What is wrong with this trigger?

It's a good trigger. It is a closed trigger design, however, unlike the original m70 trigger. I don't think there's really anything wrong, it is just that the original was so good. An open trigger design certainly has its merits.

It is hard to adjust.

I have had one MOA trigger that was easily adjustable to the 2 1/2 pound break range. All
I did with it was scrape off the sealing junk on the front of the trigger and move the adjustment screw.

Others have had to have a spring from Ernie's installed to get it to the acceptable range. Not a big deal
but certainly much more difficult than the original Model 70 trigger.

Guy's,


Can the MOA trigger on the BACO guns be replaced with the new haven classic 'open trigger'?

Thanks,

Jerry

BACO took the world's best hunting rifle trigger (pre-'64 and New Haven M 70) and unnecessarily complicated it. "An ingenious solution to a nonexistent problem" as the pundits have said.

Negative.

I have two pre-64 and two New Haven model 70's. I like the triggers just fine. I have worked on a dozen BACO rifles and like those triggers fine too. GD

My experience is that the old trigger could be made to work very well...by someone how knows what they are doing.

The new triggers can be made to work very well by someone, like me, who doesn't really know what he is doing.

As a matter of fact, my MOAs have felt very good out of the box!

I'm in agreement with South Texas with this one. It's so easy to put an Ernie spring in a moa and have a very good feeling trigger, with a crisp, smooth 2.5 pound pull. I pride myself in being able to fine tune the old style trigger to almost perfection, but have shot pre 64's and bacos side by side and the bacos just feel better. They are designed with a mechanical advantage, that just makes them feel crisper, with less creep. I laugh my azz off when some stupid sob says they are replacing the moa with a timney, because that is a lateral move and waste of hard earned money. You gain nothing. However, with this being said, I still prefer the simplicity and reliability of the old trigger...

Most Gunsmiths lobe the old triggers because to get a light and SAFE trigger pull on the old m70s you needed their services.

Now ,with the new MOA triggers at most you just need a few replacement springs and an allen key.

Those SAME gunsmiths will be glad to install a Timney trigger in either a new or old M70 for $125+, though..

You figure it out...;)

The open trigger design is one of the best trigger designs out there. If properly worked over by a Gene Simmilion or a gunsmith of similar talents, you would be a fool to replace it with an aftermarket product. Dakota triggers are a good place start if you want something to compare against. The pins can all be replaced and the triggers honed to eliminate creep.

Couldn’t agree more. I love the older triggers but the MOAs I’ve swapped spring on were very good as well.

Four words. The test of time.

In 82 years get back with me on the life of the MOA vs original trigger.

Four more words:

"Ernie The Gunsmith Springs"

I'm a fan of the original M70 trigger, I like the open design. However, I've found the MOA trigger to be very good with the Ernie's Spring Kit. I've done two. My current M70 EW 300 WSM has its trigger done at 2.5 lbs, and is "crisper" than any open trigger M70 I've had, and I've had dozens.

At the end of the day, the 3 position safety on the shroud of the M70 helps keep most of the debris out of the trigger area of the M70, unlike the M700 whose safety slot is a direct pipeline for water and debris into the trigger housing.

I purchased a new M 70 Extreme Weather last spring. The MOA trigger right out of the box was great. Predictable & easy to squeeze off. A friend who also purchased a new Extreme Weather at the same time replaced his MOA with a new Timney . It was a simple drop in replacement which any one should be able to handle. I consider the new MOA trigger more complex but superior as to adjustability compared to my Pre 64 models.

Gus's moa trigger doesnt do well in the conditions around Koyuk, Alaska. I dont think a spring replacement will cure this.

Classic fkn box trigger with a catchy name: collect rust, grime and debris:

Hmmm. If the MOA was so great, why did he replace it???



Pffft... Until, like the video above, that wonderful (and complex) POS MOA trigger fails in the field... Hope the shooter brought a spare rifle, just in case... While the original trigger can be stripped, cleaned and back in business inside of about five minutes...
'
YMMV..

Was there a reason your friend replaced his trigger? Also have you installed an ernie spring in yours yet? Do that and then do a side by side comparison of the MOA and Timney. Like I said in my earlier post, it's a "lateral" move. You aren't gaining anything by going with a Timney. Its still a box trigger. However, if he was having some sort of issue with his MOA, maybe he should have contacted Winchester, I mean Browning..

The funny thing is you don't know whether it's a MOA trigger or old tried and true. In his comment, he said he fixed it by "brushing the rust and dirt off". This could be a classic and probably is based off the bolt shroud. The video is such that there are no other clues pointing to what era of model 70 it is, but I'd bet its not a BACO. Its also in a Hogue rubberized stock. It is more likely someone would do that to a classic vs. an Extreme weather. It probably had a POS duratouch stock on it that got gummy and those were classic model 70's. However, if that's all it took to fix the issue, it is more likely an oldstyle trigger. Like Lee said, they are simple to fix in the field. About a 5 minute job. With a MOA, you'd be more chidt out of luck and all the wire brushing in the world isn't going to fix an issue like being rusted up inside.

That’s an early classic stainless has the old style trigger. Bolt shroud dead giveaway all BACO’s have flat side bolt shroud.

Bingo. I think someone said that earlier..

As stated that’s a classic model 70 in the video. BACO’s don’t have that style of bolt shroud.

I just read the rest of your post and caught the bolt shroud as well. Somewhere in 300xxx SN range Winchester switched to a flat side bolt shroud.

I've had 7 digit classics with the round bolt shroud. Here's a pretty late 7WSM:


My baco's had the flat sided ones. Even the first year 2008 models:

My 300 wsm 7 digit is a flat side. I need to look at my 6 digits, I’m probably wrong on the transition to the flat side bolt shroud. I do know it started in the 7 digit time frame..

All of you old farts that hate MOA triggers, be sure to state it in your will, that after death, you are to buried with your old open type M70 triggers enclosed with you in your casket. RJ

I'd bet there'd be some grave robbing going on if some of these folks knew I had a passel of P64 triggers in my eternal resting place.

LMAO... Oh ye of so little knowledge.... Too bad you little boys don't obtain some education before you reach adulthood...

Redneck, I do not doubt that you have much experience and knowledge of Winchester M70 rifles, and I respect that, but you do not know it all. In 100 years, both of us will be dead, but I will bet you that those MOA triggers will still be working fine. RJ