from a 13.7" barrel?

*No one is fooling anyone one with the wrist braces. I've yet to see a shooter really practice shooting an AR-15 handgun one handed with the pistol brace wrapped around his wrist. I've seen quite a few guys strap the AR-15 handgun to their wrist and empty a magazine into a paper target. However, when moving through a course of fire, engaging friendlies and bad guys they all shouldered the wrist brace utilizing it as a butt stock. These AR-15 "handguns" are really SBRs.

Why not a 7.62x39?? Get it in a 10.5" and suppress it. Cheap, plentiful ammo, more energy. If you aren't looking to poke past 300yds, def worth a look.

For in and out of vehicles the shorter barrel absolutely makes a difference. Not enough velocity lost to be an issue at "urban" distance.

I went with an 11.5 barrel just because the 10.5 is a little harder on parts and a little more finicky.

In urban environments mag capacity is a consideration. A blackout is certainly viable, especially with a can. Either way the handier it is, and the more familiar you are with it, the better you'll do under pressure.

My notes are at work but I'll find it and get back.

Wrestling with my next pistol: build another AR or buy a Galil ACE or AKM-P…..either in 7.62x39. A 123-154gr 30 @ 2k-ish isn’t gonna have much competition from any 5.56 at urban ranges and rcp distances and uses. Leaning towards non-AR, just because of folding length, and reliability with the x39 vs an AR. Mini dot or irons is plenty, and I’d want to can it, so would need an adjustable piston or gas block, either way. Ruled out another AAC…. Just not worth the AMMO hassle or cost right now, and most any x39 load has more juice anyway. Nothing ‘wrong’ with a 11.5” 5.56…..but not much ideal about it vs other stuff, either. Just my internal arguments on it. $ vs ease vs better mousetrap in a pistol?

2400fps with 75grain Gold Dot. That’s all I’ve chrono’d in it.

With the same ammo we got 2300 from 11.5” and 2500 from 16” barrels.

I had an AR15 pistol.
Only gun I ever sold.
Noise went through earplugs AND hearing protectors.